#develop his dynamic with Izzy

[vanishingtrainwreck]

I completely understand why they chose to age up Izzy Hands in “Our Flag Means Death”. In fact, basically all the characters are aged up from their more likely historical ages- pirates didn’t have particularly long live spans. Izzy Hands is my favorite ofmd character and the direction they took with him requires his to be this angry, pathetic, masochistic, old man. (Plus it doesn’t hurt that the actor is both fantastic and hot.)

However, I can’t help but imagine a late adolescence 16-19 year old Izzy.

An Izzy, who like Stede, had always admired Blackbeard and wanted to be like him, but who was capable of violence because he had been forced into it to survive.

An Izzy who Edward took in because he saw himself in this boy and saw him as someone he can take in and mold as a mini version of himself, only as this goes on, for Ed to realize that doesn’t even like himself so the parts he liked about Izzy were the parts that uniquely belong to Izzy. Parts that Ed weeded out, only to resent the outcome at how similar the two of them had become.

An Izzy who Stede can’t bring himself to be mad at, because that’s just a child, only a few years older than his eldest. And an Izzy who takes this sympathy and care as condescending and reacts aggressively in order to prove himself.

I think it could pose a big question to Ed’s morality that he would be willing to let this child, not only on his ship, but as his right-hand man. Even if Izzy was in a previously violent situation, Ed is just introducing him to another one.  

I just think it could be interesting to have this masochist worship, but without any of the definite romance. (Maybe Izzy could still have feelings for Ed, because he’s not exactly a father figure, but their relationship is far from professional so he’s not sure what it is and he develops these complex romantic feelings in the confusion. This has the added benefit where Izzy is longing for an affection that will never be reciprocated in any form. Ed trying to ignore the fact that he is taking advantage of the kid’s feelings anytime he has him do something. Izzy feeling like Stede taking Ed from him, even though ed was never his in the first place and never could be. Idk, a lot of these are kinda already done in the show, but I do think the age difference would inherently change the way it’s done. I do actually think it’s more tragic that in the show there is nothing inherent about Izzy that makes Ed unable to love him the way he should, he just… doesn’t.)

I think in general, I would’ve liked to see a teen character in the show, apart of the crew. I would’ve especially liked to see the dynamics it would’ve created with Ed and Stede. The moral dilemma of allowing a child in a violent environment when they no doubt were already in one prior. Most pirates were teenagers and young people in their twenties, so it seems fitting to me. Obviously though, I love the direction they when with Izzy. He’s such a unique, nuance character and I love him sm

[izzyfishie]

IZZY'S PERSONAL INTERPRETATIONS ON GI-HUN AND IN-HO’S DYNAMIC

some friends encouraged me to finally post this long essay, so here i am!

some pre-post notes:

this is NOT an inhun analysis. the admin of this post does not like inhun whatsoever, nor do they feel the need to be "swayed" into liking inhun. this is just a non-romantic/non-sexual exploration of in-ho and gi-hun's dynamic, brushing past the surface.

however, this is also not an inhun hate post or an attack on those who do ship them. people are entitled to their own opinions, this just happens to be mine, as well as the select people who beta read this analysis post LOL

without further ado, let's get into things.

i think gi-hun confuses in-ho. and not in the “wow i’m gay for him haha” way everybody thinks.

gi-hun makes in-ho question his morals and person, to say the least. he’s confused, and likely angry about that fact. he manipulates gi-hun as young-il to show him the way the world works, and prove him wrong. i also feel like, like il-nam, he would take his beliefs to the grave. it’s just like. when you’re religious for the longest time and confirmation bias the shit out of that until suddenly all those beliefs are being refuted by somebody. that’s probably where the “slightly rooting for him” thing came from as well

but at the same time, in-ho still has anger and likely some sort of envy towards gi-hun — he is the thing in-ho is not morally. and gi-hun is breaking the system set up and breaking his cynical beliefs. so yes, despite what inhun fans think, i do really think he does want to see gi-hun suffer.

but no matter what, even if gi-hun were to show sympathy for in-ho despite his heinous crimes, i do not think in-ho will be fully forgiven, nor do i think he deserves forgiveness. he still has/had autonomy. his trauma can be an explanation, but never an excuse.

not to mention, we forget in-ho was previously a police officer. what do police officers do? guys.. acab.. come on.. i refuse to believe in-ho was fully a good person before the games. until there is genuine concrete canonical proof, i cannot believe it. did he have good qualities? yes. everybody has good and bad qualities. but i also believe he developed a lot of cynicism and moral disengagement over the years, and the games later solidified that.

when he’s playing as young-il, he’s trying to play god, and show gi-hun reality. he does this in many ways – puts their lives on the line during the six-legged pentathlon, uses his words in ways to make gi-hun fall down a pit of questioning, etc. but gi-hun never breaks! and this confuses the shit out of in-ho.

i do firmly believe in-ho is a bad person beyond redemption. nothing can excuse the thousands of deaths he oversaw willingly. unless we somehow find out he’s being forced or coerced into this, which is highly unlikely considering his genuine beliefs on humanity, it is made evident that in-ho is willingly doing this.

at the end of the day, he still did the things he did. he still toyed with lives, and oversaw the deaths and displacement of thousands. he believes he’s doing the right thing, but does that really justify any of it? it does not.

another thing i want to say. i believe gi-hun would give in-ho mercy, not forgiveness. gi-hun is a good person. but he is not naive. he is strongly set on his morals and has been affected deeply by the games set up, and would likely show in-ho mercy without absolution. he never forgave il-nam, did he? (i know it’s not exactly the same since il-nam set the games up but in-ho is still endorsing them!! he still has autonomy despite what people will say. that’s why i said mercy.)

