#hazbin theory

[short-wooloo]

"Great Alastor altruist died for his friends"

The look on Alastor's face when he says that

He looks haunted, shaken, disturbed, and horrified by it

I've been joking about Alastor accidentally-ing himself into caring about the other characters

But on some level, it seems that it did happen

And he HATES it

It terrifies him

Perhaps it's because Alastor understands that on some level this proves him wrong, sinners are not beyond hope, there is a chance to be better, and that's bad for him because it's easy to revel and wallow in being an evil monster when there's no hope of being anything else, but when there isn't, well, that means Alastor might have to face who he is and what he's done

Alternatively, Al wants to be a horrible monster, feared hated and infamous, and if he becomes some kind and benevolent person, even to just those he considers friends, it's a chip in his reputation and the persona he wants to be seen as

Or perhaps Al's breakdown is because if he cares about anyone, then that's a weakness someone can exploit, another string holding him back, something he's desperate to not have

[anthurak]

You know the more I've thought about it, the fact that Charlie and Vaggie do a romantic reprise of 'More Than Anything' feels like a strong indicator not just that Chaggie will end up being framed as a thematic parallel/foil to Lilith and Lucifer, but also that Charlie is specifically meant to be the counterpart to Lilith; the (half)human woman who inspires Hell through song, and Vaggie the counterpart to Lucifer; the fallen angel who fell in love with her.

[imp-imp-im-a-simp]

Okay, we have overlords of mass media: Alastor for radio, Vox for television and Velvette for social media.

BUT

You know who is missing here?

There is that one mass media that is still a massive thing, but people often forget about it's existence.

And it is newspaper.

I might get into a history of newspaper, thou I'm not gonna pretend I'm an expert. Just, newspaper at it's most primarily version is a very old thing.

So old that if there was an overlord of newspaper, they might be the oldest overlord in Hell.

*Cough cough* Zestial *cough cough*

Silently pulling all the strings from the shadows, like a spider weaving its web.

Giving informations radio, television and social media will take as true and publish them as their own.

Yeah, if we had an overlord like this they would be hella powerful.

And it would be a bit funny if they had a hat giving journalist vibes.

[greenhybrid]

WHY IS NO ONE TALKING ABOUT LILITH?!!?! HER FACE BEING GRAYED OUT!??!?! HER TAKING CHARLIE AWAY FROM LUCIFER?!?! ALASTOR BEING ON A SO CALLED LEASH AND GONE THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME AS LILITH?!?!

[maxiemumdamage]

I realize we’re probably supposed to feel threatened, or at least worried, that the Vees are all ready for a power grab, but I’m…not.

Like, we just watched Carmilla and Rosie — aka the supplier of Angelic weapons and the apparent best information broker in Hell — clearly cement themselves as being on Charlie’s side. Alastor might have gotten his ass kicked by Adam, but he still held his own for a good while. Besides, Adam was clearly the strongest person in Hell at that point except for Lucifer, so it’s hardly a humiliating defeat. And considering the other Overlords already there are his friends, we can expect Zestial would probably jump in on the project just for kicks.

Compared to all them, the Vees…aren’t exactly a threat. They can’t do shit if Carmilla refuses to sell to them, and while she’s the least invested in the Hotel of all the Overlords involved, I do think she’d draw that line if she thought it necessary. Business is clearly a secondary priority compared to family for her, and I’m suspecting her daughters might end up being some of the Hotel residents since it’s a good place to stay safe.

And even without that, uh. Lucifer. Lucifer who just kicked Exterminator ass for all of Hell to watch, Lucifer who just demonstrated to the public how much he cares for his daughter and how brutal he would be to anyone that threatened her, Lucifer who is the literal king of Hell and will now be staying at the Hotel.

To throw Vox’s words back in his face: they’re gonna die. They’re gonna fucking die.

[wjkae]

1. Charlie is distraught and scared for Angel. She’ll likely become increasingly determined to free him from Valentino as the season progresses.

2. Alastor is feuding with Vox. He would love to screw Vox over and potentially reap untold power benefits as an overlord.

3. Valentino is obsessed with Angel. He loses it at any hint of losing control over “his favourite toy”.

4. Vox is functionally in charge of Valentino’s meltdowns. Destabilizing Valentino threatens to destabilize all the Vees, especially Vox.

