#until dawn MatPat

[an-architect-of-words]

Why the “Josh was misdiagnosed” theory is very likely incorrect. (Reworded)

Yeah, I know I did a post on this, but I liked my articulation of it better on Reddit, so I’m reposting.

Josh being misdiagnosed has been one of the most popular fan-canons since 2015, but way more indicates that the schizophrenic behavior was caused by Phenelzine withdrawal.

I think the misdiagnosis theory is popular because it’s so tragic and unfair (not that Josh’s story isn’t tragic already). It also allows us to feel more sympathy for Josh while placing some blame on outside characters (the failure of five doctors!)… But the misdiagnosis theory doesn’t have nearly as much supporting it as the withdrawal theory does. All the details we get are telling us that Josh has been depressed since childhood, but developed the schizophrenic symptoms much more recently.

Breakdown

The last drug Josh was on was Phenelzine. The story indicates, from Hill’s text messages (and from a line Chris says about Josh being off his meds) that Josh suddenly stopped taking this medication. Here are some relevant details:

1. BAD HISTORY WITH TAPERING— Josh has a bad history with drug tapering: (Referred on 11/29/2013 after patient's response to drugs tapered badly). The report also mentions that electroconvulsive therapy (ECT) was considered due to Josh’s history with tapering.

2. POSITIVE FINAL CONSULTATION— The end of Josh’s report shows that the Phenelzine worked. Josh said that he was doing better, and Hill decided Josh could be discharged. I think this detail is important because— unless Josh was lying— it indicates that the Phenelzine was affective for the condition he had. But it ALSO gives us a reason for Josh to have stopped taking his meds.

The report lists the Phenelzine‘s withdrawal symptoms.

Nightmares

Hallucinations

Catatonia

Shocks

Agitation

Aggression

Slurred speech

Ataxia

Paranoia

Insomnia

Many of these side effects are linked. Hallucinations and catatonia can go hand-in-hand, for example. The scene when Josh is dazed in front of Mike and Sam has some elements of both schizophrenia and catatonia in it. Slurred speech and ataxia are both on here, and Josh definitely shows odd, erratic, and slurred speech patterns. (I think ataxia is more about coordination? But it can affect speech). To be honest, you can point out moments in-game that are symptomatic of most of these.

Finally, we get dialogue that suggests that Josh’s really schizophrenic behavior is new. For example, Mike asks Chris if he’s ever seen Josh behave this way. Chris says he never has. Because Chris and Josh have known each other for around ten years, this question and answer stands out.

Conclusion (TL;DR)

I can’t speak to the accuracy of all the medical stuff in here; that’s a different can of worms. I am just saying the writers did all the following— A) gave a list of drug withdrawal symptoms, B) told us that Josh might have stopped taking his meds, C) made sure to show Josh exhibiting the withdrawal symptoms they already mentioned, D) explained that some of this behavior feels new. Conversely, there’s not much included to show that he was misdiagnosed. We have one doctor disagreeing with Josh on treatment. But we don’t have the same story-in-the-details that we do for the withdrawal theory.

Hill medicated correctly, for what Josh had at the time: depression. The schizophrenic-like behavior only started after the depression meds weren’t tapered correctly.

[captainthomasrobbie]

Important:

Main channel (Films) - Robin Sweets Studios

Gaming channel (Game) - Ryan's Gothic Attic

Masterlist of my fics;

Mafia/YouTubers (8-bitRyan);

Shadows over Lost Heaven

Arkin O'Brien/ The collector;

About Hawks and Snakes

Chad Charming;

What remains of Chad Charming

Requiem

Charlie Lonnit;

Frozen with fear, burning with hatred

Adam (Hazbin Hotel);

When all Is said and all is done... Hell is forever, and Haven is gone. (Series)

--------------------

Characters /plus the fandoms their in/ that I'm very happy to talk about;

!I RP, DRAW, WRITE FICS, OR JUST VENT ABOUT THESE CHARACTERS!

!Also y'all'll maybe see some fics about those so if ya want anything, all you need to do is ask!

