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whitewolfofwinterfell · 6 years

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Angel and Cordelia (Cangel) - an in-depth analysis of their relationship

Angel and Cordelia are a ship I never expected to ship before watching Angel, but since finishing the show around November, I’ve fallen in love with them (and the show generally) and wanted to compile a post where I could express all my thoughts and feelings about them. This meta will be very in-depth and is divided into 9 sections:

1. ‘Pensiver Face’: Opposites Attract - Will explore Angel and Cordelia’s personalities and the ways in which these two unlikely characters came together and brought out new and wonderful sides to each other.

2. ‘Help the Helpless’: Finding purpose - Discusses the way in which Angel and Cordelia found purpose in their lives through meeting and the creation of Angel Investigations.

3. ‘We’re family’: Belonging and Family - Insight into how Angel and Cordelia created a family and home with each other that provided them with a sense of belonging (perhaps for the first time in their lives).

4. ‘My Dearest Friend’: Friendship and Love - Looks at Angel and Cordelia’s friendship and how that was at the core of their relationship throughout the series.

5. ‘You’re not alone’: Emotional connection - Uncovers the profound emotional connection Angel and Cordelia established with each other.

6. ‘It’s the stars’: Everyone can see it - Reflects on the common ‘Everyone can see it’ trope and how that was important to Angel and Cordelia’s relationship.

7. ‘Were we in love?’: Romantic love - An exploration of when and how Angel and Cordy’s romantic feelings for each other developed.

8. ‘I’ll be seeing you’: Missed Opportunity - Analyses the writing in seasons 4 and 5, and the ways in which Angel and Cordelia’s relationship was hugely disadvantaged by the writing.

9. ‘There are no people like us’: Why Angel/Cordelia are misunderstood and live in Buffy/Angel’s shadow - Unpicks some of the common misconceptions I’ve seen about Angel and Cordy’s relationship and the how comparisons made between their relationship and Buffy and Angel’s is unfair and does a disservice to both couples.

As you can see, section 9 does discuss Buffy and Angel, because I really couldn’t discuss Angel and Cordelia without also talking about Angel’s relationship with Buffy since she was so significant to Angel. It won’t be anti-Buffy/Angel (because I’m a huge Bangel shipper, as anyone that follows me will know), but I just wanted to give a warning for those that are a big fan of the ship as you might not want to read. However, the primary focus throughout will be on Angel and Cordelia’s relationship on ATS (I don’t really give much focus to BTVS since their interactions were so brief and lacking).

Before we get into it, I wanted to say this post is long, (coming in at around 9k words, whew! I had more to say than I realised), so if you’re interested in reading you might want to grab a drink or a snack and make yourself comfortable.

1. ‘Pensiver Face’: Opposites Attract

What makes Angel and Cordelia’s relationship so special is that it’s between two unlikely characters who, on the surface are polar opposites, but that compliment each other beautifully. Cordelia was specifically chosen to be a regular on ATS because she was the opposite to Angel - Whedon stated that Cordelia’s bright smile was needed to counteract Angel’s broody persona (x). The fundamental differences in Angel and Cordelia’s personalities meant that together they brought out different sides to each other. Angel was known for being reserved, contemplative, melancholy, deep and pessimistic, whilst in contrast Cordelia was known for being outgoing, bubbly, outspoken, shallow and optimistic.

Both characters came to ATS season 1 displaying these characteristics which they were well-known for on BTVS, but through meeting each other, they changed. Angel smiled more with Cordelia than arguably any other character in the Buffyverse (x) (x) (x) (x). Her infectious personality, witty sense of humour and straight-talking attitude coaxed him out of his shell. Also, because he was more submissive by nature, Angel responded to Cordelia’s assertiveness - she wasn’t afraid to take charge, call him out on things, make demands of him and ensure he stayed on the right path. She was the one that took charge of the business, launching Angel Investigations from practically nothing; she persuaded Angel that he should pay Gunn for working with them; she didn’t easily relent after he fired her, Wesley and Gunn; she told him he needed to set boundaries with Fred when she had a crush on Angel to prevent Fred from getting hurt; she held him accountable for getting Darla pregnant in season 3; she consistently encouraged him to fight for Connor no matter how hopeless or difficult it became and even in her brief return in season 5 she continued with this pattern. She straight up told Angel that he’d lost his way, lost sight of their mantra to help the helpless and had become entangled in the messiness of W&H. In doing so, she set Angel back on the right path. It’s strange because generally people view Angel as having more positive traits than Cordelia, but despite his good intentions, he was more prone to giving up and wallowing than Cordelia. Angel was more malleable, more willing to accept the bad in the world whilst Cordelia, on the other hand, persevered no matter what obstacles came her way and was firm in her morals. She knew what she believed to be good and she didn’t stray from that no matter what. That clear-cut attitude really helped Angel, who being a vampire and having seen so much evil, often become lost in the blurriness between good and evil, and became disheartened about fighting the good fight on numerous ocassions. Cordelia was truly Angel’s centre of gravity and moral compass - she was the one he relied on most in his redemptive journey and helping the helpless. That’s why throughout the series there was such a heavy emphasis on Angel needing Cordy (x) and why he proclaimed to be lost without her. Angel needing Cordelia was also demonstrative of a deeper emotional connection between them, which I’ll discuss later on.

Whilst Angel and Cordelia’s differences helped/changed Angel, they did the same for Cordy. Cordelia as a person was very focused on superficial gratification. She sought popularity and status, and she enjoyed money and material objects because of the pleasure they brought her. Her desire to become an actress reflects those desires she had. Although Cordelia demonstrated on BTVS that she was much more than the stereotypical popular-shallow girl she was portrayed to be (x), she wasn’t inclined to be considerate of others and empathy didn’t come naturally to her. In comparison, Angel spent a majority of his time thinking of others and had a wealth of empathy, for everybody regardless of whether they were those he loved or strangers; good or bad. There’s no doubt that the visions were a large part of what enabled Cordelia to be more empathetic since she was quite literally experiencing the traumas of others, but being close to Angel also impacted this. Until Cordelia became friends with Angel (and Doyle, Wes and Gunn), she’d never really been prioritised or cared for unconditionally. Angel’s kindness, consideration and support enabled Cordelia to open up emotionally in a way she never had before, not just to those closest to her, but to everybody. Ironically, a vampire (albeit a vampire with a soul) was the deepest insight Cordelia had gained into humanity. Angel devoted himself to helping others and Cordelia witnessed first-hand the positive impact that had on others and the rewards it brought. Whilst she fought against evil alongside the Scoobies on BTVS, it was being part of Angel Investigations that truly showed her the true meaning of fighting. It gave her purpose and belonging, which in turn allowed her to blossom in an entirely new way.

2. ‘Help the Helpless’: Finding purpose

Despite being different in many ways, Angel and Cordelia had one main thing in common - they were both seeking purpose, meaning and belonging in their lives at the start of ATS - and they found that with each other.

On BTVS Angel went through a traumatic ordeal with losing his soul, being killed by the woman he loved, being trapped in a hell dimension, coming back to life and then having to break up with Buffy. After Angel was cursed and his soul was restored, he retreated into the shadows and lived like a hermit for a century. He no longer belonged in the vampire or the human world, and he was so consumed with the guilt about his actions as Angelus that he was paralysed. He lived a lonely and purposeless existence - until the moment he saw Buffy. Buffy symbolised hope for Angel, because she was destined to fight evil and helping her provided him with a purpose for the first time in decades and I strongly believe that this (amongst other reasons) is why he fell in love with her. So when he split up with her and left for L.A. he lost his purpose along with Buffy. It’s clear that Angel’s time with Buffy and the Scoobies had been so significant to him that he couldn’t return to the life he had before he met Buffy, he needed to continue helping people, but he didn’t know how. Meeting Doyle immediately provided him with a sense of purpose by providing him with a connection to the HP, but as I already mentioned above, Cordelia really cemented that. Although Doyle knew he and Angel had a mission that they needed to work on together, he didn’t know how to make that a reality. Cordelia’s practicality, pragmatism and organisation is what took an idea - helping the helpless - and made it a reality - Angel Investigations. Like I said, Angel knew he wanted to help others but he didn’t really have a plan. When Angel Investigations was born, it became so much more than simply helping the odd person in distress after having stumbled upon them by chance. It became an indefinite commitment and mission which provided Angel with a true purpose - a purpose he realised was the singular most important thing to him in ‘Epiphany’ (2x16).

Cordelia was also in a similar place to Angel when she arrived in L.A. at the start of ATS. During her time on BTVS Cordelia’s character was built upon her status in high-school - she was pretty, rich and popular. Although she wasn’t afraid to stand up for what she believed in (such as defending Xander against her HS friends), she generally sought the approval of others. In HS Cordelia felt that she was somebody and that really came from her popularity and status. However, she admitted that that popularity came with a downside and that she was in fact, very lonely as a result of it (x). Cordelia’s experience in her relationship with Xander only fuelled that loneliness she felt because she isolated herself from her friends to be with him, and when he cheated on her, her ‘friendships’ with the rest of the Scoobies were revealed to be superficial in nature and quickly broke down. By the time she came to ATS, she had left high school and therefore was without her boyfriend (Xander), friends and the status that HS afforded her. This explains why she was on a mission to become a famous actress - to reclaim that status that she’d lost but on an even grander scale. The problem with this is that regardless of how shallow Cordy may have appeared, she clearly craved more than just popularity, fame or money. She’d already had that but it hadn’t fulfilled her. Enter Angel. Cordelia saw that Angel (and Doyle) needed guidance and that she could bring something important to the table. When she joined Angel and Doyle and set up Angel Investigations, she found her purpose just like Angel did. Initially, Cordelia’s desire to stick with Angel may have been because she didn’t have any other particularly appealing options, but it became so much more than that and by the end of season 1 Cordelia was wholly devoted to helping the helpless (x). In ‘Disharmony’ (2x17) she told Harmony that despite the popularity she had at HS, she was happier than she’d ever been because of the work she was doing, and having that sense of purpose came from meeting Angel. ‘Birthday’ (3x11) further reaffirmed this, when Cordelia chose being with Angel and helping the helpless over her dream of being a famous actress.

The creation of Angel Investigations (not just the business but also the family) wouldn’t have happened if Angel and Cordelia hadn’t of come together in the way they did. From the beginning, they were the heart of everything it was and when Angel lost Cordy in season 5, he admitted that he lost his way and was lost without her (again, this beckons back to Cordy being Angel’s centre of gravity). Poetically, Cordelia kissing Angel in ‘You’re Welcome’ (5x11) and passing on the vision to him quite literally set Angel (and co.) on the path to their final battle and brought purpose back into his life. But in addition to bringing purpose to each other’s lives through their shared mission of helping the helpless, they brought something else, perhaps more significant - belonging and family.

3. ‘We’re family’: Belonging and Family

Although Angel and Cordelia had bonds with others prior to ATS - Angel had relationships with Darla, Dru, Spike, Buffy; Cordelia with Harmony, Xander and the Scoobies - they never had with anyone else what they found with each other (and the rest of Angel Investigations) (x). In season 1 Cordelia referred to Angel as being her family and Angel reiterated that later in the series. The unconditional support, acceptance and care Angel and Cordelia had towards one other was unlike anything they’d had in any of their previous relationships (particularly for Cordelia).

