#at least the polin of it all (and the frannie)

[pensbridgrton]

Colin Bridgerton is canon Demisexual and I have never won so hard.

[shameonmeeguiltypleasure]

Helloooo so I have this question. Are you going to explore Polin's obsession with eachother from an outside perspective? more umportantly Colin's obsessiveness because speaking as someone who would be labeled a wallflower if I were to live in ye old England, wanting to see an outside perspective (maybe Lady Danbury's cuz that woman sees all ) is tremendously gratifying. Like I want him publicly pining over her and I would love seeing one half of the ton completely gobsmacked at the utter devotion Colin is showing to Pen and Pen alone while the rest who knows Colin (eg. his family) are just shrugging and are like "I knew it was gonna happen eventually."

Hiiiiiii Anon !! Thank you for the question x

(Please note, the following might be spoilery for SMB Chp 13)

Have you somewhat snuck into my mind and had a peek at my muse? How did you know this is exactly what I planned for Chapter 13? lmao. I intend for Chp 13 to be from everyone's POV but POLIN until the very end where I might leave it on a Cliffhanger. Again, I never know what's gonna make the final cut of a chapter until its all written but you can expect something along the following:

Miss Felicity is only the beginning of Poor Colin's torment (she is very much in bratty little sister mode again)

And she'll have the brilliant help of her two eldest sisters Prudence and Phillipa who are determined to make Colin work for Pen's attention. (They missed having her focus, and ever since Pen fancied herself in love with him, she's been obsessed with the Bridgertons. Its only because they love their little sister they are accepting the match lol)

Also, let's not forget that Penelope technically has brothers now too, in the form of her sister's husbands.

Then there's Ant, Ben and Simon trying to make sure Colin stays gentlemanly and proper while making his intentions to court Penelope clear at the ball.

We also have Eloise, who while not actively going out of her way to interfere, 100% will be offering her unwanted commentary. Cue Daphne with her ill-timed attempts to keep Colin from becoming an unhinged spectacle. Add a dash of Hyacinth adding fuel to the fire with her misguided assumptions about Colin's interest in Felicity Featherington.

While we're at it, let's peek at where Francesca is an unwilling witness to a verbal battle of will between Portia and Violet, where history is remembered and accusations are made. (Franny will argue this to be the reason she escaped back to Scotland)

How unfortunate of Lady Whistledown to retire just before the juiciest most scandalous ball (as of yet) came to be..... Oh well, at least Lady Danbury won't want for entertainment again.

:)

[starhallows]

THANK YOU for saying what you said on twitter! I was seriously disappointed by this season and I’m tired of walking on eggshells around it. The heart of the Kathony story is their shared love for their families. And their families treated them terribly. Especially the Sharmas. I cannot forgive how Mary and Edwina treated Kate. And there was no resolution to that at all. The whole triangle storyline was yucky. Edwina was not “fleshed out” she was a plot device. I only rewatch Kathony scenes.

For context, this was my tweet:

Prompted by, but not limited to, CVDs and Shonda's comments yesterday.

Am I about to get in trouble? I think I'm about to get in trouble.

I have seen the tweets and the reaction some people have to any kind of criticism regarding season 2, and that's just not for me. It seems to be contained to Twitter, so I've been curating my timeline for the past month. I said it yesterday, and I'll repeat it: no one should be attacking anyone as long as you are respectfully stating your opinion. The fact that some people are doing it says more about them than I think they realise. Be respectful but call shit out; there are at least 2 other seasons left, we need to try and get heard.

I've been pretty much silent about the season so far because I didn't know what to say when I finished it the first (and only) time. It was pretty late when we finished binge-watching, and I'd had a long week, so I blamed the hype and my high expectations for the way I felt.

Instead, I created this happy bubble, reblogged gifs, read fic, gushed over edits and fanart... and I've been reluctant to burst that bubble. I did read the deep dives and the reviews that fans were writing, but there are aspects I can't comment on (because I'm white as snow).

Having said that: the season has issues.

