#also believe me i have so many issues w the label toxic as a whole lmfao

[theghostofashton]

.

[whatdoyouwanttobecalled-1]

I've been seeing a lot of posts about this all over social media, and while the majority of them are fine and just people expressing their opinions, a lot of people from both sides of the argument have been saying some really inexcusable stuff (such as telling people on the opposing side to off themselves, etc) and it's really pissing me off. Pls everyone idc if you agree w me or not but at least try to be mature and respectful when engaging in these conversations bc the goal is learning, understanding, tolerance, and cooperation (working together to find solutions to problems that will benefit all of us). So here's my stance on the issue, and feel free to reply, ask questions, or dm me and start a conversation regardless of your veiws. Just be nice! Here's my opinions, based off my own personal experience:

To start off: pansexuality is not inherently biphobic and/or transphobic

Yes, there are pansexuals who are biphobic, and yes they harm the transgender community in that sense. This is because generally pansexuals who are biphobic say they bisexuals are transphobic and essentially invalidate binary trans people's identity as a man or woman by saying that bisexuals are only attracted to cis men and cis women, not trans people. However, the majority of pansexual people do not think this way. Personally (and most of the pansexuals as talked to agree w me), I do not believe that bisexuality is transphobic. Why? Trans women are women, and trans men are men. If you will not date a trans person simply bc they are trans, then you're transphobic, but that has absolutely nothing to do w your sexuality. My own and most people's understanding of bisexuality (and the definition you get if you Google it, and the definition that most bisexuals will give you), is that bisexuality means attraction to 2 or more genders (which yes, could mean all), with a preference. With. A. Preference. I identified as bi to myself for years, and came out as bi for almost a year, never feeling as if the label fully fit me or that I was fully understood by the community bc there is always sm emphasis on the fact that bisexuals have a preference, while I never have. I don't think anyone is less than anyone else for having a preference, or better than anyone else for not having a preference. Pansexuality simply allows me to be apart of a smaller more specific community that fully understands my experience w attraction. I also know that bisexuality can be used as an umbrella term for anyone attracted to 2+ genders, but in the same way that it's not biphobic for lesbians to prefer to date other lesbians bc of their shared experience, I like having a smaller community that specifically experiences attraction in the same way that I do. I've also seen a lot of people talking about how people seem to think that bisexuals only care about sex, and that pansexuals think theyre better bc they're uwu innocent babies. I'm not entirely sure I'm not on the ace spectrum somewhere but lemme tell you that does not make me any less of a whore. No one is better than anyone else for how much or little they think about or enjoy sex.

2nd; bisexuality is not inherently transphobic.

Yes, there are bisexuals who are transphobic, but this is not the majority of the community. Most bi people consider trans women to be real women (which they are) and trans men to be real men (which they are). I will say it again; if you won't date someone just bc they're trans, you are transphobic, but that has nothing to do w your sexuality. As for non binary people, yes, bisexuality includes them too. Bisexuality is not inherently transphobic.

3rd; all mspec labels are fucking valid.

Whether you identify as bisexual, pansexual, omnisexual, or polysexual, you are valid. You can use bisexuality as an umbrella term if that's what you're most comfortable w, or if the definition perfectly describes your relationship w attraction then that's cool too. If you feel that pansexuality, omnisexuality, or polysexuality better describes you and you enjoy having a smaller more specific community to fully relate to, guess what, that's also cool. No one is better than anyone else, and while there are members of every community who feel that they are, they do not represent everyone.

4th; panphobia/omniphobia/polyphobia only comes from the mspec community, if it comes from outside, it's probably biphobia

Let me explain; there is no problem that comes from people who are not attracted to multiple genders that everyone on this spectrum doesn't face. Bisexuality is a spectrum that we all fall on, an umbrella term that we all fit under. This means that unless it's coming from a person or group on this spectrum, it's probably biphobia you're facing. There are 2 types of biphobia: the biphobia that comes from mspecs, and the biphobia that comes from people who aren't on the spectrum of bisexuality. The biphobia that comes from inside is only against people who identify as bisexual, and the biphobia that comes from outside is against anyone who is attracted to multiple genders. I'm not saying there aren't a few instances of people who arent mspec targeting a specific group and not every mspec identity, but most of the time, if it's from the outside, it's classified as biphobia, bc that includes all of us.

In conclusion, this is what the mspec sexualities are and some of my final thoughts;

Bisexuality = attraction to 2+ genders with or without a preference. It can be used as an umbrella term by the whole mspec community, or as a specific label on it's own. It includes trans and non binary people, and is not a transphobic label. There are transphobic bisexuals, but the fact that they are transphobic and the fact that they are bisexual are not related in any way. They are not more or less than any other mspec identity, or sexuality in general.

Pansexuality = attraction to all genders without a preference. It is not biphobic and/or transphobic. There are biphobic and/or transphobic pansexuals but the fact that they are biphobic and/or transphobic is not related to their pansexuality. Many people who identify as bisexual describe their attraction in the same way as pansexuals. This is 100% valid as bisexuality can be used as an umbrella term and the label you identify w is all about your comfort. They are not more or less than any other mspec identity or sexuality in general.

Omnisexuality = attraction to all genders w a preference. It is not biphobic and/or transphobic. There are biphobic and/or transphobic omnisexuals but the fact that they are biphobic and/or transphobic is not related to their omnisexuality. Many people who identify as bisexual describe their attraction in the same way as omnisexuals. This is 100% valid as bisexuality can be used as an umbrella term and the label you identify w is all about your comfort. They are not more or less than any other mspec identity or sexuality in general.

Polysexuality = attraction to more than 2, but not all genders. It is not biphobic and/or transphobic. There are biphobic and/or transphobic polysexuals but the fact that they are biphobic and/or transphobic is not related to their polysexuality. Many people who identify as bisexual describe their attraction in the same way as polysexuals. This is 100% valid as bisexuality can be used as an umbrella term and the label you identify w is all about your comfort. They are not more or less than any other mspec identity or sexuality in general.

Honestly, I think we all get enough hate from inside and outside the lgbtqia+ community and we need to stick together and have each others backs. It's not the microlabels that are causing problems, it's the exclusionists. Invalidating eo's experiences and saying that biphobia is a bigger problem, panphobia is a bigger problem, omniphobia is a bigger problem, or polyphobia is a bigger problem, isn't gonna help anyone or solve anything. We can have slightly different experiences and still relate and support eo. Also, even if you have a problem w a specific label, pls just ask your questions genuinely, and try to understand the opposing side. Just have a mature conversation. If you're too young or immature to do that then you probably shouldn't be on social media. Calling eo names and telling eo to off ourselves isn't helping anything and there is no excuse for it. I've always loved the lgbtqia+ community for it's love and acceptance, but the more active I become within the community itself, the more I realise how toxic it can be. Sometimes I'm genuinely embarrassed to part of this community. Especially when it's grown adults acting like children that is causing the problems. Pls do better. Thank you for your time, thank you for reading, I love you, have a nice day!!!

Also I just want to add that ik there are more mspec identities than this, and you're all so valid. These are just the sexualities that ik enough about to give a proper statement on and the ones I've seen mentioned in this discourse the most. I'm actively trying to learn more about the mspec identities I mentioned, and those that I didn't. Pls feel free to give me any info on any sexuality (doesn't even have to be mspec I just want to learn more so I can be good ally for everyone), or ask me any questions about my own sexuality, and pls let me know if there is anything I should add or any misinformation in this post (I will not be including blatant blankphobia against any mspec identity so don't even try it bitches)

[myatuesday]

This case, man.

Idk what's more triggering @ this point,

The fact nobody will shut up about Heard supposedly having BPD

Or her blatant HPD jumping out the screen at us in real time.

-

I'm triggered AF. But I can't turn away.

The whole fucking thing makes my blood boil.

She, like every HPD bitch I've ever met, is a traitor to women and a menace to society.

-

The HPD element is triggering enough I'm actually seeking out someone to discuss it with who has been exposed to the toxic nature of HPD.

(No luck yet. It's, apparently, such a little known disorder... it seems nobody really even knows what it is. Sigh. FUCK. 😭)

I think it's especially hard when everyone sees and hears her behavior and believes it's BPD, when I'm like... holy fuck balls... she's histrionic AF.

It feels like... being victimized by someone w HPD all over again, basically.

-

See... now I'm crying. It's fucking with me that much.

I was bullied (I didn't see it as bullying at the time, just thought some girls were nice and some girls were fn cunts, even if they're your "friend") by girls w HPD basically half my life.

I don't want to name names, but this includes close girlfriends, girls who claimed to be my best friend, frienemies, and girls who actually were my best friend (for years) even if they were also in many ways my biggest adversary and subjecting me to constant bullying, and abuse, basically.

To have lived with these girls constantly ruining my life for literal decades

To be a grown adult, above all that shit

To now only have this bitch

Spitting in the face of actual survivors of DV, rape, etc

And on top of it all...