Angel prioritised Cordelia, he devoted himself to keeping her safe (x) (x), he was always concerned for her well-being and he took the time to get to know her as a person. He didn’t like Cordy because of her status or popularity, he liked her for her and he expressed that numerous times - he told her he liked both versions of her (old and new), that she was an extraordinary woman and that he’d never known anybody like her (x) (x). Likewise, Cordelia accepted Angel - warts and all - without white washing his past or being ignorant to his darkness. She knew Angelus had done terrible things, and that Angel wasn’t immune from making mistakes and she held him accountable for that. But she also encouraged Angel to be open with her about that side of himself, telling him to drink blood in front of her and reassuring him that she and Doyle wouldn’t judge his vamp face (x). Cordelia came face to face with Angelus multiple times and she knew that even with a soul Angel had the capacity for darkness, but she still saw the good in him and believed it out-weighed the bad. She was never under any false illusions that Angel was perfect and that’s why she was firm in her promise that if needs be she would stake Angelus without hesitation.

It’s really that unconditional support and acceptance that led them to consider each other family. What’s most significant about this is that neither of them really had that before ATS. Angel (Liam) grew up in a volatile family situation with an abusive father and Cordelia’s family was so insignificant in her life that we only had a few references to them throughout the course of BTVS and ATS and not a single appearance from them. Neither of them really had a true home or family until they found each other. The friendship they found with each other (and the rest of Angel Investigations) truly was one of the most beautiful things that ever happened to either of them and provided them with a true home for the first time in their lives. In fact, in season 4 Angel explicitly said when Cordelia was missing “We’ll do whatever it takes to bring her home, where she belongs”, which perfectly sums up the title for this section about belonging and family. The bond they forged was one of the first they established with another that felt completely secure and contented (which is also why Cordelia reacted so negatively to him abandoning her, Wes and Gunn in season 2 over Darla), because at it’s core it was a friendship built upon familial love, which in my opinion, is the strongest and most enduring love there is.

4. ‘My Dearest Friend’: Friendship and Love

The most common argument I’ve seen against Angel and Cordelia as a romantic ship is, “They should’ve just stayed friends, they were better that way”. My issue with this is that Angel and Cordelia didn’t just fulfil one or the other - friendship or romance - they fulfilled both and so much more (x). What makes Angel and Cordelia’s relationship so special is that they morphed from acquaintances, to coworkers, to confidantes, to friends, to family, to lovers and were often some (or all) of these things to each other at once. Their feelings for each other cannot be boxed in, because they encompass so much, but there is no disputing that they loved each other.

Angel and Cordy had a profound connection spanning across the entirety of ATS, that no amount of words I type can quite express. They were a constant presence in each others’ lives for years, they were by each others’ sides through some of the most significant events of their lives and they shared it all - the highs and lows, the good and bad. Even when their romantic feelings came into fruition, their friendship remained unchanged. Nothing could change that fundamental dynamic between them or the ease with which they communicated and bounced off of one another. Any scene between Angel and Cordy has a natural chemistry (the nature of that chemistry is up to interpretation), and even when Angel was a awkward, bumbling and flustered fool, their interactions never felt strained or uncomfortable. This is because they knew each other so well and were so attuned to each other, but also because their relationship was already so well established by the time they realised they had romantic feelings for each other that there was no danger of those feelings complicating or endangering that friendship. It’s why in ‘Spin the Bottle’ (4x06) Angel told Cordelia that she was his dearest friend and he wanted that back. He was able to push aside his romantic feelings and desires because her friendship was more important to him than anything else.

Some may claim it’s weird for two people who referred to each other as family to be in love with each other, but when you’re in love with someone they are your family. The fact that Angel and Cordelia had that kind of connection provided them with the closeness, comfortableness, familiarity and security for those romantic feelings to blossom. Angel, in particular, had an aversion to romance because of The Curse and his experience with Buffy, but he felt so safe with Cordelia that it’s almost like he allowed himself to feel that way about him. Likewise, Cordelia was rather guarded in matters of the heart given her romantic history with Xander, but she felt so safe with Angel that she was able to finally open herself up in that way without even really realising she was. That profound connection between them can’t really be quantified, but can be seen in their actions.

5. ‘You’re not alone’: Emotional connection

When I say that it would do them a disservice to try and box Angel and Cordelia’s relationship into the platonic or romantic arena, that’s because of the emotional connection they shared which extends beyond such labels.

According to Wiki, ‘Emotional intimacy is a psychological event that happens when trust levels and communication between two people are such that it fosters the mutual sharing of one another's deepest selves.’ It involves trust, mutual trust, sense of community, understanding, open communication and sharing a duty. As you read this I’m sure you’re realising that Angel and Cordelia had all of this. They lived in close proximity day after day for years - they worked together, they fought together, they laughed together, they loved the same people (Doyle, Wes, Gunn, Fred, Connor), they grieved together (for Doyle and Connor), they shared the same beliefs and morals and they were united in the same mission to help the helpless. All of this led to them developing a profound emotional connection whereby they came to rely on each other and trust each other, and were able to open up to each other without fear of judgement or rejection (x). Throughout the series Angel and Cordy had multiple heart to hearts in which they confided in each other, encouraged or reassured each other and those talks became more regular as their connection grew. Something as simple as Angel calling Cordelia ‘Cordy’ (which he didn’t do until ATS ‘Are You Now or Have You Ever Been?’ 2x02) demonstrated that developing connection between them.

Again, it would be futile for me to list every example of when Angel and Cordelia had a scene that showed this emotional connection (particularly since you’ll have seen them all if you’ve watched the show), but off the top of my head some key examples would be - Cordelia helped Angel open up about Doyle’s death after Angel accidentally called Wesley Doyle; Cordelia helped Angel to open up about Buffy’s death after he’d spent 3 months trying to come to terms with it; when Cordelia fell ill from a vision Angel reassured her that her value to him wasn’t invested solely in her visions; generally Angel supported Cordelia repeatedly through the trauma of her visions; after Connor was born Angel developed an overly-protective paternal instinct and wouldn’t let anybody hold him, and Cordelia was the first he allowed to hold him; after Connor’s kidnapping Cordelia was able to simply sit with him in the silence and provide the emotional support no one else could and when Angel was insecure about bonding with Connor (after his return) she reassured him he was a capable and loving father.

Nothing showed the depth of that emotional connection more than the beginning of season 4 when Angel was at the bottom of the ocean. In order to hold on to his sanity, Angel repeatedly dreamt of Cordelia in various romantic scenarios and admitted to Wes and Gunn when he returned that the one thing that had kept him holding on was the thought of returning home to Cordelia. Cordy and his love for her was the tether to his humanity, his hope when everything was hopeless, his light in the dark.

I could continue exploring this because their emotional connection is demonstrated in nearly every scene they have together, but the point has been made that Angel and Cordelia consistently opened up to one another and were by each other’s sides through the hardest of times. Although they both had the rest of Angel Investigations (Wesley, Gunn, Fred and Lorne), they primarily turned to each other in their time or need or when they were feeling low. They instinctively knew what to do/say to ease each other’s insecurities, fears or anxieties and were each other’s source of emotional strength. What’s even more significant about this is that their connection was so profound, that even those around them noticed it.

6. ‘It’s the stars’: Everyone can see it

‘Everyone can see it’ is a popular romantic trope whereby a couple are perfect for each other but don’t realise their feelings for one another, but everyone else around them does. This was an integral part of Angel and Cordelia’s relationship since they found it very difficult, as friends, to make sense of their romantic feelings for each other and to acknowledge those feelings.

The first person to notice the chemistry between Angel and Cordelia was Fred in ‘Offspring’ (3x07). After seeing them sparring Fred spoke about kyrumption (two heroes meeting in battle and recognising their same fate) and moira (the gut physical attraction between two larger-than-life souls). Angel’s feelings for Cordelia had already been present long before then, but Fred’s observations provided him with an opportunity to acknowledge them for the first time and reflect on them.

Lorne being an empath naturally had an insight into Angel’s feelings and in ‘Waiting in the Wings’ (3x13) he revealed that he’d read Angel and knew he had feelings for Cordelia. Like Fred, he also spoke of kyrumption and told Angel that the way he was feeling for Cordelia was real. Lorne consistently was attuned to Angel’s feelings for Cordelia and understood that they’d grown beyond friendship. He also actively encouraged Angel to act on them because he believed Cordelia felt the same way about him and he shouldn’t miss the chance to see what they could be.

I watched ‘Waiting in the Wings’ with commentary from Whedon last week and in that he explained that the spell was a way for Angel and Cordelia to act on the feelings they had for each other (that they were only just starting to realise) in a way whereby they didn’t actually have to admit that they had those feelings and wanted to act on them (because they were afraid of the consequences). Fred and Lorne’s observations are very much the same - they’re a conduit through which Angel was able to internally explore his growing romantic feelings for Cordy and slowly come to the realisation that he was in love with her.

7. ‘Were we in love?’: Romantic love

Although I’ve been primarily focused on the general connection between Angel and Cordelia and what they brought to each other’s lives, there was definitely romantic love and attraction between the two of them and it’s important to discuss that.

I think when people compare Angel and Cordy’s relationship to Angel’s relationship with Buffy people feel Angel’s love for Cordelia wasn’t romantic or passionate, but it was, it’s just that the love he had for Cordy and their relationship was so fundamentally different from his relationship with Buffy that the two can’t really be compared. Buffy was Angel’s epic, great love - it consumed him from the inside out, it was intense, passionate and devastating - but Cordy was something entirely different. She wasn’t supposed to be some big epic love, she was supposed to be a friend with whom he developed a strong bond with and slowly came to fall in love with over time. Their love wasn’t characterised by angst-ridden scenes, grand speeches of forbidden love and sexual tension - it was grounded in family, friendship and emotional connection (as I’ve explored above). Their feelings for each other weren’t sudden and didn’t start out big (they truly were just acquaintances at the start of ATS season 1), but as they spent time together, shared experiences and got to know each other, their romantic feelings quietly grew in the background until neither of them could ignore it anymore.

It’s frustrating that we never got a clear admission of love between the two (all of their love confessions were to other people or cut off before they finished), but there is no doubt in my mind that Angel and Cordelia were in love. Their actions proved that and from a personal perspective, I could feel the love between them. Everyone will have different interpretations of when they believe the pair fell in love, but interestingly, I don’t think there’s supposed to be ‘one moment’ that they fell in love, because the whole point of their relationship is that it was never that clear cut. They didn’t go to bed one night as best friends and wake up the next day a think, “I’m in love with Angel/Cordelia!”. It was a subtle evolution of feelings over time, which neither of them truly noticed until it was brought to their attention by others, because they were so used to being friends and navigating within the realms of that, that they didn’t consider the possibility that their feelings could have gone beyond that.