- Arkin O'Brien (The collection series)

- Adam & Lute (Hazbin hotel)

- Mark Mayhew & Antonio Geist (Don't feed the muse arg)

- Tyrell Wellick (Mr Robot)

- Aaron (Creep)

- Charlie Lonnit (The devil in me)

- Tommy Angelo (Mafia 1-3)

- Chad Charming (Descendants)

- Googleplier (Markiplier)

- Chase (Jacksepticeye)

- Unus Annus (+Ethan)

- Josh Washington (Until Dawn)

- Aaron Burr (Hamilton)

- Logan Sanders (Sanders sides)

- Phantom (Natewantstobattle)

- Matpat (GTLive)

- Chris Bean (Goes wrong show)

- King Dice (CupHead)

- Gavin Reed (Detroit; BH)

- Lady D (Resident Evil)

- Trevor/Julian (Would you rather)

- Mycroft (Sherlock)

- Killian Jones (OUAT)

- Michael (The good Place)

- Andy Dufresne (Shawshank redemption)

Will be adding if I find a new obsession or remember an older one!

[iheartpeppino]

Okay, everyone in the Pizza Tower fandom is aware that The Noise was inspired by The Noid, an anti-mascot from Domino's Pizza. But... did you know The Noid has lore? I found this comment on MatPat's Food Theory video on The Noid today; it was posted 10 months ago:

If you can't read it, it says this:

I briefly worked at domino's in the early 90's.. One of my tasks there was dressing up in a 6ft tall Noid costume and dance around on the side of the road. It really sucked. One interesting thing about working there was a poster in the breakroom that gave actual lore for the Noid. It stated that gremlins have plagued mankind since the dawn of time and as time and technology progressed, various gremlins would specialize in messing with various things, like airplanes, cars, etc. Then one day, a "renegade gremlin" named the Noid decided to take specialization a step further by causing mayhem for pizza delivery, and was highly successful at it, until he went up against his arch nemesis, Domino's. It was a professionally made poster that was provided to the store by Domino's, so I figure it's official Noid canon, but I've never seen a copy of it online, nor have I seen anything anywhere on the internet that states this lore.. it's weird.

So, assuming this is true... all the times we've called The Noise or Noisette gremlins is actually spot-on, and not just because a poster in one of Pizza Tower's levels calls them "Pizza Gremlins". The Noid is a gremlin who specializes in messing up pizza deliveries... a PIZZA GREMLIN. Another example of gremlins in popular media is The Gremlins by Walt Disney, which was originally a book written by famous children's author Roald Dahl:

The Gremlins were originally going to star in a full-length film in the 1940's, but it never came to fruition. Here, they were known to sabotage war planes. These guys did show up in books later, and even made appearances in the Epic Mickey video game series.

So yeah, calling Noise and Noisette "gremlins" is correct. Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if The Doise was also some sort of gremlin...

[standard-human]

hey, i just need to get this out there.

matpat has been one of the biggests influences on my life. i remember my first theory very specifically- the bendy theory about max fleisher. and it was good. it was really good. it took my interest in a game, taught me about real history, and made me laugh. but most importantly, it gave me an escape. at that point, my dad and i were living in a crappy one bedroom apartment. he had to work so much, he barely got to spend any time with me. i didnt really have a father figure for a year or two there. but then, heres this guy online who talks about video games i like while making bad jokes and teaching me something. i remember that for a solid month after i watched the rosalina theories, i was obsessed with punnett squares. i learned, i laughed, and i felt like there was something i could go to every week to feel like i was cared about. eventually, my dad got better hours and could hang out with me, but i still kept coming back to the theories. this channel was my happy place. if i was having a bad day, id rewatch the mario series or the fnaf playlists, or sometimes id just pull up the until dawn theory. that was always one of my favorites. now that im older, my dependence on theories has lessened, but i still watch every video. even when i have a bad day now, i go back and laugh at sans is ness. im definitely gonna stick around, but im never gonna forget the father figure of my childhood

so, i guess what im trying to say is this: thank you matthew. thank you so much for everything youve done over the years, and thank you for making my life better. im truly proud to be a theorist.