For the world to think that I am this type of person, because we supposedly share the same PD?!

It's a fucking nightmare.

I am nothing like this bitch.

Bitches like this tortured me.

She's torturing every survivor and every female with BPD as we fucking speak.

How can people think victims of her antics and of people like her... could possibly be like her?!

-

Idk how the fuck other people are wired, but I'm not a vindictive little cunt.

I don't get attention by hurting other people or even by attempting to take the attention away from other people (there's enough attention to go around).

And certainly the last thing in the world I would ever do is... God! Literally anything and everything she's doing right now!

It takes an incredibly, incredibly fucked up human being with A LOT more fn wrong with them than 2 gender-biased PDs to be pulling the shit this fucked up bitch is pulling.

-

That fucking video that's going around supposedly describing HPD & BPD does NOT describe BPD.

It very very clearly describes HPD & NPD, at great length. That Dr, for whatever reason, just decided to list all the features of a dog then call it a cat. And the world listened, as if this one fucking woman had all the answers.

Do you know that the rate of misdiagnosis is like 88%? 88%!

But this bitch, who met w Heard, for all of 2 fucking days has all the answers?

Obviously not.

That video describes at least one trait and/or symptom of every B-cluster disorder that exists.

But, if we're going to label that video, it is NOT a description of HPD & BPD. It is a description of HPD & NPD.

Anyone with google can look up the criteria.

This bitch fucked us all.

-

I'm obviously not on Amber's side, but this "doctor" didn't need to throw millions of women under the bus to prove her fucking point. Smh.

It's despicable.

This is hurting people.

My Twitter is full of women, on both teams, pleading to not be stigmatized by this BPD diagnosis.

We've always faced stigma, but this is on a grand scale.

And it's so damaging.

-

Shit finally seemed to be looking up.

BPD dx was looking to be a thing of the past.

They were realizing we had PTSD, CPTSD, spectrum disorders/neurodivergency.

All these years... they were wrong about many, many of us and we were on our road to redemption and recovery and support for our actual issues, finally...

Then this case happens. And it just cuts us at the knees.

Sigh

It's so fucked up.

-

I, technically, am no longer diagnosed with BPD.

My official files now say CPTSD (+ ADHD and shit, but for the sake of this conversation, that's kindof moot).

My therapist has been treating me for APD (formerly known as Aspergers) for awhile now. It's in my chart and insurance information, but I'm not technically officially officially diagnosed yet. Kindof a technicality.

But anyway

So... all in all

As of 2022, I just have CPTSD & ASD.

(Just. Ha.)

But, no. I'm no longer considered borderline. Maybe I never was.

But even if I were, at this time, I no longer meet BPD criteria (hallelujah). Regardless.

-

But still.

BPD was part of my identity for half of my life.

Plus, of course, I care about everyone else still in the struggle.

We're all in this community together.

We've been through so fucking much already.

Especially us old folks who realize we've been underdiagnosed and misdiagnosed our whole fucking lives.

There's a whole generation of us. All just trying to recover. And figure out, what now?

This is the last fucking thing we needed.

5 steps forward and 20 steps back.

-

Amber Heard's bullshit and one goddamn paid "doctor" get to do that to us?

Have we not been through enough?

I swear to god.

-

A lifetime screaming into the void.

I am not the only one.

THIS

IS NOT

JUSTICE.

[llawlietofficial]

What type of characterisation do u like for fics? I do find that fic from back in the day is mostly 1 dimensional but I was curious what ur issues w it where?

I’m sorry it’s taken me so long to answer this but I’m gonna be real my opinions on stuff like this have led to me being labeled toxic to the point where people have literally implied they want me and people who share similar opinions with me to leave the fandom, so I’ve been kind of hesitant to answer something like this bashing some recent characterization again. So if you’re one of those people I’m sorry and you should probably stop reading now.

opinions under the cut with some lawlight characterization stuff I don’t like + some stuff I do like:

Honestly? I try and read at least the first chapter or so of every new lawlight fic in the tag and recently it’s been impossible for me to enjoy a lot of it because when I read it it just doesn’t feel like L and Light to me at all? Like it feels like someone at some point wrote a big fic with strong characterization and interesting characters, except they weren’t much like L and Light and they acted in ways L and Light wouldn’t act. And a lot of fics now are based off that same characterization, which in turn inspires fics with that characterization, rinse and repeat. And that’s just not enjoyable to me when I’m looking to read lawlight fanfiction.

Obviously old lawlight fanfiction wasn’t all 100% perfect and there were a lot of doozies in that mix too but it felt like there were more really solid multichapter fics that might have been messy and toxic in ways but they made sense with the canon characters. And fics that did have a happy ending and some fluff thrown in were still written using circumstances that could be believable, even if it took a long time or a slow burn to get there.

To answer your question more specifically, here’s some common tropes that feel out of character to me (and I’m not calling out any specific author or saying fics that do any of these things are poorly written because they’re not and we have a lot of talented and dedicated people here):

Either one of them changing their principles and switching sides within the first 20k words and without a LOT of persuading. IMO “we’re two sides of the same coin and not that different despite both being hugely stubborn” is shit I love, “actually I’ve sided with you secretly the whole time/your magical dick has cured me of disagreeing with you/I’m willing to sacrifice the principles I literally died for in canon easily because I want to be with you” is shit I don’t love.

“We suddenly agree and work super well together as partners now that we’re in an AU and there’s no death note” doesn’t feel authentic to me because death note or no death note their entire outlook on the world is different. Light would think L’s methods are disgusting. L would think Light’s initial idealism is naive. Light believes mankind is inherently good and once you get rid of the bad that can shine, L…doesn’t seem to share that. That’s not to say they can never work together but the good shit is when it’s a long journey into understanding each other and where they’re coming from and slowly making compromises and falling in love.

L being a naive uwu tries his best baby who’s being taken advantage of by Light. Light being a misguided uwu baby who tries his best and is being taken advantage of the whole time by L. They’re more complex than that and they’re both bad people but they also both have good sides so any sort of simplification of the characters into one being a villain and one being a victim is uninteresting to me. 

They shouldn’t work but somehow despite everything they do, because they’re alone and because despite disagreeing and being enemies by circumstance and by beliefs, they know without the other they’d never really be challenged or fulfilled. That’s neat. I like that. It’s messy. They’re drawn to each other even as they’re disgusted with each other.

It’s more interesting when they are their own conflict rather than the conflict solely coming from outside sources.

The 500000 fics where Light is a rebellious and progressive omega who actually secretly wants to be protected by L and feels grateful that they’ve found each other? don’t love that. I dislike omega fics in general even if there’s a couple I’ve thought were pretty alright so that doesn’t help either. It is kind of interesting that despite their differences this could be an in-universe reason to force them together. It just seems like omegafic is the lawlight default right now. Like even fics where the plot doesn’t revolve around omegaverse stuff is sometimes omegaverse and that’s ? hard for me to wrap my brain around? that’s not just a lawlight problem though that seems to be happening in a lot of fandoms

Similarly to point one, either of them being okay with losing like lol what. 

yotsuba can be difficult to tackle because there’s so much going on there with the characters, but there’s so many interesting layers to explore and dive into that sometimes get ignored in favor of fluffy hijinks and that’s boring to me. from Light’s perspective L took everything from him and has made his life pretty miserable because of this whole Kira thing and catching the real Kira is the only real thing that could totally clear Light’s name and L just sort of….gives up, for a lot of it. mopes about and acts unmotivated and uninterested because Light isn’t Kira. that’s probably very frustrating for light! and fun wacky fluff or hijinks can happen, but I love when it happens in the “we got so distracted being the smartest people in the room we forgot we’re supposed to be enemies” way because that’s juicy to me

sometimes it’s the little things, too, that bother me. stuff that’ll happen and it’ll completely pull me out of the story. like L Lawliet made Naomi Misora destroy her whole damn computer after he slid into her DMs and you really think there’s any way in hell he’d have any sort of google home or siri or alexa? or casual social media, even under fake names? facebook knows everything. or light saying something or making a joke that i could never in a million years see him saying in canon because the author thought it would be funny or cute. 

anytime Light is suddenly some kind of beacon of goodness champion of justice just because he didn’t find the death note. the death note didn’t make him a completely different person, he’s bitter and jaded and thinks some people would be better off dead even before getting the death note. self righteous yeah totally but actually righteous? nah man

or Light just being a fucking awful person who kidnaps and r*pes L because he lusts after him but it’s okay because somehow in the end they end up together ? i’ve seen that trope a few times and i know it existed in 2007 too i just avoided it like the plague then also. 

