#and interpretation of something but. yeah.

[therainscene]

I didn't start shipping Byler because I picked up on a few moments of chemistry and decided they'd make a cute couple -- I started off by absolutely refusing to entertain said moments as reciprocally queer until I ran into the ridiculous homophobia on the ST subreddit and decided to review Mike's character arc out of sheer gay spite.

Let me clarify: Spite isn't what made me change my mind about Mike. Spite just made me read a few Byler analyses and rewatch the show with an open mind because I didn't want to be like those pricks who would insult and censor queer fans for... [checks notes]... thinking something gay might happen in a TV show with gay people in it. I truly wasn't expecting a queer interpretation to fit Mike's arc anywhere near as well as the default interpretation -- but by the time I'd finished my rewatch, I was reeling from how much better it fit.

Cause that's the thing: Mike's queerness is pretty obvious once you look for it. The difficulty is in giving yourself permission to look.

-------------------

A question Bylers are often asked is "why would the show spend four seasons building up Milevn just to tear it down at the last minute for some unrealistic woke ship? Mike literally said he loves El!" And yeah, Mike's grand love confession at the end of S4 certainly seems like a triumphant pay-off to all that build-up... but I have a few questions of my own.

Firstly: why establish in no uncertain terms that feeling loved is the key to unlocking El's fullest potential against Vecna--

--only to undermine the power of Mike's longed-for confession by having it only be good enough to delay Vecna instead of defeat him? Yes, it's the penultimate season -- so why did Milevn's pay-off happen here instead of S5 where it could properly shine?

Secondly: why couldn't Milevn fix their relationship by themselves? Even if you believe that El commissioned the painting (she didn't) and that the feelings Will describes are truly hers (they aren't), it was still Will who had to perform this romantic gesture on her behalf, and it broke his heart to do so. Why hand this important work off to a third party? Why weave queer tragedy into the build-up towards a heterosexual pay-off that's supposed to feel triumphantly romantic?

Speaking of which: why undermine the intimacy of this scene by having Will hover behind Mike's shoulder the whole time? Couldn't they have asked Noah to take a few steps to the left for the sake of a better shot? Couldn't they have waited until after Milevn's big romantic moment to remind us for the millionth fucking time how sad Will is about it?

In my opinion, this scene and its four seasons of build-up make much more sense if you read them as three entwined character arcs about the trials of growing up in a suffocatingly heteronormative era: the gay kid who doesn't think he's entitled to a happy ending; the abused girl who thinks shallow romance with the first boy who's nice to her will make her feel normal; and the confused hero who hasn't figured out the solution yet.

For all the insistence that this show has to stick to "realistic" depictions of 80s queerness... it's hardly a realistic depiction of 80s straightness for Mike to score an awesome magical girlfriend, either. That's just nerdy wish-fulfillment, and common only as a trope in fiction.

So it's not unreasonable to suppose that Mike's true role in the Subverting 80s Tropes Show might be to represent the actually very realistic 80s experience of getting swept up in compulsory heterosexuality.

Think about it: Will's vulnerability to the horrors functions as a metaphor for being visibly gay in a world that despises gay people--

--whereas Mike's girlfriend quite literally has the power to protect him from monsters and homophobic bullies alike.

This doesn't mean Mike is callously using El, though. He learned the hard way in S1 that treating an innocent girl like a means to an end would only end up destroying her, and the guilt and fear of hurting her again has been weighing heavy on him ever since.

Comphet isn't about taking advantage of other people's feelings so you can pretend to be straight -- it's about deluding yourself into believing you're straight because queerness isn't an option you're allowed to consider.

Mike genuinely does love El and he genuinely does want to be an important part of her life -- so surely that means he wants to be her boyfriend, right? Twelve is perhaps a little young to know that yet... but surely there's gotta be something here that sets his feelings apart from how a friend or brother would feel?

Surely the reason he later finds himself struggling to say to her face that he loves her is because he's just an immature loser who needs to try harder to grow up and be the man this girl he adores deserves to have...?

...and certainly not because the guilt and fear of losing her just keeps piling up as the romantic instincts he thinks he's been waiting to grow into turn out to be developing at exactly the pace they're supposed to -- in the wrong direction.

That would be ridiculous. Will's his best friend. Yes, he loves him and can't bear to be without him, but that doesn't mean anything. Why can't a guy display a little unhinged devotion to his special friend without it having to mean something romantic?

Why can't he, indeed.

At his core, Mike is someone who desperately wants to be as special as the straight heroes in the nerdy media he loves. But there isn't anything inherently heroic about being some lame middle-class white nerd who's bad with girls, so he believes that the best he can do is to be a dutiful sidekick who would sacrifice himself in a heartbeat for people he perceives as more special than himself.

For all the "build-up" Mike's romance with El has enjoyed across four seasons, it's done absolutely nothing to help him grow as a character and overcome this self-worth problem.

So is it really any surprise that even after realizing El would be fine and still want to be friends with him if he told her the truth, and even after realizing just how good Will is at understanding his insecurities and reassuring him of his inherent worth--

--Mike would still sacrifice his chance at happiness for the sake of the greater good?

El was literally dying in his arms. How could queer desire possibly be as important as this girl who needed him to be a man and do his damn job so she could do hers?

I'm interpreting Mike as gay here, but I think it's important to note that this principle applies even if he's bi or straight -- Mike can be attracted to girls and still be forcing himself to stay in a relationship with a girl he's not a good romantic match for because that's just what he thinks he's supposed to do.

His sister had a similar problem: Nancy was legitimately attracted to Steve, but her infatuation with him was more about doing what cool teen girls are supposed do than about authentic connection. And because this is a horror story as much a coming-of-age story, Wheeler's conformity had horrendous consequences -- her critical-of-comphet bestie was killed by the horrors.

Which sounds familiar, doesn't it?

(Sure, Max technically didn't die -- but she still died enough for Vecna's plan to come to fruition. Which just brings us back to my first question: why couldn't the Power of Heterosexual Love prevent this? In the same season that said "forced conforming is what's killing the kids", no less?)

Will describes Vecna as an inevitability that won't stop until he's taken everyone -- which in my opinion is the same defeatist attitude demanded by comphet.

It's not that Mr. Refuses-To-Participate-In-Society's-Silly-Play symbolizes comphet itself, per se; rather, he represents the despair of feeling like you can't truly escape it. But either way, this means that the solution to defeating Vecna is the same solution to defeating comphet:

Giving yourself permission to look and see that your true self is far more valuable than whatever you think you're supposed to be.

[timeplayed]

hope im not hijacking ops post because i really hope im interpreting it right because i was just scavenging the reblogs.

from what i understand, they mean like... when someone is running a foot fetish blog and they post about trans people a lot. and let's just say we don't know if this person is trans or cis so it might be easy to come to the conclusion that they might be a chaser or something of the sort. so "are you normal about trans people?" is meant to ask, "do you treat trans people normally, or do you treat them like sex objects? im not sure because you post primarily trans feet." then this person would be like, "yeah im normal about trans people, i also want to suck cis people's feet. [maybe a reason as to why there's so much trans feet]."

so basically this post is more about like, differentiating one group or another and maybe putting a group on a pedestal (or some other way to separate a minority from a supposed majority). "oh, you treat this trans man/trans woman/wtv in this certain way, are you Normal about trans men/trans women/wtv?" "Yeah im normal, [specific reason that makes sense], I'd do the same to a cis person" or something. the "normal" is just if the subject matter is applicable to everyone (normal) or if you're singling something out

sorry if this is super long winded ans I probably misinterpreted it in some way but I hope it maybe clarifies something (?) Not very sure

Just so you know, the "normal" when people say "are you normal about" refers to your base level of what counts as normal. As in, whatever is normal and typical behaviour for you. Being tormented by an all-consuming urge to lick trans peoples' feet counts as "being normal" if you're like that about cis people too.

