#ML theory

[bklily]

I find it funny how these intro scenes are being kinda brushed aside with the overall conversation because not only do they give a good insight on where Adrien's head is at the moment, but they also set up the perfect tragedy of what his life will become once the secret comes out to everyone. He won't be able to have that simple life he wants anymore and everyone will always be aware of "Adrien Agreste son of international terrorist" all the fripplin time.

...Unless.... 👀 He takes Adrien Agreste out of the picture.... 👀 👀

[miraculous-floconfettis]

That's way too many frogs.

Either someone in the Miraculous team is fan of frogs or this is sus.

[idleinteen]

WOW

the parallels between adrien/ivan hit hard omg

[linartblogs]

GUYS THE REVEAL IN THE RULER IS EXACTLY LIKE THE REVEAL IN EPHEMERAL I'M TWEAKING

Not kidding. I just checked and Nathaniel says almost exactly the same thing as Ladybug when she revealed herself as Marinette to Adrien :

"S'il-te plaît dit quelque chose" / "Please say something"

"Dis quelque chose" / "Say something"

This coupled with Lila/Cerise mentioning Nathaniel while writing means that there's a big chance this reveal will have consequences later in this season omg...She probably already has suspicions of him being Caprikid...

[familyagrestefanblog]

Ladybug's Lucky Charms in Werepapas

Let's talk about another detail that people kinda REALLY wanna ignore about Marinette's decision in the Werepapas akuma battle. It's the fact that she hand-waves away FIVE Lucky Charms until she finally goes with the sixth:

No, that is NOT irrelevant. Marinette is not supposed to disregard her Lucky Charms left and right because they're trying to tell her what she's supposed to do. That's Lucky Charm 101 in an akuma battle.

I'm not gonna pretend like I know for 100% certainty what they all tried to tell her, but

1) a couple of them can be easily interpreted in very relevant ways.

And 2) I don't NEED to know what exactly they all mean because it doesn't need to be PROVEN that Marinette isn't supposed to cherry-pick her Lucky Charms. We've known since s1 how this works and it's still done like this in s6. Thanks to not being limited anymore to 1 Lucky Charm, she gained the luxury of sometimes just getting to summon one for the purpose of whooping ass instead of solving the actual situation - which is still a lucky charm's REAL purpose - but that doesn't change the fact that you're supposed to listen to the Lucky Charm, not the Lucky Charm to you!

Under special circumstances like a final battle, sure, use additional ones to whoop ass. But you can't just switch out the problem solving Charm with a purely ass whooping one which is what Marinette did here in "Werepapas". It's fine when you do that in an extremely dire situation, but a normal akuma battle is no dire situation. Especially not when the only real stakes there are is being reckless with Adrien's amoks!

She's supposed to use whatever she gets and that'll lead her to the right solution. Not going through a whole line of Lucky Charms until she gets one where she finally likes the first thought she gets from it because of how little it challenges her self-preservation (makes you wonder if having unlimited Lucky Charms now isnt the worst thing that ever happened to her. Now she can just ignore whole Lucky Charms until she finally gets one that tells her something closer to what she wants to hear instead of listening to the CHARM)

Let's take a look at her 6 Lucky Charms:

From my recollection (so correct me if I'm wrong), while the teapot sometimes shows up here and there as filler Charms it was firmly established and used several times as a visual cue for Marinette to go to Master Fu.

Obviously, she can't do that anymore, but she has Alya as co-guardian, Luka who was trained by Su-Han, and even Su-Han himself as Celestial Guardian who now does whatever she wants.

In a situation where Adrien's amoks are the akuma object, it's a pretty logical thing to happen that her first Lucky Charm tells her to get Guaridan-related help. She has the option, all the needed support, and all the resources, but doesn't use it because it wouldn't be nice having to face the baggage that could come with it.

And even if you wanna say "She didn't get help because she didn't wanted the new Butterfly to possibly find out that Adrien is a Sentibeing!" Then that excuse still falls flat because obviously Adrien's LIFE is supposed to be more important than preventing that secret from coming out. The secret has no value if Adrien is DEAD.