I see a lot of AUs that are less “what would L and Light legitimately do if this was the situation or universe they were placed in” and more “i want to write this situation happening like this and i want to make it lawlight because that’s my main ship” 

like, the characters that are being written are fine but if you want to write OCs right OCs. I know all of this seems really harsh which is why I put a warning about it at the beginning, and of course I know some of these problems were also prevalent between 2013-2017 and there’s tropes here that have been happening like this since the dawn of lawlight fanfiction, but since it’s happening now and now is when i’m frustrated by it now is what i’m complaining about, it could be the reason i go back to older fanfiction so much is because i had lower standards back then and it was easier for me to wade through the ones i hated to get to ones i liked and now it’s easy for me to find those again. who knows. Also I agree most fanfiction from 2007-2009 were pretty 1 dimensional. 

And like, fuck me I guess but I actually like the canon characters and I joined the fandom to experience more of them and apparently that makes other people feel unsafe.

I’m not saying people aren’t allowed to express opinions that are different than me or that I Know Better Than Everyone Else or that I don’t like people posting their own headcanons or ideas or things they wish were different about the series, it’s just not my cup of tea and it’s a little frustrating that fanon is mostly all I get in fics now and that people are allowed to express opinions but only if those opinions are “people who stick too close to canon are elitist and should die and are sticks in the mud and need to leave the fandom to stop ruining things for everyone else” because like, we’re people too?

Anyway sorry this veered in a bit of a different direction and I hope I don’t lose followers over this because it’s sad to see people go but I’ve been blogging here for over 5 years and I’m not going to stop anytime soon. I also wrote most of this while having bad anxiety at like 3am last night so it’s all over the place and i’m probably going to think of like eight things in the shower later I forgot to mention because i’ve been thinking over this ask for like two weeks now. 

[banchoaniki]

Multiples of 4 then ☠

4: Talk show host: Imma be real w you I havent watched a talk show since attack of the show on g4 and that got cancelled years ago 8: Yankee candle scent: Fresh Balsam Fir. Smells like christmas and being cozy. Pine scents in general are god tier 12: Thing to cook: Anything that puts a smile on the face of those who eat it. Or Steak, Mashed Potatoes and Asparagus. Its easy, nutritious, and delicious. (That’d make a good dating profile header) 16: Book: Hard question. I’d have to go with Colorless Tsukuru and His Years of Pilgrimage by Haruki Murakami. 20: Holiday: Thanksgiving! I was born on it, so I have to like it. Other than that, toss up between Halloween and Christmas. 24: Movie: Uhhhhhhh, for live action, its a toss up between A Clockwork Orange and Apocalypse Now. For animated, Mind Game 28: Band: I dont follow a ton of bands, so Death Grips I guess. Its not like I dont listen to other music, but its mostly individual songs as opposed to deep diving into their discography 32: Athlete: I dont follow sports dude. Maybe like Usain Bolt cause he also has a pet tortoise like me.  36: Vehicle: Triump Bonneville T-100 40: Last person I got mad at: Uhh my former friend who’s girlfriend left him for being a piece of shit basically 44: One person that you wish you could see right now: I’m not missing anyone a whole ton rn. Wish we could meet tho jaz! 48: Ever been in love: Of course, its great and terrible 52: My room is: Fairly messy rn but I’ll clean up soon.  56: Favorite web site: Certainly not tumblr dot com. Idk dude probably like youtube cause I spend a lot of time watching videos or listening to podcasts.  60: I lose all respect for people who: Treat their partners like crap 64: My friends are: Great people! Things have been getting better for a lot of people in my circle of friends recently, and they really deserve it! 68: The worst sound in the world: Nails on chalkboard.  72: Today: Pretty ok day. Need to get a few things under control and still need to work out a bit, but studied hard and met up w a classmate to work on a project together! 76: Right now I am talking to: No one in particular, but ive been talking to friends throughout the day 80: The first person i talked to today was: Probably my dad when he woke me up 84: People call me: a lot of things im sure. Depends on who you ask.  88: Something I will really miss when I leave home is: Connection to where I live. My family’s owned my house for almost 100 years now, living elsewhere lacks that certain je ne sais quoi 92: Got a peircing: Never! maybe in the future tho... 96: Changed a diaper: also never! didn’t have any siblings or a close connected family growing up so I never had to. When I’m a dad, I’m sure I will though 100: Cried in front of someone: Oh jeez, not really sure. Maybe a few months ago, but I can’t recall what for 104: The future: Its filled with infinite possibilities, I just have to work for a future I want. I’m not too worried about stability, but you never know. Always try to have contingency plans for your contingency plans.  108: Designer Clothes: Generally overpriced trash. I’d rather buy from a local artisan that makes clothes specifically for me. Not like I don’t shop for clothes or like looking good, but theres a lot of issues in the fashion industry that I take umbrage with and like to look for alternatives.  112: Facebook: Boomerbook is convenient website that I use on occasion but I find to be fairly toxic, like most social media, so i rarely post on it. I just use the messenger app to talk with friends. 116: Reality TV: Utter trash! There are a billion other ways to spend your time that are more productive and beneficial to yourself and others that getting caught up in some fake drama with celebrities.  120: Gay Marriage: I don’t believe any kind of marriage should be regulated by the government, as its a religious sacrament. If churches want to allow it, that’s their prerogative that I won’t infringe on, but that’s in an ideal world. As it stands, I don’t have any strong feels for or against it, insofar that I think most marriages are fairly toxic.  124: Disney or Six Flags: Didney Worl 128: Manicure or Pedicure: I’ll take both, thanks 132: Kat McPhee or Taylor Hicks: Whomst’d’ve?  136: Hillary or Obama: Both are genuinely terrible people like most, if not all, government officials in Washington.  140: Mac or PC: I built my own PC but iPads do be kinda fresh tho I can see why people who don’t have the same hobbies or interests prefer macs, their visual design blows most PCs out of the water, and they’re functional for work and video editing. They’re obviously overpriced for the performance, but you’re buying it for the label and the well designed UI (generally, theres obviously some UI designs that are/were less than great by apple) 144: Oranges or Apples: While I like oranges, I FUCKING LOVE apples. So yeah, apples, particularly Fuji apples.  148: Summer or winter: Winter. I live in Los Angeles. Our winters are mild and maybe drizzley. Our summers are hellish. Easy choice. 152: Phone or Online: Uh I mean I like talking on the phone but texting or instant messaging is super convenient and, really, a very different form of communication that I engage in more.  156: Orbs: Do i believe in orbs? What kind of orbs? idk dude this is very nondescript and im too lazy to research this. Orbs as a geometric object do exist yes. Jury is still out on whatever the fuck this is asking tho 160: Soul mates: A distinct possibility that I’d love to be true 164: Heaven: I’m catholic, pretty sure I have to believe in it.  168: Luck: Yeah, I believe in it, but I also believe we make our own luck most times. 172: Are you taller than your mom? yeah shes like 5′2  176: Last YouTube video watched: Sure hope you like smooth japanese jazz fusion  https://youtu.be/6GEI3PpXEAo 180: Marriage is: A great responsibility I hope to be ready for one day. It can be incredible and life-affirming or it can be soul crushing if you rush into things or just have a bad partner. I don’t mean to be cynical, I genuinely believe its a beautiful thing, but so many marriages today end up horribly, so I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t afraid of it at the same time.  184: Xbox or ps3: Whichever game console can give me a better user experience with better games and services. Right now that’s playstation, but I sincerely hope microsoft steps up to the plate next gen.  188: My bed is: A queen. Kinda messy rn.  192: I am allergic to: Nothing in particular 196: My eye color is: Green! I’m actually pretty proud of them, its the rarest eye color in the world, so its part of what makes me who I am.  200: My crush’s name is:  Jaz (no homo)  But also I’m not single so I don’t necessarily have any rn

PS: I sincerely apologize for this wall of text y’all 

[dotthings]

Okay, about this “g*ncest” thing that just cropped up which makes me feel like I splintered back to the year 2006 and aren’t we over this by now...what that is is a bona fide example of toxic masculinity attitudes at work and being valorized by a small number of fans, mostly female.

First off, as far as I’m concerned, you are free to enjoy or write any type of fic you want, I don’t care. I’m not judging your fic tastes. I won’t insult you as a human being, attack you, send anon hate, or put this post on your tags or even any shared tags. Which is more than antis have done to respect my shipping but whatever. 

However I disagree with the idea that there can be no discussion when fandom reinforces certain biases or ideas and tries to normalize them, without realizing how they’re reinforcing some real world level stuff that needs to be questioned. The discussion itself is valuable if you aren’t being a dick about it. 

So you know how D*stiel fans get accused all the freakin’ time, endlessly, ad nauseam “you don’t respect male friendships! male friendships are rare and precious commodities in the media! why do you have to ruin it by making it gay!” (Sorry I need a moment to stop laughing). When the fact is D*stiel fans openly own their slash and own the gay and fling glitter, they don’t tend to apologize for it, instead of trying to mask the fact that it’s slash. Nobody is denying that close platonic male friendships can exist, either. But guess what, it is outright not toxic masculinity to see past heteronormative defaults to see how shipping two male friends together and seeing the potential for romance instead of by default ruling it out just because people are the same gender. It’s just not. It gets concerned trolled into the freakin’ ground as reinforcing toxic masculinity. It isn’t.