“but izzy,, he forgave sang-woo!”

and this is where i diverge from the topic for a moment.

sang-woo and gi-hun had a past. gi-hun knew sang-woo in ways he didn’t know in-ho or other people. also, there’s no way gi-hun would have immediately forgiven sang-woo. like i said, he is very strongly set on his morals. gi-hun would forgive sang-woo at some point because he knows sang-woo, and he knows the kid in sang-woo that wouldn’t have done this. they had a strong connection. also also.. sang-woo is a victim of the games. it’s not like he had a choice; he was just trying to survive, as was everybody in the games.

season 2 gi-hun has also learned that the players are not at fault. i think that notion would help him show more forgiveness for sang-woo. while yes, he KNOWS killing is wrong, i think s2 gi-hun has definitely realized more that they are the victims, not the ones to blame, the GAME MASTERS are (cough IN-HO). therefore, i think while gi-hun didn't forgive sang-woo right off the bat, his development, along with his genuine CARE for him would have. anybody who denies they care for each other is just pure wrong. while s1 gi-hun was fighting for himself and his mother, and FOR THE MONEY, s2 gi-hun is fighting for the players as a whole. that sentiment definitely set in after the limo scene AND il-nam and his final interaction!!

this is also why the in-ho to sang-woo pipeline comparison doesn’t sit 100% well with me. they have similarities, of course, and they’ve both done questionable things. they also have both challenged gi-hun’s morals. but sang-woo’s actions CANNOT compare to the extremity of in-ho’s situation. people may deny it as much as they want, but in-ho is fucked. up. as stated earlier, trauma is not an excuse for that. sang-woo was thrown into a situation that, might i add, in-ho assisted in. gi-hun is sympathetic of the players, seeing them as the victims in this situation. and YES i KNOW in-ho was a player so don’t jump on my dick with that argument. VOLITIONAL AUTONOMY is key here. gi-hun would physically not be able to understand why in-ho turned out the way he did.

alright. back to the original topic.

now, about gi-hun’s feelings on young-il… i don’t think he has more feelings for young-il as opposed to the other players. “young-il” made himself more visible to gi-hun intentionally, and did what he could to get closer to him, which does make it kind of impossible to ignore somebody like that. i don’t think gi-hun was more drawn to young-il. as we’ve said before, young-il made himself appear more. when somebody is in your proximity, you think about them more. also, as i’ve said before, “young-il” had a child and a wife at home!! gi-hun likely feels a lot of responsibility and sympathy. and we see this with jun-hee, too. it doesn’t feel like the same “if you die I will feel empty inside because i'd miss your company” we see with jung-bae or sang-woo. to me, it reads more as the guilt and general sympathy that this man has a wife and an unborn child that he has the possibility of losing. young-il just made those feel more personal by getting close to gi-hun and, yes, manipulating him.

in conclusion, in-ho and gi-hun have a very compelling dynamic that to me personally gets ruined when romance comes into play. people are entitled to their own opinions but the general mischaracterization of in-ho pisses me off and i really don’t see them working out in a romantic sense whatsoever.

[edwardteachswombtattoo]

Actually the concept of Izzy being part of Ed and Stede's relationship is deeply hilarious to me. Because he would hate that so fucking much. He got some development in Season 2 but even that wouldn't be enough to make him withstand 24/7 Ed and Stede one hundred percent full bright lights in love with each other.

Ed and Stede doing silly little bits, Yes and-ing each other to oblivion? Ed and Stede giggling and telling each other jokes and playing? Ed and Stede doing elaborate theater performances for no other reason than why the fuck not? Swapping clothes just for the hell of it? Kissing each other at every possible opportunity? Sneaking off to make out/fuck during business hours? All the inside jokes? Izzy would fucking implode within five hours.

I think if Ed and Stede told Izzy they don't stick to strict top/bottom dynamics (i.e. they switch out who "works the back" and who "works the front"), Izzy would explode into dust. I don't think Izzy could conceptualize the idea, I think he would probably have to sit and stare at the wall for two hours and then scream for fifteen minutes and then maybe he'd walk into the sea.

Ed: "Hey, Stede, these paint samples--"

Stede: "Yes, what about them?"

Ed: (shyly): "So if I was a paint sample....which one would I be?"

Stede: "Oh, you'd be misty lilac or mulberry of course! Or some other pretty paint color."

Ed: (blushing) "Awww, babe."

Ed: ....

Ed: "Why don't they make paint samples that aren't pretty colors? If they did I could just...be that."

Stede: (immediately running over to kiss Ed on both his cheeks and his forehead) "No!!! You'd make such a lovely misty lilac or mulberry!!"

Ed: "Really? You mean it?"

Stede: (kissing Ed's forehead again) "Of course I mean it, you nut. And they do make ugly paint colors. Oil gray or something. No one wants oil gray."

Ed: (kissing Stede) "Babe, I'd still love you if you were oil gray."

Stede: (blushing) "Oh.."

Ed: ....

Stede: .....

(Ed and Stede start making out passionately)

Izzy: (suddenly wishing he'd died from that bullet wound): "What?"

[thebumblingbookbee]

My hot Shadowhunters take:

I care more about the platonic ships than the romantic ones. Sure Clace and Jessa/Wessa are great, but give me Jace and Alec, Clary and Simon, Sophie and Tessa, Will and Jem. I want me some more Mark and Julian and Gabriel and Gideon and Ty and Livvy and Izzy and Alec and Jace and Max!

Absolutely yes.

The Last Hours KILLS me in the regard cause it started out with SO many amazing friendships or potential friendships but I didn't get to see them developing

The rest of her series? The friendships/family made my heart actually ACHE

Sophie and Tessa? Will and Jem? Clary and Simon? Simon and his family? The Blackthorns entire dynamic

[sixstepsaway]

I don't get why people want to pretend Ed wasn't abusive. Why do people insist on making everything into binaries? Yes, Ed has been a victim of abuse. Yes, he has been abusive. Both things can be true. I love him because I think he's in interesting and I understand where his pain is coming from (even if I think S2 was a missed opportunity in terms of character development). But anyway, thank you for writing about this because maybe some folks genuinely don't recognize abusive trends.