Since ATS was primarily focused on Angel’s POV, it’s very easy to follow Angel’s evolving feelings for Cordelia and attempt to pin-point the moment at which his romantic feelings came to fruition. Like I said, I don’t think there was one particular moment where Angel realised his feelings for Cordelia, but in my opinion, they had definitley developed by ‘Dead End’ (2x18). At the beginning of season 2, Angel had a crisis due to Darla’s return and he fired Cordelia, Wesley and Gunn. It was really the darkest we saw Angel get in ATS whilst he had his soul, he truly lost his way for a while and Cordelia was so hurt and angry by his actions that she couldn’t forgive him. When Angel finally realised he’d made a mistake cutting his friends out of his life, he did everything he could to make amends, but he seemed most affected by the loss of Cordelia’s friendship and he was determined to earn her forgiveness. What’s interesting about this is that at this point one could argue that Angel’s friendship with Cordelia wasn’t that profound and it didn’t particularly matter if they made up, because they still could’ve worked together as co-workers (although it might’ve been a little awkward and uncomfortable). But Angel was adamant that he wanted her friendship back and almost the entirety of ‘Epiphany’ (2x16) was focused on Angel’s desire to make amends with Cordy and his devastation when she refused to accept him back. This continued in ‘Disharmony’ (2x17), with him desperately fighting to earn her forgiveness and ending with him winning Cordelia over by buying her clothes, which he was visibly happy about (x). Angel’s reaction at the prospect of losing Cordelia beckons back to ‘To Shanshu to L.A.’ (1x22) when we witnessed for the first time how scared he was to lose her and also suggests that at this point in season 2 his romantic feelings were developing for her. In the following episode ‘Dead End’ (2x18), he was so focused on making Cordelia feel better (and this was likely a continuation of him making it up to her) that he brought her food and his reaction to her saying she loved him was perhaps the brightest smile I’ve ever seen on Angel’s face (x). In ‘Belonging’ (2x19), Angel’s attraction to Cordelia was made clear when he saw her in a bikini and he also expressed anger at the director of the commercial she was filming for treating her like a ‘commodity’ and a ‘slave’, forcing him to apologise to Cordelia for the way he spoke to her and telling Cordelia he would rip his head off if she wanted him to. When Cordelia was sucked into the portal to Pylea in ‘Over the Rainbow’ (2x20), Angel’s profound emotional connection to Cordelia was clear (x) - he just wanted her back, he didn’t care how or what they had to do and he expressed that he couldn’t lose Cordy again after just getting her back (also that one line, ‘It’s Cordy’, that Angel says to Wesley when he tells Angel it’s too dangerous to go through the portal and they may never get back holds so much emotion). When Cordelia admitted to loving Groo in Pylea, Angel mistakenly thought she was saying it to him and was disappointed to learn otherwise. So basically, by the end of season 2 Angel undoubtedly had romantic feelings for Cordelia, but wasn’t yet aware of them. Season 3 continued to build on that by allowing Angel to heal following Buffy’s death and reach a resolution in ‘Heartthrob’ (3x01) whereby he could start to process his feelings for Cordy, putting him a situation where he was faced with the prospect of losing her again, therefore cementing the depth of his feelings for her (‘That Vision Thing’ 3x02) and having Fred share her observations about his feelings for her, finally allowing him to fully acknowledge them for the first time.

From Cordelia’s POV it’s much harder to guess when her romantic feelings for Angel developed, because we didn’t get as much insight into her. I do think her feelings for him didn’t come as soon as Angel’s did for her and neither did the realisation that she felt that way. ‘That Vision Thing’ (3x02) hints that Cordelia’s feelings for Angel may have begun to grow beyond friendship when she said, “If I lose the visions I wouldn't be able to help you anymore. You wouldn't need me.” Notice, Cordelia was concerned with Angel needing her, not the rest of the team. Also, since Angel was so devoted to saving Cordelia and explicitly told her she was more important to him than his vendetta against W&H, we can assume this impacted Cordelia’s feelings towards him since this was perhaps the first time she noticed how committed he was to keeping her safe and how much he wanted her in his life. I also think that witnessing Angel go through the process of becoming a father significantly impacted Cordy’s feelings for Angel. Seeing him take on the role of a father showed an even softer, nurturing side of him and the bond Cordy developed with Connor also brought them closer together. However, ‘Birthday’ (3x11) is the first episode that properly affirms the depth of Cordelia’s feelings for Angel. She was given everything she ever wanted - fame, money, stardom - and she gave it all up to return to Angel. Despite having no memory, upon seeing Angel so broken, Cordelia instinctively leaned in and kissed him fulfilling the old fairy-tale trope of true love’s kiss breaking the spell. I think from Cordelia’s POV, she was much more closed off to allowing herself to acknowledge her romantic feelings for Angel because she didn’t even consider Angel a romantic option given The Curse. This also explains why upon Groo’s return in season 3, she resumed her relationship with him despite having clearly developed profound romantic feelings for Angel that led her to prioritise him above Groo repeatedly to the point that Groo himself noticed that she had feelings for Angel.

This brings me back to the main point about Angel and Cordelia’s romantic feelings for each other never being straightforward or easily defined. In ‘Waiting in the Wings’ (3x13) it was clear - spell or no spell - that Angel and Cordelia shared a mutual sexual attraction and that Angel’s canonically confirmed romantic feelings for Cordelia were reciprocated. Yet Cordelia didn’t confirm her feelings for him explicitly to the audience until 9 episodes later in the finale of the season. This is for a number of reasons, but primarily because it was easier to continue denying their feelings and remain friends than face the complications that a romance posed. Even if they had been given the chance to openly express their feelings for each other, what would’ve happened next? As Angel said to Lorne in ‘Waiting in the Wings’, what could he offer her (as a cursed vampire)? It would’ve been too complicated and they knew that.

That criss-cross and complexity of their love is part of the reason I love them so much, because it’s authentic and relatable. Particularly in the case of friends who have fallen in love - it’s no easy transition and it’s definitely not easy to make sense of your feelings Plus, Angel and Cordy had the added complications that went with their life (Angel being a vampire, The Curse, Darla, their friends, Angel Investigations, W&H and the supernatural world generally, to name a few). In an interview a long time ago SMG said that the most heartbreaking thing about Buffy and Angel was that it was unfulfilled love, and in this respect so are Angel and Cordelia. It’s heartbreaking because they truly loved one another but they were never even given the opportunity to see what they could potentially be. They missed their chance and because of that they were always left wondering ‘what if?’

8. ‘I’ll be seeing you’: Missed Opportunity

The fact that Angel and Cordy never got their shot to be together (which they discussed in ‘You’re Welcome’ 5x11) is the tragedy of their love. However, it wouldn’t be the same love story if it didn’t have that unresolved element to it. Everybody longs for closure and resolution with their ships, but the truth is, in real life few people truly get that, they simply have to move on and live with their regrets. But whilst I love Angel and Cordelia’s relationship and story as it is, there’s no escaping the fact that they were done dirty in seasons 4 and 5 in regards to the writing and as a result their story did go in a...shall we say unfavourable direction?

Everyone that’s ever watched ATS has problems with season 4 (I could write a separate post about the problems with season 4, particularly in regards to Cordelia’s character), and when it comes to Angel and Cordelia’s relationship, there’s a lot that was handled badly which unfortunately, derailed the beautiful development that took place between them in season 3. We still had a lot of key moments that played out between Angel and Cordelia in season 4, but the main problem with the season is that we don’t actually know when Cordelia was actually Cordelia. At what point was she herself, if she ever was? Did she really have amnesia? If so, can we count amnesia!Cordy as still being Cordy to an extent? When did Jasmine start to take over? Did she have any agency at all when she was possessed by Jasmine, even if it was only the briefest of moments? All of these questions remain unanswered and make it very difficult to fully assess the Angel/Cordelia relationship during season 4, but I’m going to try to anyway.

What remained clear throughout season 4 was that Angel loved Cordy. In fact, despite Cordelia technically being absent for the majority of the season, it was very Cangel-heavy, perhaps more than the seasons before it. Angel had multiple dreams/fantasies about Cordelia, devoted himself to finding her when she was missing at the start of the season, was visibly distraught to have her lose her memories and strike up a relationship with Connor, and lost his soul from a fantasy of making love to her. In my opinion, this is the season that really affirmed that Angel was in love with Cordy beyond any doubt. When Angel asked Cordelia if they were in love and she replied, “We were”, I strongly believe that was Cordelia. She’d just gotten her memories back so Jasmine hadn’t had chance to worm her way to the forefront yet, and I believe in that moment that was Cordelia finally breaking through and telling Angel that she loved him. Although the circumstances are ambiguous to say the least, I believe this to be the first admission of love exchanged between the two whereby the words were said plainly (because obviously they said ‘I love you’ to each other repeatedly before this moment in other ways). However, this doesn’t undo the dirty that was done to Angel and Cordelia in this season. Despite the fact that we know Cordelia wasn’t responsible for any of her actions since she was possessed by Jasmine, it’s still very hard when watching her with Connor to separate Jasmine from Cordelia. And from Angel’s perspective, he literally watched the woman he loved have sex with his son. Finding out afterwards that it wasn’t actually Cordelia doesn’t reduce the devastating impact of witnessing that and the way the Cordelia!Jasmine arc was written did taint some aspects of their relationship by forcing Angel to have to witness ‘Cordelia’ enter into a romantic relationship with Connor and have a child with him. Also, it was utterly ridiculous and unbelievable that Angel and co. wouldn’t recognise that Cordy wasn’t herself. This is definitely a writing issue, because the whole possession thing was handled so badly in the respect that Cordelia seemed like herself (even her sleeping with Connor was believable due to her amnesiac state), but it was still not in-keeping with the show that none of her friends (and especially Angel) would notice that Cordelia was possessed. Overall, season 4 did a huge disservice to Angel and Cordelia’s romance (although the biggest disservice was definitely done to Cordelia’s character) and whilst their relationship was beautifully developed in seasons 1-3, season 4 stopped that development in its tracks.

Season 5 continued to do a disservice to Cordelia (and Angel and Cordelia) by practically erasing Cordy from existence (I know that backstage issues with the cast need to be taken into consideration here, but the lack of consideration to Cordelia’s character is still a valid point to discuss). Despite how utterly terrified Angel was whenever faced with the prospect of losing Cordelia, in season 5 he was visibly fine about Cordelia being in a coma and wasn’t even attempting to pull her out of it. The fact that Angel (and co.) would simply stand by and go on with the rest of their lives without devoting every single second to waking Cordy is ridiculous and completely OOC for all of them. Angel, Wes, Gunn, Fred, Lorne and Cordy were deeply connected and would have done anything for each other, and there’s no way they would’ve given up on Cordy like that. But back to the point, despite Angel being in love with Cordelia throughout season 4, there was no reference to his feelings for her until ‘You’re Welcome’ (5x11). Now, don’t get me wrong, I love that episode and I always will, but I also can’t help but notice how out of place that episode feels within the rest of the season. In the episodes leading up to it Cordelia was barely mentioned and in the episodes afterwards, her death was completely ignored with only a few passing references from Angel near the end of the season (don’t even get me started on the fact that she didn’t even get a funeral. What the hell was that all about?!?!? This is Cordy.) Furthermore, Angel reverted back to being actively in love with Buffy (particularly in ‘The Girl in Question’ 5x20, which is honestly such a bad episode, I can’t even) with no consideration given to the fact that he had feelings for Cordelia. Personally, I believe all of these consistencies come from fan pandering - the reaction to Angel and Cordelia becoming a couple was very negative so they reverted back to the Angel/Buffy relationship because it was so popular and well-loved. But back to, ‘You’re Welcome’, the episode definitely redeemed some of what was done to Cordelia (and her relationship with Angel) by giving her/them a satisfying ending after an horrendous season 4, but nothing can truly make up for the fact that Angel and Cordelia’s relationship was so abruptly ended in the manner it was. It also can’t make up for the fact that we missed out on two entire seasons worth of development that we would’ve potentially got if the Jasmine plot hadn’t taken place (again, I understand this was largely down to behind-the-scenes complications with Charisma and Whedon).

