#hints of mileven

[chirpsythismorning]

Mentally I'm here (wait for it…)

[cleradinscloset]

ok so hear me out but I need mike in the upside down calling out for will like how el and will both called for mike (their love interest) while they were in the upside down

[hellinhawkins]

there is genuinely no reason that i can come up with as to why the duffers created a string of tension among mike and will other than the fact that they are building up a relationship, as you do for slow burn. if byler isn’t endgame, it would be a lot more than a queerbait. it simply wouldn’t make sense.

everyone’s said this before but they seriously could have given will a love interest two seasons ago and everyone would have been much more cool with it than they would be now. they are defining will and mike’s friendship and characters based on will’s love for mike. hell, even mileven is being defined by that at this point.

and there was absolutely no plausible reason as to why they’d do all this if byler isn’t canon. it’s more than just bad writing- we’d probably need a new name for it.

someone please explain to me why they made the airport hug so awkward and why they made byler fight in the rain like a frequent romance scene, and why they even made will in love with mike to start with if he’s only getting repeatedly beaten every season and then has to come to terms with the fact that his best friend doesn’t love him that way, because i truly don’t understand it.

[frozenfrogz]

I’m scared for what happens to me after byler is endgame and the three months of non stop posting about it are over. What will become of me?

[tearsofsaudade]

eleven - angels like you

[teambyler]

One simple trick to make it obvious that Mike and El don't have a healthy relationship:

Switch their genders. Imagine that El is a GUY with superpowers. And Mike is a GIRL who feels like a nobody next to him.

Why would this amazing guy ever like her? She doesn't deserve him. She's just some random person who happened to catch his eye.

(Pics by u/alwaysbi and from Reddit)

He heightens her feeling of inadequacy. Yet she can't imagine losing her superhero boyfriend, because her sense of self-worth depends on having this guy.

She must make sure he DOESN'T LEAVE HER. Loving him as a person is less on her mind than her fear that he will leave her. (Mike literally spends more time thinking and talking about El leaving him than about her being hunted by part of the government.)

When the time comes, it's chaotic and our superhero is in danger of dying. She genuinely doesn't want him to die. But in her love confession, she says that he is HER superhero. She still views him as better than her. She looks UP to him and admires him from below.

Their relationship has never been about them being in love with the other person, but with the IDEA of the other person, the IDEA of a conventional "happy" relationship. And in this case, one where she sees herself as the lesser half of the two.

And still, after her confession of love, he is barely talking to her! For his own reasons (in El's case, probably healthy ones), the superhero seems to have moved on. The girl's fear of losing him was actually well-grounded.

The unhealthiness of Mike and El's relationship is disguised by the fact that the show switches the usual dynamic in real-life opposite-sex couples, where often it's the girl who feels inadequate and undeserving of the guy.

We know the show DID pull back the veil at one point: Mike refers to himself as Lois Lane and El as Superman in describing how he feels:

The writers deliberately chose these words to make clearer the unhealthy unequal dynamic in the Mileven relationship. (As well as hint that Mike might like boys. =D )

Hey Mike! There IS someone who loves you exactly for being you, and unconditionally...

-teambyler

[love-byers]

so as hard as it may be to believe, i was a mileven shipper right up until just before vol 2 of s4 came out. not hardcore twitter mileven, but a shipper nonetheless. i did love will and mike's relationship, maybe even more than mileven, but i never clocked it as romantic. i vividly remember thinking "aww, will and mike would be so cute together but they would never let that happen." and never thought about it again. even when i saw the rain fight and heard "it's not my fault you don't like girls" i was like "ohh wow so will is probably gay" and didn't even think he was in love with mike. i didn't believe that until the s4 trailer said "i think there is someone he likes" and of course, this was because of my own heteronormativity. i dismissed everything i saw and didn't even look for hints because the idea that the writers would allow a gay relationship between two main characters was not even a thought in my head. once i dropped that and started to trust that the writers actually cared and did want queer characters/storylines, everything made sense.

