#i JUST got to davos i in acok :

[fjordstan]

GET HIS ASS DAVOS

[baelontargaryen]

ASOIAF + Wind and words

Robert set the pace, driving his huge black destrier hard as Ned galloped along beside him, trying to keep up. He called out a question as they rode, but the wind blew his words away, and the king did not hear him. After that Ned rode in silence. They soon left the kingsroad and took off across rolling plains dark with mist. By then the guard had fallen back a small distance, safely out of earshot, but still Robert would not slow. — AGOT, Eddard I

“Then Lord Eddard is a man in ten thousand. Most of us are not so strong. What is honor compared to a woman’s love? What is duty against the feel of a newborn son in your arms … or the memory of a brother’s smile? Wind and words. Wind and words. We are only human, and the gods have fashioned us for love. That is our great glory, and our great tragedy. — AGOT, Jon VIII

“Well, as to that, some gave me soft words and some blunt, some made excuses, some promises, some only lied.” He shrugged. “In the end words are just wind.” — ACOK, Prologue

The maester laughed at that. “And there you have it, my lord. Words are wind, you know, and you’ve blown mine away with your good sense. His Grace knows what he has in you, I think.” — ASOS, Davos V

“Words. Words are wind. Why do you think I abandoned Dragonstone and sailed to the Wall, Lord Snow?” — ASOS, Jon XI

“Words are wind. If you love me, do not leave me.” — AFFC, A Soiled Knight

“. . . did not stop you slaying Aerys. Words are wind. You could have had me, but you chose a cloak instead. Get out.” — AFFC, Jaime II

“Words are wind,” Victarion told them, “and the only good wind is that which fills our sails. Would you have me fight the Crow’s Eye? Brother against brother, ironborn against ironborn?” Euron was still his elder, no matter how much bad blood might be between them. No man is as accursed as the kinslayer. — AFFC, The Iron Captain

Words are wind, Brienne told herself. They cannot hurt you. Let them wash over you. “As you command, my lord,” she tried to say, but Tarly had gone before she got it out. She walked from the yard like one asleep, not knowing where she was going. — AFFC, Brienne V

“So you say. Words are wind. When the hour is ripe, you may produce this paragon of yours and we will see if he is all that you have promised.” — AFFC, Cersei VII

The thing that had been Catelyn Stark took hold of her throat again, fingers pinching at the ghastly long slash in her neck, and choked out more sounds. “Words are wind, she says,” the northman told Brienne. “She says that you must prove your faith.” — AFFC, Brienne VIII

“Fine words.” Tyrion was unimpressed. “Words are wind. Who is this bloody savior?” — ADWD, Tyrion I

[...] “From all I hear, his lordship’s fatter than ever. So much for vows. Words are wind, and the wind from Manderly’s mouth means no more than the wind escaping out his bottom.” — ADWD, Davos I

“Words are wind,” said the young woman behind Lord Wyman’s high seat, the handsome one with the long brown braid. “And men will lie to get their way, as any maid could tell you.” — ADWD, Davos III

He shall be the stallion that mounts the world. Dany knew how it went with prophecies. They were made of words, and words were wind. There would be no son for Loraq, no heir to unite dragon and harpy. When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, when the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves. Only then would her womb quicken once again … ... Dany folded her hands together. “Words are wind, even words like love and peace. I put more trust in deeds. In my Seven Kingdoms, knights go on quests to prove themselves worthy of the maiden that they love. They seek for magic swords, for chests of gold, for crowns stolen from a dragon’s hoard.” — ADWD, Daenerys IV

Iron Emmett grimaced. “Men are men, vows are words, and words are wind. You should put guards around the women.” — ADWD, Jon VII

“Be that as it may, they do not trust you. The men of New Ghis feel the same. Words are wind, as you yourself have so oft said. No words of yours will secure this peace for Meereen. Your foes require deeds. They would see us wed, and they would see me crowned as king, to rule beside you.” — ADWD, Daenerys VI

“That is good to hear,” the prince said, “but words are wind. You are my brother’s daughters and I love you, but I have learned I cannot trust you. I want your oath. Will you swear to serve me, to do as I command?” — ADWD, The Watcher

“—that I am half a wildling myself, a turncloak who means to sell the realm to our raiders, cannibals, and giants.” Jon did not need to stare into a fire to know what was being said of him. The worst part was, they were not wrong, not wholly. “Words are wind, and the wind is always blowing at the Wall. Come.” — ADWD, Jon VIII

“Words are wind.” They are no better than me. We’re just the same. “You killed the others, why not him? Yellow Dick—” — ADWD, Theon I

The words seemed to give the girl some comfort. Words are wind, though, Ser Barristan thought. How can I protect the queen when I am not with her? — ADWD, The Queensguard

His years in the Kingsguard had taught him the trick of listening without hearing, especially useful when the speaker was intent on proving that words were truly wind. — ADWD, The Discarded Knight

Cersei walked on. I am blind and deaf, and they are worms, she told herself. “Shame, shame,” the septas sang. “Chestnuts, hot roast chestnuts,” a peddler cried. “Queen Cunt,” a drunkard pronounced solemnly from a balcony above, lifting his cup to her in a mocking toast. “All hail the royal teats!” Words are wind, Cersei thought. Words cannot harm me .… Words are wind, she thought, words cannot hurt me. — ADWD, Cersei II

A steady drip-drip-drip punctuated his words, as snowmelt ran off his cloak to puddle on the floor. The snow had been falling on King’s Landing most of the night; outside the drifts were ankle deep. Ser Kevan Lannister pulled his cloak about himself more closely. “So you say, ser. Words are wind.” — ADWD, Epilogue

[agentrouka-blog]

"It is customary to take a finger from a thief," Lord Tarly replied in a hard voice, "but a man who steals from a sept is stealing from the gods." He turned to his captain of guards. "Seven fingers. Leave his thumbs."- Brienne(AFFC III). It reminds me of Stannis taking fingers of Davos. Is it actually punishment for thievery?

I don't think we have reason to doubt that Randyll Tarly is speaking the truth about the customary punishment. But oh, is it ever unflattering to be compared to him. How much more like Stannis could this man seem in the scene where he is holding court in Maidenpool?

A stripling in a roughspun cloak and soiled jerkin was being heard when they came up. “I never hurt no one, m’lord,” Brienne heard him say. “I only took what the septons left when they run off. If you got to take my finger for that, do it.” “It is customary to take a finger from a thief,” Lord Tarly replied in a hard voice, “but a man who steals from a sept is stealing from the gods.” He turned to his captain of guards. “Seven fingers. Leave his thumbs.” “Seven?” The thief paled. When the guards seized hold of him he tried to fight, but feebly, as if he were already maimed. Watching him, Brienne could not help think of Ser Jaime, and the way he’d screamed when Zollo’s arakh came flashing down. (AFFC, Brienne III)

That's a kid. A teenager, more than likely, seemingly maimed from a previous injury, taking from an abandoned sept in order to survive in a region devastated by war. Even if there was paying work to be had, what is he even capable of doing if he can't work up a proper struggle in a moment of accute panic? Now they are taking the majority of his fingers. He's going to die starving and begging. Over stealing from an abandoned sept. This judgment serves no one. How can it be justice?

That's something Davos never allows himself to think about.

Everything I am, I owe to him. Stannis had raised him to knighthood. He had given him a place of honor at his table, a war galley to sail in place of a smuggler's skiff. [...] All this he had of Stannis Baratheon, for the price of a few finger joints. It was just, what he did to me. I had flouted the king's laws all my life. He has earned my loyalty. Davos touched the little pouch that hung from the leather thong about his neck. His fingers were his luck, and he needed luck now. As do we all. Lord Stannis most of all. (ACOK, Davos I)

He so ardently wants to believe he is serving a just man. The man who gave him status and wealth, who accepts the council of a lowborn man, but who also maimed him when he could have pardoned him. It must be justice. Stannis is a just man who doesn't bend the rules for anyone. It's right that he should be king. Davos owes him. It must have been justice. Stannis is a just man. He'll make a good king who does justice. Surely.

[lant-sovs]

on rhaenyras children

Been seeing a couple of takes that try to say that jace, luke and joffreys paternity “doesnt matter” or that theyre not bastards because theyve been “claimed” by both rhaenyra and laenor/house velaryon. I dont know what the real life practices were in relation to bastard children, but that is absolutely not true by asoiaf standards. (and yes you do have to interpret the issue of parentage in the show based on the in-universe context.)

First, Rhaenyras children are bastards. Lets just get that out of the way first. someone tried to assert that since its Rhaenyra who has the claim the children are Targaryen through her and therefore not bastards, but if Alicent were to have bastard children they would be bastards because she herself has no claim which is.. incorrect. In asoiaf, a bastard is any child born out of wedlock. Lollys Stokeworth’s son is still a bastard, despite any possible inheritance of his coming from his mother (Jaime II, AFFC). Theres no question on whether or not Rhaenyra’s kids are bastards- they are. Its a settled definition. You cannot simply tweak the definition of bastards and tie their legitimacy to Rhaenyra’s claim. Thats not how it works. Any child born out of wedlock is a bastard. Next question.  Second. Laenor and Rhaenyra “claiming” the children as theirs does not erase their bastardry. Again, I have no idea how real life bastardry was addressed, but I do know there is no such thing as ‘claiming’ bastard children in asoiaf. There are two other concepts though - acknowledgement, and legitimization. A parent may acknowledge their bastard child, and acknowledged bastards get region-typical surnames (Storm, Stone, Flowers, Sand, Snow, etc). Best example? Jon Snow, who was acknowledged by his ‘apparent’ father. Remember, this doesn’t make Jon not a bastard - Jon is still very much a bastard throughout the GOT timeline, he’s just an acknowledged one. The same goes for all the sand snakes- their last name is Sand because Oberyn acknowledged them. Gendry, on the other hands, doesnt use the surname Waters because he was never acknowledged by Robert, whereas another one of Roberts bastards is Edric Storm, who has the bastard surname storm because Robert acknowledged him as his bastard son by Delena Florent (Davos I, ACOK). Edric is still a bastard, because Robert didnt legitimise him. (If he had, Edric would be Edric Baratheon instead). The acknowledgement does NOT change the bastardry. The only thing that could possibly change their bastardry is having them legitimised, but only a king or queen can legitimise a bastard. We see this with Ramsay Bolton, who was previously Ramsay Snow but was legitimised by Tommen (Jaime IX, ASOS). Similarly, Robb (when crowned King in the North) legitimises Jon (in ASOS I believe). That still holds weight, even if Robb isnt sitting the iron throne at the time, because he’s been crowned King in The North. F&B readers will know about two other bastards who are legitimised later, but I wont bring that up bc spoilers. Heres where things get spicy. Rhaenyra can never legitimise her children. Why? Because for them to be legitimised, she has to first admit they were bastards in need of legitimising in the first place. You’d only need to remove the status of bastardry from a child if you recognise that they werent trueborn to begin with. Any attempt to legitimise them would only prove to everyone around her that she lied about their parentage all this while. Its her very own catch-22, and IMO its one of the really well written details of F&B.  What Rhaenyra is doing is neither acknowledgement nor legitimisation nor ‘claiming’, because again, there is no such thing in-universe. What Rhaenyra is doing is, very simply, lying about her childrens parentage. And just to be clear, I’m not anti-black or anti-green (I love the dance because its a story of mutual destruction, I have zero interest in taking sides). But I am anti-misinformation and anti-misinterpretation of the text. If you can find one example of a bastard child in ASOIAF who wasnt considered a bastard because they were ‘claimed’ by their parent, then (and I mean this sincerely) I invite you to disagree with me, but until then. 

[greywoe]

sketches sketches sketches

got inspired by looking at some of those year end wips (by artists way better than me) and decided to post some old sketches i could find bc sometimes i enjoy the sketches more than the final illustration lol. so without further ado:

similar to the one of jon i posted above, here's a really ancient one of arya. don't know where i was going with this one i think it was just a doodle

here's a progress pic of the sansa collage i posted way back that looks godawful to me now but whatever. hashtag behind the scenes

i made a whole bunch of collages that i never got around to posting (i should). here's a progress pic of one of those (as you can see i colour the necessary bits first, then add the cutouts, then the final lineart):

and here's a screenshot i took in the middle of drawing the cat and brienne scene. i actually think i overworked it a little, i liked it better with flats (also the colours look like ass here, they always look more vibrant in procreate but when i export the pics they end up super desaturated. idk why)

NOW to the fun part! so when i first read the books way back i had this notebook that i doodled scenes that i liked or made an impact on me (i guess) in. i might or might not post some in the future - they're simple pencil doodles and super old and certified rubbish but they're still kinda funny because of that lol. in any case here are a few of them in the rough sketch stage:

arya and gendry playfighting at acorn hall, mel visiting davos in jail (LMAO)

jon and ygritte first meeting (you can barely tell what's going on there at all lol). sandor and beric fight

Ok so now it's theon time. in that drawing i made of him with reek!ramsay in acok i initially yassified his crown and had to stop when i remembered it's supposed to be shit.

