#eyrie relates to her. doing what one has to do

[impossible-rat-babies]

ohhhhh I think the endwalker healer role quests are gonna be my fave

[kellyvela]

You are getting a lot of winter rose related anons because rhaelyas have decided to gatekeep winter roses from characters unrelated to Rhaegar/Lyanna and Jon Snow. Someone tell them winter roses grow in the glass gardens of winterfell so people are not 'stealing' when they headcanon Sansa, Arya, Catelyn and all the other Starks with those flowers

The question is, is Sansa really unrelated to Rhaegar/Lyanna, and hence to Jon??? Obviously certain shippers will scream that Sansa has nothing to do with Rhaegar/Lyanna and the blue winter roses, but they are wrong, big time!

I already said that the blue winter roses grow in Winterfell's Glass Gardens, so any woman of House Stark has probably been given at least one of those blue roses in her lifetime. I also said that the first Stark girl associated with a blue winter rose was the one from the legend of Bael the Bard and The Rose of Winterfell. See here.

Bael the Bard and The Rose of Winterfell are obviously a proto version of Rhaegar/Lyanna.

The tale of Rhaegar/Lyanna has their own features that differ from Bael the Bard and The Rose of Winterfell. For example, it happened during a tourney, the Great Tourney at Harrenhal. And who is the ASOIAF character most associated with tourneys??? The obvious answer is Sansa Stark.

Sansa was the unofficial Queen of Love and Beauty of the Hand's tourney in honor of her father at King's Landing, where Loras Tyrell, wearing an armor of blue sapphires forget me nots, gave Sansa a red rose. Fact that is a clear allusion to Rhaegar Targaryen, wearing an armor of red rubies and crowning Lyanna with blue winter roses during the Great Tourney at Harrenhal. And what did Sansa's younger sister say about attending this tourney??? She called the event stupid . . . .

Sansa also saved Dontos Hollard's life during the Tourney in honor of King's Joffrey 13th name day. Fact that is a clear allusion to Lyanna saving Howland Reed from the abuse of three squires during the Great Tourney at Harrenhal.

And right now Sansa/Alayne is forever organizing a tourney at The Gates of the Moon in the Vale of Arryn. Alayne Stone is the daughter of the Lord Protector of the Eyrie and the Vale, who is also the Lord of Harrenhal. Fact that is a clear allusion to the Lord of Harrenhal organizing the Great Tourney at Harrenhal in honor of his daughter.

And last but no least, Sansa is profoundly associated with the Tourney at Ashford Meadow, event that take place during the first tale of Dunk and Egg: The Hedge Knight. The five champions's surnames at the end of the first day of competition are: Lannister, Baratheon, Tyrell, Hardyng and Targaryen. Four out of five of those surnames match with the surnames of every Sansa's suitors so far: Joffrey Baratheon, Tyrion Lannister, Willas Tyrell and Harrold Hardyng . . . . Other tourney contestants and melee fighters mentioned in this tale, also match with men in Sansa's arc, there's a Ser Donnel of Duskendale and the Lords Arryn and Royce . . . .  

The Tourney at Ashford Meadow was organized by Lord Ashford in honor of his daughter's 13th name day. Among other allusions to Sansa's arc.

Anywas, back to the blue winter rose, the rose motif is strongly related to Sansa Stark. As every girl of House Stark she is obviously associated to the blue winter roses that grow in Winterfell's Glass Gardens. She was befriended by the Tyrells, whose sigil is a golden rose, Loras Tyrell gave her a red rose during the Hand's Tourney, Marillion told her that he was composing a song for her called the Roadside Rose.

But we also have the so many times mentioned beauty and the beast motif in Sansa's arc. The ancient tale, in its many versions, usually starts with a especial rose.

Obviously most readers want for Sansa to be the beauty for their fave beast, like cujo, Tyrion and Baelish. But none of those men are cursed princes, that have skinchanging abilities, live in a magical castle with magical companions and with a strong relation with a special rose . . . . You know who has all those requirements checked??? Yeah, Lyannas's baby boy.

Thanks for your message :)

[talestold-a]

( arryn b / jaz sinclair / cis woman + she/her ) hear ye hear ye — king matthos baratheon welcomes lady rowena arryn of the eyrie ! his great majesty is glad that the twenty seven year old noble appears to be persevering while overlooking that it’s said they are also volatile, as long as they are glad to celebrate peace in the seven kingdoms. fortunately for them, matthos remains oblivious that they aren't happy with his reign and that their true allegiance lies with house arryn.

i. background.

full name: rowena arryn.

commonly goes by: ro.

official title: lady of the eyrie.

age: twenty seven.

date of birth: the ninth day of the ninth moon in the year 271 after conquest.

gender + pronouns: cis woman + she/her.

orientation: bisexual.

allegiance: house arryn & the vale.

spoken language: common tongue.

religion: the faith of the seven.

ii. appearance.

faceclaim: jaz sinclair.

eye color: brown.

hair color: brown.

dominant hand: left.

height: 5'5"

build: slim.

iii. personality.

virtues: persevering, precise, agreeable, protective, curious.

vices: volatile, perfectionist, abrasive, impatient, secretive.

weapon of choice: crossbow.

moral alignment: chaotic good.

inspired by: no one at the moment !

common tropes: coming soon <3

iv. relationships.

parents: mychel arryn, former hand of the king ( deceased ) & gwyn arryn nee corbray.

siblings: ruling liege tbd arryn.

relationship status: single / widow.

children: two year old son named ryon.

pets: has a trained peregrine falcon named sora.

other relations: house corbray ( cousins ), former in laws tbd !

previous relations: former husband tbd, more available to plot !

v. biography.

when she began to walk, rowena became a shadow of her mother - always a step behind, the two usually hand in hand. she has always been rowena's favorite person but her father hadn't been much competition since he left for the capital not too long after her third name day. she remembers how her mother used to refuse to speak badly about her father while the children were in ears reach, though rowena also remembers that changing after receiving the news of mychel's first bastard. her mother used to say how conflicted she was, not wanting the children to hate their father, but what she didn't know was that rowena hated him from the second he left.

by the time he died, rowena felt little to nothing for her father. when he did send ravens, as scarce as they were, she would burn the parchment without bothering to break the arryn seal. she had gotten over his departure in time, anger turned toward the king instead, but the bastards had caused her to want nothing more to do with him. if she was ruling lady, she would make sure the bastards never set foot in the vale for the rest of their lives and voices this idea to her older sibling frequently. while she doesn't exactly hate them the way she hated her father, rowena views their existence and potential proximity incredibly disrespectful for her mother.

rowena trusts no one more than her older sibling. while she is incredibly opinionated and vocal about this to them, she trusts them to lead the vale wholeheartedly. there are days when she wishes it was her but most days, she's thankful to be the second child. she is good at appearing one way to strangers and behaving incredibly different around loved ones. though rowena can appear as a proper lady, if the right buttons are pushed, her temper will spoil the entire facade. she swears it's something she's always had, but only as she got older did she begin to behave more pessimistic. deep down, rowena can be kind and protective, but tends to show that in unconventional ways.

loves to study the moon and the stars, enjoys a nice breeze in the mountains, has always had a passion for needlework and is incredibly skilled at playing the harp. has difficulty sitting still and loves to learn, always curious. never thought she would love being a mother but now she dreams of a big family.

vi. wanted plots.

former in laws - rowena was married a couple years ago to a younger sibling of a vassal house of house arryn through betrothal from her parents ( mainly her father ), though the two fell in love ! this will be a wc sent in to the main eventually but if anyone has deceased brothers that could have been married to rowena or wants to have one, just hmu ! ro is a bit terrified her in laws want nothing to do with her after her husband's death, especially since most of their marriage he was with rowena in the eyrie, but she loved her husband and cares for his family - plus they have a son, ryon, and rowena still wants to try to maintain a relationship.

suitor / future betrothal - this would be either someone who is going to approach rowena soon about the prospects of marriage since it's been at least over a year since her husband passed or someone who has impressed ( or manipulated ) her mother enough to see the possible betrothal as a good thing, meddling enough to have rowena seriously consider it if all is as her mother says.

trusted gossip pals - not necessarily spies, but people who rowena trusts and they trust her enough to seek out information on what could have happened to her father. would probably be from either the vale or someone allied to house arryn ( or even allied to rowena specifically ).

p much anything !!

[thetoxicgamer]

DBD Update Details Dead by Daylight 6.5.0 and Survivor Action Icons

Dead by Daylight patch 6.5.0 for 2023 is described in great detail in a recent DBD update from creator Behaviour Interactive. A lot of significant updates are coming to the multiplayer survival horror game, and the January developer update delves deeply into many of them. There are improvements to the Nurse and Knight killers, a redesign of the Eyrie of Crows map, and some wonderful quality of life elements like survivor activity icons and an in-game challenge tracker, in addition to the continued development of beta features like improved wiggle tech. The new wiggle system has been in beta since last year, but with 83% of players currently opted-in the mechanical change is now making its way into the full game as part of the DBD 6.5.0 update. There are a few tweaks coming, however, which will make it harder to slip out of your captor’s grasp than before. Great skill checks will no longer increase wiggle speed, instead increasing the killer’s sway by 20%. They’ll also be delayed slightly after the Decisive Strike skill check, to make them a little less sudden. In better news for survivors, a new ‘survivor activity HUD’ is being implemented as part of the 6.5.0 update. This will show you what all the survivors are doing currently as an icon next to their portrait, making it much easier for players who aren’t talking over voice chat to know exactly what their teammates are up to. These actions include repairing generators, opening an exit gate, healing, mending, recovering, cleansing and blessing totems, searching chests, and activities related to specific killers such as waking up fellow survivors. The updated display will also include an icon around the survivor portraits if they are being currently chased. This will also be shown to the killer, making it easier for them to track who they are chasing if multiple survivors are similarly dressed. There’s also now a distinct health state for survivors currently being carried by the killer, to avoid confusion from the previous system which showed them as being in the dying state. Dead By Daylight 6.5.0 - screenshot showing the new survivor activity icons by the player namesChallenges are getting some welcome quality of life updates in 6.5.0 as well. You’ll now be able to browse the archives and store while searching for a match, as well as spend Bloodpoints in the Bloodweb. Once you’re in-game, a challenge tracker will appear whenever you make progress on an active challenge. This should make it a lot easier to keep an eye on your current goals, but you can disable the feature if you find it getting in your way. The Eyrie of Crows map has been frequently considered a little too survivor-favoured by the community throughout 2022, and moving into this year Behaviour Interactive says its own data backs this statistic up. As a result, the map will become more square than its current, more rectangular, shape in patch 6.5.0, which should allow killers a slightly easier time patrolling. The tall ‘maze tiles’ have also been moved away from the main building and shack, which should make it harder to run rings around the killer. It’s not all bad news for the baddies, however; new foliage on the map should make hiding traps a little easier. The Nurse is having some slight add-on reworks, with all instances of add-ons extending her maximum blink range being changed to make her a little less capable of traversing long distances. ‘Bad Man’s’ Last Breath will cause the Nurse to become undetectable for 25 seconds after hitting a survivor with a blink attack, while Jenner’s Last Breath will now let the Nurse teleport back to her original position and restore her blink charges once she has exhausted them all. More changes are coming, though you’ll have to wait for the full patch notes for those. Newcomer the Knight is also seeing some changes, with the team aiming to make longer distance play more powerful. Creating paths greater than ten metres in length for your guards will now grant several benefits: survivors will no longer see an orb when the path is created, guards will begin chasing faster on long paths, and the Knight will gain the Haste effect for a few seconds, with more duration for longer paths. In addition to this, a ten-second limit has been added to patrol path creation to limit how long the Knight can hide his terror radius while creating a new path. Finally, there are a few minor additional updates. The Merciless Killer rating is now tied directly to kills, requiring four for the top tier. Existing non-licensed outfits will continue to get the option to purchase them with Iridescent Shards, with the Clown, the Spirit, Ace Visconti, and Feng Min next in line, Behaviour Interactive also reveals that they banned 64,601 DBD cheaters in 2022 – their highest in a single year to date. DBD update 6.5.0 lands on the public test build on January 4, with plans for the patch to arrive on the live servers for all platforms later in January. We’ll be sure to keep you up to date on all the details as they arrive. Our DBD killer tier list will keep you up to date on who the strongest Dead By Daylight characters are following these latest changes. We’ve also got more of the best co-op games on PC for 2023 if you’re looking to team up with others, along with a look at the delightfully dangerous DBD dating sim Hooked on You. Read the full article

[kerra-and-company]

@just-eyris-things​ Okay, we’re trying this again asl;kdjfasdf--the original ask posted before I was done with it, and then I couldn’t edit the post properly. So! Round 2!

Thanks so much for the ask!! :D <3 <3 This is from a bit ago now, but I am choosing to cash in my free ask :) You get some assorted songs that correspond with characters, with brief explanations, because I feel like talking about that for a bit. Hope you enjoy!!

This one is for Kerra and her Wyld Hunt, but also her and herself/her trauma in some ways. To pick out a couple key bits, this first verse is Baby!Kerra:

The first day that we met I saw you out of the corner Of my eye, I was 5 You're still the thumb that I'm under

This bit is LWS1 Kerra:

On the wall I was 10, you were more than a feeling By my side, unwanted The sun would see you come creeping Made of fear I was strong There's no shame to have you here Where you belong

And last but not least, this bit is Kerra at the end of HoT:

I see it's only me needing You back there behind me In my soul I feel like Maybe we'll be friends But you're holding me back Yeah, you're holding me back And I just want to run Dear shadow

This song is very Cal--to the point that when I heard it for the first time, I immediately put it on their playlist. First of all, the first line is "Create with me a work of art", which is perfect for them. Second, there's a couple more bits that I'll highlight.

This gives me vibes for how they felt leaving Ascalon and heading to Kryta over two years after the Searing:

Sitting here stuck in my head while the sun is just rising Come on, it's late, and we know we're the lone survivors

This bit just is...kinda how they are as a leader, and (in the first couple lines there) a bit how they are as a romantic partner to Daisy:

You're all that I've got, when it's dark, I have a light I finished the line, but my heart's on my own time Don't you wanna push, don't you wanna fight, don't you ever talk to your mind? You can make that come alive

And overall, it's just very them. "Let's see what we can do", indeed.

This one is Nabi, and though it's kinda bouncy, it's related (to me) to the fact that she chose to fight a lifelong battle against the Ministry of Purity and made a huge impact on the world by doing so, even if she couldn't stop them completely. Anyways, my point is that this is her:

You could give me hell You could give me death Right before I bend I will have revenge

Fire through my veins I will fan the flames Until my dying breath

'Cause I will never go down Any other way

I mentioned this one the other day, but this is a song for Brook and Casca--they're both the couple that's distanced from each other according to the lyrics and the couple meeting in the music video for the song. They find each other after years apart and thinking that the other is most certainly dead.

Nobody gets me like you do I'm not the same, not after you So many things that we've been through I'm not the same, not after All that's been said and done I don't even feel like I’m back at one Nobody gets me like you do I’m not the same, not after you

This song is the reason that Daisy's mother's name is Grace. She has a very close bond with her mother, who more-or-less raised her alone from the time Daisy was five.

Guess I got it from her, no I’m not sorry for it

Yeah I’m my mother’s daughter So glad I get the honor Yeah I’m my mother’s daughter Turns out I’m a little like Grace

This one goes out to all the Secondborn sylvari :)

See, I was born the second child With a spirit running wild, running free And they saw trouble in my eyes They were quick to recognize the devil in me See, I was born a restless child And I could hear the world outside calling me And heaven knows how hard I tried But the devil whispered lies I believed Can you hear it hanging on the wind? Can you feel it underneath your skin? You've got to go on, further than you've ever gone You've got to run far from all you've ever known

One of the songs that I think was originally intended to mean something slightly different, but it's on Nisha's playlist, because in the context of xem, it sounds like a Nisha-falling-in-love song. Letting down walls, being willing to get hurt, letting others in.

Maybe I'll crash into you Maybe we would open these wounds We're only alive if we bruise So I lay down this armor I will surrender tonight Before we both lose this fight Take my defenses All my defenses

I lay down this armor for you

I'll be your escape I'll be your safe place I'll be your shelter

Now, this song--this song I would make an animatic to if I could. It's very accurate to Casca's anger towards Weylon for his betrayal of their warband, as well as each of their individual struggles with forgiveness. Casca never intends to forgive him, so she doesn't take on the burden of forgiveness. Weylon struggles for years, after fully taking in how wrong his actions were, with forgiving himself. He's the one who needs to forgive here, not her. She's done.