[grayandthyme]

hi :) i love your fics--i'm making thins particular request because i just read the morning after--and i was just wondering if you could write a tommy x reader where she uses her safe word? or tells him to stop? (being the gentleman he is, keeping the deed very intimate, all that jazz--or it depends on your interpretation--i dont think he'd need a safe word persay? to him it's a "if you say stop, we stop" kind of deal) but up to you! just some good ol' hurt/comfort and really good aftercare :)) thanks again <33

ohohoho.. u know exactly WHAT I LIKE.. keep requesting ily

warnings: semi-smut. dirty-talk. oral (f receiving), fingering. matingpress. comfort/hurt fic. nothing is super explicit.

He all but ushered you into the bedroom, urgency painted in the rough glide of his hands down your sides, like he couldn’t touch enough, fast enough. His grip was molten—one hand curling at your throat with a reverent kind of possession, the next tugging at the waistband of your jeans like the barrier offended him.

"You looked so fuckin’ good today," he murmured low, voice thick with heat, dragging like velvet across gravel. His mouth traced the column of your neck, finding skin beneath your jaw to claim with a kiss that was more bite than breath. "Takin’ charge… talkin’ about soil rotation like you were runnin’ the whole damn world."

You laughed—light and breathless—melting into his hold, fingers threading through his hair as your head tilted back, giving him full access. “Suggestin’ that the goats eat the overgrowth on the north plain isn’t exactly groundbreaking,” you murmured against his temple, the smile in your voice betraying your need.

He groaned into your throat, nipping once, harder now. “Maybe not. But watchin’ you talk like that—in front of everyone—head high, voice steady, like you knew exactly what the hell you were doin’? Jesus.”

His hand slid beneath your shirt, palm searing against your ribs as he pushed the fabric upward, slow and sure. You inhaled sharply, caught somewhere between a laugh and a moan, your body already arching into his.

“Didn’t know I had a fan club.”

“Nah,” he rasped, lifting your shirt the rest of the way and tossing it over his shoulder. “You’ve got me. And that’s a whole lot worse.”

You grinned, even as your jeans slid further down your hips under his deft fingers. “Is that so?”

He kissed you then—deep, dragging, reverent like he needed to memorize every part of your mouth. Then he pulled back just enough to murmur:

“Yeah. Because I’m not just watchin’… I'm bendin' you over this fuckin' bed."

The mattress creaked behind your knees as he gently eased you back, his hands never leaving your body, like letting go would undo the spell.

His mouth followed—pressing, biting, worshiping—and your laugh turned into something heavier, needier, threading into the air between you like some silk on fire.

“Tommy—”

His name spilled from your lips like a prayer, breathless and reverent, as your fingers caught the hem of his shirt and dragged it upward in one practiced sweep.

The fabric gave way easy—just like everything between you two did now.

No hesitation. No fumbling.

Just heat and instinct, intimacy like a dance you’d long since learned by heart.

“Goddamn,” he muttered, shirt tossed aside, eyes raking over you like you were something he’d bled for.

Maybe he had. His hands were already on you again—firm, insistent, sliding over your waist like he was mapping the land he owned.

“Every time I touch you, I swear I forget my fuckin’ name.”

His mouth crashed against yours, all teeth and hunger and heat. You felt the sting of his fingers at your hips, yanking you in with a growl caught in his throat. When he broke the kiss, it was only to trail his lips to your ear, breath ragged.

“Wanna hear you say it again,” he rasped. “Say my name like you need it—like you need me inside you more than air.”

You exhaled hard, your body arching, chest brushing his—your voice caught somewhere between surrender and a moan. “Tommy—”

He smirked against your jaw, lips dragging down your throat, biting just enough to make you gasp.

“That’s it, sweetheart. You sound so fuckin’ pretty when you beg.”

One hand slipped down, palming between your thighs through only the thin line of panties, pressure firm, cruel in the best way. “You already soaked through?” he murmured darkly, voice all filth and reverence. “Just from me talkin’? From thinkin’ about what I’m gonna do to you?”

You couldn’t even form words—not when his fingers were already teasing you, not when his voice curled around your nerves like smoke and fire. Every syllable he breathed lit you up from the inside, burning straight down your spine.

He pulled back just enough to look at you—eyes dark, burning, locked on yours like you were the only thing in the world he could see. His chest rose and fell in heavy, hungry pulls. “Gonna fuckin’ ruin you tonight,” he growled, voice thick with promise. “Not gentle. Not soft. Not after watchin’ you all goddamn day actin’ like you didn’t know what you do to me.”

Then he kissed you again—hard, messy, possessive—and you melted into it like you belonged there. Because you did. Because there was no place safer, no place hotter, than in the center of his storm.

You writhed against him, the friction unbearable, but not nearly enough. His fingers gripped your hips like he was anchoring himself, dragging you close, tugging the fabric between you away with a practiced roughness.

And then—he dropped to his knees.

Not rushed. Not clumsy. Like worship.

Like he was made for this.

“Look at you,” he muttered, thumbing over the inside of your thigh, eyes locked between your legs like it was salvation. “Shakin’ already. Just from my hands. You know what that does to me?”

You swallowed hard, lips parted, fingers tangled in his hair without even realizing you’d moved. He smirked—wolfish, unholy—and pressed a kiss to your inner thigh that felt more like a brand.

“I’m gonna make you forget every name but mine,” he rasped, voice dragging low across your skin like a threat wrapped in velvet. “Gonna get you cryin’ so sweet—first beggin’ me to stop, then beggin’ me not to.”

And then his mouth was on you—hot, reverent, unrelenting.

It wasn’t just touch—it was worship.

Tongue working you open in slow, devastating circles, then flattening with purpose, a rhythm carved from obsession.

Every flick sent your breath stuttering, your back arching, your thighs trembling around him.

And then—his hands.

One slid beneath the curve of your thigh, anchoring you in place like gravity wasn’t enough. The other slipped between your legs, fingers sliding in—one at first, slow and coaxing. Then two. Stretching you, claiming space inside you like it belonged to him.

Like he wasn’t just touching you. Like he was shaping you.

Preparing you to take all of him—every inch, every pulse, every bit of the need he’d been dragging behind his teeth since sundown. And when you cried out—high, frantic, grasping for him—he didn’t stop.

He smiled against you. And kept going.

His fingers were relentless—unforgiving in their rhythm, a punishing cadence that tore through your resolve. It wasn’t just pleasure—it was unraveling. A slow, dizzy collapse from the inside out. Your hips bucked against the pressure, hands fisting the comforter like it was the only thing keeping you grounded.

You were right on the edge—dangling, shaking. Tears threatening at the corners of your eyes from how sharp, how deep it all felt.

“Tommy—” It slipped out broken, more a desperate whimper than anything else. His name, a prayer clawing its way from your throat.

And then he stopped.

Pulled back slow, a calculated retreat, leaving you gasping for him—emptied and aching.

He sat back on his knees, chest heaving, sweat clinging to the line of his brow. A slow grin unfurled across his lips—cocky, wild, flushed with triumph.

“Fuck,” he breathed, admiring the wreck he made of you. “You look so goddamn pretty when you fall apart for me.” And then he reached for you again.

His tongue swept across his upper lip, slow and deliberate, catching every trace of you like it was sacred.

That grin followed—wicked, knowing, painted in sin—as he watched your hand twitch in the space between you, reaching for him again without thought, without shame.

“So desperate for me, huh?” he murmured, voice dragging like velvet over gravel. “Can’t go a second without me touchin’ you.”

He rose to his feet in a slow, deliberate motion, fingers tugging at his belt. The metallic clink of the buckle echoed in the silence like a promise—low and electric. It was a sound you’d grown to recognize, one that sent a ripple straight through your spine. When that belt came off, nothing in the world remained uncertain.

The leather slid free with a practiced pull, landing on the floor in a weighted thud.

“I love you.”

It left him in a murmur—roughened, sincere—as his fingers worked the button of his jeans, pushing them just low enough to bare flesh.

Your eyes just flicked down. He was already hard, and angry. The shine of pre all knowing. You didn’t speak. Couldn’t. You only swallowed thickly, your breath leaving you in a hush, heart thudding against the quiet like a drum of surrender.