These flaws in the writing (and execution of the relationship) in seasons 4 and 5 is far and above my biggest criticism of Angel and Cordelia’s relationship as a whole (although it’s a criticism of the writers more so than Cordelia and Angel or David and Charisma). It never would have made sense for Angel and Cordy to have a plain sailing fairy-tale romance, but they had so much more potential and could have grown to become something even more beautiful if season 4 had continued to build upon their development from seasons 1-3. ‘You’re Welcome’ perfectly demonstrates the potential they had and what they could’ve become if Cordelia hadn’t been possessed by Jasmine. And that was only a taster and we could’ve had, we could’ve so much more. In my opinion, there were no limits on where their relationship could have been taken since it was so well written, built-up and established leading up to season 4. The fact that we’ll never know how the relationship would’ve played out if it had continued is sad, but as I said, that missed chance that they had is key to Angel and Cordelia’s relationship. It’s the one that got away, the love that could never be and that one person whom we always wonder, “What if?” about.

9. ‘There are no people like us’: Why Angel/Cordelia are misunderstood and live in Buffy/Angel’s shadow

The final section I wanted to do is an exploration of the reasons why I feel Cordelia and Angel are misunderstood as a ship and how I believe this primarily stems from the fact that they live in Buffy/Angel’s shadow. This is where I’ll be comparing Angel/Cordelia and Buffy/Angel, so if you’re a fan of Buffy/Angel, you may not want to read this final section. However, this isn’t anti-Buffy/Angel, it’s really me working through my own thoughts and feelings as both a Buffy/Angel and a Angel/Cordelia shipper (yes, we exist haha).

People have a tendency to make comparisons between the Angel/Cordelia and Buffy/Angel relationship two relationships, when in reality (as I’ve mentioned above) the two aren’t really comparable. Angel’s relationships with Buffy and Cordelia were distinctive, took place under completely different circumstances and brought different things to his life. Angel was fully engaged in a romantic relationship with Buffy for 2 years (on and off), but he never had the opportunity to do that with Cordelia. The romantic feelings were there, as was the potential for them to act on that and see what they could be, but it didn’t happen. So to compare the two relationships (when technically Angel and Cordy never entered into a romantic relationship) is futile to say the least. However, people naturally make those comparisons and when they do they seem to come up with two key reasons Angel/Cordelia are inferior to Buffy/Angel:

1. Sexual relationship/chemistry - It hasn’t escaped my attention that Buffy and Angel have a lot more sexual chemistry than Angel and Cordelia. Honestly, in my opinion, nothing can really compare to SMG/David chemistry, it’s so damn good. However, this criticism simply fails to understand that Angel and Cordelia’s love/connection never was primarily one of a sexual nature (notice that every fantasy Angel ever had of Cordelia was romantic not sexual). Romance was definitely part of their relationship (particularly in seasons 3, 4 and 5) and they had an attraction and they had chemistry (’Waiting in the Wings’ damn well proved that), but their relationship was never about sex. In comparison to Angel and Buffy, their relationship was deeply rooted in attraction. From the moment they meet each other they’re very physically attracted to each other and in seasons 1 and 2 they both make references made to how badly they want to kiss each other whenever they’re together, whilst in season 3 they discuss the difficulties they find in fighting against their sexual attraction to each other. As a result, Angel and Buffy’s relationship was always heavily steeped in sexual tension. The fact that Angel and Cordelia’s relationship didn’t have the same level of sexual attraction doesn’t make that relationship any less important, just different (which I know I keep saying, but it’s kind of my whole argument here - the two relationships are so fundamentally different you can’t compare them).

2. Buffy is Angel’s one and only true love - There’s no denying that Buffy was and always will be Angel’s great love, but to quote one of my not-so-favourite shows (The Vampire Diaries), contrary to popular belief, people can (and usually do) have more than one great love in their lives. Clinging too tightly to the Buffy/Angel relationship ignores the immense changes Angel undergoes on ATS and the fact he moved on from Buffy (up until Spike’s return in season 5, which reverts him back to being kind of obsessed with Buffy, which is such bad writing and so inconsistent that it annoys me. And this isn’t including crossovers either, because damn, they’re so problematic/inconsistent and I didn’t even realised until I watched ATS, but I can see now why the writers didn’t want to do too many crossovers despite the fans wanting them). Buffy was always in Angel’s heart and he always carried her with him, but he didn’t actively pine over her or yearn for her when he moved to L.A. (he did more so in season 1 and particularly after the events of ‘I Will Remember You’, but he slowly moved on). Angel conclusively and healthily moved on from Buffy - he established a life for himself which he loved and made him happy, he found a home, friends and embarked on a new love with Cordy. When two people have shared a love like Angel did with Buffy, it never goes away but it does change and it almost grows dormant (for reference, there’s a brilliant meta that discusses Angel moving on from Buffy which you can read here). To use a real life example here, my mom (who’s now 50) has been in around 5 serious long-term relationships in her life and has been with her current partner for 5 years and is completely in love with him. However, she’s openly admitted to me that she loved my dad more than she’s ever loved any man and she still regards him the love of her life. That doesn’t mean she’s still in love with him, because she’s not. She hasn’t seen him in two decades, she’s moved on and she’s found love with someone new. That love she had with him is a memory in her head and her heart, but it has no place in her life now. She’s a different person, her life has changed dramatically and that love is in the past. If he rocked up now he’d be a stranger to her and regardless of those memories she has of him, he’s no longer the person she’s in love with. That’s exactly what happened with Buffy and Angel. They always loved each other, but Angel truly did move forward (whether Buffy moved on is something I’m less unsure of). In ‘Heartthrob’ (3x01) Angel told James that he’d lost the woman he loved (Buffy) and that he had loved her with his whole heart. In response, James said that that couldn’t be true because if it was, when she had died Angel would’ve died along with her. After that, in a scene with Cordy (x), Angel admitted that he was okay and had dealt with Buffy’s death and how he felt guilty about that. In my opinion, this episode (and those scenes in particular) confirmed that Angel had moved on from Buffy and had gotten to a place where he could finally open himself up to Cordelia wholeheartedly. In fact, David spoke about how Angel had moved on from Buffy and that Cordy was what he needed (he also mentioned Darla, which is a topic I won’t get into because I could write an entirely separate post about that too) and here’s what he said:

Interviewer: Darla killed herself, right? The baby's mother? Who's gonna step up and help Angel raise the baby? Buffy?

David: God, no. Buffy's pretty much out of the picture. They've played their storyline and that's just the past. I think between Cordelia and Fred he'll be mommied to death. But, Buffy's just the past.

Interviewer: Oh, come on. Buffy can never really be just the past, can she? I mean, that's Angel's soulmate.

David: I think Darla was probably his soulmate. I mean, they spent a hundred years together, then made a baby. You can't just--

Interviewer: Well, then Buffy was his first love.

David: Angel was Buffy's first love, but Angel loved Darla in a sick way.

Interviewer: I'm a Buffy/Angel fan. Sorry.

David: You're forgiven. No, I'm just saying that the two shows are on different networks and it's not gonna happen. There's no more story there for those two. Buffy isn't Angel's priority anymore. In season one and two of our show, she was always in the back of his mind, well, now it's all about the baby and Buffy is just, well, she's just a person he used to know.

Interviewer : Awww, come on! The story there was so incredible.

David: And like every good story, it came to an end. And then started over. On. Different. Networks. (again with the emphasis)

Interviewer : Is Angel going to hook up with Cordy?

David: Well, I'm all for it. I don't know what the writers have planned in that regard, but I'm a fan of Charisma's work and I'd love for our characters to be romantically involved. Cordy is really what Angel needs, I believe. (x)

See, it’s important to acknowledge that as amazing as Buffy and Angel’s story was, they broke up and went their separate ways. As David rightfully pointed out, it was the past and Buffy was no longer his priority. It’s always frustrated me that Angel was expected not to move on and to pine for Buffy, whilst Buffy was allowed to move on and find love again. The argument is that Angel was so much older than Buffy that he couldn’t or rather shouldn’t want to find love, whilst Buffy was still young, but the problem is, although Angel was technically old, he was still a teenager himself in terms of his experiences in love. He didn’t have a soul for 100 years so was incapable of love and then he spent 100 years when he had a soul cut off from the world. He had barely experienced anything the world had to offer and he certainly hadn’t had the opportunity to forge connections with others or explore the world of love. Buffy was able to move on from Angel and experience different types of relationships/loves with Parker (urgh), Riley and Spike (amongst others who she flirted with or briefly dated post-BTVS season 3). Angel deserved the same opportunity to experience new types of relationships that were different than the one he had with Buffy. I’m going to use another quote The Vampire Diaries because I feel it sums this up perfectly, “I realised that I may not be able to explain what I feel for her, but it is something, and, yeah, maybe all love isn't true love in the messed up way that you and I have experienced it, but I think this could turn into something even better.” This right here is exactly how I perceive Angel’s feelings for Buffy and Cordelia to be. Angel had only ever loved one person, Buffy was all he’d ever known of love and it was so big, messy and all-consuming , but with Cordelia he realised that love didn’t necessarily have to be like that and that there are different types of love.

There’s no disputing that Angel never loved Cordelia in the same way he loved Buffy (which this post explains perfectly) - Angel will never love anyone the way he loved Buffy, but he did fall in love with Cordelia and she enriched his life in new ways and filled a void in him in much the same way Buffy did. During ATS Cordelia surpassed Buffy in importance simply because of the place she had in Angel’s life - she was the center of his world and without her it wouldn’t be the same (we saw that in season 5). It would be unfair to claim Angel couldn’t or shouldn’t love someone else just because he had such an intense love with Buffy. What makes his relationship with Cordelia so special is that it was so different than the love he had with Buffy. Those two loves will always sit in contrast to each other, but will never overshadow or replace one another because they’re both significant and special for different reasons.

The point of talking about this was really just to highlight that Angel and Cordelia’s relationship is not by any means invalid or inferior because of Buffy/Angel. Both relationships are important and exist in contrast to each other. Angel and Cordelia’s relationship does tend to be misunderstood and/or unappreciated due to the nature of the writing (which had a lot of problems in seasons 4 and 5, and even a little in season 3) and because they’re too heavily compared to the hot and heavy romance between Angel and Buffy. However, Angel and Cordelia’s relationship developed organically over time in a subtle way and is demonstrative of how much relationships can evolve as life progresses and circumstances change, and how two people can grow together. Theirs was a story about two people, who in the beginning were indifferent to each other, but grew to know each other profoundly and found a lot through being in each others lives - purpose, belonging, family, friendship and love - and through having and sharing that, they fell in love. It’s not a conventional romantic love as most of us would expect, and they didn’t have the chances to fully explore their romantic connection because their story ended prematurely, but it was a beautiful relationship embedded in human connection and friendship at the deepest and purest level.