Which brings us to this g*ncest thing which, I stfg I thought we’d left behind in 2006. It’s an old fandom term that has outlived its need and outlived the context of the mores in fandom and society at the time that created it, like its related fic label concept, “smarm.”

“Smarm” isn’t the same definition as “smarmy.” The fandom definition of smarm is fic that depicts two people of the same gender being emotionally and physically close who are not in love and the intent is not romantic and not slash.

In other words, gen fic.

It depicts a platonic friendship or sibling bond.

It’s..gen fic. But for some reason, some felt they had to call it “smarm” because either it’s difficult to grasp that two men can be physically or emotionally close without it being slashy, or, fans who wanted to slash but self-shamed for it. They wouldn’t just call it a slash fic. Just like, it’s not w*ncest it’s g*ncest!!! Which somehow seems to assume itself a fest safe for anyone who isn’t into incest and just wants to celebrate the platonic sibling bond and...no, really, no. Probably be smarter to just host a Sam and Dean Gen Fic fest, which I’m sure exists, and hey, something for everyone, I’m not saying the g*ncest fest shouldn’t be allowed to continue, just pointing out why some people are bothered by it for reasons other than “you are ship shaming meanies!!”

There’s a big aspect of shame in smarm, and I’m arguing, to g*ncest. 

The recent uptick of intensity in SPN fandom where w*incest fandom stans determinedly turn every single canon Sam and Dean moment into incest, and insist every story, every fic, every image, every concept about Sam & Dean’s bond is emotional w*incest is part of this toxic masculinity thing, the g*ncest issue, the smarm issue. A Sam and Dean image, boom, incest! The brothers are so in love! D*stiel fans are considered horrible for, y’know, reading romance into a shit-ton of usage of romantic tropes, canon pining, plot and dialogue and long arcs that map to romantic tropes, even overt shout-outs from other characters to the idea that Dean and Cas are a thing, but if Sam and Dean so much as stand next to each other it’s incest ftw.

There is such a thing as pre-slash and I find it a whole lot less squicky than smarm or g*ncest. I kind of like pre-slash because it owns the fact that romantic relationships don’t always have to manifest as sexy times, but why did we even call it pre-slash, why not just slash at a G or PG rating? I think this is becoming more of the norm, with slash shippers unapologetically posting slash fic at a G or PG rating. Readers are free to read into whatever they want into a gen fic, but if the author ships it and intends to put romance into it, but it isn’t about how the characters have sex or even kiss, they’re still romantically in love and they’re going to label it slash or pre-slash. I don’t see the need for the “pre” in that any more. No they aren’t kissing yet, no they aren’t having sex yet, but they are in love nonetheless. 

Let go of the idea that a kiss or having sex is the only way to verify characters being in love. 

Toxic masculinity isn’t the removal of heteronormative goggles that were probably fused to our faces from birth because that’s how our society is and being capable of imagining that two male friends in a story can fall in love the same way we imagine a man and woman can. 

Toxic masculinity is when you are so determined that men--be it friends or siblings--cannot be close and it be, in fact, friendship or sibling love. It’s the equating of all male intimacy with a sexual and/or romantic bond. And I feel that a false narrative’s been allowed to prevail in SPN fandom that D*stiel fandom is deeply guilty of this when it’s not, while other groups that are doing this chronically, get a free pass.

I’d say it’s a pretty major example of toxic masculinity to insist that platonic w*incest is a thing, instead of just, y’know, Sam & Dean loving each other as siblings without hints of a romantic or sexual element. It’s toxic masculinity to slap the -cest slapping on every-freakin’-thing and then claim you’re being ship-shamed because you actually gate-keeped against fans who really just appreciate the sibling bond and don’t need any -cest to appreciate how close Sam and Dean are and appreciate that bond, and it’s pretty toxic to keep flinging a trigger in people’s faces every five minutes, openly, as if you own the entire fandom, and insist canon backs you up when in fact it’s gently shut you down on multiple occasions, and then expect absolutely nobody to be upset at you ever, and if anyone gets upset they’re ship-shaming you. That’s quite a big amount of entitlement, to assume that people aren’t allowed to be uncomfortable with something like incest.

Especially when you try to force LGBT ships that are non-trigger into the same mode, force a false equivalency, thus fetishizing the LGBT ships, and get offended if someone points out why a differentiation is sensible and necessary.

If you’re into Dean and Cas’s friendship and don’t see any romantic element, that’s gen. No really. It’s friendship fic. That’s not pre-slash. That’s not platonic D*stiel. You see a friendship. There is no such thing as platonic Destiel. Now, this gets tricky, because while that is 100% valid to feel that way, D*stiel is reaching a stage where not-shipping it is cool and all that, but if you vehemently deny there is any reason for other people to see more to it, you’re kind of having to ignore a hella lot of canon to keep those heteronormative goggles fused to your face, and no I am not accusing people who don’t ship it of being homophobic. Or of unconscious biases of being homophobic. We all have them. Talk about it, don’t insult people or shame them, sometimes it just takes a little bit to get people to understand. Others will never get there no matter what. Depends on the person. 

There’s any number of het ships where I have eyes, I can see canon intent, I see they’re into each other, but I don’t care and I don’t ship it and I might enjoy genfic about that relationship or have them wind up as friends, I don’t ship it. There’s non-canon popular slash fics I don’t feel it or see it. I don’t yell down its shippers though. Its that simple. My advice is just don’t go screaming down D*stiel shippers with why must you ruin their friendship or claiming it’s toxic masculinity and going on about the sanctity of platonic male friendship which is just such a rare and precious flower in the media (sorry. pausing to lmfao again). 

I also literally do not care how you see Sam and Dean’s relationship or if you ship that. I honestly do not care and I don’t make assumptions about you as a person (your fandom behavior over your ship might make me decide things about you). But...it’s still incest. I’m not ship-shaming. It’s incest. Why does this have to be explained over and over. You can ship whatever you want and should be allowed to have safe spaces for it but this assumption that everyone has to be 100% cool with such an obvious trigger and societal taboo or they’re hypocrites who don’t really believe in the “ship and let ship” they believe in...come on. “Ship and let ship” doesn’t mean be inconsiderate and it doesn’t mean you have to be comfortable with every ship in the fleet.

But SPN fandom has this lingering thing it can’t seem to let go of where systemically, it thinks incest and an LGBT ship should be treated exactly alike, and it has this thing where incest is being intrusively slapped onto every-freakin’-thing about Sam & Dean in spaces where fans can’t avoid it and it’s not behind a cut tag it’s not labeled, and if you aren’t into it you get mocked, and if you don’t watch only for the brother bond you get mocked, and this is coming from many of the same people who think an LGBT ship is identical to incest and from many of the same people who get offended if you point out why an LGBT ship isn’t like incest, and who get offended people ship that LGBT ship as well as from generalized anti-shippers who treat being a non-shipper like a superior badge of honor and who reinforce the gatekeeping that virulent incest shippers aim at D*stiel shippers while valorizing an incest ship, but this breed of anti-shippers are in total denial about doing it. (Note the distinction between anti-shipper and non-shipper).

But taking what is actually just gen fic about Sam & Dean being emotionally intimate or showing physical affection and insisting it needs a -cest on the end instead of just, y’know, being about a sibling bond...that’s where toxic masculinity comes in. Isn’t one of the whole major points of SPN’s narrative to deconstruct these perceptions of masculinity? To debunk the idea that men can’t be emotionally intimate? And please miss me with the idea that shipping D*stiel is somehow contrary to this. D*stiel is a part of that debunking because neither Dean nor Cas act like the media stereotypes of what bi (or ace or pan or whatever Dean and Cas might be) looks like. They started as friends, and became emotionally close before SPN canon got into the zone where it seems a lot more serious about possibly openly vocalizing or consummating the subtextual pining. Friends-to-lovers isn’t insisting all friends must be lovers. It’s fans identifying something in this particular pair of friends and in the narrative, in the canon, and don’t discard it just because of a heteronormative default that buys a slow burn will-they-won’t-they for m/f but sneers that same-gender potential romance is delusional.

Likewise if it’s Dean and Cas and someone slaps some form of slash label on it while refusing to own that they ship it and refusing to own there could be sexual attraction, instead of simply saying “it’s a gen fic I love their friendship” would also an example of toxic masculinity ideas and probably a lot of self-shaming about seeing and enjoying the slash in the first place. Dean and Cas friendship enthusiasts and Dean and Cas shippers actually get along pretty well (assuming no one is acting like a dick) and that, I think, is because there is such a powerful emotional component to the ship, and Dean and Cas friendship enthusiasts tend to be non-virulent and tend to be open-minded about why the shippers see more in it even if they don’t.