I think it has a lot to do with the fandom culture of only being allowed to like "wholesome" ships.

Look at it this way: when season 1 was airing, Ed and Stede were, in fact, very wholesome. Sure, they had some moments of lesser wholesomeness, but overall they were pretty wholesome and sweet and gentle. They were sweet and finding love in middle age and it was adorable. They had a general stamp of fandom approval that they were, in fact, Wholesome And Good To Ship™.

If you look at other fandoms, you'll see a lot of times there's the Good And Acceptable Ship and then there's the Bad Ship (or ships) and the Bad Ship is always slapped with the "oh that's actually incest!" label when they've, idk, grown up together, or "oh it's abusive!" because one of them one time made a bad joke or something, or "power dynamics!" because one is 27 and one is 25 or one is short and the other is tall or whatever, and yeah sometimes the Bad Ship is actually toxic or whatever (which is not a reason to not ship and enjoy it!), but they're put in neat little boxes: Good and Bad.

And for a lot of people, those boxes keep them safe. Last year, someone who was an Izzy Hands fan got doxxed because...? They liked Izzy Hands and shipped him with... I don't know actually. Ed? Stede? It doesn't matter, all I know is they got doxxed.

The side of fandom that thinks you should only ship the Good Ship are toxic and downright dangerous. It's happened again and again in numerous fandoms and just keeps happening.

So when at the end of s1, Ed turned around and cut Izzy's toe off and fed it to him, I think a lot of people panicked because shit, now Ed was Bad too, and if he's Bad then you can't like him or relate to him or ship him with the Good guy of Stede, so what the fuck do you do?

Obvious answer: Blame Izzy. Izzy's already classed as Bad, so put all the responsibility on Izzy for Ed's darkness and then it's safe to ship Ed and Stede again and no one can call you an abuse apologist or whatever for liking them together.

(To be clear: Shipping says nothing about your real morality. This is very clear for many reasons, one of which is... spend thirty seconds watching fans of the Wholesome Ships dox people and abuse people online lol)

So they spent all this time saying Ed was just scared and lashing out, and now s2 has come along and Ed is... well, abusive, canonically.

And for most of us, that doesn't really matter. We can still enjoy Ed and Stede or Ed and Izzy, we can throw ourselves into fanworks and enjoy the show for the things we like, and we can critique the things we have issues with (my problem is not Ed being written as dark and twisty and having a villain arc, my problem is the show writing it badly, exploring it badly, and then handwaving it, because it's shitty writing) and still really enjoy the vibes we got from the show.

But for people who are scared because they spent all this time saying Izzy fans should kill themselves for liking an abuser, well... now they have a choice: either admit Ed is an abuser and admit that liking a character doesn't dictate your irl morality, nor does it say anything about you aside from what you enjoy in fiction, or excuse away his actions, insist he's just a lil meow meow and continue feeling safe in their little bubble.

In a lot of ways I can't blame people for wanting to duck and cover from it. I mean, look at the shit people get for liking characters who aren't perfect, or talking about the imperfections of characters, or just enjoying complex narratives!

But what genuinely concerns me isn't anything to do with the fiction really, it's when people look at Ed's behavior in 2x01 and 2x02 and go, "Nah he's fine," because oh, honey, no, you are making yourself so vulnerable to real life abuse. That is what worries me, which is why I answered that one ask saying Ed wasn't abusive, it felt important to point out why he is.

Anyway, that's what I think is happening here. I think people are just scared that if they admit their fave has multitudes and isn't a perfect character who never does any wrong, they'll get doxxed and abused and harassed online.

I get that.

[ladyluscinia]

2x08 Reaction #7

Ok, last episode thing in this series I've finally circled around to being pissed about is framing Izzy as a mentor to Edward.

Because what the fuck.

When they had Stede do the whole "taught him everything he knows" bit in 2x05 I thought it was pure flattery, to the point I thought it was wild that Izzy even gave a little shrug like he might believe it. I thought we had established pretty clearly in S1 that Edward was the creative thinker and leader in their dynamic.

Izzy was useful - probably even essential - but he was the support. The tool. Good at the execution.

And he certainly seemed to know this. In 1x04 where they establish their pre-Stede dynamic, Izzy expects Edward to come up with a brilliant plan and tell him what to do. He only doubts him enough to try and take charge at the last possible second, seems mostly aware his own idea is "get shot fighting back instead of sitting and dying", and feels genuine regret for both having to shoot down Edward's first plan and insulting him at all once he saves them in the end.

Because Edward is brilliant. He's earned his place as the leader between them. As Blackbeard.

Which makes it absolutely infuriating that in pivoting him into a "wise mentor" role they have Ricky say to Izzy's face that he was the brains behind Blackbeard and Izzy doesn't even refute it??? Paired with killing him off as the mentor (supposedly), and paralleling him to Auntie as they really double down on the "mentor who has authority over strategy and is proud of you" thing, and the displays of respect in 2x07... it kinda feels like the show is saying Edward learned most or all of his shit from Izzy.

And, like... if they just meant swordfighting and getting an approving nod when he pulled off a complicated disarm that would be one thing, but they kept focusing on things like "brains of the operation" and "how to lead the crew as a Captain" lessons.

And Edward is so much less interesting if Izzy actually taught him how to be Blackbeard, or if he was doing things as Blackbeard for Izzy's approval.

Like I guess I'm glad they didn't flesh it out enough to make the implications fully textual so you can fudge them away from that direction, but they don't really tell you not to read it that way. The man is even giving emotional development advice for fuck's sake. The mentor thing is jarring enough because the authority and respect dynamic really never flowed in Izzy's direction, but it's also putting Izzy in a position where I feel like they are implying he made Edward the man he was for better and worse, and... no. Don't do that.

Stop giving Edward's anxiety-ridden henchman credit for his atrocities - he worked hard on those.