[iangallagherz]

you guys ever think about josh washington and how he was just a mentally ill kid who never got the help he needed and how he blamed himself for what happened to his sisters despite the fact he is in no way responsible and how he acted out of sheer grief and anger towards the friends who hurt his sisters and caused their deaths and how despite the fact that he is one of the only two characters in the game that doesn't directly hurt anybody his only options are to die or be abandoned and left alone down in the mines to succumb to the terrible fate of becoming a wendigo?

yall ever think about him and just

[writers-embarrass]

Just so we’re all clear: the creator of fnaf just communicated with this girl THROUGH HER DREAM AND GAVE HER REAL MONEY saying video game characters have come to life and she just rolls with

[shadowyvoidfreakoaf]

Okay so I just got done today watching MatPat's gameplay of what remains of Edith Finch and so it I loved it and I'm officially obsessed with that game now I would love to play it myself someday and I thought you know what let me just go and since I saw some lines that Edith during the game has said about the family members I'm going to put down my favorite ones and yeah I am also going to list who they are to Edith

⚠️Spoilers!!!!!⚠️

(Great Aunt) Molly: she seems like the kind of girl I would have been friends with if she didn't die in 1947

(Great-Great Grandfather) Odin: Whatever's wrong with this family goes back a long ways

(Great Grandfather) Sven: Sven made this music box for Barbara, Sven had refurbished the camera he gave it to Sam

(Grandfather) Samuel "Sam": I never met my grandpa Sam but I think he and my mom had a lot in common

(Grandfather's Twin) Calvin: Calvin stories adult strangely funnier when I was I remember trying to do the exact same thing

(Great Aunt) Barbara: I never thought about how hard it must have been for her afterwards

(Great Uncle) Walter: I remember asking about mom once where Walter had gone, she said after Barbara died he got as far away as he could

(Mother) Dawn: I'm sure my mom was trying to Protect me, but the older I get the more I say from my mom was coming from,

(Uncle) Gus: mom never talked about him but she told me once that if I was a boy that they were going to name me Gus

(Uncle) Gregory: (she never really says anything about Gregory and he's not messing a lot other than his story so I'll just be able to my favorite quotes that Sam had made about him since he was the main person talking) whatever he saw, it sure made him happy, remind me so much of Calvin

(Brother) Milton: whatever Milton had found in the house Mom didn't want it getting out

(Brother) Lewis: Lewis and I spent a lot of time playing games together but he was surprisingly bad at them he died a lot

(in Christopher's case she was talking to him through her journal / diary) ( Son) Christopher: my brother was really cool I wish you could have met him, and I was alone, the last Finch Left alive, until I found out about you, this is where your story begins I'm sorry it will be there to see it it's a lot to ask but I don't want you to be sad I'm gone I want you to be amazed that any of us ever had a chance to be here at all

The ending of that game really sad and I literally found the fandom and I was very shocked at the fact that there's another game and it kind of explains what happened to Milton it's called The unfinished swan but if you search up the wiki page for what remains of Edith Finch then you'll find out all that stuff and that they are in fact actually connected and it is confirmed so there's that and I think I literally just became obsessed and have a new fans in now could could receive me watching people play this game and so you might see more of that content on here but anyways I hope you have a wonderful rest of your day and stay safe bye-bye

[maxer-blaster]

MatPat: We're totally gonna bang Jess by the way guys, just saying.

Steph: Collectively.

MatPat: All of us. It'll be weird. It'll be awkward.

[the-red-rainy-perytons]

If you guys are ever confused about something I'm into, reading, or watching, and have questions, please hecking ask. I know you might feel awkward about it, but please. I would love to answer your questions about my fandoms, no matter how weird

What's the plot of dsmp? I have no clue what happens in there

You're going to wish you hadn't asked but ok

It's kind of a lot but I'll do my best. Also it's still in the works, so technically any of this could change on a dime but

/rp (black font from here on out so I don't absolutely destroy your eyes)

Season 1:

So it starts off relatively normal for an SMP, with the Dream Team and some of their cohorts messing around. Then Tommyinnit and Wilbur Soot show up and start making drugs (potions) in a van.

Drug van -> drug empire. Drug empire -> country.

Dream doesn't like this, and the members of the newly formed L'Manburg (Tommy, Wilbur, Eret, and Fundy) go to war against those who are still technically with Dream or haven't split off and made their own faction (also known as the Greater Dream SMP). At the end, Eret betrays them. ("It was never meant to be" #1) They lose, but reparations are made and L'Manburg gets independence. Wilbur becomes president of L'Manburg, Tommy his vice. Eret becomes king of the Greater Dream SMP. Niki joins L'Manburg, completing its major members.