This should be also true of w*ncest fans and enthusiasts of the sibling bond because again, massive emotional component as common ground, but I feel like what’s happening is the more intense and virulent w*ncest fans are trying to draw such a hard line that if you aren’t into incest, there’s no space for you. This goes hand in hand with the virulently pro-codependency fans, who romanticize mental illness and then can’t seem to figure out why anyone is upset with them, and who think that anyone who isn’t into romanticizing mental illness hates the bro bond so they’ve swept out plenty fans who adore the sibling bond with their virulence.

Personally I find uncomfortable when fans insist that gen fic about two dudes being close needs to be some kind of pick-your-fighter-label form of slash instead of just owning it’s a celebration of close male friendship. Bromance is a stupid term and IMO part of toxic masculinity too. 

There’s also the erasure of the fact that D*estiel is one of the least smut-driven ships. A recent study of ships with the highest smut content found w*ncest at the top and D*stiel barely even rated, and here’s the ironic part: virulently anti-destiel w*ncest fans and ship shamey non-shippers slapped D*stiel with a default assumption that it’s all about fapping material and two dudes getting it on and you just want to make spn into a porno and accuses D*stiel fandom of fetishizing m/m relationships when w*ncest is at the top of the smut pile. No I am not shaming you for enjoying smut. No I am not saying that a ship is superior for being less smutty. I’m very clearly objecting to the shaming and misconceptions of D*stiel fandom, which are often willfully perpetuated. 

This misconception has stubbornly stuck in spn fandom and it’s incredibly annoying. Please join us in the year 2018. When so much of D*stiel is Dean and Cas not having sex but just being ridiculous and making heart-eyes and in denial and trying to figure this out and maybe they brush hands and blush, it’s almost Victorian. (Y’know, like the canon ha ha. Oh wait that’s not funny I’m serious). A lot of D*stiel fans write slash fic so they can get them to talk honestly with each other. 

So sure, have your ficfests how you like, but I think it’s worth at least pointing out that this fixation with slapping the -cest label on everything is an example of toxic masculinity concepts at work, is normalizing incest to a ridiculous degree, is de-normalizing fans who really just appreciate a sibling bond, what with the stans insisting that w*ncest is just another term for their close emotional bond, *splutter* I don’t watch SPN for ships how dare you instead of, y’know, having the balls to own the fact that they’re intrigued by the incest ship. They shove it everywhere and disown it all in the same breath.

[borderline-vent]

So I know this is a vent blog but honestly like

I'm really grateful to my fp for helping me learn how to handle not only my bpd, but my other personality disorders, too. Whether it's avpd or avpd traits is a little up in the air w my therapist right now- at this point the list is kind of long and we're focusing on managing symptoms rather than what precise label goes where - but npd is a definite. When I met my fp I was mostly just questioning npd traits; I realized as I learned more about it and talked more to my therapist that I have, like, The Whole Thing. You know how it goes.

I'm determined not to be my mother who I suspect has bpd and npd traits -probably not the whole disorder, but some of our thought patterns and perceptions have been pretty similar in that regard -and kind of ruins everyone's life she touches, including mine. She's badly fucked her own self over, her husband I really don't think she abuses but he also seems uninvolved in some pretty significant ways; he just kind of let her do whatever she wanted to us, believed her over us, and she hides some of her worst abuse from him- like hitting me with a hanger, and choking my sibling and throwing them to the floor to scream at them and not letting us tell him what happened. She's also just manipulative and controlling and blames everyone else for her negative feelings and anything that goes wrong, even (especially) when it's her fault (sort of how her throwing me into a wall as a teenager was my fault somehow... lol). So that's oart of my motivation to work hard with therapy and learn to manage all this stuff, but really put some focus into managing my narcissism. It's not going to benefit me, or anybody else, if I'm unselfaware and I just treat people like shit all the time -which I don't, but I don't ever want to, and there are always places I can improce as a person.

It's hard to be honest and fucking excruciating to be vulnerable. I have a huge ego and a massive rift in self-esteem, I can't confront shame (so I use other mechanisms to motivate me to adjust problematic behavior) and I'm incapable of self-compassion, which apparently is essential for healing your inner child or something. I guess my inner child is just going to have to stay broken, but I can work on other things.

Fp has aspd and npd, which I think I've mentioned here before; and he's conscientious enough and makes me feel comfortable enough to talk to him about new things in my life, even things that make me feel vulnerable. We don't have all the same symptoms of course, but we share several, and he's got a lot of experience learning how to manage comorbid personality disorders, and when I'm really struggling he's extremely helpful in clearing my perception- and often he's the only person I feel comfortable enough to talk to about it, given that childhood abuse gave me such trouble with trust. I've known him for nearly 2 years now, and he's only ever demonstrated more commitment to treating me well, and so I trust him. I mean, I don't /really/ trust anybody. But I trust him more than anyone else, and he's made me feel more comfortable being secure and he's never been malicious or gaslit me or been cruel to me or put me down or any of the shit some other people have done.

I've also learned a lot about how dysfunctional my family is- for instance, defensiveness to the point of making an ass of yourself instead of correcting your mistakes, seems to be a family trait. Stuff like that is pretty frustating, given I'm (still) too sick to work and I have to live with them (but with therapy and a purse full of medicine I'm getting there). I isolate here a lot, because communication breaks down so easily, and then I get frustrated, and I don't want to snap at people and I want to try to identify what I could do to smooth interactions; and some things I'm oversensitive to because they remind me of my abusive mother (but apparently I'm not allowed to say "hey please don't do this because I have a history with it happening to me in greater degree and it's bad" because then I get accused of comparing people to my mother... anyway I spend a lot of time by myself.

Recently I've been deep in a ptsd swing because an alter got a (shiny!new!) flashback to our csa and so we had a bad couple of weeks tbh but it seems like that's smoothing out now. I haven't had a flashback or a panic attack in a couple of days and the nightmares are better too.

And I've realized that a lot of what I was so worried about before -a lot of what I yelled about on this blog actually- was just... not all an inaccurate perception on my part, but that I noticed changes in communication with fp and reacted to them in a characteristically borderline way. I correctly registered that he seemed more withdrawn, was less warm, etc. And when we talked about it, he told me he still liked me just as much as ever, but he was depressed, like we'd been talking about, and he had less energy and he just hadn't been expressing it the way he had when he'd felt better. And that's something I'm familiar with, because it's super common with depression and I've withdrawn like that, too.

He told me this friendship, and his being my fp, is important to him and he wants to maintain it, and he was glad I shared my feelings with him, because he wants to know if there's a issue. I told him that while I didn't want to make him feel taxed while he's depressed (or at all), more expression would ameliorate my anxiety and make me feel more secure. He didn't blame me for feeling the way I did, didn't try to make it my fault (it wasn't anyone's fault; I have my symptoms and he has his and we communicate out limitations and work on issues together) just told me he appreciated me, my friendship, and my communicating with him, and he'd adjust his behavior to help remind me I was liked and valued. And he has, and his depression has gotten better with meds, and I feel better (and the fact he was so receptive and so willing to put in the effort also made me feel better) and he's helped me as I've been stressed over family drama (my mother having some drama with other family members- I need to figure out somehow who's telling the truth but it's gonna be uhhh stressful) and over the new piece of trauma we remembered (not good) and the worsening of ptsd symptoms.

I feel stable in our friendship, and have done for several weeks now, and that's been the defining trend of our friendship over two years. It's fucking hard for me to feel stable or secure in friendships, especially with fps and especially when I have strong romantic feelings for them, but he puts in a lot of effort to help me feel that way, /and to help me improve my baseline ability to feel that way./

Our friendship is predicated in many ways on what's most useful; for instance, it's beneficial to him to put in that effort because I feel better, and so there's less maintenance work he needs to do. That's not a drawback; we genuinely like each other and enjoy one another's company, and help each other a lot, and while it's not an empathetic friendship from his side, it's a kind ans supportive one, a safe one, a sheltering one, a comfortable and profoundly important one. It's the strongest and healthiest relationship I've ever had, and it's done as much or maybe even more than therapy has to get me through struggling times and improve the way I feel about myself and other people.

This is a long fucking post right now but like. I'm really grateful for this man. I always have been. I have strong emotional reactions to real or percieved abandonment, and I see it everywhere, but he never tries to make me feel bad for it, just helps me feel better. I yell a lot on this blog but there's a reason I haven't really posted here in a while (and other things go wrong elsewhere but I usually post about that on my other blog. That's where my ptsd and family vents went.) I have an as-soon-as-possible goal to get myself well enough to work, and save enough money to move so that I can live where he lives. I'll finally be away from toxic family (telecontact, I'm sure, but still a meaningful distance) and regularly able to see the most important person in my life, and I think that has a lot of potential to help with my mental health.

[ambigamingcorner]

It’s been a while since I’ve written about the quagmire that is gender and gaming. But we’re winding up for another set of posts on the topic, and what better way to ease into this topic than talking about toxic masculinity and toxic femininity/feminism?