Afterwards she gets a fan and this obviously could VERY likely mean that she's supposed to get Felix involved because he's the Miraculous holder of the Peacock. And by "VERY likely" I mean "I doubt there is a likely chance that it ISNT a hint to get Felix".

I won't even elaborate on this further. Her second Lucky Charm tried telling her to get Felix when Adrien's amoks were on the line and she ignored it. It is what it is.

For the third and fifth ones, I personally don't know what they could mean because I already struggle recognizing what exactly they are supposed to be. Though, they do have recognizable shapes. I bet other people could look at them and know where they've seen these objects before in the show.

Then right between these two, the fourth Charm Marinette summons is an unicycle (that for some reason isn't polkadotted, but screw it)

An unicycle like she summoned back in season 2 "Sabotis", the episode in which Alya became Rena Rouge for the first time. Meaning this one pointed to getting Rena's help.

For me, this is one of the most interesting ones regarding Marinette's feelings of not wanting to face the Lucky Charm's solution to instead protect all her secrets. But if anything, I would want to give it its own post and not half-ass it here. Cause there are a lot of layers to this one.

And, of course, the last one: the scarf. It's alongside the fan the one for which the fandom does casually acknowledge the symbolism of it being a call back to 1x01 "The Bubbler" where Marinette now infamously made the decision to let Adrien believe that it was his father who made the scarf for him - and not her - because of how happy it made Adrien that his father finally "cared":

I don't think I need to explain why it makes sense that this is the one s6 Marinette cherry-picks to finally work with. The poor scarf has been made into the symbol of Marinette wanting to keep pretty much everything about Adrien's family a secret from him. Including him being a Sentibeing. I miss the good old days when we dreamed of the scarf being set-up to become the catalyst for Adrien to write off his father as a useless deadbeat who isnt worth his time and love.

So, unfortunately, of course this is the one she goes with now. Even if it means taking the risk to kill Adrien. Anything to keep the secrets save and lies unnoticed. How tf did we GET here?

[uptoolateart]

Anyone notice how many times Ladybug talked about herself in third person in the London Special?

As soon as she told that lie about Gabriel and Tomoe, she began separating herself from what she'd done. She's coping through dissociation.

Throughout S1-5, she and Adrien were on paths towards integration. They were learning to see that he already was Cat Noir and she already was Ladybug. The strength lay within all along.

But by being untrue, she's gone backwards, splitting her two selves rather than unifying them. She's attempting to compartmentalise Marinette's relationship with Adrien from Ladybug's...which is unworkable.

In a word...our girl is a mess. She's supposedly doing all this to protect Adrien - but who's protecting her?

[mamayura]

Revelator analysis: Marinette remembering the Umbrella scene incorrectly

You know what I find really interesting about the interview scene in "Revelator" where Adrinette retells how they met? Marinette is actually getting a few details wrong.

Mind you, no deal breakers. She got all the emotional beats down accurately. And I will only truly take this as canon anyway when the French original has her misremember things the same way. But for now, it's really interesting that MARINETTE is the one who gets a couple of details wrong about the moment she fell SO in love with Adrien, while Adrien himself is out here making no such mistake in the whole interview:

This is correct. Simple as that.

This one... is on very thin ice. In reality, Marinette had just left the building and noticed it was raining when Adrien started talking to her. Yes, she was ready to wait until the rain stopped, but she never truly got to the waiting part:

But, by all means, if this were only this detail, I wouldnt make this post right now. Even if, factually, she didnt wait, she just noticed it was raining and thought she had to wait.

But let's get back to this later because there is another layer to this that was the catalyst for me writing this. But for now, moving on:

This is correct again. Adrien, in fact, had an umbrella.

But here is the thing:

This is... straight up wrong. Objectively. What Marinette reacted negatively to was Adrien trying to be friendly and saying "Hi" to her:

He only offered his umbrella at the end, so Marinette claiming so confidently in "Revelator" that she at first turned down the umbrella is false. Adrien opened it for himself because he was the one standing in the rain for a bit while explaining his perspective:

I sure don't see any umbrellas being turned down here, Marinette. So what exactly are you remembering? Just saying.

