#it's also that from what i remember of the third episode she's like putting aegon to bed and spending time with him as a baby

[navree]

hm.

hm.

[bbygirl-aemond]

What would happen if Alicent agreed to marry Jace and Helaena?

Alright so there are a few posts that'll be useful to check out before reading my answer! The first is a post here about how Rhaenyra is actually smarter and more politically savvy than most people give her credit for, which will explain why I treat her in this response as fully aware of the implications of what she's doing. The second is a post here about what would happen if the Greens let Rhaenyra take the throne, which builds on historical precedent from the time period GRRM based HotD off of to explain why Alicent is convinced that her children would be killed if Rhaenyra assumed the throne. Okay, so with all of this information in mind, let's get into why this was a win-win scenario for Rhaenyra, and a lose-lose scenario for Alicent!

From a political standpoint, if Helaena married Jace, she would be used against the Greens. It would bring Dreamfyre over to the Blacks' side, leaving the Greens with only Sunfyre and Tessarion, who are both young dragons. Remember, Laena and Laenor are still alive in this episode, so Vhagar is still on Team Black, as is Seasmoke. And Helaena would also immediately become a political hostage the second war broke out, because the Blacks would imprison her in case she tried to escape and help her family.

And conflict between the Blacks and the Greens would still be inevitable, because Helaena marrying does nothing to erase the facts that (1) Westeros is highly misogynistic and (2) Viserys still has three sons who are alternatives to Rhaenyra in many lords' eyes. So as in the post I linked above, the Greens would still become figureheads of a movement against Rhaenyra, either willingly or unwillingly. If war broke out, the Greens would lose, and Alicent's sons would all be put to death; even if it didn't, they would still pose a threat to Rhaenyra's claim and would likely be killed by one of her supporters (cough cough Daemon) to stabilize her rule.

From a personal standpoint, Alicent also has reason to believe this arrangement would be detrimental to Helaena's happiness. First, we know that Helaena is close with her family, and Aemond in particular. Remember that in canon, Helaena killed herself right after Aemond died, and since the show has explicitly made her a dragon dreamer this is in no way a coincidence. Even if she wasn't entirely suicidal and remained alive after her siblings died, she'd 100% be mad with grief the way she was in canon.

Second, Alicent has no reason to believe Jace would be a better/safer husband than Aegon. Remember, Alicent doesn't know Jace; she doesn't know he's a good person the way we as the audience do. Someone pointed out in the reblogs that the only data point she has on Jace is that he was involved in bullying Aemond, which doesn't make a great impression. She also hasn't been shown evidence of Aegon being a rapist yet. And honestly, in canon Aegon is far from an abusive husband to Helaena considering the circumstances. The only evidence we have of their relationship shows that he leaves her alone, except for when he's forced to conceive children with her, and brings her gifts (the beetle she's playing with at the dinner is from him). There are no hints of him physically or verbally abusing her. And Helaena seems very content with this situation, being left to her own devices. Alicent has no way of hoping that Jace would be as understanding of Helaena's eccentricities as she can ensure Aegon will be. In fact, because of the above point about bullying Aemond, she has reason to believe Jace might be unkind about Helaena being different.

Third, Helaena is also very heavily coded as autistic, and I can tell you that being forced to leave behind everyone and everything she's ever known to go with Jace to Dragonstone is absolutely her worst nightmare, regardless of how much she might like Jace. Like, autism and complete upheavals of routines and familiar environments do NOT mix, at ALL.

Fourth, Alicent wants to save Helaena from the trauma she herself went through, as much as she has the power to. Remember, Alicent went through all of the trauma of rape and forced pregnancy/childbirth completely alone. She didn't have her best friend, and she also didn't have her mother, and she absolutely doesn't want Helaena to go through the same things without her mother's support. Alicent maintains the most control over Helaena's safety and happiness by keeping her close to home; who would send their child into an unknown situation with an unknown spouse who may or may not make them miserable, knowing that they're different in a way that practically everyone refuses to understand or accommodate?

Oh also, a lot of people say that by marrying Helaena to Aegon, Alicent was forcing her to be a SA victim. But that ignores that there is no real possibility, in Alicent's mind, that Helaena would ever have a husband she's attracted to and wants to sleep with. It's never even been a possibility for Alicent herself, nor for like 99% of noble women in Westeros who have to marry for purely political reasons rather than true love. Besides, Alicent has no reason to think Helaena would be magically attracted to Jace since she doesn't know him. In Alicent's mind, Jace doesn't present a possibility of consensual sex for Helaena; no potential husband does. In this, Aegon is no worse than any other option for her.

Meanwhile, though this arrangement would come at political and personal cost to Helaena and the Greens as a whole, it only serves to benefit Rhaenyra. Securing a Valyrian bride for Jace- and babies that will most likely look Valyrian- only helps to strengthen Jace's claim, which in turn strengthens Rhaenyra's. As mentioned above, it also disarms Rhaenyra's enemies of their biggest, oldest dragon at the time. So while Alicent would risk everything by agreeing to this arrangement, Rhaenyra risks nothing and in fact only stands to gain from it.

So of course Alicent says no. Her children's chance of survival, including Helaena's, is best if they remain united and fight together. Helaena's chance of happiness, in Alicent's mind, is most certain if she stays close to home, and Alicent is honestly probably right for all of the reasons stated above.

The kicker is that Rhaenyra has proposed this whole thing KNOWING Alicent cannot accept. She probably suspects that Alicent's trying to maneuver towards the throne even if she doesn't fully appreciate why, and she and Alicent both demonstrate a ton of empathy for each other as mothers, so she absolutely understands why Alicent wants to keep Helaena close. She's not proposing this because she thinks Alicent will accept. She WANTS Alicent to reject her offer.