"I love you too."

His hands grip the underside of your knees, pushing up and downward. It was a new-ish position, one that he didn't know you could bend into. But, tonight, he was testing luck.

He only let one hand fall off as he lined himself up—and then sunk in. No slow barring, just right down to the hilt, a guttural noise falling from his lips. "Fuck—Sweetheart you always feel so right."

At first, the rhythm was right. It sank deep, finding every tender edge, and you curled beneath him like a ribbon folding into itself. It was electric—wild, alive.

Until it wasn’t.

Until the air grew thin, breath caught in your throat. Until the same fierce strike pounded relentlessly, your mind fraying at the edges. Until his movement slammed so hard against your cervix, nausea fluttered like a warning beneath your ribs.

“Tommy—” you breathed out, a strained mix of plea and ache, a groan tangled with want.

He answered only with a low, satisfied hum, claiming your lips once more.

You turned your head slightly, a breathless sigh catching in your throat, sharp and unsteady.

“Tommy—” you whispered, voice trembling. “Stop—”

The air snapped, crackling with a charged tension. In an instant, he was off you, pulling back sharply.

“Shit—” he muttered, sliding beside you with urgent care. His hands gathered you close, shifting your legs gently to ease the ache.

“Fuck—Fuck—I'm sorry. I got carried away.”

He exhaled deeply, reaching over to flick the lamp on. The soft light spilled across the room, warm but sudden, making you blink against the glare.

Tommy’s brows furrowed, guilt tightening his chest like a vise.

He brushed a shaky hand over your temple, careful as if you might shatter.

“Shit, darlin’…” His voice cracked with the weight of regret. “I should’ve been more careful—I'm sorry—"

"I didn’t mean to hurt you,” His fingers lingered a moment longer, tracing slow circles on your skin as if to erase the pain by touch alone. He swallowed hard, eyes searching yours for any sign you were really okay. “You gotta tell me when it’s too much, alright?"

"... I don’t wanna be the reason you’re hurtin'.” His grip tightened, protective, like he was holding you together with sheer will.

“I’m here. Gonna make it right... Whatever you need, just say the word.”

You could see the rawness in him—the part that never wanted to cause you pain, that was desperate to be your strength instead of your burden. And in that moment, you felt it too: the fierce, fragile love he carried beneath all the rough edges.

"I'm fine, Miller.. You're just big." You huffed, though it came out more like a laugh, pushing gently on his bare shoulder.

Tommy let out a breathy chuckle, shaking his head as he settled beside you on the bed, careful not to press too hard.

“Big, huh? Yeahh, well—big guys gotta be gentle, I guess… Even if it’s not really in the manual.”

You smirked, eyes brightening despite the dull ache lingering under your skin. “Guess I’m lucky you even remember what gentle means.”

He grinned, that familiar spark flickering to life behind his tired eyes.

“Don’t let the scars fool you. I’ve got a soft side buried somewhere under all this.” He tapped his chest with a playful jab. “You just gotta find it.”

“Sure,” you teased, “… next you’ll tell me you bake cookies and knit sweaters when no one’s looking.”

He laughed—a low, genuine sound that warmed the room. Sliding down so he's laid on his stomach, forearms folded against each other. “Maybe I do,"

"What if I told you I once tried to make a pie and set the kitchen on fire?”

Clearly, he was trying to distract you.

Pull the tension from the room.

Make it easier to breathe.

“Only you could turn dessert into a disaster,” you said, shaking your head with a smile.

Tommy’s chuckle rumbled deep in his chest as he settled back against the headboard, eyes sparking with that familiar mischievous fire. “Yeah, yeah… probably smart to give those insides a break.”

“But not too long,” he added with a smirk, voice dropping low and teasing, “I swear sometimes I hear it cryin’ my name.”

You shot him a sharp side-eye, deadpan.

“Please don’t start characterizing my holes...”

He scrunched his nose, mock offended. “Way to kill the mood—and the banter.”

His arm swung over you, wrapping around like a worn seatbelt, pulling you close enough to feel the steady thump of his heart.

“Raincheck it is. But hey, now we can focus on those goats you were pitchin’ earlier…”

His grin softened, and he leaned down, pressing gentle, feather-light kisses across your chest—nothing urgent or charged, just steady and loving.

The kind that said, I’m here. You’re safe.

I ain't gonna do anythin' you don't want.

You let out a soft sigh, fingers finding his hair. “You always know how to make even goat talk sound romantic."

He smiled against your skin, voice just above a whisper.

“I love you too."

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[mystxmomo]

I love your posts on Vhaeraun! They're really grounded in his character and I appreciate that you went into the reasoning behind his actions while not dismissing that he sometimes does messed up things. I've been insane about drow lore for years now and I'm curious about your thoughts on Eilistraee. She's such an interesting character to me in that while she obviously cares about the drow and seeks their freedom the way she goes about it come off almost naive at times. But at the same time she has a deep melancholy and temper. And she opposes Lolth but her clergy still operates similarly at times with the exclusion of males and almost dogmatic reluctance to accept change. Idk I think her contradictions are interesting and she's not frequently explored beyond a shallow, romanticized lens. Sorry for ranting lol but if you have any thoughts on her I would love to hear them!

Yeeeah. I'm glad you sent this, actually. I have another ask that I'm writing up a longer answer for dealing with Vhaeraun and Eilistraee's relationship, and to get into why I see their relationship like I do I had to sit down and spend the first part of that analyzing her character. So, I'm actually happy that I have the chance to separate the post into parts, both for length and just keeping things concise.

First off, yeah. I think the important thing about DnD gods is that they're as "human" as they are. They're not omnipotent, they're deeply flawed people and characters with motivations and histories that color their perspective on things. I think a more grounded approach to them is "the correct one" (in as much as any interpretation in DND can be a correct one, but my thoughts on that still remain that they're just building blocks for you to do as you'd like with.

Now. This post is going to be equally long. I actually have a lot of thoughts on Eilistraee, but to explore the thoughts that I have on her we need to go into the bigger real world concepts that influence her and the idea's around her. So, I do feel that a few disclaimers going into this before I hit it with our read-more are necessary.

I'm going to format this post a little differently than I did Vhaeruan's. The thing about Vhaeraun's character is that within the books and DnD proper, he's meant to be an evil. Right. So it's not very hard to get people on board with the idea that in their attempts to demonize him, they managed to create a compelling abuse narrative. However. Eilistraee and her church, as you mentioned, often ends up getting seen through this incredibly romanticized lens especially within in the role she plays in drow society. So when her church doesn't have the best portrayal in these books, there's seemingly this community impulse to disregard those portrayals as something lesser or like they hold less narrative weight because they don't play into the better parts of the church.

So I want to start this post by creating a groundwork using things that are strictly from the source books and official magazines, and then building on that to lend weight to the portrayals her and her church is given within the novels. And then I will get into sourcing things like Evermeet, War of the Spider Queen, and Lady Penitent when I talk about Eilistraee and Vhaeraun's relationship.

Secondly, you'll notice I mentioned her church a lot here. Eilistraee is in an interesting position. Unlike Vhaeraun and Lolth (Of who I believe the books are rather explicit about where and how their motivations differ from their churches) Eilistraee really doesn't get as much of that treatment. We're told some things about how she holds herself and what she values, but she's purposefully left as an enigma. You have to make a lot more assumptions about who she is based around the community around her.

Now, I DO think the gods are separate people from their churches, and often times do hold different views to the communities that are devoted to them. My favorite example being Vhaeraun being genuinely far more chill about woman than his church is, and you can see it in the way he has to go "Yes, oh my god, you even need to help the female drow rogues no matter what."

So, I want to explore her church and what is seen as "good" within it in relationship to her, though I do promise to account for the fact that it is not her. I just think that there are some conclusions you can draw about her based on her church.