They say the truth will set you free But it shackled me like chains

Some trust the law to guide them Some trust in the divine I am neither I have never been I have only been myself

Did you come for absolution? I have got none left to give You must find your own solution Find a reason to forgive You came looking for atonement You came looking where I live I can see right through your intent I have nothing to forgive

And because this is already long, one last song for you:

This one is for Cio and Ari! They're different but really similar at the same time, and honestly I think this song is a good encapsulation of that. So many of the back-and-forth bits could be either of them, but I've picked out the parts that seem the most like them:

You hurt I heal we cry But I'ma love you still You bail I dwell but we try So I'ma love you still

You're calm I rage enough But I'ma love you still You're scared I've shared too much But will you love me still

I'ma love you still I'ma love you through it all

[agentrouka-blog]

"What's wrong with flowers?" "Nothing, for a bee."-Jon(ASOS V). Jon wanted to woo a girl with flowers but ygritte mentioned that flowers are for bees. "Lysa's suitors were gathering around them like bees round a blossom."-Cat(AGOT VII). Cat compare Lysa and her suitors with flowers and bees. "He was a bee in a stone honeycomb, and someone had torn off his wings."- Tyrion (AGOT). So Tyrion, a bee, who married to Sansa(flower). She is currently in honeycomb Vale. Grrm is doing something.

GRRM is definitely doing something with the image of bees, flowers and honey.

The entire Eyrie, as you point out, is replete with beehive imagery, and I think it’s connected to Littlefinger, especially. The Vale is his home, and the Eyrie with Lysa his secret power base. It’s where he brings Sansa.

Ellyn Ever Sweet, the girl who loved honey so much she sought out the King of the Bees in his vast mountain hive and made a pact with him, to care for his children and his children's children for all time. She was the first beekeeper, and the mother to House Beesbury. (The World of Ice and Fire - The Reach: Garth Greenhand)

Littlefinger would love for Sansa to be his Ellyn Ever Sweet, his Alayne. But like the maiden fair with honey in her hair, the dye can be washed out and the red constantly creeps back. She does not want his honey. She is not Alayne, not Ellyn. She is Sansa.

Littlefinger looked like a boy who had just taken a furtive bite from a honeycomb. He was trying to watch for bees, but the honey was so sweet. "Harrenhal and all its lands and incomes," he mused. "With a stroke, you'd make me one of the greatest lords in the realm. Not that I'm ungrateful, my lord, but—why?" (ACOK, Tyrion IV)

The honey he thirsts for is power, and “honey sweet” Sansa (ASOS, Arya XIII) will be his downfall. 

Jon, meanwhile, has no negative honey imagery. He feeds Ghost honeyed chicken - which the puppy defends against an enemy dog in a scene GRRM took care to insert early and prominently. Dareon's voice is honey poured over thunder. He admires Val’s honey-colored hair - especially when it’s a dark honey (red) shade. And, as you point out, he does fantasize about giving flowers. Specifically, a flower from the glass gardens - they grow likely only one kind of flower there, as it’s primarily used for growing food - the blue rose. Rare and precious and sweet-smelling. 

The Gift - foreshadowed to be Jon's domain one day - lists beekeeping among its abandoned practices. 

Brandon's Gift had been farmed for thousands of years, but as the Watch dwindled there were fewer hands to plow the fields, tend the bees, and plant the orchards, so the wild had reclaimed many a field and hall. (ASOS, Jon V)

All the related imagery (flowers, honey, bees) for Jon is either explicitly or vaguely romantic (beauty, music, protectiveness) or points to positive foreshadowing for himself. (Ygritte excludes herself rather beautifully.) 

Seems they are both looking for the right combination of flowers and bees to make honey. 

Sansa thinks it would be “sweet” to see Jon once again, and I suspect it will be. Ever Sweet.

[cappymightwrite]

So I’ve just read your meta on the TWOW Alayne I sample chapter (it’s amazing btw!) and I noticed something while reading it that I wanted to share and see if anybody else has noticed - nearly every man Alayne dances with during the feast could be taken as a reference to Jon or the Night’s Watch.

Ben Coldwater -> Snow is, obviously, cold water, and Ben is a sneaky Benjen reference

Andrew Tollett -> most likely related to Dolorous Edd Tollett, Jon’s old steward and good friend

Ser Byron the Beautiful -> GRRM has described Jon as a Byronic hero

Ser Morgarth and Ser Shadrich the Mad Mouse -> these men are more dubious, I’m not really sure of the link with Morgarth. Shadrich is a callback from Brienne’s AFFC plot though, and a sign that Sansa’s cover isn’t as secure as she and Littlefinger think it is

Ser Albar Royce - a reference to Waymar Royce, he of the many Jon parallels and Sansa’s old crush, though she finds his cousin(?) stout and dull

The Sunderlands - their family are the lords of the Three Sisters. In ADWD, Davos is told a story on Sweetsister about Ned having to sneak across the Bite during Robert’s Rebellion, to get North and call his banners. A fisherman helped him but drowned when a storm caught their boat - but his daughter got Ned safely to the Sisters. The prevailing story on the islands seems to be that he left her with a bag of silver and a bastard in her belly, whom she named after Jon Arryn

Uther Shett - I was half-convinced this guy also had a relative on the wall, because his name (insulting pun aside) seems to be a reference to Chett, the prologue POV of ASOS who had a grudge against Jon for losing him his position as one of Maester Aemon’s stewards in favour of Sam

Ser Targon the Halfwild - Jon will likely be half-wild when he comes back from the dead, but he’s already been described as ‘half a wildling’ multiple times. Also Targon = Targ-Jon?

Ser Roland and Ser Wallace Waynwood - both are described earlier in the chapter as long-faced with brown hair, which are also Stark features. Alayne thinks of them as “horsefaced”, probably an Arya reference that also calls back to her and Jon’s shared Stark look. Wallace is even the same age as Robb, and thus Jon, would be.

So though Jon wasn’t mentioned by name in the chapter, I think he was very present... not just lemoncake-wise ;)

Thank you! :D Haha for a moment there I was like...wait which meta? Had to take my mind back for a sec there because I've written quite a bit since then! But yeah, doing deep dives into certain chapters is really fun — my next one that's in the works is Jon XI in A Dance With Dragons. Great to hear you enjoyed my Winds one :)

Ooooh that is really interesting and a mighty fine catch! Definitely the vibe I got whilst reading that chapter, after having analysed Alayne II, AFFC (which chronologically precedes it), is that Jon's presence or references to him are made subtly throughout the chapter(s) — especially whenever Winterfell is alluded to because Jon is the "Snow of Wintefell", the "blood of Winterfell", etc. But also vice versa, Sansa is very much connected to Winterfell in Jon's chapters as well — "Winterfell belongs to my sister, Sansa."

But let's take a look at those names you listed below the cut! Big post ahead, so buckle up kids!

So, I hadn't noticed the significance of those names on my reading, but I can well believe what you're suggesting because it plays very much into how I interpreted the subconscious goings on of that chapter — that you have these rememberances/reminders of Winterfell and Sansa's Stark idenity at crucial moments within the chapter’s narrative pacing, especially prior to moments with Harry the Heir. Not to sound too crass, but it's sort like a marking of territory, and this is made even stronger by that goddamn phallic as hell Giant's Lance lemoncake (aka Jon's peen). It's all quite neatly buried, but when you start matching up the imagery...I mean, I guess wolves are territorial beasts, so...checks out? (George...why are you like this?)

It is interesting that we get that iconic entrance of the Giant's Lance lemoncake prior to these dance partners, i.e. a claim has been staked essentially, and it ain't from Littlefinger, which is what could be interpreted on first inspection. And let's not beat around the bush, as uncomfortable as it is (because Sansa is ONLY 13/14!!), this is a sexual claim being made owing to the phallic symbolism and the general tone of the chapter being about Alayne's betrothal/marriage:

And best of all, Lord Nestor’s cooks prepared a splendid subtlety, a lemon cake in the shape of the Giant’s Lance, twelve feet tall and adorned with an Eyrie made of sugar.

For me, Alayne thought, as they wheeled it out.

I legit just snorted re-reading this: "splendid subtlety" MY ASS! What follows is a whole lot of gift-giving, which come to think of it, in combination with this bloody big cake...well, it reads quite a bit like a wedding breakfast to me, followed by dancing, in addition to a possible nod to a Stark bridal cloak, masked by the Arryn colours:

There were gifts as well, splendid gifts. Each of the competitors received a cloak of cloth-of-silver and a lapis brooch in the shape of a pair of falcon’s wings. Fine steel daggers were given to the brothers, fathers, and friends who had come to watch them tilt. For their mothers, sisters, and ladies fair there were bolts of silk and Myrish lace.

Because if we compare this "cloak of cloth-of-silver" with previous descriptions of Sansa's maiden cloak, we see this obvious recurring inclusion of either silver or grey as one of the Stark colours:

Cersei Lannister ignored the question. "The cloak," she commanded, and the women brought it out: a long cloak of white velvet heavy with pearls. A fierce direwolf was embroidered upon it in silver thread. Sansa looked at it with sudden dread. "Your father's colors," said Cersei, as they fastened it about her neck with a slender silver chain.

A maiden's cloak. Sansa's hand went to her throat. She would have torn the thing away if she had dared. – ASOS, Sansa III

"[...] and when they come together for his wedding, and you come out with your long auburn hair, clad in a maiden's cloak of white and grey with a direwolf emblazoned on the back...why, every knight in the Vale will pledge his sword to win you back your birthright [...]" – AFFC, Alayne II

This is all very in keeping with the theme of the chapter, which is meeting Alayne's betrothed, Harrold Hardyng, so obviously a future marriage/alliance is very much a prevalent theme here. Furthermore, the mention of "Myrish lace" for the "ladies fair" does somewhat remind me of Alys Karstark's wedding garb:

The girl smiled in a way that reminded Jon so much of his little sister that it almost broke his heart. "Let him be scared of me." The snowflakes were melting on her cheeks, but her hair was wrapped in a swirl of lace that Satin had found somewhere, and the snow had begun to collect there, giving her a frosty crown. Her cheeks were flushed and red, and her eyes sparkled.

"Winter's lady." Jon squeezed her hand. – ADWD, Jon X

I think some other people have mentioned before how even though Jon makes a conscious comparison between Arya and Alys — "reminded Jon so much of his little sister" — the romanticised, flushed cheeked imagery very much points towards a subconsious allusion to Sansa (ETA: anyone spoken on this got a link?). With that in mind, we could see this as foreshadowing of not only Jonsa, but a Jonsa wedding, and Sansa as Queen in the North — "a frosty crown" "Winter's lady" — with Jon as her king/consort. In my current Jon chapter analysis I've been working with the idea that actually as soon as Jon starts romanticising a girl, which is notably different from just noticing someone's physical beauty (e.g. with Val), that is when the subconscious comparisons to Sansa really jump out.

But anyway! Onto those names...or rather, Jon Snow stand-ins.

Rising, [Ben Coldwater] offered Alayne his hand. “Would you honor me with this dance, my lady?”

“You’re very kind,” she said, as he led her to the floor.

He was her first partner of the evening, but far from the last. Just as Petyr had promised, the young knights flocked around her, vying for her favor. After Ben came Andrew Tollett, handsome Ser Byron, red-nosed Ser Morgarth, and Ser Shadrich the Mad Mouse. Then Ser Albar Royce, Myranda’s stout dull brother and Lord Nestor’s heir. She danced with all three Sunderlands, none of whom had webs between their fingers, though she could not vouch for their toes. Uther Shett appeared to pay her slimy compliments as he trod upon her feet, but Ser Targon the Halfwild proved to be the soul of courtesy. After that Ser Roland Waynwood swept her up and made her laugh with mocking comments about half the other knights in the hall. His uncle Wallace took a turn as well and tried to do the same, but the words would not come. Alayne finally took pity on him and began to chatter happily, to spare him the embarrassment. When the dance was done she excused herself, and went back to her place to have a drink of wine.

And there he stood, Harry the Heir himself; tall, handsome, scowling. “Lady Alayne. May I partner you in this dance?”

She considered for a moment. “No. I don’t think so.”

If I've counted that right, that's 14 men? Alright, here we go.

First up...Ben Coldwater

I think you're right that Ben Coldwater feels very much like a nod to Ben-jen Stark, who is referred to as Ben a few times I think, and Jon Snow (cold water = snow), both men of the Night's Watch. House Coldwater also traces its lineage back to the First Men, and are sworn to House Royce, who are also notably descended from the First Men, have previously married into the Stark family and still maintain close connections to the current house through Ned's fosterage in the Vale. So, through the Royces, we see another possible connection to the Starks and Jon Snow...Jon Snow who was named after Jon Arryn.

I would also add that we have Ben make this inquiry prior to his dance with Alayne:

“Are there no singers?” asked Ben Coldwater.

I don't know, maybe I'm reaching but...singers feature quite a lot in connection to Jon, for instance:

Mance Rayder, who infiltrates Winterfell disguised as a singer called Abel, an anagram of Bael, aka Bael the Bard;

Bael the Bard and the Blue Rose of Winterfell — a story told to Jon by Ygritte, which very much evokes the tale of Rhaegar and Lyanna;

Rhaegar Targaryen, Jon's real father, was a notably skilled lyre player, whose singing supposedly made Lyanna cry — "The dragon prince sang a song so sad it made the wolf maid sniffle," (ASOS, Bran II). He is also theorised to have written the song Jenny of Oldstones, possibly for the Ghost of High Heart, Jenny's friend.

Ygritte — when Jon starts to find her more attractive, when he starts to romanticise her, he observes that "sometimes she sang in a low husky voice that stirred him," (ASOS, Jon II).

Val — again, we start to see Jon begin to warm to Val, to see her in more of a romantic + typically feminine light, because of her singing to the baby Monster: "I have heard you singing to him," (ADWD, Jon VIII).

Sansa — oh, my sweet Sansa...when remembering his family, not quite in his dying moments, but a little bit prior to that, Jon thinks "Of Sansa, brushing out Lady's coat and singing to herself. You know nothing, Jon Snow," (ADWD, Jon XIII).

I think it's clear that Jon loves a good song and you know what? He'd probably be asking about the lack of singers too! One final detail perhaps worth noting is the seat of House Coldwater:

[...] the Coldwaters of Coldwater Burn [...] – TWOIAF, The Vale

Obviously, the "song of ice and fire" is not a person, but more the elemental and destructive forces of the Others and the dragons, yet nevertheless, through Jon's parentage, as well as his actions (burned hand, etc.), plus his personality to a certain extent (hot-headed then repressing emotions) you do have this duality of hot and cold, of fire and ice...Coldwater Burn? Could be something.

Ser Andrew Tollett

So, like you said, the name Tollett immediately puts us in mind of Eddison Tollett, also known as Dolorous Edd, who is like Jon, a black brother of the Night's Watch. And he is a good brother to Jon, voting for him in the election for the Lord Commander, as well as becoming his loyal steward for a time, before being sent on a mission to Long Barrow. Interestingly, Dolorous Edd, as well as the Tolletts in general, do have a bit of a Stark vibe to them...

Like a typical Stark, Dolorous Edd is described as having a "long face" (ACOK, Jon III), a face like a mule's to be exact, but also notably a horse's as well:

"[...] Me, I have the mules. Nettles claims we're kin. It's true we have the same long face, but I'm not near as stubborn [...]" – ADWD, Jon XII

He only wished he had time to kill Tollett as well. Gloomy horsefaced fool, that's what he is. – ASOS, Prologue

He is given the nickname Dolorous Edd (dolorous = mournful), and is referred to several times as being "dour" (ACOK, Jon II, Jon III, ASOS, Jon V, ADWD, Jon XII, XIII), an attribute not entirely out of place when we consider some notable Starks and their disposition, as well as their house words:

He had the Stark face if not the name: long, solemn, guarded, a face that gave nothing away. – AGOT, Tyrion II

Winter is coming. The Stark words had never sounded so grim or ominous to Jon as they did now. – AGOT, Jon VIII

I gave my maidenhood to this solemn stranger and sent him off to his war and his king and the woman who bore him his bastard, because I always did my duty. – ACOK, Catelyn VI

Ned was shorter and plainer of face, and so somber. He spoke courteously enough, but beneath the words she sensed a coolness that was all at odds with Brandon, whose mirths had been as wild as his rages [...] And after the war, at Winterfell, I had love enough for any woman, once I found the good sweet heart beneath Ned's solemn face. – ASOS, Catelyn V

So, not unlike Jon, Arya and Ned, Dolorous Edd has a "long and solemn" face (AGOT, Arya I), as well as a "dour" personality. Furthermore, even House Tollet of Grey Glen's sigil and words have Stark vibes, since according to semi-canon sources, their shield is "pily grey and black" and their words are "When all is darkest," which arguably carries the same ominous, Long Night warning of "Winter is coming". In addition to this, like the Coldwaters, the Tollets are sworn to the First Men descended Royces.