It has issues with characterisation (hello, Edwina, my love, how's the whiplash?), plot, character motivations, pacing... I could make a 2000 word essay about it - I sent a 15-minute voice note to a friend of mine the other day ranting about the show, and I hadn't even moved past Kate and Anthony - so I'll try to summarise some "hot takes" (that aren't hot because everyone has already talked about it). Don't get me started with the Featheringtons, Benedict, Polin and Philloise... OR FRANCESCA (honestly, Frannie, babes. Just run away to Bath with Aunty Winnie, and we'll write you fic, we promise. We'll make Franchael Week a thing if we have to)

Edwina:

Let's start with the elephant in the room. The only "nice" way I can describe my feelings about the Edwina arc is: I see what you were trying to do, but you didn't do it.

What we know about Edwina from the books is that, yes, she is innocent, but she is also intelligent. Edwina knows that her family is not doing great financially, no matter how much Kate and Mary try to hide it from her, and that's why she pushes for Anthony - she knows that Anthony will give her the security she and her family need.

What we see from Edwina in the show is that she is young and naive, and incredibly sweet. You understand why Kate wants to protect her, it makes the audience want to protect her, I was in love with her from the beginning. When we meet Edwina at the beginning, we very quickly see a side of her that is unsure, almost as if she knows this is their big chance, and she feels all the pressure she is hiding. "I hope they like me," she says, and you feel for her. Then, she tells Kate she wants Anthony because he is honest in episode 2, and there was this moment in episode 3 when I had hope for her character development and depth. When Edwina doesn't get proposed to at dinner, and she cries when Kate is doing her hair, she chastises herself, "I should have been better, I should've known better..." and I thought we were going to see what was under the surface of this perfect diamond. And then, we just didn't.

They made Edwina fall in love with this perfect persona Anthony kept presenting, and she wouldn't listen to anyone: not her sister, not Daphne, not all the noise Anthony's eyes must've made while he looked at Kate like I look at chocolate cake.

And still, even after the proposal, there would have been hope for something more. They could have fixed it, which brings me to...

Mary:

*long and deep sigh* I will never forgive them for turning Mary into a doormat. You can take Mary out of the entire season, plop her in for episodes 7 and 8 and nothing changes, and it breaks my heart because I LOVE Mary. She could've just tried to find Kate in ep 6, and she would've won so many browny points in my book.

Kate is completely alone until she falls off that horse (aka Mufasa the horse pulls a Scar):

I don't have words to explain how much this hurts. Kate, who sacrifices her future and happiness for her sister; who is ready to let the man she loves go so Edwina can marry and love him instead; Kate, who has no prospects and is going to leave once the season is over to go back home and will be forced to live through others. Kate is isolated from everyone the entire season, and all everyone can do is be angry at her for things.

Anthony is angry because he can't feel feelings, and now he has them for her, and it's all her fault.

Lady Danbury gets angry because she knows that there's something between K&A while Anthony is pursuing Edwina. You know, the match that Kate has been against since the very beginning? The one LD pushed for? The same LD that will talk to Kate about her part in the emotional affair but never calls Anthony out?

Edwina is angry, and she's not even angry with Kate for the right reasons! Be angry because your sister pushed you until you met all these standards, and she was projecting her idea of perfection onto you, not because she is willing to sacrifice everything for you even if it destroys her! What? Episode 6 is a shitshow, and it shouldn't exist.

I could go on, but I think I've ranted enough. My asks are always open if anyone wants to talk about the season and its characters.

[kepnerandavery]

The hair and make-up team could have dyed Hannah's hair the same color as Ruby's to at least PRETEND they are the same person, but they are acting as if Ruby's frannie never existed and are introducing frannie as a new character. Nothing against Hannah bc it's really not her fault, but i feel like they've hired Ruby as a place holder. if Frannie was really 16 in s1 then why they didn't cast someone who they wanted to keep and make her a main character? Lots of shows have adults playing 16y/o

Ikr? All they had to do was have her wear a chestnut-colored wig. It’s literally that simple. It's almost like they don't give a damn about consistency when it comes to this show 🤔😂