(Plus we literally already know the first authoritative figure in piracy he got round two of Daddy Issues and his fucked up ideas about piracy from. How many symbolic fathers pushing him in dark directions does one man need to kill / be visited by in purgatory / watch die before he can start addressing those???)

[veiwryn]

Vaguely explaining the teams pt 2

Now for Team Phoenix. (Alejandro, Bridgette, Eva, Noah, and Izzy)

Without Sierra being in Team Two, this group gets the opportunity to choose a decent name for themselves. They decide they want to have a symbolic name, Noah suggesting animals like foxes and ravens (Which is meant to be foreshadowing). Alejandro would suggest elements, while Eva and Bridgette are just listening to this mini debate. Eventually Izzy decides to pop in and suggest Pheonix, which the team have no objections.

This is how their dynamic plays out, Alejandro and Noah shoving the leadership position back and forth (Noah unwillingly getting it while Alejandro wants complete control—in the beginning), Eva and Bridgette being supportive of the person they're bias towards—occasionally being on neither or both sides—and Izzy being a wild card.

Alejandro knows he has to contribute to the group, Eva isn't easy to manipulate compared to Owen, and he's low key intimidated by her. So, it makes him determined to win/do good, cause if he's valuable there's a higher chance he could convince Team Escope to keep him around longer than Bridgette. (He knows he'll be the first out otherwise). His game plan changes, instead of focusing on other teams, he tries to maintain a good relationship with his teammates, particularly Noah as they're the only boys on the team and are intelligent. Alejandro could've have noticed how Noah acts like his little trio's leader (but it's actually Izzy), so if he gets to Noah, he can be safe.

With Alejandro distracted, this also gives the opportunity to develop the relationship between Eva and Bridgette, as the iron woman is given a 2nd chance to be a better person to the hostess. Occasionally Izzy is added on their shenanigans, which causes the surfer and female bully to sort of become friends. With the rest of the group becoming genuine friends. It makes being away from Geoff a little bareable, and Bridgette wouldn't be as tempted by Alejandro. They're on the same team, and while Alejandro does want to last longer, he acknowledges the fact that plotting against Bridgette would only backfire.

THIS DOESN'T MEAN ALEJANDRO WILL NOT BE EVIL. He's just more careful with his plotting and won't go out his way to make his team lose. And maybe Alejandro learns to genuinely appreciate his friends teammates. I think it'd be funny for Alejandro to have a crisis because he doesn't know what to do; if he should betray the team he learned to love, or disappoint his parents/family.

Found family, my beloved.

I also just realized that Alejandro and Heather's roles are swapped. What a loser.

[bloomeng]

i made the joke earlier about how steddyhands fans tend to like edstede the least of all the pairs, and i just wanted to elaborate bc actually i do have more to say about this

when i first watched the show i didn't really participate in the fandom (so i don't know pre-s2 fandom drama), i was neutral about izzy and i suppose i liked edstede the most simply by default. in general in season 1 i thought their relationship was charming back when the show was still firmly in the realm of a comedy. then s2 happened...

i wouldn't say that s2 ruined edstede for me permanently because i still like them, but i will say that it definitely reshaped how i see their relationship. suddenly their relationship was stagnant, going in circles, and generally starting to feel more like active bad influences on each other. which is wild considering how in s1 the whole crux of it was that stede and ed were actively making each other more authentic people. i will say though that i personally feel the reason edstede fell flat to me in s2 was mostly due to ed's behavior and the way stede overlooks it. ed's behavior in s2 will always be one of my biggest complaints of s2 (the rest of the issues are more technical).

recently i've seen the opinion that edstede are now MORE problematic than edizzy, which i don't exactly agree with. i agree with the sentiment that with all the developments in s2 edstede feels worse, but i think that has more to do with the fact that their relationship issues are far more tangible to the majority of the audience. with edizzy their issues stem from an intense bond forged by a deep codependence that is pushed to extremes. simply put their dynamic is rare. (i want to quickly note that this doesn’t make their relationship better narratively; there’s ���a space for both in story telling and both are equally valuable.) edstede's issues on the other hand are more grounded, to the point where most people have experienced some level of their conflicts in their life whether that be firsthand or secondhand. so it's not that their problems are worse so much as more people have stronger reactions because they can relate directly. not saying people don't relate to edizzy, it's more about the scale to which people relate.

my famous example is breaking bad (spoilers for a decade-old series) but i think one of the reasons people hate skylar so much more than walt (besides the obvious misogyny) is that they can relate to the anger of being cheated on while it's harder to relate to the feeling of your husband secretly being a drug lord. like sure his thing on paper is ten times worse but audiences usually relate strongly to the things they personally relate to.

edizzy will always be worse on paper (the toe incident alone makes sure of that) but edstede now feels worse is what i'm getting at. and sure i know izzy emotionally matured leaps and bounds in s2 but unfortunately that doesn't fix edizzy. in order for it to actually be a healthy relationship they both need to grow, so yeah they're still firmly in the toxi yuri category.

anyway i actually do like them a whole lot, but they also make me angry on izzy and the crew's behalf. and on a personal level, i just tend to prefer non-canon ships because i feel like i have more wiggle room. that and if they're canon i'm usually satisfied with that canon so i don't find myself hyper-fixating as much. hence why i didn't really get into the fandom after s1, despite liking the show more at that point.

this is just my observation but i think a lot of the reasons people are now drifting from edstede and into the safety of non-canon ships is simply because s2 stripped their relationship of some of their whimsy. a lot of people are angry with ed and stede and are seeking refugee amongst ships that don’t feel like they have to confront the glaring holes in their relationship.

but these are just my musings i don’t speak for anyone but myself.

[izzythehutt]

Hi Izzy!

I am a BSD lover and how you developed the Black family dynamics on your AU! Congrats for it. I really like your portrait of Orion, Arcturus and Walburga, and I was wondering what was your take on the reaction Arcturus and Walburga (and an AU where Orion lives) had when they learnt about Sirius being imprisoned and his alleged crime? Would Orion really think his son did that knowing why he run away? What about Walburga and Arcturus?