Why? Because it makes Rhaenyra look good, and it makes Alicent look bad. Remember, this is right after Joffrey was born, with the whole deal over the bastard situation. When the people in that room are wondering why Alicent turned Rhaenyra down, their minds won't go where Rhaenyra's went. They'll assume Alicent only turned Rhaenyra down because of the rumors. This will make them think Rhaenyra was extending an olive branch and being the better person, while Alicent was refusing it and being bitter and hostile.

This is what I mean when I say this is a win-win scenario for Rhaenyra, and a lose-lose scenario for Alicent. If Alicent accepts, Rhaenyra secures a Valyrian bride for her son and strengthens her claim, while Alicent's kids will be in equal danger but less equipped to protect themselves and Helaena will likely be miserable. If Alicent refuses, Rhaenyra comes off as the empathetic hero, while Alicent is painted as the paranoid, crazy villain.

Again, this is some pretty next-level political maneuvering from Rhaenyra here. Remember, the more irrational and mean Alicent seems, the easier it is to rope everyone else, especially Viserys, into gaslighting Alicent. And with the rejection of this offer, Rhaenyra can lean into being more hostile with the justification that she tried to be the good guy, but Alicent forced her hand.

[myungodlyhour]

DISCLAIMER FOR SPOILERS

I’m probably going to rewatch this season, but here’s my major thoughts on House of the Dragon that no one asked for (from someone who read the books and is nearly a super fan, my favorite fantasy series by a mile from all the ones I’ve read in my life)

First off, The people upset the Vaeleryons are black are racist and need to get over it. It also proves y’all have no sense didn’t understand whats shown to y’all. Jace and Luke are not Laenors kids biologically. Those kids are completely white by blood, but black by name. And Jace has the Targaryen last name due to to the deal Corlyes and Viserys made, so its only Luke with the name anyway. And neither of them end up on the throne anyway, they die. Dany is a descendant of Rhaneyra, but from Rhaneyras son with Damon. Dany is all white still for those who care so much. Fucking idiots.

The pacing in the beginning was wild, unnecessarily fast. There could’ve been 2 more episodes between that 6 year time jump (the third jump to get to the cast we have now) just to explore the characters and their dynamics more. Especially with Rhaneyra and her lover, Damon and Laena, Aemond and Vhagar bonding (or the fail of it), Aegon and Helena, Alicent being Alicent and etc. I think one of the issues I see with shows that are prequels, or shows that are trying to get to something (this show is both) always rush to get to that exciting part. Like, we know how this ends from GOT (thanks Joffrey), take your time. You have an entire other season to start filming the actual dance, two more episodes would’ve been fine so we can connect with characters and it be more tragic and upsetting with what happens cus it’s all so tragic.

The childbirth and death scene with Aemma was uncalled for. I get what they were attempting, but completely uncalled for in the way they shot that. My mother had c-sections for all 5 of her kids and was horrified when watching that. That was completely irresponsible, and I don’t want to hear anything about “that’s what happened in medieval times” pls shut the fuck up. We know that, and we kno it still happens now, we’re not stupid.

Ladies, never be an Alicent. Yes, she was forced into the situation by her father, we saw that. However, the actress that plays the older version of Alicent (Olivia Cook) said she thinks of Alicent as a woman for trump and it’s very obvious and correct. However, she does not say republican, and women need to remember that white women aren’t the only women for trump, and more importantly from the amazing GRRM himself, Alicent is a woman who uphold the patriarchy. Both things are true, she for trump and upholds the patriarchy regardless of the man in charge. Black women, Asian women, Hispanic women, old and youn women, higher educated and not women, rich and poor women, able and disabled women, straight and queer women. There’s so much more in depth I could go with Alicent, but this woman (especially the show version) has no self respect. Princess Rhaenys, The Queen Who Never Was, said it best that all Alicent wants is to make a window on the wall of her prison. This woman lets Clubfoot degrade her by showing her feet for information, puts her rapist son on the throne when he doesn’t even want it. This woman does not uplift herself at all when uplifting the patriarchy. The show is clearly attempting to make Alicent more likeable in the show and oblivious to the consequences her actions will have, but book Alicent isn’t nearly as stupid. She knows exactly what she’s doing.

Otto started the whole thing. No one was going after Alicent children when Rhaneyra ended up on the throne. He planted that seed in her head. There was never going to be a civil war between lords, he was egging it on. Otto wants power for himself and the hightowers, he doesn’t give a damn about Aegon and what’s best for the realm. And he ain’t no Littlefinger either, he plays the game too publicly and messy, that’s why his ass got caught and fired the first time.

Why are people shocked and outraged with what Damon did? He’s always shown signs of what a piece shit of a husband he is to literally all of his other wives. Y’all think Rhaeneyra was going to change him? There such a power struggle and balance in daemons favor that he absolutely takes advantage of constantly, and episode 10 showed it perfectly. This man has ambitions and that’s never going to change, it’s always a high chance that that ambition will trump his love for anyone. It’s very obvious and I’m not shocked that Viserys didn’t tell him about the dream, I wouldn’t either. He’s reckless alas the Rouge Prince nickname and I doubt he would take it seriously. Granted, they shouldn’t have taken the scene out with him hugging his daughters after their mother passed, but he’s overall not a good person. Matt Smith (the actor who plays him) just does an outstanding job.

Some people are forgetting that this show is based off a book that is not a novel, but a history book written by a maester with testimonies from others. The book is based off rumors and gossip by onlookers. None of these characters have a pov like in ASOIAF books. The show is attempting to be objective and show what actually happened during the dance, which automatically signals changes are to be made. And the change they did with the fight at Storms End makes complete sense. No one was up there with Aemond and Luke but Aemond and Luke. Everyone knows that Aemond has resentment, a grudge, and wants Luke’s eye for repayment for what he did to him. So why do people think it’s far fetched that the person writing this history book wouldn’t believe it was an accident when all Aemond has shown for years is animosity for his nephew?