From this point onwards, the Adrinette interview is accurate again because 1) it's about the emotional core of it, and 2) well, Adrien is then talking the most because it's about him and Marinette is mostly just adding to it. So, yeah...

Look, I don't wanna say that this is some deep betrayal of love and proof that Marinette's love for Adrien isnt real. Of course not. And again, there is still the chance that the line in question is right in the French original (though, I do gotta say, I doubt it because that would change the natural flow of the conversation)

I just find it interesting that the thing about THE Umbrella scene that Marinette gets wrong is the UMBRELLA itself and how and when it was extended to her.

Cause, well... This is not a documentary. Marinette is not a real life person who can mix some things up without it meaning anything. She's the main character and the main narrative tool of the story.

This is the moment SHE FELL IN LOVE WITH ADRIEN. Pretty much 80% of what she does in this show goes back to this moment. In story-telling practice, yes, her being the one who recalls that moment incorrectly should mean something.

Bad faith reading: it's a major indicator that Marinette is actually not as invested in Adrien and their relationship anymore as she was once upon a time. Her needs and desires have changed and that's causing problems now.

Good faith reading (and I genuinely mean good faith reading. Fucking BEST faith reading, in my opinion):

The details that Marinette gets wrong about the Umbrella scene actually correspond with the ending of "Strike Back" where Marinette's lightning moment happened with Chat Noir:

Cause if you combine Marinette's memories of the Umbrella scene with the Strike Back scene, then, yes, Marinette WOULD remember standing way longer in the RAIN before Adrien eventually came to her:

Not because that's how it factually happened in "Origins", but because she was alone in the rain for a solid bit before Chat Noir arrived in "Strike Back".

But the most important thing is that, if you combine the two lightning scenes, this objectively incorrect line actually checks out again:

Because the moment Marinette fell in love with Chat Noir was about him having extended his hand several times but her having pushed him away and held at arms length:

Marinette in the Umbrella scene didnt turn down Adrien's umbrella. Not only because that simply didnt happen, but also because Adrien only had the opportunity to offer it ONCE which she then immediately took. Chat Noir, on the other hand (is that a pun?), did offer the gesture she then fell in love with more than once, which she initially turned down, but eventually accepted.

So, again, worst faith reading: we were supposed to pick up on Marinette remembering the iconic Umbrella scene incorrectly which is supposed to subtly tell us that life has changed Marinette's feelings for Adrien for the worse because she's simply not the girl she was a year ago and the love she once wanted doesnt fit her needs anymore, so it's fading and getting drowned out.

Best faith reading: It's a subtle hint that the love she once wanted doesnt really fit her needs anymore, but the one that does more and more now is Chat Noir who, as we all know, is Adrien Agreste.

Though, no matter which one it is, one truth remains: Marinette remembered the UMBRELLA SCENE wrong and that means something.

[l4dymarika]

My theory on revelators parallels to chat blanc

What I understood from Revelator and its parallels to Chat Blanc is that it might be how it would end if Chat hadn’t wiped Rena’s memory.

Let’s take this scenario into consideration: Alya has expressed her spite toward keeping secrets/lying. If she hadn’t had her memory wiped, she probably wouldn’t have lasted long without telling someone—whether it be Nino, Adrien (I don’t want to think so little of her, but maybe even the Ladyblog, considering how mad Alya was at MariBug). The truth would spread, eventually reaching Adrien, who would be completely devastated ( I genuinely don’t think that telling Adrien about it sooner would help especially with him being such a wreck (who tries to hide it) right now (wrinkled shirt theory))

That episode might have implied that the truth is so dangerous it could actually destroy the world—if not revealed at the right moment—and that we were heading exactly down that path. Now, it’s Marinette’s responsibility to determine the right time to reveal the secrets.

Secrets don’t tend to stay hidden for long, especially when they involve such important matters, and I don’t think anyone expects her to keep it a secret forever. That’s exactly why, right now, the truth shouldn’t be revealed. There’s a right time for everything, and during both Revelator and The London Special, that time just hadn’t come yet.