so i went into s4 thinking mileven were gonna be fine and that will was sad and hopelessly in love with mike. i mean fully believing it. so im mindlessly watching s4 e2 and thinking "aww poor will mike is so in love with el he can't pay attention to will" no questions asked.

then the fight happened. when mike blew up and said "you were! you were! you were rolling your eyes, you were moping, you were barely talking you basically sabotaged the whole day" i was like " how do you know that" but still, i dismissed it and barely thought about it.

then it happened. "we're friends! we're. friends." all the alarm bells went off. red flags flew up. my eyebrows furrowed. "ummm what mike? he didn't say you were more than friends. why is he viewing this romantically and why is he being so defensive???"

i was so deep into believing the writers would never let the gay romance happen, but that just couldn't get past me. there's no other way that line can be interpreted. that's a trope that means one thing and one thing only.

my next thought was "ok, this is gonna be like the rain fight. will is gonna be really hurt by this and go silent."

but nope, will claps back with "well we used to be best friends!" and i was stunned. utterly stunned. what is going on here? what is this dynamic? and why is mike more worried about this than finding el? why did he care enough to completely stop walking so he couple blow up at will for not talking?? but still, i was somehow able to let this go. because the writers just wouldn't do that. would they?

the mileven fight happens and i've never wanted to backhand a teenager more in my entire life. i'm reminded of stancy and their whole "i love you" thing

then THIS happened, and i was thinking more and more that mike doesn't love el romantically. look at his face when will says "whatever you didn't say you can say it to her then". will starts talking but the camera stays focused on mike and will remains blurred. we're supposed to be taking in mikes reaction. he says yes, but frowns and blinks rapidly. will was trying to reassure him, but mike has not been reassured. i don't know how to describe the emotion on his face. it's like you just had a chance to clear up your lie, but you still didn't, and now you're back to thinking about the moment your lie will blow up in your face. it's like his face is saying, "no, i can't just say it to her then because i don't want to."

the scene where they talk on top of the car is what started to make me think mike doesn't love el romantically. his reaction to will saying "it's scary, to say how you really feel. especially to people you care about the most. because..what if they don't like the truth?" he nodded. he felt seen. i remember thinking "ooooh. he doesn't love her and he knows she won't like that" everything made sense. if we apply mike's monologue logic to this, it makes no sense. whatever it is that mike is feeling, he thinks el won't like it. then he supposedly decides that the moment to tell her that is when she's dying?

mike is lying. he was holding back saying how he feels because he knows el won't like it. then when she's dying, he suddenly thinks his feelings are what she wants enough that it'll save her life? whatever he was feeling on top of the car and what he tells her in the monologue are not the same. you don't tell someone something they won't like when they're dying.

and 2 years ago i came to this conclusion without an ounce me believing byler could be canon.

[pinksmonkey]

Posting my Ultimate Byler Evidence/Analysis List here directly because it probably makes it more convenient and I should have done this a while ago. XD

There is so much proof for Byler being endgame in S5 of Stranger Things. They are so cute together, and so much in the show has been building up to their relationship. I just wanted to share some of my favourite Byler analyses, because they are so cool, detailed, and in-depth. I love reading about all the hints, symbolism, and subtext for Byler, it's amazing how much thought must have been put into all these things. Why go through all the effort of adding these details if they aren't actually going anywhere with them? Mike is so queercoded, and they are truly in love with each other.

🫥 Just gonna leave some good Byler analyses here 🤐

Most of the links go to written Tumblr posts, and a couple of them are Reddit posts. So it's a lot of reading. If you prefer watching videos over reading, I highlighted my Byler YouTube playlist in green so it's easy to find.