5. The Vees expressed concern in S1E2 about Alastor making a deal with Charlie in her capacity as Lucifer’s daughter.

6. Alastor has canonically attempted to ensnare Charlie in a soul-binding deal before in S1E0. This is possible despite Charlie’s hellborn status.

All that in mind …

What would Princess Charlie Morningstar, heir to the throne of Hell, be willing to trade away to The Radio Demon for Angel’s safety?

[peachedtvs]

So we all know Valentino and his strange saliva, that pinkish liquid that drools out his mouth

We also know that whenever Valentino kisses someone his saliva is transferred into their mouth too, which is seen in Poison (not explicitly), and when Valentino kisses Vox

Now before Stayed Gone began, Vox is talking with Valentino completely clean

And then right when the song begins, vox emerges again and THERE IS THE SALIVA. VOX HAD A 'Goodluck baby boy' KISS OF ENCOURAGEMENT TO SING HIS DISTRACK

Not EVEN to mention how Vox is seen with his saliva a LOT, like at the end of Poison. LOOK AT VOX WHEN HE SEES ANGEL, his smile drops and he teleports away. He's a jealous lil man like VOX IS SO NEEDY FOR VALENTINO HE NEEDS KISSES ALL THE TIME

I legit bet tv man gets whiny if Valentino doesn't give in too

THIS MAN IS A NEEDY BOTTOM

[elsa-fogen]

Fallen angels?

Okay i understand why people may think of Crmila being a fallen angel. But Alastor and Rosie? Especially Alastor. There's absolutely no way that he was an angel LMAO. I also don't belive that Rosie can be a fallen angel. Like, come on, it's just her dress. And for angels, especially exorcists, it's just part of their armor! This is so silly

BUT!!! If Rosie is fallen angel it would add such an interesting dynamic to radiorose relatonships. Like........ How would Alastor even react to this? I'm trying to imgine and... I don''t think it would affect their friendship too much? Alastor isn't Charlie lol. But also he isn't Charlie. And Rosie pretty much THE ONLY person he trusts (as far as we can tell). So... That's really difficult to figure out his reaction. I think maybe he would not know how to react to this either! Like, from one side this doesn't change much. From the other side it's a kind of a huge thing to keep in secret.

HA MAYBE HE KNOWS! Like i'm sure they sometimes bite each other unpromted, it's their love language (pretty much like my mom LOL) (ha- now this is my headcanon for Alastor's mom too AHHAHDHAHSHDSAH) So yeah, he bit her once and saw golden blood and was like wtf, and rosie like, ah yeah i'm a fallen angel, but it's a secret don't tell anyone, and alastor's just ok then

anyone else to the pile of fallen angels?

[ghosted-draws]

Really liked that Alastor lost the fight in the finale, actually! A lot of people have been saying that they wished he went full power on Adam, but a theory i really enjoy is that he WAS, but he didn’t OUTPUT what he was expecting.

Alastor canonically rose to becoming an overlord INCREDIBLY quickly. a power no being in hell had ever seen before- I don’t think it’s an accident Lilith picked him, and i’m super curious what would have prompted him to EVER sell his soul as a DEAL DEMON. (And even if he didn’t sell his soul directly, making a deal that would restrict him so badly) Like he knows what that does he must have been DESPERATE. He says specifically both that his wings have been clipped, and also that once he figures his way OUT of his deal he will be pulling all the strings. I think his deal was something to do with his power, or whatever let him rise so quickly to overlord status. He’s not exactly used to being properly challenged.

So when his staff broke, it wasn’t even something he thought COULD happen. It’s not “Oh shit”, its “What just happened?” he holds it out in front of him like he expected it to withstand that attack. But he DOESN’T. It freaks him out so badly he drops everything but the smile for a second. You could say he miscalculated Adam’s power, which, sure, but Alastor is good at picking out weakness, i think he just assumed he could take him, or at least distract him for much longer- he doesn’t seem to have an angelic weapon with him so his job could have just been keeping him busy

when we see him in his studio he is downright hysterical. Because he DID almost die, FOR THIS DEAL. Whatever is tying him to the hotel, he let it almost KILL HIM. And the realization he is not as in control as he thought he was shakes him to his core- he goes back to the shattered radio tower just to feel like himself again, battered and bleeding.