Finally, same disclaimer I gave in Vhaeraun Analysis is worth giving here. I am about to focus on Eilistraee and her church in a lot of very critical ways. I don't hate Eilistraee, I think a lot of people do use character criticism as an excuse to engage in character hate, so I understand why people get a little defensive about it sometimes. But I think she's genuinely a very fascinating character, and the criticisms I have are part of the reason I'm so interested in her and who she is. I'm an author who's main interest comes from exploring these heavier themes of abuse and trauma and exploring how real world cultural influences show within art.

Basically. This is fun for me, and if it's not fun for you, you don't have to take my analysis as anything more then one persons insane ramblings on the internet. This is a red string board of media analysis. It's also a LOT more subjective and has a lot of my opinions baked into it as a result of what we're going to get into, so. Make of it what you will.

Now. This pre read-more part of the post is already quite long, but as a final note. I'm going to be getting into a lot of heavier topics here. Abuse is obvious given the drow, but I actually want to get into specfically emotionally abusive structures, what cultural catholicism is, and passive sexism (Especially with Gender Elitism) and how these ideas and their existence within our cultural effects her church.

Okay!

So, I will actually start on a more positive note:

I'm not going to be criticizing the nudity or sexuality of her church. I have made mention in the past that I'm of the belief that the drow and the cultures around it, despite often being played rather straight in-universe as horror and cult abusive narratives, were things created on a Doylist level to be very titillating, sexually explicit, and horrifying. I don't think this is a bad thing and I don't think it discredits the weight these characters and stories end up having. And in fact, I think these stories could only be as strong as they are because they were fueled by being as emotionally charged as they are (Sexuality is an emotion.)

I think. And I acknowledge that this one is a very subjective opinion, but my opinion you will have nonetheless. I think, in a time where cultural puritanical-ism is at it's height, it's actually growing to be very important to have casual portrayals of sexuality and nudity, let ALONE nonsexual nudity. I've always been of the opinion that it's fine. Let woman go topless (if that's something you want to explore of course, the beauty of DnD remains if you DON'T want to include it you don't have to. But to deny it as a source of inspiration would feel incorrect.)

So I'm not going to be criticizing the nudity and sexuality of it all when it comes to her church. I think it's fun, I think there are ways you can explore that in a meaningful way, and I think something is being done thematically there that's worth keeping and examining as is given to us.

Secondarily. While there are things I'm going to be critical of with her church, there are things I really, really love about her church. I think the thing that tends to draw people into her isn't all the things I'm about to talk about, but rather the focus on drow as a people with art, and culture, and community. And this is something I really like about her church as well. Having something that puts divine weight on the importance of these things speaks to a lot of people I think, especially given that DnD was created in fuckle America land of the "Continuing to cut more and more from arts and humanities and community everyday." Her religion really is the only of the drow religions that puts this much emphasis on celebrating that.

I like domestic fantasy. I prefer it to hero's journeys actually, but if I start talking about that I'll get off topic.

So yes. I think there is a reason she and her church gets as romanticized as it does. It's built into the text to be romanticized, because the people who originally made it were romanticizing it.

Okay. so with THOSE two things spoken for. Lets get into the nitty gritty.

DnD and it's alignment system, at it's core, has always had something of an issue with the cultural Catholicism of it all. Cultural Catholicism is the idea that when you're raised in a society where the dominant religion is Christian-Catholic, even if you yourself are not Catholic it's likely you'll still pick up idea's of Catholicism within your own morality, and that those ideas will be echoed within the media you consume because as it is the dominant culture it influences what is seen as acceptable. You don't have to be Catholic, or even be raised as Catholic, to end up holding a lot of trauma and shame regarding ideas that are only considered shameful through the lens of Catholicism. As an example, a lot of people are still taught to feel a lot of shame around nudity and sex as a result of living in a society who's dominant religion influences the way conversations around it are handled.

So. To make my point about this, I would like to start by exploring the concept of Sin Eating.

The Silver Haired Knights were a concept introduced in Dragon Magazine #315. Dragon Magazine, if you don't know, if an official supplement material in the age before the internet. Now, it's worth noting. This was 3e-3.5e, which was the start of their attempts to double down on the demonization of all drow. Nonetheless, I think they thought this was a good thing and I still see it talked about today in some communities as a Good Thing:tm:.

Sin Eating is an ability that the Silver Haired Knights contain. I'm going to copy and paste from the wiki rather than Dragon Magazine itself because it summarizes it far better than the Dragon Magazine article does, though the Dragon Magazine article isn't hard to find, I implore you to go read it for yourself to get the full context of the class.

Powerful Silverhair Knights had the ability to "consume sins", to take the full weight of cruelty and suffering inflicted by evil beings' (mostly fey, humanoids, monstrous humanoids, and giants, but especially drow) upon themselves, which gave the Silverhair Knights their nickname: sin eaters. This was a complex and dangerous ritual, taking some minutes, that required the sin eater to maintain uninterrupted physical contact with their subject. The subject creature could be willing or unwilling, usually kept bound in the latter cases, or else unaware of the sin eater's intent if the sin eater chose to disguise it. When fully performed, the target creature felt the weight of all their sins on their conscience, understanding firsthand the errors of their ways. In cases of success, the target creatures were freed from their evil, regretted their past actions, and chose a different path from evil, often taking after the Knight, while the sins themselves were absorbed into the sin eater's soul and destroyed in the light of their purity and faith. In cases of failure, the sin eaters themselves were overcome by the absorbed sins; filled with despair, grief, rage, drained of their vitality, and fell into a coma for a full day. This could potentially kill the sin eater, but they would rise again as a ghost, with the same evil ways as the one they had tried to redeem. A sin eater could only attempt this risky ritual once a week, and only perform it on an individual sinner once a year.

I think this is, a little gross actually! To view this as a moral positive you have to believe in four things.

One, that sin and the weight of it is real on a metaphysical level (I do not.) Two, that redemption is earned strictly with forgiveness (I do not), Three, that people who are "pure" are noble by nature of being pure (I do not) and Four, that doing things without peoples consent to make them a "Better Person" is an inherent moral good, and anything done in the name of making someone live a "more ethical lifestyle" is an equal inherent good (Which I REALLY do not believe in. What is "good." Why is "good." How are you so sure your idea of good is so correct that it is work inflicting violence upon another person over, and in this context, changing the core of who they are over.)

The modern idea of purity, sin, and redemption, all come from Christianity. It is the idea that you need to work to be forgiven. It puts moral weight on the guilt and discomfort people feel for not only their past actions, but the past actions of the community around them. That you need to save others from their sin and from "evil."

To DnD, Good and Evil have an Aesthetic. You can be a good person that does violent things so long as it's for "good" reasons, and you can be an evil person that does good things however those good things are still considered evil because you yourself are bad. It's this idea of evil not as this very nuanced ethical dilemma, but instead as something that can be "Removed" from someone. I do not believe in this. I don't believe in the concept of sin (In that I don't believe in the concept of spiritual transgression or the idea of it as a corruptive influence) I don't believe in the concept of redemption (On a religious level of being absolved of it). I believe in people and their actions and how they respond to their circumstance, and I believe in people choosing to do better than they did yesterday. And this is one of the big flaws of Eilistraee's church and world view to me. Because to believe in Eilistraee's Churches Dogma, you have to accept the idea that drow need to work to be accepted. That it is their moral responsibility to show other people that they deserve their place in the world. And I don't believe that.

Although her arrow went astray because of Araushnee's treachery, Eilistraee chose banishment from Arvandor (and the Seldarine) along with her mother and brother, foreseeing a time when she would be needed to balance their evil. On Toril, the Dark Maiden strove for centuries against the hatred of Vhaeraun and his corrupting influence on the Ilythiiri (southern, darkskinned elves).

We don't know how much of Eilistraee's churches dogma's are her own. But based around how she talks about and views the drow under her brother and her mother (Cited above), I am willing to make the assumption that she sincerely does believe they need to earn their place in the world. And that's... It's kind of a depressing world view, isn't it? No community needs to earn acceptance and approval of others. To be allowed to exist should be enough.

...