The seeds were planted from the jump. Viserys literally said the Targaryen control over dragons is an illusion. Why would anyone think they could actually control those beasts? They are intelligent creatures who have autonomy. Which ks why Aemond had every right to claim Vhaegar. They’re not passed down. You want one, go get one. Was it wrong for him to do it at that time yes, but you can’t hold a dragon. That dragon could have rejected the little girl who they were going to give Vhaegar to, because dragons choose their riders, not the other way around. And it’s obvious that Aemond used Vhaegar as an object and symbol and toy, not a champion with the respect she deserved from a rider. You don’t play in the sky with a big ass war dragon like that. VHAEGAR IS A WAR DRAGON TRAINED TO KILL NOT FUCK AROUND. You might have been playing, but dragons can feel the emotions of their rider. She felt the anger Aemond had and acted on it. Arrax blew fire and Vhaegar said not only will I not be disrespected by a child dragon, but I know how to get us out of here alive because I been here before. She has war flashbacks and only saw an enemy at that point. That’s exactly why Rhaneyra said she didn’t want to start a war with dragons, because although team black has more, theirs haven’t seen war. And neither did Aemond, so of course he couldn’t control her. Neither could Luke control Arrax, bc Arrax felt Luke being terrified in that situation which made him terrified and decide to act and protect them both. Arrax was not in the wrong, he was antagonized and defended himself (and Luke). That was a fight between dragons who didn’t give a damn about their riders command, they’re trying to survive just as their riders are. Luke literally had to calm Arrax before they even took off because he was scared as hell seeing that big ass dragon and having to fly inside a storm. Aemond is a perfect example of ducking around ad finding out. You don’t do stupid shit like that. Now he either has a choice in season 2 to go home and say it was an accident or play it off that he did it in cold blood because either way, he’ll be known as a Kinslayer, and the incident will be written in the history books exactly how it was in Fire & Blood.

Aemond was a kid bullied by his brother and nephews, then got disabled and bullied for it and constantly reminded of it, and lives in a world that treats disabled people like shit, very much like our own. I’m not saying all disabled people would do this, but what would people think this character in this world and personality and family was going to do when he gained possession of a big as dragon, the biggest and oldest one alive? Terrorize those mother duckers back.

RIP Lucareys Vaelaryon. He followed his mothers orders and came as a messenger not a warrior. That poor baby just wanted to go home. He didn’t even want to go. He shouldn’t have been there in the first place and I stand by that. He had no confidence to win over the Baratheon’s loyalty, it was going to fail regardless. That baby died terrified just wanting to go home.

Even knowing that Luke was going to die going into the show and episode (from the book and not the leak, whoever leaks stuff are shifty people ruining stuff for others like a get a life), it still had me tearing up and on the edge of my seat panicking. For them to fly through a storm and think they’re in the clear when they get to a clear sky, and have them be shown clear as day getting devoured is awful but genius and a beautiful scene visually. Very well done scene.

I’m not ready for 🩸 & 🧀 that’s going to be horrific. I’m interested in seeing how they’re going to go abou that in the show version.

No matter what team you’re on (I’m neither despite loving Rhaneyra), you have to acknowledge that Team green is doing everything illegally, which fundamentally makes them in the wrong. Alicent had no documentation that Viserys said he wanted aegon to be king, which he didn’t. He was talking about Aegon the Conqueror and his prophecy of A Song of Ice and Fire (the white walkers), not his incompetent, abusive, rapist son. Alicent heard what she wanted to hear, which is Aegons name and ran with it. And she knew this man had dementia. He thought he was talking to Rhaneyra. HE LITERALLY CALLED ALICENT AEMMA (his dead first wife) AT THE FUNERAL FOR LEANA.

Viserys should’ve made Rhaneyra his hand, then she would’ve been there at his death and would know exactly how to rule because she was at his side to see how it’s done. She never should’ve been at dragon stone, especially with his clear demise. He should’ve made his daughter Halena marry Rhaneyras son Jacerys to keep the peace. But even at his weakest point he still showed up for his daughter, because that’s what a father does. The actor (Paddy) who plays him truly deserves an Emmy. Phenomenal job.

The vast majority of these characters will do terrible things, including my girl Rhaneyra. They’ll have tragic endings (some deserved more than others). Unlike Tolkiens middle-earth that is good vs evil, GRRM who was inspired by that world took that and explored very, very morally gray characters.

And for all those complaining about it not being accurate, no movie adaptation ever will be a 100% copy of the book. It’s impossible, and every writer and author knows that, but for some reason fans/readers are incapable or refuse to understand that. The conversation is always was it good changes or bad ones when authors are upset, they’re never upset that things are changed. Unlike with most seasons of the GOT show, GRRM has heavy input and is said they are listening to him and he’s signing off on these changes. So if he’s happy and/or fine with it and is possibly suggesting it, then why are you mad and complaining on the basis that it’s not 100% accurate? And again, the book itself probably isn’t accurate on the events that happened itself anyway.

And the joke that Vhaegar thought Visenya was still on her back attempting to conquer Dorne and being like “we did it Visenya, we got Dorne! Wait—-what happened to your 👁” is hilarious 😂 and probably the most accurate thing out of the whole show (I really hope we get a prequel prequel on the conquest, how epic that would be)

[ansheofthevalley]

Truth

This word has been mentioned in all the episodes so far. But what’s interesting is that all three times this word was uttered was in the Crypts.

If we look at it in a surface level, it’s not much. The word is said in different episodes by different people in different contexts. The three scenes have a literal meaning, but there’s more than one meaning to every, any, text. 