If you got to the end of this, thank you so much for reading. This took me days and days to write and edit, so I’m really grateful to you for reading and would appreciate likes/reblogs if you found this interesting. I’d also love to hear your thoughts on this topic, so if you have any feel free to stop by my ask box :)

#angel the series #ats #cangel #angel x cordelia #ats meta #angel the series meta #cangel meta #mine #my meta #i can't even explain how long this took to write #i just hope that at least one person reads it now lmao #i spent so long on my last meta about the punisher and that has no notes #i guess even if no one reads it i get the enjoyment out of writing it and that's what counts

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taki118 · 5 years

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How I’d do a new God’s movie

So DC has confirmed a New Gods movie, my one real hope is it doesnt get caught in devlopment hell. But this is my rough idea of what should happen. It’s rough but I think it hits the beats it needs. (Please ignore my misspelling names)

Ok we open it’s the dead of night you can barely see anything but you hear a boy panting and we see it’s a young Scott running slowly we hear alarms and guards yelling and realize this boy is in a prison we get some shots of him like counting corridors showing he’s done this before and is memorizing the layout and have some parkour and acrobatics displayed. He stumbles a few times showing he’s tired but has to keep moving then he hears a voice cry out

“I’m sorry I’m sorry granny I’ll behave please please it hurts”

Scott stops for a second it’s down the wrong way he almost runs away from the screams but in the end runs towards it. Scott finds a girl strung up against a wall crying out in agony Scott knows this room and what’s happening he takes a bit of food and water out of his pack and gives it to her saying

“I can’t pick the lock but you’ll get be out soon just stay strong a few more days” She can’t say more than “why?” Before Scott runs again the guards gaining on him he makes it out and with how recoil at the light smiling in relief as we pan out to the hellscape that is apokopis before he’s dragged back in violently by guards

We cut to Scott in a cell battered and bruised and a soothing voice calls “Why do you keep doing this to yourself my boy? You won’t always get off Scott Free like this” Scott and granny back and forth about his escapes until Scott snaps “I WILL ESCAPE I WILL GET OFF THIS PLANET AND WHEN I GET TO NEW GENISIS” granny smacks him silent the the kind tone dropped stating to the guards he has yet to learn his lesson offering a threat of a new education tool

So we jump forward Scott is an adult and working for darksied he’s giving a report to his father with a pleased granny looking on she thinks she’s won.

We get some shots of the inside of darksieds fortress and the cruelty that takes place there. Scott gets out on a mission to retrieve the final part of the anti life equation but doesn’t take it seriously believing it another wild goose chase but it isn’t this snaps Scott

He rembers his promise to his younger self pretends the mission was a failure and tries to secure a mother box for himself to get off apolkolips undetected cause he knows the second darksied has this it means the end to everything

He makes his way through apokolpis and gets a broken mother box it’s faulty but darksied won’t know. He tries to fix it but is found out before he’s done and uses it landing not on new genesis but earth yet Scott can’t see the difference to him it’s heaven.

Scott marvels at the blue sky, the green grass and people walking around without a care. He wanders the area trying to find someone to give the equation to but obviously he’s met with stares the police try to apprehend him but a man comes to his assistance telling them he’s a method actor.

Scott is confused no one has ever helped him before the man introduces himself as oberon and says something like "You know most people say Thank You when someone sticks their next out to help" to which scott replies "Oh um thank you" and "is this New genisis?" and suddenly it hits Oberon this guy aint from earth

Oberon takes Scott to his home a failing theater where they eat on the stage. Scott eats like he's never had food before and it kinda grosses oberon out. Oberon summarizes what Scott has told him in a he cant really believe this is happening to him sort of way.

Scott says he can't get to New Genisis until he can fix the mother box which was damaged even more in the trip. Oberon offers Scott a place to stay with him but he aint a charity worker and scott will have to help him out. Again scott is confused and aks why oberon is doing this he replies simply "Looks like you could use some help is all"

meanwhile back on apkolpis they have found a way to track scott Granny sends her most ruthless and devoted charge head of the female furies Big Barda to find Scott. She accepts with bravado and lands in the same city scott she too is confounded by earth.

Scott helps oberon with up keep to the theatre but he can barely get a crowd in i would 100% have him make a crack like "You know not even 10 years ago this place got THE Giovanni Zatara now it cant even get his daughter"

While Scott tries to help oberon and fix his mother box Barda has accidentally been becoming a hero. Oberon and Scott bond more while watching tv and oberon essientally gives Scott the talk (like he sees a couple on tv being affectionate and asks what they're doing and why and oberon goes "its you know nice gives comfort and stuff")

Eventually scott stumbles on an old straight jacket and asks what it is Oberon happily exclaims it belonged to Mister Miracle an escape artist and headliner at the theater he puts it on Scott when he turns his back to look for an old sign to show scott has already disposed of it. Obero gets an idea.

Barda is having trouble tracking scott down and is having a bit of an identity crisis doubting she even wants to go back, then she shes an advertizment for a familiar face. Mister Miracle has booked a full house as scott entertains with his skills after the show when the pair celebrates. Barda arrives and fight ensues. Eventually with the assitance of Oberon Scott gets the upper hand trapping Barda

Scott ponders what to do with barda while oberon is away. he says "Every voice in my head says I should kill you" she replies "So why don't you?" he can't answer.

The pair begin to talk about this strange planet when news of her "heroics" shows up on the news. Eventually scott offers Barda food. And it hits her

"It was you." she reminds him of the time he helped her during one of his escape attempts. She asks "Why? All these years and I could never understand why you did that?" Scott thinks for a moment and says "I just couldn't ignore your pain."

Soon enough Barda agrees that darksied can't get the equation. she agrees to use her mother box to take them to new genisis. Scott is excited but finds he doesnt want to leave and has a heart to heart with oberon who says

"he never expected to have an alien as a friend" Scott says "I've never had a friend" "Well i'm glad to be your first."

They arrive on new genisis its everything apoklpis isnt its bright, clean, organized, sterile and cold. Its nothing scott imaged it'd be. he and barda make their way to high fathers castle where he explains the treaty he and darksied had made and that scott is his true son. Scott is distressed by this and begins to wonder if he should give the equation over to a man who would willingly allow darkseid to exisits.

he talks with barda about their shared experiences. tentaively scott interocks his hand with bardas she asks what hes doing?

"Something they do on earth to give comfort, is it working?" "Yeah i think it is" They dont get to enjoy this long as apokoliptan ships are seen in the distance.

A battle ensues and before scott gets caputred barda sends him off with her mother box smiling sadly as he calls out to her. Held captive by her former allies and mentor Barda tells them she wont break.

Alone scott realizes he's done running and travels back to apokolips he sneaks about using his knowledge of the place to cause havok confusing darksieds generals. Soon he manages to save Barda who does the same by letting loose some of darksieds most uncontrollable monsters.

Scott confronts granny with barda and offers her the equation in exchange for their freedom. Granny thinks she has the upperhand and takes the deal. What she doesn't know is scott took another part of the equation they already had with him. by the time the realize what he's done they're gone leaving darkseid to smirk stating "That one always had the greatest potential"

Barda and Scott now live on Earth with Oberon as the New Gods of earth. The movie ends with them watching news feed of Justice League fighting. Barda states "They look like they could use some help." Scott replies "Why not?"

#dc comics #dceu #wishful thoughts #mister miracle #new gods #fouth world #big barda #scott free

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jojofurkmelifu · 6 years

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Steven and the Diamonds

White Diamond: Yes I will look at the memory data on this Pearl *looks at it* Steven:So anything? White Diamond:Quite the adventure you have been on Pink Diamond, no Rose Quartz Steven:Rose Quartz? White Diamond:Oh sorry I meant STEVEN UNVIERSE *Steven shits his pants* Steven:Um I can explain White Diamond:No need you thing I understand exactly what you are, but the fact something of your existence has set foot in my presence really bothers me Steven:I guess I'll just be going now heh heh White Diamond:No stay Blue Diamond:Huh shes not Pink? Yellow Diamond:Where is PInk? Tell us Rose! White Diamond:Thats not Rose you idiots, Rose is just one of Pink's many alter egos she tricked us for thousands of years Blue Diamond:So she never died? Yellow Diamond:What? What? Then what is that thing down there? White Diamond:Some sort of combination of gem and organic from Earth identified as the sound "Steven Universe" Blue Diamond:So thats what you meant by Steven you little! Steven:Diamonds please I can explain White Diamond:Calm down you two dont make noise in my court *Blue and Yellow shit their pants* White Diamond:Pink my dear Pink perhaps its time I give you a reality check Steven:Huh White Diamond:Millions of years ago I decided to create three constructs to follow my grand creation the gem empire that would one day conquer the entire universe in time. I didnt have to create you three I could have ruled it by myself, GEMS ARE MY CREATIONS NOT YOURS I JUST LOAN THEM TO YOU REMEMBER THAT. It also means you are also mine you do what I say, i gave you life and I can take it away anytime I wish. So the least you ungrateful children can do is MAKE ME HAPPY! Blue and Yellow are wonderful daughters but you you you you ohhhhhh. Im so disgusted I cant even think straight *breathes in* Pink I gave you a colony 900,000 years ago and you messed up big time so I decided to held off giving you one until after you matured. I thought you matured but I was wrong

White Diamond:It seems as though you are unfit for running a colony or commanding gems meaning you have no purpose as a diamond. It means I was wrong I HATE BEING WRONG I HATE IT! Me a perfect being wrong its unfathomable! Three perfect creations that all I asked for! ALL I ASKED FOR! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The failure of gems dont matter to me but you are my personal creations you must never fail you have to be perfect like me why arent you like me! *she breaks down into tears* Blue:Pink you made White cry Yellow:Steven I know Pink is there I can sense her in you, what do you have to say for yourself Steven:Look I dont know whats really going on here Im just a human from Earth, and Pink Diamond is my mom Im just doing this because I dont want the Earth to be seen as an enemy to the Diamond Authority so could you please leave Earth alone? White Diamond:Leave it alone! That planet is now a reminder of my imperfection it must be eviscerated. Blue:I agree Yellow:Absolutely Steven:Oh no :( White Diamond:So Steven Universe return to your rock and enjoy your last days with your species until their extinction at our hands, and blame no one but your stupid "mother" Pink Diamond for your suffering. Steven:Wait please dont do this, kill me instead leave the people of Earth alone! Blue:Never Yellow:We never let any species that disrespects us live at all its just protocol Steven Universe White Diamond:As for you Pink I can believe Im doing this, you are clearly banned from the Diamond Authority forever. You will be seen as a nongem to all gems form this moment, you will have no diamond privileges, you will not be allowed on any gem controlled territory either. Your court will be split and shared among your sisters, and your planet will be given to either Blue or Yellow but it seems they want to destroy it so Ill just give the entire star system to one of them no need to waste all of that matter.