The Issue of Non-Issue

What fascinates me about this particular issue is that because sexim is not blatantly overt in the general population, and gender roles have changed slightly, many people are content to dust off their hands, say, “Problem solved!” and give a side-eye to those who continue to question whether the solutions are as absolute as some people like to claim.

So, in this particular article, we will be defining masculinity and femininity, and talking about when these constructs are taken to their unyielding extreme and begin to not work in harmony, but strike at the foundations of a cohesive society.

A Few Definitions

When I posted about this topic on Patreon, I had a nice discussion with LightningEllen about toxic masculinity and toxic femininity. What was most striking to me was that there was no real definition to the latter and, indeed, the two of us had wildly different ideas as to what these terms actually entailed.

So, to make sure we are on the same page, for the following article, I will be defining the above terms thus:

Masculinity: physical, emotional, and behavioral traits traditionally associated with men. These characteristics are active (that is, the person is taking an active role in social contexts), and are opposite to the feminine.

Toxic masculinity: a state of being wherein masculine traits are exhibited to a point that they are harmful or oppressive to the person exhibiting the traits, and/or to those around them. A man must never show weakness in any capacity: physically, mentally, or emotionally.

NO NO NO NO NO

Femininity: physical, emotional, and behavioral traits traditionally associated with women. These characteristics are passive (that is, the person is being acted upon by other forces, such as the masculine), and are opposite to the masculine.

Toxic femininity: A sub-group under toxic masculinity. It is a state of being wherein feminine traits are exhibited to a point that they are harmful or oppressive to the person exhibiting the traits, and/or to those around them. Tends toward women being passive and being acted upon, rather than taking action.

  Do you know how hard it is to find a picture for toxic femininity? That’s how passive it is.

Feminism: a social idea that the genders should be equal in social, cultural, and vocational positions.

Yay! Yes!

Third-wave feminism: Extreme, revenge-filled feminism. It is a set of ideas that proclaims women to be superior to men, or otherwise labels men as “the other” or, worse, “the enemy.” Also sees women who want to be stay-at-home moms, believe that men should be the breadwinners, and/or who simply don’t believe men are The Enemy, as “the enemy.”

When It’s Okay, and When It’s Toxic

I have a radical idea: masculine and feminine are actually made to complement each other. The strength, courage, independence, violence, and assertiveness are balanced by empathy, gentleness, and sensitivity. There is nothing inherently wrong or toxic about any of these characteristics, and having a balance of both is – or should be – considered ideal.

This is actually a real idea!!!

When this begins to crumble is when they are taken to their extreme, to the point where a person is expected to have all of Column A without ever demonstrating characteristics from Column B. The characteristics in the above paragraph are some examples of masculinity and femininity, but within society there are many other expectations that pressure men and women to think, act, and feel in particular ways.

When all of these things become toxic, it’s because a person has adopted these characteristics, but then also attempts to take away another person’s autonomy because of them. This can either be internal or external. For instance, a man might feel pressure to not “show weakness” by crying at a movie, or he might think it’s okay to talk over women because he has been raised to always be assertive with his ideas. A woman might feel pressure to wear makeup and be appealing for “the male gaze,” or she might think it’s okay to wield her emotions like a weapon.*

Notice something here. These are both harmful, please make no mistake about that. But when one group is always the one “acting” and one group is always being “acted upon,” it not only harmful to the individual, but can be harmful to the group as a whole.

A Brief Digression

But Athena, some of you might wonder. If everyone just stayed in their gender roles, this wouldn’t be a problem. You said yourself that masculine and feminine are complements of each other!

The hammer and nail argument, yes. In Japan, there is a saying that roughly translates to: the nail that sticks out gets hammered down. Sure, yes, if everyone sat down, shut up, and continued on, yep this wouldn’t be a problem. We’d all be squeezed into our tiny little cookie cutters, whether or not we really fix, and go through our lives peacefully, if not incredibly unhappy.

Everyone wants to be the hammer, and doesn’t think about who is the nail.

Let’s face it, people. We’re all affected by “The Patriarchy,” but because within the confines of the masculine and feminine gender roles one is always active and one is always acted upon, some issues are a lot more immediately or externally harmful, and some are more internally harmful. As a blunt example: men can take what they want, when they want it, but if a woman wants something for herself (which is outside of her “gender role”) she must subvert the system and act in a manipulative way, since being assertive isn’t a socially acceptable option.

This causes men to be angry at how deceptive “women as an entire gender” are, and then further results in women being expected/forced to deal with/deflect/defuse their anger. And because men are supposed to be dominant, there is no room for listening to “her side” of the story. Man must stay in control, because men are always supposed to be in control.*

Two sides of one horrendous, ridiculous coin.

Games and This Whole Mess

Thank the Maker, we’re finally talking about video games.

I’m not even going to attempt to dive into the cesspool that is toxic masculine behavior online or within gaming communities, with gatekeeping, slurs, and general horribleness happening from men to women and men to other men. But I would like to talk briefly about the roles that games play in all of this.

For those of you who have been hanging around a while, you’ll know that I am a big believer in representation mattering in games. We emulate behaviors that we observe, whether that is in real life or on a screen. We emulate behaviors more strongly when we have an inherent disposition toward an idea (i.e., it’s “in our nature” or “our personality”), but we can also absorb as true the ideas that are presented to us most consistently, even at a subconscious level.

Remember a long time ago when I asked you to play a game with me? And then we talked about what the game was all about? Seeing how certain characters are portrayed, as you guys know, contributes to how a person sees themselves. Yes, it is possible to rage against the machine, as it were, but when operating within a social group, we are expected to fulfill the norms and expectations put on us, with a slight degree of variation (again decided by society) being acceptable. Break all the norms and expectations, and the group at large will not be accepting of your behavior.

How these norms are developed is far outside of the scope of this article, but suffice it to say that once the norms are developed, it is up to the member of society and the media of that society to maintain and enforce those norms. Such is the state of video games and the video game community.

On the video game front, we are given men and women who fall into masculine and feminine boxes. Solid Snake and Cole McGrath, for instance, are as comic-book-hero-esque as characters can get, and are examples of what A Man should be: powerful, aggressive, lacking any sort of emotional display other than outrage or anger (or, if they do, it’s not long before the more “acceptable” emotions come back, i.e., sadness turning immediately into anger). Compare to Raiden from Metal Gear Solid 2: still pretty powerful, still pretty aggressive, but also has a girlfriend that he loves and is emotionally hurt by. And fans called him a pansy.

Some men might not see this as a problem, though.

Let’s take two queens of gaming, Princess Zelda and Princess Peach. Avoiding stereotypical language, Peach is the woman who waits at home for Mario, baking him cakes and offering him kisses as rewards for doing things for her. She passively waits for Mario to actively go and be the hero. Princess Zelda (with the exception of possibly Wind Waker and Breath of the Wild) is demure and quiet, although enjoys the slight deviation from the norm by being wise and even taking a slightly more active role in Twilight Princess when she actually holds a sword for a few seconds and fires some arrows alongside Link, but sufficiently makes up for this by being largely absent as Link saves the world.

Compare this to another famous woman in gaming, Lara Croft, who started off as a female Indiana Jones and then was somehow twisted into gaming’s biggest sex symbol, because it wasn’t enough that she was smart and capable and the primary character like her male counterparts: she had to be appealing to men.

Notice as she became more realistic (in many ways), her body proportions changed.

Which brings me to the actual point of this article: the effects these games can have on a person. Video games enforce (for the most part) the ideals and values of the society, and so the societal pressure on a man to never be weak, and a woman to always be second, is reflected in that.

Why Is This Bad, and Why Aren’t You Talking About Games Yet?

I’ll be blunt: toxic masculinity is bad because it hurts people. It forces men into a role that is not sustainable, at least without compromising other people. How can one always be in control, unless one takes control away from another person? How can one always be the strongest, if the other person isn’t expected to be weaker? How can one always be right, unless other thoughts and opinions are silenced or belittled? How can one be expected to not emote, and yet be expected to be so compassionate as to risk life and limb for another person? How can a person help bring another person into being, and then think it’s okay to say that they are “babysitting” their own children, when in reality they are parenting?

What about toxic femininity? Well, that hurts people, too, but in a more reactive (versus active) way. How can one succeed in a job that requires you to self-advocate, when one is insulted for being assertive? How can one exert independence, when one is expected to sit quietly and wait for a man to come along? How can one ever hope for equality, when there is one superior and one inferior gender?

While some folks may disagree, media is so important. To be clear, no, video games, movies, books, and the like don’t need to validate my existence and I’m not asking society for permission to exist. But I’m asking media to have balance, to offer a window into worlds that we might not otherwise see, to offer a window into worlds that could be, if only we tried hard enough.

Because it matters.

Studies have shown that, when men are exposed to video games that glorify the “masculine” stereotype and systematically supports the oppression of women, those men have a greater tolerance for real-life violence against women. The same effects were not seen when women played these same games.