TLDR: Alastor isn’t as in control as he thought he was, and i am very interested to know how he killed so many overlords so fast

[falling-star-cygnus]

i wouldn't like- stake my life on this like i would my "pentious watches the other hotel goers sleep because he's working up the nerve to ask to cuddle them" theory but-

what if Zestiel is the one that owns Alastor's soul?

i started thinking about it when Alastor's magic was like- lime green? which on it's own wouldn't of meant anything to me, but it's also the color of the stitches keeping his smile in place

and coincidentally the same color as the stitching on Zestiel's hat

he went headlights the second Zestiel showed up, which only happened one other time when Adam broke his microphone

also, why would Alastor agree to stay out of a fight? He loves drama, he loves picking fights, he thinks angels taste good, and clearly he doesn't mind taunting people stronger than him {Lucifer, Adam, Charlie} -> Zestiel can move by shadow, Alastor can command shadow

"I'm sure you've all been wondering~" "Not really. But welcome back in any case."

Zestiel and Carmilla obviously trust each other more than they trust anyone else, why wonder about their probably most dangerous overlord's disappearance when he can easily be recalled?

now, i don't think it's incredibly plausible or that this has any actual standing; but a lot of it aligns a little too well. after all, what do we really know about Zestiel?

on the other hand, Alastor and Lillith's disappearance align suspiciously too -> for all we know, Eve is the one that owns Alastor

[aggywytchking]

I love the little details they put in the show like rewriting the error screen lol

[anthurak]

So with everything we learned and saw in Episode 4 from Angel, Valentino, Charlie and Husk, here’s a little theory on how the Hotel crew saving Angel from Valentino might play out. Particularly in how Husk’s status as a former Overlord may factor into things.

Because I have a hunch it’s actually going to be Husk, rather than Charlie who gets fed up first and goes out to make a real attempt at getting Angel away from Valentino, given everything we saw between Husk and Angel in this episode. Specifically, Husk aims to lure Valentino into gambling for Angel’s contract.

Now that raises the question of what exactly Husk could gamble with. I see two possibilities:

Option One, Husk full on bluffs Valentino that he still has substantial power as an Overlord and has been hiding it all this time, tempting him with more souls and power. And as we’ve seen most notably in Episode 2, Val in kind of a massive fucking idiot, so I could see him actually falling for this. Essentially, Husk gambles with nothing, save his own soul, for a chance to save Angel.

Option Two, Husk actually gets his power BACK from Alastor. Specifically through fulfilling some mysterious, nebulous condition Alastor set up for him. It could even be that this is what sets up Husk to gamble Val for Angel’s freedom. Alastor returns Husk’s power as an Overlord because he’s curious as to what Husk will do with it now. Which we see, is putting it all on the line again for a chance to save Angel.

Whichever way we get to it, we find Husk in a high-stakes card game with Valentino. And of course, Husk does the classic trope of NOT telling his friends or even the guy he’s doing this for what he’s doing to ‘keep them safe’ and all that. Of course, they do find out. Which will come into play later…

As for the all-important gamble; Husk actually does WIN legitimately against Valentino. However, because Valentino is… well, Valentino he welches on the deal and attacks Husk, and perhaps a recently arrived Angel as well.

Now in the event that Husk was bluffing Valentino the whole time and is actually helpless against a fully-powered Overlord, this would be when Alastor, from afar, actually returns Husk’s own power as an Overlord as some offhand, magnanimous whim. Which of course now allows Husk to actually fight back against Valentino.

What ensues is a full and proper fight between Husk/Angel and Valentino, with all the requisite emotional drama of Angel and Husk admitting their feelings for each other and all of Valentino’s shittiness as a person coming out in force. Maybe like an mlm version of the Bees vs. Adam fight.

However, despite getting his power as an Overlord back, Husk ultimately turns out to not be as powerful as Valentino. Alternatively, perhaps he never gets his power back at all and we just skip to here from Husk winning the bet. Whichever way we get here, Husk and Angel are now at the non-existent mercy of Valentino.