I hope you have a nice weekend!

That's an interesting question. I tend to think Walburga canonically probably would have believed the truth—that Sirius was trying to kill Peter, but probably not that he betrayed James and was actually working for Voldemort the whole time. I guess it depends on whether they knew that Regulus was a Death Eater and why he disappeared.

But I like to believe that even canon Mrs. Black knew enough of her son to know he wasn't a turn-coat.

[vroomvroomwee]

Izzy Hands is the perfect example of what Neil Gaiman was trying to tell us with the season 2 finale.

Look at it objectively. We got a canonical queer love story as the centre of the show, with Ed and Stede's relationship now developing to new levels both emotionally and physically. And YET, everyone is focused like a hawk on the weird, desperate, pathetic mess of a person that is Izzy Hands and his dynamic with the crew (particularly Ed, Stede, and Lucius).

With how uneventful it would be for us fans if aziracrow got together so easily and effortlessly. How so many of us are focused on characters like Muriel and Beelzebub themselves more than the actual canonical new queer romance that we got. Because it was just so easy. There was no flavour for us to taste, no cooking for us to digest, no spark, no sprinkle. After all, at the end of the day, the show is entertainment and it's there for us to watch and love and have fun, and the fun part is the angst, the pining, the affection and the drama that has us rooting for the characters. When that is done and over with, what then?

[ofmdsalt]

so regarding the environment and fan culture that brought about pccp.

GB girlies and izzy antis twisted ofmd into the bastion of radically progressive queer media, and made GB into beacon of all good queer rep, when most of it was just Not That Deep (or even well-written, if we're looking at s2). and in order to pat themselves on the back for being upstanding queer citizens and consumers of the morally upright media, they obviously have to point blame to a villain - systemic homophobia. the obvious villain here is obviously the british empire, but because the empire is not a material villain they project it onto the next closest thing; a shouty angry secondary antagonist, and turn him into the embodiment of all and every form of real-world queer oppression.

but wait, that's not enough! that's not politically savvy enough! they need to add another dimension of racialised violence in Ed and Izzy's dynamic to show JUST how politically progressive they are.

which, ironically, is an interpretation that's actually more racist. ofmd deliberately averted overt homophobia directed at its protagonists because they didn't want that to be a trigger for its audience, and the fans loved praising it for being SO SAFE and SO COMFORTING and SO COZY. unfortunately, izzy antis needed izzy to be the axis of all oppression that Ed suffers, so the resulting OFMD that existed in the heads of Izzy antis is a show where white queers get an escapist love story, but characters of colour has to suffer years of systemic racism. and as a fan of colour......it's the kind of performance of race awareness that can only come from a fandom of white queers overcompensating for their white guilt. if we're being honest.

a white guy racefaking to give his arguments more weight? a fandom so up its own arse and high on its fumes of moral superiority is just perfect environment for that kind of jobless behaviour tbh.

(had this sitting in the drafts for a while and now i've finally returned to it)

oh anon i think you've hit the head on a lot of issues here.

to preface: i think OFMD is a perfectly fine show. it's fun. it's well acted. the set design and costuming was great. the first season obviously remains my favourite because of how well everything sort of fits together.

season 2, well, it has it's moments, but knowing what we know of production, i think it was nerfed quite a bit and what we got was a bit of a mess and all over the place in terms of pacing and storytelling. a lot of characters were ill developed because they didn't have the time they needed to continue their character arcs. i was honestly so confused by Archie's introduction because so much time had been skipped and suddenly Jim is in a new relationship?? so the relationship they had with Oluwande just fizzled out. and obviously we never would have gotten that poly ship between Jim, Archie, Olu, and Zheng, so that remains just a mess of a story.

and obviously this isn't even touching upon the elephant in the room Ed/Izzy/Stede

characters i wouldn't even want to touch with a ten foot poll because they have been so torn apart by fandom speculation that they now exist as caricatures of themselves if we're being honest

what i find frustrating about how izzy is treated within this fandom, is that people pour their frustrations onto him and refuse to look in the mirror.

for example: some people critique trans Izzy headcanons. and it usually boils down to 'if you want GOOD trans representation, Jim is right there' as if that isn't condescending as hell. here's the thing: Jim as non-binary representation gets sidelined by the main story in s2. that's just the reality. whatever made them interesting in s1, got completely skipped over in s2. we weren't seeing Jim on screen in s2. we were seeing Vico. and if people can make critiques like that of trans Izzy headcanons, would it be fair of me to say the same about trans Ed headcanons? gnc Stede headcanons? if you want gnc representation, Jim is literally right there

and what it comes down to is, don't yuck anyone's yum???

and obviously this fandom has a racism problem. and it's hilarious to see some people saying 'i didn't realize it was so bad' when it's been obvious from the start that if you treat liking a character as a litmus test for how good you are as a person, you're going to run into racism by implying that IF YOU LIKE IZZY AS A CHARACTER THEN YOU ARE EITHER 1) RACIST OR 2) YOU HAVE INTERNALIZED RACISM AS A FAN OF COLOUR IN THIS FANDOM

and i doubt this fandom will learn from this

[meanbossart]

I love Izzy so much, I feel for him tremendously.

Can you tell us something about his future relationship, whatever it might be, with Grodderick? Or is it under wraps for spoilers? 👀

Sure! The details of their relationship are never relevant to the plot, it's more of a background thing that changes some very minor character interactions in ways I doubt one can predict by simply learning about it - I'll still leave it under a cut for anyone who wants to avoid it. I'll also skip certain story beats which allow their relationship to happen in the first place that are most definitely spoilers, and only talk about the actual dynamic between them and post-ANE events, so if details feel amiss, that's because they are.