Taking Roland Barthes’ theory of the Five Codes from “S/Z”, we could say that these scenes can fall into one group because they all hint at the same thing, their connotation is the same: they all hint at the truth. These scenes share the same signifier (truth), which means that “truth” is something that will appear more than once, it will appears several times, so it’s safe to say that “truth” is a crucial aspect of the story. This refers to the second code: the semantic code. But we can view “truth” through another lens. We can take this word and ask ourselves what it means, what does it hint at, what does it answer. The word acts as an enigma: it’s both a question and an answer, one that will come up again and again, until we have more pieces of the puzzle, so we could finally piece it all together. This refers to the first code: the hermeneutic code.

So, having this in mind, there are some questions that arises when watching these scenes while being aware of their shared connotation and the repetition of the word truth: What could this mean? How does this one word drive the story forward? 

8x01: “Winterfell”

The scene where this is said is during the revelation of Jon’s parentage to him by Sam.

J: I wasn’t a king.

S: But you were. You’ve always been.

J: I gave up my crown, Sam. I bent the knee, I’m not King in the North anymore.

S: I’m not talking about King in the North, I’m talking about the King of the bloody Seven Kingdoms.

[…]

S: Your mother was Lyanna Stark. And your father, your real father, was Rhaegar Targaryen. You’ve never been a bastard. You’re Aegon Targaryen, true heir to the Iron Throne.

What’s interesting is that during the reveal, the camera zooms in on Jon’s face. This same technique is used when Jon reveals the truth to Dænerys in the following episode. We watch Jon take in all the information Sam is giving him.

J: My father was the most honorable man I’ve ever met. You’re saying he lied to me all my life?

S: Your father, well, Ned Stark, he promised your mother he’d always protect you.

S: And he did. Robert would’ve murdered you if he knew. You’re the true King. Aegon Targaryen, the sixth of his name, Protector of the Realm, all of it.

This shot is poignant. It’s not only there to put Jon in the same frame with his mother. It’s also there to remind us what Ned did for love. He lied to his wife, to his family, to his King. All because of her sister. “The things we do for love…”

J: Dænerys is our Queen.

S: She shouldn’t be.

J: That’s treason.

S: It’s the truth. You gave up your crown to save your people, would she do the same?

While the first thing that comes to mind when we link this scene with the word “truth” is the truth of Jon’s parentage: that’s the literal meaning. But we must not forget the when and why that word it’s said.

Sam says that Dænerys shouldn’t be queen, to which Jon replies: “it’s treason”, and Sam is quick to say that what he’s saying is the truth: she shouldn’t be queen, and Jon doesn’t deny what Sam says. Remember that this conversation started with Sam telling Jon that Dænerys executed his father and brother for not bending the knee. 

If we look at it with the hermeneutic code in mind, the scene acts as a formulation of the enigma: should Dænerys be Queen? It’s the first episode of the season, a lot of things can still happen. Some believe that she should be Queen, others don’t. But what this scene does to us, the audience, is make us ask ourselves this. That “truth” will come up again, whether in actions or lines. The enigma presented in 8x01 was present in both 8x02 and 8x03, and it’s only right that it will be present in the remaining episodes, because it’s a question it needs answering. 

It gets a little more difficult with the semantic code, because the meaning can change throughout the story. In this particular scene, the word “truth” is connected to monarch: Jon is the true heir, Dænerys claims to be the true heir. One is the one that’s supposed to be the monarch, the other wants to be the monarch. So, in 8x01, we can equal the word “truth” to the concept of “monarch”.

So this scene not only deals with the truth of Jon’s parents, but also with the connotation of monarch and the formulation of the enigma.

8x02: “A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms”

This scene is fairly similar to the one in 8x01, overall. There’s a reveal of the truth of Jon’s parentage in the Crypts. But the context and the connotations of this scene are vastly different. We have a shaken Jon with a clueless Dænerys, but when the reveal happens, the tension instantly grows, because of what this means politically.

D: Who’s that?

J: Lyanna Stark.

It’s pretty significant that this reveal happens in front of Lyanna’s statue. In 8x01, when Sam formulated the enigma, it was in front of Lyanna’s statue as well. From a visual POV, the show doesn’t want us to forget the importance of Lyanna, whether it’s the promise she got from Ned or the fact that she’s Jon’s mother. But right now, we’re taken right to history between House Stark and House Targaryen, and how Lyanna and Rhaegar’s elopment caused caos and war.

D: My brother Rhaegar… Everyone told me he was decent and kind. He liked to sing, gave money to poor children… And he raped her.

J: He didn’t.

J: He loved her. They were married in secret. After Rhaegar fell in the Trident, she had a son.

This is the first time during the scene they are not only physically separated, but facing each other, with Lyanna’s statue in the back of the shot, appearing to be between the two. While in the 8x01 scene the statue represented Ned’s promise to Lyanna, now it represents an obstacle in Jon and Dæny’s relationship.

J: Robert would’ve murdered the baby and Lyanna knew it. So the last thing she did, as she bled to death in her birthing bed…

J: was give the boy to her brother, Ned Stark, to raise as his bastard. My name, my real name, is Aegon Targaryen.

During this reveal, we’re meant to see Dæny’s reaction to the truth. The camera slowly zooms in on her face just as Jon is telling her about Lyanna’s final moments and Ned’s promise. 

D: That’s impossible.

J: I wish it were.

D: Who told you this?

J: Bran. He saw it.

D: He saw it?

J: And Samwell confirmed it. He read about their marriage in the Citadel without even knowing what it meant.

Dænerys is quick to ask about how Jon found out about this, clearly questioning its veracity, as she will do in the next .

D: A secret no one in the world knew, except your brother and your best friend. Doesn’t it seem strange to you?

J: It’s true, Dæny. I know it is.

D: If it were true, it would make you the last male heir of House Targaryen. You’d have a claim to the Iron Throne.

