#aegon analysis

[mejcinta]

"In the world, we must defend our own."

When it comes to his family's welfare, Aegon stands on business. 😤

[darylandbethfanforever9]

Aegon ready to unleash hell on the blacks

Aegon was quick to anger and slow to forgive.  

He intends to take full revenge for his firstborn and the pain&suffering that enemies have brought to his family.

[greenqueenhightower]

I think people forget that if Alicent had not pursued her ideals and installed Aegon to the throne then the result would have been the same—Rhaenyra would be compelled to kill him and his brothers to ensure her own rule and to minimize the chance of any uprising.

Show!Rhaenyra seems averse to the idea of killing her siblings to secure the throne, but the thing is, she would essentially have had to do it because it would pave the only way to legitimize her rule, as it were, and to hold it in place without any question. If all the challengers to the throne no longer existed, then no other rule would pose any threat to Rhaenyra, which means that her own reign would be secure.

Some might argue that “no, Rhaenyra wouldn’t have to kill her siblings if they’d sworn fealty to her and stayed put” but this is a foolish idea as per Westerosi/medieval standards because AS LONG AS ANY OTHER HEIRS WERE ALIVE there always was a threat to the current monarch’s reign. Anyone dissatisfied with Rhaenyra’s rule for any reason, big or small, could very easily inspire an uprising using the remaining Targaryen heirs as figureheads to pursue their own ideals. It is very important to me that people finally understand that, and eventually see the harsh reality that Alicent had to accept, and the necessity behind her decision to install Aegon to the throne. She knew that if she didn’t get to do it, then she might be risking his life and that of his siblings. So for Alicent and her sons, pursuing the throne was really the only available option, since they were, in fact, living in a patriarchal society, and they would never be viewed as anything LESS than pure-blooded, thoroughbred Targaryen heirs.

Making yet another parallel with Alicent and Margaret Beaufort: history proved that any living heir is dangerous to the rule of a rather new and controversial monarch, which is what both Henry VII and Rhaenyra are. Henry VII because he is a Tudor—Lancastrian heir instead of a York, and Rhaenyra because she’s a woman instead of a man in a patriarchal society. Therefore, for Rhaenyra to stay in power and secure it, she would have to eliminate all other possible heirs. Only then would the realm accept Rhaenyra as their rightful Targaryen ruler, as they finally accepted Henry VII as the unifier of the two houses when all the York heirs (along with their pretenders) were dead and buried.

[wwwhateveryouwant]

i think the main reason people didnt like the brothel scene with aemond was because they could no longer precieve him as a dominant man. i think that people truly are not watching because they enjoy the characters and the plotlines. they’re watching cause they’re attracted to characters, so they’re molding them to what they like personally. aemond was depicted as a child who was bullied and abused (s wordly and emotionally). the writing for his character is probably one of the most realistic in the show. he grew up being denied the things he wanted and forced into things he didnt want. its all hes ever known. of course when hes hurting hes not gonna go give somebody fucking backshots hes gonna crawl back to someone who already knows him. this is really a useless rant but i just think it’s interesting how people perceive people they’re attracted to. completely changing his character to fit the narrative of some 50 shades of gray shit when truly hes a teenage boy who’s incredibly traumatized.

[tessarionbestgirl]

Alicent & her kids.

Exactly, everything she despite about herself she sees on Aegon and Aemond. Aegon her softness and emotional side that she sees as weakness. Aemond is her vengefulness and rage that she find ugly. She loves and despite them both for it.

Helaena is the innocence she lost. She tries to protect and feel guilty of her lost. Daeron is her spelling image that she can't even look at.

[mejcinta]

He has his own family, and sure as hell Viserys isn't and will never be a part of it. He is an older brother, his mother's son, a husband, a father. It's THEM he protects. It's THEM he grows a backbone and walks up to the crown that will doom him for. Because somewhere, inside this mess of a man, lies unconditional love for the family he sometimes alienates himself for. Because he hopes, THEY hope, Alicent and Aegon, that one day, their blood will live on because of this near suicide.