And apologies for any of the links that aren't working, I know some of the posts have been deleted now sadly, but there's no way I'm re-numbering all these so I'm just leaving them in. My fellow Bylers, please stop deleting your amazing posts. ;-;

So anyway, here is the list of some of my favourite Byler evidence/analyses of all time (not in any particular order):

1. Mike's Season 4 Monologue To El

2. Camera Roll Byler Proof Part 3

3. Mike's Monologue and Milkvan

4. Mostly Byler Post Index

5. Dawson's Creek Parallel

6. "My Experience With Stranger Things"

7. What Ollie Learned From Film School

8. Byler Music Analysis

9. Why Don't The Duffers Discuss This?

10. ST Theories Masterpost

11. If Byler Isn't Endgame Then Someone Screwed Up

12. Byler Crumbs From The Cast and Crew

13. Favourite Combination of Endgame Byler Proof

14. I Doubt Byler Then I Remember This

15. The Fact That We Have This Interview

16. You Know Your Ship is Endgame When

17. Mostly Byler Post Index 2

18. Losing Hope Of Byler Endgame?

19. Why I Think Byler is Endgame

20. So Many Thoughts on This

21. Mike's Wall Art

22. Painting Miscommunication Leading to Mike's Monologue Coded

23. Yes, That Scene Did Foreshadow Mike's Monologue as Disingenuous

24. Mike's Monologue Didn't Sit Right With Me

25. Blue And Yellow Pen

26. That Tweet Is So Sweet

27. Heart Eyes, Literally

28. "My Process of Realizing Byler is Real"

29. Looking at Will, Not El

30. High School Musical Parallel

31. Said It Before and I'll Say It Again

32. Delusional Milkdud?

33. ST Writers Twitter Analysis 1

34. ST Writers Twitter Analysis 2

35. For When You Are Doubting Byler

36. Is Mike Bi or Gay?

37. Fully Convinced

38. The Ultimate Byler Playlist (my Byler YouTube playlist)

39. 100% Confident

40. Mike in S4 and S2

41. Mike Is Angry With Himself

42. It's Been A Year, Mike

43. Rink-O-Mania Remodel

44. The Development Of Will And Mike's Relationship

45. Mike's Lies

46. El Was Holding So Much In

47. Flickergate + Lettergate

48. Did Mike Ever Like El Romantically?

49. Mike Is Stupid

50. Byler Won't Write Itself

51. What's The Alternative Explanation?

52. Comparing Mileven and Byler

53. It Was Always About Them

54. Mike Is Not Ok

55. He Has A Love Interest

56. Will's Happy Ending

57. Trying To Be Normal

58. It's Not That Milevens Are Homophobic

59. Byler Is Reality

60. A Proper Look At El's Shrine To Mike

61. Mileven Through The Seasons

62. Suspicious

63. I Can't Doubt Byler

64. D&D Soulmates

65. Let's Talk Phones

66. Not Delusional

67. What Do They Want?

68. The Main Character

69. Mike's Mental Health

70. So Close

71. This Look Confirms Byler Isn't One Sided

72. Mileven Is Bones

73. They Don't Care About Mileven?

74. The Airport Hug Will Always Be Famous

75. The Monologue Mystery, Why Did They Lose?

76. The Cabin Scene

77. Why Couldn't Mike Say It For 2 Seasons?

78. He Was Trying To Find Will

79. Mike The Surfer Boy

80. Mike Definitely Shows Attraction To Girls

81. The Cast Knows

82. Mileven Loses On All Fronts

83. The Bouquet

84. 53 Minutes And 5 Seconds

85. Pink Panther

86. El And Choice

87. Will's Spotify Playlist

88. He'll Come Crawling Back To You, Begging For Forgiveness

89. Mike's Character Arc Prediction

90. It's The Same Look

91. Will's Truly Happy Ending

92. That's The Same Look, Right?

93. You're The Heart

94. Mike And El's Relationship In S4 Was Really Weird

95. Fireworks Parallel

96. Mileven Has Been Built Up For 4 Seasons

97. Not Stupid: The Fate of Mileven and Byler

98. This Suddenly Makes So Much Sense

99. Metaphors In Filmmaking

And unfortunately Tumblr will only let me add 100 links per post, so when I've posted part 2 of this list, I'll link it here: Part 2

[will80sbyers]

What makes you believe that byler is real? I ship Mileven personally, but I'm trying to understand byler shippers' logic, because a lot of the time it feels like it makes no sense.