Not unlike how I think a lot of Vhaeraun fans want to kind of swerve around the drow racism of it all, I think a lot of interpretations of Eilistraee really don't want to acknowledge the sexism of it all. But not unlike how I think the racism of Vhaeraun is deeply important to understanding how he see's the world, Eilistraee's churches specific brand of sexism and how it is an echo of Lolth's is DEEPLY important to understanding her and the culture around her.

In a way, I think ignoring the sexism of her church is worse..? Because often times, I'm met with the impression that it's not that we're CHOOSING not to include it, it's that we're not aware that it is sexism, right? There are a lot of people who, because of the romanticized idea they have of her (and because, admittedly of my own belief, of what is normalized in our culture and dominant religions) just don't view her sexism as a sexism, or believe her churches sexism to be a less severe form of it. I think both in the real world and in the in-character context of the text, the passive sexism of Eilistraee's church tends to get downplayed because it exists in conversation with the more explicit and violent idea's of Lolth's church.

Let's talk about Gender Elitism. You're almost definitely familiar with the concept of it, but. Term needs described nonetheless.

Gender Elitism is the idea that some genders are inherently superior to others. That they are, by nature of the existence of being that gender, inherently more valuable, more knowledgeable, more deserving of privilege and authority. There is no way to build a truly inclusive community with any kind Gender elitism as the framework. The idea that woman are inherently more valuable or more knowledgeable or more spiritually attuned is in itself a sexist ideology, and in the real world is often a reflection of sexist ideas of the inherent spirituality of womanhood.

And well.

All clergy of Eilistraee must be female, but they may be of any intelligent race.

I don't think people are often willing to meet the text where it's at. in the books, there's very clearly a self aware inversion of patriarchy -> matriarchy and a destruction of passive patriarchy through the lens of fantasy sexism.

However. Unlike the cultural Catholicism of DND and it's surrounding idea's of good and evil, I actually don't mind it's inclusion within the text. The written prose with DND (in recent years) are generally actually pretty self-aware of this flaw of the church, and a lot of authors purposefully play into the themes of it. And it makes sense to have it be included within the world building given what what this religion is in response to with Lolth's being the dominant religion of society. Eilistraee's church tends to reach out and recruit fallen nobility, and these are woman who are going to keep the views and want to keep holding the power that they do within their communities.

When you look at the kind of sexism Eilistraee's church is guilty of when in contrast with Lolth's, it's more palatable it's something I think men and well meaning woman alike raised in a lolth society would see as better. These are a group of people who already grew up believing woman to be born intrinsically more important by nature of that birth-rite. I don't think it's bad writing to have the conclusion that the Good church comes to be "Because we're not beating and killing these men, we have defeated sexism," while not addressing the core of where that mentality came from, and as a result still replicating a lot of exclusion and dismissing the importance of the lives of the men around them. Because that's a reflection of real life. I think even in real life, people struggle to sympathize with men and especially men who are victims of abuse, and it's something that blinds them to how they're engaging with this media.

Instead, my argument is that it's bad media analysis to ignore thats whats happening in an attempt to stick to this romanticized idea of the church.

So. That's the two big things with Eilistraee's Church. That's the lead-up to exploring Eilistraee as a character. But what does all of this say about her. How do we explore Eilistraee as a person as a result of all of this. Because, as I mentioned, the gods are separate from their church. A lot of gods do hold different values to their churches and different idea's then what their churches end up doing.

So let's dial this back a little bit and actually examine Eilistraee as a person. I'm going to post how she's described, and then I'm going to go into the longest point I want to make about her.

Eilistraee is a melancholy, moody drow female, a lover of beau- ty and peace. The evil of most drow banks a burning anger within her, and when her faithful are harmed, that anger is apt to spill out into wild action. It is not her way to act openly, but she often aids creatures she favors (whether they worship her or not) in small, immediately practical ways. Eilistraee is happi- est when she looks on bards singing or composing, craftsmen at work, lovers, or acts of kindness.

Eilistraee (pronounced “eel-ISS-trayee”) is a goddess of song and beauty, worshipped through song and dance— preferably in the surface world, under the stars of a moonlit night. Eilistraee aids her faithful in hunting and swordcraft, and worship of her is usually accompanied by feasting. Eilis¬ traee has worshippers of human, elven, and in particular half-elven stock (partic¬ ularly around Silvery moon), and looks kindly upon the Harpers. She is usually seen only from afar, but her song (of unearthly beauty, driving many to tears) is heard whenever she appears. Roleplaying Notes: Eilistraee is a melan¬ choly, moody drow female, a lover of beauty and peace. The evil of most drow banks a burning anger within her, and when her faithful are harmed, that anger is apt to spill out into wild action. It is not her way to act openly, but she often aids creatures she favors (whether they wor¬ ship her or not) in small, immediately practical ways. Eilistraee is happiest when she looks on bards singing or composing, crafts¬ men at work, lovers, or acts of kindness.

....

It is of my opinion that, when you look at the Eilistrae-Vhaeraun Dynamic and how they were treated by Lolth and Corellon, you're looking at a classic Golden Child/Scrape Goat dynamic. This is important to mention here because I do think that's important context within how Eilistraee (the person) see's and understands the world, and where her mind is at when it comes to the perception of her sense of self.

To VASTLY oversimplify about how emotionally abusive family structures work by a lot, when you look at emotionally abusive families with siblings, you tend to find a pattern where one child ends up getting the bulk of the favoritism and affection (The golden child), while the other takes the bulk of the abuse and tends to take a of blame and is seen as being deserving of the abuse (The scrapegoat.) I'll get a little bit more into the specifics of what that means for their relationship in a later post.

Now. Calling her the Golden Child, but I don't think being the Golden Child is strictly a good thing. In a lot of ways, I think a lot of golden children end up very emotionally stilted, and I think you kind of see that in Eilistraee. She HAS to be the perfect one. And she's had this expectation to be The Good One placed on her shoulders since she was young. Golden Children are often blinded to the abuse their siblings face because they themselves are not subjected to the same kind of abuse.

I think you're right in that despite everything, I would consider her defining trait her naivete. And I think the issue with trying to get into that is that people have a very specific idea of what being naive is. Like I think a lot of people associate naivete with people who are very childish and hold themselves with a lot of immaturity, and I don't think that's true. I think Eilistraee holds herself with a lot of dignity and comes across as mature and gentle and soft spoken, and you feel the weight of her presence in a way that you don't realize until she's left.

Naivete is just a lack of wisdom, a lack of having experienced the thing first hand. Eilistraee grew up very sheltered. She was shielded from the worst of her mothers abuse as a result of being her fathers favorite. Lolth doesn't give her the same attention she gives Vhaeraun (Which is good, largely, considering what her attention entails), she disregards Eilistraee as foolish and cowardly and weak, so she doesn't bother at all. That she was so sheltered is the source of both her empathy and her blindness. She knows the sight of abuse, but I don't think she's experienced abuse to the same extent her brother has, let alone the people in her church have. So she doesn't understand it to the same degree.

Now. The other thing about Eilistraee is that I don't actually think she's as open as she implies she is. She's always come across to me as someone who's very guarded. On one hand, she's walking around nude and supposedly that's representative of the vulnerability she has. But on the other hand, she doesn't reveal a lot, does she? She doesn't change. While Eilistraee is explicitly involved in her followers lives in a way that a lot of non-drow gods aren't, she's involved in a very passive way. She listens to them. Maybe she'll bless them with a dance. She'll send signs of her pleasure and displeasure, and she'll help them in immediate, practical ways.

But do any of her followers know her? Do WE know her? We know Vhaeraun. We know his personality. But what we're given of Eilistraee is what she likes and how she feels. It points to this very careful presence she makes of herself.

And that's why exploring the flaws of her church is so important. She wants to give her followers freewill, she wants to be the "good" one that doesn't influence them and lets them make their own choices. But... I'm going to steal a quote from @pansythoughts who I ran my thoughts about this by before typing it up, and I think that they articulated this really well.