I sure hope this is what they will go for in season 2. Because they have to compensate for how they erased Aegon's acceptance of the crown for his family's safety. They could do this after B&C.

"The title of the book is The Princess and The Queen so the book is about Rhaenicent!!!!11!1!11!1!1!111!!1!"

Respectfully, no. The book being titled after the two women who wanted to be the most powerful ladies of Westeros does not take importance away from the civil war, fought between TARGARYENS, AT ALL.

Aegon II is important. He leads the faction of the Greens (ALONG with his mother and sister wife), he's the Targtower that gave the inbred self proclaimed gods a taste of their own medicine, ALL for the safety of his family. He stepped up when his mother impressed it on him that Helaena, who above all, was his younger sister, would've been sold off to the enemy or literally anyone else that could've locked her away, mistreated her, or used her to make babe after babe.

He literally grew up watching his mother get used and discarded like a whore by her father, y'all think he'd willingly cause Helaena the same pain? Not that it isn't bad or absolutely fucked up, but the only things that are 100% true about him being promiscuous are the times where he's said to grope every serving maid out of reach and two alleged, ALLEGED bastards with them, if you don't count Gaemon as his or the story Mushroom out of all people invented.

He resents his father every day more than the last one. He tries so hard not to be like him, he drowns himself in cups because he can't help but see that a part of that walking corpse is in him. Every time he looks in the mirror is a constant reminder that his very own existence was forced upon both him and his mother, every day he seeks the approval of the woman who was strong enough to put away her trauma, all for him. HER approval, not his father. It's HER he admires the most.

And that character is taken away and stepped on entirely. By making him rape a young maid. By making him say that he will never be enough for Alicent "OR VISERYS". As if Aegon would actually care. Trust me, I wish I could chop his cock off inch by inch like a cucumber, but he's way more than that.

He has his own family, and sure as hell Viserys isn't and will never be a part of it. He is an older brother, his mother's son, a husband, a father. It's THEM he protects. It's THEM he grows a backbone and walks up to the crown that will doom him for. Because somewhere, inside this mess of a man, lies unconditional love for the family he sometimes alienates himself for. Because he hopes, THEY hope, Alicent and Aegon, that one day, their blood will live on because of this near suicide.

But it doesn't. It all crumbles down on them, like sand on their hands on a windy day. They bury the very only reasons they started this whole coup for, the ones that were supposed to bury them. And that's their tragedy. There's no karma, no victory for anyone.

By the time he's finally killed Rhaenyra, he has nothing. He has lost his sons, his brothers, his wife, his realm, his dragon. He's a cripple hanging by a thread. He ignores the advice of killing Aegon the Younger like he did with his mother. He gives up on executing Baela. What did these kids do? What's their fault? Being his cousin and half-nephew? Being his enemies' children? He isn't going to make the nightmare that was life, someone else's. He's tired. He doesn't want anymore war.

THIS is Aegon II Targaryen, not the degenerate piece of shit the show tried shoving down our throats.

[helaenarchive]

‼️ TRIGGER WARNING: CSA ‼️

My thoughts on Phia's interviews talking about Helaena's marriage as an autistic survivor and lover of Helaena:

Helaena was married aged fourteen (a child) to someone shown as sexually predacious (even described as evil by Phia), and then was pregnant not soon after.

These are all glaring signs of CSA.

All Helaena's relationships interest me and I want to explore the reality of their marriage at this time when she was a little girl. This was the first big trauma of her endlessly tragic life. Phia has discussed how Helaena puts duty before everything, and this is the root.

Helaena and Aegon are shown and described to have a distant and strained relationship, not one of mutual respect or healthy partnership. Let's explore this in the context of abuse.