*Steven breaks down in tears* Steven:Please Ill do anything to make you not destroy Earth Blue:What part of Never can you not understant SteVON Universe? Yellow:Hmphf we are done here now get of this planet White Diamond:Remember you thing this is all Pink Diamond's fault, gather up this worthless Pearl, those "crystal gems" and your pet leave this planet. Never come back or you will be sorry Pink Ill do something far worse than killing you stupid girl. *Blue begins crying* Blue:You went too far this time! It breaks my heart that I cant even consider my sister one of my own anymore but I'll still love you no matter what Pink we just wont see each other anymore forever Yellow:Stupid runt this is goodbye it was fun I guess little sister *Yellow Diamond shows slight signs of sniffling* White Diamond:If you are gonna make that noise do it outside my court! *Blue and Yellow leave* *Steven gets the gang and they take a ship back to earth, the ship self destructs after it leaves them on Earth to ensure they can never get back to Homeworld* *Steven falls to the ground in utter defeat unable to even talk* *Connie begins freaking out about the upcoming gem invasion* *The crystal gems begin crying as well*

*weeks past and Steven is suffering from intense despair and depression over the ordeal* *Greg is sad as well his Stewball is a sad sack* *Back at the temple* Garnet:So its war then a second gem war but we have no forces we need some sort of rebel army Bismuth:We only survived because it was staged by Rose I mean Pink Diamond in real war we cant beat the Diamonds Garnet:So what do we do? Bismuth:Look I know Rose sorry Pink Diamond loved this planet but if it means Im going to be killed for it then Im out Lapis:I agree its just one planet out of many that has water on it Peridot:A logical assertion but Steven really likes this planet so I cant give up on it because hes my friend Lapis:Steven will be really happy with me and him just alone somewhere out there in the cosmos just us two hehehehehe *Bismuth gives a wtf expression* Garnet:Steven cant be reasoned with right now hes pretty down so all we can do is try to make him happish by giving him hope he can stand on Bismuth:Yellow can instantly end us this is not a fight at all its a massacre its like a star fighting an asteroid there just is no chance at victory. Peridot:Maybe the cluster can help? Garnet:Huh? Peridot:Its friends with Steven but the cluster should be able to match the diamonds in power Garnet:Its a gem fusion meaning one hit from Yellow and its over Bismuth:In my fight with the diamonds they are pretty indestructable nothing we used even scratched them and that White Diamond is said to be even more powerful than those two combined and shes coming here too Garnet:Right White Diamond how do we stop her? Lapis:Lets just run away and take Steven with us! Hes gonna outlive all the creatures on this planet anyway but we can live forever with him. Bismuth:I made an oath to Steven Lazuli I cant just betray him Im not his mother Pearl:Uhhh well are there any bright ideas?

Peridot:The only way to beat a diamond is to use a diamond, a diamond has more power than all gem armies put together non fusion wise I mean if we had one we could destroy every army Homeworld throws at us Bismuth:We do? Garnet:Steven isnt Pink Diamond Pearl:Actually the gem on Steven's belly is Pink Diamond so we could bring her back if Steven were dead? But I would never do something like that even if the planet Pink wasted her life on was threatened. Bismuth:Right.... Garnet: If only there was a way to summon Pink without killing Steven, Steven even if he could use Pink's power doesnt have the mindset to really fight the Diamonds we need her Pearl:Well Im not supposed to tell you this but you could talk to her you know *every gem looks at her dumbfounded* Garnet:Pearl why? Why?! Bismuth:You have got to be kidding me I think Im gonna drown my face in some magma again this time for 400 years Peridot:What a revelation! hahaha Lapis:What? Pearl:Im sorry I couldnt really tell you Garnet:Talk to Pink Diamond I dont know Ruby and Sapphire wont like that Bismuth:Its the only way Pearl:Very Well then Ill show you.

*They are in some sort of dimensional space for minds or something* *They see Steven playing in field* Garnet:Steven why are you so cheerful? "Steven":Im always cheerful Garnet I love being human and happy ahahahaha Garnet:Rose Steven:Oh no you found out *Steven morphs into Pink Diamond* PD:So you found out huh? What did you think was it funny? Garnet:Funny? Do you have any idea how many gems died because of you? PD:Oh man you should have seen Blue crying it was hilarious Garnet:Pink why did you start the rebellion? You told me as Rose it was the protect the Earth was that true? PD:This again Garnet I already told you no more questions, but if you wanna know yes I did start the rebellion because all attempts at the Earth being ran my style failed Garnet:Was it worth it? PD:Earth is still here right so yes Ameythst:Uh hey Rose I mean Pink Diamond you are my diamond right so like Im supposed to follow you. PD:No I dont care what you do I dont really care if gems grovel to me Ameythst:Wow you are so much cooler than those duds back on Homeworld PD:My Ameythsts understand me so well Bismuth:You told me that the diamonds are the enemy and that our reward for winning the rebellion was freedom, and yet you bubbled me PD:Bismuth how are you doing, it been thousands of years still making weapons I see Bismuth:Dont change the subject PD:Sigh you have freedom no diamond is telling you what to do right? Theres your freedom embrace it Pearl:My diamond because of your actions planet Earth is at risk PD:What but the faking of my death? Pearl:Unfortunately thanks to your son the diamonds found out about it PD:Oh Steven Pearl:So I ask you what we your orders for the upcoming invasion? PD:I dunno why are you asking me I dont anything about tactics, Rose Quartz was really me thinking up stuff on the fly Im not military person you see Bismuth:Um..... Pearl:My diamond I understand you can be quite whimsical but this is serious

PD:Well nobody told him to talk to my sisters did they? Pearl:My diamond hes only a child he felt guilty over the things you did and he felt it was the best way to save Earth PD:A child ignores what mom and dad keeps hidden from them, I guess Steven's just a bad kid reminds me of myself sometimes Im so proud of him Garnet:Ahem, your sisters are gonna invade this planet what are you plans? PD:I just told you I got no plans Pearl:What if Earth is destroyed? PD:Oh well at least do me a favor stuff my sweet Greg into a pocket space so I can play with him for the rest of time will you Pearl Pearl:You remember the human PD:Oh Greg I miss you so much how I loved your organic tentacles inside of my body! Pearl:Too much information my diamond

(courtesy of /sug/ we need this as you do)

#/sug #/sug/#sug #steven universe #su #white diamond #blue diamond #Yellow Diamond #pink diamond #steven quartz universe #pearl #garnet #bismuth #lapis #peridot #4chan #not mine #diamonds #Diamond authority

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theflowersofdoom · 5 years

Text

gonna talk about my spooky side account lore bc its unabashedly my favorite

sam and his sibling max lost their parents to to the bringer when they were really young. they were freed from terror mountain when the hannah thing went down. sam had trouble adjusting and stayed in terror mountain for awhile while max eagerly went out into world. the two kept in constant contact, until max suddenly stopped replying after he traveled to the haunted woods. sam decided to leave for the haunted woods to look for his sibling, and had a pretty terrifying time of it until he met lonnie

lonnie is a ne’er-do-well grave robber squatting in an abandoned house in the middle of the haunted woods. he found a very afraid and confused sam stumbling around and took him in with the intention of using him to help in illegal activities. sam, being cut off form the world for 10000 yrs and being generally too trusting, enthusiastically goes along with him. the two run around causing trouble and eventually lonnie finds himself actually CARING about this sweet bori

paix was born to a terrestrial aisha and alien aisha couple and was raised exclusively on the virupets space station. her childhood had a backdrop of constant and oppressive paranoia of sloth. her family had several connections with the resistance and as a result knew several ppl who either disappeared or were seriously negatively effected by the sloth empire. she even lived through the sloth takeover of virtupets, which while thankfully was relatively uneventful on the part of the station her family lived in, it was still pretty terrifying for 10-or-smth yr old. while all this died down when paix grow up to adult, her parents were still very protective, not allowing paix or her little sister to travel unsupervised and helicoptered pretty bad. paix prided her self in being very level headed, but then one of her only friends disappeared while tracking down a sloth aligned organization and is presumed dead, paix is absolutely devastated, and in the months following his disappearance she quietly takes a small, former resistance ship from a family friend. she intended on flying it to neo central and parking it somewhere visible where the authorities would find it and return it with her apology note sitting in the seat of the cockpit, meanwhile shes in faerieland or mystery island, she doesnt know where just anywhere she’ll figure it out when she gets there.

what ACTUALLY happened was a little more dramatic than she intended

paix initially and rightfully doesnt trust lonnie much, but he IS nice enough to let her stay at his house after she crashed into his back yard (is this even his house? i looks like its been run down for a while). sam was amazed in meeting a real alien and paix liked him well enough, hes a very kind guy, but still the whole situation was suspect

she probably wouldnt have stayed for long if lonnie hadnt up and died on them

paix suspected murder, from what sam says lonnie wasnt the most liked person around, but its not like theres any laws this is the haunted woods. as far as sam knows lonnie doesnt have any family, he thinks once there was a sister mentioned but he didnt even get a first name. the only family sam had left was a missing sibling he had been trying to find for a year now. so paix helps sam bury him in the back yard

paix takes on a lot of the responsibilities, like get food and telling people that lonnie is in fact dead, he wont be bothering you anymore. she even starts helping sam in his attempts to track down his sibling (shes not super optimistic but its not like shes going to tell sam that).

at first paix thinks that sam is just very, VERY upset. he hasnt been very tired and acting a little strange, but his friend just died in front of him, its not like she has any room to judge. but as time goes on, things seem increasingly off. theres breif moments where sam seems to be his old self, but more and more he seems confused. paix finds him standing in the middle of the hall, staring at the wall. theres times where sam doesnt remember where hes been or what he was doing just moments ago. paix goes to the attic to get sam, finding no one, only to remember that sam is asleep in the in the living room, and when she goes back down staris of course hes still there, passed out on the couch like he has been all day, why was she so sure there was someone in the attic

when it becomes clear that lonnies been possessing sam, paix has a weird mix of terror and relief, though its drowned out by how PISSED she is at lonnie. she yells at him in portuguese for WHILE before he explains that he really wasnt trying to hurt sam or steal his body or anything else paix is accusing him of, hes been trapped in the ghost zone since he died and nothing he did could get their attention (he had gotten SO CLOSE with paix, she seemed to almost hear him. paix remembers all the times she felt she was being watch or heard someone screaming and just shrugged it off as a side effect of the haunted woods)

paix could absolutely kill him AGAIN when he goes on to explain that hes now stuck in sams body. she begrudgingly agrees to help lonnie not be stuck, using a ritual from one of the weird creepy books littered around the house. it works and paix is incredibly relieved to find that sam is alright, but then immediately un-relieved to feel someone standing behind her and turned around to find lonnies spooky ghost standing there, menacingly

the tension was immediately broken as sam scrambled up screaming YOURE ALIVE and attempting to tackle-hug lonnie only to go through him and crash into the wall

and after paix gives lonnie a peice of her mind and lonnie profusely apologizes to both her and sam, things fall back into normality. paix and sam have found ways to make a living without doing anything illegal. lonnie is somewhat weirder as a ghost, hes taken a liking to scaring the heck out of ppl and is back to being a menace, but he seems to be more sincere with sam and paix at least

zaf generally doesnt like photos, meko probably caught them by surprise

zaf was a unfortunate victim of one of the many sloth-aligned splinter groups, and while they have made an amazing recovery, they remember nothing before waking up in the hospital. they were told that they had been kidnapped and eventually were found and taken in by authorities before being treated and successfully reverted to the physiology of an average mutant kacheek. zaf knows theres more to the story that authorities and their friends arent telling them, and has vague memories, but zaf isnt sure if they want to remember them. they were told by their friends that they had been a zafara before, that they were kind and generous and everyone was devastated when they went missing. zaf, surrounded by people that they cant remember, felt incredibly guilty. they hear stories about themself that they cant remember or even relate to. they ask for descriptions of themself that dont feel like them, least not anymore. zaf looks at pictures of this person that doesnt even look like them, and they cant help but feel like that person isnt here anymore.