I personally think there are some scenes in the show and there are some choices that the writers made that are telling us that the plot of the show is going towards Will getting a "pay off", in terms of writing, at the end of the show and Mike and El finding out they are better as friends instead and Mike discovering he has romantic feelings for Will!

The writers have emphasized Will's sadness in relation to Mike and El as a couple both thematically and visually, in the writing & filming of the show there are too many scenes like this especially in season 3 and 4 they have made it clear that he will never be happy if Mike and El are the endgame relationship, even during Mike's love monologue after he supposedly decided that he was ok with El having his own feelings for Mike by saying that the painting was a thoughtful gift from El when it wasn't... They put a shot of Will's sad face in the middle of the monologue, and also he was framed behind Mike when he said "I love you" which in film is a EXTREMELY weird choice unless it means something more is going on that should make us not want El and Mike's relationship to work - the writers have been sabotaging the emotional connection of the fans with mileven by doing this and I don't think that professional filmmakers don't know that, I think it's on purpose!

The writers have shown Mike and Will as having a deeper relationship than all the other relationships Mike has, putting him in the same category of El as one of his possible love interests in the plot, they have multiple scenes bonding in a tender way than Mike has with any other of his friends, they happen in private usually or in emotionally charged moments that they film to make you as a viewer feel like they are in private and show how they have this connection that's more than just friendship

The writers have wrote in the show since season 1 MANY parallels between Mike and Will and other official couples (Mileven too!!!) that are, in my opinion, hinting at them ending up together at the end of the show

You can find the parallels here

The writers have continously shown El and Mike to have some kind of problem in their relationship and made El decide to leave Mike behind multiple times even if to save his life because she loves him, the writers have been showing us how Mike is not her PLOT priority and instead they have put having a romantic relationship with Mike as Will's deepest desire since season 3

The writers are building up El's character to have a coming of age that has recurrent themes of her finding herself without the influence of others around her, her becoming completely free from any kind of influence, and Mike has been represented as having too many internal fears to overcome at the moment about their relationship, especially with the love monologue at the end of season 4, he has beliefs about himself as a person that clash with El's character arc about not having to feel influenced in any way, the end of the show for El should be her having complete freedom in all aspects of her life because of the circumstances of her upbringing... Not saying that Mike is influencing her in a bad way necessarily, I think they both love each other a lot but having a relationship with someone that is that much insecure about his role in your life because you have powers will always be a type of influence

The writers have shown Mike and El as not being a team at the same level by separating them constantly after s1, instead they have shown the other couples that work as working together in the supernatural plot (Jancy, Jopper, Lumax, Byler)

The writers have paralleled Mike and El's relationship to all the ships that are not working for some reasons/are not endgame and have more infatuation than a real "true love" kind of relationship (Steve x Nancy, Karen X Ted, Bob x Joyce)

The writers have wrote in multiple scenes of Mike acting awkward with Will (Mike!!! Not Will) or them having coded conversations about how much they care for each other that have no sense to exist unless there is a pay off at the end

The writers have presented El, Mike and Will as being in a love triangle and have been framing them in a love triangle composition in the framing of multiple scenes, with Mike at the centre

When during season 4 the writers talked about all the movies that have inspired season 4 and 5 they have put multiple movies with love triangles that are almost identical to the situation between Mike, El and Will

Will and Mike have multiple fight scenes that are scenes you give to two possible love interests usually, the way the fight happen is written as two lovers having emotional fights instead of as how you would write two friends fighting

The writers wrote in the show a precise parallel in all the scenes of Vickie and Robin... between them and Will and Mike, paralleling Mike to Vickie specifically... who is a canon bisexual character and even paralleling Steve and Jonathan in that context as observers of the couples!