I’ve also heard people say that Marinette acts selfishly by avoiding uncomfortable conversations and staying in her comfort zone. I tend to do the same, so I understand her completely. In my case, I just wait for things to evolve on their own and delay them as much as possible while mentally preparing for them—sometimes, it’s just for the best. Sometimes, you have to be selfish.

But enough about me—Marinette has been through so much that it’s basically a coping mechanism (in fact, it is exactly that). You can’t expect someone who’s so lost in her life, practically living on autopilot, not to rely on their coping mechanisms. We forget that she’s just a fourteen-year-old girl who doesn’t have enough experience to handle such complicated situations.

Give this girl a break. Life is already doing everything it can to crush her, and her mind is doing everything it can to keep her from collapsing. She has to do what’s best for her—sometimes, she has to think about herself, even if she is a superhero.

The unraveling will happen eventually—when the time is right, when the truth will cause the least harm to everyone involved.

[raptorwozhere]

ok so mild miraculous the ruler spoilers

so most people have noticed marc and nathaniel clearly parallel marinette and adrien in this episode but i haven’t seen people talk much in depth about how nathaniel’s parents mirror adrien’s. (and marc’s to marrinette’s to a lesser extent - loving and supportive without question)

the fight between caprikid and his akumatised mother felt very familiar to chat and his akumatised fathers fight in representation, with both of them taking out their frustrations of being controlled by their parent.

so what if in a similar way nathaniel’s dad parallels emilie and gives us a hint to how she could have acted and what role she could have played in the agreste family dynamic before she died. kinder and more supportive on a surface level but still disconnected and enabling, still focused on her own wants and ideals but in a much more subtle way than gabriel.

to me that lines up with the emilie we see in werepapas, quick to excuse gabriel’s behaviour in service to keep her delusion of a perfect loving family.

[wield-the-mighty-pen]

Season 6 of ML is a direct reflection of Season 3: Here's why

Going into season 6, the writers claimed that this would be a new beginning, a reset on everything that has happened so far. And to a large extent it is.

No longer are we expecting serialized episodes, and have thus far been treated to several expositional episodes, where we are introduced to new and old characters and situations.

Some might consider this a "new season 1" a brand new beginning to welcome in arc 2 of the miraculous ladybug story. However, I think that this is a misrepresentation of season 6 as a whole. And I believe from what we've seen so far of this season, and what has been teased to us, that this season relates far more to season 3, than it does to season 1.

For starters, let's talk about the most obvious comparison the call-back to season 1 episode 1's Stormy Weather. While we have yet to see episode 1 of season 6, the weather-themed akuma "Climatiqueen" sounds to be a clear reference to the French name of Stormy Weather "Climatika".

In both these instances, the reference back to the first episode effectively functions as a reset. In season 3, "Stormy Weather 2" serves as an introduction point to the latter half of the season and a way to distance the more "frivolous" early episodes from the more important and high-stakes latter episodes. In season 6, it functions as a transition from what we saw in season 5 to what we are to expect in season 6.

There are a few more episode call-backs in season 6 to season three, but of all of them, this was the most convincing of intentionality on the part of the writers.

Next comparison we see is with Lila, and how she "changes targets". The episode Chameleon in season 3, is when we start to see a major shift in Lila, specifically in her focus from Ladybug to Marinette. While she still targets Ladybug after this episode, this is where we start to see a decline, until we get to season 5, and she's all but forgotten about Ladybug.

In season 6 too, we see her begin to shift again. While in episode 2, we see her obsessively watching Marinette and Adrien's date, this is ultimately in pursuit of Ladybug. The shift has begun. If my analysis is correct, we will see more and more of a preoccupation with Ladybug from Lila (Cerise?) and less of a focus on Marinette in Lila's antagonistic role

(Also wanted to point out this amazing call back to season 3 episode 1 "Chameleon it's very on the nose)

What's also important to note is that while season 3 might have been episodic, the information relayed in each episode was vital, and nearly all of it was brought up in subsequent episodes/seasons (re: new heroes, chat blanc, the statue scene TM). With season 6 so far, this appears to also be the case. The episodes are episodic, but I would hardly call them fluff. We've been told new lore, understood ever-changing relationships, and have been privy to the delicacy in which virtually all characters exist.