"[...] She’s worshipped and revered and symbolic but because she didn’t involve herself in the running of things people mistook that as she shouldn’t be involved or shouldnt be involved (“don’t concern our lady with such trivial things, she shouldn’t be bothered, it makes her so sad”) that that for a long time enabled a lot of abuse to run rampant under eilistraee’s nose. By becoming impersonal she’s removed her real thoughts from her church in the name of being impartial. But it’s not actually helping [...]"

So Eilistraee hits this weird note of... She seems to think that being impersonal is what makes her good, but in being impersonal, she enabled the culture in her church to get as bad as it did. It's the intent over action mentality. It's the separation of herself from her people.

....

Now. I also want establish. I don't think Eilistraee holds the same views as her church with it comes to how a lot of men are treated. All text points to the fact she loves men as much as she does woman, just as she does any other race (Though I said I wouldn't quote it too much, her prioritizing woman to dismantle her brothers power in evermeet should at least get a passing mention, I put that in the same spot as I put Vhaeraun trying to kill her in that it feels like she was doing that as an uncomfortable means to an end. She sincerely see's him an evil, and if that is what she had to do to get him out of power then so be it. And then it spiraled)

In rare circumstances, males who worship Eilistraee-or beings without any priest powers who work to further Eilistraee's aims and need her visible blessing and support (or just some light)- will temporarily manifest moonfire (see Eitistroee's moonfire below). Such manifestations are at the will of the goddess; the lucky recipient has no control over the duration, intensity, and location of the radiance

Eilistraee to me feels like someone deeply rooted in idealism, and romanticism, and fantasy. She loves the arts. She loves dance, and music, and romance and love of all kinds. She loves the fantasy of lovers.

And this goes over to her wider views. She likes the fantasy of what she thinks good drow can be, and I think she lives in that fantasy and denies the lived reality of what a lot of her people have been through, and the biases they hold as a result of what they've been through.

But, she's not comfortable with what drow are now, because what drow are now are what her mother and her brother made of them. And she views both as evil, and the same kind of even. She explicitly views them as people that are fallen and broken, because they're not good.

Only in recent centuries has Eilistraee's faith regained a small amount of prominence in Faerun, as the Dark Maiden seeks to lead the fallen drow back to the long-forsaken light.

And they're not good and they can't be good, because there is an aesthetic to good for DnD and thus there is an aesthetic to good for her. And inevitably, when theres an Aesthetic to good, when you only view good through a certain framework and you're only able to understand good through the lens of people that fulfill a certain amount of requirements, there are going to be those who are left behind not because they're not good, but because they can't meet that aesthetic. They can't change, or don't want to. And there is going to be abuse that slips through the cracks because the good goes unquestioned.

Pulling another quote from pansythoughts

[...] And to get metatextual, I think that’s why a lot of people miss the implied problems of her church too, besides the insidious nature of bio-essentialism. The narrative context of the drow is horror. It’s meant to be antagonistic and horrifying to players of the game. So of course the thing from that culture rejecting that culture completely looks “good”

To accept that her church needs to change is to accept that maybe, she wasn't good.

Because. If she's not the good one, then what is she...?

...

Despite you mentioning them, I also didn't really touch on her temper and melancholy all that much here. I do actually think that's like. A defining part of her character.

I think it's deeply telling that one of the few times she's mentioned as manifesting as an avatar is explicitly in defense of her people. She doesn't know how to approach them to celebrate with them ("The Dark Maiden seldom takes a direct hand in the affairs of mortals, but she sometimes appears in the midst of a dance in her honor, leaping amid the flames of the feast unharmed") And she's heard of seen in the distance more then she's directly engaging ("Most worshipers see Eilistraee only from afar, perched on a hillock or battlement, silver hair streaming out behind her. She appears to show her favor or blessing and often rallies or heartens creatures by causing a high, far-off hunting horn call to beheard.")

But she WILL appear to defend her worshipers. And she IS deeply concerned with defending those coming out of the underdark.

I don't know. I don't have canon proof of this one, but I do think that Eilistraee is a deeply lonely person. Despite having friends in other pantheons such as Mystra, she feels isolated in the image she has to uphold. She can't connect with her followers, she's left with this view that most of her family is evil, or has rejected her for leaving. Of course she carries herself with grief. Of course she doesn't know how to be anything other than "The good one."

[cityofmeliora]

Where did the "Emeritus" part of the Papas names come from? Also, why is Papa V referred to as "Papa V Perpetua" rather than "Papa Emeritus V" (unless he is?) Is Perpetua like his real name or something?Also, if you can, because I don't know how many albums there are total, are you able to specify which album was written by / belongs to / is associated with each Papa? Thank you.

hi thanks for the quastions

1: Where did the "Emeritus" part of the Papas names come from?

a lot of people think "Emeritus" is a name / their last name or something. it is not. "Emeritus" is an honorary title given to people who have retired from their position but continue to use their title. for example, a retired university teacher would be referred to as "Professor Emeritus [insert name]" or "[insert name], Professor Emeritus of [subject]".

so "Papa Emeritus" is a title without a name attached. it's not Title: Papa / Name: Emeritus. "Papa Emeritus" is just a title without a name, and it's the entire name of the character, like how The Doctor in Doctor Who is just called "The Doctor".

anyway, the name "Papa Emeritus" was always supposed to be ironic. popes are supposed to serve until they die, so the joke was that a former pope, a Pope Emeritus, would, categorically, be a dead pope. and in the old Era 1 lore from way back, Papa Emeritus I was originally a zombie. but when the lore changed so Papa was no longer undead, the joke became more the fact that it's ironic to have a living person be named "Papa Emeritus". unfortunately Ghost's joke was ruined a little bit when catholic Pope Benedict XVI resigned in 2013 and became the first and only alive pope to have the title "Pope Emeritus".

the name stuff has been addressed in interviews before:

The fact that the various Papas are 'emeritus', does that mean that they never really go away? NAMELESS GHOUL: Well, that's the ironic thing. 'Emeritus' in the tradition of popes means that you're dead - you never get that title until after you've died. Benedictus was the first pope in something like 400 years who was named 'emeritus' while he's still alive. He got to retire with that title. So our Papa Emerituses get to retire, but they're still here. MusicRadar (June 15, 2015)

2: Also, why is Papa V referred to as "Papa V Perpetua" rather than "Papa Emeritus V" (unless he is?) Is Perpetua like his real name or something?

like the "Papa Emeritus" name, "Papa V Perpetua" is also supposed to be ironic / a joke.

also, like the "Emeritus" part of "Papa Emeritus", "Perpetua" is not the character's name, it's part of the title.

TF said in an interview recently that he chose the name "Papa V Perpetua" because he thinks it's really funny when dictators are called "the eternal leader" or something like that as part of their grandiose titles, and then they die anyway. it fits with Ghost's recurring 'nothing lasts forever' theme.

INTERVIEWER: What can you tell us about the name 'Perpetua', which means "forever"? TOBIAS FORGE: I mean, I've always found it humoristic when leaders of– Because you know, scattered across the world, there are a few "eternal" leaders. And that is, you know –maybe it's a linguistic thing, but for me and most people I know who interpret that– means that you're eternally leading something. And, like, that has a tendency to change when that person passes away, and then there's another "eternal" leader. Which is… yeah! It just makes me laugh a little because it's funny. And so I just thought: wouldn't that be a great little mind fuck to have in our world, too? "The eternal leader." Oüi FM (April 25, 2025)

it's a joke, and it seems like TF just wanted to mix things up a little bit with the character name pattern.

3: Also, if you can, because I don't know how many albums there are total, are you able to specify which album was written by / belongs to / is associated with each Papa?

well, the Papas actually do not write their own music. the Ghoul Writer writes the music and the Papas just sing it.