So what does that mean? That means that society primes men to think a certain way (they are “masculine”), and media reinforces that “masculine” means never being feminine, and that harming those who are “the feminine” is okay. Rewarded, even. So that’s what one learns.

And thus we have reinforced toxic masculinity.

Video games that portray men being violent toward women causes men to be more tolerant toward violence against women.

I… shouldn’t have to say anything after that.

Like violence before this, being subjected to certain themes in certain games can make you more tolerant of them. Maybe there isn’t causation between playing a video game and actually sexually harassing a woman, but seeing images of men dominating women reinforces that men are the ones who do the acting, and women are the ones who are acted upon. In these games, men are always in control and always exerting power over others. And the man doing the acting is the hero, and the woman being acted upon is just that: scenery, waiting for a man to show up and give her existence meaning.

Out of context game picture is out of context.

So, no, while playing a Grand Theft Auto game isn’t going to turn you into a sexual predator, it might make a man feel entitled to a woman, or reinforce that respecting her integrity or right to an existence outside of your gaze/pleasure is not necessary. And that’s a problem.

But #NotAllMen!

Yes. Not all men, and not all games. Men are not, I’ll remind all of you sharpening your pitchforks, the enemy here. No one is the enemy here. No one is an enemy. Say it with me: no one is an enemy.

In recent years, games have begun to explore more realistic portrayals of women, and that’s great. I’m certainly not saying that power fantasies are inherently bad; after all, who doesn’t want to be a superhero all the time? And I’m not saying that no video game should ever objectify or subjugate anyone else. I’m not completely out-of-touch: being able to exert power over someone else makes a person feel powerful. You can’t always do it in the physical world, so sure, put it in a game. But also realize that what you put in a game is going to affect how the person interacts with their actual, real world.

So men may feel pressure to never feel anything beyond angry, to “man up” and fulfill any number of stereotypes that can, at the end of the day, oppress their true natures. And women might feel pressured to stay a step behind men, keeping their heads down and their voices soft, waiting to be called on. Society says it, games show it, and that’s the only possibility that is ever given.

What I advocate, as per usual, is the inclusion of games into our collective minds that have well-written characters. Yes, there is a whole social brick wall that we’re going to run into, because men have been led to believe they can’t show emotions, and so will not want to play as a “sissy,” as we saw with poor Raiden. Women have been led to believe that being assertive is being a bitch, or that women cannot take care of themselves, and so may instead prefer playing as a “strong” man instead of a “strong” woman.

We’re all stuck in the matrix, folks. We are all constantly under pressure by society to fit into the little boxes it provides to us, all little pegs waiting to be hammered down into our respective holes, whether or not we actually fit in them.

I love video games. I love that they can open the door to new realities and experiences that aren’t possible in the physical world.

I love that they can open doors into worlds that are possible, and that could be, if only…

I love that games can hold up a mirror and say, here’s what is.

And I really love that they are important enough to us that they can influence our behavior.

…We just always need to be aware of the type of person we are being influenced to be.

What are your thoughts on toxic masculinity/femininity? How can this be translated into our real-world communities? Or is this not a problem at all? Let me know in the comments!

Thanks for stopping by, and I’ll see you soon! ~ Athena

Do you like what you’ve read? Become a revered Aegis of AmbiGaming and show your support for small creators and for video games as a serious, viable, and relevant medium!

For more reading on games and masculinity:

Fox, J., & Tang, W.Y. (2013). Sexism in online video games: The role of conformity to masculine norms and social dominance orientation. Computers in Human Behavior, 33, 314-320. Linked here: https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/be6b/69d4062dd20d35728ff2e515048b1dcd5f5e.pdf

Dill, K.E., Brown, B.P., & Collins, M.A. (2007). Effects of exposure to sex-stereotyped video game characters on tolerance of sexual harassment. Journal of Experimental Social Psychology, 44, 1402-1408.

http://www.marissabellino.com/uploads/7/6/6/1/7661682/content_analysis_video_games_and_gender.pdf

#ICYMI: Better late than never: #men, #women, #games, and #toxicity. Hold onto your hats! Oh, and maybe some #feminism, too. All in one #ThrowbackThursday #tbt It’s been a while since I’ve written about the quagmire that is gender and gaming. But we’re winding up for another set of posts on the topic, and what better way to ease into this topic than talking about toxic masculinity and toxic femininity/feminism?

[ambigamingcorner]

It’s been a while since I’ve written about the quagmire that is gender and gaming. But we’re winding up for another set of posts on the topic, and what better way to ease into this topic than talking about toxic masculinity and toxic femininity/feminism?

The Issue of Non-Issue

What fascinates me about this particular issue is that because sexim is not blatantly overt in the general population, and gender roles have changed slightly, many people are content to dust off their hands, say, “Problem solved!” and give a side-eye to those who continue to question whether the solutions are as absolute as some people like to claim.

So, in this particular article, we will be defining masculinity and femininity, and talking about when these constructs are taken to their unyielding extreme and begin to not work in harmony, but strike at the foundations of a cohesive society.

A Few Definitions

When I posted about this topic on Patreon, I had a nice discussion with LightningEllen about toxic masculinity and toxic femininity. What was most striking to me was that there was no real definition to the latter and, indeed, the two of us had wildly different ideas as to what these terms actually entailed.

So, to make sure we are on the same page, for the following article, I will be defining the above terms thus:

Masculinity: physical, emotional, and behavioral traits traditionally associated with men. These characteristics are active (that is, the person is taking an active role in social contexts), and are opposite to the feminine.

Toxic masculinity: a state of being wherein masculine traits are exhibited to a point that they are harmful or oppressive to the person exhibiting the traits, and/or to those around them. A man must never show weakness in any capacity: physically, mentally, or emotionally.

NO NO NO NO NO

Femininity: physical, emotional, and behavioral traits traditionally associated with women. These characteristics are passive (that is, the person is being acted upon by other forces, such as the masculine), and are opposite to the masculine.

Toxic femininity: A sub-group under toxic masculinity. It is a state of being wherein feminine traits are exhibited to a point that they are harmful or oppressive to the person exhibiting the traits, and/or to those around them. Tends toward women being passive and being acted upon, rather than taking action.

  Do you know how hard it is to find a picture for toxic femininity? That’s how passive it is.

Feminism: a social idea that the genders should be equal in social, cultural, and vocational positions.

Yay! Yes!

Third-wave feminism: Extreme, revenge-filled feminism. It is a set of ideas that proclaims women to be superior to men, or otherwise labels men as “the other” or, worse, “the enemy.” Also sees women who want to be stay-at-home moms, believe that men should be the breadwinners, and/or who simply don’t believe men are The Enemy, as “the enemy.”

When It’s Okay, and When It’s Toxic

I have a radical idea: masculine and feminine are actually made to complement each other. The strength, courage, independence, violence, and assertiveness are balanced by empathy, gentleness, and sensitivity. There is nothing inherently wrong or toxic about any of these characteristics, and having a balance of both is – or should be – considered ideal.

This is actually a real idea!!!

When this begins to crumble is when they are taken to their extreme, to the point where a person is expected to have all of Column A without ever demonstrating characteristics from Column B. The characteristics in the above paragraph are some examples of masculinity and femininity, but within society there are many other expectations that pressure men and women to think, act, and feel in particular ways.

When all of these things become toxic, it’s because a person has adopted these characteristics, but then also attempts to take away another person’s autonomy because of them. This can either be internal or external. For instance, a man might feel pressure to not “show weakness” by crying at a movie, or he might think it’s okay to talk over women because he has been raised to always be assertive with his ideas. A woman might feel pressure to wear makeup and be appealing for “the male gaze,” or she might think it’s okay to wield her emotions like a weapon.*

Notice something here. These are both harmful, please make no mistake about that. But when one group is always the one “acting” and one group is always being “acted upon,” it not only harmful to the individual, but can be harmful to the group as a whole.

A Brief Digression

But Athena, some of you might wonder. If everyone just stayed in their gender roles, this wouldn’t be a problem. You said yourself that masculine and feminine are complements of each other!

The hammer and nail argument, yes. In Japan, there is a saying that roughly translates to: the nail that sticks out gets hammered down. Sure, yes, if everyone sat down, shut up, and continued on, yep this wouldn’t be a problem. We’d all be squeezed into our tiny little cookie cutters, whether or not we really fix, and go through our lives peacefully, if not incredibly unhappy.

Everyone wants to be the hammer, and doesn’t think about who is the nail.

Let’s face it, people. We’re all affected by “The Patriarchy,” but because within the confines of the masculine and feminine gender roles one is always active and one is always acted upon, some issues are a lot more immediately or externally harmful, and some are more internally harmful. As a blunt example: men can take what they want, when they want it, but if a woman wants something for herself (which is outside of her “gender role”) she must subvert the system and act in a manipulative way, since being assertive isn’t a socially acceptable option.