zaf distances themself and eventually leaves neo central, taking a job at a hotel in the haunted woods. they have trouble finding a place to stay, and on their way to look at yet another apartment, they mistakenly knock on the door of a spotted bori who has THE friendliest face theyve seen since they moved to the woods

the two talk until its dark out and sam insists they stay the night bc its not safe to be out are you kidding me its the haunted woods. paix, given her past, is suspicious before zaf mentions what happened to them and she straight up offers for them to stay indefinitely (good thing too bc sam was pretty confident the place they had been on their way to see was a scheme to murder people, which seemed way more alarming to zaf than it did sam)

it takes 3 days for zaf to meet lonnie bc hes busy being an ass, slamming doors and leaving creepy messages in the mirror, culminating into jump-scaring zaf in the hallway at 3 in the morning. paix had tried to warn them but its still a spooky ghost in your apartment. sam mentioned that lonnies body was buried in the back yard and zaf looked like they were about to cry. just two sweet kids living in a dilapidated old house thats haunted by their dead friend, whose body they had bury in the back

zaf seems to be the only one concerned about the skulls in the living room, and the strange books, all of which, at least the ones zaf can make sense of, contain what appears to be spells. they mentioned where they lived to their boss and some coworkers and all hell broke loose and zaf had to leave the premises. paix apologized and said that lonnie had a reputation with the hotel staff and it kind of extended to everyone esle in the house. lonnie zipped through the ceiling and stated that they had ALWAYS had it out for him even BEFORE he stole that golf cart and the two start up another argument and the initial point is lost.

but even months afterward, zaf cant forget the the moment of panic in their former boss’s eyes when they mentioned the house

mini is a witch living in the woods. sam and the gang think shes their neighbor, but no one is really sure where she lives. she comes by the house every now and then. sam, paix, and zaf have invited her in but always stated that she cant come in. has started to come around more frequently after zaf showed her one of the book they had found, wondering if she could make any sense of it. usually cryptic mini straight up said it was incredibly dangerous in the wrong hands. the two have since working through the books to see if any of more of them had spell theorems that could ‘potentially warp the fabric of reality’ as mini had put it

#here take my neopets novel #i was gonna draw little portraits but im gay

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mandaloriangf · 6 years

Text

reasons why detroit become human makes no goddamn fucking sense beyond just the shitty allegory (aka i nitpick the fuck out of this game)

captain allen refuses to give connor any information about daniel despite this being a hostage situation and connor is there to diffuse it

also allen says that if connor doesnt take care of it he will and if he could why didnt he??

connor can reconstruct crime scenes with so little information that theres no way he could come to his deduction. for example in the first chapter he figures out that the father was holding something when daniel shot him despite there being NO WAY he could know this

theres segregation despite the fact that androids are servants to humans??? how are androids supposed to work for humans if they’re barred from entering certain places??

TEMPORARY PARKING????????????

unemployment is at 35% yet the economy is booming????

unemployed people blame androids for stealing their jobs despite the fact that androids did not get a choice and were made to do certain jobs. their anger should be directed toward cyberlife

markus shows emotion and has a distinct personality before becoming deviant like why does he even need to become deviant when he clearly already is??

carl’s on the nose monologuing.

carl says lets see where we left off and when markus takes down the tarp theres a finished painting. carl makes like five strokes lol.

he also makes the same “oh my god” no matter what markus paints

PRESS X TO SADNESS

how does todd afford kara and alice when he doesnt have a job

and why does he live on ethan mars’ street

and the biggest issue - ALICE IS AN ANDROID??????????

seriously how do android children work? whats the point???? if people hate androids why would they pay money to take care of one????????????????????

honestly how do they work? because alice can sleep but she doesnt eat????? and shes not gonna age so what happens to child androids? do they just have their memories wiped and get bought by another parent????

and if alice is an android, why does todd say kara needs to help with alice’s homework? she doesnt go to school! its addressed in the same fucking chapter!

and why doesnt alice saying anything to kara like hey stop trying to ask me if i want food i dont eat because im a fucking android

also kara figures out that alice is an android at the very beginning yet just ignores it?? i guess??????

and alice has a picture in her keepsake box of todd, his wife, and his biological daughter?? why???????? kill me

todd leaves his drugs in the laundry detergent, makes kara do the laundry, and then gets mad when she finds the drugs

HE MAKES HIS ROBOT TURN ON HIS ROOMBA LSAKDJFLKSJDFLKJSDF

no one does anything when connor enters a bar that doesnt allow androids

also its never explained in game (i think) why connor does the coin trick. i suppose it can be up to the player (i see it as a nervous habit/fidget device but you could also argue its for recalibration)

no one checks the attic of carlos’ house??? and his android hid up there for THREE WEEKS????????????

connor is designed to work “harmoniously with humans” but they gave him a forensics lab on his tongue so he literally just puts blood in his mouth in a crime scene alsdjflsjflajsdlfjdlj

kara serves alice dinner and alice actually sits there but she wont eat BECAUSE SHES AN ANDROID

the guy that comes on the bus doesnt bat an eye when he sees an android in the human section of the bus (i almost threw up typing that)

leo can survive that????????

carl doesnt try to reason with the cops before they shoot markus

why do deviants self destruct in stressful situations? we dont know. we dont fucking know.

connor can show genuine compassion to carlos’ android but doesnt seem bothered by it????

why is there such an extensive android scrapyard? first of all theres android resale shops (yuck) and parts are probably expensive, plus androids have existed for what? ten years at the most? theres no way cyberlife would just allow perfectly good android parts to be thrown away this makes no fucking sense

MARKUS CAN JUST PULL OFF HIS LED LIKE ITS A STICKER

A STICKER

seriously if its that easy whats the point? they already dress androids a certain way, why have the led except to know what androids are thinking? and if theyre thinking dont they have some level of free will?? (for example kara’s turns red when todd threatens her)

no one recognizes kara despite being a relatively common model like yeah she eventually changes her hair and clothes but she’s still got the same face lkadjfalsjdfljsdlfj

connor is unfazed when he’s shot but looks like he’s in pain when gavin punches him???

connor is able to get a confession from carlos’ android but can’t make small talk asdjflskjdfljdf

the whole chapter where markus finds jericho doesnt like have a lot wrong its just REALLY tedious

though the jump scares are stupid

ra9 is constantly referenced (particuarly in connor’s story) but doesnt go anywhere. at all. unless i missed something. but as far as i know its never explained who ra9 is.

(i think its markus)

the deviant in the pigeon filled apartment is just chilling in the attic? why do androids always stay in the same place instead of escaping????

the androids in jericho are really just hanging out in an abandoned, rusting ship doing nothing. like theyre shutting down bc they dont have blue blood and incompetents but no one thinks to go get any until markus rallies them.

also what is up with lucy? why does she talk like she can see the future

THE ENTIRE ZLATKO CHAPTER HAPPENS AT ALL

no seriously!!!!! you expect me to believe kara would just go to the address given to her by some random garbage collector android in the middle of the night which leads to a creepy house with a creepy guy with BLUE BLOOD ON HIS FINGERS who wants to take kara into the basement alone to remove a tracker she clearly doesnt have??????????????????????? she would’ve just booked it

KARA ACTUALLY GETS IN THE MACHINE AND IS SURPRISED ZLATKO IS GOING TO ERASE HER MEMORY

that android that says “whos the real monster” PLEASE MR CAGE MY NOSE IS SORE

connor just fucking breaks the window and jumps in alflskdjflskjfljsdljfkdsfljldsafskdf

putting hank under cold water sobers him up somehow

the game thinks it needs to spell out for me in actual letters on the screen that hank is suicidal despite the fact that you find him unconscious on the floor with alcohol and a gun AND he says he was playing russian roulette.

connor petting sumo is cute but sumo looks like he’s from a ps2 game

markus magically develops the ability to “convert” androids so to speak.

im telling you, he’s ra9

the whole eden club thing is very...icky

like the androids are literally put in tubes like wtf

the tracis have a relationship despite club policy of wiping memories every two hours

also im pretty sure they have the same face...?? why is this not addressed more

hank hates androids but likes it when connor spares them?

kara, luther, and alice dont just stay in the car for the night

luther brings up that theres something off about alice but gets interrupted. this is not the first time it happens. it happens THREE TIMES in total before the reveal she’s an android

the jerrys break the windows like zombies and then are like “dont shoot we come in peace”

the carousel scene is cute but where did the power come from???

connor starts showing signs of deviancy but doesnt notice it??? and amandas just like “stop it” and does nothing about it saljdflsjdflsjkdf

markus does the fake phone call right in front of the person he’s calling

who brought the box up to the bathroom? was it the deviant that connor can interrogate???? explain pls

pick up the bag. carry the bag. put down the bag. open the bag. kill me.

THEY GET OUT ONTO A WINDOW WASHING LIFT BUT THEN RAPPEL UP?????????????????

a giant screen that says rise as markus and north are going up the building

markus removes his skin for the broadcast (ew) to conceal his identity BUT IT REVEALS HIS SERIAL NUMBER THAT CONNOR LATER SCANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

north straight up wants to murder other androids for android freedom

no one finds simon on the roof unless connor goes up there

no one hears connor and the deviant fighting in the kitchen and no one hears connor calling out for help

rose is literally just 2038 harriet tubman

she compares what is happening to androids to what happened to black people in the past yet david cage expects me to believe this game isn’t about racism

kara believes that they will find refuge in canada because there are no android laws there, however the reason they dont have android laws is because CANADA HATES ANDROIDS JUST AS MUCH AS THE US

she has literally no reason to believe they’ll be able to survive in canada. theyd have to act like the cullens and move around all the time.

ntm if androids and their parts aren’t being manufactured, if anything happens to kara, alice, or luther theyre fucked!

markus had to choose between two very black and white options: violence or pacifism. i have a HUGE problem with how this is done bc being peaceful results in the “good” ending while being violent results in the bad “ending

(and for the record, going with a violent revolution can still result in freedom for androids. its just a LOT harder to keep everyone alive)

basically it completely misunderstands how real life oppression works and assumes that if a marginalized group is peaceful, public opinion will go up

thats not how it fucking works dipshit cage

kamski is literally just a weird combination of oscar isaac in ex machina and jared leto in blade runner 2049

like he’s left so ambiguous that you can’t even come to your own conclusion

connor can remark that chloe is pretty and seems sincere but doesnt question himself????

if you choose not to shoot chloe, you get nothing. you either have to replay the chapter and shoot her or look it up yourself. and im not fucking shooting her.

markus and north become “lovers” during a normal conversation

seriously. when it happened my mom and i were like ???????????????

yet markus can’t romance simon despite having more chemistry

and on that topic why can’t kara romance luther???? they have a lot of chemistry too.

the freedom march. just. ugh.

like markus really leads a bunch of androids down a street shouting “EQUAL RIGHTS” lkjasldfjlakjfjldf

markus evolves to the point where he can just look at androids and convert them like what

north and josh clearly both have a death wish

if i have to hear “we were going to crack the case” one more time i will kill david cage myself. do cops even talk like that?

gavin just straight up tries to murder connor????