The directors filmed their scenes how you would film romantic scenes in stuff like Bridgerton or a romcom lol

The whole painting scene was Will making Mike feel so loved that he felt comfortable being vulnerable with El, but this means he was still not comfortable on his own relationship with her, he didn't feel safe enough to open up on his own and needed that talk and needed to believe all of those ideas about him being the heart came from Eleven so that he made the jump and told her how he felt instead of being selfishly silent on it because he was too afraid of her possibly leaving him one day... When you are really deeply in love with someone in the context of movies the characters don't let those type of fears influence them and if what gives him courage is the feelings of another character in the love triangle it means he's the right person for the character

( idk if you saw gossip girl but the was a love triangle situation between Blair, Dan and another character where Dan made Blair believe the other character felt some type of way towards her, she understood that she loved Dan because of this act because she wanted those words to be from him and not from the other guy... The whole painting lie is that same trope)

The writers are obsessed with IT from Stephen King and there are clear parallels with it in the show, the whole plot of s4 about the painting is a reprise of the plot between the romantic relationship of Bev and Ben in IT (with the postcard and the poem) Beverly is supposed to be Mike, Ben is Will and Bill is El.... Mike and El share a kiss at the end of season 3 that is supposed to parallel a kiss between Bill and Bev (they did love each other and liked each other but are not endgame)

Both Will and Mike are queercoded multiple times during the seasons

There are WAYYYY more reasons but this post is becoming too long so I'll leave it as this lol

You should rewatch the show and imagine if Will was a girl, I think many people would be seeing what I'm talking about way more and take it as a sign that Mike is going to choose "Willow" and see how Will is the better love interest for him...

Maybe it's all just queerbaiting, who knows, but at the moment I believe this is way too much for it to be queerbait!

I personally think Mike is bisexual

Masterpost about it here

and has feelings for both of them, but his feelings for El have always been a "puppy love" type that is growing to become more platonic than romantic with time, and I think he's a best match with Will, I think Will is able to make him be the best he can be, he's capable of making Mike feel worthy in a very natural way unlike the relationship with El does at the moment!

In my fixed post in the blog you can find all these things in more detail if you're interested!!

Thank you if you read all of this, regardless of what I believe I think everybody should be free to ship what ship they like best!! 😊

[nerdflayer]

This is my opinion on why I believe the GA doesn’t see Byler.

Before I begin, I just want to say I’ve been a Byler fan since Season 1. Season 2 cemented my feelings about them. Season 3 crushed my soul. And season 4 at first watch made me feel pessimistic but eventually optimistic. As a gay boy myself I can’t help but see the whole show through Will eyes (he is me) and can’t help but fall in love with Mike. I mean he did so much for Will in the beginning, how could you not love Mike for that.

The relationship between the boys really does take a turn for the worse coming off S2 into S3 because Mikes character kind of does a 180 in terms of Bylers relationship.

Anyway. Talking about S4, we see A LOT of the CA plot line from Wills perspective. And I think this is key to people not seeing Byler. Wills feelings are made very clear. He’s depressed, traumatized, he doesn’t fit in, he is well aware of his homosexuality which brings stress and suffering and the tremendous disappointment that he has in Mikes character, yet he can’t help but love regardless. With that said, Wills POV is bleak, and coming off the back of S3 it’s easier and, I would say necessary, for his character to believe that Mike doesn’t love him. The pain of letting yourself believe they do love you only to be rejected, is very hurtful. And I don’t think that boy can handle more pain so it’s safer for him to deny the hope. Will even says “I’m not going to fall in love.”

Mikes actions also play into this. Will does not see Mikes love for him. He can’t hug him, is dismissive, he argues and blames Will at Rink O Mania, he wrote to El but didn’t seam to call Will, makes the whole trip about El, isn’t attentive to Will at all, and even when Mike apologizes for obsessing over El- every one of their conversations is still about her. Again this is Wills POV. I will say Mike does give him hints and mix messages for romantics feelings but like I said, how is Will suppose to trust? Is Will just reading into the flirting because he wants it so badly? It needs to be direct otherwise Will and the GA won’t see it or believe it.