But beyond this, if we take a look at some legendary and historical Tolletts...we actually have two notable names:

Torgold Tollett — also known as Torgold the Grim, though ironically, because he was famous for riding into battle laughing, and naked from the waist up:

The songs say that Torgold knew no fear and felt no pain. Though bleeding from a score of wounds, he cut a red swathe through Lord Redfort's staunchest warriors, then took his lordship's arm off at the shoulder with a single cut. Nor was he dismayed when the sorceress Ursula Upcliff appeared upon a bloodred horse to curse him. By then he was bare-handed, having left both of his axes buried in a foe's chest, but the singers say he leapt upon the witch's horse, grasped her face between two bloody hands, and tore her head from her shoulders as she screamed for succor. – TWOIAF, The Vale

Ser Jon Tollett — In Fire & Blood, Jon Tollett is recorded as a member of King Maegor the Cruel's Kingsguard. After the king's mysterious death, his successor, King Jaeherys I, offered Maegor's surviving Kingsguard a choice between execution or taking the black. Jon Tollett chose the latter. This somewhat parallels Ned's decision to take the black, to a certain extent.

You could argue that there are more than a few similarities, or future foreshadowings, between these Tolletts and Jon Snow...

Ser Byron the Beautiful

Like you mentioned, Jon Snow has been described by GRRM as a "Byronic, romantic hero". I'm so annoyed with myself, because I had written up some good stuff on how Jon really does possess certain Byronic traits but as I was inserting a gif it ended up deleting most of what I wrote...so I'm still a bit bitter over that, but will rewrite it at some point soon. Take my word for it though, Jon Snow is 100% more of a Byronic Hero (a la Byron's own Manfred), than Sandor Clegane, for example:

GRRM: “Well who wouldn’t want to be Jon Snow — the brooding, Byronic, romantic hero whom all the girls love.” [source]

Ser Byron, as well as being described as beautiful, is also notably very gallant, the perfect knight:

"Dutiful and beautiful," said an elegant young knight whose thick blond mane cascaded down well past his shoulders. – AFFC, Alayne II

We all know that Sansa appreciates a bit of genuine courtesy, and in fact, she's taught Jon well in that regard:

"Gilly, he called me. For the gillyflower."

"That's pretty." He remembered Sansa telling him once that he should say that whenever a lady told him her name. He could not help the girl, but perhaps the courtesy would please her. – ACOK, Jon III

I think this Jon stand-in does rely mostly on Jon's connection to the Byronic Hero. So, if anyone is still a bit dubious on that (because Rochester and Heathcliff are trash), just hang in there for my eventual meta on the subject, which focuses on Lord Byron's OG Byronic Hero, rather than the later Brontë/Victorian iterations.

In fact, in terms of Jon's parentage and future romance with Sansa, there's one Byronic tale that may be a particular source of inspiration — The Bride of Abydos. This poem notably includes a romance in which half-siblings are revealed to be cousins...sound familiar?

Ser Morgarth the Merry

Another hedge knight, like Ser Byron, who is sworn into the service of Petyr Baelish. I've got to agree with you here, red-nosed Ser Morgarth's connection to Jon is quite a bit harder to decipher! I have done a little digging though, and it is possible that the Garth in Morgarth is a reference to several Garths that appear in Jon's chapters, as well as Garth Greenhand, the alleged ancestor of legendary House Stark founder...Brandon the Builder:

Garth of Oldtown

Garth of Greenaway

Garth Greyfeather

All of these Garths are rangers/members of the Night's Watch at the same time as Jon, though I think by Dance it is presumed that they are all dead, or at least missing — in fact, Garth of Greenaway kills Garth of Oldtown. Garth on Garth violence!!

Haha, oh god...I think I just got the pun...Morgarth = More Garth! More Garths the merrier! Get it?! More Garths everybody!

George, I hate you.

Ok, so that's what that is. It's literally just a dumb pun, yet it also connects Morgarth to the Night's Watch Garths, and therefore Jon.

Ser Shadrich the Mad Mouse

I think you're right that Ser Shadrich's presence connects us to Brienne's quest, as well as foreshadowing potential shit hitting the fan at the tourney of the Winged Knights. But he also notably makes some interesting remarks, both to Brienne and Sansa, which we can connect to Jon Snow's secret Targaryen heritage:

"Where?" Brienne slapped another silver stag down.

He flicked the coin back at her with his forefinger. "Someplace no stag ever found...though a dragon might." – AFFC, Brienne III

On the surface, in response to Brienne's questioning about the whereabouts of the Stark sisters, Shadrich is talking about a monetary bribe. However, beneath that explicit meaning, is an implicit reference to a stag (Joffrey) failing, where a dragon (Jon) will succeed. Others have talked about this line in more detail elsewhere, but it seems like a pretty good allusion to the foils, Joffrey (a prince who is really a bastard) and Jon (a bastard who is really a prince).

In this exact Winds chapter, however, we also see a conversation between Alayne and Shadrich, which hints at his possible plans to uncover and abduct Sansa Stark in return for a lucrative reward:

“A good melee is all a hedge knight can hope for, unless he stumbles on a bag of dragons. And that’s not likely, is it?”

This "stumbl[ing] on a bag of dragons" could also be seen as an implicit nod towards stumbling upon Jon's Targaryen heritage later in the novel, something that is more "likely" than anyone would expect. That claim might be a reach, were it not for the implication that when Shadrich talks about money, i.e. dragons...he isn't actually talking about gold coins, he's talking about Targaryens, but more than that...he's talking specifically about Jon Snow.

Ser Albar Royce

"Myranda’s stout dull brother and Lord Nestor’s heir." I think like Ser Morgarth, the physical appearance of these stand-ins doesn't always play a factor, because it would be kind of unnerving if they all had solemn long faces... So, what is important here is, like you say, the name Royce and his relation to Ser Waymar Royce, Sansa's first crush, who just happens to resemble and parallels Jon quite a bit:

She had fallen wildly in love with Ser Waymar, she remembered dimly, but that was a lifetime ago, when she was a stupid little girl. – AFFC, Alayne I

Ser Waymar Royce was the youngest son of an ancient house with too many heirs. He was a handsome youth of eighteen, grey-eyed and graceful and slender as a knife. Mounted on his huge black destrier, the knight towered above Will and Gared on their smaller garrons. He wore black leather boots, black woolen pants, black moleskin gloves, and a fine supple coat of gleaming black ringmail over layers of black wool and boiled leather. Ser Waymar had been a Sworn Brother of the Night's Watch for less than half a year, but no one could say he had not prepared for his vocation. At least insofar as his wardrobe was concerned. – AGOT, Prologue

Jon's eyes were a grey so dark they seemed almost black, but there was little they did not see. He was of an age with Robb, but they did not look alike. Jon was slender where Robb was muscular, dark where Robb was fair, graceful and quick where his half brother was strong and fast. – AGOT, Bran I

"They're not my brothers," Jon snapped. "They hate me because I'm better than they are." – AGOT, Jon III

Although, it is worth noting that the Royces, as a whole, do somewhat resemble the Starks in appearance, at least in terms of their eye colour:

Bronze Yohn Royce, the current head of House Royce of Runestone, has "slate-grey eyes" as well as a "solemn face", (AFFC, Alayne I).

Ser Robar, his second son was "comely in a rough-hewn way" (ACOK, Catelyn III), with "pale" eyes (ACOK, Catelyn IV), possibly grey like his father's.

Ser Waymar, Yohn's third son, as mentioned, was "grey-eyed" (AGOT, Prologue).

It isn't as clear whether or not their cadet branch, which Albar belongs to, tend towards grey eyes as well, though we know that Myranda has brown hair, specifically "thick chestnut curls" (AFFC, Alayne II) — typical looking Starks, like Ned, Arya, and Jon, all have brown/dark hair.

As previously mentioned, the Royces are also descended from the First Men, have kinship links to the Starks, knew Ned when he fostered in the Vale, and Bronze Yohn even "knows" Sansa Stark:

"Bronze Yohn knows me," she reminded him. "He was a guest at Winterfell when his son rode north to take the black." She had fallen wildly in love with Ser Waymar, she remembered dimly, but that was a lifetime ago, when she was a stupid little girl. "And that was not the only time. Lord Royce saw...he saw Sansa Stark again at King's Landing, during the Hand's tourney." – AFFC, Alayne I

His seamed and solemn face brought back all of Sansa's memories of his time at Winterfell. She remembered him at table, speaking quietly with her mother. She heard his voice booming off the walls when he rode back from a hunt with a buck behind his saddle. She could see him in the yard, a practice sword in hand, hammering her father to the ground and turning to defeat Ser Rodrik as well. He will know me. How could he not? She considered throwing herself at his feet to beg for his protection. He never fought for Robb, why should he fight for me? The war is finished and Winterfell is fallen. "Lord Royce," she asked timidly, "will you have a cup of wine, to take the chill off?"

Bronze Yohn had slate-grey eyes, half-hidden beneath the bushiest eyebrows she had ever seen. They crinkled when he looked down at her. "Do I know you, girl?" – AFFC, Alayne I

They also have the house words "We will remember", which somewhat evokes the recurring refrain "the north remembers" (ASOS, Catelyn, ADWD, Davos IV, ADWD, A Ghost in Winterfell, TWOW, Theon I), as well as a possible remembrance of the Long Night, similar to the Starks’ and Tolletts’ words. All in all, as well as evoking a certain Starkness (and Jon-ness), the Royces seem set up to be staunch allies of the Starks going forward.

All Three Sunderlands

Since these Sunderland brothers aren't given names, we can assume what is significant about them, in relation to Jon and Sansa, is their Sunderland name. As you noted, the Sunderlands are the reigning lords of the Three Sisters, and in Dance, through Davos' pov, we hear about Ned's time there during Robert's Rebellion:

"At the dawn of Robert's Rebellion. The Mad King had sent to the Eyrie for Stark's head, but Jon Arryn sent him back defiance. Gulltown stayed loyal to the throne, though. To get home and call his banners, Stark had to cross the mountains to the Fingers and find a fisherman to carry him across the Bite. A storm caught them on the way. The fisherman drowned, but his daughter got Stark to the Sisters before the boat went down. They say he left her with a bag of silver and a bastard in her belly. Jon Snow, she named him, after Arryn.

"Be that as it may. My father sat where I sit now when Lord Eddard came to Sisterton. Our maester urged us to send Stark's head to Aerys, to prove our loyalty. It would have meant a rich reward. The Mad King was open-handed with them as pleased him. By then we knew that Jon Arryn had taken Gulltown, though. Robert was the first man to gain the wall, and slew Marq Grafton with his own hand. 'This Baratheon is fearless,' I said. 'He fights the way a king should fight.' Our maester chuckled at me and told us that Prince Rhaegar was certain to defeat this rebel. That was when Stark said, 'In this world only winter is certain. We may lose our heads, it's true…but what if we prevail?' My father sent him on his way with his head still on his shoulders. 'If you lose,' he told Lord Eddard, 'you were never here.' " – ADWD, Davos I

This passage has one of my favourite asoiaf quotes of all time..."In this world only winter is certain. We may lose our heads, it's true...but what if we prevail?" Truly iconic. So defiantly hopeful.

But, yes, you're right that this story, and the Sunderlands, connects us to Ned, but more importantly...to Jon Snow. Really, Jon has quite a few Vale connections, all things considered, and he is named after Jon Arryn after all!

Uther Shett

Well, along with his buddy Ossifer Lipps (ass for lips), Uther Shett (utter shit) is an example of George having some pretty lowbrow fun with punny names. During their dance, Uther paid Alayne "slimy compliments as he trod upon her feet"...so not the best partner!

But from one shit to another...I think you're probably right that Uther Shett is meant to recall Chett, indeed, if we take a look at his description in Winds:

The one on her left was no more than eighteen, and skinny as a spear. His ginger-colored whiskers only partially served to disguise the angry red pimples that dotted his face.

His bad skin is somewhat comparable to Chett's boils:

Chett had a wen on his neck the size of a pigeon's egg, and a face red with boils and pimples. Perhaps that was why he always seemed so angry. – AGOT, Jon V

What is also noteworthy about Chett's prologue pov in ASOS, is that we get this linking of literal snow and Jon Snow:

Snow was falling.

He could feel tears freezing to his cheeks. It isn't fair, he wanted to scream. Snow would ruin everything he'd worked for, all his careful plans. It was a heavy fall, thick white flakes coming down all about him [...] The snow's taken it all from me...the bloody snow...

Snow had ruined him once before. Snow and his pet pig. – ASOS, Prologue

This makes any mention of snow beyond this point a bit more noteworthy, especially since Jon is referred to as "the Snow of Winterfell," (ASOS, Jon I), and we also have Sansa's famous "drifting snowflakes brushed her face as light as lover's kisses" whilst building Winterfell out of snow scene, also in ASOS, (Sansa VII). So, Chett is very important when it comes to establishing this connection.

Ser Targon the Halfwild

Targon is only mentioned once and it is in that list of dance partners. He's not connected to any particular house, all we know of him is that he is a knight and that he "proved to be the soul of courtesy." This detail is interesting because it sort goes against his "Halfwild" moniker — he is courteous in spite of his half-wildness. Likewise, Jon is also courteous, chivalrous and knightly even, in spite of the stigma attached to being a bastard:

They still think me a turncloak. That was a bitter draft to drink, but Jon could not blame them. He was a bastard, after all. Everyone knew that bastards were wanton and treacherous by nature, having been born of lust and deceit. And he had made as many enemies as friends at Castle Black...Rast, for one. Jon had once threatened to have Ghost rip his throat out unless he stopped tormenting Samwell Tarly, and Rast did not forget things like that. – ASOS, Jon VII

As mentioned in comparison to Ser Byron, Jon behaves courteously towards Gilly, calling her name "pretty", just as Sansa taught him. He also often refers to Val as "my lady" despite her being a proud woman of the Free Folk. Jon also clearly looks up to and wishes to emulate legendary knights to a certain extent, and behaving with courtesy and honour is very much part of that:

They were not little boys when they fought, but knights and mighty heroes. "I'm Prince Aemon the Dragonknight," Jon would call out, and Robb would shout back, "Well, I'm Florian the Fool." Or Robb would say, "I'm the Young Dragon," and Jon would reply, "I'm Ser Ryam Redwyne." – ASOS, Jon XII

Furthermore, Jon has this connection to the Free Folk, also known as the wildlings, having spent a fair amount of time with them:

"The wildling blood is the blood of the First Men, the same blood that flows in the veins of the Starks [...]" – ASOS, Jon I

"Some of your own Sworn Brothers would have me believe that you are half a wildling yourself. Is it true?" – ADWD, Jon IV

Mully cleared his throat. "M'lord? The wildling princess, letting her go, the men may say—"

"—that I am half a wildling myself, a turncloak who means to sell the realm to our raiders, cannibals, and giants." Jon did not need to stare into a fire to know what was being said of him. The worst part was, they were not wrong, not wholly. "Words are wind, and the wind is always blowing at the Wall. Come." – ADWD, Jon VIII

"A wildling. A filthy, murdering wildling." Cregan's hands closed into fists. The gloves that covered them were leather, lined with fur to match the cloak that hung matted and stiff from his broad shoulders. His black wool surcoat was emblazoned with the white sunburst of his house. "I see what you are, Snow. Half a wolf and half a wildling, baseborn get of a traitor and a whore. You would deliver a highborn maid to the bed of some stinking savage. Did you sample her yourself first?" He laughed. "If you mean to kill me, do it and be damned for a kinslayer. Stark and Karstark are one blood."

"My name is Snow." – ADWD, Jon X

I am not the trusting fool you take me for...nor am I half wildling, no matter what you believe. – ADWD, Jon XI

If Stark blood is also essentially wildling blood, and Jon is half Stark on his mother's side...that would make him "Halfwild" in blood as well as in spirit. And like you said, Targon feels very close to Targaryen/Targ-Jon. So this name is there solely as a hint towards Jon's true parentage — half Targaryen and half Stark. But I think you could argue that the "Halfwild" element could allude to Jon's post-resurrection state as well. I do personally like the idea of Feral Jon™.

Ser Roland & Ser Wallace Waynwood

Like the Royces, and Dolorous Edd, the Waynwoods also bear some notable Stark physical traits, as noted by Myranda in this chapter:

“The first Lady Waynwood must have been a mare, I think. How else to explain why all the Waynwood men are horse-faced? [...]"

As we know, looking horse-faced, or in Edd's case, mule-faced, indicates a rather long visage:

Arya took after their lord father. Her hair was a lusterless brown, and her face was long and solemn. Jeyne used to call her Arya Horseface, and neigh whenever she came near. – AGOT, Arya I

[Arya] even looked like Jon, with the long face and brown hair of the Starks, and nothing of their lady mother in her face or her coloring. – AGOT, Sansa I

Interestingly though, Jon is never referred to as being called horse-faced, although we know he has a long Stark face. You'd think that Chett, in the ASOS Prologue would have made that kind of dig, since he says as much about Dolorous Edd? This is why I tentatively believe that, although long-faced, Jon isn't as apparently "homely" as these Stark looking Waynwood brothers:

Ser Roland was the oldest of the three, though no more than five-and-twenty. He was taller and more muscular than Ser Wallace, but both were long-faced and lantern-jawed, with stringy brown hair and pinched noses. Horsefaced and homely, Alayne thought.