This frailty is something that we actually see a lot in season 3, especially in relation to secret keeping. In season 3, we have Kwamibuster, Desperada, Weredad, Chat Blanc, and Ladybug. All episodes that either reference, or center around issues relating to secrets and identities. In season 3, we actually see the most threats to secret keeping. Season 4 by comparison only has 3 (gang of secrets, wishmaker, and ephemeral).

Secrets are winding their way around the plot of season 6 as well, a threat that appears most pointed in the most recent episode "Revelator". The delicate tether of these secrets seem precarious to us viewers, just as they did in season 3. And just like season 3, they're bound to break at some point, in a catastrophic and calamitous way...

Which leads me to the whole reason I made this post and why I think the writers created this reflection...

The episode 22 slot.

Just to be clear on what I mean by that, here is the 22nd episode of season 3:

and here is the 22nd episode of season 6:

The tenterhooks of identities in season 3, eventually came to a head in the episode "Chat Blanc", an episode where we learn what would happen if they knew each others identities. An episode where we say Adrien get akumatized for the first time.

So far, every clue seems to point to Marinette being akumatized this season, right down to the name of this villain "Lady Chaos" seems perfect of a callback to Ladybug for me. And with the way this secret has intertwined with Ladybug's identity, relationships, and reputation, there's no shortage of reasons as to why she might get akumatized.

Right now, in these early season 6 episodes, we are being provided the tools to allow her to finally get akumatized. Alya has a kwagatama and can reference Marinette to defeat Marinette. She also has been named Marinette's successor if necessary (and has a premade suit). Chat Noir has the ability to remove the memory of Ladybug's identity from anyone's mind. And most importantly, we have been provided a motive, over and over again.

After all, let's not forget this call back...

Akumanette is coming... the only question is what will remain in the aftermath

[zaaaras]

the parallels between ivan and adrien this episode hurt so bad because what if it’s showing what could possibly happen to adrien if he found out? if he was angry as ivan and if he felt as much guilt… he could go the route of giving up his miraculous and ladybug never seeing him again or using its destruction for worse like ivan’s coping with his drums ☹️

[miraculous-floconfettis]

"They are the monsters".

This resonate very differently after watching 'El Toro de Piedra'. Why do I feel like Felix knows way more than he lets on? 😏

[idleinteen]

my “lila isn’t just stalking marinette, she’s stalking everyone” theory was kinda confirmed in this episode omg

[treatop]

for the people who are complaining that adrien doesnt have a new outfit/design for season six, i think that you’re just gonna have to be patient. my theory is that he will get a outfit change at some point later in the season, like sabrina did. he just needs to find himself first and discover his own style (possibly designed and made by his loving girlfriend?)

[uptoolateart]

Loved learning that all those years when Gabriel was absent, he wasn't neglecting Adrien for work - he was out trying to find a cure for Emilie. He's still such an ass, but I really appreciate all the shades of grey / moments of sympathy they build into his character, so he isn't just evil. It makes him so much more believable, despite how crazy he is.

And if he was going away on all these trips alone with Nathalie, I can only assume they were tucked up together in tents, and stuff was going on. No one can convince me otherwise.

*Please no comment spoilers for things after S6 E5 :)*

[mamayura]

Okay but what's crazy is that the episode does subtly reveal that Adrien did keep it a secret from Marinette that he's more than silent jogging buddies with Sublime

In the beginning, Marinette says that when she asked Adrien if he and Sublime talk when they go running he always says "no". This is factually correct as we find out in the end through Sublime:

But there is obviously something not adding up here. Sublime literally says "Outside of running, of course Adrien and I talk". They just arent talking in any of their morning runs because Sublime in particular is doing it as serious training. So no talking because that would impact their breathing, but outside of that? Well, yeah, duh.