Below is a script exerpt of Helaena looking at Aegon with “flat detachment” (disassociation) when faced with the aftermath of him raping Dyana. Furthermore, how Alicent hugs her as she realises that Helaena has endured a similar fate to herself.

Credit: Darksvster

Now, at the dinner we see them again. But this time, Helaena makes a toast: “Mostly he just ignores you, except sometimes when he’s drunk,” as Aegon rolls his eyes at her, implying that he neglects her as a wife except for when he needs sex (something she doesn't get a say in). He can also be seen sexually harassing Baela and Jace as Helaena sits next to him, trying to focus on other things.

From the script we get more about their dynamic in descriptions of how “lonely she has been”. She's so happily surprised that someone would pay her attention as Jace did. Loneliness and low self esteem are extremely common in survivors, just like with Helaena.

Credit: Darksvster

At Laena’s funeral, referring to their betrothal, Aegon outright calls her an idiot and (in my opinion) makes a sexual ‘joke’ involving her. This younger Aegon also masturbates out of windows, showing the pleasure he reaps from exerting sexual power over non-consenting others.

That isn't a sign that she was respected. Alongside Aegon's persistent characterisation as a sexual assaulter, implies that any consummation wasn't going to be consensual, but on his terms only.

She was a child forced to marry her raping brother and led a very lonely life.

Exploring this dynamic is incredibly important, and how it develops, but I don’t see the point if we don’t acknowledge the reality of this from Helaena’s point of view.

This life was forced upon her by the system, Aegon included.

Apologies for lack of a better example, but Daemon didn't consummate his marriage. It's not essential. If he respected her he wouldn't have had sex with her. He did because he wanted to and could without repercussions. It’s not nice to think about, but in this deeply patriarchal society, he has an immense power over her that she does not also have over him. He was abused, just as Helaena, but he also abuses her. It is not as simple as them both being equal, because they are not. In daily routine, he can frequent brothels and assault the help, she has to take care of the children and do whatever is asked of her.

It hurts and troubles me to see people act like Helaena isn’t a victim, especially with what we're shown.

At 14 she was forced to marry her rapist brother and used by him for sex. No child could consent to that.

I'm not saying that this is everything their dynamic was or will be, or that she hates him in any way, but just that this is at their core. It purposefully parallels Alicent's child marriage to Viserys.

Please be kind. I'm not attacking but trying to shed light on this. I'm trying to open up this discussion to what Helaena's perspective was and to do some honest scene, relationship and character analysis. 

[fictonrantsworld]

My headcanon is that helaena stitched aegons outfit and I think it's so cute that she was making a similar one for jaeherys so he could match with daddy

Edit:yeah I understand it's a shroud, but the thing is Helaena didn't even know she was making a shroud, remember what phia said that Helaena has intuitions more than dreams at this point of time...but it's still cute she tried to match with his daddy.

[mejcinta]

Ryan, Sara and TGC all had very interesting things to say about Aegon's sad background story but none of these wonderful concepts and depths are sufficiently, if at all, shown on screen, making Aegon one of the least comprehensible characters in s1 going into s2.

Living in baby Baelon's shadow. Robbed of his birthright as a male heir. Indifferent to his family because he's resigned to the idea he's unloved, if loveable at all.

Why, again, did Aegon not have a deep scene with Viserys? It would've done wonders for his characterisation, opposed to what we got.

[mejcinta]

Of course, there's the counterargument that Vaemond's murder is a political disadvantage to Aegon and he wouldn't be happy about it, compared to when he's out enjoying the pain of people he cares little about.

While that's a reasonable argument, isn't it funny that Alicent slaps him for not knowing what day it is and that he's not prepared for the gathering? Additionally, Aegon seemed very nonchalant with everything.

If he truly was Joffrey, he wouldn't contain his fascination with the macabre. Vaemond's dead body would strike his interest, despite of his death being disadvantageous. And remember, Aegon doesn't even care for this meeting. He didn't even want to be there.