Obviously there are a lot of hints for Byler, and I believe 100% it will happen. I’m choosing to trust the hope even though Will isn’t able to.

My point is I think Wills painful POV cannot be underestimated even if straight viewers dont like Will you can’t deny how powerful it is. Will literally helped Mike say I love you to El because he doesn’t have hope for himself. I think straight viewers use his hopeless as evidence for why Mike and El will end up together. It’s interesting that you hate Will but Will plays a role in convincing you of Milevens endgame. What they don’t understand, other than all the Byler evidence, is that Will is wrong! Mike does have romantic feelings for him and Mike will get there! Because Mike doesn’t need to find himself he needs to return to the person he’s always been. He showed us who he is and it’s the person he was in S1 & S2 and we see it when he’s with Will!

[hercynianforest]

Reasons why Mileven drama/breakup and Byler endgame in ST5 are unlikely

Looking at the whole show, we can see two constants regarding these relationships:

-Mike and El keep overcoming external and internal obstacles, and always end up together again

-Will's homosexuality is hinted at from the start, as well as his deep feelings for Mike.

Regarding the latter, this creates the expectation to have Will accept his own feelings and then his friends do the same.

In S4, it's clear that we got the first. Will's monologue didn't achieve the coming out, but he did express his love for Mike, albeit disguising it as El's feelings. He basically sacrificed himself in order to support Mike, who in turn was able to support El, who then managed to (barely) save Max.

Based on that, I think we have two possible scenarios for S5:

-Will won't confess his love to Mike openly. He has accepted that Mike and El love each other, and we see him having moved on from this right from the beginning of the season. His coming out as gay will still happen though, and Mike's acceptance of that will be crucial for Will.

-Will will confess to Mike that he's in love with him - I'm thinking of the close-up of his face during Mike's monologue in S4, when he says "And somehow I thought telling you how I felt would make that day hurt more." Will clearly feels the same way, but maybe hearing Mike confess this to El gives him the courage to confess it to Mike as well.

No matter which scenario we'll get, I think the focus will be on Mike's acceptance of Will's homosexuality, on him being different, but Mike making him feel better for it. It's possible that Mike might mess it up, not knowing what to say, but no doubt he will be accepting of Will's sexuality, and I think this will give power to Will to be freely himself (and maybe kick some butt).

However, from a storytelling perspective, I really don't see Mike suddenly realising he loves Will and not El. It would be extremely bad writing, because they have been telling us that Mike and El love each other since they first met in S1.

If they had not planned for them to be endgame, they would have sunken the ship already. There were plenty of opportunities. But what we got instead were relationship issues and them being able to work through these issues.

Mike not being very articulate at telling El how he feels about her has also been a constant since S1. However, this finally got resolved at the end of S4.

That's why I think that ST5 will start of with a strenghtened bond between them and their love won't be tested any more.

Mike finally told her how much he loves her, El has no more reason to doubt him. Mike doing a 180 degree turn and realising he lied to El would be equal to creating a new character for Mike. It also would spit on everything they took the pain to show us of Mike and El's love during the whole show.

From a storytelling perspective, this would be total self-sabotage. Why waste a whole series to tell viewers that two characters are in love and then saying "Surprise! It was a lie all along!"? What would be achieved by that?

If it had been their goal to show us that romantic feelings can change, then they would have had to tell a completely different story and would have sowed the seeds for doubt from the very beginning. Instead we got nothing but soulmatism for Mike and Eleven (including their relationship issues, because they overcame those).

Also, remember that this story is about defeating the big evil with love. El is the super-hero. Destroying her biggest source of power (love) would make it impossible for her to win against anyone.

Apart from all this, considering everything that needs to be wrapped up in S5, there simply is not enough time to have Will confess to Mike, Mike figuring out his new feelings, getting up the courage to tell El, the drama of breaking up the main ship of the show, have El get over it, establish Mike and Will as a couple, get all their friends' support, AND defeat Henry.