That being said, I don't think he's as "handsome" as Ser Waymar Royce, or "beautiful" like Ser Byron. But obviously, he's got something going for him because as GRRM says "all the girls love" him, and you know, he's got a good bod probably and if the Giant's Lance cake is anything to go by, as well as all Tormund's small penis jokes...um, well, maybe he's packing, I don't know! (Don't look at me like that guys...it's GRRM not me!)

But anyway! Like you said, Ser Wallace Waynwood is even of an age with Robb, and therefore also Jon:

Robb would be his age, if he were still alive, she could not help but think, but Robb died a king, and this is just a boy.

There is also a teeny bit of Stark blood, though obviously potent stuff, in the mix with those Waynwoods:

"No," Catelyn agreed. "You must name another heir, until such time as Jeyne gives you a son." She considered a moment. "Your father's father had no siblings, but his father had a sister who married a younger son of Lord Raymar Royce, of the junior branch. They had three daughters, all of whom wed Vale lordlings. A Waynwood and a Corbray, for certain. The youngest...it might have been a Templeton, but..."

"Mother." There was a sharpness in Robb's tone. "You forget. My father had four sons." – ASOS, Catelyn V

Shit — "all of whom wed Vale lordlings" — that's probably where all these Stark looking mother fudgers are coming from. So, all in all, I think there's some strong parallels.

And finally...Ser Harrold Hardyng

But let's not forget this bitch.

And there he stood, Harry the Heir himself; tall, handsome, scowling. “Lady Alayne. May I partner you in this dance?”

She considered for a moment. “No. I don’t think so.”

Prior to Harry, who notably fits into the Ashford pattern of Sansa's suitors, we have all these Jon stand-ins, or references to Jon. We can actually separate them out into their different functions, though there is some overlap with Andrew Tollett:

Those who reference Jon's Starkness/the Stark Look™:

Andrew Tollett

Albar Royce

Roland Waynwood

Wallace Waynwood

Those who reference his position/location at the Night's Watch:

Because in the Alayne chapter prior to this one, Sansa learns that Jon has been made Lord Commander:

[..] Oh, and the Night’s Watch has a boy commander, some bastard son of Eddard Stark’s.” “Jon Snow?” she blurted out, surprised. “Snow? Yes, it would be Snow, I suppose.” – AFFC, Alayne II

So, it is interesting that you then have a number of dance partners connected to members of the Watch:

Ben Coldwater

Andrew Tollett

Morgarth the Merry

Uther Shett

This could be read as foreshadowing for Sansa's future journey north, and specifically to the Wall, where she believes Jon to be.

Those who reference his true/uncertain parentage:

Byron the Beautiful

Shadrich the Mad Mouse

The Three Sunderlands

Targon the Halfwild

All these guys get a dance, but when Harry asks? He is denied. It is only after some A+ dragging by Alayne, and begging by Harry that the latter gets his dance. Yet don't be fooled into thinking this is a win for Harrold:

"Should we ever wed, you'll have to send Saffron back to her father. I’ll be all the spice you’ll want."

He grinned. "I will hold you to that promise, my lady. Until that day, may I wear your favor in the tourney?"

"You may not. It is promised to… another." She was not sure who as yet, but she knew she would find someone.

First off, we have this reminder of the betrothal, but there is a lack of certainty there — "should we wed" — and I would argue that's because...they ain't gonna. Remember all that wedding breakfast imagery, including an umcomfortably phallic lemon (wedding) cake, gift-giving and nod to a bridal cloak? Remember how that was followed by several dances with Jon stand-ins?

"[...] It is promised to… another."

Oh, I wonder who that could be? Honestly...GRRM has very clearly, for those who care to really look, stated someone else's claim here, and it ain't Harry's. In fact, it is the very same person who also evokes Valarr Targaryen in the Ashford pattern.

...it's our boi, Jon Snow.

“Jon Snow?” she blurted out, surprised.

“Snow? Yes, it would be Snow, I suppose.” – AFFC, Alayne II

You "suppose", Myranda? Honey, I'm certain.

[makerkenzie]

Sansa learns the limits of Family.

An idea that keeps coming up in Sansa’s arc is what I describe as: “Family is not destiny.”

Does Sansa love her family? Of course. She loves them, she misses them, she will always regret not having more time with her mother and Robb. 

Westeros is a setting in which politics are tangled up with family dynamics. A noble family represents power as much as it represents love. Members of noble families, especially children, are treated as assets of their Houses before they’re seen as individuals. Examples: any noble marriage ever, fosterage, squiring, service, hostage-taking, and expectations of combat service. 

Sansa knows this; she’s lived it. Her marriage to Joffrey would’ve represented an alliance with House Baratheon and, because we’re talking about the royal family, it would’ve given House Stark much more influence on the governance of the realm. Her being kept as hostage was meant to affect her brother’s political ambitions. Her marriage to Tyrion was supposed to put House Stark’s assets under the Lannisters’ control. She grew up with Theon as a de facto sibling but his purpose in the Starks’ household was to keep his father under control. 

In this system, the family determines the individual’s reputation. Individuals from more powerful Houses are generally treated with more deference and generosity than those from poorer and lower-positioned Houses. From the perspective of a noble child, individuals from the “right” Houses are to be trusted and those from the “wrong” Houses are to be regarded with the most uncharitable assumptions.

In the culture of Westerosi nobility, one is viewed by one’s surname, first, and one’s actions...later. 

As the child of a Paramount-level family---especially, having grown up with loving parents and affectionate siblings---it would be understandable if Sansa bought into this culture. Her own mother’s House motto is “Family, Duty, Honor.” It would be understandable if Sansa were inclined to conflate family ties with one’s sense of duty and honor, and assume everyone else did the same. 

Having been forcibly separated from her family for so long, while kept hostage by people who don’t care to make her feel safe and welcome...it would be understandable if Sansa became more entrenched in the belief of surname as a representation of character.

She’s going in the opposite direction.

Sansa has interacted enough with the royal family to see that they are not a monolith. The non-viability of her marriage to Tyrion is a separate issue from his behavior. When Aunt Lysa asks, Sansa recalls Tyrion as...kind. 

She knows Podrick Payne is related to Ilyn Payne and she doesn’t hold that against him. He’s a nice kid trying to survive in the Red Keep and he didn’t ask to be born into the same House as the official headsman. 

In an early chapter in AGOT, King Robert is making a loud drunken scene at Cersei, and Jaime is the only man there who tries to get him to settle down. Even after Robert knocks him on his ass, he keeps his cool. This is in Sansa’s POV. Contrast that with Ser Barristan, and Renly, and oh, all the other men at the feast who could have intervened, and didn’t. 

When Joffrey was having his Kingsguard knights beat her, Tyrion was the one who put a stop to it, and Sandor Clegane--a kingsguard at that point--used his cloak to cover her. This happens in front of the court in the throne room. Tyrion’s move is the bolder one but Sandor’s kindness is still meaningful. By putting that cloak on Sansa’s body, he is quietly showing the court that he sympathizes with the Stark girl, not the king. Later, he rescues Sansa from the mob in Flea Bottom, and not on Joffrey’s orders. She remembers Sandor coming to her aid. Meanwhile his older brother is leading the Lannister troops’ invasion of the Riverlands. Sandor is nothing like his brother and Sansa knows that. 

She knows Tyrion is not like Cersei. Tommen is not like Joffrey. Podrick is not like Ser Ilyn. Jaime is not like the other Kingsguard. Sandor is not like his brother, not like the other Lannister vassals, not like the other Kingsguard, either. 

Either way, Littlefinger takes her out of the Red Keep and up to Aunt Lysa and Cousin Robin at the Eyrie. It’s the first time she’s been around blood relations since her father was executed. First of all, Aunt Lysa starts talking about marrying Sansa to Robin, which, first of all, yuck, and second: because Lysa is the only adult family member presently available to Sansa, she’s not really in a position to refuse. Anyway, because Sansa can’t catch a break from people trying to plant their flags on her ass, Littlefinger starts molesting her. Aunt Lysa, being the nearest equivalent to a parent in Sansa’s life...treats her like a homewrecker.

Aunt Lysa was born into House Tully, the one whose motto is “Family, Duty, Honor.” When she sees her new husband behaving inappropriately with her teenage niece, she tries to toss the girl out the Moon Door. Is that what Family-Duty-Honor looks like? Granted, Lord Hoster fucked up with Lysa pretty hard, but there’s no need to take that out on your sister’s daughter. 

Now this much is bad enough: Sansa’s own aunt is trying to kill her out of jealousy. There’s that. The much bigger issue is where the conversation goes as Littlefinger talks Lysa down from the literal and figurative ledge. She mentions that she killed her first husband, Hand of the King Lord Jon Arryn, using the poison Littlefinger gave her. She wrote to Catelyn, at Littlefinger’s instructions, and told her the Lannisters killed Jon. 

If we recall: Ned and Cat spent all of AGOT trying to prove the Lannisters killed Jon Arryn. The fallout from that investigation started the War of Five Kings and cost Ned his life. Because of that fallout, Sansa was held hostage at the Red Keep and forced into marriage with Tyrion. Because of that fallout, Cat and Robb have just been murdered at the Red Wedding and Arya is off who knows where doing Seven only knows what. Far as Sansa knows, her brothers Bran and Rickon were killed by Theon Greyjoy and she has no way of knowing Arya is even alive. Aunt Lysa is the only family member left in a position to take care of Sansa now, because of the war she and Littlefinger started. 

In more news of Littlefinger’s machinations: because he conspired with the Tyrells to frame Tyrion for Joffrey’s murder, Sansa’s life at the Red Keep went from uncomfortable to untenable, with Littlefinger being the only one ready to rescue her. She’s dependent on him because of his political sabotage, so now he’s molesting her at her aunt’s house, and her aunt has to be coaxed and cajoled out of killing her. 

It’s because of Littlefinger’s machinations that the Lannisters became the Starks’ enemies. Granted there’s no version of this story in which the AGOT-era Starks and Lannisters are buddies, but there could’ve been a story where they haven’t been actively trying to kill each other. 

Sansa’s been places and met people enough to know the Lannisters are not consistently villainous and her own family are not reliably safe. 

Unbeknownst to her Sansa (yet), Tyrion’s squire Podrick Payne is traveling around with a big warrior-lady carrying a Lannister-branded Valyrian steel sword. A gift from Jaime Lannister. Cersei’s twin brother, and the one man with the backbone to ask the drunken king to stop embarrassing himself. Unbeknownst to Sansa, Ser Jaime has just deserted his army because he’s helping Brienne and Podrick rescue Sansa out from under Cersei. 

They have this assignment because Catelyn stepped away from her animosity to the Lannisters for a moment long enough to give Ser Jaime a chance to do the right thing. That Jaime is rejecting the Lannister regime in favor of Stark-Tully interests has a lot to do with Brienne’s influence, while the likely success of their mission will probably have to do with Sansa’s conduct at the Red Keep. It’s Podrick Payne who’ll recognize Sansa with her hair dyed brown, and Podrick who has the best chance to convince Sansa that Lady Brienne is good and Ser Jaime is on their side. 

Winter is Coming. The Stark motto isn’t nihilistic; it is a call to action. The lone wolf dies, but the pack survives. It’s the spirit of mutual protection, care, and cooperation that keeps the pups alive in the darkest and meanest times. 

Sansa is gradually learning that “the pack” isn’t just those who share her family tree. The pack is made up of the ones who show up. When the wolves are tossed to the four winds, the pack may welcome the strength of lions. Unbeknownst to Sansa, the Hound showed up for Arya and may yet appear and join her pack. The real danger is the mockingbird. 

It was Sansa’s own family---her mother’s sister and foster brother---who created the conflict that drove the Starks into war with the Lannisters. Now it’s Lannister associates coming to her rescue. There may yet be a story in which the wolf and the lion work together and learn to trust each other. Sansa can help write that story. 

[mkstrigidae]

Okay so I'm making my way through your masterlist and I'm in love?? Like let's start off with Winter's Child- a masterpiece. You make Sansa a loving and relatable character and interweave the powers into cannon in a way that actually makes cannon make more sense (preconceived biases and such). Jon and Sansa's relationship is SO SWEET and they way they bonded was absolutely adorable (and the backstory with the houses and the powers they have make so much sense) 1/3

(2/3) Neon Rain literally the best Cyberpunk AU! I've ever read. Like what you did with the world building?? The stark class differences (haha see what I did there?), the choices in SOUND, and I could FEEL myself there! I love the family dynamics between the Starks and I'm loving the little details you're dropping with the Greyjoy's , Jon's parentage, and all of the medical procedures. Jon is dramatic af and I love it and Sansa is a bamf AS SHE SHOULD. Nothing but love for this

(3/3) A Past Worth Having has a special place in my heart. You build up this setting like a tapestry, just seeing more richness and depth the longer you look. I'm proud of Sansa for holding her composure, just FEELING in the angst that the older Starks feel at her return, and loving the relationships with Robin and the rest of the Starks + Jon Arryn. The detail that you're putting into the investigation/Oberyn is awe inspiring and I can't wait to see what you do next with the trial + Jonsa

Haha thank you so much!!! This is such a sweet ask to get! My response is under a cut, because this might get kind of long! (lots of my own meta below, bc i accidentally had a lot to say, haha)

With ‘Winter’s Child’ I’ve really enjoyed weaving in fantasy elements to the world because I like to look at stories and pick at loose threads until they unravel and asking ‘what if?’. I thought it would be a super interesting concept to take a character like Sansa, who in ASOIAF is exactly what she is supposed to be as a noblewoman of her class and conforms very well in that role, and put her in a position where she was essentially a societal outcast in a lot of ways! In WC, Sansa has a lot of similar coping mechanisms to ASOIAF Sansa, in that she sort of romanticizes society to avoid thinking about how absolutely awful it is. In ASOIAF, Sansa holds tight to the notion of knights and chivalry and courtly love to cope with the fact that she essentially has no control over her future and, as a woman, is basically property. In WC, I have her really struggling to make herself into that perfect lady and using that as a sort of shield to the fact that, without a gift, there isn’t anything she can do to improve her lot in life. Sansa has these ideas about becoming a perfect lady and hoping that being perfect in other areas will ‘make up’ for what society perceives as deficient about her, but is more jaded than ASOIAF Sansa due to her age and her earlier exposure to the ills of society. So you get a Sansa who gets along better with Arya and Jon as a result, in part because she’s had that exposure to what it’s like to be an outcast in society. I think that the best fantasy has a really strong emotional backdrop (a really great example is ‘Fruits Basket’ which starts by hooking you with this wacky, fun premise about people in a family turning into animals when hugged by a member of the opposite sex, and slowly builds into a point where you can see that the family ‘curse’ is a representation of generational and familial abuse- of bonds that should be broken, and of bonds that may kill us even as we cling to them- it’s extremely complex and rich and if you haven’t read or watched it, I can’t recommend it highly enough), and so while I really love writing about the fantasy aspects, and writing scenes where Sansa does really cool things with her ice powers, the core of the story is really about Sansa coming into her own, and learning that she was a person who was worth something even without any sort of gift. Sort of overcoming societal stigma and realizing your worth and forcing others to see it. It’s so much fun to write, but i’m stuck at the moment, because i need to reread the books, and my roommate is borrowing them right now haha!

God, APWH is like, indulging my inner world-building suspense-narrative loving writer persona. It’s literally my all time favorite trope- which is of someone growing up to find out that they’re a long-lost somebody or have family they never knew about- combined with a lot of research on trauma (which i’ve been doing for academic and other reasons for a while) and a lot of slowly growing psychological horror courtesy of Petyr Baelish (trust me, it’s going to get WAY more intense). There are so many pieces of media that I love, but I think that GRRM has so many characters and such a well fleshed out world that it’s very fun to dive into his worlds and create something there. Inherently, I love a slowly unraveling mystery and morally gray characters, and this is allowing me to indulge in both!!! World-building is my favorite, because i tend to be fairly detail oriented, and i’ve been laying bread crumbs in so many places throughout the story to hopefully build up to a decent conclusion! I know sort of how it ends, and I think people are going to absolutely lose their minds if I execute it correctly. We have a few chapters to go until we get to anything in the semblance of a trial- there’s some more emotional aspects that I think need to get addressed first, and so I’m so grateful that people are so supportive of being willing to wait for the Jonsa, because they really start spending a lot of time with each other during the trial and prior to the trial (i’m a big believer in bonding via long car rides and so there’s a lot of that!). I’m just so humbled and awed by the response to it- I never dreamed that people would enjoy the story this much- when I started it, I was writing a light-hearted family piece that wouldn’t be too long, and, uh, it kind of evolved from there. Clearly, I am not good at keeping things concise haha.