Again. like the scene in 8x01, the word “true” is linked to Jon’s real parentage. The literal meaning is the same. 

But Jon says “It’s true, Dæny. I know it is” after she questions the veracity of what Jon, Bran, Sam and the audience know is true. Jon isn’t lying. But Dæny still refuses to accept it as the truth, for she says “if it were true”. For her it’s something that can be refuted. 

If we look at it with the hermeneutic code in mind, what this scene does is gives us a partial answer to the enigma from 8x01: the rules of succession in Westeros indicate that the heir to the Throne is the eldest son. In this case, the Mad King having been overthrown and Rhaegar, his heir, killed in battle, the next one in the line of succession would be Jon, for he is the last living legitimate son of the heir to the Throne. His claim surpasses Dæny’s, who’s a third child and female. So, should Dænerys be Queen of the Seven Kingdoms? Well, if we take into account the rules of succession, the answer would be no. This scene gives us an answer to that question, but it’s not the definitive answer.

If we look at it with the semantic code in mind, the word “true” is still connected to the word “monarch”, but it could also be connected to “conflict”. This connotation is implied. Dænerys has been fighting for the Iron Throne since s1, but now it turns out she’s not even the righful heir. The implied conflict comes from the last two remaining Targaryens, one that has a legitimate claim to the Throne as the true heir, and the other who has been fighting to get it back for most of her life.

So this scene not only deals with Jon’s true parentage (again), but it gives a partial answer to the enigma and hints at a possible conflict.

8x03: “The Long Night”

This scene is different than the first two, in that it’s not about the parentage reveal. This scene, in essence, is about sacrifice, making a difference, hopelessness and bravery.

T: If we were up there, we might see something everyone else is missing. Something that makes a difference.

V: *scoffs*

T: What? Remember the Battle of Blackwater? I brought us through the mudgate.

V: And got your face cut in half.

T: And it made a difference. If I was out there right now

S: You’d die. 

The framing of the first two shots is interesting; Tyrion is in the middle of the frame, looking straight at us, it’s as if he’s saying his line to us: “if we were up there, we might see something everyone else is missing. Something that makes a difference”. With the reaction shot of Varys, the spell is gone, we’re no longer interacting with Tyrion, we’re mere spectators. They do a back-and-forth until Sansa cuts in.

S: There’s nothing you can do. 

Now, the back-and-forth is between Tyrion and Sansa. 

T: You might be surprised of the lenghts I’d go to to avoid joining the Army of the Dead. I could think of no organization less suited to my talents.

S: Witty remarks won’t make a difference. It’s why we’re down here, none of us can do anything. 

One of the things that makes this scene interesting is how differently are Tyrion and Sansa handling hopelessness in the face of danger. Tyrion just can’t seem to sit still, while Sansa admits that the situation is far out of her reach. All they can do is wait.

When she says that none of them can do anything, she isn’t saying that they’re useless because they can’t fight. She’s saying that they’re better down in the crypts because them being out there where the fight is wouldn’t make a difference. 

S: It’s the truth. It’s the most heroic thing we can do now, look the truth in the face.

Sansa saying “it’s the truth” is pretty meaningful. It’s admitting there are certain battles she just can’t fight, where she has to sit and wait and hope for the best. It means having to trust the ones fighting the good fight for you.

Look at her face in the second, third and fourth shots. She’s not looking at Tyrion while saying “it’s the most heroic thing we can do now, look the truth in the face”, she looks fazed out. 

So, what is this truth Sansa is referring to? Well, literally, is about that none of them can do anything about their current situation. That’s the literal meaning of the word “truth” in this scene.

Having the semantic code in mind, the word “truth” takes on another connotation, different from “monarch” and “conflict”. In this scene, it relates to “change”: the heart of the scene is the fact of wanting to change things for the better, of having and giving advantage to their allies in order to come out on top, and whether or not they can do this. It’s implied these characters want to be a driving force of change, and they could be: it’s just that given this particular situation, they just can’t. 

But with the hermeneutic code in mind, it’s different. While you can connect the connotations of the word “truth” to the enigma presented by Sam in 8x01, should Dænerys be Queen?, I believe we’re given a suspended answer. Why? Because we know for a fact that both Sansa and Tyrion are driving forces of change: the former made it possible for her family to retake Winterfell, the latter believes himself to be a driving force of change by bringing Dænerys to Westeros to reclaim the Iron Throne. They’re also on opposite sides; Sansa fights for Northern Independence, Tyrion is Dæny’s Hand. So there you’ve got conflict. We started to get our answers regarding the 8x01 enigma with the Jon-Dæny scene in 8x02, but came to a halt in 8x03. But it’s not that 8x03 gave us nothing, it reminded us of the players on both sides of the conflict, and the change they’re both fighting for. 

But it could also introduce another enigma: what can we do to make a difference? This question is in no way isolated from the other. They’re both political in nature, they both have political implications. If we go this route, we have to take into consideration the characters with lines on this scene: Varys, Tyrion, Sansa and Missandei. Given that they all survived the Battle of Winterfell, is only logical to think that they will have a role to play in the political aspect of the conflict in the second half of the season. So, what can these characters do to make a difference? That’s a question we’ve got no answer for (right now). Maybe 8x04 will gives us a promise of an answer or a partial answer. But one thing is clear: now that the Long Night is over, it’s time to play the Game of Thrones again.

[castaliareed]

All Roads Lead to the same Castle: Pt: 3, Betrayals and Treasons

My meandering reactions to s.7 and predictions for s.8/endgame continue. Originally I was only going to write 3 parts to this series. There are going to be at least 2 more. :-) You can read the first parts here --> Pt. 1, Pt. 2

In these different parts, some of my theories and predictions may be in conflict with one and other. Eventually, I will try to clean it all up. These thoughts are evolving over time. Here I get into more detail about Dany’s 3 treasons. 