PITCHFORK: On the new album, the songs/lyrics are credited to “A Ghoul Writer.” Are you this “Ghoul Writer”? If so, what inspired the words? PAPA EMERITUS: I am not the Ghoul Writer. Pitchfork (April 2013)

Does Papa contribute to the composing process? NAMELESS GHOUL: No, Papa doesn’t contribute to the song-writing. Metal Paths (August 2015)

TOBIAS FORGE: Essentially, the premise is that the songs are interpreted by the band and also our character that are our main focal points of each tour or each tour cycle Papa Emeritus I, II, III, Cardinal and beyond, they're just there executing. It's never been the point. I mean, Cardinal Copia hasn't written a tune in his life and couldn't to save his life. Under the Rockies (February 28, 2020) via Archive.org

the only Papa who ever wrote his own music was Papa Nihil, who is credited as a writer for Seven Inches Of Satanic Panic with the name "Papa Emeritus Nihil".

anyway though, here's the explainer:

Papa Emeritus Nihil (Papa Nihil) = Seven Inches Of Satanic Panic

Papa Emeritus I = Opus Eponymous

Papa Emeritus II = Infestissumam + If You Have Ghost

Papa Emeritus III = Meliora + Popestar

Cardinal Copia = Prequelle

Papa Emeritus IV = IMPERA + Phantomime

Papa V Perpetua = Skeletá

[theamazingmaddyas]

For Kayla and Austin's age:

Austin is explicitly stated to be 13 during The Hidden Oracle, meaning when we first meet him, in The Last Olympian (Off-page, Michael calls Kayla and Austin by name, saying they're checking something, if I remember correctly, during the battle, which I in hindsight interpretted as him getting the youngest away from the center of the fight.) he is between the ages of 11 and 12. (Depending on his birthday, as THO takes place about a year and a half after TLO.)

Kayla, on the other hand, does not explicitly get an age, like Austin. Instead, Apollo calls her "a younger girl". Now, when I first read this, I interpretted "younger" as "younger than Will", and therefore in my fics, she's older than Austin by a few months but tbh rereading it, it probably meant "younger than Austin", which would make her 10 or 11 during the Battle of Manhattan. I'll put a picture of the quote below so you can draw your own conclusions.

Hidden Oracle, US First Hardback Edition, Page 85

Here's there part in The Last Olympian, so you can see what I meant:

Last Olympian, US Paperback 2011, Page 185

So in conclusion; yeah, you're so right. The infirmary is run by literal pre-teens and teens. (Let's not mention the only surviving names we get out of the Apollo kids are who we can assume are three of the cabin's youngest—as the probability of Will, whom is no older than 12/13, perhaps 14, being made counselor if older campers survived is slim.)

There is no way the infirmary is clean safe or organized. It is run by teenagers.

Er, a teenager. No clue how old Kayla and Austin are. I have not encountered them yet.

A teenager. A bisexual, ADHD, sleep deprived teenager that has too many dead peoples names memorized.

There are candy wrappers kicked under a desk, open needles on the counter (that will not be used, they aren’t stupid.), a tissue box just. On the ground. A little kid threw it. The Ares kids are called in to hold demigods down while they set bones (when Nico isn’t around to do it for them. Which I believe is most of the time. Dude’s a wanderer.), there’s a bandage wrapped around a broken IV stand (bandages are an Apollo kids duct tape), and at least two kids asleep on the floor.

It is not a hospital. They are not doctors.

[numberonetacostan]

Hii!! Can i please have some mentally down/depressed MePad hcs?

Hi Aki!!^^ Welcome back, and thank you for sending in your request!! :] You can put depressed, I don't mind!

I wonder if Mepad would pick up on Taco's habit of tippy-tapping her fists together when she's nervous, and tippy-tap his feet together when he's feeling worried about something. He could tippy-tap so hard he gives himself little bruises, it's not as difficult to do as you'd think.

I wonder if Mepad is able to cry. Cobs made his creations less and less able to emote, so did he program Mepad with the ability to cry? To simulate crying, at least? Or does he lack that emotional release? How would that affect how he interprets his own feelings? Would he underestimate his own sadness, if he doesn't have that way of expressing it?

This would require Mepad to have been revived, but I wonder if where the cracks were on his screen, and where he'd been stabbed would hurt if he got too upset. His body responding to his distress, yeah? I'm sure he'd be having a whole lot of feelings if he were still around...

[holydramon]

I do think some people need to understand that like. Sometimes people have different opinions on things. Like just because someone dislikes something it doesn’t mean the person is stupid and doesn’t understand the story and nuance. People can still understand everything and still come to a different personal conclusion than you, and you just. Need to accept that.

Your take is not inherently more correct or valid or smarter than anyone else’s, and just because you disagree with someone it doesn’t mean they don’t know what they’re talking about.

[nettleshuttle]

let me just add something i find particularly wholesome in context of ishy: the limbus company fandom that vibes with the trans mtf ish hc considers “ishmael” as a gender-neutral but primarily female name she chose for herself to self-express; the moby dick fandom that vibes with the trans ftm ish hc considers “ishmael” as a gender-neutral but primarily male name that he chose for himself to self-express

and you know what? thats just so uplifting in some way. like hell yeah, that very same name can be and mean and represent whatever we want it to and give just the potential for self-expression that we’re looking for. especially since moby dick (the book) is all about people interpreting the same things differently to suit their perspective. it gets a nice twist at this intersection of fandoms

[goldenflowers]

isabeau's confession at the end of ISAT is constantly living rent-free in my head it's so fucking good. right now i'm obsessed with the way he responds to siffrin saying "i love you too" because just. imagine you're siffrin and for so long now you've believed that you were horrible disgusting manipulative unloved and unworthy of love and yet. your best friend is telling you he loves you. and you feel that you love him too (in what way? the same way that he loves you? you're not quite sure yet, but stars, you feel like your heart is going to burst out of your chest, he means so much to you) so you tell him so.

and he responds by telling you he already knew that because he has eyes.

you're siffrin and you are kind passionate protective and so loved and full of love for your friends, your family, and yet you hate yourself so, so deeply that you don't see any of that but isabeau does. according to him it's written all over your face, apparently--the face you're always trying so hard to hide with your hat, which as the universe would have it, you don't have anymore!! and he sees you and he loves you and he knows you love him back, even after you said and did such horrible, cruel things to him and the rest of your family that you know they didn't deserve, after you almost broke the world trying to keep them by your side, somehow isa understands you and still loves every single part of you. and you love him, you love him, you love him because how could you not?

especially since he also got so excited when you told him you loved him that he shouted "CRAB YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" in your face.

[valkugo]

He's just kind of longing for, I think, a real relationship. [...] I think he's finally having that moment where he's like, "Maybe I want something that's real."

Saxon Ratliff in The White Lotus (3.08) // Patrick Schwarzenegger on The Tonight Show for The White Lotus (04/10/2025)

[vantabone]

Canto 8 Spoilers!

TW: SA/CSA, Grooming and familial, emotional abuse.

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A small analysis on Hong Lu's Story as a Metaphor for SA/CSA

I’d like to preface this with if I come off as insensitive or offensive, I sincerely apologize. I'll delete this if need be. Feel free to correct me on anything. Of course, feel free to disagree as well. This is just my own reading into the story. It's not supposed to be "the canon or right" way of interpreting it.

I'm fully aware that this could be entirely unintentional on PM's part, but the beauty of stories is finding your own interpretation of the words gifted to you. Please be civil!

If you find yourself feeling unwell while reading through this, please close out for your own mental safety.

I believe that Hong Lu's backstory can be read as SA. I don't think I'm alone in this as I've seen others mention it too, but I’d like to talk about my main points on why I believe this: his objectification, his abject grooming by Jia Mu, and how he reacts during and after, as well as the circumstances around it.

A question you might ask is: why this topic? Couldn't this be applied to other types of abuse too? The answer is yes! It can! But the imagery of the cuckoospawns, its wordings, and how Hong Lu acts afterwards is a direct result of that incident and recontextualizes his behavior. The inherent horror of the loss of bodily autonomy, the imagery violent creatures rising from one's own body, the silencing of the victim and its specific wording leads one to think in that direction. So I will be going that direction.