So it's probably obvious that they're meant to develop a romantic relationship lol this happens after Grodderick gets somewhat "stuck" with Izzy around through certain circumstances. Izzantar, in his predicament, happens to be far more comfortable around him than anyone else because of his predisposition to feel safe around "slave" races. Now, that's obviously not a great start to any relationship, romantic or otherwise lol but it is what it is.

They grow a little closer through Grodderick's endless patience and sincere curiosity about a culture he isn't familiar with. Izzantar, despite his experiences, considers the underdark his home, he can only properly conceptualize of surface customs by comparing them to his own culture, and Grodderick is the only one willing to hear it without judgement - with the eventual wisecrack or pushback. But the way he does it is one Izzantar comfortable with.

Likewise Izzantar would probably defy Grod's own generalized negativity around the orc-ish side of his culture (and frankly be positively shocked it has any merit at all). It's a funny little game of "no, YOU have internalized hate" they keep playing between themselves by accident.

Another major point here is that Grodderick is a) the only person who sees Izzantar as an adult and b) someone who immediately recognizes him as someone with an anxiety disorder. With time he would help Izzy to calm the fuck down and not always assume the worse out of people. His company also allows Izzantar to feel more at ease in public settings in the surface as a drow, and Izzy's brazen company and completely unfiltered perspective is a breath of fresh air to Grodderick. He thinks he's funny, he recognizes and participates in his dry humor, he doesn't offend easy, and he's the furthest thing from a drow. This makes him an apt friend choice and later a romantic interest. Being hot and having cool tats helps LOL

Also they both like to partake in a little devil🌿 which is likely how their first meaningful interaction ever happens (Izzantar sees him smoking and is like "oh boy I could really fucking use some of that right now")

They probably starting fucking kind of casually. It's entirely on Izzantar to pursue him since Grodderick isn't interested in feeding a drow's ego, which is a funny interaction of its own where Izzantar just blows up frustrated that he won't make the first move, since he's used to being a very passive partner. Something along the lines of "WHY DON'T YOU WANT TO FUCK ME" probably comes out his mouth verbatim LOL they get over this non-misunderstanding quickly and Izzantar is just happy to have sex in a way that's completely the opposite of what's expected of him in the Underdark as a popular breeder. Obviously he also finds Grodderick profoundly attractive both for his confidence, smarts, appearance, and frankly his imposing presence because he's not immune to a little bad-boy charm.

I think they catch feelings around the same time as one another, and proceed to get on a long-term relationship.

Izzantar (this is post ANE and never mentioned) eventually sets shop somewhere as a jeweler. He gets a lot of business based on the fact that he's a drow and knowingly plays up the part of someone who's mystically more knowledgeable and skilled about precious stones and minerals than most because of his race (on top of his genuine talent). His bad attitude is also hysterically seen as charming drow bedside-manner and indicative of the quality of his work to wealthy clients.

He lets his hair grow out and for semi-plot-related-reasons starts passing as a female drow (also, he just likes it) Grodderick doesn't care either way. At that point they're living together and get a cat that Izzantar names Angkacha. To his despair, Grodderick nickanames it Chacha and it sticks. Izzy wants the cat to be a vicious killing machine but whenever he casts animal speak on it the cat's just like OOOO MAMA ME LOVE MAMA and he hates it (but not really, he would kill for this cat)

aaaand here's some old doodles of him from that point of his life! The last two have been uh cropped for uh reasons

[spinteresting]

After having an OFMD S2 marathon yesterday, I have some thoughts.

The first 3 episodes are really good. But they change the tone of the show a lot from what it was in season 1. And the following 5 episodes do not properly deal with the descent into darkness. They made Ed incredibly unlikable. And it wasn’t funny. Everything with Blackbeard and his crew felt very dark and serious.

I think the 2nd season would have worked better if they had kept a more comedic tone and not gone as dark as they did.

My favorite Ed/Stede moments in season 2 were stede begging Ed to wake up, mermaid, and when they reconnected at Anne and Mary’s place.

Nothing else was very compelling. They didn’t have many good moments together this season. And in fact, the show kept flashing back to their good moments in s1 instead of building their relationship further.

Despite kissing multiple times and implied sex, they really lacked any passion or tension. They didn’t seem to desire each other. There was no romance. It felt very flat.

I still love Lucius and Pete. I wish they had been given more screen time this season.

I still hate what they did with Jim and Olu. It made no sense with what we saw in season 1. They should have been poly this season, just adding another into their dynamic instead of changing it completely.

Episode 5 was my favorite. It was funny and the crew was featured significantly.

Episode 6 needed about 5 more minutes added to its runtime. I loved the concept though.

Episodes 7 and 8 were not good. They both had good moments, but overall they felt rushed and underdeveloped. And they felt disconnected from the rest of the season.

And the decision to kill Izzy is baffling. It makes even less sense when watching the whole season in one go. Nor does it read as “he’s not really dead” like Lucius’ death in season 1.

One other major weakness this season was the Prince Ricky character. He wasn’t funny and he really needed to be. The Badmintons in season 1 were hilarious and added so much to the comedy. Season 2 needed that with the antagonist.

The other major complaint I have about this season is that the writers mostly forgot it was supposed to be an ensemble show. The crew were not given as much time or development as in season 1, and that was one of the best things about the show. I loved all the B and C plots in season 1 and this season really needed that. It had a couple but they weren’t executed as well as the ones in season 1.

Overall this season also lacked in comedy. It was no where near as funny as season 1.

Season 1 of Our Flag Means Death set the bar really high, and season 2 just didn’t reach the same level.