This is why they resolved Mike and El's conflict in S4. Because there won't even be time for their established relationship to have any drama. This is why they already showed us that Will accepts and supports Mike and El's love, so the love triangle situation has been resolved as well.

The only thing left to resolve is Will's coming out to his friends, which doesn't need to take up a lot of time. It could be one or two scenes.

[hellinhawkins]

”byler would be rushed!”

wrong! mileven kissed after knowing each other for around six episodes when they were twelve and eleven couldn’t speak basic english! mike and will have known each other since they were five and know everything about each other! they have had intense buildup over five seasons!! hope this helps <3

“byler would be poor writing!”

wrong again! mike and will have had deeper more heartfelt scenes since episode one than mileven has and it would reveal how much effort the duffers put in to hiding easter eggs and hinting strongly in this direction for YEARS!! hope you find this helpful <333

[malfack]

i'll never understand people who choose mileven cause it's literally the most toxic ship i've ever met. even the cast members agree with that.

listen - girl who grew up outside of society becomes attached to the first person she meets who takes her in and gives care. she doesn't know what love is and thinks that's what's going on between her and mike.

meanwhile, mike, who grew up in an unhappy family with a homophobic father, tries to behave like everyone else, to fit in with society and indoctrinate himself with his feelings for eleven, because he must have a girlfriend. mike using el as a cover and protection, thus traumatizing her time after time. he loves odie, he really does, but it is not the love she thinks it is. mileven can only exist in a platonic way because mike is gay, and the duffers reveal this throughout the series, giving millions of obvious references and almost direct hints. people who think byler is fanon and not canon have either watched the series extremely superficially, completely ignoring the details and internal problems of the characters, or are homophobes who are willing to turn a blind eye to everything just to avoid seeing the real thing.

we’ve already seen the outcome of the romantic mileven - two unhappy people who don’t have a mutual understanding and are completely unable to communicate with each other, + suffering will, who is forced to watch this whole game of love -

the only way out in their situation - eleven who is temporarily left alone to work through her own traumas and just live for herself, without trying to please anyone. and the long-awaited byler romantic reunion ofc .

[bibylers]

Another mileven s4 love confession theory!! 😌 (BYLER)

Okay so, obviously Mike’s love confession to El is just about him telling her he loves her. But what if I told you there’s something in the same episode that could hint to the fact that Mileven is just platonic?

Let’s take a look at what time the love confession happens.

1:30. Now, only a few scenes later, what happens? Something really memorable.

Eddies death, 1:40. Let’s think about some similarities during these scenes.

Eddie is very close to death, and so is El.

Dustin is with Eddie, Mike is with El.

Eddie tells Dustin he loves him and Dustin says it too (platonically obviously). Mike tells El he loves her (“romantically”) El obviously can’t say it back.

So, if their scenes are so alike, why does Mike and El need to be romantic, if they’re almost paralleled to a platonic duo?

Also, they show that a friend can tell a friend that they love them, without it needing to be romantic, only 10 minutes after Mike tells El he loves her.

There’s just something about these scenes being so close and so memorable and so alike, that’s taking my attention.

It’s almost as if the duffers are trying to show us how Mike telling El he loves her doesn’t automatically mean he romantically loves her.

Just to add to this theory,

Will literally needed to tell Mike to say I love you to El.

[bylrlve]

Warning! Potential spoilers for Stranger Things 5!

To recap, Alex received this dm on 13/2/23, seemingly confirming mileven breakup

She received this message on that day, which states that mileven are still together and happy. However it’s also instantly debunkable bc they’re absolutely not going to do the Hopper-Mike feud bs again. That is beyond clear.

On this past Tuesday, 20/2/23, she received a second message outright stating Mileven breakup.

Finally, on Wednesday, 21/2/23, she received this message full of pretty plausible statements, with mileven breakup included as fact. Interesting.

This person claims it’s all fake, with no rationale or alt info - what, is Will not important now?

Worth noting: Millie is currently doing promo for Damsels, so she’ll be out of commission re: filming for a few weeks. Early March is probably when she’ll come back, but Finn will be be busy with his Ghosbusters 2 promo.