I agree with you completely. It's so clear that they weren't planning on recasting her. It's not like they couldn’t have given each upcoming season to the siblings in birth order. That way Ruby would’ve been the proper age to play a mature version of Frannie in her season which would’ve come by in around four years (that is if the show went on for that long). But in my opinion, the idea to give polin season three was obviously not a decision that was planned and neither was their choice to recast Frannie. Whether that has anything to do with Ruby’s plans is the question here. Technically, Frannie is 20 when she marries John so they could’ve kept Ruby since she’s super close to that age (If the Internet is right about her being 22). Plus it's not like Fran is the main character in season three, so why couldn’t Ruby do both her new show and Bridgerton simultaneously like Jhonny is doing, especially since both Bridgerton and Lockwood & Co are Netflix shows? I just hope that Ruby is treated well by that production team and Hannah gets proper screen time in Bridgerton.

[alrightsnaps]

It upsets me that RJP left the show because I wanted to see the WHOLE family growing. Especially because it’s just him, Kate and Sophie for a while (and also John, but he and Frannie were mostly in Scotland) I hope we get kathony in S3, even if they’re not in it a lot I want to see them married and being in love, same with Benophie in S4 because god knows they’re the only reason I would have to even watch a whole season of p*lin 😒

I didn't care much at first because I was too angry at the wave of people throwing a tantrum because he wouldn't be in the show, but after things cooled down a bit those were my thoughts too. I'd have loved to see Simon and Anthony's relationship develop and mend for example, because we hardly got to see them as best friends in season 1. And it would have been nice to see Simon's reactions to Anthony falling head over heels for Kate!

If Colin, Eloise and Penelope can take time out of other couples’ seasons and promo, why shouldn't Anthony and Kate and later on Benedict and Sophie do as well? It's not like Shonda wouldn't have adjusted the s02 script to give Simon and Daphne their own arcs.

And don't get me started on Francesca! Scotland isn't even an excuse yet and her character is practically nonexistent. They've given all the grown Bridgertons their own early storylines from season 1 and deliberately kept Frannie out of the story entirely. Are they really gonna spend the first 3 seasons giving her two guest appearances per seasons and then say she got married off screen and she's in Scotland? If they can have Colin get engaged and Eloise play Enola Holmes, the least they can do is give us a proper Frannie/John storyline one season and keep up with her in Scotland. I'm not even asking for much for fuck’s sake, just give her the screen time Benedict, Colin or Eloise had in s01!

If s04 is going to be just Polin and Eloise why even bother? We'll get more of the PR they're already giving them, minus any worthwhile couples

[youngandanactress]

To clarify some thoughts/opinions I thought I’d post a few random things about myself?

I’m 18, and a sophomore in college (this is because I graduated High School a year early. I’m currently an online student because of Covid obvi 🙄)

I’m double-majoring in Political Science and Drama.

I was born and raised in the Pacific Northwest.

I’m planning on pursuing acting post-graduation. I was signed to an acting agency prior to college, but college students aren’t usually able to work professionally because of school schedules.

I’m cisgender, bisexual and my pronouns are she/her.

Alongside acting, I model because I’m needlessly tall (5’10) and I’m both ethnically and religiously (Reform) Jewish. My ethnicity means that I (according to some industry professionals, most of which being white men) apparently appear “somewhat ethnically ambiguous” or “exotic.” (I have 3b/3c natural/curly hair and a wide nose/nose bridge so I’m fairly obviously not “WASPy” in appearance. But my eyes aren’t brown and I’m tall so I apparently don’t fit the idea of what a Jewish woman “looks like.” Honestly, to most Jews I appear Jewish/Semitic. The label of “exotic” feels like poorly veiled antisemitism.)

I’m an intersectional feminist and a member of the ‘Democratic Socialists of America.’

I’m a fan of: Taylor Swift, Megan Thee Stallion and Kacey Musgraves. (I love Kacey and Taylor but hate, hate, hate almost all country music.)

I’m neurodivergent (I have fairly intense ADHD and ADD.)

I’m impatient, to my own self detriment, (and often unfortunately the detriment of others.)