So, his reaction of disgust is in fact a surprising one. It shows that he's concerned. Vaemond's murder is an open threat to his family.

Guess he's not as psychotic as people think he is or want him to be after all.

So you're telling me that Aegon who reacts to an act of violence like this is the same person who enjoys cruelty and has sadistic tendencies? I mean… Your character's actions and reactions literally contradict each other, and you don't need to be a brilliant screenwriter to understand this.

[queendaeron1]

Some things I’d like to remind this fandom concerning Daemon and Daemyra:

It’s often the same old “Daemon didn’t have interactions with his children or with Rhaenyra” or “We don’t know how they felt about each other”

But remember this: GRRM dedicated an entire novella (which was already a section of the Dance of the Dragons), The Rogue Prince, which was published in 2014, embedded in F&B, centred around Daemon. Precisely because he wants us to understand the character, his arc and his role in the narrative. Writing a short novella is more practical because F&B is excessively plagued by the narrators’ editorialising and the conflicting, biased sources

We see that Daemon is constantly at the centre of attention. Whether he’s seen in a positive light or not, everyone knows where he is, what he’s doing and what he’s saying, and YET, he remains mysterious at the core. In short: all eyes are on him, for better or worse

So when he finally marries Laena in 115, a woman he actually wanted, and becomes a father for the first time in 116, you notice that he starts being more composed, you could even say that he matured

And then he marries Rhaenyra in 120 and poof: nothing. The man practically vanishes from the text

And that’s the point!

The novella fleshes out how Daemon’s one true love, desire and goal is to have a true family. As much as he loved his brother, let’s not forget that Viserys is responsible for Mysaria’s tragic miscarriage, a child Daemon made it clear that he wanted. Baelon and Alyssa were long dead, Otto hated him and did everything to create distensions between the two brothers, and he was married to a woman he didn’t love at all… Daemon had no true place in the world. No real role and we know how much he craves serving a purpose. Serving his FAMILY. That’s how The Rogue Prince starts: he’s marginalised and deep down, he’s lonely

Daemon was a man who attracted everyone’s attention, always present in conversations, always reviled or loved. He was seen in whorehouses and rat pits. Everyone knew him without understanding him

Yet suddenly he disappears, marries his third and final wife, and has two children that were technically useless in terms of politics and very low in the line of succession. He even almost had a third child seven years after Viserys was born. He was 48, Rhaenyra 32. They already had seven children between them. And Visenya was clearly very much awaited. He loved being a father and a husband, explains why he was apparently still enthusiastically active even at his age, if you know what I mean…

When Daemon built his family, he let go of his old roguish ways because he finally found purpose: with his children and his wife. As Rhaenys said “Dragons thrive best on Dragonstone”. It’s obvious this was GRRM’s way of pointing out that Daemon and his family actually thrived, not just the dragons. They literally multiplied. Syrax kept laying eggs. I mean it’s RIGHT HERE lol. Really don’t get why everyone misses that (or chooses to miss that…)

The fact that we know so little about their life on Dragonstone is actually very telling. Because the small details we do have say everything. That’s why I just cannot understand those who claim book Daemyra had “less depth” than Daemon and Laena for example, or show! Daemyra itself. They spent ten years together, what more are you asking for? They were safe on Dragonstone, away from the Greens who bullied Rhaenyra and her children at any occasion. This was a life of freedom and fulfilment. They were the closest to their Targaryen heritage and the power of their own blood. We barely hear from them because they were too focused on their little lives. Meanwhile we hear how miserable things are at King’s Landing

I’ll also point out how their children loved each other. The twins were inseparable. The Velaryon boys admired and loved each other. Jace was the one who made sure his younger half brothers were safe during the war. Baela was fiercely protective of Aegon when he became king. Rhaena called him her “beloved brother”. Aegon and Viserys were basically one soul in two bodies. Jace was considered a worthy heir, his little brother Viserys was literally compared to Jaehaerys I, Aegon worshipped his half brothers…