Two conclusions:

1.) there will be no mileven scenes filmed for a few weeks. Filming schedules are very tightly planned to accommodate other actor commitments, so it doesn’t seem like this posed a massive issue. Hm.

2,) Millie will likely be doing any scenes she has with Sadie and Caleb, aka Max and Lucas, when she gets back. As this message says.

This person is probably just smart and well-informed enough to figure this out, but it’s interesting.

There has been some very intriguing activity on a stranger things set a few days ago - red UD ligthing, castle Byers.., and Will Byers. Will’s plotline for season 5 seriously looks like everything us Will stans have been dreaming of in terms of plot relevance, emotional catharsis, etc. This pic dropped yesterday, and the spoiler acc seems to have confirmed it’s Will:

Lastly,this also dropped today:

(Credit to @1987byler on twt)

Very strange framework, here. If the goal is to set up Will being rejected gently by Mike, but understood and accepted, why not focus on that? Why not have Vecna say ‘you’re afraid he’ll be disgusted by you. You’re afraid he’ll see you as the disgusting, broken boy you are’ or something like that? Elsewhere in the game, it’s being reported by players that Will is being taunted about how his friends are all ignoring him, and how Max fits into the group better than he does. This is canonically a sore spot for him - not so much the Max part, but the general point. So why not emphasise his fear of Mike’s rejection, rather than his hurt at Mike picking El over him?

Maybe because, if this is carried into s5 and we get scenes of Vecna taunting Will about Mike choosing El, it’ll be certain that Mike will indeed pick Will. Maybe this is a means of hinting that?

(Side note: at this point in the time line, El was really just a concept to Will. The one time he met her, it was for barely a minute as a delirious, dying child. By s4, it’s very clear that they’re close and loving. I’ll hear no critique of him for apparently not wanting her to come back - it’s very obviously Vecna twisting things, as he did with Max in s4 to make it seem like she actively wanted to murder Billy.)

Also worth noting: the best Mike can say about the girl he supposedly loved at first sight, after a whole week with her, is that she’s ‘cool’, ‘different’, ‘awesome’. Very lacklustre. Compare to how Lucas would describe the comatose max to a newcomer in s4.

Finally: Will quite literally utilises a never-seen memory of Mike and him in Castle Byers as his happy menory, his safe place. You know,like the Snow Ball and those other memories of good times with Lucas that Max clung to in s4?

Credit to @will80sbyers

This post by @nebulousfishgills reports Vecna saying that Will is ‘the key’, manipulating Will’s memories, and directly saying “You’ll finally matter to someone, Will.” Byler kind of has to be endgame, right? For this to make any sense as a narrative? ‘We can still be friends’ won’t cut it, not if, as the messages Alex is getting make out, Will is still so achingly in love post-time jump that he’s staying by Mike’s hospital bed after everyone else leaves and kissing his forehead (a). Not if they’re still emphasising that Mike is his safe place, his home, his light, in (technically) pre-season five promotional material.

All of this is… interesting, to say the least.

I’ll leave off by sharing the posts made by the wonderful @solgmorell on the set leak (x) and the VR byler stuff (x, y).

(a)

ETA: two of the previous dms Alex has gotten state that Will struggles with his friendships with the other party member this season due to being closeted. This game touches heavily on Will’s feeling disconnected from his friends, at least partly bc of his sexuality…. One is above, the other is here:

[starsarefire824]

Guys, I literally want Byler to be endgame, and the hints that have been left in season 3 and 4 have led me to the same belief that everyone else here has---I don't think Mileven are compatible, and I think they're destined to go their separate ways. I think that Mike and Will love each other the way the other needs to be loved, which neither Mike or Eleven ever felt about each other since season 2.

I'm just saying----for all ya'lls mental health and as someone who's been in fandom spaces for like 20 years at this point. DON'T let it stop you from enjoying it or making stuff you love if it happens to not be canon.