Before we start, I’ve been seeing a lot of ink spilled or should I say words typed about the Undercover Lover (UCL) Jon theory. I  pretty much put forward a version of the theory even before season 7 started. Read my thoughts here on the Trust Issues that Sansa-Jon-Dany may/will have. 

To me, UCL!Jon is the same as political!Jon or sacrificial!Jon. The only difference is the coordination. And we do know from the actor himself that Jon is manipulating (in a kind way) someone in s.7.

In my earlier posts in this series, I talked about how the show was unclear about when Arya and Sansa began to move against Littlefinger. In the script, it was very late in the game. In the show, it could’ve happened minutes after Arya returned to Winterfell or hours before they killed Littlefinger. Most likely we’ll never have a clear answer on this.

The same could very well happen between Jon and Daenerys. Assuming Jon moves against her at some point in s.8. Which he may not do at all...who knows everyone could get together and fight the undead happily united for 5 episodes...and then go kill Cersei in the finale…Or it could be Dany that strikes first and moves against Jon perceiving a betrayal is on its way. But this post isn’t about those theories.

book!Dany, as we know, is paranoid about betrayals and treasons. She is haunted by the prophecy told to her in the House of the Undying that she will know three treasons, “once for blood, once for gold and once for love". show!Dany was also a bit hung up on betrayals in s.7. She threatened Varys and questioned Tyrion’s loyalty.

Dany believes the first and second treasons have happened. The first being Mirri Maz Duur. Who betrayed her by using blood magic to return Khal Drogo but only to a catatonic state. 

The second treason being either Jorah Mormont or Brown Ben Plumm. The knight sold her secrets to the crown in exchange for exoneration for his past crimes. And Brown Ben Plumm switched sides in Mereen to fight with the Yunkai against Dany.

Aside from Brown Ben’s treason, Mirri and Jorah’s happened before the prophecy in the House of the Undying.

What if Dany’s betrayals have not happened, yet? (Or are in the process of happening in the show…) It is very possible Dany’s treasons are tied to her endgame. 

For blood: In the last post, I put forward the idea that Tyrion could already be betraying her by plotting with Cersei. (I mean really he believes Cersei will stop fighting...come on…). Or he may eventually get fed up with Dany and her burning ways. This could happen if Jaime shows up at Winterfell pledging for the North. Tyrion does love his brother and I don’t believe he will hurt him. book!Jaime has made a pledge never to fight against House Stark or Tully. If the North regrets Dany’s rule then Tyrion could be again torn between his brother and Dany. This time he may choose differently. Tyrion loves being a Lannister. And remember ‘A Lannister always pays his debts.’

If ‘for blood’ is not about family but blood magic. Then Varys could be the betrayer. Blood magic was used on him as a child and there are theories that he is a Blackfyre, a line of Targaryen bastards. He may decide to leave Dany to her own demise. (This is more likely in the books with the fAegon story happening.)

For gold: This treason is going to be different in the books and the show. Aegon aka Young Griff aka fAegon could be her treason for gold. He is being sent to meet her and instead hires the Golden Company to start invading Westeros. Essentially betraying Dany without her even knowing it. In the show, this parallels Cersei’s lie to Dany and Jon that she would agree to a cease-fire and help them in the Great War. Instead, unknown to Dany, she has hired the Golden Company to come to Westeros and fight. Remember Dany also burned lots of food and tried to burn the gold being sent from Highgarden to King’s Landing. 

The above being said, it is still also likely that someone is going to get paid in gold to commit an act of treason against Dany. Bronn perhaps? TINFOIL ALERT: Tyrion pays Bronn to try and off Dany or one of her dragons. <--that’s a good one. ;-)

For love: The third treason, a treason for love, has definitely not happened anywhere in show or book yet. It will be Jon. Should I repeat this for the folks in the back? It will be Jon.

A treason for love is just that. The person you are with or think you are with falls in love, sleeps with, etc. etc. someone else. Treasons for love are common themes in folklore and stories. It would be just like GRRM to play with this theme.

One quote I unearthed on the subject as a trope stated, “A woman’s sacrifice of family, country, position, and reputation for the sake of love, and the abandonment by the man for which she has given up everything she holds dear”. Except in our story, Dany is not the one giving up family, country, position, and reputation. That is Jon. Dany for her part has had to put her ambition on hold. She retains her position, her reputation. Jon is in the vulnerable position at least we as the audience perceive him to be.

There is a meta by @sneakystarks that recently put forward the idea that the Sansa-Jon-Dany triangle will reenact Sansa-Littlefinger-Lysa triangle. Read it here. 

This is a great theory. Jon is acting much as Littlefinger did. Appearing to be in the weaker position but ultimately manipulating the person (Lysa/Dany) in power. When that person threatens the true object of their desire (Sansa). Well, that’s it, the person is toast. This theory could explain why we have been show!Jon’s violent reactions to men/people who he sees as dangerous to Sansa. Perhaps the most violent reaction is yet to come? It could come when Jon no longer has anything to lose.

Jon has given up his kingdom and Dany will still abandon the Great War when the other treasons (Cersei’s and Tyrion’s or Varys’) come to light. Jon after learning his parentage will have lost everything (family, country, position, reputation). What will Sansa do? She will be there at Winterfell. She will be there when Jon needs her. And at this point, their love romantic or familial will be realized in some form. Whether it comes about because she comforts him when he is low, because there will be a political need to prevent the North from outright crowning her Queen and bringing dragon fire down upon themselves, or because Dany directly threatens Sansa, we can’t say. I believe at some point, Dany will threaten Sansa, the Starks, and/or the North. Jon will have to choose and he will always choose his Stark family.