Mind you these kids had at least four different parents, probably five if you count Harwin 😭 That’s precisely because not only did Daemon and Rhaenyra raise good children, they raised them with love

And that’s how The Rogue Prince ends: he finally found his place in the world: with a family he built for himself. He was heir to nothing. Laena was heir to nothing too, so they had nothing to give to their girls but love, yet he was canonically a girl dad. Rhaenyra, while heir to the Iron Throne, already had three sons. The twins were betrothed to those boys. Baela and Rhaena transformed Daemon: Aegon and Viserys cemented that transformation. Visenya would have been the apogee, the crowning point of that life…had Rhaenyra not been usurped

That is when, and only then, Daemon started to waver in his stability. The only reason he returned to his fatal flaws was because he was grieving, not because his marriage was unfulfilling or shallow

That’s why the progressive estrangement between Rhaenyra and Daemon after the Fall of King’s Landing is so heartbreaking in hindsight:

They had everything they ever wanted: Rhaenyra and her sons were finally safe from the Greens and their suffocating influence, she finally had a husband of her choice, Daemon found the stability he needed to raise his daughters, Rhaenyra ruled Dragonstone on her own right, the kids were, as we well know, good and brave and loyal kids. Everyone valued one another. But everything was taken from them. And while Rhaenyra and Daemon died five months apart, and their deaths interestingly mirror each other, they still couldn’t quite reach one another. It’s the tragedy of these parallels: it wasn’t natural for them to be separated, it wasn’t RIGHT. They weren’t made for that

And yet I find that the reunion between Viserys and Aegon actually represents how Daemyra never truly died, and how their love persisted over time, it passed on to the people they loved the most: their children. Aegon and Viserys ruled together. They trusted each other blindly. They were the brothers Daemon and Viserys I never managed to be because of the external pressure. Aegon and Viserys were sons of the realm’s delight and the Rogue Prince, they grew up seeing their parents love each other. That gave them a fierce sense of loyalty. The same is true for Baela and Rhaena: let’s not forget that it was Baela’s husband, Alyn, who brought Viserys back. She and Rhaena introduced Aegon to Daenaera so that he wouldn’t be used for the benefits of some greedy Lord. They watched closely over their little brother

And the way Baela’s characterisation is so intertwined with Daemon’s own shows just how much of an influence their parents had. The children idolised their parents. Baela was basically her father reborn, she was the best of everything he was. It provides us a more positive light on Daemon’s person, one that is depicted in a very subtle way. Probably why most people here are so blind to it, or don’t accept it

I’d say Daemon died because he loved his family too much, and couldn’t bear to watch it crumble:

He fulfilled his duty by killing Vhagar, but he abandoned another when he died without returning to his family, precisely because his accumulating grief, whether from physical or spiritual loss, had extinguished the joy within him. Yes I’m paraphrasing the book here

But even his duty to kill Vhagar was motivated by the love he had for his family. He didn’t go back to Rhaenyra because he thought he had lost her, because he had no idea of her situation: he didn’t know about Tumbleton, thought Aegon II was no threat, Sunfyre was out of the picture, Addam was still defending King’s Landing, Rhaenyra still had the Velaryon fleet, Baela was still safe on Dragonstone…

He didn’t “save” Rhaenyra because he had NO IDEA of what was going on. He didn’t think she needed to be saved. He thought she would be safe once Aemond was dead. He DID NOT KNOW. He could have never imagined what she would suffer in her last days

Again this is the tragic aspect of Daemyra: the miscommunication in a world where their strength was based on their deeply personal relationship, and their marriage of love and partnership. Once it fell down, they died within months of each other: I think this choice in the timing was deliberate on GRRM’s part to show that those two should never be separated, and when they were, they died without having ever said goodbye

That’s why GRRM wrote The Rogue Prince. That’s what Daemon is. Just think what you will with what you have…

EDIT*** see the discussion in the comments section for some clarifications about The Rogue Prince

[cruciomee]

I cannot wait to see this beadwork in high definition!