"crown" (it does look a little like worms at this stage so i guess it's not so ill-fitting after all)

uhh anyway you all know what this next one is about. love this delusional child <3 (might just refine it to make it post-worthy so look forward to that i guess...........)

and finally the Tree drawing but it's just the lineart bc my colouring skills are... lacking

[melrosing]

Favorite POVs/books in order?

books is easy:

A Feast for Crows bc of my severe Jaime/Brienne/Cersei bias obvs. Their POVs are like half this entire book if not more. GRRM wrote this book for me specifically

A Storm of Swords because firstly GRRM is killing it here with Jaime’s POVs but also just what’s not to like about ASOS. it’s got it all

A Clash of Kings I think old acok gets neglected even more so than AFFC these days honestly but I like it a lot. I think a lot of characters really come into their own here, esp Tyrion and Catelyn, and Sansa most of all. Plus I’m living for the KL a drama and also hello Brienne! And of course a shout out to Jaime’s salty bastard man monologue

A Game of Thrones - I love the slow build and the calm before the storm of it all and just the DREAD you get as a re-reader I am Walter white screaming from inside the car

A Dance With Dragons - no shade because ADWD has so much going for it like the climax of Dany’s arc + the intro of Joncon’s POV + Bran’s chapters in this volume are some of my faves buuut yeah I do find many of ADWD’s chapters slower going. I keep meaning to try out a combined order to break some of ADWD's acts up a bit with AFFC's but I can't lie I just really the binge of J/B/C in AFFC soooo

POVs in this order (though if I were to do by each book it would probably vary a little, and also the order I like the POVs isn't really the order I like the characters themselves necessarily... except the top three obvs):

Jaime Brienne Cersei Sansa Bran Catelyn Arya Dany Theon Tyrion Arianne Ned Jon Sam Asha Joncon Davos Aeron Quentyn Areo Victarion Melisandre Barristan Arys

[amaidasfairassummer]

Updated- A SONG OF ICE AND FIRE THE MUSICAL!

Various songs from existing musicals brought together to tell the story Asoiaf, including some pre-series stuff. Obvs some of this doesn’t translate literally, some of the songs I chose more for the vibe rather than specifically relevant lyrics, and some are pretty much just jokes.

- Aerys- “Johanna” from Sweeney Todd 

- Tyrion’s birth- “Miracle” from Matilda (mostly the last couple of minutes).

- Baby innocent optimistic Tyrion before Tywin fucked him up- “Naughty” from Matilda.

- Also baby Tyrion- “Quiet” from Matilda.

- Elia @ Rhaegar- “No Way” from Six.

- Robert and Ned during the rebellion- “You and Me (But Mostly Me)” from The Book of Mormon. With Robert as elder price and Ned as elder Cunningham of course. Also kind of works for robert and stannis I guess 

- The rebellion- ABC cafe, Les Miserables

- Rebellion-era Robert- “Gaston” from Beauty and the Beast. 

- The siege of Storm’s End- “Those Canaan Days” from Joseph 

- Stannis meeting Davos- “Pulled” from the Addams Family musical

- Stannis- “Stars” from Les Miserables because he’s got Javert vibes.

- Lysa being made to marry Jon A- “I Don’t Need Your Love” from Six.

- Tyrion and Tysha meeting- “Love is an open door” from Frozen the musical 

- Tyrion and Tysha’s elopement- “A Million Dreams” from The Greatest Showman, “Marry for Love” from Cinderella fro (or for a modern au, “Wishing for the Normal” from Soho Cinders).

- Tysha after the elopement- “I Dreamed A Dream” from Les Miserables

- Ramsay @ Roose after murdering Domeric- “One More Angel in Heaven” from Joseph and the Amazing Technicolour Dreamcoat.

- Catelyn- “How Do You Solve A Problem Like [Arya]” from The Sound of Music.

- Jaime and Cersei- “Our Love Is God” from Heathers.

- Sansa during her and Joff’s courtship- “I can hear the bells” from Hairspray and “I Feel Pretty” from West Side Story (this could be repeated with her when loras gives her the rose during the tourney actually). 

- Cat saying goodbye to Bran- (parts of) “Heart of Stone” from Six.

- Bran coming out of his coma dream- “Defying Gravity” from Wicked (he probably also reprises this when he learns to warg into birds)

- Arya and Syrio’s “dancing” lessons- “I’ll Make A Man Out Of You” from Mulan.

- Petyr @ Catelyn- “I’m Not Saying A Word” from Blood Brothers.

- Petyr @ Sansa- “Hello, Little Girl” from Into The Woods.

- Tyrion every time he’s in a jail cell- “Close Every Door To Me” from Joseph and the Amazing Technicolour Dreamcoat.

- Cersei after Robert’s death- “Get Down” from Six.

- Theon and Robb- “That Guy” from Blood Brothers.

- Cat after Ned’s death- “The Cold, Hard Ground” from Treason the musical

- The northern lords @ Robb in the King in the North scene- “Take Things Into Our Own Hands” from Treason and “Once We Were Kings” from Billy Elliot.

- Theon finding out he’s going back to the iron islands- “I can go the distance” from Hercules. 

- Inroducing Davos and his family- “Jacob and Sons” from Joseph. 

- Renly and loras, and renly deciding to be king- “The Promise” from Treason the musical 

- Renly in ACOK- “You Don’t Even Know It” from Everybody’s Talking About Jaime 

- Loras and Brienne about Renly, and davos and mel about stannis- “Blind Faith” from Treason. 

- Robb and Cleos Frey- “Farmer refuted” from Hamilton

- Joffrey when he finds out about northern independence- “You’ll Be Back” from Hamilton.

- Bran, Rickon and the Walders- “Kids’ Game” from Blood Brothers.

- Bran @ Jojen in ACOK- “Song of the King” from Joseph and the Amazing Technicolour Dreamcoat.

- About Sam after he killed the Other- “Zero To Hero” from Hercules.

- Theon in ACOK- “My Shot” from Hamilton and “Damned for All Time” from Jesus Christ Superstar 

- Sansa and Sandor in ACOK- “Angel of Music” from The Phantom of the Opera and “Something There” from Beauty and the Beast.

- @ Sansa in King’s Landing- “School Song” from Matilda.

- The people of King’s Landing during ACOK- “At The End Of The Day” from Les Miserables and “Food, Glorious Food” from Oliver!

- Sansa and Sandor during the Battle of Blackwater- “Music Of The Night” from The Phantom of the Opera.

- Margaery’s arrival in King’s Landing- “New Girl In Town” from Hairspray.

- Jaime (not really sure when)- “Wait For It” from Hamilton.

- Devan telling Davos about his brothers dying- “[Four] More Angels In Heaven,” from Joseph and the Amazing Technicolour Dreamcoat, a really heartbreaking version of Ramsay’s song earlier, made 100% times sadder because four people are dead not one and... devan is actually genuinely sad/isn’t responsible for the deaths instead of faking.

- About Davos as Hand (also kind of him being knighted for saving storm’s end- “Stone the Crows” from Joseph and the Amazing Technicolour Dreamcoat.

- Ygritte @ Jon- “Colours Of the Wind” from Pocahontas.

- The slaves of Slavers Bay- “Look Down” from Les Miserables.

- Jaime and Brienne- “I Can Do Without You” from Calamity Jane.

- Theon finding out about Robb’s death- “Judas’s death” from Jesus Christ Superstar 

- Cat as Lady Stoneheart- “Heart of Stone” from Six. Again.

- Purple Wedding- “The Day [Joffrey] Died” from Treason.

- Shae @ Tyrion- “Mein Herr” from Cabaret.

- Tyrion and Tywin- “Your Obedient Servant” from Hamilton. I know this doesn’t really reflect their story but there are just bits like “here’s an itemised list of thirty years of disagreements” “sweet Jesus” and “you call me immoral, a dangerous disgrace” and them both signing their names “T. Lann” which fit well.

-Varys and his little birds- “Be Back Soon” from Oliver!

- The Lannisters at some point- “Roar” from & Juliet and also “Be Prepared” from The Lion King. And for a modern au “Candy Store” from Heathers.

- Tommen in AFOC- “I Just Can’t Wait To Be King [In My Own Right]” from The Lion King.

- Asha, Arianne and Aegon in AFFC/ADWD- “Don’t Rain On My Parade” from Funny Girl.

- Genna- “Big, Blonde and Beautiful” from Hairspray.

- Sansa- “I Know Things Now” from Into The Woods and “All You Wanna Do” from Six.

- Melisandre during her POV chapter- “I Believe” from The Book Of Mormon.

- Arianne- “Speechless” from Aladdin

- Tyrion in ADWD- “Til I Hear You Sing” from Love Never Dies.

- Penny- “Little People” from Les Miserables.

- Shireen in Castle Back- “Giants In The Sky” from Into The Woods.

- Shireen, Devan and Edric at some point- “Revolting Children” from Matilda, because even though it doesn’t really fit it would be epic.

- Arya- “Reflections” from Mulan 

- The “killed their spouse/lover crew” aka Tyrion, Cersei, Jaime, Petyr, Lysa and Victarion- “Cell Block Tango” from Chicago.

- Jon about Dany in ADOS- “Heaven On Their Minds” from Jesus Christ Superstar.

- “The Last Supper” from Jesus Christ Superstar, with Dany and Jon doing the Judas/Jesus bits and the Lannisters as the apostles.

- Dany in ADOS- “Gethsamane” from Jesus Christ Superstar.

1 note

[istumpysk]

Operation Stumpy Re-Read

ACOK: Bran II (Chapter 16)

Thank the lords, it’s a simple Bran tax plan chapter.

They went quicker with Hodor's help. Once he had been taught to do something, he did it deftly. His hands were always gentle, though his strength was astonishing. "You could have been a knight too, I bet," Bran told him. "If the gods hadn't taken your wits, you would have been a great knight."

+.+

Their shields and surcoats also set them apart from each other. Little Walder quartered the twin towers of Frey with the brindled boar of his grandmother's House and the plowman of his mother's: Crakehall and Darry, respectively. Big Walder's quarterings were the tree-and-ravens of House Blackwood and the twining snakes of the Paeges. They must be hungry for honor, Bran thought as he watched them take up their lances. A Stark needs only the direwolf.

This immediately brings to mind that conversation between Jon and Arya regarding a mother’s house being equal in honour.

This seems oddly out of character for Bran, no? I’m choosing to read entirely too much into it, and believe this is hinting both Sansa and her husband will share the same sigil.

It’s not so far-fetched if you keep reading!

+.+

He ducked low as they passed through the door. One time Hodor smelled bread baking and ran to the kitchens, and Bran got such a crack that Maester Luwin had to sew up his scalp. Mikken had given him a rusty old visorless helm from the armory, but Bran seldom troubled to wear it. The Walders laughed whenever they saw it on his head.

x

Maester Luwin held the door open, and Bran hugged Hodor's neck and ducked as they went through.    

Describe them walking through a door together one more time, old man.

+.+

In addition to a mint, Lord Manderly also proposed to build Robb a warfleet. "We have had no strength at sea for hundreds of years, since Brandon the Burner put the torch to his father's ships. Grant me the gold and within the year I will float you sufficient galleys to take Dragonstone and King's Landing both."    

A man of his word!

Behind the jetty wall, the inner harbor was crowded with war galleys. Davos counted twenty-three. Lord Wyman was a fat man, but not an idle one, it seemed. - Davos II, ADWD

x

"Perhaps you understand, then." Wyman Manderly lurched ponderously to his feet. "I have been building warships for more than a year. Some you saw, but there are as many more hidden up the White Knife. Even with the losses I have suffered, I still command more heavy horse than any other lord north of the Neck - Davos IV, ADWD

But what will the fleet be used for? 🤔

+.+

He wondered if a cripple had ever commanded a warship.

Of course, Bran. Victarion Greyjoy has a charred blackened hand, and he commands a great fleet.