A treason for love means someone Dany is in love with has to be in love and/or act on their love for someone else. There are no two ways around this. In our story, as it is now the only person Dany loves is Jon. The only other woman that Jon has a close relationship with is Sansa.

In the end, show watchers will be shocked by this. Book readers will look back and talk about how they saw it coming all along. 

[rhegar]

Show!Rhaegar: You’re Not Really Meant to Look That Deeply into Him.

Or, How Game of Thrones Bastardized Rhaegar to Unbastardize Jon. 

So, now that I can finally access the internet from my computer for an unlimited amount of time, I wanted to write down what you’re meant to make of show!Rhaegar, why he annulled his marriage to Elia (even though that shouldn’t even be possible) and how close he is to being book!Rhaegar. And while we’re at it, let me tell you all the reasons why book!Rhaegar would never do such a thing (even if he could.)

I have definitely gotten a lot of inspiration and ideas from @lyannas and @oadara especially about annulment and the complications of Jon being and then not being a bastard, and gotten a lot of useful info from A Wiki of Ice and Fire.  So huge thanks <3 The article contains mentions of rape and dubious consent. 

To begin this, we need to take a look back on what the show has made of Rhaegar so far, and the differences between the show and the book depictions. 

1. In season one, Robert mentions Rhaegar’s kidnapping of Lyanna, but not in detail, just that Rhaegar did something bad to Lyanna. At the end of the season, in episode 10, Bran mentions specifically that Rhaegar kidnapped Lyanna and that Robert started a war for that and killed him, but Lyanna died. Somewhere in the middle of the season, Jorah mentions that Rhaegar was the last dragon while “Viserys is less than the shadow of a snake” painting Rhaegar, for the first time on the show, in a positive light. 

Now, one thing in season one that interested me that nobody else ever notices (or if they do notice, they never talk about it) is when Jon was having a talk with Aemon. I always watched this conversation carefully as it is the first time that Jon communicated with a Targaryen and heard him speak of the family. One odd thing that Aemon said that I noticed is, (as well as I can remember) “But when I heard how they murdered my brother’s son, and his poor son, and the children... even the little children,” and then Aemon later clarifies the line of the latest Targaryen kings on the show, saying that his father was Maekar, and then Aemon’s brother Aegon V (Egg) ruled after him, and then came his son Aerys. This is unlike the books where Aerys is actually the son of Jaehaerys II, not Aegon V, so there’s a king in between that the show skipped. 

Back to the first quote now. When Aemon said “They killed my brother’s son,” he was talking about Aerys. “And his poor son,” that’s Rhaegar. Why would Aegon talk about Rhaegar especially that way? Was there some type of connection between them? Why would Aemon sympathize with Rhaegar especially? In the books, we know that Aemon exchanged letters with Rhaegar, but on the show, Aemon is now dead and we never knew (unless there’s going to be a flashback or if someone is going to find Rhaegar’s letters in Aemon’s records at Castle Black, but I don’t personally think the show gives so much regards to continuity or that Castle Black is going to exist for very long at all.)

2. In season 3, Barristan gives Dany a talk about Rhaegar and how he fought at the battle of the trident and how his men died for him because they believed in him and loved him. Again, Rhaegar is painted in a positive light, as a charismatic and well-loved leader who inspired loyalty. 

3. In season 4, the very first episode. Oberyn finally appears to give us the perspective of Elia’s family on Rhaegar’s deeds. Oberyn calls Rhaegar “beautiful and noble” sarcastically and says that he left Elia for another woman after Elia had been nothing but good and kind to him and his children. He also went as far as to say that Elia loved Rhaegar. What kind of love did he mean? Did she truly love Rhaegar or was she “fond” of him? We can’t tell. 

4. In season 5, the writers seemed to be in a hurry to catch up with reminding us who Rhaegar is, by inserting talks about him twice in one episode, for pretty long conversations. That is, of course, episode 4, in which Littlefinger tells Sansa the story of the tourney of Harrenhal as we all know it, quite objectively, and then asks, “How many men had to die because Rhaegar chose your aunt?” and Sansa replies, “Yes, he chose her, and then he kidnapped her and raped her.” The second time he is mentioned in that episode shows how much contrast there is between the two ways people see Rhaegar, when Barristan again paints him in a positive light by telling Dany that he liked to walk among the people, sing to them, give money to orphans and poor singers, and that he never liked killing, but loved singing. 

5. And of course, in season six, came the (bastardized) conversation between Ned and the three (now two) Kingsguard at the ToJ, most importantly Arthur. Ned reminds them of Rhaegar’s defeat and asks them why they weren’t there to protect him, and Arthur replies that Rhaegar wanted them at the ToJ. And at the end of the season, Bran presses play and we resume watching this scene, leading up to the big R+L=J reveal. 

6. In season seven, we are told that he (somehow????) convinced the High Septon at the time to annul his (four-year, consummated) marriage to Elia and married him to Lyanna (or to “someone else” as Gilly puts it, but we all know it’s Lyanna) in a secret ceremony in Dorne. 

So, what has the show missed?

1. In all of this, there isn’t a peep about the prophecy, when in the books we are told three times that Rhaegar cared about it and it motivated his actions a great deal: a. At the House of the Undying b. When we’re told that he found a scroll that changed his life and made him feel that he “must become a warrior” and c. When Maester Aemon discusses his communications with Rhaegar concerning the prophecy with Sam. So, as much as the show is concerned, Rhaegar never even heard the word prophecy, and would think The Prince that Was Promised was the name of a rock band if he heard of him. 

So, the part of Rhaegar’s character that escaped with Lyanna because they must have a child together who is ice + fire (and I plan on exploring why this had to be the case, why Lyanna specifically when he could have had a third child on any milkmaid or handmaiden on Dragonstone with no political consequences) basically doesn’t exist on the show. Show!Rhaegar was NOT motivated by the prophecy (and I know one could argue that he is but we just haven’t heard that yet, but I personally find it weird that we haven’t heard about this whatsoever in seven seasons, when we could have seen the scene at the HotU or at least been told by Aemon or even Barristan).