Hong Lu is heavily objectified. In his IDs and even before his canto itself, this is one of the things we know about him. He’s described as a “gem of a child” (Liu Hong Lu uptie story), “a precious jade that must be kept within the deepest coffers” (Qingtao) and during the flashbacks, everyone else around him either praises him or scorns him for his upbringing without thinking about how it affects him emotionally. The first scene where the shadows close in on him while he hears about how they whisper is obviously a sign that this is something he’s distressed about.

The elders themselves literally use him as a source of their entertainment. This objectification is one of the main reasons why he believes he has no bodily control over himself.

To be clear, Jia Mu was absolutely grooming him. One of the main tactics abusers will use is to isolate their victims from people who could support them, and when Baoyu shared how scared he was to Xiren, Jia Mu immediately had her lobotomized. This reinforced the belief in his mind that if he were to speak about this to anyone, bad things would befall them too. This is also a common thinking pattern that SA victims have, particularly the ones that have suffered familial abuse.

Familial abuse especially is tricky because it affects everyone. Some family members would even tell the victim not to report the abuse because it could “ruin” their family by tearing it apart. The weight of the emotional turmoil falls once again to the victim, adding more stress to an already traumatizing situation.

As Jia Mu is the family hierarch and him as a child, there is already a clear power imbalance there that Hong Lu will never be able to escape anything she makes him do. Jia Mu knows he’s a kind and gentle child. Someone who would try his best to save a person suffering. Someone who believes he could befriend even the people who speak ill of him. That boy would never willingly put anyone in harm’s way. She uses this as leverage to ensure that he would never talk to anyone about his circumstances again and to continue her abuse over him.

During the lab scenes we’re treated to how he continues to be forced even though he pleads he doesn’t want to. He begs anyone to help him, but Jia Mu even goes as far as taking away his only source of support: Xiren. In the end, what breaks him is his sole confidant rehashing the same words that sends him unbearable fear: to be silent and keep watching. He pushes away Daiyu, who is the only other person that notices his change of heart. A sign of trauma is pushing away the people that care about you as well as the isolation abuse tactic in full display. He now forces himself into the mold of what Jia Mu wants him to be. Because if he does this, then it’ll hurt less. Because this is what they tell him to do. He forces himself to be more palatable to his abuser.

Now, the incident. When he tries to stop people from going inside the venue, they don't believe him. He can't explain why out of fear. They laugh, ridicule or get mad at him for saying nonsense. This also mirrors the way victims are treated: are you sure it really happened? You're ruining someone's reputation. You don't even have any proof. Are we supposed to believe you? They're a good person, they would never do that. They do not take his cries for help seriously. Baoyu trying to help was also his own cry for help. That if they listened to him, maybe his choices do matter.

Second, I believe it’s no coincidence that it has implicit sexual violence, in my opinion. They did not go into details into how the cuckoobirds reproduce exactly, but their choice of wording is very intentional: “high level of fertility”, “reproductive abilities”, and “the glint of hunger when it’s reproductive instincts kicked in”. It is supposed to invoke that type of imagery within you without actually saying what went on. That’s part of the horror. So then, it should be easy to guess what it means for Hong Lu to have witnessed all of that unwillingly.

To preface I'm not saying he was assaulted himself. However, the things he witnessed also counts as SA because this was done to him against his well. I think it's an important distinction that there are different types of SA as well.

He was forced to watch people used as a breeding ground for the cuckoospawns. And even if they were not, these were things bursting out of people's bodies and wombs. There's a lack of bodily control for everyone imvolved. That's incredibly violating to imagine. Baoyu was only a child, too.

This is how he reacts after it all: dissociation, self-hatred and a deep, deep desire to be heard and comforted by anyone. It was vile. It was extremely violating. All he wished was someone to please help him, because this was something that never should have happened.

“After today, nothing good will ever happen to me again.” this was the line that made me go, oh.. Baoyu.. :(... And what fueled me to think about how exactly I was reading the canto. Not going into details, but this was a line that struck me personally. When something that violating happens to you, you just feel... I don't think I could describe how empty it makes you feel. But it really does feel like nothing good will happen to you again, because that traumatizing experience will always weigh down on you no matter what.

He buries his flowers-- his emotions and conscience, his free will and choices, and most importantly himself-- in a way that he won't have to watch as they wither. They will still be as "clean" and pure as they ever were, like what happened to him never happened at all. This is a common pattern among victims of SA, especially children. When someone has been assaulted, they think they've been dirtied by the experience and will never be "clean" again. This is a tangent but I personally don't like this perception because no matter what happened to someone, I don't think they've been "dirtied" at all. It was never their fault to begin with.

The elders as well have an obsession for him to stay a pristine jade. Impervious to anything beneath him like despair, fear, and agony.

Here are some other points I couldn't fit in above:

- When Jia Huan exclaimed he knew the reason why Baoyu was depressed, he reacted with fear. But when Jia Huan went on to say it was because of Daiyu, you could actually see his face slowly fall too. Whether it was disappointment or relief, but I think it was because he wanted someone to understand his situation without him having to say it out loud.

- (credit to user lyrecross for noticing this) Hong Lu shares the same "emphasis on the stomach area which is either wounded, open or binded" imagery across his EGOs. It's intriguing and sad how he shares the theme with the woman who was undeniably violated the most in this canto, Kong Sihui, who had her baby eaten by a creature which then burst out of her womb.

I'd like to point out his effervescent corrosion EGO: oysters create pearls because it's their body's natural defence against parasites entering their shell or to damage to their fragile shell. His corrosion line is this, too: “Filth nests inside me... So that they may be reborn as something useful.” This one's more or a stretch but the pearl's positioning also looks like a pregnant woman's belly. (I guess the entire clam opening is the stomach though)

The only exception to this trend is Soda Hong Lu which has the corrosion ego line “The seagulls... They keep crying and screaming away..!” and his base ego.

- DOTRC also had very blatant themes of sexual assault because it was about the misogyny women faced during that time. I interpret the original Jia Baoyu as also a victim of CSA, because even if its the time period, children having sex is pretty.. yeah. I'm glad to see they didn't leave this particular theme behind, even if they weren't that faithful to the original novel.

If you managed to read this far, thank you for taking the time out of your day to do so! And please be kind. Hong Lu is one of my favorite ever characters and I'm a big fan of the direction PM took with him. It might have been unintentional, but it was nontheless written well. Please share your thoughts with me, as long as it's polite!

[lyricwritesprose]

For extra angst potential: this episode is probably only the second time in Murderbot's life when it has been nonviolently touched. The first one being, what, three or so days ago when it helped Arada out of Hostile One's crater. It doesn't like physical contact, not at all, and only some of that is General Sensory Issues About Humans. There's also the insane amount of violence that has been in its life up to this point, up to and including (in the books, anyway) low-level mining supervisors setting up unauthorized betting rings on SecUnit fights, which tended to involve massive levels of injury.

So it pretty much has only one reference point for benign touch, which is: first aid. It's only mildly uncomfortable with picking up Bharadwaj and carrying her, that's first aid. Getting Arada out of the crater, that also—sort of counts as first aid. Interpreted loosely.

Pretty sure it had never imagined first aid for itself.

Pretty sure it had never imagined rescue for itself.

It is absolutely and completely cognizant that it's disposable. That in a dangerous situation it will be abandoned or written off. And a human came in and rescued it and now it's going to do something that it has suddenly realized will make her very sad?

Yeah. Imagine that you just realized that it is actually possible for someone to care about you and then you have to go and do that.

Mensah taking care of and worrying about SecUnit in Murderbot 1x04 "Escape Velocity Protocol"

[egophiliac]

OMG EGO HAVE YOU SEEN THE BOOK 7 CATER CARD YET

80s britpunk Cater is such an incredible direction to take. his Sid Vicious jacket! his little british police cap! I wouldn't have anticipated that going full-on Sex Pistols would be his alternate self but it is SO fitting actually. 😭

(also th-the crown symbol?! the gavel?! is housewarden Cater real because I will TRANSCEND --)

[kate-bot]

a few more little pizza animations!!! they're a little rough around the edges but they were a lot of fun to make!!

[hannaxjo]

It’s cold af here, so I’m letting them enjoy some summer (their favourite day of the year)