#phoenix's savior complex

[aceof-stars]

Phoenix believes in people but he doesn't trust them, oh my god you're so right. I think it's more so that he believes in the ideal, rather than the person themselves, at least as time goes on or for people he doesn't know well. The ideal of being an attorney, the ideal that people need to be saved.

I think what I love the most about AA is that characters have a duality to them that I don't see often in media. They have actual flaws and do actual bad things, and it's not glossed over. Phoenix is a fundamentally good person, he helps people at the drop of a hat, risks his life for them. Has a penchant for taking strays under his wing. He believes in people... but also not really. He carries a literal lie detector with him at all times, and only employs people who can also peer into other people's hearts. So is he really that trusting? Sure he trusts his clients are innocent, but he doesn't trust they will tell him the truth at all (there's always something to lie about). He believes himself naive, and that's why he works extra hard not to be. Some people think he changed with his disbarment but I feel like when he actually changed was after Dahlia. He became less and less trusting as time went on. And Phoenix actually does forge evidence and risks his subordinate's career, and he says pretty nasty things sometimes (that one time to Edgeworth had got to hurt, badly, especially if you consider that the note could have been genuine at first, which we don't know for sure), has a pretty tactless and somewhat hurtful sense of humor, brings his daughter to cheat at poker, and doesn't tell said daughter she actually has some family left alive. He's secretive, elusive and cryptic, and masks it under a false pretence of goofiness. Miles is, by contrast, very easy to read. He may appear emotionally stunted but is one of the more emphathetic characters. He realizes when he's wrong and immediately needs to correct those wrongs. He grows uneasy and uncertain and eventually recognizes when he's mistaken. By the end of it he begins to help people naturally, without even thinking about it as much as he would have in the past. He helps so many people, he has basically got Phoenix's savior complex 2.0 but the healthy kind where he doesn't jump off a bridge. But... he was also actually cruel, and did send innocent people to their graves (was he really so naive to believe whichever defendant came his way was guilty?). He feigned his death disregarding other people's feelings, and while you could say he had no obligation towards Phoenix (apart from basic decency and respect towards someone who had turned his life around to save him), he still abandoned Franziska, who was still just a kid and had just discovered her father was a psychopath. She probably thought, at some point, that the apple didn't fall that far from the tree. That's it's somehow her fault as well. He may be rude and antagonistic, frank to a fault. Isn't afraid of telling stuff to your face. But he also cares about the people he loves so much, to the point he doesn't hesitate to risk his career and break the law multiple times. He may appear a pessimist but he's pretty idealistic at heart, it's quite funny that his favourite show is about an hero of justice, isn't it? Godot is... well, we don't know much about it from before his coma, but he definitely shared Mia's sentiments for helping people in their hour of need. But when he wakes from a 6-year coma he's so broken that he just pins the blame on the most absurd person to blame it on, settles on a complicated plan, and also prosecutes on that particular murder he should just confess upon. Iris was sweet, innocent, self-sacrificing. She knew absolutely nothing about the world apart from what Bikini or her sister told her. She was naive and falsely thought she could fix everything, that her sister was salvageable, that she could save Phoenix. But she still ended up lying to the person she loved and abetting a murder. That's why I love these characters so much. They're interesting and their stories make sense. People don't remain unchanged from what happens to them. People are multi-faceted and complex. You can't sum them up in a bunch of characteristics and aspect them to act on every single one of them, always, consistently. Sometimes people break. They make mistakes they regret, ...and some they don't.

[mikqchoux]

Mentally Imbalanced

[coffee-scrub]

Got hit with the narumitsu royal AU truck… 30 injured 7 confirmed dead

Based on/actually just set in @maym0rin’s royal AU artworks. Check out their posts for the deeper lore and gorgeous art!!! This is kinda a spin off/continuation of what they have so far.

[aceof-stars]

I'm so tired of hearing that Phoenix saved Miles without hearing about any of its implications.

Because Phoenix's savior complex is a major problem not a solution. Because Wrightworth is not about Phoenix saving Miles, it's about them saving each other. Because in Farewell My Turnabout, Miles Edgeworth said "We aren't some sort of heroes. We're only human." and he was right.

[wildfey]

Actually I do find the contrast between Phoenix Larry and Edgeworth very funny when it comes to the class trial.

Phoenix considers it the defining moment of his childhood, and takes from it the feeling of being alone and needing support and to be defended (it also is massively influential when it comes to his relationship with Edgeworth).

Larry does remember and feels a bit guilty about it (enough to eventually confess) but also... he's done worse. And hey, in his mind at least he made up for it

Edgeworth... barely remembers. He needs reminding. It's not important to him. You could say that with everything else that's happened in his life that this is a footnote. You could also point out that this kid wore a bow tie to school and spent his whole life talking about how much he loves his lawyer dad. This is not the only time he got his money stolen I think.