[thewhizzyhead]

hi its me so back when wattblr was at its peak (2020), watt basically gave me a drug that made me really fuckin creative and want to do a bajillion musicals. 4 years later, warriors has now force-fed me this drug again. Welcome back to me being annoying as fuck woo here's the Izzy Original Rambly Musical Masterlist - Part 1

+ Misfits - been developing this SINCE I WAS 13 and um its Basically A Show Within A Show idea inspired by my past experiences with my former church and their Christmas musicals. TO UNDERSTAND THIS HERE IS SOME BACKSTORY: so when I was 10-13 I used to be in Christmas musicals staged by my sunday school. These musicals were Pilipino translations (the songs stayed English) of Typical American Children Christmas Musicals found on youtube (check out A Rocking Royal Christmas on YouTube yes we did a Filipino translation of that and I played the narrator when I was 11 I'm not kidding). When I was 13, I wanted to make something more resonant to the teen crowd as um to be quite honest the stuff my fellow Sunday school people were going through were Fucking Heavy and i wanted to feature that + I always knew that the Very Kiddy Musicals we set up were mainly a show for the parents and all that. I wanted a message of faith that actually resonated with my age group - and i developed it far enough that at 14, i was commisioned by my sunday school teachers to work with the church's orchestra in actually having this developed! But 15 happened and I started questioning a lot of the stuff my Sunday school and church does in terms of like politics, mental health stuff, sexuality and identity and pressuring me and my fellow teens to become something we were not, and it really felt alienating, almost as if I was simply putting on a show to appease all those that look to me and want me to be the Best of Young Christian Soldiers

So the concept of Misfits is um okay just read this ramble i wrote 3 years ago that is MUCH MORE COHERENT AND COHESIVE than the descriptions ive been whipping up for three hours now:

There is more to this like I have been developing this for 7 years now and there IS A TRACKLIST and each character has a storyline and a certain dynamic with all of the characters - like all are connected one way or another - but the basic gist is:

1.) The Narrators Put On A Show For The Religious Audience, then Start Crumbling at The Questions Presented and Prompted by The Misfits, but also Upon The Realization Of How Much Pressure They Are Under in Supporting A Narrative They Are Conditioned To Unquestionably Trust + the reveal of the secrets they hide and deny about themselves in order to seem as the Perfect Model Christian (sexuality, mental health issues, parental/pastoral pressures, abuse, psychological trauma as a result of Putting On The Show - the Time Travel element is not just there for the purposes of the show, it has a very important plot element too that connects the leader of the Narrators with the defacto leader of the Misfits) + how do they deal with these secrets being slowly revealed when They Know They Are Being Watched

2.) The Misfits Try To Navigate The Strange Musical Scenario and Why The Narrators Seem Preachy, While Also Being Forced to Address Their Pasts and Presents on why They Are Deemed "Misfits" in the First Place (outside of Christian conservatism, there exists undeniable concern for the wellbeing of the "Misfits" aka juvenile delinquency and poverty, mental health issues, and um the defacto leader being a Former Member of the Narrators wHICH WILL BECOME THE RUNNING THREAD TO THE PLOT TWIST which is why they were chosen in the first place), so basically The Misfits Are Challenged to Acknowledged that They Are Indeed Troubled (especially with carefully planted plot points and script prompts used by the Narrators to have these in the open) - but the original Producers Approved plotline has them Turn Back To God, but how can they do so if the problems they face are rooted in the current religious institutions in place? That is the question presented by the Misfits to the Narrators - which is what causes their show to fall apart

3.) Through Questioning The Mission They Were Given and the Environments That Mandate Them To Do So Despite Their Own Struggles (Narrators), and Through Questioning Themselves, Their Struggle, and The Acknowledgment That They Do Need Help (Misfits), the two groups face what I want to be the ultimate thesis question of the musical: when you grow up, where does one find hope? This is my attempt at breaking down the concept of religion because ultimately, people look to a higher figure in the dream of hope and the want for answers - thus, religion cannot ultimately be taken away from people who truly want and seek it. But we gotta deconstruct the narrative that hope is only limited to these religious institutions - and criticism must be relayed to the institutions that mandate that people serve them for the hope they supposedly provide but subsequently break because of prejudice, conservatism, and close-mindedness towards the people the Bible says to serve above all.

So yea the thesis slogan is basically: grow as you go, redefine your mission, and break the script if needed be.

Also it's pop rock, very inspired by SPRING AWAKENING, we are the tigers, and a dash or rent. The songs are English when They Are Part of the Producer's script, and Tagalog when They Are Not Part of the Script (like the characters being honest or unexpected rebuttals to the narrators' preaching moments or when the narrators themselves reveal their secrets). Otherwise, dialogue is taglish YAY

[pixiedust-poppers]

you know funny enough, I feel like Jake and the neverland pirates would actually do really well as a Disney channel show for older kids (like say Gravity falls) instead of a preschool show. You’d be able to get more into lore and emotional stuff. Maybe even plot?

I don’t know, if they ever did decide to reboot the show it’s a neat idea.

*grabs your shoulders and shakes you excitedly*

THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING!!!! LIKE!!!!

Ok, I think there is something to be done with Jake and his crew and his dynamic with Peter and Hook. Like for example how do the kids feel that Peter is only here for a day or a few hours, just enough to help with their issue? I'm sure the kids have a bit of an unhealthy attachment to him as he's really the only guardian figure they know, and as shown in Peter Pan's return, they all crave his attention so bad that they fuck up the mission trying to impress him! Like sure they can call him to bring him back to Neverland, but they don't perhaps he implemented a rule that they can only call him for emergencies. Which is also kinda hm. But you know he doesn't completely neglect them.