THEY START PUTTING ANDROIDS IN CAMPS?????????????????? AS IF THE REST OF THE GAME WASN’T BAD ENOUGH????????????????????????

kara finds out alice is an android and luther has to spell out all her feelings for her??? like why would she stop loving alice skalfsjdlfkjdlfj theyre both androids

the fact that connor even has a machine story line

carl just straight up dies while markus is venting about his oppression asdjfsjflskjflkejiofjeijfoejflkjsflsj

we dont get any kind of resolution to connor going deviant. he just suddenly is. how does he feel about it? who cares!

“ask us something only the real connor would know”

why is that human couple with the baby so upset about not getting out of detroit? theyre human. they’ll be fine. i feel no guilt in taking their tickets.

alice can arguably forgive todd as he explains he just wanted to prove he’s a good dad. boo hoo. he’s still a dick.

connor can suddenly wake up androids too????

markus can really save the androids by kissing north or singing.

that actually

happens

KILL ME

the president looks like hillary clinton but has a “was a celebrity with no political experience” trump like background

#theres probably a lot more but this took forever and i just want to move on ldaskjflsjflskjf

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megacarapa · 3 years

Note

What are your thoughts on the recent manga developements? Like the climax of the vs stanley arc and the suika mini arc etc, idk ive just been loving the recent chapters and wanna hear more talk about it and your rants so far have been really entertaining ^^

ANON FCGB;;;😳

WELL i did make an entire playlist based off those 3 suika chapters so i guess you could say i’ve been enjoying the current arc gfgfh. ok here are my VERY extended thoughts on the last 10ish chapters under the cut (manga spoilers obv) (LUCY DON’T READ THIS ONE FR) (also cw for like.. discussion of diseases and stuff tho i dont go too much into detail, i’m not an actual doctor obviously dfgdfg)

this ended up being way longer than i expected so i tried breaking it into a few sections and adding images to make it easier on the eyes, i’ve really loved the south america arc as a whole but these last few chapters have been especially amazing

vs stanley climax

first of all, i gotta love how you called it the "vs stanley fight", and i mean, you're technically right since he is the antagonist of this arc, but it's interesting how they never have a direct faceoff with stanley, it's more like stanley and his troops attacking super one sidedly in a way the kos can't really fight against, so they use communication between their different teams to trap stanley & co in a situation they can't run away from and win in the long term

i love that dr stone "fights" are most often won strategically rather than in a straight up 1v1 brawl, in fact those more standard fights are most often used as a way to keep the enemy at bay until senku & co can figure out a way to actually win, also it's just really cool that the team that delivered the final blow was thousands of miles away from where the actual fight was taking place, or even hundreds of thousands if you count whyman as the "person who delivered the final blow"

stanley theorizes at the end that the kos will probably keep his statue as a hostage to make xeno work for them on the rocket if he wants stanley back (lmao gay), but considering their track record of letting past enemies join the crew, i have a feeling we’ll have both xeno and stanley (and the rest of the americans) back rather than just xeno

the only antagonist so far that hasn't been redeemed is ibara, who is just being kept as a stone statue somewhere, but you could tell that would be the case based on his design alone, he just screams *irredeemable villain*

xeno and stanley, while antagonists, are also clearly designed to be likeable characters, so i don't see them getting the same treatment

the only problem would be keeping a constant watch over xeno to make sure he doesn't do any Side Projects™ and develop firearms again, but it could also be that xeno was actually convinced of senku’s philosophy in their last talk before the beam hit, so maybe he will be willing to help even without having stanley be a hostage, but i guess we’ll just wait and see

as a side note, whyman periodically sending the petrification command was basically a chekhov's gun now that i think about it, so it makes sense in a meta way that a second worldwide petrification would happen, why establish it if it wont come into play later in the story? i actually felt kinda dumb for not seeing it coming fgdfg

aftermath/suika chapters

the first strategy they had for defeating stanley was a good one, but it wouldn't really make for good storytelling if it just Worked and they won just like that, it would be pretty anticlimactic after running from him for almost 20 chapters, so it makes sense then that what they had to go with in the end was the same strategy, but on a much bigger scale

suika being the one to be depetrified first and have to save everyone is also a good choice both thematically and to make sure the victory isn't too easy

having someone like senku or chrome who understands the platinum method to make revival fluid and then have it done in less than a day, or having suika simply find some extra revival fluid lying around like she was initially planning would, again, be anticlimactic, it would've lacked impact after everything they've been through

these 3 chapters also nicely bring back the theme of science not being exclusive to the “pros”, everyone can use it as long as they have the proper steps to follow, the most impressive example before this was the corn city crew managing to make a diamond by following senku’s instructions despite not having any scientists on board (and before that, gen and the villagers making a telescope)

and now suika is even more impressive, being a literal child and all, even though she wasn't able to understand the more complex methods, there was still a way for her to succeed, all she needed was to be patient and diligently go at it step by step, i adore these 3 chapters and i love suika so much now it's insane

suika being the one to get revived serves another purpose as well...

honestly, already around 188/189 i was starting to get really worried about how the story would handle the emotional aftermath

shonen jump manga has a tendency to just gloss over the psychological consequences of traumatic events (one moment i remember finding really frustrating was in bnha, when kirishima gets really fucked up during the overhaul arc but the next time we see him he’s just joking around about looking like a mummy because of all his bandages🙄), so i was worried they wouldn't treat the aftermath of an event like this with the gravity it deserves, (i think LITERALLY DYING could be considered a traumatic event but i'm no psychologist🤔)

suika’s time alone shows a nice contrast to senku, while senku is definitely not emotionless, during his time alone before taiju was revived he is still very cool and collected, not showing any emotional weakness like the king of repression he is

suika is a whole different story, she’s a kid, she doesn't repress her emotions like senku does, so during her time alone she is scared and lonely, especially at the beginning, we see her breaking down into tears multiple times, imagining her friends statues talking to her, hugging kohaku’s statue for comfort etc

this really provided the emotional catharsis i was hoping for, through suika, the audience is genuinely able to feel the gravity of what has happened

i do wish more of the older characters could be allowed to show emotional weakness like this, but i guess having suika serve as a proxy for everyone works well enough

on that note, senku was alone for only 6 months and even then its implied in treasure island that he may have a problem with loneliness

suika on the other hand was alone for YEARS, i can only imagine how that affected her mental state, tho honestly i can't say i expect the story to delve into something like that too deeply (or at all) since this is a shonen manga after all..

immortality

i’ve seen some people interpreting hyoga’s resurrection in 197 as “they can revive somebody that died from an injury, but people will still die eventually due to old age”, but i don’t think that's really the case, people don’t just die from “old age” by itself, they die because their body slowly degrades over time, which makes it harder to fight against numerous diseases, one of which will eventually get you and kill you

but dr stone (aka the combination of medusa+revival fluid) can nullify that degradation and bring your body back into a healthy state, we’ve already seen this with kaseki on treasure island where senku explains that dr stone healed his arthritis, a disease which probably would have lead to his natural death sooner or later

while we already know kaseki was in better shape than most people his age, it’s still surprising to see an old man like him jumping around so energetically, thats how much the restoration improved his health

we also know it healed mirai who was brain dead before being revived, so i think it's a pretty safe bet that it can heal other brain related diseases such as alzheimers

if so, then dr stone can heal injuries, diseases and even death as we’ve seen with hyoga, i think it’s pretty accurate of senku to say that humanity has gained immortality with it

honestly this development has been a long time coming, the idea of dr stone being able to bring back the dead was introduced as early as the first arc when tsukasa killed senku but taiyuzu were able to bring him back, but it really does seem like such an out there concept so i’m interested to see how they will base it in science... (and also how they will handle the whole… moral dilemma of immortality but i ain't ready to even attempt to think abt any of that)

my favourite theory that has sprung up from this is that if people really can live forever thanks to dr stone, it could be that whyman is actually a normal human who has been continually petrifying and reviving themself to live for 3700 years

wat will happen nixt?

back when 196 came out it kinda dawned on me just how much the crew has been set back in the progress they've made so far that it was giving me anxiety for real gfgdfg

seven years have passed, and in that time a lot of the tools they've made must have degraded, along with that, everyone they've revived so far has been turned to stone once again, there was nobody to upkeep the wheat fields and sundial and basically everything they've left in japan, and after all this time even the perseus must be in bad shape and in need of repair, as chrome suggests

how long will it take them to repair the ship? to repair all the tools they've lost? their original plan was to go around the world building cities where they can get all the materials to work on that rocket they’ll be making eventually, they already kinda started up corn city, but that has been out of commission for a while now, they were planning to build superalloy city in south america and have barely started on that

so they need to keep building these cities but also need to go back and revive everyone if they don't want their progress to go to waste, how will they go about this?? will they just tackle it one by one or split into teams, so one team can stay behind and work on superalloy city and the other can go back and revive everyone? who knows?? ryusui certainly made it sound way easier than how i've been imagining it dfgdfg

other than that, i gotta wonder are the kingdom of science really the only humans left on earth now that there's been a second worldwide petrification, or has some other group revived somewhere during the timeskip, OR maybe there might be another group out there who also devised the revival formula and was able to escape the 2nd petrification, which would then give them 7 more years to develop while senku n co are just stuck in stone 🤔 dr stone has always had some human antagonist so i wonder who’s next now that xeno and stanley have been dealt with

honestly my favourite arc has always been age of exploration precisely because it doesn't have any human threat and the characters are just left to craft and work on rebuilding society without the pressure of a looming war or a crazy american hunting them down, so honestly i'm hoping we will get another arc like that now, i think the crew definitely deserves it dnjd

random bonus ramblings

-using poop and shells to create nitric acid and it being a process that would take a long time is something that has already been mentioned multiple times in the series, so it’s really cool to see it actually utilized in the story rather than being random throwaway info

makes you wonder what other seemingly throwaway lines could actually be foreshadowing...

😬😬😬

-since joel managed to fix a medusa im very excited for him to be revived so we can learn how he did it and how the petrification works in the first place!! (and for joel and kaseki to finally meet in general)

-drst has a habit of introducing a character in one arc and having them be Just kinda There for some time until they finally have their time to shine in a later arc, examples being minami and of course yuzuriha, so i'm wondering if the same will happen later on with some of the americans, charlotte seems like a good contender for this (the girl that suika saved in 185, i gotta wonder how she felt having to shoot down the people who saved her life)

-on that note i feel like matsukaze also still hasn’t had his time to shine or contribute in any unique way yet (other than exposition gdvdj)

-i was also really liking dr brody as a character so i was kinda disappointed that he just blindly decided to kill everyone in corn city instead of talking and trying to come to an agreement w them like he has been up till then (though i guess it was necessary for the plot🙄), interested to see what they do with him as well

-i wanna see stanxeno on screen makeout sesh 🙄!

-will senku not losing his petrification cracks be explained? if he still has them, will xeno, stanley, luna etc still have theirs too? (honestly i hope so, i don’t wanna have to stare at xeno’s big shiny forehead for the rest of the series gsdhgfd)

ok i feel like i've finally exhausted all the numerous thoughts i had sdfdfd thank you for giving me an excuse to ramble on for so long and congratulations if you've managed to make it til the end <3

in conclusion

#it's good stuff!#sorry i really used this ask as a springboard to rant abt whatever tf i want huh #asks #anon #deadass it took me 2 days to write this finally i can go back to my diys #dr stone #drst #long post #VERY long post #come closer i am a normal drst fan #drst rants

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