I’m sure there’s all kinds of captains with mangled hands sailing the high seas.

+.+

Maester Luwin answered. "With no direct heir, there are sure to be many claimants contending for the Hornwood lands. The Tallharts, Flints, and Karstarks all have ties to House Hornwood through the female line, and the Glovers are fostering Lord Harys's bastard at Deepwood Motte. The Dreadfort has no claim that I know, but the lands adjoin, and Roose Bolton is not one to overlook such a chance."

Roughly 90% of this chapter is men attempting to secure a marriage with Lady Hornwood to claim her lands.

I get it, George. I’m reading you loud and clear.

+.+

"Then let Lord Hornwood's bastard be the heir," Bran said, thinking of his half brother Jon.                 

Ser Rodrik said, "That would please the Glovers, and perhaps Lord Hornwood's shade as well, but I do not think Lady Hornwood would love us. The boy is not of her blood."

Lady Hornwood doesn’t just cosplay as Sansa, she’ll try on Catelyn from time to time.

+.+

"As you will, my prince," said Ser Rodrik. "You did well." Bran flushed with pleasure. Being a lord was not so tedious as he had feared, and since Lady Hornwood had been so much briefer than Lord Manderly, he even had a few hours of daylight left to visit with Summer.

AHAHAHAHAHA

Was it not so TEDIOUS, Bran? What great news for the realm.

Laws are a tedious business and counting coppers is worse. And the people … there is no end of them. I sit on that damnable iron chair and listen to them complain until my mind is numb and my ass is raw. - Eddard I, AGOT

x

The rest was a tedium the queen knew well. She sat upon her cushions, listening, one foot jiggling with impatience. - Daenerys VII, ADWD

+.+

"Might be there isn't." She grinned. "What are you staring at, boy? Never seen a woman before?"                 

"I have so." Bran had bathed with his sisters hundreds of times and he'd seen serving women in the hot pools too. Osha looked different, though, hard and sharp instead of soft and curvy. Her legs were all sinew, her breasts flat as two empty purses. "You've got a lot of scars."

All the Starkling boys spy on naked girls in the hot pools. It’s canon.

+.+

A crow had once taken Mors for dead and pecked out his eye, so he wore a chunk of dragonglass in its stead. As Old Nan told the tale, he'd grabbed the crow in his fist and bitten its head off, so they named him Crowfood.

May I request an interpreter?

+.+

Ser Rodrik commanded the man to set aside a fifth, and questioned the steward closely about Lord Hornwood's bastard, the boy Larence Snow. In the north, all highborn bastards took the surname Snow. This lad was near twelve, and the steward praised his wits and courage.                 

"Your notion about the bastard may have merit, Bran," Maester Luwin said after. "One day you will be a good lord for Winterfell, I think."

"No I won't." Bran knew he would never be a lord, no more than he could be a knight.

Bran would like to Gift some land to the bastard Snow with wits and courage. Tee-hee.

+.+

"It may be so, Bran," Ser Rodrik said, "but I was wed three times and my wives gave me daughters. Now only Beth remains to me. My brother Martyn fathered four strong sons, yet only Jory lived to be a man. When he was slain, Martyn's line died with him. When we speak of the morrow nothing is ever certain."

I love how all these adults are determined to make Bran understand Robb might die tomorrow. Like damn, let him breathe, lol.

+.+

"Beren Tallhart may well be our best answer," he told them when Leobald had gone. "By blood he is half Hornwood. If he takes his uncle's name . . ."

Oh, there’s a plan! Somebody could take their uncle’s name, and inherit Hornwood.

Do you think they may have left out a few major plot points on the show?

+.+

"It may come down to practicalities," said Maester Luwin. "Which lord he most needs to court. The riverlands are part of his realm, he may wish to cement the alliance by wedding Lady Hornwood to one of the lords of the Trident. A Blackwood, perhaps, or a Frey—"    

Lord Tywin's look was scornful. "Send her to Riverrun and her mother will match her with a Blackwood or a Mallister to shore up her son's alliances along the Trident. Send her north, and she will be wed to some Manderly or Umber before the moon turns. Yet she is no less dangerous here at court, as this business with the Tyrells should prove. She must marry a Lannister, and soon." - Tyrion III, ASOS    

+.+

Finally all of the principal vassals of House Stark had been heard from save for Howland Reed the crannogman, who had not set foot outside his swamps for many a year

Oh, don’t worry, you’ll be hearing from Howland Reed the second they give Ned Stark’s Winterfell to a Targaryen.

+.+

Bran was riding Dancer around the yard when they came through the gate.

Aww, can we just appreciate Bran naming his horse Dancer?…

As if I actually care. I’m only using this space to insist the ship will be named Water Dancer.

+.+

The pain was an axe splitting his head apart, but when the crow wrenched out its beak all slimy with bits of bone and brain, Bran could see again. What he saw made him gasp in fear. He was clinging to a tower miles high, and his fingers were slipping, nails scrabbling at the stone, his legs dragging him down, stupid useless dead legs. "Help me!" he cried. A golden man appeared in the sky above him and pulled him up. "The things I do for love," he murmured softly as he tossed him out kicking into empty air.    

One day I’ll make up my mind and finally decide whether I believe Bran and Jaime will ever meet again.

Today is not that day.

Final thoughts:

It’s made explicitly clear in the text how vulnerable Lady Hornwood is without an heir or a husband.

Do you really believe Sansa will finish the story unwed with no prospect of children?

-> return to menu <-

[nobodysuspectsthebutterfly]

Knights and the Night’s Watch

@the-perfunctorily asked: Can a knight who has sworn NW vows knight somebody else? Or does he no longer have the ability? Similarly, can a Watchman be knighted or would that be gaining a title? Furthermore, can you be stripped of your knighthood if you fuck up badly enough?

A knight who joins the Night’s Watch is still a sworn knight, he's just not sworn to any lord but the Watch (and the gods I guess). And if knights who join the Watch stay knights (see the Shieldhall), I can't see why they couldn't knight others— it's not like a knighthood automatically grants lands or anything. The NW vows say “I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crowns and win no glory,” but nothing about titles, so whether you’re keeping your ser or gaining one, it shouldn’t be a problem.

As for stripping a knighthood from an unworthy individual, I don’t think so unfortunately? Else Gregor should have lost his ages ago (though yeah, I suppose Tywin would have protected him). And consider what Stannis says about Jaime when writing his slam book letter,

“Make it Ser Jaime the Kingslayer henceforth,” Stannis said, frowning. “Whatever else the man may be, he remains a knight.” —ACOK, Davos I

Like, “he may be a traitorous kingslayer and sister-fucker, but he's still a knight, so you have to call him ser”. And Stannis is so precise, particularly with legal things, so he should know if anyone does. But let me check the wiki just in case...

...ah, hmm, it says knighthood can be stripped? and cites an ACOK Sansa chapter... oh, Dontos, I guess. Looking that up, the wiki editor was probably referring to this part:

“No one, sweet lady. I swear it on my honor as a knight.” “A knight?” Joffrey had decreed that he was to be a knight no longer, only a fool, lower even than Moon Boy. —ACOK, Sansa II

But I’m still not completely sure if this is a usual practice in Westeros. This may be just one of those Joff things, like making a non-knight a Kingsguard and dismissing a KG, flaunting established customs because he's the king and nobody tells him no. And people do still call Dontos Ser afterwards... though mostly just Sansa and Brienne, hyper-courteous and knight-focused... kind of a fuzzy situation there. So let me just check the text to see if there’s any other, better examples elsewhere. I’m particularly wondering about the incident when Ned attainted Gregor... aha.

“...I charge you to ride to the westlands with all haste, to cross the Red Fork of the Trident under the king's flag, and there bring the king's justice to the false knight Gregor Clegane, and to all those who shared in his crimes. I denounce him, and attaint him, and strip him of all rank and titles, of all lands and incomes and holdings, and do sentence him to death. May the gods take pity on his soul.” —AGOT, Eddard XI

It does seem like Gregor’s knighthood was stripped! (Although reversed shortly thereafter by Joffrey or Cersei or Tywin.) So it’s definitely a thing in Westeros, not just a Joffrey quirk, albeit probably extremely rare for extremely terrible individuals. I wonder, though, if GRRM got this from something, if attainder ever stripped knighthood in the real world? ...Oh yes, it could:

For a case in the Parliament of 1610 presenting similar issues, see the “bill of particulars” brought against Sir Stephen Proctor, holder of a commission to investigate and collect royal debts. [...] The bill voids Proctor's commission, strips him of his knighthood and right to bear arms, subjects his lands and goods to bankruptcy proceedings to pay complaints against him, bars him from court, and prohibits him from taking future offices, stating that he “shall from henceforth forever stand and be disabled and made incapable forever to have, use, or exercise any office, place judicial or ministerial.”

So, to sum up, a knight sent to the Night’s Watch as a punishment would also have to be attainted before losing his title. And most knights who go to the NW (like the Warrior's Sons after Maegor's war against the Faith Militant, or Alliser Thorne et al after Robert’s Rebellion) just don't have that happen, so they’re free to knight others as they wish. I hope that helps!

[turtle-paced]

Why doesn’t stannis like his wife? I know he’s sexist but he’s still way nicer to Melisandre then seylse

You’ve got half the issue right there. Stannis is a misogynist. That much is his problem, and nothing to do with Selyse.

That said, “likeable” is not a word I would use to describe Selyse.

"Yes," Lady Selyse agreed. "Patches's helm. It suits you well, old man. Put it on again, I command you." [...] "Perhaps he ought sing his counsel henceforth," Lady Selyse said.

- Prologue, ACoK

"Your own wife begs as well, lord husband." Queen Selyse went down on both knees before the king, hands clasped as if in prayer. "Robert and Delena defiled our bed and laid a curse upon our union. This boy is the foul fruit of their fornications. Lift his shadow from my womb and I will bear you many trueborn sons, I know it." She threw her arms around his legs. "He is only one boy, born of your brother's lust and my cousin's shame."

- Davos V, ASoS

Queen Selyse sniffed. "We are done with Eastwatch. We did not like it there. A queen should be mistress beneath her own roof. We found your Cotter Pyke to be an uncouth and unpleasant man, quarrelsome and niggardly."

- Jon IX, ADWD

Queen Selyse gave the tiniest of nods. "It was ever my lord husband's wish to grant sanctuary to these savage peoples. So long as they keep the king's peace and the king's laws, they are welcome in our realm." 

- Jon XI, ADWD

Humiliating Maester Cressen, supporting the sacrifice of Edric Storm, general ingratitude to the Night’s Watch for sharing what they had despite their own dire straits, racism towards the Free Folk... and that’s just the quotes. Her dialogue shows her to be a humourless fundamentalist. I’m not totally unsympathetic - Selyse is clearly an unhappy person, clutching to religion to give her life meaning and social station to give her loveless marriage meaning.

I don’t know what in particular Stannis doesn’t like about Selyse, but damned if I can’t see reasons why people in general wouldn’t like Selyse. Selyse and Stannis looks like a personality mismatch to me.

[alicenttully]

"The Iron Throne is mine by rights. All those who deny that are my foes." – Stannis Baratheon, ACOK

"By right Winterfell should go to my sister Sansa."

"Lady Lannister, you mean? Are you so eager to see the Imp perched on your father's seat? I promise you, that will not happen whilst I live, Lord Snow." – Stannis Baratheon, ADWD

Stannis Baratheon is portrayed as inflexible, someone who will ‘’ break before he bends.’’  He has a Manichean view of the world (black and white) – see his response to Davos’ smuggling.  

Which is why I find his hypocrisy here fascinating.

The first quote above is only of many in which Stannis empathises that the Iron Throne by rights, is his.  And the thing is, he’s correct.  Joffrey, Myrcella, and Tommen were bastards born of incest. Renly is younger than Stannis. So, when Robert succumbed to his injuries, Stannis was Robert’s legal and rightful heir.

Which relates to my next point – based on what Stannis knows and the laws of Westeros in which he trying to reinforce, Sansa is the rightful heir to Winterfell.

As far as Stannis believes, Bran and Rickon are dead. He’s unaware that the “Arya” being married to Ramsay Bolton is an imposter, and even then, not only does Arya come after Sansa in the succession, he wants to make Jon Lord of Winterfell.

Stannis argues against Sansa’s claim by using her (forced) Lannister marriage. This was something that drove Robb to write his will. However, despite Stannis’ justifiable anger against the Lannisters – the fact remains (as far as he understands based on the information available) Sansa is the rightful heir.