I left Neon Rain for last, because your comments on this one really made me smile! Of all of my stories, oddly enough, Neon Rain is actually the most deeply personal for me, and I’m just so flattered at your kind words! I spend a lot of my time thinking about the flaws inherent in our society, and without getting too detailed, Sansa’s experience with a family member struggling in the medical system is not unfamiliar to me. There’s a weight that comes with the realization that a system that is supposed to care for people is based on capitalistic ideals of profit maximization, and as someone who has experience working in the healthcare system- no matter how bad you think it is in the US, I can promise you it’s actually worse.

Neon Rain actually just started out as a series of mental images from listening to music that I had to get down on paper, and evolved from there. I actually really love the ‘soulmates’ and ‘class differences’ and ‘mastermind art thief’ tropes, but am incapable of writing fun stories without thinking about the reality of those tropes (see APWH for another extreme example of this haha), and so as I was writing and trying to capture this mental image, the rest of the world began unfolding around me. Jon is different because of a different upbringing here, and so is Sansa, and to see the formerly idealistic Sansa become so jaded by the time she meets her soulmate is just catnip for me. You have this interesting dynamic between them, because Jon wants nothing more than to have Sansa in his life, and give her everything she wants and needs, but where the old Sansa (who was arguably middle-class and somewhat naive, as financially secure teenagers understandably tend to be) would have swooned over that, the Sansa who meets Jon when the story begins is seeing the world and all the unfair and unequal systems in it. She can’t just live happily ever after with him right away- there’s a sense of guilt there, of sansa not feeling like she deserves nice things, and there’s also Sansa’s deep sense of compassion and kindness that won’t allow her to just live life as the well taken-care-of girlfriend of a wealthy man, because she isn’t able to just put on blinders and pretend that all the injustice in the world around her doesn’t exist, simply because it wouldn’t affect her that way anymore.

I think that the core to writing Sansa, for me, in any universe, is that she is a kind and compassionate person who is capable of feeling sympathy towards even the people who have done horrific things to her and her family- that emotional awareness and empathy is a harsh thing to have in a world like Neon Rain, and in our own world, honestly. I’m so glad that you appreciate Sansa’s BAMF-ness in the story- I think that her chapters demonstrate that she is capable of doing extraordinary things when she’s doing them for people she cares for, to be kind (The scene where Alayne helps Robin down from the eyrie is most indicative of this I think), and so in this world, I just love having Sansa be a complete badass out of necessity. Also, it’s fanfiction, and I really wanted to give Sansa a cool motorcyle, because no one else was gonna do it!!!

Also, my characters like to run away with me, and before I knew it, Rodrik Greyjoy had a huge adorable crush on Sansa in the story that I immensely enjoy writing. The Greyjoys are fun because they’re all absolutely insane, and i’m a total sucker for ‘gruff dangerous character is completely a sucker for the kind sunshine-y character’ trope.

God, this accidentally got really long??? I’m sorry- thank you so much for such a kind ask!!! I love hearing what people think of my stories, and this was so sweet :)

[selkiewife]

@the-king-andthe-lionheart​, thanks for your questions and comments! It was easier for me to create whole new post because this got long, so I’ll respond to your questions on my post here.

cw/tw: This post contains description of rape and sexual assault, and discussion of seizures.

First, it’s important for me to reiterate that even if Sansa is not being triggered, she still has every right to reject unwanted touch from Sweetrobin.

But the reason I got the impression that Sansa was being triggered by the touching of her breasts is because she has experienced sexual trauma related to her breasts being touched or exposed at least three times before Sweetrobin nuzzles her there. First, as Joffrey is having her beaten in front of the court, he orders Boros to strip her naked:

Boros shoved a meaty hand down the front of Sansa's bodice and gave a hard yank. The silk came tearing away, baring her to the waist. Sansa covered her breasts with her hands. She could hear sniggers, far off and cruel. "Beat her bloody," Joffrey said...

On her forced wedding night she is asked to strip again:

She kept her eyes on the floor, too shy to look at him, but when she was done she glanced up and found him staring. There was hunger in his green eye, it seemed to her, and fury in the black. Sansa did not know which scared her more." You're a child," he said. She covered her breasts with her hands. "I've flowered."

Then when she is told to get into bed:

She had started to pull up a blanket to cover herself when she heard him say, "No." The cold made her shiver, but she obeyed. Her eyes closed, and she waited. After a moment she heard the sound of her husband pulling off his boots, and the rustle of clothing as he undressed himself. When he hopped up on the bed and put his hand on her breast, Sansa could not help but shudder. She lay with her eyes closed, every muscle tense, dreading what might come next. 

Then after she has escaped King’s Landing with Little Finger, Marillion, the singer, attempts to rape her. 

Sansa jerked away from him, frightened. "If you don't leave me, my au—my father will hang you. Lord Petyr."

"Littlefinger?" He chuckled. "Lady Lysa loves me well, and I am Lord Robert's favorite. If your father offends me, I will destroy him with a verse." He put a hand on her breast, and squeezed. "Let's get you out of these wet clothes. You wouldn't want them ripped, I know."

So when Sweetrobin climbs into her bed and nuzzles against her breast, I do think that it triggers her. As she describes:

She would not have minded if he only slept, but he was always trying to nuzzle at her breasts.

We understand why he is doing it and so does Sansa- even though he is eight, he’s still weaning since Lysa was still breastfeeding him and she died so suddenly. Sansa knows he is only looking for comfort. But at the age of thirteen, Sansa has already had three traumatic incidents related to unwanted touching or displaying of her breasts (two of which happened when she was only twelve.)

TWOW Spoilers: It sickens me just talking about this as well, but Arya is also groped at the age of eleven in the Mercy chapter of TWOW. So I completely agree with you that Arya is going through the same kind of abuse and traumas as her sister. At the time she cares for Weasel, I don’t think she has been touched in this way (I may be wrong.) But even if she wasn’t and didn’t have any sort of trigger, I would still not judge Arya to be “unmotherly” or lacking compassion if she rejected a touch from Weasel there or anywhere else on her body.

Speaking of Weasel, I did not say that Arya’s situation was any less traumatic than Sansa. And I totally agree, Arya is on the run, starving, traumatized, and hunted. I also did not intend to say Weasel herself was any less traumatized than Sweetrobin. I do believe that it is kind of ridiculous to compare traumas anyway and obviously it is just not right to do that. However I do think that Sweetrobin may be more difficult to care for than Weasel at baseline. Ordinarily, I wouldn’t have thought to compare which child was harder. But it was Sansa’s care of Sweetrobin that was being called into question, not Arya’s. So I did start to compare how difficult each child would be to care for when thinking about why Sansa reacts to Sweetrobin the way she does sometimes. 

So it was intentional when I said that I think Sweetrobin is arguably harder to care for than Weasel, just objectively speaking, for a number of reasons. I also said arguably, because you could argue the opposite- that Weasel is harder. Or say they are equally hard. I mean, Weasel is tough to deal with as well. She cried so much she was called “the crying girl” before she got the nickname Weasel and she even kicked Hot Pie once I think. And she also has that habit of eating mud. And even Gendry complained that she was slowing them down (Isn’t it interesting how the fandom never calls Gendry’s fathering skills into question even though he would have willingly abandoned a traumatized child?) 

But one reason that I personally think that Weasel is easier to care for is because she is more likable than Sweetrobin and less demanding. Although this may be just my own feelings as a reader (which are subjective), Weasel was endearing to me immediately in a way that I didn’t feel with Sweetrobin at first. Now I know that might sound harsh, but I think that GRRM writes Sweetrobin to be off-putting purposely and I will explain why later. He does that with a lot of characters. Sansa for one, but also Theon, Jaime etc... there are a lot of characters in asoiaf that you are set up to dislike at first, before coming to understand and root for them later. I think Sweetrobin is one of those characters. And I think Sansa feels similarly toward him- gradually bonding with him instead of instantaneously. 

And we know Arya seems to like Weasel immediately. She even chooses “Weasel” as one of her aliases later in her arc and she tends to pick names of people she loves. I also think Weasel and Arya have a lot in common. They are both resilient, traumatized little girls on the run you know? I loved that out of the whole group they were the only ones unafraid to eat bugs when they were starving (these poor children!) And so, I feel like Arya could identify with her in a lot of ways.

Whereas I think that Sansa takes longer to bond with Sweetrobin because it is more complicated with him for a couple of reasons. For one, even before the trauma, Lysa has been raising Sweetrobin to be a spoiled brat. He is also emotionally stunted as a result of the way Lysa has kept him isolated and coddled. And even though I don’t think that Sweetrobin really understands what is happening when he is so gleeful about making people “fly” through the moon door- it’s still a little chilling and off putting. 

A specific reason that I think Sansa doesn’t immediately warm to him is that even before she meets him, Lysa intends for them to wed each other. Sansa has just left a traumatizing marriage into the Lannister family and the last thing she wants is another forced marriage right now. As Lysa instructs her:

“He likes to play hopfrog and spin-the-sword and come-into-my-castle, but you must always let him win. That's only proper, don't you think? He is the Lord of the Eyrie, after all, you must never forget that... My son will have a grateful and obedient wife.”

Sweetrobin, at first, symbolizes another unwanted, forced marriage to Sansa. So she might have an initial aversion to him just because of this. And I stand by my original assessment that this does make the situation with Sweetrobin more fucked up than Weasel. Weasel represents a frightened, traumatized child to Arya. Whereas Sweetrobin represents a traumatized child as well, but also a possible future husband that Sansa would have to be “grateful and obedient” to. Of course that changes once Lysa dies- but it is still the way she was introduced to him. And Robert still talks about marrying her in TWOW. We know that it is just a sweet crush from a little boy- but again, even the sweet things he does is sometimes off putting to Sansa because it is related to her trauma. Not to mention the fact that she is only caring for him because his mother tried to murder her. And she is dealing with misplaced guilt since Baelish ended up murdering Lysa after that incident. So Sweetrobin is intricately linked with her trauma.

And then his behavior in general is tough to deal with. None of it is his fault, but it still tough nonetheless. He is given to temper tantrums, throwing his chamber pot and bowls of food at people, and he is very petulant- and this was part of his character even before Lysa was murdered. He kind of reminds me of Colin from The Secret Garden. Like, it’s not his fault he is a spoiled brat, but he does start out like that.

He also has health issues and seizures. Obviously this is not his fault, but Sansa doesn’t have the necessary training to deal with his seizures or know the appropriate thing to do when he is having them. Sansa gives him sweetsleep so that he doesn’t have a seizure on the way down the mountain. As you said, she has no idea it could lead to his death and the side effects seem to be way less of a threat than him having a seizure and falling to his death. She is not a maester and doesn’t know the true effects of what she thinks is a medicine. Maester Coleman is the one who knows how harmful it is. And as the actual adult in the situation, he should either clearly tell her “hey, this will kill him,” or intervene himself. 

She has also been injured while trying to help him during a seizure:

Alayne turned to soothe the little lordling, but too late. The fit was on him. A pitcher of milk went flying as his hand caught it, flailing. When he tried to rise he knocked his chair backwards and fell on top of it. One foot caught Alayne in the belly, so hard it knocked the wind from her. 

And it’s worth mentioning that she never complains specifically about these incidents because she knows it is not his fault at all. That is it just part of his illness. She never complains about him at all actually to his face or to others- she is always sweet and soothing. The only reason we know of her frustrations at all is because we can read her thoughts. Which is similar to Arya who is bothered by Weasel’s crying as well but always defends her against the others who are complaining. 

But I think that Sweetrobin is purposely set up to be a difficult child to care for- because, as I said in the original post, Sansa is on a learning arc. She is learning to care for him (And I think she does an excellent job, personally.) Whereas, Arya’s relationship with Weasel is set up to reveal her compassion, her leadership skills, and ability to stand up for people (like when Gendry wants to leave Weasel behind.)

I agree with you that Sansa represses a lot of Little Finger’s machinations due to her trauma. But I don’t think she knows that Sweetrobin is being poisoned. I think she buys Little Finger’s story that Robert will die because of his health issues. And even then, I think she hopes for the best. Why else would she want to make him stronger and brave? Why else would she hope for a kind wife for him one day, if she was knowingly poisoning him? It doesn’t make sense. But I do think that GRRM leaves some things purposely vague so that it creates suspense. Will she realize he is being poisoned in time? If she does, will she try to save him? I think she will but that is probably one of the reasons he made Sweetrobin so difficult for Sansa specifically. To plant that seed of doubt in the reader. Like we know Arya would do anything to save Weasel. That’s a no brainer. But would Sansa save Sweetrobin? I think yes, and I will write a longer post about this at some point. But regardless, her initial complicated feelings toward him does serve to create narrative suspense.

Anyway, thanks for the questions and sorry that my explanation got so long. I hope you don’t take what I said, comparing Sweetrobin to Weasel, as me saying anything bad against Arya. It breaks my heart when I think of the trauma she has survived and is currently going through as well. And there are definitely many situations where she is dealing with things that are objectively harder than Sansa as well. And like I said, this is just my opinion of the two different childcare plots. 

And also, this may be controversial, but I think Arya absolutely did the right thing when she slapped Weasel to get her to move out of the battle. She needed to do whatever she could as a ten year old child trying to save a toddler’s life! Like seriously, if I were Weasel’s mother I would never be like “why did you slap my child?” I’d be like, "thank you for saving my child!” But like I said, I probably wouldn’t even have tried to compare the difficulty of the two situations had it not been for the initial comparison in the discourse. 

[azvolrien]

An Incomplete Timeline of Stranatir

OK, despite the tag this is more of a reference document than a story; I mentioned once that I have a timeline drawn up to help keep when all my stories happen straight in my head. I update it periodically when I have new stuff to add, but this is what I have sorted out so far.

AI = ‘Anno imperii’, ‘in the Year of the Empire’ (I hope). Previous years are ‘BE’, ‘Before the Empire’, as ‘ante imperium’ would lead to confusion.

AI   1          Raan the Conqueror, chieftain of the Bear Tribe of Raan’s Fort (‘Ki-Raan’), finishes his campaign to unite the scattered Kargvallen (the ‘Jagged Lands’, an old name for the Kiraani Hills) tribes into a single nation; traditionally considered the founding of the Kiraani Empire. Things kind of escalate from there.

     1409   ��Schism of the Balaurin; the expansionist ‘Sky Kings’ led by Voice of the Mountain travel from the Dragon’s Teeth to the Eastern Highlands and enslave the orcs. I guess they thought it would be easier than trying to conquer the Kiraani, as the orcs had yet to invent ballistae.  

     1420    Approximate beginning of the Raiding Period – an era in Sea Loch history characterised by warfare and raiding between the people of the different lochs, each under the leadership of a different local monarch. Vikings, basically. Kiraan glances in their direction and decides to let things settle down over there before attempting anything.

     1740    Traditionally considered the end of the Raiding Period, with the unification of the Sea Lochs under High King Fergus. Local monarchs keep their titles but swear fealty to the High King.

     2109    The Sea Loch Country and the Hawk Steppes are annexed into the Kiraani Empire; the Emperor adds ‘High King’ and ‘Great Khan’ to his list of titles. The nation of Stormhaven is founded when a slave ship runs aground on the coast and Queen Eleri the First (just Eleri at that point) masterminds the escape. On the other side of the continent, Ikara the Black leads the orcs (who have now invented ballistae, and have also worked out a few useful things about ‘blast pulp’) in the Last Revolt against the Sky Kings; Voice of the Mountain and all other dragons in the Eastern Highlands (save one) are slain. Some of the Sky Kings successfully escape the mountains and join communities in the lowlands to the west, but most are killed with the dragons.

     2214    The Devourer appears at Eyrie Spire and begins consuming magic for miles around. To date no one is completely sure what it really was (not even me!). Almost all dragons die in the event, leaving only a handful of survivors and unhatched eggs; Balaurin civilisation collapses without them. Most human survivors quietly integrate into the Mammoth People on the ice fields to the north or Kiraan south of the mountains and a few remain in the mountains with most of the surviving  dragons, but some become more belligerent. The Balaurin mage Morath (known to Stormhaven as the Harbinger) and her dragon Dark Shadow over the Frozen Land (‘Shadow’) come to Stormhaven in warning and are slain in battle against an invading Balaurin faction.

     2696    Crown Prince Zarannon of Kiraan (‘Zar’, and believe it or not that was not an intentional pun on ‘Tsar’) is born to Emperor Kaial III and Imperial Consort Aysel Darehyin Yaigani.

     2702    Lorna, an eighteen-year-old girl of the Sea People, becomes disillusioned with the violent culture of her remote island birthplace and steals a boat to defect to the mainland. She is caught in a storm on the way and washes up on a beach in the Sea Loch Country, where she is taken in by Bruide MacDovran, his wife Morag, and their son Euan (also eighteen). Although she’s unofficially adopted into the family, her relationship with Euan is very much not that of brother and sister.  