This causes men to be angry at how deceptive “women as an entire gender” are, and then further results in women being expected/forced to deal with/deflect/defuse their anger. And because men are supposed to be dominant, there is no room for listening to “her side” of the story. Man must stay in control, because men are always supposed to be in control.*

Two sides of one horrendous, ridiculous coin.

Games and This Whole Mess

Thank the Maker, we’re finally talking about video games.

I’m not even going to attempt to dive into the cesspool that is toxic masculine behavior online or within gaming communities, with gatekeeping, slurs, and general horribleness happening from men to women and men to other men. But I would like to talk briefly about the roles that games play in all of this.

For those of you who have been hanging around a while, you’ll know that I am a big believer in representation mattering in games. We emulate behaviors that we observe, whether that is in real life or on a screen. We emulate behaviors more strongly when we have an inherent disposition toward an idea (i.e., it’s “in our nature” or “our personality”), but we can also absorb as true the ideas that are presented to us most consistently, even at a subconscious level.

Remember a long time ago when I asked you to play a game with me? And then we talked about what the game was all about? Seeing how certain characters are portrayed, as you guys know, contributes to how a person sees themselves. Yes, it is possible to rage against the machine, as it were, but when operating within a social group, we are expected to fulfill the norms and expectations put on us, with a slight degree of variation (again decided by society) being acceptable. Break all the norms and expectations, and the group at large will not be accepting of your behavior.

How these norms are developed is far outside of the scope of this article, but suffice it to say that once the norms are developed, it is up to the member of society and the media of that society to maintain and enforce those norms. Such is the state of video games and the video game community.

On the video game front, we are given men and women who fall into masculine and feminine boxes. Solid Snake and Cole McGrath, for instance, are as comic-book-hero-esque as characters can get, and are examples of what A Man should be: powerful, aggressive, lacking any sort of emotional display other than outrage or anger (or, if they do, it’s not long before the more “acceptable” emotions come back, i.e., sadness turning immediately into anger). Compare to Raiden from Metal Gear Solid 2: still pretty powerful, still pretty aggressive, but also has a girlfriend that he loves and is emotionally hurt by. And fans called him a pansy.

Some men might not see this as a problem, though.

Let’s take two queens of gaming, Princess Zelda and Princess Peach. Avoiding stereotypical language, Peach is the woman who waits at home for Mario, baking him cakes and offering him kisses as rewards for doing things for her. She passively waits for Mario to actively go and be the hero. Princess Zelda (with the exception of possibly Wind Waker and Breath of the Wild) is demure and quiet, although enjoys the slight deviation from the norm by being wise and even taking a slightly more active role in Twilight Princess when she actually holds a sword for a few seconds and fires some arrows alongside Link, but sufficiently makes up for this by being largely absent as Link saves the world.

Compare this to another famous woman in gaming, Lara Croft, who started off as a female Indiana Jones and then was somehow twisted into gaming’s biggest sex symbol, because it wasn’t enough that she was smart and capable and the primary character like her male counterparts: she had to be appealing to men.

Notice as she became more realistic (in many ways), her body proportions changed.

Which brings me to the actual point of this article: the effects these games can have on a person. Video games enforce (for the most part) the ideals and values of the society, and so the societal pressure on a man to never be weak, and a woman to always be second, is reflected in that.

Why Is This Bad, and Why Aren’t You Talking About Games Yet?

I’ll be blunt: toxic masculinity is bad because it hurts people. It forces men into a role that is not sustainable, at least without compromising other people. How can one always be in control, unless one takes control away from another person? How can one always be the strongest, if the other person isn’t expected to be weaker? How can one always be right, unless other thoughts and opinions are silenced or belittled? How can one be expected to not emote, and yet be expected to be so compassionate as to risk life and limb for another person? How can a person help bring another person into being, and then think it’s okay to say that they are “babysitting” their own children, when in reality they are parenting?

What about toxic femininity? Well, that hurts people, too, but in a more reactive (versus active) way. How can one succeed in a job that requires you to self-advocate, when one is insulted for being assertive? How can one exert independence, when one is expected to sit quietly and wait for a man to come along? How can one ever hope for equality, when there is one superior and one inferior gender?

While some folks may disagree, media is so important. To be clear, no, video games, movies, books, and the like don’t need to validate my existence and I’m not asking society for permission to exist. But I’m asking media to have balance, to offer a window into worlds that we might not otherwise see, to offer a window into worlds that could be, if only we tried hard enough.

Because it matters.

Studies have shown that, when men are exposed to video games that glorify the “masculine” stereotype and systematically supports the oppression of women, those men have a greater tolerance for real-life violence against women. The same effects were not seen when women played these same games.

So what does that mean? That means that society primes men to think a certain way (they are “masculine”), and media reinforces that “masculine” means never being feminine, and that harming those who are “the feminine” is okay. Rewarded, even. So that’s what one learns.

And thus we have reinforced toxic masculinity.

Video games that portray men being violent toward women causes men to be more tolerant toward violence against women.

I… shouldn’t have to say anything after that.

Like violence before this, being subjected to certain themes in certain games can make you more tolerant of them. Maybe there isn’t causation between playing a video game and actually sexually harassing a woman, but seeing images of men dominating women reinforces that men are the ones who do the acting, and women are the ones who are acted upon. In these games, men are always in control and always exerting power over others. And the man doing the acting is the hero, and the woman being acted upon is just that: scenery, waiting for a man to show up and give her existence meaning.

Out of context game picture is out of context.

So, no, while playing a Grand Theft Auto game isn’t going to turn you into a sexual predator, it might make a man feel entitled to a woman, or reinforce that respecting her integrity or right to an existence outside of your gaze/pleasure is not necessary. And that’s a problem.

But #NotAllMen!

Yes. Not all men, and not all games. Men are not, I’ll remind all of you sharpening your pitchforks, the enemy here. No one is the enemy here. No one is an enemy. Say it with me: no one is an enemy.

In recent years, games have begun to explore more realistic portrayals of women, and that’s great. I’m certainly not saying that power fantasies are inherently bad; after all, who doesn’t want to be a superhero all the time? And I’m not saying that no video game should ever objectify or subjugate anyone else. I’m not completely out-of-touch: being able to exert power over someone else makes a person feel powerful. You can’t always do it in the physical world, so sure, put it in a game. But also realize that what you put in a game is going to affect how the person interacts with their actual, real world.

So men may feel pressure to never feel anything beyond angry, to “man up” and fulfill any number of stereotypes that can, at the end of the day, oppress their true natures. And women might feel pressured to stay a step behind men, keeping their heads down and their voices soft, waiting to be called on. Society says it, games show it, and that’s the only possibility that is ever given.

What I advocate, as per usual, is the inclusion of games into our collective minds that have well-written characters. Yes, there is a whole social brick wall that we’re going to run into, because men have been led to believe they can’t show emotions, and so will not want to play as a “sissy,” as we saw with poor Raiden. Women have been led to believe that being assertive is being a bitch, or that women cannot take care of themselves, and so may instead prefer playing as a “strong” man instead of a “strong” woman.

We’re all stuck in the matrix, folks. We are all constantly under pressure by society to fit into the little boxes it provides to us, all little pegs waiting to be hammered down into our respective holes, whether or not we actually fit in them.

I love video games. I love that they can open the door to new realities and experiences that aren’t possible in the physical world.

I love that they can open doors into worlds that are possible, and that could be, if only…

I love that games can hold up a mirror and say, here’s what is.

And I really love that they are important enough to us that they can influence our behavior.

…We just always need to be aware of the type of person we are being influenced to be.

What are your thoughts on toxic masculinity/femininity? How can this be translated into our real-world communities? Or is this not a problem at all? Let me know in the comments!

Thanks for stopping by, and I’ll see you soon! ~ Athena

Do you like what you’ve read? Become a revered Aegis of AmbiGaming and show your support for small creators and for video games as a serious, viable, and relevant medium!

For more reading on games and masculinity:

Fox, J., & Tang, W.Y. (2013). Sexism in online video games: The role of conformity to masculine norms and social dominance orientation. Computers in Human Behavior, 33, 314-320. Linked here: https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/be6b/69d4062dd20d35728ff2e515048b1dcd5f5e.pdf

Dill, K.E., Brown, B.P., & Collins, M.A. (2007). Effects of exposure to sex-stereotyped video game characters on tolerance of sexual harassment. Journal of Experimental Social Psychology, 44, 1402-1408.

http://www.marissabellino.com/uploads/7/6/6/1/7661682/content_analysis_video_games_and_gender.pdf

A charged #tbt for you all.... A talk of #men, #women, #games, and #toxicity. Oh, an maybe some #feminism, too. Hold onto your hats and join the conversation! It’s been a while since I’ve written about the quagmire that is gender and gaming. But we’re winding up for another set of posts on the topic, and what better way to ease into this topic than talking about toxic masculinity and toxic femininity/feminism?