Which got me thinking – would Stannis’ be less of a hypocrite if he knew of Robb’s will?

IMO, no he wouldn’t be.

First off, Stannis makes it quite clear he believed Robb to be a usurper.

 The last was in the king's hand. This one he studied a moment as it writhed between his fingers. "The usurper," he said at last. "Robb Stark." And he threw it on the flames.

By being KITN, Stannis believed Robb to be committing treason. The chapter in which I pulled the quote from, shows that he wanted Robb dead for such treason (unless he bends the knee to him).  

Consequentially which means that if he wants to abide by his own beliefs, he cannot in good faith use Robb’s will because it was arguably an act of treason.

There is a lot of debate over the specific wording of Robb’s will, but according to Robb himself the purpose of his will is who will succeed him as the “king” in the North if he dies without issue. Not Lord of Winterfell. King.  

So yeah, I don’t find Stannis any less of a hypocrite even if he did know of Robb’s will.  I honestly feel though that Stannis’ hypocrisy in this situation not only pales to his other actions in pursuit of the IT, but is just one of many in which will culminate in the murder of his own child.

[mrsjadecurtiss]

Another ask, if you have the inclination: I've just been rereading Reek III with all that entails, and Theon thinks about 'the son is just the shadow of the father' re Roose and Ramsay. Do you believe that Roose can actually be as bad or worse than Ramsay at this point? He's got to be worse than average and his morals very lacking, but it's hard to imagine us being made to abhor him more than Ramsay in the remaining books. Is it just Theon's terrified paranoia, or do you think it can pay off somehow? 🤔 Or am I misinterpreting that line do you think?

Do you believe that Roose can actually be as bad or worse than Ramsay at this point? He's got to be worse than average and his morals very lacking [...].

This is a trap, he is playing with you, the son is just the shadow of the father. Lord Ramsay played with his hopes all the time. - Reek III, aDwD

This is no man to jape with. You had only to look at Bolton to know that he had more cruelty in his pinky toe than all the Freys combined. - Reek III, aDwD

I believe quotes like these refer to the effect of the cruelty they enact, rather than the specific crimes.

Ramsay is vile and cruel, enacting heinous violence upon people like a slasher movie villain. We do not have any evidence that Roose personally inflicts the same degree of crass violence upon people, as even in his presumably candid retelling of the miller's wife story, while a horrifying and inexcusable crime, he does not reach the extreme level of violence Ramsay inflicts upon smallfolk on the regular with his hunts and torturings.

"Roose Bolton's cold and cunning, aye, but a man can deal with Roose. We've all known worse. But this bastard son of his … they say he's mad and cruel, a monster." - Davos III, aDwD

The point, i believe, is not who produces the worst feats of violence, but rather another facette of grrms criticism of feudalism:

Would Ramsay even have a chance to do these heinous crimes if his father, who knows about everything, had an ounce of morality in him?

[Roose:] "All you have I gave you. You would do well to remember that, bastard." - Reek III, aDwD

Everything Ramsay has, his high position, the freedom to do all the crimes he wants, the protection from law that would have otherwise sent him to the wall in no time, he has because of his father's selfishness. Roose could have stopped these crimes from happening, he could have given Ramsay the appropriate punishment, instead he keeps Ramsay around because he feels like it...

Roose is at the top of his society, answering to barely anyone except his overlord and his king; so much power is at his fingertips, and yet he uses it for selfish reasons, commits crimes, allows crimes to happen in full knowledge, and everything is handled as it benefits him instead of abiding to morality or law. Every crime Ramsay does is Roose' responsibility as feudal lord and thus his crime.

"When soldiers lack discipline, the fault lies with their lord commander," his father said. - Tyrion VIII, aGoT

Roose is called the leech lord, and indeed he is a leech upon society, bleeding his people dry to his own benefit while not lifting a finger himself. While he is not a literal vampire, obviously parts of his character are a play on vampire myths, and the aristocratic bloodsucking vampire is frequently used as a metaphor for critique of the ruling class (i hear Fever Dream by grrm plays with this, though i have not read it). He might not commit a Texas Chainsaw Massacre in person, but that doesn't make him any less morally bankrupt and despicable, and he still has the same blood on his hands.

There is a tendency where Roose tries to lighten his crimes in conversation - here are three examples showing different facettes:

"The arrogance of it! They do not expect the north to believe their lies, not truly, but they think we must pretend to believe or die. Roose Bolton lies about his part in the Red Wedding, and his bastard lies about the fall of Winterfell." - Davos IV, aDwD

[Roose:] "Tell me, my lord … if the kinslayer is accursed, what is a father to do when one son slays another?" - Reek III, aDwD

[Roose:] "The maesters will tell you that King Jaehaerys abolished the lord's right to the first night to appease his shrewish queen, but where the old gods rule, old customs linger. The Umbers keep the first night too, deny it as they may. Certain of the mountain clans as well, and on Skagos … well, only heart trees ever see half of what they do on Skagos." - Reek III, aDwD

1. Denial of involvement - Roose frequently either escapes blame completely (for example for Duskendale), puts blame on someone else (like blaming Ramsay's bastard blood for Winterfell), or lies about his crimes to evade blame.

2. Selectively invoking law - using the kinslaying law, he pretends his hands are tied when it comes to Ramsay, even though he could for example also send him to the wall as punishment. He frequently breaks laws as he pleases and also took part in breaking sacred contracts such as guest right (red wedding), so him invoking law in this instance is likely a tool to absolve himself of blame during the conversation.

3. Comparing himself to others to lessen his own acts, after failing to escape blame - by bringing the Umbers etc into the conversation, he tries to make himself look less bad; "look, everyone's doing it, and the skagosi are probably even worse than me!"

As opposed to Ramsay, he is aware of how the severity of the crimes he is doing would be received by others. He likes to present himself as a rational and civilized man, and thus has an interest to downplay his criminal actions, even if he does not see anything wrong with them as he did them for his own benefit.

"No tales were ever told of me. Do you think I would be sitting here if it were otherwise?" - Reek III, aDwD

"That annoyed me, so I gave her the mill and had the brother's tongue cut out, to make certain he did not go running to Winterfell with tales that might disturb Lord Rickard." - Reek III, aDwD

As the Mormonts were bannermen to the Starks, [Jorah's] crime had dishonored the north. Ned had made the long journey west to Bear Island, only to find when he arrived that Jorah had taken ship beyond the reach of Ice and the king's justice. - Eddard II, aGoT

The foolish Ramsay tries to pride himself in his crimes; Roose however knows of the importance of optics. He is aware that he frequently breaks the law, and tries his best to keep his reputation intact as to not attract unwanted attention; especially with an overlord like Ned Stark, who would not handwave any crime and would make sure justice is served.

From what we can observe, in my opinion the difference between Roose and Ramsay is that Roose doesn't see anything wrong with comitting violence as long as the result is of a benefit for him, while Ramsay additionally also commits violence because he merely finds enjoyment in inflicting it, violence for violence's sake. This is why Roose is able to control himself and always gives Ramsay the advice to be restrained, but Ramsay is unable and unwilling to do so and his acts are much more extreme. Roose is likely starting to realize this difference by aDwD.

Is it just Theon's terrified paranoia [...]?

I do also believe Theon's statement is fueled by paranoia, if you look at the entire context:

"I mean you no harm, you know. I owe you much and more." - "You do?" Some part of him was screaming, This is a trap, he is playing with you, the son is just the shadow of the father. Lord Ramsay played with his hopes all the time. "What … what do you owe me, m'lord?" - "The north. The Starks were done and doomed the night that you took Winterfell." He waved a pale hand, dismissive. "All this is only squabbling over spoils." - Reek III, aDwD

Roose is not necessarily tricking Theon here since it appears to be a correct statement; And he does have an interest to be on friendly terms with Theon (offering him fresh clothes for example) because he wants to make use of his position as heir to the iron islands, a goal he expressed as early as a Storm of Swords.

"Flaying Theon will not bring my brothers back," Robb said. "I want his head, not his skin." - "He is Balon Greyjoy's only living son," Lord Bolton said softly, as if they had forgotten, "and now rightful King of the Iron Islands. A captive king has great value as a hostage." - Catelyn VI, aCoK

"Serve us in this, and when Stannis is defeated we will discuss how best to restore you to your father's seat," his lordship had said in that soft voice of his, a voice made for lies and whispers. Theon never believed a word of it. - The Prince of Winterfell, aDwD

Note that here Theon does not believe him either, any trust he has shattered by Ramsay as well as Roose' unlikable personality. Still it seems likely Roose was really somewhat trying to be nice with Theon, because as he tries to teach Ramsay there's value in it:

"Power tastes best when sweetened by courtesy. You had best learn that if you ever hope to rule." - Reek III, aDwD

Do you think it can pay off somehow?

This is speculation, but i believe Roose' story is likely headed in the opposite direction - A Storm of Swords featured his greatest villainous feat, the Red Wedding, a showcase of cruelty and treacherousness. I do not think it will be followed up by an act of even greater cruelty; instead i think he will finally reap what he has sown.

Roose Bolton said nothing at all. But Theon Greyjoy saw a look in his pale eyes that he had never seen before — an uneasiness, even a hint of fear.

That night the new stable collapsed beneath the weight of the snow that had buried it. - a Ghost in Winterfell, aDwD

I believe the line about the stable is meant as a metaphor for his regime collapsing, as it is put directly after the line where he realizes the situation is growing dire for him.

It all seemed so familiar, like a mummer show that he had seen before. Only the mummers had changed. Roose Bolton was playing the part that Theon had played the last time round, and the dead men were playing the parts of Aggar, Gynir Rednose, and Gelmarr the Grim. - a Ghost in Winterfell, aDwD

Roose is likely going to continue the parallel with Theon as his arc goes steadily downwards. He is a foil to Ned; where Ned died but his legacy lives on, Roose will likely live to see his legacy crumble.

There is of course a possibility that he, when cornered, starts expressing more cruelty as a last-ditch effort. We saw the stable used as a metaphor for his rule in Winterfell; but there is another interesting detail about the reconstruction of the burned Winterfell:

Serve well, Lord Bolton told them, and he would be merciful. Stone and timber were plentiful with the wolfswood so close at hand. Stout new gates had gone up first, to replace those that had been burned. Then the collapsed roof of the Great Hall had been cleared away and a new one raised hurriedly in its stead. When the work was done, Lord Bolton hanged the workers. True to his word, he showed them mercy and did not flay a one. - the Prince of Winterfell, aDwD

Aegon the Conqueror had commanded [the Red Keep] built. His son Maegor the Cruel had seen it completed. Afterward he had taken the heads of every stonemason, woodworker, and builder who had labored on it. Only the blood of the dragon would ever know the secrets of the fortress the Dragonlords had built, he vowed. - Catelyn IV, aGoT

This is a crack theory, but perhaps Roose has something up his sleeve when it comes to the newly constructed roof of the Great Hall (a location that features extremely prominently through all of Theon's aDwD Winterfell chapters). Maybe he could make it crash intentionally to bury his treacherous allies or something like that...

I doubt however that he will do Ramsay-style extreme violence, i can't really see a reason and it doesn't appear to be his style. He seems more about cunning than flashy displays.

As always these are not PoV characters, so as long as we don't have a view inside their heads we can never say anything with 100% certainty.