     2710    26th Voynithi/March – Roan is born to Lorna and Euan, and orphaned by raiders a couple of months later; she is then raised by her widowed grandfather Bruide, who cannot bear to keep using NicEuan as her patronymic and changes it to NicBruide, the name she will bear for the rest of her life.

     2711    15th of Sirakithi/January – Fayn reyth Aren is born. The village priest views her albinism as a terrible omen and insists that they leave her in the forest to die. Her parents Aren and Kayun can’t completely overrule him, but manage to talk him down to allowing her to live just outside the village boundaries in the care of her eldest sister Una. Una does a pretty good job, all things considered, and is probably the biggest reason Fayn had both the skills to survive alone and the ability to eventually return to civilisation.  

                 8th of Rivedi/July – Asta zeDamar is born. There’s not really anything more interesting to say about that part of her life; she has a fairly happy and nondescript middle-class upbringing up until the point everything goes horribly wrong for her.

                 16th of Messis/September – Wygar Smith is born, and left at a Stormhaven orphanage by his biological parents Wyatt and Irwen (no surname) two days later. Nicholas and Mari Smith adopt him after a month in the orphanage; he doesn’t remember it, but once he’s financially capable of it he makes regular donations to the orphanage.

     2716    Nirali is born. (cradle name: ‘Blue Eyes’) Unlike Fayn’s experience, her albinism is noted as unusual and her parents are advised to be careful with sun exposure, but it otherwise has no effect on her upbringing. Her eccentricities are entirely her own.

     2717    Emperor Kaial orders the genocide of the Falkari people out of paranoia; only Fayn survives. Zar, horrified, cuts all ties to his father not strictly related to his duties as Crown Prince and immediately starts planning what he’ll do to try and atone for it once he takes the throne. Stormhaven declares war shortly after the massacre.

     2719    The Darkwald War ends with the signing of Treaty of Harbinger Pass; nobody can really be said to have conclusively won or lost but hostilities between Stormhaven and the Empire are officially over. Unofficially, Stormhaven is not totally convinced, so the Harbinger Gate is constructed to block the pass. The Darkwald as far south as the Stone River is designated an official buffer zone between Stormhaven and the Empire. People can still pass through from one to the other but the only activity allowed within the zone is services for travellers on the Great Darkwald Road, such as roadside campsites and the village of Halfway.

     2723    Wygar begins his apprenticeship at the Stormhaven College of Sorcery alongside Calburn, Rhona and the rest of their yearmates.

     2726    Karash is born. (cradle name: ‘Honey’)

     2731    Roan graduates from the University of Duncraig following the death of her grandfather earlier in the year and begins working in a bank.

     2732    Asta graduates from the Imperial University of Kiraan. Her parents are killed in an accident; she sells herself into slavery to cover their considerable debts (in Nivalis/December) and is purchased by Lady Fiona MacArra as a secretary. Fiona initially offers her freedom but Asta declines on the grounds that she would just be out on the street. Instead she agrees to stay with Fiona for five years or until Fiona’s death, whichever comes soonest. Roan decides she hates working in a bank, resigns, and moves to Dun Ardech to live, as Asta put it, as a semi-feral sea witch. Nirali begins training as a Memory-Singer.

     2736    Voynithi: Wygar and his yearmates leave the College for the traditional journeying year.

     2737    Events of The Last Shapeshifter and most of Water Horses.

                 Voynithi: Wygar returns from his journeying year and meets Fayn in the Darkwald, where she’s been living a mostly feral existence since the Falkari genocide. She accompanies him back to Stormhaven and adjusts surprisingly well.

                 Gracilis/November: Wygar and Fayn marry. They acknowledge that this is pretty soon but it works for them. Death of Lady Fiona MacArra.

                 Nivalis: Asta’s manumission in Fiona’s will is overruled and her ownership passes to Lord Darius ‘Daro’ MacArra, Fiona’s grandson, who has had his eye on her since she first came to Duncraig. Asta escapes from Castle MacArra (not unscathed) and flees to Dun Ardech, where she meets Roan.

     2738    Sirakithi: Daro kidnaps Asta from Dun Ardech with the help of his guards and a hired crew; Roan kills him and rescues her. Asta travels to Stormhaven aboard the merchant ship Curlew at Roan’s insistence and finds work in the College’s admin office.

                 Nivalis: Wygar and Fayn travel to the Northern Forest at Zar’s request to investigate a spate of mysterious disappearances there. Events of The Northern Forest.

     2739    Nivalis: Death (from old age) of Emperor Kaial; Zar ascends the Imperial throne to become Emperor Zarannon IV, with his coronation held on the winter solstice. Wygar and Fayn attend with the Stormhaven delegation. Events of To Kiraan. Aysel leaves the Imperial City and returns home to the Hawk Steppes.

     2740    Sirakithi: Under Zar’s new Protection of Slaves Act, Clan MacArra are arrested and imprisoned for their horrific abuse of their slaves. Now that it’s safe for her to do so, Asta returns to Dun Ardech to live with Roan. Specifically on the 7th.

                 12th of Rivedi: Una Falkari Smith is born. Calburn and Rhona travel to the Hawk Steppes and travel with a band of Yaigan nomads for a while. Events of The Hawk Steppes.

                 Gracilis: Wygar and Fayn travel to the Darkwald for Una’s naming ceremony.

     2742    Ikara is born. (Cradle name: ‘Little Red’) Karash begins training as a Memory-Singer.

     2744    Torsani/June: Karash and Ikara are orphaned in the Fever Summer. Karash takes on parental duties for his infant half-sister; juggling his training with raising her is difficult, but he manages.

                 Nivalis: Asta and Roan marry.

     2746    Wygar reconnects with his biological family, somewhat by accident. He never really comes to think of Wyatt and Irwen as his parents, but he remains on cordial terms with them and Una does consider them her grandparents.

     2748    Wygar, Calburn and Rhona go missing on the far western continent and are presumed dead. Events of Centaurs of Varakai.

     2749    Wygar, Calburn and Rhona make it home to Stormhaven, accompanied by the Red Sun centaur herd. The Red Suns go to live on the Hawk Steppes, where the landscape suits them a bit better. The Steppe tribes are surprised but generally roll with it.

     2750    Events of The Lady of Kaltara. Wygar, Fayn and Una go on holiday to Stonehead. Fayn is kidnapped by Mara Kovar, the Lady of Kaltara, and Wygar and Una travel to rescue her.

     2752    Una begins her own apprenticeship at the College.

     2754    Nivalis: Roan goes missing fishing in a winter storm. Riabhach rescues her from the water and gets her safely to the island of Starwatch. Una and some other apprentices visit the Order of Night on the island and are caught up in a raid by a band of Sea People led by the warrior Svanna, the daughter of Lorna’s sister and so Roan’s first cousin unbeknownst to either of them. Events of The Island of Stars.

     2756    High Master Idris Carwel retires; Wygar is promoted to take his place as head of the School of Combat. Nobody is really surprised by this.

     2758    Ikara begins training as an Initiate Windkindred.  

     2764    Ikara bonds with the rukh Tsheer and ascends to full Windsister.

     2765    Una leaves on her journeying year. She meets Bright Star in the High Cold Dark (‘Star’) in the Dragon’s Teeth, accidentally forms a permanent blood-bond with the young dragon, and is adopted by the surviving Balaurin. The Sea People invade Stormhaven in force under King Torann, but are defeated (read: their fleet is practically obliterated) by the Balaurin dragons.

     2767    Events of Anchored Tempest. The Balaurin relocate from Journey’s End to Ornfell, close enough to the Sea Loch Country for much easier trade. Una and Star travel to the Eastern Highlands and encounter the orcs. Halted Flow of the River of Time (‘River’), the last survivor of the Sky Kings’ faction, is discovered guarding a cache of five hundred viable dragon eggs held in stasis. River is killed; the Balaurin transport the eggs to Ornfell for incubation.

     2768    Interim between Anchored Tempest and its epilogue. Karash, Ikara and Nirali accompany Una on her journey back across the continent from the Eastern Highlands to Stormhaven, acting as something between explorers and unofficial ambassadors between the orcs and the wider world. They have a few hurdles along the way, but overall it goes well. I haven’t decided anything more specific yet.

[dreadwulf]

#3 One Flesh, One Heart, One Soul

Brienne has become exceedingly annoyed with him. 

It is a little like when they had first met, this antagonism. Except she had despised Jaime then, and he could not arouse any anger in her however he tried. She had remained calmly disdainful that entire journey despite his continued efforts to irritate her. 

Now she is vexed. Jaime has succeeded in breaking her composure, nearly without trying, and all he had to do was inform a tavern filled with people that they were married, and convince them to toast his bride and buy them drinks. Drinks that their companions were very appreciative of, mind you. Even Brienne had finished a flagon, her face turned a now-familiar scarlet. She was at first clearly torn between shouting at him and punching him in the face, and settled on glaring daggers and leaving the room without a word to anyone, and now she has ridden ahead to their next destination without him. 

Jaime is not nearly so satisfied with this accomplishment as he might have expected. It is a little unnerving actually. Brienne avoiding his gaze and not speaking to him was more troubling than he wanted to admit, but he has never seen her openly angry and it is inexplicably worse. He wasn’t completely sure that was possible. 

Even their companions have noticed. The Hound has been clearly amused by the entire situation, and Ser Hyle has been smugly enjoying the deterioration of their relations. Young Podrick had ridden beside Jaime most of the afternoon, and questioned him anxiously.

“Why do you antagonize my lady so, my lord?” Podrick has been unfailingly polite to him thus far, in a way that suggests he is intimidated by him, or more likely by his House. But just now he is worried and protective of his lady knight, as loyal as any squire. 

“I don’t know what you mean, Podrick.” He gives the boy only a sidelong glance. 

“It upsets her. Ser Lady Brienne. I’ve never seen her like this before.” Pod sits up a little straighter on his little horse and affects a hardened expression. “You should be nicer to her.”

Jaime snorts. The lad is about as threatening as a newborn puppy. “I’m very nice to her. Am I not praising her to everyone we meet?”

Pod screws up his face in frustration. “She doesn’t understand. You’re hurting her.”

He shrugs off these comments; surely the boy has it the wrong way around. He spurs his horse and rides ahead all the way to Ironoaks, and the rough terrain of the rising road successfully occupies his thoughts. 

The high road to the Vale is closed by the snows, but they have managed to hug the coast around Wickenden rather than travel through the Mountains of the Moon. It takes weeks longer, and still they have had to fight their way through rising snow. Hopefully their destination is close. Much of the Eyrie court has moved to the Gates of the Moon, and Brienne’s party has heard news of a tourney there to select new members for the Brotherhood of Winged Knights. It is in this direction they ride despite the worsening weather. From there they can cross to the rest of the Vale, if needed.

The village surrounding Ironoaks Castle is quiet and still. Jaime rides through much of it, looking for some central place where he might find Brienne. If she has not decided to ride somewhere else entirely to escape him. But no, she would not leave her squire, and Podrick Payne is hot on his heels even now.

He finds her at a posting in the village square with news of the tourney. She stands enfolded in her heavy travel cloak, her loose blonde hair blowing in the snow, and he dismounts to join her.

Jaime thinks little enough of the Vale Knights - they are confident in their superiority but were no match for his sword when he had two hands. But the conflagration of nobles and knights will surely be an ideal location to learn news of the region, and a safe place to hide from Crown forces. If the Stark girl is indeed in the Vale, she would surely be there. 

“I might have competed in this once,” he says by way of greeting as he comes to stand beside her. “Perhaps you might consider it, becoming a winged knight. There are not so many Starks left to serve.”

Brienne does not turn to him. She fairly growls at him, arms crossed beneath her cloak. “I thought you wanted to find your honor? If you are not so distracted by ridiculing me.”

A strange falling sensation fills his stomach. “Oh, so you’re speaking to me now? How nice.”

“Will you stop telling people I am your bride?”

“Why? It’s true.”

“It’s misleading.” She glares at the missive nailed to the wall as if it has attacked her personally. “I never agreed to be anyone’s wife. Must you make this more unpleasant?” 

“It’s not unpleasant for me,” he says cheerfully.

“Of course it isn’t.” Brienne lifts her chin and looks at him, and this time it is he who cannot quite meet her eye.  “You can amuse yourself as you like, you are not the one who will be considered spoiled afterwards. Your reputation will be pristine when the marriage is undone, but not mine. Even though I spoke no vow, and was not even awake for the ceremony.”

He feels a pang of guilt at that. “It was not my idea either, Brienne. It was a convenience. I know that it was not real, and you did not agree to it.” 

“For gods sake let’s keep it quiet then,” she hisses at him. “For the survival of my good name keep your japes to yourself.”

“For your good name, I’ll refrain from sullying it with mine,” he agrees with considerably less cheer. 

“Why did you allow it in the first place? I thought you were forbidden to marry, as a Kingsguard…?” Brienne is staring at him most earnestly, her eyebrows furrowed in confusion. 

“As it happens, King Tommen has declared me dead and replaced me in the Guard. He did not wait overlong to do it, either. So as dead men have no vows…” he shrugs, with a great deal more indifference than he is feeling. 

He hadn’t known that detail at the time, of course. It had most likely happened while they were on the Quiet Isle, and he had learned of it from rumors on the road. But she does not need to know that. Nor does she need to know how hurt he had been, to find himself so easily discarded.

“But what was the purpose? The Quiet Isle would have tended to me just the same. Why -- ?”

How to explain? She doesn’t remember it. She doesn’t remember him holding her belly together as they rode for the Isle. She doesn’t remember screaming in pain in the bed they put her in. How she had thrashed and writhed in it, when they let him look in. They would not let them go to her side, not even young Podrick, who clearly loved her like a mother. Not even him, when he had carried her in pleading for their help, and was still covered in her blood.

How can he explain to her that he tried to tell them no? That he had refused to wed an unconscious woman without her permission? That was when they had shown him, when he had seen her in that bed and wanted to carry her away immediately from that awful room. It stank of sickness, of infection, and she did not belong there. But of course it was coming from her, the sickness was in her and radiating off her in waves. Her skin was grey and damp with sweat and those wounds open to the air were black and dripping with pus. Her face gaped open at her cheek and he could see a flash of muscle tissue through the swelling, the cheek she had always kept covered before. These were old wounds, weeks’ worth of wounds, one on top of another, and worst of all the one to her belly that should have carved out her guts. They had stitched it shut, that one, but it showed no inclination to stay closed. She was shivering, moving in small, restless jerks. 

“Can you give her nothing for the pain?” he had demanded of them, but they said the amount they would have to give to touch these wounds, she was unlikely to wake from it. They said it and the monk and his fellow looked at Jaime expectantly, as though they have asked him a question. It takes him too long to realize what the question is. 

“If you’re asking,” he said testily, “whether I agree to a mercy killing, I do not. Brienne will live. You will save her life.”

They had looked at one another, grimacing. The monks had explained, one after another, that they could not save her. That her wounds were quite grievous, and quite infected, and the lady was mortally ill. They would be only delaying the inevitable. They thought, after a certain point when they had tired of arguing with him, that it would be selfish to continue.

“When I lost this” -- he had shouted at them, holding up what was left of his right arm -- “and I was burning with infection, wearing my own rotting hand on a chain around my neck and in such unimaginable pain I was pleading to gods I don’t even believe in to put an end to me, Brienne told me to live. She said I must live, and so I did. I would ask no less of her. I don’t care that she is a maid, she is no weaker than I am and has endured far more than most men. She will survive this if we let her. You will give her the chance to, and so help me I will make certain of it. I will burn this monastery down if you don’t.”

But she had writhed. The monks held her arms down firmly against the bed, to keep her from hurting herself or flinging herself off of it. Her entire body seized with pain, silently, an agony too harsh even to allow a cry to escape her lips. It bent her back so that she arched off the bed and her hands formed claws at her sides. 

When she relaxed into unconsciousness again, Jaime noticed his lungs screaming at him and remembered to breathe in. He took a harsh gulp of air and held it painfully, his vision blurred.

“Do you see?” The Elder Brother had said then. “Do you understand?”

He had nodded wordlessly. He believed them, that she was dying. Dying by inches and measured breaths, the Stranger’s hand on her shoulder. He never told anyone that, not then and not later, that he had given in. Out loud he had insisted she would live, that they must try. But in that moment, looking at her in the bed, he knew that she was dying and there was nothing he could do to save her. That was why he had agreed to marry her. He could do nothing for her terrible pain but he would not allow her to die alone and scared. He could at least do that.

But she did not die. She did not die, and now she stands before him and she is confused and he does not know what to tell her. She doesn’t remember and there are no words to describe it. It had been agony, that helpless moment looking at her in the bed, and he would have done anything in his power to help her, and so he married her. There is no way to explain that.