2. Rhaegar as a melancholic (potentially clinically depressed) person and an intellectual scholar is not mentioned. Again, in the books, those are important aspects of Rhaegar’s personality that also seemed to motivate his actions and affect his way of thinking. 

3. Rhaegar as a politician is not mentioned. We don’t hear anything about the rift between him and his father, his plans to establish a regency/overthrow Aerys, his possible involvement in organizing the tourney of Harrenhal, and the fact that he held his own court at Dragonstone and had his own backing. Show!Rhaegar doesn’t seem to have politics in mind much either.

So, what does the show tell us about Rhaegar?

That Rhaegar never once thought of himself as a prophetic figure/a father to one. That he was a man who liked the smallfolk and mingling with them. That Rhaegar was charismatic, well-loved, the last dragon, and seemed like a sympathetic figure to someone as smart as Maester Aemon. And finally, that he ran away with Lyanna Stark and annulled his marriage for her, and at this point, only one reason for that is left by process of elimination: Love. 

So, basically what the show did, is try to simplify Rhaegar into someone that the viewer doesn’t need to look too deeply into. He was a spirited singer who didn’t care about politics but loved the people (who here wants to bet that show!Rhaegar also called all the nobles fake, made fun of fat noblewomen and made a lot of dick jokes?) and he was married to Elia for political reasons/because he needed to marry someone, but along came Lyanna Stark, he fell in love, and set aside everything (including his own family) to marry her, not even caring about all the political repercussions because, hey, he’s spirited! And all the nobles are fake! Who cares about politics, kids? Of course he later paid with his life and the lives of his entire family, but who cares, still got laid.

It’s basically the same thing that the show did with Jaime. Take a complex character that has a core struggle and a life mission, simplify it into a one-dimensional character that doesn’t really require any effort to understand or depict. The writers of the show know that they don’t have nearly as much talent or IQ as it takes to depict either of them with their full complexity and depth in the books, so they simplified things up for themselves and for the members of the audience that don’t really want to look too deeply into things either. 

Now, if we look completely away from Rhaegar... why would the showmakers do this whole annulment nonsense, you say? Why did they waste screentime on it and energy writing it? Because Jon Snow is their favorite, and bastardy is such a bad thing (not just an invented and bigoted Westerosi social stigma) that, on his nameday, they decided to take it away and give him legal rights to a kingdom that he never wanted, fought for or thought of having. Even though bastardy wouldn’t have affected his ability to be a hero, and even though we already have a legal claimant with an army and three dragons, who’s struggled and fought plenty for that kingdom, there’s a small problem: She’s a woman, and she’s not everyone’s favorite like Jon Snow is. Must keep the ratings up, guys. 

Now, as to all the reasons why book!Rhaegar would never annul his marriage to Elia (even if it were possible, which it isn’t, because their marriage was beyond a shadow of doubt consensual and consummated, and Rhaegar needs to be a king to set her aside and take another wife, which he wasn’t yet. Source) (UPDATE: Linda Antonsson, a writer who has collabed with GRRM on A World of Ice and Fire and is very familiar with ASOIAF content, has said on twitter in criticism for the episode that the idea of an annulment is bizarre and that it would be very difficult for Rhaegar to obtain one and the fact that those “records” exist in the citadel is very odd. I also asked her if she knows for sure that an annulment would make Rhaenys and Aegon bastards, and she said there’s no definite answer but it’s likely that yes. Her twitter)

1. Let’s assume that Rhaegar absolutely held no value for Elia whatsoever and had no problem giving her the ultimate humiliation of annulment. Elia is a princess of Dorne, and Dorne has only ever joined the fold of Westeros by marriage. No Targaryen king was able to defeat Dorne and forcibly make it kneel to him. If Elia is returned to Dorne with such an insult as setting her aside, this threatens that Dorne might disassociate itself from the rest of Westeros again, taking away a huge asset from Rhaegar (the Dornish were his biggest allies against his father.)

2. For reasons mentioned here by Lyannas, it’s most likely that this annulment would result in Rhaenys and Aegon to become bastards. Not only would Rhaegar not do that to his children who are also important prophetic figures to him (two heads of the dragon) but also it threatens civil war in the future. If Dorne decides to not only remove itself from Rhaegar’s backing but also align themselves behind Aegon against Lyanna’s (”legitimate”) children in the case that Rhaegar does become the king and the line of succession continues normally, a civil war similar to the Blackfyre Rebellion could break and the future of House Targaryen will be majorly threatened. Who has time for that when you’re trying to stop a zombie apocalypse? 

Book!Rhaegar may have been a lot of things, but he wasn’t that big an idiot as to jeopardize his future on the throne and the future of his children like this. But of course, show!Rhaegar who was practically an idiot had no problem with all that.

I want to conclude by saying that we have been looking at show!Rhaegar the wrong way. We’ve all had book!Rhaegar in mind while thinking about show!Rhaegar, but the truth is, they’re two completely different people. And while book!Rhaegar is smart and sensible enough to know that he couldn’t and shouldn’t annul his marriage to Elia, show!Rhaegar, who is merely a wasteful bastardization of everything that Rhaegar is, totally would. He’s a miracle man who was able to obtain an annulment from a marriage as steady as rocks because he’s THE Rhaegar Targaryen. And while thousands of metas and rereadings have been done to understand the dilemma of book!Rhaegar, show!Rhaegar only needs you to clear your mind of book!Rhaegar, forget about any depth or intellect or savior complex, watch the show, and enjoy his jackassery. 

Oh, poor George...