[janiedean]

Book!Theon is Azor!Ahai, not Jon. It makes no sense narratively for Jon to be AA, and it’s the most stereotypical thing ever, and he’s already stereotypical, he’s the red flag for the audience. Theon’s chapters are full of hints, he has the perfect salt/smoke/stars/dragons thing at the end of ACOK, when he “dies”. His story is about destroying death, his entire narrative, with things that come from mythology and ancient literature, points to that. The show is trash, but don’t you think that it’s a little weird that Theon is there at the end and then Arya comes out of nowhere and becomes AA? And what ending does she get? Exploring the unknown SEA with SHIPS? Being free and on her own? Maybe it doesn’t make sense for her because it’s not for her. D&D already took everything else from Theon, they took this too. And even if he’s not AA, he’s still clearly connected to magic and all of that, he didn’t go though so much for nothing, he didn’t take his name back for the first time in his life, his name that literally means “godly”, for nothing. He has something big to do, and it’s about himself, not Robb and the Starks. And he’s also so clearly connected to the politics of the north and of the iron islands, a villain was literally created for him, so I don’t understand how can you say he’s not really important and all he’s got left to do is retire in a house and be sad. Of course he has a lot of trauma and that’s important, but I don’t like how people reduce him to that and act like just because those things happened, he can’t do anything else

anon with no ill will and I swear I don't want to sound pedantic or anything but I, uh, never came to the conclusion you say I came from - that said let's go in order even if I think I already went through all the reasons why it makes literally no sense if it's anyone but jon, but let's start with one thing:

It makes no sense narratively for Jon to be AA, and it’s the most stereotypical thing ever, and he’s already stereotypical, he’s the red flag for the audience.

it's stereotypical.... to us maybe, but it is not to westeros. like, you're looking at it through audience-lens because it has been years and the show confirmed r+l=j and we all figured that shit out, but to westeros, the idea that the prince that was promised is a bastard guy serving on the wall aka a state-sponsored prison where people go to not die and is filled to non-desirables to society is... the least likely option in existence? no really, but again:

first thing that should quiet all doubts, when melisandre asks r'hollor to see azor ahai bc she wants to see stannis, r'hollor shows her jon snow and instead of going like 'uh wait why am I seeing another dude' she's like 'I want to see stannis but r'hollor shows me jon snow there must be some disturbance on the line', like she doesn't even consider for a second that it might be jon;

no one else has brought WITHIN THE NARRATIVE jon up as a likely candidate - they said stannis, they said dany, they said whoever but no one ever said hey jon snow might be AA, because again no one even suspects that it might be jon;

other matter that you're overlooking here: if theon is azor ahai.... it means that the rebellion basically was for nothing? because like the entire shtick with rhaegar targaryen's bad life choices™ is that he was apparently a swell dude, then he read a book where somehow it was exactly explained how the apocalypse was gonna happen, he deduced that he was the guy who had to father AA/the prince that was promised and in order - first he doesn't care about fighting but suddenly after that he starts getting learned; - he immediately worries over having THREE children from which we can deduce from the narrative that as far as he knows in order to fight when the wights come he has to have three kids for three dragons and one of them is azor ahai; - the moment his wife can't have more than two even if he's sure that he already had the right one (aegon) he still runs off with lyanna to make sure he has the third because it's that important that HE rhaegar targaryen fathers the three heads of the dragon... to the point of starting a civil war and most likely giving arthur orders to make sure that the kid lives at all costs even if he thinks lyanna's kid is NOT AA; - let's remember that the entire schtick is also that 'he is the ptwp and his is the song of ice and fire' which means that this kid of rhaegar's is the person these books are titled after.

now, let's look again at tyrion's infamous quote which I always bring up in these cases but let's refresh our memory here Prophecy is like a half-trained mule. It looks as though it might be useful, but the moment you trust in it, it kicks you in the head now: given this, we can absolutely assume that no single prophecy in this book goes the way the person at the end of it interprets it... which means that rhaegar was wrong on a lot of accounts, but guess what, the thing is that one out of three of his kids is dead (if we count aegon as trueborn, if he's not then two on three but I think he's trueborn) and the one who hatched the eggs/has the dragon is DANY so he already was wrong on head of the dragon #1, and he can absolutely be wrong on aegon being tptwp which would mean mistake #2 and we should know about the prophecy, but one of his children being AA and his being the song of ice and fire looks a bit too much of a stretch to be incorrect and have AA being someone else's son also would be.... but if AA is jon ie the one he had for last that he was sure was not AA and who doesn't even have the targ name (nor the stark one) and no one suspects having that kinda ancestry then yes it fits exactly all the parameters and it still allows for rhaegar to have partially misinterpreted the entire thing even in large chunks but not enough to make it look like he was completely making shit up, which... I mean the long night is coming I don't doubt he had very good reasons to want to stop it; also, anon not to beat the dead horse, but: - jon's death fits all the prophecy parameters already there's the bleeding star, the smoking wound and the salt of the tears which btw is not obvious nor something you'd immediately do 2+2 about... which fits perfectly with the above - jon died and came back to life in the godforsaken show like he's literally the only idiot who resurrected in it and we're supposed to handwave it the way dnd did? - jon has a valyrian steel sword that he can handle while theon atm really doesn't - we could argue that ygritte could be a possible nissa-nissa contender though I mean maybe it could also be that he and val get hot and bothered and it turns out it's her or someone else and that hasn't happened yet but surely there's more evidence for that with jon than with theon - theon has like... povs in two books for a total amount of less than fifteen chapters, jon has at least ten chapters per book or so on, which just mathematically makes jon a main fiver character while theon is not and like I understand deconstruction and all but you don't make your ace in the hole mystical prince hero character someone who has had fifteen chapters total at most unless I remember wrong the amount he had in acok in comparison to someone who was a main throughout the entire thing - like guys I say it as someone whose third-fave char is theon, theon is not a main fiver™ character and that's okay that's not the point, and with that I don't mean he's not important, I mean that he's not one of the five main ones that have most of the plot stuff on their shoulders and he's not THE main character, because if theon is AA then these books are named a song of theon greyjoy and considering that the main five are jon tyrion arya dany and bran I think it's highly not probable that at the end of it theon is the one character to rule them all

and that was for how jon fit the criteria, but theon doesn't fit them because again he doesn't have a number of chapters/povs that justifies such a plot twist, balon is certainly not rhaegar and I don't see how rhaegar reads a prophecy wrt balon and thinks it's about him, the heads of the dragon should be three and theon had three siblings two of which are dead and asha has no tie to the dragon storyline, this means that theon should be able to ride/command a dragon and we know that in theory just targs can and there's already three of them around - dany jon and aegon - and if anyone who's not a targ has a narrative reason to ride a dragon is tyrion not theon... and tyrion is a main fiver too, also there's the nissa-nissa/burning sword angle and as it is theon could absolutely use a bow again but a longsword with his hands maimed like that and no muscle mass would be a bit implausible, in order for the reborn prophecy to actually make sense it means his last adwd chapter should have smoke, salt and the bleeding star which it doesn't but jon's has so there's that

now, re what you said wrt theon:

Theon’s chapters are full of hints

not really? he doesn't have a tie to the magical storyline beyond his connection to bran. they have hints for a lot of things but that he's AA? idt so

he has the perfect salt/smoke/stars/dragons thing at the end of ACOK, when he “dies”

okay but then I could use the same argument for saying that AA could be davos when he survives blackwater because he says he woke up in wreckage of smoke in salty water, and then stannis has equally valid arguments bc he has the shiny sword and he's in dragonstone etc and we all know it's not stannis, also an AA death at the ending of acok when the topic has barely been introduced in dany's vision is entirely too early for me to drop that bomb

his story is about destroying death, his entire narrative, with things that come from mythology and ancient literature, points to that.

his story is about overcoming trauma and abuse and not dying in the process (which is why I think the show was trash) and okay but everyone in these books has something that comes from a mythology or ancient literature, like jaime brienne and c. all have arthuriana roots same as bran, doesn't make any of them a viable AA candidate

The show is trash, but don’t you think that it’s a little weird that Theon is there at the end and then Arya comes out of nowhere and becomes AA?And what ending does she get? Exploring the unknown SEA with SHIPS? Being free and on her own? Maybe it doesn’t make sense for her because it’s not for her.

considering that maisie williams was shocked that arya was AA and she also thought it made no sense and that dnd never thought theon had his own storyline while I can agree on the fact that it fits more for him as an ending than for arya, I don't think that means it makes him AA, same as I think that they gave sansa his storyline and possibly his confrontation with ramsay and I'm not 100% convinced on the last part anyway but that just means they didn't realize theon doesn't exist for the starks' storyline, also like.. in the show everyone but c. was in WF and theon was already dead when arya did her thing and honestly idt the battle of the long night will ever go like that anyway so idt even partially show truthing is bringing us anywhere

and even if he’s not AA, he’s still clearly connected to magic and all of that, he didn’t go though so much for nothing, he didn’t take his name back for the first time in his life, his name that literally means “godly”, for nothing

I never said it was for nothing which I'll elaborate in a second and ofc he's connected to the magic storyline... because he's connected with bran's storyline and his last round of atonement has to happen through bran in the sense that since he was the one basically forcing bran out of wf now he most likely has to facilitate bringing him back or smth (surely not dying for him), but like whatever magical stuff he has going on it has to do with bran dot, not with AA which I still think he doesn't have a stricter text connection to than davos has for that matter and idt davos is AA as I think I made clear

He has something big to do, and it’s about himself, not Robb and the Starks.

never said he didn't, and I also said that I wasn't going to speculate in detail about what theon has to do because I don't think there are enough text elements to say it now but there will be when wow comes out for sure, but like again I don't want to make predictions when I don't have the elements and wrt theon's themes/possible canon ending etc I always said that he most likely isn't going to inherit the islands but that he'll do something huge before the books are done which is gonna be tied to the northern storyline and possibly to bran because he has to go specular to acok - acok is his downfall, adwd is 'I'll find myself again', wow+ados have to be what would theon do if he decides his own thing while being his own person, or recycling my old THEON HAS HEGELIAN THEMES IN HIS STORYLINE acok = thesis, adwd = antithesis, wow+ados = synthesis so obviously he has something huge in the plans.... I just don't think it means he's AA

And he’s also so clearly connected to the politics of the north and of the iron islands, a villain was literally created for him, so I don’t understand how can you say he’s not really important and all he’s got left to do is retire in a house and be sad

aaand here we get to the point which is that... I never said that? I honestly never said that? I said he has to overcome his trauma and live and thrive and be happy after that. if he retires in a house at the end of ados after he does whatever he has to do in the main plot it's going to be because it's what he wants to do and most likely he and jeyne are going to be adorbs while doing it together or smth or if he goes back to the islands and advises asha then he's going to be happy doing that too, but like... the entire point of theon's sl is that he overcomes that horrendous abuse while not being a perfect good victim™ throughout and still be happy after and gain his redemption? that's what I always said. I never said that now he can just retire and be sad. trauma recovery is becoming happy after getting over your trauma. not being sad. and like.... sometimes not getting amazing mythological things but just being happy by yourself is actually a goal? again, grrm is a lapsed catholic. if I know that breed and I do, he doesn't think redemption and happiness are in shortage at the supermarket. and in order for theon to have narrative importance/weight/relevance he doesn't have to do magical mythological IMPORTANT™ things (even if I think he does have something cooked up as I said above), but like the entire point of his sl is the trauma recovery. he's there for that. that's literally his point in the plot and the fact that grrm created a villain for him means that he thinks it's an important thing to explore.

also I personally think that theon's arc is the best written thing in those books so like I don't want to undermine its importance, I just don't think that in order to be important™ then theon has to be dragged kicking and screaming into main fiver territory because there isn't the need.

. Of course he has a lot of trauma and that’s important, but I don’t like how people reduce him to that and act like just because those things happened, he can’t do anything else

I don't like that either esp. when coming from dnd who didn't even let him have it fully, but: and when did I ever do it? I never said that theon is only his trauma. my standing opinion wrt theon is that he's grrm's best written/constructed character (along with jaime) and his most innovative one (jaime following but theon wins it) because theon deconstructs the backstabber trope which I already went on about but:

again usually ppl who backstab the good protagonist™ get caught and punished and you never hear their pov

theon has all the povs

he's the main char in that storyline not robb

he has entirely understandable reasons that ppl decided aren't sympathetic just bc they don't want to admit that in his position they'd have done the same thing

the audience hates him for having contributed to robb's downfall but then he gets a comeuppance that's completely not what anyone would deserve for that and he gets the spotlight/the sympathy again

he gets narrative redemption saving jeyne so you can see he's not an asshole at all

has to get through horrific abuse for his entire life not just with ramsay, he's not a good victim™ but he's still written in a way that makes you want to root for him and at the end he actually comes through so you want him to keep on succeeding

which is smth that with the backstabber trope never happens

now the thing is that theon's there bc a) identity issues b) trauma recovery storylines that then get tied to bran's main one but like idg why just having the recovery storyline would make him lesser - saying he's not a main fiver doesn't mean he's not important, it means he's not a MAIN™ character... which in asoiaf doesn't matter bc even ppl without povs are important to the narration and are there to drive a point (see sandor and stannis), and I don't see why saying that the most important part of his sl/the one grrm wants to stick with the readers is the survivor part of it rather than whichever heavy magic related plot thing he has to play in the future means undermining his importance. and while I think he has that role, idt it's the most important one he has bc being a survivor is what sells his storyline/the entire arc of his character.