[shikisei]

im doing a lot better now!

[coolerfox]

thinking about this moment again….they make me ill

[chstart]

i've wound up mentioning it in a couple of convos n posts already but thinkin abt how phoenix's whole "full acquittal or nothing" overachiever way of practice even just in theory has a short life expectancy & can bite him in the ass real easily, & how both engarde's & atishon's cases are perfect examples of this, with phoenix's reputation being that of not only not losing any cases but also getting perfect acquittals every time (in jfa's case he hadn't lost once since his court debut two years ago & had only been getting full acquittals, & in dd's case he had a singular loss with engarde personally begging to be declared guilty & an unresolved trial with gramarye disappearing before a verdict could be handed, forged evidence or no). not only does the all or nothing mentality risk clouding judgement mid-case, it literally endangers him & those around him because his reputation of getting perfect acquittals even in cases where all the evidence seems to point at the defendant makes him a good target for blackmail. he always gets the verdict he's demanding. & esp after the whole gramarye thing taints the world's view of phoenix, why wouldn't some people who are fully aware they're guilty of wrongdoing still seek out phoenix wright?? after all, who's to say all those wins were legitimate?? prosecutors aren't the only capable of perjury & tampering with evidence.

[painand-more-pain]

THE LAST SENTENCE???? HELLO???

so we know that Phoenix Wright is an insane guy that swallowed glass and survived falling from a burning bridge AND almost got murdered. we know that he's an insane guy that goes through insane lengths to not just to defend but be a savior to people he doesn't even know well or those that don't even share the same kind of care to him. we know he goes through a lot of bullshit in court and we've seen how stressful it can be for him in legal battles, but do we ever consider what it must've been like to come home after an unbearable day of trying to win a case whilst having the weight of realizing you're pulling at strings to save someone's life? many of which have complicated ties to the dead and involve so much more than just saving a client from a guilty plea? how the guy he literally switched the course of his life and became an attorney for doesn't want a thing to do with him, yet still swears he see the slightest bit of good in him and fights against the deadliest prosecutor to save him and prove to him that he was never guilty for the death he's blamed himself for all his life? how no matter how many times Maya gets herself in trouble he instinctively literally and metaphorically crosses burning bridges to make sure she's safe? or the little things like how he had Pearl channel Mia so she didn't watch her mom get convicted? how despite everything Phoenix seeks the droplet of good in someone and does anything he can to help them and even prove that good is there? or how despite the lack of immense money and gratitude he TRULY deserves he still pushes himself to not just save but change the minds and lives of his clients? have we considered the fact that Phoenix Wright is literally a symbol for Jesus Christ???

[velvees-archive]

art cr: @cokiicookies on twitter

Tags: Love Confessions, Bratfeen, Art Student Feenie, Law Student Bratworth, Ace Attorney-typical cringefail, Canon Divergence

and many others!

HEAVILY inspired by @cokiicookies's bratfeen art on twitter! check out the full comic there!!!

"Hey...so...uh..." Phoenix coughs out, voice scratchy from his most recent line repetitions. It's a small mistake, not unsalvageable. All he has to do is stick to the script. Stick to the script. Stick... His eyes flick down to his note cards. He swears he’d printed them in his best penmanship, atop one of the library's extra premium desks, but everything is spinning and he feels faintly like he's going to throw up. "Did you uh," he starts, letters swirling in his eyes. "Did...you fall out of heaven...?" Genius prosecutor-in-training Miles Edgeworth regards him with a blank stare. Phoenix thinks now would be an opportune time for him to locate the nearest possible bridge and promptly jump off of it. - The joys and woes (mostly woes) of being in love, as told by BratFeen.

so i caved and wrote narumitsu. another huge thank you to @cokiicookies on twitter for allowing me to write an accompanying fic for their work. i attached some of the comic here in an attempt to entice you to look at their comic (well? are you enticed?!), but if you wanna see the full thing, please do give their art a like, a retweet, a comment, and all the love on twitter! fic screenshots below:

misc commentary/musings under the cut :)

the way i wrote feenie inner monologue and narration parallels my informal writing style, so writing his freak outs weren't challenging. consciously changing sentence structures/verbiage to be more or less extra, on the other hand, totally was.

the bulk of my pain came from writing fluff in the first place, stumbling through dialogue exchanges (as always), and attempting larry dialogue...all of which i honestly think i failed at pretty badly HAHA. who cares tho? it's my work!

bratfeen is one of my favorite narumitsu "eras" if you will. i've always wanted to write them. i didn't know the opportunity would come so soon (and at my expense considering i still have a zine fic to finalize for a diff fandom), but i took the shot. the full fic was written over the course of a day which i do not recommend anyone experience. i was on a writing hiatus for months and wrote 8k words as soon as i came back. do you see why i burnt out in the first place?