Some of my Bridgerton-related favorites:

My favorite books:

#1: TVWLM (by far. It’s not even fucking close.)

#2: RMB and TSPWL tie (I wish TSPWL was longer and I dislike the allusions to domestic violence in RMB.)

#3: WHWW (I think it’s one of the best written books, but I feel like certain parts are longer than necessary.)

My favorite couples:

#1: Kathony and Polin “duke it out” ;), but I’m currently in a Kathony mood because of S2. I somehow actually prefer show-Polin to book-Polin thus far. Probably because Nicola and Luke N are adorable.

#2: Franchael and Philoise tie. As morose as it sounds, I love the whole “sunshine after the rain” theme. (Another reason I’m drawn to Kathony.) There’s added complexity given the sanctuary-like environment aforementioned relationships provide to the characters in them.

#3: Hyacinth/Gareth. I love them. Truly, deeply, loudly. However IIHK is lacking to me because the narration feels incomplete.

My favorite characters:

#1. Anthony and Kate tie. I never thought I could love Kate Sharma/Sheffield more and then Simone Ashley was cast. I feel that oftentimes Romance authors allocate too little time to developing complex individual characters, and instead choose to simply focus on developing the relationship between them. Kate and Anthony are independently gorgeous and vivid characters, which is why their relationship is so poetic and legendary.

#2. Michael Sterling. If Dev Patel isn’t at least considered for the role, I’m going to cry. Michael pines for Francesca for such a long time, and yet it’s never creepy or manipulative. The standards for men are on the fucking ground, but Michael’s extraordinary and I love him deeply.

#3. In no particular order: Hyacinth, Penelope and Francesca. I love all three of these women, and hope to god that Frannie gets more screen time in S2. I also hope that we see Penelope recognize the power she wields, and the ramifications of her actions. It feels slightly difficult to reconcile S1 Penelope with book-Penelope, and I hope we see her mature in S2.

#4. Colin and (show) Benedict tie. I love book AND show Colin. However, somehow the show depiction of Benedict is even more enchanting than the book version. This is likely due to the innate talent and acting ability of Luke T.

#5. Mary Sharma/Sheffield. I’m a Jew so my opinion regarding the topic of sainthood is irrelevant but, the woman’s a SAINT. I want show Mary to be slightly more ‘mama bear’ than mentioned in the books. I would like for her to maternally chastise/contradict Kate (regarding some of Kate’s more denigrating/insecure comments about herself.)

[viscountessevie]

AN OPEN LETTER TO THE BRIDGERTON FANDOM

Okay so context for why I decided to write this: I had started drafting the last two Salty Asks since I got them yesterday but the fandom drama and fighting really has reared such an ugly head. It's just awful the language and hostility on both sides - especially to those on anon. Just because you can hide behind the screen and anonymity to throw such terrible rhetorics that are just straight up being racist and misogynistic, doesn't mean you should do it.

That being said I don't think posting my answers for those questions are going to be productive or create positive content in the fandom tags and spaces no matter how funny or in jest I make it. So I'll refrain from posting them and if the anons who sent them would still like to know my answers, you can hit me up again via asks off-anon so I can reply privately or even drop me a DM if you're feeling comfortable enough to do so. I promise I don't bite! For reference these were the questions the last two anons asked:

Anon 1 - 15 (Show/Books Unpopular Opinion) , 26 & 27 (Most & Least Shippable Char) Anon 2 - 7 (NoTPs in fandom) , 11 (Unpopular Char I like) , 14 (Unpopular Opinion About the Fandom)

Now to the Main Part of this post. I would really appreciate it if EVERYONE could read this. Like literally if you don't wanna read the first two paragraphs fine, just scroll and:

EVERYONE PLEASE READ FROM THIS POINT ON

I initially wrote this part as an answer to the asks and was going to post it last to close out the Salty Asks because it felt like a good way to end out everything that had been answered and make it clear how to maintain fandom boundaries and just be civil and nice. Here it is as I wrote it last night and just added a section about the language and 'defences' used on anon but are really attacks on the blog user:

We all need to take a breather and cool off - even me I'll admit. We need to stop clutching our pearls every time our faves get criticised.