then if come wow I'm wrong I'll be like okay I fucked up, but: honestly, imvho there is no way that azor ahai is not jon snow, the fact that collectively as a fandom we think it's obvious doesn't mean people in westeros do, each single point of evidence is at jon and if occam's razor is a thing then it's jon and that's okay because as deconstructed chosen one as he is, jon is still the protagonist of these books and regarding the prophecy above, it makes a lot more sense that this series is titled a song of jon snow and not a song of theon greyjoy and I say this as someone who vastly prefers theon as a character. also, if smth is well-written, readers should see it coming, so the fact that jon is AA isn't predictable if it's true, it's grrm.... knowing how to write a book and plant his hints because if everyone guessed right then if he makes it suddenly someone else bc jon is too predictable then it's dnd making it arya bc SURPRISE WE NEEDED YOU TO GO LIKE WTF HAS JUST HAPPENED INSTEAD OF FOLLOWING THE NARRATION TO ITS NATURAL CONCLUSION, not 'it's too predictable' or the audience red herring the way jaime being the valonqar is an audience red herring. jon being AA should be absolutely obvious for the reader who paid attention and a total surprise for the other characters in the narration, the audience red herring is more dany than anyone else imvho and I'm dying on that hill for now, thanks for coming to my ted talk but like I don't see how it's anyone but jon personally X°D

[a-libra-writes]

Hey Libra! I wanted to know your thoughts on the whole ‘Stannis is a misogynist’ argument, since he’s a loved figure on your page! I personally haven’t been able to see much of his personality in the books, seeing as I’m only on like chapter 13 of ACOK, but from what I’ve seen from him in the shows and books, he’s just… curt? And awkward? I would hardly say he shows anymore animosity towards women than he shows to men. I know people talk about his treatment of Selsye as proof of his sexism, but I’m really not sure. I’m sorry if this is a commonly asked question, but I wanted to know your stance since my love of Stannis stemmed from reading your fics about him!

mmm I think this idea stems from his treatment of both Gilly and Selyse. I'm def not an authority on his character or anything, just what I've observed and gathered:

Gilly - She's an "abomination" because she's the offspring of her father and sister, it doesn't matter that it was almost certainly against her will. In the book he speaks of her poorly: "Her own father got this child on her? We are well rid of her, then. I will not suffer such abominations here. This is not King's Landing".

I was surprised by this because the Westerosi belief that incest is an abomination before the gods - and yanno, it's gross, but Stannis himself is not a religious man. He could've just said it was gross but he has a totally zero tolerance here. He doesn't even entertain the fact it wasn't consensual. Which being Westerosi, maybe that doesn't matter at all... and of course he's disgusted by Cersei+Jaime and their kids. So shrug. Societal shames and taboos run deep.

Selyse - So now that I've read the books, I'm pretty annoyed with the show painting Selyse as "lol crazy woman" and little else. In the book she has a degree of cunning. It ain't much, but she and her men certainly have their own agenda and she specifically disagrees with Stannis and almost seems to work against him - if not her directly, her relatives and her queensmen certainly do. Selyse may be devoted to Melisandre and R'hllor, but she and Stannis have a clear dislike of each other, to the point where he doesn't even want her touching him. He refers to her as "woman" several times and when she holds onto his arm, he pointedly tells her to "stop clutching" him and tries to get out of her grasp.

Another big rift between them is her treatment of Shireen: Book!Seylse thinks her daughter is repulsive and wants nothing to do with her, while Stannis sees Shireen as his true heir. I think their personalities are wholly incompatible. It's a big shame; I rlly love Stannis so I wish we had some more on his marriage and why she was chosen (are Florents powerful in the Stormlands or something??) or at least I wish she had more character.

Between these two there's also a running theme of Stannis being uncomfortable with sex - any mention of it, consensual or otherwise. When Selyse is clutching him in that scene and he shoos her off, she's says, "Robert and Delena defiled our bed and laid a curse upon our union. This boy is the foul fruit of their fornications. Lift his shadow from my womb and I will bear you many trueborn sons, I know it. He is only one boy, born of your brother's lust and my cousin's shame." While he was indifferent to Gilly until the incest was mentioned, then he wanted nothing to do with her. This could be a coincidence, but I've seen several HCs of Stannis being very sex-repulsed and/or Ace, and I myself HC him as ace. So more food there.

Now!! Let's compare this to Melisandre. So in the books she's waaay more mysterious and creepy, at least to me. He takes her counsel seriously and often discusses matters with her. I'm one of the people who doesn't believe he's sleeping with her - she's an actual advisor, like Davos. I haven't finished a Dance with Dragons, but I'm excited to see her scenes. Even without reading that, it's pretty clear Stannis respects her. I'm not sure how people take away Stannis is a misogynist when Melisandre has such a high rank in his army. Lady Melisandre wore no crown, but every man there knew she was Stannis Baratheon's true queen, not the homely woman he had left to shiver at Eastwatch-By-The-Sea.

[fedonciadale]

I was reading one of your metas and I got surprised because people read this as jonerys foreshadowing: Sometimes she would close her eyes and dream of him, but it was never Jorah Mormont she dreamed of; her lover was always younger and more comely, though his face remained a shifting shadow.

I’ve always read this thinking that dany was dreaming about having a cute man and someone who isn’t old like Jorah and Drogo, especially because later when she uses Irri for sex (again) she pictures Daario’s face so I’ve never put much thoughts on it. I guess I just let it pass because jon is really associated with shadows, but anyway is not good as some people think it is. Great meta btw.

Hi there!

Thanks for the compliment.

Yes, the “shifting shadow” is possible Jonerys foreshadowing, but not in a good way, or rather it is foreshadowing that Jon will be the death of Dany.

The shifting shadows made the stone figures seem to stir as the living passed by. (AGOT, Eddard I).

This is about the Stark statues in the crypts. The dead Starks, just like Jon is dead right now.

And this is corroborated by this scene:

Lady Dustin's serjeant raised the lantern. Shadows slid and shifted. A small light in a great darkness. Theon had never felt comfortable in the crypts. (ADWD, The Turncloak)

Then we have a telling scene in Catelyn’s PoV:

She thought she glimpsed movement, but when she turned her head, it was only the king's shadow shifting against the silken walls. She heard Renly begin a jest, his shadow moving, lifting its sword, black on green, candles guttering, shivering, something was queer, wrong, and then she saw Renly's sword still in its scabbard, sheathed still, but the shadowsword . . .     (ACOK, Catelyn IV)

That is about Stannis’ shadowbaby killing Renly, an act of kinslaying.

King Stannis pointed a finger. "There you err, Onion Knight. Some lights cast more than one shadow. Stand before the nightfire and you'll see for yourself. The flames shift and dance, never still. The shadows grow tall and short, and every man casts a dozen. Some are fainter than others, that's all. Well, men cast their shadows across the future as well. One shadow or many. Melisandre sees them all."     (ACOK, Davos II)

This is also rather ominous in general, if you ask me.

As well as this:

The nightfire burned against the gathering dark, a great bright beast whose shifting orange light threw shadows twenty feet tall across the yard. All along the walls of Dragonstone the army of gargoyles and grotesques seemed to stir and shift.     (ASOS, Davos VI)

The shifting shadows are connected to Rh’llor and Melisandre, a power/powers that probably will partly be responsible for resurrecting Jon Snow.

She told the Myrish woman all that had occurred beneath the shifting shadow of the Iron Throne. (AFFC, Cersei VII)

This might point towards the fact that the Iron Throne is Dany’s true love.

This also doesn’t seem to bode well:

The way the shadows shifted made it seem as if the walls were moving too. Bran saw great white snakes slithering in and out of the earth around him, and his heart thumped in fear. He wondered if they had blundered into a nest of milk snakes or giant grave worms, soft and pale and squishy. Grave worms have teeth.     (ADWD, Bran II)

There again is a connection to the dead.

As is this quote:

Griff was on the second man the instant he shambled down off the cabin roof. With a sword in his right hand and a torch in his left, he drove the creature backwards. As the current swept the Shy Maid beneath the bridge, their shifting shadows danced upon the mossy walls. (ADWD, Tyrion V)

So all in all, shifting shadows should not be read as a promise for Dany, but a deadly threat.

No, why is this scene even seen as Jonerys foreshadowing? Because of this quote in Melisandre’s PoV where Jon is the shadow:

The flames crackled softly, and in their crackling she heard the whispered name Jon Snow. His long face floated before her, limned in tongues of red and orange, appearing and disappearing again, a shadow half-seen behind a fluttering curtain. Now he was a man, now a wolf, now a man again. But the skulls were here as well, the skulls were all around him. Melisandre had seen his danger before, had tried to warn the boy of it. Enemies all around him, daggers in the dark. He would not listen.     (ADWD, Melisandre I)

As you can see, Melisandre’s vision connects the theme of the shifting shadow quite well to Jon and to the other quotes. So, yes Jon is the shifting shadow, the dead man brought back by Rh’llor and his orange flames, the man who is also a beast, a wolf, surrounded by skulls, harbringer of death for Dany.

Usually Jonerys shippers connect this to this quote:

Beneath her coverlets she tossed and turned, dreaming that Hizdahr was kissing her … but his lips were blue and bruised, and when he thrust himself inside her, his manhood was cold as ice. She sat up with her hair disheveled and the bedclothes atangle. Her captain slept beside her, yet she was alone. (ADWD, Daenerys VII)

They say the shifting shadow and the manhood cold as ice is Jon. And that Dany feels like she sleeps alone, just like Jon felt when he lay beside Ygritte.

I must admit, that I see the foreshadowing, but I don’t see how this can be positive.

Thanks for the ask!

[agentrouka-blog]

Arya and Weasel - sending your inner child off into the woods

Weasel is an orphaned, traumatized girl of around two years of age whose story is absolutely heartbreaking. We meet her in A Clash of Kings and she accompanies us for the span of three Arya chapters, which takes place over just about a month, most of which takes place off page. 

We meet her at the end of Arya III, she has her first interaction with Arya in Arya IV and then tags along with Arya, Lommy, Hot Pie and Gendry in the woods until she runs off into the unknown at the end of Arya V.

I’ll follow the story and try to give some sense of time and location to justify my time estimates, simply because GRRM chooses to be so vague. 

Gods, Arya’s chapters in ACOK are among the very finest in the entire book series. 

Warning: Long. As always, excessive use of quotes.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ACOK, Arya III (chapter 9)

Yoren and his gang have been traveling the Kingsroad since King’s Landing. She beat Hot Pie bloody in Arya I and they had a tense encounter with goldcloaks looking for Gendry in Arya II. Now they change course westward of the Kingsroad close to the beginning of the chapter.

“We’re not far from Gods Eye,” the black brother said one morning. “The kingsroad won’t be safe till we’re across the Trident. So we’ll come up around the lake along the western shore, they’re not like to look for us there.” At the next spot where two ruts cut cross each other, he turned the wagons west. 

Here farmland gave way to forest, the villages and holdfasts were smaller and farther apart, the hills higher and the valleys deeper. Food grew harder to come by.

They spend an unspecified amount of time, likely about two weeks, traveling and living off the land. Enough for two days delay to still matter but long enough to form habits, see landscapes change, have hunting adventures.

Outside a holdfast called Briarwhite, some fieldhands surrounded them in a cornfield, demanding coin for the ears they’d taken. (…)

The next day Koss came racing back to warn Yoren of a camp ahead. (…) “Might be one side, might be t’other. If they’re hurt that bad, likely they’d take our mounts no matter who they are. Might be they’d take more than that. I believe we’ll go wide around them.” It took them miles out of their way, and cost them two days at the least, but the old man said it was cheap at the price. (…) 

Arya saw men guarding the fields more and more when they turned north again. (…) At one place, she spotted a man perched up in a dead tree, with a bow in his hand and a quiver hanging from the branch beside him. (…) 

A day later Dobber spied a red glow against the evening sky. “Either this road went and turned again, or that sun’s setting in the north.”

Weasel’s tragedy begins when her village is put to the torch. The blaze is enough to light up the night sky from half a day’s travel away. Judging from what we see in Arya IV, the violence was likely unspeakable.

By dawn the fire had burned itself out, but none of them slept very well that night. It was midday when they arrived at the place where the village had been.

It’s butchery and desolation. Yoren goes to investigate the destroyed holdfast. 

When they finally returned, Yoren had a little girl in his arms, and Murch and Cutjack were carrying a woman in a sling made of an old torn quilt. The girl was no older than two and she cried all the time, a whimpery sound, like something was caught in her throat. Either she couldn’t talk yet or she had forgotten how. The woman’s right arm ended in a bloody stump at her elbow, and her eyes didn’t seem to see anything, even when she was looking right at it.