And that makes sense

Adrien and Sublime are in the same ancient Greek class, of course they would talk. I'm gonna go with the assumption that this is why Sublime started running by his side, because they vaguely knew each other from Greek class and when they crossed each others running paths one morning they were familiar enough to just run together in silence

Look, I- I dont know how to put this more elegantly, so I'll rip off the bandaid. The vibes I'm getting from this episode are that Adrien was more than cool with not talking anyway because he deliberately keep his friendship with Sublime a secret from Marinette because he knew Marinette would be weird about it and that made him uncomfortable.

He knows his girlfriend and she's peanut-butter-and-jealous.

And the thing is, as much as this certainly is a complicated topic with a lot of factors to consider for both sides, the way the episode had Marinette go about all this...

... the episode proved him RIGHT. He was right to be too uncomfortable with letting Marinette know about being friends with Sublime. She merely found out that they were running together in silence and proceeded to not only keep watching them each morning and taking photos, Marinette even proceeded to stalk the hell out Sublime:

No, this isnt normal. This isnt a "quirky girlfriend" thing to do, or "funny haha". Its one of the reason why Adrien didnt feel comfortable letting her know.

And, I mean, yeah. I can't blame him for it, can I? :I

Later on, Sublime is very quick to piece together that the girl hiding behind them is Adrien's girlfriend. Not the thing I would immediately go with, unless of course Adrien did already vaguely mention having a girlfriend to Sublime at one point. Then yes, her coming to this conclusion after Marinette followed her all day makes a lot more sense. Even if those are not.. nice implications. The episode does go on playing it straight at first that Marinette is the weird and a bit alarming girlfriend.

Look, you can pretty this up if you like, but for me, Adrien is clearly a solid bit uncomfortable and very apologetic here to Sublime because of Marinette's behavior. Sublime too is being nice about it to a degree you shouldnt take for granted. She would have had been perfectly justified in saying something else entirely. Adrien is trying to be a good boyfriend about this, but Marinette is out here proving him right in having struggled with wanting her to know about Sublime. Marinette has been following her around all day, Sublime noticed, and Adrien is doing good faith damage control here by telling Sublime that Marinette has good intentions and only wants to be her friend.

Something, though, that the episode clarified 3 times wasnt really the case:

It is so weird that at the core of the problem for both sides of Adrinette WAS Marinette being peanut-butter-and-jealous.

Marinette did NOT try to befriend Sublime out of some pure-hearted desire to know her. She did so because she feared that Adrien could end up not loving her anymore if she doesnt gain some control over the Sublime situation real quick

And Adrien DID keep his friendship with Sublime a secret from Marinette because, well, was he wrong?

And thats the thing. The episode just DROPS this in favor of saying that Marinette only had these pure-hearted intentions to know her when that isnt true. The episode proved Adrien alarmingly RIGHT in his gut feeling to keep Sublime a secret from Marinette, they just-

They just didnt let him know about any of it as if that makes it any less true. I would understand it if this episode had been entirely about tackling this issue for good. Adrien not being wrong for feeling uncomfortable with letting Marinette know about any new female friends and then Adrien gets proven right, but the situation is saved by Marinette's secondary desire of befriending Sublime.

Sure, not the plot of my choice, but I would GET IT because it would actually cover the given problem. Here it is... they didnt do it. Adrien was proven right, Marinette did everything wrong to Sublime that was possible and ended up breaking her prosthetic and ruined the sponsorship with a combo of Marinette's and Ladybug's harmful inconsideration.

Marinette did exactly what Adrien was afraid of... and they just DON'T resolve the initial Adrinette core of this issue. It's still ongoing. Marinette didnt even get to react in the end to finding out that Adrien did keep her in the dark about talking to Sublime:

I guess for now the explanation for that will be that Adrinette switched positions in this for once and now it's Marinette who isnt questioning it enough that Adrien only said the truth to her going by the technicality of "She only ask him if they talk while running".

Obviously, this is not how it works. He kept her in the dark. And whether he was right to doing so or not isnt important for the feeling I'm getting that this is just the beginning of a streak of similar problems like this. The postponed resolution to this will happen at a later point, and knowing Miraculous, they'll do it after it escalates to hell.

We already saw it in "Illustrhater" and the synopsis for "Werepapas" for example also sounds like Marinette will not stop here being a questionable girlfriend

I just dont understand why they would keep on DOING that?