the easiest part about writing bratfeen is that none of the things i write are exaggerated for the purpose of carrying the plot forward. feenie believing that bratworth is better of a human being than everyone makes him out to be? sounds about right. feenie insisting to others that miles is the best thing since grilled cheese? his raging savior complex says that's likely to occur. feenie fumbling the bag because he thinks miles is the prettiest thing he's ever seen? yeah, 20 y/o feenie would! feenie shoving the asshole who talked shit abt miles? we saw the exact same thing with doug swallow (and we all know how that ended...). all of it is in line w his character. also miles being a try hard. that's a given.

i am hoping i can showcase more of my technical skill aka the angst writer in me with my next work, though i've been closely following fictober (haven't been publishing because, again, zine fic obligations) and have plenty of angsty fics stored in my drafts. i hope you enjoy my poor attempt at humor and fluff. may i muster the strength to finish the rest of my zine fic...please...

[aceof-stars]

What I really want is a case where Phoenix's client is truly guilty of the crime they’re being accused of and there isn’t anyone blackmailing him to get an acquittal.

Farewell My Turnabout is the only case where a guilty verdict is the good ending and the only case that challenged Phoenix’s entire worldview. (Correct me if I'm wrong though because I haven't played the Apollo Justice trilogy). I wouldn't change anything about that case but I still think another case could have been taken further. Because 2-4, at the end of the day, is still about saving someone; it's about the value of trust and partnership in fighting for the truth because that is what will save someone.

But I want a case where there really isn’t anyone who can be or needs to be saved. Phoenix’s client is guilty, and there are no kidnapped loved ones or anyone forcing him to get a verdict either way. Even better if the defendant is a sympathetic killer like Acro. And there is no huge impossible decision/moral dilemma about who to save, it’s just realizing that doing the right thing means accepting a loss.

I always found it ironic that Edgeworth taking a loss in the name of truth is seen as an important sign of his redemption, but Phoenix almost never does the same thing. I know Phoenix gets to choose his cases and Miles doesn't but it just seems kind of hypocritical to me.

And I still want the case to have a happy ending because Phoenix still helped his client by giving them a proper defense. I don’t want Phoenix to come out of this demoralized. I just really need a case to finally hammer home to Phoenix that he should not be hinging his entire worth and motivation for being a defense attorney on if he can save people (because clearly 2-4 did not do that).

[orokana-bara]

okay I’m sorry I have to do this in a reblog bc I have screenshots I want to share

yeah I agree that he specifically chose defense lawyer for miles, and he wanted to be a lawyer bc of miles and larry, but he didn’t pursue law FOR them. like, they definitely inspired that decision, and he definitely became a defense attorney for miles, but becoming a lawyer per se was something that Phoenix did for himself.

Like, in his childhood, Phoenix had his own idol that was separate from Miles and Gregory.

Phoenix’s dream of becoming a lawyer didn’t revolve around his relationship with Miles- there was also 1) a specific way he as an individual wanted to live and 2) a way he wanted to be perceived by others (ie. like Judge Wackner, his own personal hero apparently).

If the only reason Phoenix wanted to be a lawyer was to get into contact with Miles, I don’t think he would specifically dream about working in court.

Phoenix wanting to be like a person in a television show also ties into the fact that he studied drama in college. He was approaching his childhood dream from the practical standpoint of actually being a lawyer and a more meta standpoint of being an actor on a television show (though i think the people’s court wasn’t scripted).

The decisions Phoenix has made in terms of education and career were legitimately pursuing his own interests. He does make like, giant decisions based on other people, but I don’t think he’s going so far as living for the sake of others.

i was ranting for like five minutes about how weird it was that ultimately phoenix's obsession with edgeworth was treated like a good thing because he was right about him in the end considering that it did cost wright nearly planning his whole life around getting the chance to meet that man again and my brother very quietly, shyly even, interrupted me with a "i think it's pretty obvious that they're boyfriends."

[cherryzlem]

Little personal analysis of Phoenix Wright's obsessive character (+savior complex as a treat):

HOW DO PEOPLE NOT REALISE HOW FUCKED UP IN THE HEAD PHOENIX WRIGHT IS ??? His relationship with Dahlia is such a good exemple of it and yet people act as if Dahlia is the only crazy one. SHE'S NOT !! Phoenix is obsessive when he's in love, it shows with Dahlia. He believes her to be so innocent and just thinks she's pure and fragile, and people don't find it weird that he finds this attractive ??? HE STARTED DATING HER FROM DAY ONE FFS !? He just instantly obsesses over Dahlia it's crazy, and wanna know the worst part ? He does the same with Miles.

Get this, Phoenix knew him for less than a year and decided to forge his entire legal career for him. I know on surface level it might seem cute and haha gay but that's so fucking weird ?! The moment he lost Dahlia he instantly changed directions, aiming to reunite with his chilhood friend because he thought he could save him from being sad (a thing he assumed just from a journal on top of that). Phoenix had planned day 1 to be Miles's savior and he stuck with it.