I knee-jerk assumed the woman to be Weasel’s mother, but that is never explicitly stated in the text. For all we know, they aren’t related at all. They are not shown to interact, and even if the woman was Weasel’s mother, she is too far gone from her severe injury to be coherent, let alone care for the child. 

 She talked, but she only said one thing. “Please,” she cried, over and over. “Please. Please.” Rorge thought that was funny. He laughed through the hole in his face where his nose had been, and Biter started laughing too, until Murch cursed them and told them to shut up. Yoren had them fix the woman a place in the back of a wagon. “And be quick about it,” he said. “Come dark, there’ll be wolves here, and worse.” “I’m scared,” Hot Pie murmured when he saw the one-armed woman thrashing in the wagon. “Me too,” Arya confessed. He squeezed her shoulder. “I never truly kicked no boy to death, Arry. I just sold my mommy’s pies, is all.” Arya rode as far ahead of the wagons as she dared, so she wouldn’t have to hear the little girl crying or listen to the woman whisper, “Please.” She remembered a story Old Nan had told once, about a man imprisoned in a dark castle by evil giants. He was very brave and smart and he tricked the giants and escaped . . . but no sooner was he outside the castle than the Others took him, and drank his hot red blood. Now she knew how he must have felt. The one-armed woman died at evenfall. Gendry and Cutjack dug her grave on a hillside beneath a weeping willow. When the wind blew, Arya thought she could hear the long trailing branches whispering, “Please. Please. Please.” The little hairs on the back of her neck rose, and she almost ran from the graveside.

I almost inserted a long paragraph about the textual parallels to Lyanna and Sansa here. But I refrained because this is merely meant to document Weasel. 

The woman and the child (and the murdered men I didn’t include in my quotes) are Arya’s first direct confrontation with the vicious of this war. She and Hot Pie are so humbled in the face of it, they forget their original enmity, their posturing. They become children again. They admit their bone-deep fear. 

The human suffering is an unbearable horror and Arya, understandably, tries to block it out and get away from it. 

So this tiny little girl Weasel has just watched every person she has ever known being murdered by scary, angry strangers and then spent that night and half a day among the charred ruins and the bodies. Hungry, thirsty, scared. No one shows up to comfort her until another stranger picks her up and carries her away. 

It goes on:

“No fire tonight,” Yoren told them. Supper was a handful of wild radishes Koss found, a cup of dry beans, water from a nearby brook. The water had a funny taste to it, and Lommy told them it was the taste of bodies, rotting someplace upstream. Hot Pie would have hit him if old Reysen hadn’t pulled them apart.

We’ll return to this lovely image.

Arya encounters wolves as she relieves herself in the woods at night. They do not harm her, but she is clearly shaken by everything that has happened. 

The crying girl travelling alonside her and the wolves prowling the woods. Two sides of Arya.

She tells Yoren she doesn’t care. She just wants to go home. The chapter ends on:

“Go to sleep, boy. Hear me?”

She did try. Yet as she lay under her thin blanket, she could hear the wolves howling . . . and another sound, fainter, no more than a whisper on the wind, that might have been screams.

Followed by a lovely thematic transition at the beginning of Davos I.

The morning air was dark with the smoke of burning gods. They were all afire now, Maid and Mother, Warrior and Smith, the Crone with her Pearl eyes and the Father with his gilded beard; even the Stranger, carved to look more animal than human. The old dry wood and countless layers of paint and varnish blazed with a fierce hungry light. Heat rose shimmering through the chill air; behind, the gargoyles and stone dragons on the castle walls seemed blurred, as if Davos were seeing them through a veil of tears. Or as if the beasts were trembling, stirring . . .

Arya is about to enter the warzone for real.

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ACOK, Arya IV (chapter 14)

We open not too far from where we left Yoren’s merry band. They have reached the river flowing straight south from the Gods Eye. 

It seemed a peaceful place . . . until Koss spotted the dead man. “There, in the reeds.” He pointed, and Arya saw it. The body of a soldier, shapeless and swollen. His sodden green cloak had hung up on a rotted log, and a school of tiny silver fishes were nibbling at his face. “I told you there was bodies,” Lommy announced. “I could taste them in that water.”

He tasted them in the brook, this is a river. Usually brooks flow into rivers, not the other way around. But not too much travel time can have passed for Lommy to make that remark. A day? Two days?

We get a location.

It was midday when the others returned. Woth reported a wooden bridge half a mile downstream, but someone had burned it up. Yoren peeled a sourleaf off the bale. “Might be we could swim the horses over, maybe the donkeys, but there’s no way we’ll get those wagons across. And there’s smoke to the north and west, more fires, could be this side o’ the river’s the place we want to be.” He picked up a long stick and drew a circle in the mud, a line trailing down from it. “That’s Gods Eye, with the river flowing south. We’re here.” He poked a hole beside the line of the river, under the circle. “We can’t go round west of the lake, like I thought. East takes us back to the kingsroad.” He moved the stick up to where the line and circle met. “Near as I recall, there’s a town here. The holdfast’s stone, and there’s a lordling got his seat there too, just a towerhouse, but he’ll have a guard, might be a knight or two. We follow the river north, should be there before dark. They’ll have boats, so I mean to sell all we got and hire us one.” He drew the stick up through the circle of the lake, from bottom to top. “Gods be good, we’ll find a wind and sail across the Gods Eye to Harrentown.”

We don’t know what hour the sun sets but it’s early autumn in Westeros and I’m guessing they’re about 7 to 8 hours from the south shore of the God’s Eye, at wagon and donkey travel-speed.

We have our first mention of Weasel among a heartbreaking instance of Arya’s remaining faith in humanity.

Hot Pie was being silly; it wouldn’t be ghosts at Harrenhal, it would be knights. Arya could reveal herself to Lady Whent, and the knights would escort her home and keep her safe. That was what knights did; they kept you safe, especially women. Maybe Lady Whent would even help the crying girl.

Sadly, we don’t hear who has been taking care of the little girl since her mother died. Arya makes no mention of it.

They reach the deserted town.

The black brother left ten to guard the wagons and the whimpery little girl, and split the rest of them into four groups of five to search the town.

There are no boats, they decide to spend the night at the holdfast. Lots of descriptions of the holdfast and the town. No mention of the little girl. Seriously, who is minding this little toddler? 

When the food was ready, Arya ate a chicken leg and a bit of onion. No one talked much, not even Lommy. Gendry went off by himself afterward, polishing his helm with a look on his face like he wasn’t even there. The crying girl whimpered and wept, but when Hot Pie offered her a bit of goose she gobbled it down and looked for more.

Ah, at least someone is feeding her. Thank you, Hot Pie. Weasel is hungry, she wants to live.

Hot Pie went off and let her alone and Arya curled up on her pallet. She could hear the crying girl from the far side of the haven. I wish she’d just be quiet. Why does she have to cry all the time?

Getting some sister parallels in here.

Jeyne Poole had been confined with her, but Jeyne was useless. Her face was puffy from all her crying, and she could not seem to stop sobbing about her father.

"I'm certain your father is well," Sansa told her when she had finally gotten the dress buttoned right. "I'll ask the queen to let you see him." She thought that kindness might lift Jeyne's spirits, but the other girl just looked at her with red, swollen eyes and began to cry all the harder. She was such a child. (AGOT, Sansa IV)

Don’t like others crying around you when you’re scared, Stark Sisters, do you? There’s a Robb parallel, too.

"Rickon needs you," Robb said sharply. "He's only three, he doesn't understand what's happening. He thinks everyone has deserted him, so he follows me around all day, clutching my leg and crying. I don't know what to do with him." He paused a moment, chewing on his lower lip the way he'd done when he was little. "Mother, I need you too. I'm trying but I can't … I can't do it all by myself." His voice broke with sudden emotion, and Catelyn remembered that he was only fourteen. She wanted to get up and go to him, but Bran was still holding her hand and she could not move. (AGOT, Catelyn III)

They tend to have other characters reflect their inner emotions. That crying, overwhelmed child that they are trying to ingore: themselves. 

Arya, likely through warg power, wakes up to warn the others of the imminent attack. Amory Lorch’s riders are putting the town to the torch. Arya is watching from the holdfast parapets.

Something bumped against her leg, and she glanced down to discover the crying girl clutching her. “Get away!” She wrenched her leg free. “What are you doing up here? Run and hide someplace, you stupid.” She shoved the girl away.

No room for soft feelings when you have to function to survive.

Lorch is not inclined to spare Yoren on account of being with the NW. They attack and throw torches, the barn has a secret tunnel and Yoren orders them to escape. But the barn is already on fire.

As they were running toward the barn, Arya spied the crying girl sitting in the middle of the chaos, surrounded by smoke and slaughter. She grabbed her by the hand and pulled her to her feet as the others raced ahead. The girl wouldn’t walk, even when slapped. Arya dragged her with her right hand while she held Needle in the left. Ahead, the night was a sullen red. The barn’s on fire, she thought. Flames were licking up its sides from where a torch had fallen on straw, and she could hear the screaming of the animals trapped within. Hot Pie stepped out of the barn. “Arry, come on! Lommy’s gone, leave her if she won’t come!” Stubbornly, Arya dragged all the harder, pulling the crying girl along. Hot Pie scuttled back inside, abandoning them . . . but Gendry came back, the fire shining so bright on his polished helm that the horns seemed to glow orange. He ran to them, and hoisted the crying girl up over his shoulder. “Run!”  

In this moment of absolute mortal danger, Arya decides to take charge of the traumatized toddler to ensure her survival, stubbornly, violently even. Just like Yoren did with her. Hot Pie would have left her. Ouch. Gendry soon takes over, luckily. 

The open trap was only a few feet ahead, but the fire was spreading fast, consuming the old wood and dry straw faster than she would have believed. Arya remembered the Hound’s horrible burned face. “Tunnel’s narrow,” Gendry shouted. “How do we get her through?” “Pull her,” Arya said. “Push her.” “Good boys, kind boys,” called Jaqen H’ghar, coughing. “Get these fucking chains off!” Rorge screamed. Gendry ignored them. “You go first, then her, then me. Hurry, it’s a long way.” “When you split the firewood,” Arya remembered, “where did you leave the axe?” “Out by the haven.” He spared a glance for the chained men. “I’d save the donkeys first. There’s no time.” “You take her!” she yelled. “You get her out! You do it!” The fire beat at her back with hot red wings as she fled the burning barn.

Even having grabbed the little girl and knowing there is a path to escaping, Arya cannot simply flee. She hands over the charge of Weasel to Gendry and proceeds to save the lives of the three captives from the black cells. Because Arya doesn’t just let people die. Not unless she wants them dead herself. A force of nature.

She gets the axe from outside in the battlezone, walks back into the blazing barn, throws the axe into the wagon and dives down to safety. The chapter ends thus:

Arya rolled headfirst into the tunnel and dropped five feet. She got dirt in her mouth but she didn’t care, the taste was fine, the taste was mud and water and worms and life. Under the earth the air was cool and dark. Above was nothing but blood and roaring red and choking smoke and the screams of dying horses. She moved her belt around so Needle would not be in her way, and began to crawl. A dozen feet down the tunnel she heard the sound, like the roar of some monstrous beast, and a cloud of hot smoke and black dust came billowing up behind her, smelling of hell. Arya held her breath and kissed the mud on the floor of the tunnel and cried. For whom, she could not say.

So that went from dire to catastrophic.

I love how this chapter was structured. It starts out quiet, the unease builds in the empty town, they create a moment of respite eating dinner in the perceived safety of the holdfast, but even there they have doomed themselves by lighting the cookfire. Then it escalates, the howling of the wolves, the phony negotiations, the blaze they saw in the distance the chapter before now comes to them, and everything sinks into cacophony, until the last second of dubious escape. Arya’s helpless tears are such a well-earned release of panic and tension. There is no safety, only momentary escape, only confusion. It’s monstrous.

She cries, like Weasel cried.

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ACOK, Arya V (chapter 19)  

We open to Arya high up on a tree observing a village on the Western lakeshore. 

Someone’s there. Arya chewed her lip. All the other places they’d come upon had been empty and desolate. Farms, villages, castles, septs, barns, it made no matter. If it could burn, the Lannisters had burned it; if it could die, they’d killed it. 

They have been traveling in the woods a while since the night of the blaze. Arya remembers them returning the next night, burying Yoren and joining up with three survivors. The route is North along the Western lakeshore.