Across the board and depending on the ship/story, it's a scale of "Yes, he's trash but he's my trash <3 what about it?" (Me about Anthony tbh) to "HOW DARE YOU INSULT THEM - THEY CAN DO NO WRONG" (this goes without saying which stans defend their characters like this). It's the doubling down on awful actions that get to me. And now I'm seeing that once these toxic people (I'm not even going to dignify calling them fans - if you were fans you wouldn't spend all day harassing other blogs about their ships) hiding behind anons run out of defences for why their ship is superior and should be liked by everyone, they start attacking other ships. Especially if the blog that they are sending anons to like this particular ship. This point is very much an observation of what I saw unfold last night and it was absolutely vile:

I do not understand how discourse on Promogate (coined by my brilliant friend 🔔) had devolved to toxic people who claim to be Polin fans slinging mud at Francesca and Franchel? Like Francesca has literally done nothing and isn't even around and THEY ARE USING THAT??? against her. Like please guys Frannie is the least problematic Bridgerton, why single her out?

Like I mentioned earlier, once the toxic anons run out of any semblance of a defence to 'protect' their faves, they either start attacking bloggers themselves or reduce to being petty and going after the blogger's ships in hopes to make them feel as bad as they clearly feel to lash out like this.

Then of course, going straight to the root of the problem and the original reason that I disliked Show!Penelope was how her storyline with Marina concluded. That was fully on the writers and CVD's shoulders. They should have never written it like that or at least taken a step back to evaluate the racial implications of Penelope lashing out at Marina in such a vitriol and public manner, leading to Marina almost dying after being publicly humiliated and outcast from society. And instead of toxic anons using some critical thinking for once in their lives we get shit like this:

I'm not even going to explain why these comments are horrible and let the obvious racism and misogyny that jumped out tell it for you.

Like Jesus Christ, I know they are fictional characters. But think about why you (toxic anon) have such a deep rage about a black woman being chosen and loved by a Bridgerton, and why you feel the need to throw awful words and comments like this at her. And yes, Marina is fictional and this won't affect her but the BIPOC fans and people who follow the tags will see these comments. I can tell you as a WOC myself, it fucking hurts to see these kind of asks. It shows us there are people in the fandom who do not give a shit about us or view us as humans beings, probably see us as disposable and find our opinions and concerns about these storylines as irrelevant.

The main takeaway from this is that if someone - especially a person from the targeted community - tells you why these characters' actions are hurtful/disgusting/ problematic, LISTEN. As a whole fandom, we have forgotten to listen and take into account of other voices. Especially within our fandom, the biggest problem I would say is not listening to minority group's voices - be people of colour or the queer community.

[Examples include: Black fans about the treatment of Marina, the Desi community about the Sharmas and the unnecessary India plotline and backstory as well as the Queer community with the Benedict Being Bi/Lesbian Eloise discourse. LISTEN to us when we talk about these issues and try to see it from our point of view.]

On the flip side, the fictional 'crimes' (I use this term loosely and I mean the bad problematic behaviour/actions) aside, I think snarking on characters you dislike is fine but don't go around attacking people who like them just stay in your own corner of the fandom.

You can stay in your lane by: unfollowing/blocking, tagging posts accordingly like let's say you often reblog snarky comments and posts about a certain character, just tag it as '[Character] Critical' and then if you have a follower who likes the character they can just block that tag. And stay out of ask boxs if you're going to be overtly mean and not offering any constructive criticism.

This is a lesson I learnt personally as well over the last year being in the fandom. I'll admit I snark a lot on a couple of characters I just cannot stand but I'm trying to do better to minimise the snarking from now on. I also know there are groups of people who like them and view the tag. We are all real people behind our screens, so I respect their preferences and them as a person. It's not like I am running a hate blog about these characters and sending death threats via anon. There's just that line between snark and being cruel and we should be mindful of it.

This is the first and last time I'll ever laid it all out in a post like this but that does not mean I will stop calling out bad behaviour should it come to my blog. If not, I'm going to follow my own advice and block tags.