Word vomit incoming

Now let's take this a step deeper; what about Peter's relationship with them individually, it's clear he has a favorite, and it's Jake like that isn't a contest. Even if the show tries not to portray it in that manner it's obvious (I mean for fuck sake his name is in the title lol). His item(s)? A wooden sword personally hand-carved by Peter himself. After completing the Forever Quest, a golden sword called the Destiny Sword (towards the end of season 3) turns him into Captain Jake after giving the others a rousing speech about teamwork and how they can all get together to defeat Fathom with it. So it's clear he's the chosen (I'll touch more on that pressure later) by Neverland. But what does that mean for Izzy and Cubby? I mean sure they got items from him and he does care about them, but they're not as special as Jake. And they're never going to be, I mean god, Disney didn't even bother to make them Birthday episodes yet gave Jake two, then gave Skully and a minor character one. So it could develop into them realizing that while they are well-liked they aren't loved by Peter, Cubby is in denial about this revelation as he has gotten more gifts than Izzy. Izzy, the only girl in the main cast, is grated by this knowledge, she KNOWS and she has known for a long time. Enough to the point where perhaps she deserves a villain arc (then a redeemed villain arc) with the help of Captain Hook, who sees this opportunity to manipulate her for his gain.

Ok so jumping, let's go back to that Captain Jake issue. I personally didn't like Season 4, I thought it was shit BUT this new Captain Jake in a reboot could bring up an interesting little angst point called, "The pressure of being forced to be THE responsible one when you're only still a child." You might have all these other well-established Captains around you but, they depend on you to think of ideas, and come up with solutions to save the day, if you fail then it's on you but you're only 8 or 10 years old!!! A user mentioned this before but Jake could develop an entirely new personality as a Captain to make himself seem smarter and more capable than he actually is! This can go two ways A) he burns out and he burns out REAL bad and rather fast. B) The apple doesn't fall far from the tree, and the realization of how much power he holds makes him realize he can almost do whatever he wants because he IS the 2nd most powerful person after Peter. This then comes his Power-tripping arc and the consequences of Peter not dividing this power between the trio, and being gassed up everyone, which raises his ego through the roof. This can only end badly obv and it does, how? idk but just know it does.

As for Captain Hook, because this is New Disney he can't be 100% back to his OG self but he can absolutely be raised to be more of an asshole in a Disney channel show and probably a bit fucked up. But you also would have to thread carefully on how you do these things, because one wrong move and Disney will have you rewrite the whole thing and tone it down more than need be. I also think there would be more to explore with the kids and their dynamic with him, since they also would have more nuance to them. They could have more stakes with him, and could honestly do more messed up shit with them he could make them have an inner conflict, he could manipulate one to join his side temporarily. Put the kids in more life-threatening situations that they don't come out unscathed from. Hell, you know what, I want him to win some episodes and get his way with Jake and his crew being powerless to stop it. It would teach a lesson that some days, you just can't win, someone who is nasty will win and get away with it and you have to be ok with that! (if you have resourced all your options first) Life will not always go your way. As for him and Red Jessica, show a toxic relationship, I mean come on do you REALLY think she has a thing for hook lol, it was shoehorned Hetero-shipping bait and it worked now can we do something else with it? As for smee, sharky and bones? I guess they can be less friendly to the sea pups, it would be more of a loyalty thing rather than a personal thing.

Also, the show could bring back the lost boys, to make the island seem less empty than it is, and maybe a different set of kids to replace the Native Americans.

Finally, to end this word vomit, the relationship between the kids. I really beg it be explored more. Now don't get me wrong they can have a wholesome and loving bond but not everything has to be peachy-keen. Like sure Jake is their captain but do they, not envy or resent him in some way? For example, they're all bright but Izzy is shown to be the brightest she has more knowledge about Neverland and its artifacts, so why is she not captain? Is it because she isn't naive enough? She isn't as nice or forgiving as Jake? She has no issue snapping at you when she's fed up? Then there's cubby, does he even have the real guts to be cut up for this type of thing? The classic "why him and not me?" type of deal. Then there's Cubby, does he hate being just stuck as coconut boy by his peers and other pirates? Will he ever break out of his shell, does he have a breaking point with his friends? Then Jake gets annoyed that they're not as in sync as they once were, he kinda hates that they're developing on their own and steadily gaining more and more independence. They're willing to talk back to him, be rude, and do less trio activities. Which leads to more conflicting ideas, possibly fights, and less "what I say goes!". He is scared of them changing and becoming their own individuals, he's scared that they might be growing up.

Sorry this is so so so long and rambly, I just have a lot to say about a reboot for this show that I cannot help myself.

[pickingbelovedoffthesofa]

Izzy has been at Ed’s heels catching scraps for YEARS. He loves Ed and it’s already been established in the first three episodes this season that he has come to Jesus on a few things regarding Ed and Stede. That Stede bringing the softer side out of Edward CLEARLY was not the worst possible thing (sure, it took Ed going full Kraken and making life hell for everyone on The Revenge for that to sink in, but he got there) and that his love of Edward, perhaps, DOES extend beyond the Blackbeard persona. He might not have even understood the KIND of love he had for Edward until seeing the mirror that is Stede held up to it.

And so, now it looks like we’re going to get a blossoming NEW dynamic between him and Stede, the OTHER man in love with Edward. His former competition. I say former, because I feel like Izzy might in fact have given up on Ed being his. He still loves him, but he loves him enough to accept that Stede is the one who will make him happy and he WANTS to see him happy. And it’s looking like there’s a possibility that viewing Stede through that lens might result in Izzy developing deeper feelings regarding him. Maybe he will find himself loving the one who makes the other one he loves happy. Maybe he’ll find himself caught in the middle of that while Ed struggles with how he mistreated his first mate and repairing things with Stede. Maybe Ed will see Izzy and Stede’s relationship growing and discover that a way to heal and make things right is to allow room for that. Maybe he’ll see that Izzy is learning to love in a way that is less possessive, controlling, repressed, and compartmentalized. That he’s growing to love Stede, even, and Ed has a deep understanding of what it means to love Stede, so it becomes something for them to bond through and heal through. Maybe the three of them come to some kind of understanding and it /isn’t/ totally incomprehensible that the three of them can move forward together somehow in a way that isn’t toxic. I’m not saying Steddyhands, necessarily, but a strong friendship built on love and good will.

Although, if banging out some of the sexual tension at first is necessary to move past it, be it the three of them or just Stizzy, I would be able to die happy. 😌