Which is precisely when CHARLIE shows up.

And I imagine what ensues plays out in a flash. Like everyone is only just registering that Charlie has appeared when suddenly everything is on fire. We get only the briefest glimpses, perhaps only in silhouette, of the full-sized horns on Charlie’s head, the great leathery wings coming out of her back and the pitchfork in her hand before she has Valentino by the throat and the mothman starts BURNING, screaming in pain as he is consumed in hellfire.

Basically, I feel that after this episode we are going to see Husk be the one to step up first to try and save Angel from Valentino, given everything we saw between the pair this episode. But at the same time, I think the interactions between Charlie and Valentino, particularly Charlie starting to transform in rage, sets her up as the one who’s going to ultimately put Val down. Specifically via giving us a glimpse at Charlie’s true power.

And I do say glimpse because I imagine the full and proper reveal of Charlie’s ‘Devil Form’ is almost certainly going to be saved for when she’s forced to take on the likes of Adam and the Exorcists, the ones who have been set-up as proper antagonists to Charlie herself.

[imp-imp-im-a-simp]

HEAR ME OUT

7 ARCHANGELS

[entjvampire]

WAIT - Vox's crush on Alastor theory?( + the Vees are a canon polycule!)

We all know Vox is obsessed with Alastor, and I'm fairly sure the Vees are a polycule. (Velvette and Valentino, both being involved with Vox romantically and sexually.)

A vee is literally a type of polyamorous relationship, as well.

Valentino also knows a lot about Vox's fixation, possibly meaning that he was there for what I think happened.

In one of the lyrics Alastor sings, he says "he asked me to join his team, I said no, now he's pissy, that's the tea!"

Alastor is AroAce , and the Vees do seem to be a polycule from what I've seen.

Alastor wants to be a solo act , and isn't interested in rising up in the ranks of hell with those he considers to be below him, so I think Vox had a fascination for a while with Alastor, both admiring his power and wanting a cheeky shag, asking him to join his polycule.

But he said no, Vox got pissy, and that's the tea!

[turtleofthehollow]

The image of Alastor's smile being bound by stitches gave me a theory about how his arc will conclude if he's on the path to redemption.

My theory starts with the idea of the stitches being a byproduct of whatever deal he made, and that he can't talk about the deal to anyone, meaning even if he wanted help with his deal, he couldn't say a word about it

It's such a horrific reality to live, and I can only think about how poetic it is for Alastor to have his free will so thoroughly revoked like that

I mean, in an earlier episode we saw how Alastor exercises control over the souls he owns (like Husk's) so it seems an appropriate punishment for him to be subjected to the same treatment

And that's where my theory kind of begins

This whole situation with his deal puts him in the position to start developing empathy by making him experience what he puts other people through

He gets to experience the same kind of helplessness he subjects others to, and it may even lead to him wanting to make amends with those he wrongs

Which could be a fun way to develop his dynamics with Husk. I mean, what better way for Alastor to start earning his redemption than by apologizing to Husk and freeing his soul?

[maxiemumdamage]

Pentious going to Heaven after being killed by Adam already could’ve easily been enough of a curveball. But y’all.

He didn’t appear where the newly-arrived mortal souls do.

We see what it looks when a newly-dead person arrives in Heaven — they’re outside the pearly gates, talk to whichever Saint is working the Reception Desk, and then go in through the main promenade thingie.

Sir Pentious manifested in what seems to be Heaven’s highest offices. Which, in some ways, it might make sense he doesn’t take the usual front door — he’s not newly dead, he’s been in Hell for centuries! And he was a Sinner killed by an Angel, yet somehow still was considered virtuous, which probably puts him in a very odd position. But, physically? His position?

Is in Heaven’s innermost sanctum where the fucking Seraphim who LEAD Heaven are working.

(And sure, it could just have been an aesthetic choice. But it’s not like we haven’t seen Emily and Sera in the outer area of Hell — or that there couldn’t be a similar punchline by showing whatever Saint is on door duty try to deal with this small moral crisis. No, having him manifest right alongside Heaven’s leaders was a deliberate choice.)

What if Pentious isn’t just a winner now, but another Seraph?

If so…it could have some very interesting implications for the next souls to be redeemed.