Jaime steps closer to Brienne. He has to look decidedly upwards to find her eyes, and has never gotten used to it. His eyeline falls more naturally to her strong jaw, her neck, which he had been so entranced by in the Inn. Her neck, with the fading burn beneath her chin where they had hung her. 

He could kiss her. She is unreasonably tall but he could bury his hand in her hair and turn her face down to his. Her mouth is not pretty but her lips are thick and pillowy and would be sweet to taste. He could do it.

“What about this?” he asks instead, suddenly. Jaime brushes his knuckles against it, the mark around her neck where the rope had been. “Why would you let the Brotherhood do this to you?”

Something strange flickers across her face. “I could hardly protest. There were too many.”

He insists. “You could have simply done as they wanted.”

Brienne shakes her head. “It would not have been right. You did not do the things they accused you of, and I would not execute an innocent man.”

Jaime should have been prepared for that answer but he isn’t. For some reason it hits him square in the chest, like a blow. 

“Of course,” he says, a little breathlessly. He lets his hand drop back to his side. “You would only do right.”

Of course. Of course that is why. Brienne is good, she is truly good and honorable and she would have done it for anyone. Brienne would do the right thing, and that is that. She is a true knight and he is a damned fool.

He pretends to read the bulletin of the tourney with great interest.

“It was a whim,” he says in answer to her earlier question, and shrugs. “The nuptuals. They said it would be undone, and it took no time at all. Only a few words and it was over.”

 “A whim.” She sniffs, and nods harshly. 

“They were quite set on having you married, their order. For a lot of unmarried monks they are quite obsessed with it.”

“I see,” she whispers.

***

When he makes the arrangements at the Inn this time, he arranges for the two rooms, but does not mention a wife. He says very little at all, and sets himself in the tavern well apart from the rest of their little party. 

Podrick Payne looks between the both of them, Brienne and Jaime, and stays with Brienne. 

The Hound, oddly enough, sits next to Jaime, though he offers little in the way of conversation. He makes a pleasant enough drinking companion, in that he signals regularly to the barmaid to replenish their supply, and does not ask any questions. 

Ser Hyle sits beside Brienne as she sullenly eats her supper, speaking to her eagerly, probably about their ridiculous situation. He had wanted to be the one to marry her, of course. He had offered it, on the Isle. But Hyle Hunt is a schemer from a minor house and he would wed Brienne for her inheritance and leave her on her deathbed, Jaime thinks. He would not have cared for her the way he had. 

I know that it was not real, he had told Brienne.

I truly believe that the ceremony was real and it was sacred, Elder Brother had said. 

There was not, in fact, much ceremony at all. He had simply sat beside her on her sickbed. The both of them in the same clothes they had worn before Lady Stoneheart, torn and bloodstained and filthy. They had bound Jaime’s left hand to her right and Elder brother said the words. One flesh, one heart, one soul, now and forever. Her hand was cold and limp in his but he threaded his fingers through hers and squeezed, hoping somehow she felt it as a comfort. If she was not silently screaming in objection to this farce of a wedding. 

He said the words; she could not say them back. I am hers and she is mine. From this day until the end of my days.

They had left him alone with her, with dreamwine and milk of the poppy to ease her passing, and he poured her a finger of the dreamwine, and when much of it dripped out of her mouth he poured her another, but no more. She did not move about so much after that. Then he had crawled into the bed beside her and slipped an arm around her, just above the stitches at her belly, and held onto her as best he could with his handless arm and her wounded from head to toe. 

She at least would not die alone, nor lie in an unmarked grave in a strange place. She would not go unremembered. He would make sure of that.

I don’t doubt you would have chosen better, but I will be a good husband to you in what way I can. I will take you to my home at Casterly Rock and make a place for you and a place for me. One day when I die they will lay our bones there together.   

But she did not die. She had survived through long nights and days of pain and fever, had survived the monks and their bandages and resetting of bones and scouring of infection, and slowly her wounds had closed and her fever broke and consciousness returned at last, against all odds and expectations.

She had survived and by the Seven, he had been so relieved. Every day since he has been relieved. For the first time perhaps ever his most fervent prayers have been answered. He has lost his mother and his father, become estranged from his brother, separated from the children he had fathered, lost his right hand and his vocation, found that the great love of his life had been an illusion and a lie, but when he had claimed Brienne for his own she had survived. 

So if she doesn’t want him for a husband, he surely cannot begrudge her that. He had not prayed for that, had he? He only asked her to live. 

He stays in the tavern longer than all the others. Brienne and Podrick and Ser Hyle finish their supper quickly and disappear. The Hound paces him admirably but eventually excuses himself to his bed, with a strangely sympathetic touch on the shoulder. 

He must look miserable indeed to earn pity from Sandor Clegane.

It takes a considerable amount of ale to do him any damage, watered-down as it is, but Jamie makes the effort. By the time he wanders upstairs he is weaving in his steps and sure that Brienne will be long asleep, and he is considerably surprised to find her sitting up, fully dressed and waiting for him. 

She sits on the foot of the bed, her hands twisting in her lap, and she looks tentative and uncertain. Jaime likes that least of all, this new timidity. It is Brienne being Good again. She treats him as a suitor she is letting down gently, and he thinks that if he is going to be rejected, he might at least have made a real overture first. He has not earned this. This is unfair.

“We must put an end to this marriage,” Brienne says slowly, meeting his eye at last. “I do not like what it has put between us.”

The words stick in his throat awkwardly, though he has thought them often enough. “If we returned to King’s Landing, the Faith could annul it at my request. But I did not think you would want to abandon our search for that.”

“I don’t see much choice.” She wipes the heel of her hand across her face, quickly.

Finally he snaps at her. "Is it so awful, being wed to me? How humiliating for you, married to the most dishonorable man in Westeros. You must be suffering intolerably.” 

Her mouth twists. “If you were not the loudest man in Westeros, it would not be so bad. If you did not insist on embarrassing me--” 

"I didn’t realize I was to be a shameful secret for you to keep. If it embarrasses you, I will not speak of it  But tell me, if you are so distressed, why didn’t you ask your Elder Brother to dissolve this farce?"

"I did," she replies sullenly.

Oh, he thinks. And then: Oh. Of course she did.

"I suppose he told you the same thing he told me then." His face is grown hot again, as if held to a fire, and he spits out the words as though they burn. "That it would be dissolved if left unconsummated at year's end. So there is your freedom if you can stand the wait."

"I can endure your japes if there will be an end to them." She hunches over strangely, her shoulders up nearly to her ears. 'i know that you would never touch me."

"Certainly not. I am a gentleman."

She looks up, suddenly fierce. "Sleep you in the other room then, so that there is no mistake. Our companions must support our claim that we do not share a bed."

"Fine," he says before he has quite thought about it, and storms out into hall, slamming the door behind him.

He stands frozen in the hall staring at the wall in front of him, until he hears footsteps behind him. Cautious footsteps. 

He listens closely to them, imagining their maker, how carefully she steps so that he will not hear. She will open the door at any moment, to be sure he is gone, and he should move quickly into the other room they have rented but he is frozen in place. For some reason or other, he wants her to see him there.

But she does not open the door. Instead he hears the lock clicking into place behind him, sealing him out.

Click.

At this he immediately breezes into the adjoining room, startling awake their companions with some story of being locked out of his room after visiting extensively with the bar patrons.

"I knew you'd fuck it up," Ser Hyle says derisively from his pallet on the floor, and Podrick evinces a small giggle, and Jaime curses them all to the darkest of the seven hells and claims a chair for his bed.

He sleeps fitfully against his fist, and he does not think of his wife asleep alone in the next room behind a locked door and it does not hurt at all, it doesn't, it doesn't.

[whitecrossgirl]

Out of Hand

AN: So this is an AU that I had previously written on my ff.net page under the same username but I thought I would edit and rewrite parts of it as my writing I feel has improved. I hope you enjoy it.

Fake Dating AU

“I’ve already promised myself to someone.”

Jaime had blurted out the lie before he could stop himself. The effect it had on his family was instantaneous. Tywin had flickered an eyebrow in surprise (the equivalent of any other person having their jaw on the floor), Cersei looked stunned by his announcement and Tyrion looked simply bemused, eager to watch the scene unfold. Tywin had originally summoned the three of them to discuss marriages which had meant scolding Tyrion for not yet consummating his marriage to Sansa Stark, scolding Cersei for her attitude towards her betrothal to Loras Tyrell and informing Jaime that he was sourcing a bride for him. The ideal would be one of Walder Frey’s numerous daughters and granddaughters or some daughter from one of their vassal houses.

It was the entirety of all of the changes that he would be facing since his return to the capital; being stripped from the Kingsguard, forced into a marriage with someone he didn’t know or care for, the useless lump of gold attached to his right wrist; that had caused Jaime’s mouth to act without informing his brain and blurted out the lie about already being engaged.

“Really?” Tywin asked finally. “Who is she?”

Jaime cursed his own stupidity as his mind began to race. Marriage. A wife. Children. The life he had always wanted but simultaneously never wanted was in front of him. He knew what Tywin’s unspoken questions were; what family was she from, what could they (Tywin) claim from the match, how suitable a bride was she and of course, how dare Jaime do something so independent without consulting him. As he tried to think of an answer, a believable answer, only one person came to mind. She would kill him for this but he had no other option. He couldn’t tell the truth now.

“Her name is Brienne. Brienne of Tarth,” Jaime answered, sealing both of their fates.

“That beast you dragged back here with you?” Cersei asked with a scoff. “You can’t be serious.”

“That’s enough,” Tywin said and Cersei fell silent at one, glaring at Jaime suspiciously instead. “She is Selwyn Tarth’s daughter.”

It wasn’t a question and Jaime wasn’t stupid enough to think it was. “She is, she stands to inherit the Sapphire Isles.”

“The Evenstar is also a possible rallying point for the Stormlands when Stannis Baratheon dies. Tarth have declared neutrality in this war, despite her own actions. It also has good trade routes, a strong fleet of ships and a strong control in the Narrow Sea. Not the most attractive of wives, but there are compensations.” Tywin stated, pragmatic to a fault. Jaime wasn’t surprised that Tywin had already found out so much information about Brienne and her homeland. Of course, control in the Stormlands was a higher benefit to Tywin than what some nameless Frey girl could give.

Every single Lannister match had been planned to ensure they controlled it all. Cersei’s first marriage got them the throne and the crownlands. Joffrey and Cersei would keep the Tyrells and Highgarden in the fold. Tyrion’s marriage to Sansa would get them the North and help secure the Eyrie through her blood relation to Lysa and Robin Arryn. Riverrun and the Twins was theirs after the Red Wedding. Myrcella’s marriage would secure them Dorne and when Tommen was old enough, they would find a suitable match for him too. With Jaime’s supposed marriage to Brienne, it would gain Tywin the Stormlands (possibly) as well as a higher control over the Narrow Sea. All that would remain would be the Iron Islands. Tywin Lannister would win the Game of Thrones; regardless of who actually sat on the Iron Throne.

“I don’t care about any of that,” Jaime admitted truthfully, now that there was no turning back, it was as if all the thoughts he had been suppressing about Brienne had burst forward. “She protected me, she helped me when I lost my hand. She kept me alive when I was at my lowest point. Brienne is honourable and true and I know it sounds absurd but her heart is where her true beauty lies.”

‘Gods save us, he does actually love her,’ Tyrion mused before he smiled at Jaime. “If that’s the case, then I wish you both every happiness Jaime. It’ll be good to have some honour in this family for once.”

“That’s enough Tyrion,” Tywin warned without looking at him. “If you have promised yourself to the Tarth woman and as she is a suitable match, we will hold the wedding in three weeks; before the Royal wedding.”

Wedding! Oh gods he was an idiot. He had not thought this through. He had expected Tywin to dismiss his supposed promise to Brienne or be sceptical of his feelings. He should have put the pieces together when Tywin had actually seemed approving of Brienne, or rather what he could benefit by having Jaime marry her. This was bad, this was really, really bad.

Brienne was going to kill him.

“Thank you Father, I’m pleased we have your blessing.” Jaime lied, managing to fake a sincere enough smile.

“She will join us for dinner tonight, I want to meet her properly.” Tywin stated, looking almost… pleased that Jaime was not arguing the marriage.

“Of course,” Jaime replied, feeling the panic inside him build even more. As Tywin dismissed them, Cersei had stormed off immediately, poison in her eyes at the idea of the beast from Tarth managing to steal Jaime, her Jaime from her. Jaime and Tyrion however rounded the corner, walked down the passageway and once Jaime was confident that they were out of earshot, calmly hit his head off of a locked door.

“Stupid! That was so stupid! We are so fucked!” Jaime muttered as the penny dropped for Tyrion.

“You haven’t proposed to her, have you, you stupid bastard?” Tyrion asked and Jaime rounded on him.

“I didn’t mean to say that. I panicked and I didn’t think he would take it seriously. I do care for her and she is a close friend but no, I didn’t ask her to marry me. We don’t feel that way about each other.” Jaime replied, ignoring the almost hurt feeling at the reminder that Brienne didn’t actually love him.

“Well you did say it.” Tyrion said heavily. It had been said. It could not be unsaid. Tywin expected Jaime and Brienne to marry and soon the word would be travelling around the Red Keep that the Kingslayer was so in love with Brienne the Beauty that he had asked her to marry him; Kingsguard and tradition be damned. Once the court knew, all of Westeros would know and they would have to get married. Tywin expected it and no one defied Tywin Lannister or made him look a fool and lived to tell the tale.

Brienne was definitely going to kill him.

“Come on, we need to speak to Brienne and Sansa before Cersei or anyone else does.” Tyrion warned and they headed for the water gardens where they had left Brienne and Sansa when they had been summoned to Tywin’s office. Since Jaime and Brienne’s arrival in Kings Landing, the four of them had banded together into a group. A band of rejects and misfits, Tyrion had dubbed it. The Kingslayer, the demon monkey, Brienne the Beauty and the disgraced daughter of a traitor. What a group they made. Still it meant that they could be honest between the four of themselves and each had three others that they could trust without question. Something that would be needed now.

Sure enough, Brienne and Sansa had been sitting by one of the fountains in the water gardens and it was Sansa who noticed the grim expressions on their faces as they approached and felt a familiar sense of dread in her stomach. Something terrible had happened again. “What is it? What’s happened?”

“Not here,” Tyrion warned as he led them to the secluded waterside where Jaime, Brienne and Bronn practiced their sparring away from prying eyes. The sound of the waves crashing against the stones would ensure anything they said would be drowned out and not even one of Varys’ many little birds would overhear them.

“What’s happened?” Sansa asked again fearfully. If it was something that couldn’t be overheard then it was something terrible.

“Our father was speaking to the three of us about marriages. Ours, Cersei and Loras and he was discussing planning a match for Jaime when Jaime decided to inform our father that he had promised himself to someone else. A love match apparently.” Tyrion explained to Sansa and Brienne.

“I don’t understand,” Sansa said, puzzled as Brienne hit a realistation and her shoulders slumped.

“Jaime, you didn’t.” Brienne said as Jaime looked at her and turned scarlet. “Jaime what were you thinking?!”

“I didn’t mean to!” Jaime protested. “He was talking about removing me from the Kingsguard and about marriages and a suitable bride and I just thought of you and I panicked and it just came out.”

“You told your father that we were promised to wed. Is this some sort of sick joke?” Brienne asked; that had to be it. Another cruel joke against her because of course handsome, rich Jaime Lannister would want to marry her.

“It’s not a joke! He was talking about marriage and you were the only person I could think of who I would want to be married to. You’re kind and brave and strong and you think you’re hideous but your eyes are beautiful and your smile lights up your face and I know this sounds forced but it’s not. I know it’s a bad situation but I know how I feel about you. It’s not a joke. It’s never been a joke for me.” Jaime confessed, finally letting some of the thoughts and feelings that he thought he had hidden away through.

“Jaime, we need to be rational.” Brienne said after a tense moment of silence. “Your father expects us to wed, everyone will. How are we supposed to do this?”

“We will work it out,” Jaime reassured. “We will have to make it look believable.”

“But it’s unbelievable.” Brienne argued. This whole situation was unbelievable. Damn Jaime for his stupid lie, forcing them into this mess and damn his stupid confession as it was causing her to question the stupid thoughts and feelings that she had forced away since Harrenhall.

“You’re going to have to make it believable. Jaime, you saw how Cersei was; she doesn’t believe this for a moment and Father won’t believe it until the two of you are in the Sept and married. If he even suspects that any of this was pretend or false; then it will be unthinkable.” Tyrion warned them both as Sansa nervously spoke up.

“If anyone had heard what Jaime had said a few minutes ago, they would believe he was in love with Brienne. You could have had to hide how you felt when you were travelling, in order to keep each other safe. It could have been a habit that you’ve just found difficult to break until your father knew of the engagement and it became official.” Sansa suggested; everyone was hiding something here. This was where all the liars were, even the terrible ones like her.