If none of you read any of that, here's a TDLR:

1) Racist/sexist/homophobic and generally hateful anon asks are not it!

2) Listen to the minorities groups within the fandom when we bring up valid issues and concerns with problematic storylines/promo/character actions

3) Just be civil and respect fellow fans - we are all in the same fandom at the end of the day and have to co-exist.

4) Carve out your own fandom space on your blog and curate your fandom experience via unfollowing/blocking and tagging posts accordingly if you want to keep away from different parts of the fandom.

[Note: I will be keeping my ask box open for constructive discussions but the moment I catch any whiff of hate or distasteful comments about me or any characters, I will block you and turn off anons. As my personal rules goes: if you have something rude to say or want to shit talk me, say it to my face.]

[kepnerandavery]

But enough about me. I wanted to ask you about When He Was Wicked. Specifically, how you would adapt it into the series. As you can see in this awesome timeline (©@pink-roses-garden for this brilliant tool), pretty much all of Francesca's story runs parallel with another book. John & Frannie courting is presumably at the time of AOFAG; part 1 mostly stands alone (until TSPWL starts), when part 2 happens it runs into RMB, and by the time Francesca gets her man, TSPWL ends too.

So, my question: how would you make sure that Francesca's story gets the focus and praise it deserves? While still counting in the other stories (most notably TSPWL; especially because Eloise and Francesca are such extremely different characters)?

I'm looking forward to reading what your ideas would be.

Kind regards,

— Thel. 💚

I honestly read and enjoyed the book for what it is, and didn’t think too much about how it would be adapted to the show, specially since it would be so far off in to the future. But now that you mentioned it, I feel like it would be a shame if the creators didn’t mess with the timeline a bit, and gave Michael and Francesca their own season. Not to mention, blending their story with that of Polin’s and Philoise’s will also be unfair to both of those couples and their fans. If they followed the books exactly, it would take 3 seasons to cover all three stories simultaneously, and that isn’t what Bridgerton is like.

But I do think they might have to introduce both John and Michael a bit earlier (maybe at the end of the 3rd season). Or, I would prefer it if they just waited and introduced them in the 6th season (fingers crossed there is one) and showed Michael and Francesca’s first encounter, John and Francesca’s wedding, a flash forward of the two years of their marriage, as well as Micheal’s reaction to having to endure being around her and John all the time, and then finally John’s death, all in the first episode, and then saved the rest of the episodes for Franchael’s story.

Even though the timeline is crucial to the flow of the books, the only thing that would really be altered is Colin being married. And his character’s contribution to WHWW could easily be done by a married version of him. Maybe it’ll even be better if he gave Michael advice from a place of experience. And same with Eloise, her being married doesn’t really alter the story too much. Francesca’s story doesn’t really have much to do with any events that occurred in any of her siblings lives. She has her own problems to deal with (a lot lol). Plus, the time between the start of RMB and the end of TSPWL is only 2 months, and WHWW spans throughout 6 years. I don’t see how much good it would do to mesh all of it together.

As for Francesca’s character getting enough focus, I do think that they need to include her more in the show. But I guess, she wasn’t really in much of the the first 5 books so that doesn’t leave much room for her to be in the show. I think she will be way more invloved in the 3rd season though, since she was in AOFAG a bit. But surely they could at least incorporate her more into family scenes right? Maybe give her more screentime in order for the viewers to really begin to understand who she is as a character.

I personally love how she was written in the book. She’s fierce and independent. Although she’s kind of an ambivert, and likes to keep to herself, she shares all the root characteristics of the other siblings (stubbornness, kindness and infinite love for their family), but she’s way more low key and subtle compared to them. She’s different but I think that makes her super interesting. She’s not in your face, but that doesn’t mean that she deserves any less screen time or dialogue 💁‍♀️

I think as long as they find a actor that could do justice to Michael’s character, keep both him and Francesca true to character, and have the storyline be anything close to what it is in the books, the praise will just come naturally. Because their story really is beautiful ❤️