Cutjack opened the door at Gendry’s shout, and when Kurz said they’d be better pressing on north than going back, Arya had clung to the hope that she still might reach Winterfell. (…)

To the east, Gods Eye was a sheet of sunhammered blue that filled half the world. Some days, as they made their slow way up the muddy shore (Gendry wanted no part of any roads, and even Hot Pie and Lommy saw the sense in that), Arya felt as though the lake were calling her. (…)

North along the shore, past a number of deserted rural settlings. 

At the end of the day she would often sit on a rock and dangle her feet in the cool water. She had finally thrown away her cracked and rotted shoes. Walking barefoot was hard at first, but the blisters had finally broken, the cuts had healed, and her soles had turned to leather. The mud was nice between her toes, and she liked to feel the earth underfoot when she walked. 

This process will have taken some time. A few weeks.

From up here, she could see a small wooded island off to the northeast.

While the Isle of Faces is not truly small, there is no mention of other wooded islands on the lake. This would place Arya less than halfway up the western shore of the lake. This would match the wagon travel speed of a few weeks from the kingsroad to the holdfast on the south shore. They are slow because they avoid roads, trudge through vegetation and mud, and because they are encumbered by injury and a toddler.

The food situation is not great.

She had broken her fast on some acorn paste and a handful of bugs. Bugs weren’t so bad when you got used to them. Worms were worse, but still not as bad as the pain in your belly after days without food. Finding bugs was easy, all you had to do was kick over a rock. Arya had eaten a bug once when she was little, just to make Sansa screech, so she hadn’t been afraid to eat another. Weasel wasn’t either, but Hot Pie retched up the beetle he tried to swallow, and Lommy and Gendry wouldn’t even try. Yesterday Gendry had caught a frog and shared it with Lommy, and, a few days before, Hot Pie had found blackberries and stripped the bush bare, but mostly they had been living on water and acorns.

The kids are on their own. Kurz the poacher was kind to them and gave them some survival training. But he died four days after they set off from an infected wound. The other two adults abandoned them directly after. Echoes of Dany with Drogo and the khalasar. Up and gone when he died, leaving behind the weak and the slaves.

Maybe Tarber and Cutjack figured they would stand a better chance without a gaggle of orphan boys to herd along. They probably would too, but that didn’t stop her hating them for leaving.

This is horrific. Four children between 14 and 9 years old, plus a little toddler. Sneakily abandoned by the two remaining adults. The Hansel and Gretel vibes are strong. Like Hansel and Gretel, they will be captured looking for food. Like Gretel, Arya will free them using cooking as a weapon, eventually. But that’s for later.

Very much of Arya’s chapters echoes Dany, actually. All from opposite sides. The violence, the abandonment, the eventual enslavement, the starving. The comparison to sheep. It all shows the bottom side of Dany’s war at Drogo’s side, and her travels through the desert with the baby dragons. Even Vaes Tolorro mirrors the Gods Eye town. Food and rest, and visitors that will lead them to another large settlement, eventually. But back to the kids in the woods.

Arya rejoins the others and we see Weasel again. 

At the sound of her voice, Weasel came creeping out from the bushes. Lommy had named her that. He said she looked like a weasel, which wasn’t true, but they couldn’t keep on calling her the crying girl after she finally stopped crying. Her mouth was filthy. Arya hoped she hadn’t been eating mud again.

“Did you see people?” asked Gendry. “Mostly just roofs,” Arya admitted, “but some chimneys were smoking, and I heard a horse.” The Weasel put her arms around her leg, clutching tight. Sometimes she did that now.

So Weasel is all cried out. It’s been a month or so since she lost her family after her village was set ablaze, followed soon after by another such violent, fiery attack. She went from a stationary life in a vilage with her family, meal time, bed time, cuddles and playing, to a life of being scared, confused, hungry, dirty and constantly on the move. 

Like Arya, Weasel stopped crying, like Arya, Weasel doesn’t mind mud in her mouth.

“If it’s a fishing village, they’d sell us fish, I bet,” said Hot Pie. The lake teemed with fresh fish, but they had nothing to catch them with. Arya had tried to use her hands, the way she’d seen Koss do, but fish were quicker than pigeons and the water played tricks on her eyes. “I don’t know about fish.” Arya tugged at the Weasel’s matted hair, thinking it might be best to hack it off. “There’s crows down by the water. Something’s dead there.” “Fish, washed up on shore,” Hot Pie said. “If the crows eat it, I bet we could.” “We should catch some crows, we could eat them,” said Lommy. “We could make a fire and roast them like chickens.”

I love these kids. They are hungry and grumpy and irritated and listless, in their way. They have no clue what to do and injured Lommy is the most anxious of them all. His leg was wounded and infection is setting in. He is the most helpless, and it makes him the most annoying of them. Yield, he says. Yield.

Like Yoren did to her, Arya contemplates hacking off Weasel’s hair. Matted, tangled. Like a bird’s nest, perchance? 

A lovely parallel highlighting the role of privilege, with another taumatized orphan cared for by a Stark daughter:

Alayne smoothed his hair. Lady Lysa had never let the servants touch it, and after she had died Robert had suffered terrible shaking fits whenever anyone came near him with a blade, so it had been allowed to grow until it tumbled over his round shoulders and halfway down his flabby white chest. He does have pretty hair. If the gods are good and he lives long enough to wed, his wife will admire his hair, surely. That much she will love about him. (TWOW, Alayne I)

Arya is trying to care for this child, for her inner child, but she does it listlessly, no practice, no plan. She doesn’t talk to Weasel, at all. Numb.

“Whoever it is, you should yield to them,” Lommy whined. “I need some potion for my leg, it hurts bad.” “If we see any leg potion, we’ll bring it,” Gendry said. “Arry, let’s go, I want to get near before the sun is down. Hot Pie, you keep Weasel here, I don’t want her following.” “Last time she kicked me.” “I’ll kick you if you don’t keep her here.” Without waiting for an answer,  Gendry donned his steel helm and walked off.  Arya had to scamper to keep up. Gendry was five years older and a foot taller than she was, and long of leg as well. For a while he said nothing, just plowed on through the trees with an angry look on his face, making too much noise. But finally he stopped and said, “I think Lommy’s going to die.”

Ah. 

Gendry is the “adult” in the group and he’s definitely going through his own “Rickon in tugging on my leg” phase, and presenting Arya with a variant of an offer Dany gets from Xaro in Meereen later: Abandon this doomed, starving lot and take your chances elsewhere. Unlike Dany, Arya is not actually responsible for any of these children, not even little Weasel. Unlike Dany, she is not even close to tempted.

“I’m sick of carrying him, and I’m sick of all his talk about yielding too. If he could stand up, I’d knock his teeth in. Lommy’s no use to anyone. That crying girl’s no use either.” “You leave Weasel alone, she’s just scared and hungry is all.” Arya glanced back, but the girl was not following for once. Hot Pie must have grabbed her, like Gendry had told him. “She’s no use,” Gendry repeated stubbornly. “Her and Hot Pie and Lommy, they’re slowing us down, and they’re going to get us killed. You’re the only one of the bunch who’s good for anything. Even if you are a girl.”

I am cutting out the following super hilarious exchange around revealing her identity, along with the horrible description of the village with the gibbet and the “SS rounds up the villagers for questioning and deportation” imagery.

Gendry gets himself captured and hauled into the warehouse with the other prisoners. Arya will leave no one behind. Arya will defend her pack. 

Lommy and Hot Pie almost shit themselves when she stepped out of the trees behind them. “Quiet,” she told them, putting an arm around Weasel when the little girl came running up.

Hot Pie stared at her with big eyes. “We thought you left us.” He had his shortsword in hand, the one Yoren had taken off the gold cloak. “I was scared you was a wolf.”

She has her arms around Weasel, trying to comfort the child, keeping in touch with the last of her innocence. It’s her final interaction with Weasel. They thought she was a wolf. She will be. 

Hot Pie glanced at Lommy, at Arya, at Lommy again. “I’ll come,” he said reluctantly. “Lommy, you keep Weasel here.” He grabbed the little girl by the hand and pulled her close. “What if the wolves come?” “Yield,” Arya suggested.

Iconic, badass quote. Heartbreaking context. Their rescue mission is unsurprisingly doomed before it truly gets going. Hot Pie “yields” at the first instance and Arya receives a terrible blow to the head. They take Needle. They are made to lead guards to Lommy and Weasel. 

The man with the torch searched around under the trees. “Are you the last? Baker Boy said there was a girl.” “She ran off when she heard you coming,” Lommy said. “You made a lot of noise.” And Arya thought, Run, Weasel, run as far as you can, run and hide and never come back.

Hide, inner child. Run and hide, like Nymeria. Like the wolf.

So that is the last we see of little Weasel. 

Realistically, she will be dead within days. Exposure, poisoning, injury, starvation unless she has absorbed enough from the others to gather enough bugs for herself. Or eaten by wolves. Plus the fear, the feeling of abandonment. It’s a grim picture. It becomes unbearable when you try and picture any toddler you know in the place of Weasel.

I am going to headcanon hardcore that Baby Weasel is going to be found by loving people and taken away to safety, wrapped up warm and fed and gently raised. Alternatively, she is kindly raised by the giant wolf pack. And somehow not freezing to death. *hands over ears* Lalalalaalalalalaalalala!

We end the chapter with one more death, one that we will see avenged four books later:

“Can you walk?” He sounded concerned. “No,” said Lommy. “You got to carry me.” “Think so?” The man lifted his spear casually and drove the point through the boy’s soft throat. Lommy never even had time to yield again. He jerked once, and that was all. When the man pulled his spear loose, blood sprayed out in a dark fountain. “Carry him, he says,” he muttered, chuckling.

The echoes are beautifully done.

"Well," she said, "I don't know how you'll get there, then." "You'll need to carry me." See? thought Mercy. You know your line, and so do I. "Think so?" asked Arya, sweetly. Raff the Sweetling looked up sharply as the long thin blade came sliding from her sleeve. She slipped it through his throat beneath the chin, twisted, and ripped it back out sideways with a single smooth slash. A fine red rain followed, and in his eyes the light went out. "Valar morghulis," Arya whispered, but Raff was dead and did not hear. 

(TWOW, Mercy)

On the one hand, it’s poetic justice. On the other, it screams out that Arya is basically a child concentration camp survivor but the war is not over. She has had no peace, only ever more hiding, no play, only ever more working, no recovery, only ever more killing. She is in exile, still. But she will return home. And she will one day recover. But she will never ever forget.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In Arya VI, she chooses a new name herself for the first time. The concentration camp vibes are strong. Just read the chapter.

“Some farmer’s whelp, are you? Well, never you mind, girl, you have a chance to win a higher place in this world if you work hard. If you won’t work hard, you’ll be beaten. And what do they call you?” Arya dared not say her true name, but Arry was no good either, it was a boy’s name and they could see she was no boy. “Weasel,” she said, naming the first girl she could think of. “Lommy called me Weasel.”

Lommy and Weasel. Injured and young. No use. Dead and gone but not forgotten.

Ramsey names his dogs for the girls he killed. Sansa and Jon each want to name her future children for the family they lost. Arya names herself for the women and girls she cared about. Weasel. Cat. Nymeria, Nan. Even little Beth Cassel. Her kill list is one part of her. But the list of names that truly matters is another. She takes up their cause not in a hope for a peaceful future with personal happiness like Jon and Sansa but in the here and now, within the broiling whirlwind of injustices. But the very first name is for the little girl, for herself, essentially. 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In conclusion:

Little Weasel is, to me, a personification of Arya’s inner child, as she struggles with her loss of innocence and the abandonment by adults. Because she shows up when they encounter their first hardcore warcrime scene. Arya tries to ignore her wailing and pays little attention to her, but attaches her to her hopes for help from Lady Whent and her Knights. She doesn’t take charge of Weasel until their adult caretakers, such as they are, become unavailable by way of being horribly murdered in battle. She is not really equipped to care for her, but she tries and she is determined not to abandon her. When she has disappeared, Arya doesn’t despair, she wishes her well, she has some remnant of faith and she attaches it to Weasel. Off into the wild, to escape certain death, perchance to survive, like she sent off Nymeria. 

It is no accident that Arya names herself Weasel when she enters the concentration camp hell that is Harrenhal, and it is a truly briliant stroke that her only direct memory of Weasel after that is when Arya enters service in the House of Black and White in AFFC, Arya II, which seems more empowering but draws up many comparisons in her mind to Harrenhal. The inner child has run off, but her spirit remains hovering over Arya, never quite fading.