“Exactly, you already are good friends and everyone has seen how the two of you talk and laugh with one another. It will be the more physically affectionate side that you will need to start showing; hand holding, linked arms, kisses, that sort of thing.” Tyrion suggested; if he was honest with himself, he had suspected since they had arrived in the capital that there was more than just friendship or companionship between Jaime and Brienne. Clearly both of them had repressed it just deep enough to hide it from one another but now it was time to force that into the open.

“That will be the difficult part,” Brienne stated and Tyrion dismissed it with a wave of his hand.

“It will take practice. If Sansa can act like she’s not repulsed by me, the two of you can fake affection for each other.” Tyrion quipped and Sansa smiled softly.

“I’m not repulsed by you.” Sansa protested and Tyrion smiled at her. Their marriage was a sham but they were just trying to make the most of a bad situation and survive as best they could.

The next few hours were spent coaching Jaime and Brienne on how to act. Part of the difficulty came from the fact that both of them felt like little children playacting. It all just seemed forced and wrong. The barrier of awkwardness between the two of them didn’t help matters. It was strange; they had shared a bath together and during their travels had seen the other wash, piss and shit without blinking an eye. But something as simple as walking with their arms linked seemed almost unbearably awkward. The sun was beginning to set by the time they felt comfortable enough to even try returning to the Red Keep for their evening meal. As they made their way back up the steps, Jaime took Brienne’s hand and squeezed it tightly.

“I’m sorry,” Jaime apologised sincerely. “I never meant for you to get caught up in this.”

“We just need to get through it,” Brienne said and smiled suddenly. “I just realised,”

“What?” Jaime asked.

“This is probably the longest you’ve gone without insulting me. Maybe we can make this work.”

“We will,” Jaime reassured, looking her in the eyes. “I do care deeply for you Brienne. I don’t know exactly what this is but I know how I feel is real. Even if this isn’t.”

“Thank you Jaime,” Brienne said as they wandered through the gardens and found a few people shooting them not to subtle looks. Time to make it seem real. Brienne lowered her head and kissed his cheek. “Kindness suits you.”

Jaime felt a wide, silly smile cross his face as he resisted the temptation to touch the spot where she had kissed him. As they walked through the gardens and into the Red Keep; it was clear that the news of their engagement had started to circle, as had different rumours about their travels; as courtiers and servants alike, shared looks and whispers as they passed.

“I heard she helped him escape Robb Stark singlehandedly.”

“Apparently he saved her from a wild bear.”

“She’s not the prettiest one but she’s definitely more than what the Kingslayer deserves.”

Jaime rubbed the back of her hand with his thumb as he considered that last remark. Brienne was definitely more than what he deserved. Jaime paused in his tracks and turned to face Brienne. In that instant, time seemed to stand still as he stroked her cheek before he leaned in to kiss her. He knew that she hadn’t kissed a man before but she didn’t hesitate in kissing him back. Believable. It had to be believable. They broke apart, smiled at one another before continuing towards their destination.

Just a kiss between two lovers. Nothing else.

As they entered the room, they found Tyrion and Sansa just taking their seats. It seemed Joffrey and Tommen had not been expected to attend this dinner. Tywin was stood beside the table, clearly waiting on their arrival. Cersei was already sat that the table, glaring daggers at both Jaime and Brienne who both tightened their grip on the other’s hand. Showtime.

“Father, may I introduce you to Lady Brienne of Tarth, my future bride.” Jaime said politely as Brienne smiled and bowed at Tywin.

“My lord, it’s an honour to meet you.” Brienne said politely as Tywin managed to hide any shock or surprise at Brienne bowing.

“It is a pleasure to meet you,” Tywin replied politely as they took their seats. As the meal was served, Jaime and Brienne managed to keep their hastily contrived story of how they apparently discovered how they felt and Jaime’s proposal. They managed to join in with Tyrion’s joking, deflect any sharp comments or criticism from Cersei and even Tywin seemed won over by Brienne. Although it was hard to tell, he also could have been constipated. As their second course was served, Jaime scowled at the portion of mutton on his plate and picked up his fork.

“Let me,” Brienne said quietly, taking his plate and cutting the meat up for him. As she did so, Jaime smiled softly at her, touched by the gesture. Brienne’s action and Jaime’s reaction hadn’t gone unnoticed by everyone else at the table who watched the tender action between the two with a growing realisation.

It may have started out as something pretend.

Only now, it seemed to have become very real.

[thebluelemontree]

Hello! I love reading what you have to say about Sansan and I’ve been wondering in my head recently about where their relationship will be at the end of the series. Do you think it’s plausible that Sansa and Sandor could actually be romantically involved at the end of the series and live a happy ending? GRRM has too much set up to not have them cross paths again. Many people have thought of different ways their stories may connect at the end of series. (1/2)

Some say Sandor will save Sansa from fire, he will die for her, she will knight him, or that they may be romantically involved and I have no idea what GRRM may choose. Will Sansa be queen and she can just marry Sandor? Will she never live a high born life again and she and Sandor just live as commoners? I seriously don’t know what to expect and I wanted to know what you think would be the most realistic ending or the one you want. Sorry this got so long! (2/2

Lotta questions here.  No need to appologize.

Do you think it’s plausible that Sansa and Sandor could actually be romantically involved at the end of the series and live a happy ending?

Yes, oh yes; however, we still got a ways to go.  A lot can happen in two books.

GRRM has too much set up to not have them cross paths again.

Agreed.

Some say Sandor will save Sansa from fire, he will die for her, she will knight him, or that they may be romantically involved and I have no idea what GRRM may choose.

I think Sandor’s arc has had him facing fire by drawing him closer and closer to it all along, but not in an ultimately bad way.  I think it’s GRRM’s exposure therapy to bring him to a place of overcoming his trauma.  His helmet is singed by fire at the Blackwater battle => His arm is burned when he is judged by the BwB for his role in Mycah’s death, rendering him a helpless child, so he’s forced to relate to his victim => He WILLINGLY submits to being burned by the boiling wine so that he might live a little bit longer to help Arya get to her aunt in the Eyrie.  Then I have my speculations and theory concerning the Burned Men of the Vale, who ritually burn themselves to prove their strength and courage, as well as magic that notably feels like it’s burning.  Would he die for her?  Absolutely.  That much is certain.  I don’t think that means he needs to actually die to prove what we all already know is true; however, he could still die in other ways for other reasons.  I think we need to read Winds first to get an idea of what his role in the endgame will look like.  I try to keep my specific theories narrowly focused on the immediate future events in Winds rather than stray too far ahead.  There are just too many unknown factors.      

As for knighting, only a knight can make a knight.  I don’t know if it will be literally or metaphorically, but I think that role goes to Elder Brother, who was a knight in his former life.  Sansa did teach Sandor that true knighthood is about what you choose to do and what you stand for, not ceremony or title.  All knights are not secretly bad people, as Sandor likes to think.  That belief comes from the knighting of his biological older brother that caused his original trauma.  If he chooses to let go of all that and embrace knighthood after earning it through selfless and noble actions, I think it would be a profoundly emotional moment to have his replacement older brother, the one that healed his wounds and cared for him, do the knighting.  Like Dunk and the ambiguity surrounding official his knighting, it doesn’t matter if it’s recognized by the rest of the world.  Just that the people that care about him are there to witness his character come full circle with it.  That is totally appropriate for Sansa to witness his knighting and be his #1 cheerleader.

Will Sansa be queen and she can just marry Sandor?

If that were to happen, I think the Starks would first set him up with a title and some land as a reward for his service to their house.  Sort of like how Littlefinger smoothed the way to being able to marry Lysa Arryn by getting upjumped to Lord of Harrenhal.  I have doubts about Sansa being a literal queen, though.  A leader, advisor, and influencer definitely, and still a highborn lady no matter what.

Will she never live a high born life again and she and Sandor just live as commoners?

Only very temporarily.  I think they will have a brief moment where she’s still under the guise of Alayne Stone, and she’ll be able to express herself more confidently and freely.  That would be a good time to rehash things and act on some feelings.  Except then there will be the pull back to being Sansa Stark again, which will inevitably bring with it a lot of drama and conflict.  What about her marriage to Tyrion?  What about the regicide charge and the bounty on her head?  How will she explain her role in Littlefinger’s schemes?  I mean, if she publically reveals herself to be Sansa Stark she looks really suspect just being associated with LF all this time and with her aunt’s timely death.  How will she manage to win the Vale to her side?  Will she be pressured to marry someone else to secure that?  I do think Sandor will play a role in helping her reclaim her identity, but I think it will also be a double-edged sword for them for at least a while.  Duty vs. love, and all that. 

I seriously don’t know what to expect and I wanted to know what you think would be the most realistic ending or the one you want.         

I'm of the opinion that a happy ending as in they are together and have a family to carry on into the future is one realistic ending George could write.  I disagree with the idea that he thinks unhappy endings are just more realistic and that romance is always doomed.  Fuck, the man married his longtime girlfriend after having a failed marriage in the past.  Why would he, who finally got the girl he always wanted to be with, think this type of ending is dumb or unrealistic?  It’s his real life!  And I think even if a tragedy like a character death happened, it would not be because he’s out to punish romantic love or the reader for caring. I think, at the very worst, their final endgame would be both bitter and sweet, with still plenty of sweet.  Maybe they can’t be together openly as they wish, but they are still passionate and devoted to each other.  Maybe Sandor is killed in the final battle, but Sansa is pregnant.  But my money is on 100% sweet and an earned optimistic ending for them after a rough ride of more war and nearly dying with a post-Quiet Isle rehab Sandor, and a post-Littlefinger reclaimed Sansa Stark.                      

[agentrouka-blog]

I don't think Knights of the Vale will defeat Boltons and free Winterfell like they did in the show but they would go North to fight against Others . Thoughts ?

I think it should be both.

They have a narrative tie to the Others via Waymar. The Royce's of the Vale are the first House named in the series.

“Do the dead frighten you?” Ser Waymar Royce asked with just the hint of a smile. (AGOT, Prologue)

Their House words are "We Remember" and they are associated with bronze and runes, all recalling the first men. The connection there is obvious.

But they are also connected to House Stark. Specifically, to Sansa. She is the one who had a crush on Waymar when he was feasted at Winterfell on his way to the Watch, she saw and recognized Bronze Yohn and the Tourney of the Hand, who in turn likely has recognized her in spite of her disguise as Alayne. The Lord of the Eyrie and future leader of the Vale is cousin to Sansa and loves her. Why build this connection between Sansa and the Vale if it will not come to matter for Sansa herself?

So is the wider Vale connected to the North. The late Domeric Bolton was specifically stated to have squired in the Vale for the Redforts, allies of House Royce. House Stark is distantly related to the Waynwoods, Corbrays, Templetons. They were eager to join Robb's Rebellion. All those are personal ties to the people of the North, not to the lore of the Others.

The question to ask is, why would the Vale Knights ever ride North to fight the Others? What would move them to do that, on the word of a letter or a messenger? About some ancient mythical threat? It's more likely they will move there for a political purpose, for House Stark, or Sansa, and then stay for the fight against the Others.

Waymar's first stop was at Winterfell, after all, before he joined the Watch. I imagine it will be the same for the Vale Knights as a whole.

[theusurpersdog]

Do you have examples of sansa thinking about arya in the book? Arya is always thinking about sansa and misses her but sansa seems to forget she have a sister.

I’m just going to ignore the antagonistic undertones of this and answer the question as best I can.

The thing that is most important to understanding how Sansa and Arya think about each other, is to realize they have literally no understanding of what the other is going through. Arya is a bit more aware of Sansa’s situation, because she knows Sansa is trapped in King’s Landing with some of the world’s worst people, but Arya is too young and naive to understand the level of cruelty Sansa experiences. But in A Clash of Kings, Sansa thinks Arya’s safe and home:

By now Arya was safe back in Winterfell, dancing and sewing, playing with Bran and baby Rickon, even riding through the winter town if she liked.

It’s not until Sansa is told that Bran and Rickon are dead and Winterfell has fallen, that Sansa finds out Arya isn’t safe (someone can correct me if I’m wrong cause I’m just going off of memory here, but I think Sansa learns this between her first and second chapter in A Storm of Swords). 

And Sansa does think of Arya many times, often fondly:

He'd owned a sword named Lion's Tooth once, Sansa remembered. Arya had taken it from him and thrown it in a river. I hope Stannis does the same with this one.

This is the first of two times Sansa thinks of Arya throwing Joffrey’s sword in the river, and both times Sansa thinks of it as something she wishes someone else would do. In hindsight, Sansa clearly loves that Arya did that.

 And later in ACOK, Sansa prays for Arya when she’s in the sept before the Battle of the Blackwater.

Sansa also remembers Arya fondly in A Storm of Swords:

It had been so long since she had enjoyed the company of other women, she had almost forgotten how pleasant it could be. Lady Leonette gave her lessons on the high harp, and Lady Janna shared all the choice gossip. Merry Crane always had an amusing story, and little Lady Bulwer reminded her of Arya, though not so fierce.

Sansa is relating this group of women to women she enjoyed being with, and one of them reminds her of Arya. 

Sansa also dreams of having a daughter who looks like her sister:

In Sansa's dreams, her children looked just like the brothers she had lost. Sometimes there was even a girl who looked like Arya.

Sansa’s dreams say a lot about her, because she often dreams of her favorite childhood memories or things she loves and misses; like when she dreams of Lady. And Sansa dreams of being little again, sharing a bed with Arya. And when Sansa builds her snow castle in the Eyrie’s Godswood, she remembers Arya:

She remembered a summer's snow in Winterfell when Arya and Bran had ambushed her as she emerged from the keep one morning. They'd each had a dozen snowballs to hand, and she'd had none. Bran had been perched on the roof of the covered bridge, out of reach, but Sansa had chased Arya through the stables and around the kitchen until both of them were breathless. She might even have caught her, but she'd slipped on some ice. Her sister came back to see if she was hurt. When she said she wasn't, Arya hit her in the face with another snowball, but Sansa grabbed her leg and pulled her down and was rubbing snow in her hair when Jory came along and pulled them apart, laughing.

That is undeniably the happiest Sansa had been since before Ned was taken prisoner, and her mind goes to Arya.

There’s a couple things you need to understand about Sansa and Arya, if you want to really grasp how they think of each other.

Starting with Arya, she thinks of Sansa about twice as much as the reverse, but look at the context:

Sansa would have known who he was, and the fat one too, but Arya had never taken much interest in titles and sigils.

So the singer played for her, so soft and sad that Arya only heard snatches of the words, though the tune was half-familiar. Sansa would know it, I bet. Her sister had known all the songs, and she could even play a little, and sing so sweetly. All I could ever do was shout the words.

Lady Catelyn always wanted her to be like Sansa, to sing and dance and sew and mind her courtesies.

But that was just stupid, like something Sansa might dream.

Arya thinks of Sansa very often, because she puts herself as the polar opposite of her sister; she relates everything back to “Sansa would do this, but I’m going to do the opposite”. These are clearly the thoughts of a younger sibling, who was raised in the shadow of a more successful older sibling. As the quote about singing shows, Arya always felt like she could never be the Lady that her sister was, and instead leaned into her more natural hobbies because she didn’t want to try and fail and would rather do other stuff anyway. 

Arya also thinks about her childhood a lot more than Sansa does, and has a lot of memories of messing with her preppy older sister. This changes a lot in A Storm of Swords, but Arya thinks about her family a lot in A Clash of Kings. She finds comfort in these memories and the times she shared with her family.

Which leads me to Sansa. Unlike Arya, Sansa deals with trauma by avoidance (just another thing she has in common with Ned, but that’s none of my business. . .). It’s completely undeniable that Jeyne Poole was Sansa’s favorite person, someone she viewed as her sister. Yet Sansa doesn’t think about her too often; because to think about her is to be sad for her. It becomes abundantly clear that Sansa grieves this way when she becomes Alayne Stone: 

Alayne loved it here. She felt alive again, for the first since her father...since Lord Eddard Stark had died.

Sansa is so happy as Alayne Stone because Alayne hasn’t experienced anything half so traumatic as Sansa. Alayne has no dead parents, brothers, or sisters, isn’t used and abused for her claim, and cannot be attractive to Petyr Baelish. She finds a freedom in being someone else because it is the highest manifestation of how she grieves. 

Sansa found strength in the members of her family that were alive, such as how she depended a lot on Lady, or think of Robb to give herself strength. The thought of them all being dead hits her hard:

If Lady was here, I would not be afraid. Lady was dead, though; Robb, Bran, Rickon, Arya, her father, her mother, even Septa Mordane. All of them are dead but me. She was alone in the world now.

Sansa doesn’t think of Arya because it’s really really hard for her. The same way Ned’s pov is basically “avoid! avoid! avoid!”, Sansa does everything she can to not think about her family. Not because she doesn’t care, but because she does.