It feels so weird to deeply analyse Phoenix like that because I love him, he's our beloved main character, he's funny and I love reading fluffy narumitsu fics but god he is so terribly fucked up it gets scary if you think about his savior complex too hard 😭

[hyperfixatinator]

Hey, do you guys ever think about the "Not Guilty" option at the end of the Engarde trial? Shelly De Killer released Maya from her kidnapping. Phoenix's hands are no longer tied. He could've said "Guilty" and sent Matt Engarde to prison where he would await the death penalty.

Instead, though, he continues fighting to get his client acquitted. Only this time, it's not an act of mercy. It's an act of revenge.

Phoenix knows De Killer has made Engarde his next target. He knows Engarde would face a worse fate should he be sent free. Phoenix isn't being a savior here. He's throwing Engarde out to the wolves. He was about to pull Engarde out of the frying pan to shove him directly into the fire for what he did to Maya.

It's one of those brief glimpses into Phoenix's humanity that's both unsettling and sobering. His savior complex and heroic reputation make it easy to forget just how far he'll go when the right lines get crossed.

[tudirkulosis]

i dont think the aa fandom talks enough abt phoenix's massive fucking savior complex in like all of the pwaa trilogy. esp as nrmts like yeah its easy to say "oo he's just super gay 4 edgey-poo" and like okay yeah. duh. not gonna sit here and deny that but at the same time i think thats super surface level?? like so much of phoenix's dialogue ESPECIALLY in aa1 regarding edgeworth is that he's like the ONLY person who can save edgeworth and he KNOWS that he can, almost to a... dare i say it... egotistical degree...? like he just kinda assumes he'll succeed in saving him? (it's been a minute since i played aa1 so i forget if this was textual or subtextual) but yeah idk. and then when u think abt the fact he was still in a relationship with dahlia/iris as he's studying law for edgeworth i think the whole "i can fix him" thing becomes even more apparent? i do not think phoenix wright knew he loved miles edgeworth. hell idek if he did. gay or not i think a lot of phoenix's motivation comes from a very paradoxically self-centered idea that it his his duty, his divine purpose to Help People to the degree that he bases his whole life on this one Dude He Needs To Help. idk if this makes sense who cares its midnight and i have mono i get an excuse to post nonsense

[periwinkla]

Phoenix - Godot parallels

I've been replaying T&T and I gotta say, the parallels between Phoenix and Godot are uncanny. The most glaring resemblance is that they're both so presumptuously convinced that they are the only ones who can and should have the responsability of saving the people they love. Note also that their Japanese names, interestingly, both reference dragons - Ryuuchi and Souryuu respectively - but they do so in reverse : the first kanji for Phoenix and the last for Godot. Godot wakes up after 5 years and learns that the love of his life was killed. He couldn't do anything about it because he was poisoned and thus out of commission. Then he learns that said love of his life had taken on a protégé, and he also learns that the lovesick idiot willingly swalled the same poison that put him into a coma, and was swimmingly fine. He is so pissed at the guy. Also envious. Phoenix was there. Why couldn't he be there instead? Why did the poison put him into a coma, and not that stupid lovesick fool? He twistedly but most furiously hates the guy. Thus he crawls back from the deepest depths of hell. But he knows, deep down, that the one he really hates is himself (not that he could have done anything about it, even if he had not been in a coma - but feelings are hardly logical) Something Phoenix and Godot share is that twisted savior complex. Godot thinks he should have been the one to save Mia, Phoenix becomes a defense attorney because he thinks he is the only one who can save Miles, the only one who understands him (and then it's a slippery slope to wanting to save everyone ever, but that's beside the point). Both are quite presumptuous in these assertions. But Phoenix was able to save Miles (in a way he hadn't expected) - Godot couldn't save Mia. If Phoenix hadn't been able to save him, would he have ended up the same as Godot did? Remember, if he hadn't won that trial, Miles would have faced the death penalty. So, if the poison had worked and he was out of commission for 5 years, he would have been too late. If you think about it, we had a glimpse of what Phoenix would have been like. When he thought Miles was dead, he snapped at Maya and told her not to speak his name in front of him ever again. He was also quite depressed for those months and refused to take on cases at first, cases of possibly innocent people who needed him. And when Miles came back, he snapped at Miles too. Which leads me to my last point: Both Godot and Phoenix resort to anger as soon as they're hurt as their form of dealing with grief. They are so similar. One was just less lucky that the other. Also by this logic you could say that miego is basically narumitsu with a bad ending, which makes me cry so hard darnit edit: it's also fun to note that they both went crazy over someone they knew for less than a year. People call Phoenix ridiculous but Godot is basically the same kind of ridiculous