The design on Aegon II’s outfit in season two has two gold dragons facing each other, to make the head of one dragon! I feel like there is symbolism in this!

The House of the Dragon costume department is upgrading their game fiercely

[velaryoncoffee]

There's something so interesting about the timing of Book!Helaegon's children's birth that says so much with so little.

They had Jaehaera and Jaehaerys within a year of their wedding. This means they were very sexually active together around this time! You could argue it's done out of duty, sure, but Aegon reads like someone very prone to his whims and emotions, much like in the show. This might mean they were/grew passionate for each other around this time or maybe before?

Perhaps the anticipation of their wedding made them spend more time with each other, initially out of obligation, and later from fondness. Or maybe the interest they had in each other compounded over the years, like a subtle slow burn that erupted on their wedding as they realised they were bonded for life, not only in blood but also by the law of the land.

However, my favourite detail has to be the timing of Maegor's birth.

You're telling me that Helaena gave birth 9 months after Jace asked to dance with her at Viserys's family dinner? The one that had Aegon so pissed?

The possessiveness is real. You know the sex that night was wild.

Aegon will not share his beloved sister with anyone. And he'll fuck a son into her womb on their marriage bed for all to see.

If Helaena's defense of Aegon's seat on the Throne is anything to go by, she might be defensive and fond of him just the same. She doesn't come off as someone with any sense of political ambition to ascend as the Queen whatsoever; if anything she asked Blood and Cheese to take her life instead of her children's. From where I stand all she wanted was to live happily with her family, and her husband having his birth right (as contentious as it may be) was included in that vision.

Again, you could interpret any of this in many ways, in bad faith especially. Aegon could be misusing his power as a husband to impose himself on her, and her sense of responsibility, passivity and sensitive nature could have led her to go along with whichever wishes he could have had.

However I personally don't believe that was GRRM's thought process as he wrote those pages. The show depicted Aegon doing many terrible things and it tainted his already flawed character beyond even what the show writers intended. Also Alicent would never allow any harm to come to her little girl. Of that, I am 100% sure.

[fadingstudentbananacookie]

Aegon II Targaryen & Maegor Targaryen - Parallels

House of the Dragon, Fire & Blood / George R.R. Martin, HotDS1Script provided by @darksvster

[greenqueenhightower]

Alicent's Domestic Performance in 2x06:

After being dismissed from the small council, Alicent heeds Aemond's advice to occupy herself with "domestic pursuits." She spends time doing her hair and changing her coiffure, she's sat hours upon hours next to Aegon as the use of the blanket denotes, and she takes Helaena along to light candles for their "lost souls" in the sept.

More importantly, she has time to ruminate about motherhood and question her effectiveness and ability to become a good mother. Hasn't she proved her worth by performing her domestic duties to her husband and family all these years? Can she never seek escape from them? Has the pursuit of her own ambitions been the root cause of all her troubles and the pain inflicted on her family?

Once again she finds herself trapped in pursuing power and performing household duties. Having to tend to Aegon who becomes the embodiment of the consequences of her actions and the manifestation of her guilty conscience for daring to desire beyond domesticity, Alicent oscillates between devotion and despair. As she clutches her seven-pointed star, it becomes evident that Alicent is losing faith in herself and her abilities as a mother and ruler.

Outside the King's chambers, Alicent is framed against the two pillars of her faith and worldview: her duty to her family and children and her craving for freedom and control. She cannot reconcile the two. As she readies herself to put on a display of domesticity, the pillars close in on her, and so her atonement for any deviant behavior and ambitiously driven transgression begins.

[banefort]

larys torturing aegon 'for his own good' in a sadistic phantom thread-like way to exercise complete dominance over his health and recovery, but also as a means to perversely unpick his stitches and remake him in his own image. much to think about