Commence Election Arc.

Wilbur decides to hold an election to make his government look more legitimate considering he kind of just claimed leadership. Naturally he tries to rig it and become the only candidate. Wilbur takes on Tommy as his running mate, forming the campaign POG2020.

(Note: MatPat made a Game Theory video on this section. While it misses about 75% of the plot and side characters, it's a good overview of this arc and the mechanics of the server in general. The theory is also wrong.)

Quackity challenges Wilbur, and runs another campaign with GeorgeNotFound as his partner, making SWAG2020. COCONUT2020 (Niki and Fundy) is also a thing that exists. No one votes for them.

JSchlatt joins the server under the guise of a political endorsement for POG2020, but promptly decides to make his own campaign (SCHLATT2020).

There's some drama afterwards, but the gist is that Quackity and Schlatt team up and combine their votes in the final election. (George was sleeping.) With their combined votes, SCHLATT2020 wins, making Schlatt the president, Tubbo (Tommy's best friend and Secretary of State under the Soot Administration) the new vice president. Quackity becomes the Secretary of State.

At his inauguration, Schlatt exiles Wilbur and Tommy (the "My first decree" speech). The two create a secret base outside the border (Pogtopia), Tubbo spies for them on the inside, and Technoblade, a violent anarchist, joins the server and sides with them. This is also the opening of Wilbur's insanity arc (aka the Vilbur arc).

Schlatt holds a festival, and Tubbo plans it. Wilbur puts TNT (TNT he got from Dream, I might add) under the podium and hooks it up to a button in the mountain, planning to press it and detonate about half the country after Tubbo gives his speech. Of course, things go south.

Techno is invited to the festival, while Wilbur and Tommy are not. After Tubbo's speech, Schlatt exposes Tubbo as a spy and orders Techno to execute him. Techno does so (the death system is weird here, and every character has 3 canon, or plot-important, deaths before they die die). And Techno being Techno, he kills everyone else attending as well. Wilbur can't actually find the button so no boom.

There's more tea and arguing but the next big event is 11/16/2020. By now quite a few people have sided with Pogtopia because no one really likes Schlatt as leader, and they decide to go to war, all in, everybody. (These are the events of SAD-ist's Dawn of 16th animation if you're curious)

Chaos ensues, lots of pvp, Schlatt dies of a heart attack for good (yes that's what happens) and Tubbo is inaugurated as the new president.

But wait. You just inaugurated a new president in front of an exceptionally violent anarchist. An anarchist who just so happens to have been the major supplier for the war you just won. Maybe that wasn't a good idea.

Anyways Wilbur finds the button, has a great monologue ("It was never meant to be" #2, and I do recommend checking this one out because the guy knows how to act.) (There's also another animatic by The Channel Without A Name that shows this scene, called Never Meant to Be) Philza Minecraft shows up for it. Wilbur presses the button, big boom, and asks, nay, begs Phil to kill him. Phil does. So now Wilbur's dead for good too. Phil is also Wilbur's dad in SMP canon.

Wow

Indeed. The timing on this bit is a little fuzzy, and most animators take some liberty with it considering there's only about 5 minutes difference between the button press and the following events.

L'Manburg blows, and Techno begins the Theseus/So You Want to Be a Hero monologue. He finishes and spawns two withers into the ruins, completing the major events of Season 1.

Afterwards, Techno leaves to retire with Phil (his old friend), Pogtopia is annexed, and Tommy goes back to L'Manburg.

Season 1 is the most concise and cinematic in my opinion. I skipped the opening of The Disc Saga, which doesn't become super important to the core plot until Season 2, but just know that it was happening in the background, and influenced some of the events (one of the main factors in the revolution, the reason Tubbo became the 3rd president instead of Tommy)

Do you actually want to hear about Season 2 or will I just be tacking on more to a very long post

I'mma be real w ya my brain is fried

That's fair

Another time

[the-real-numba-one]

I’m seeing alotta women, Steph.

Matthew Patrick (Until Dawn Play through)

[fuckmatpat]

iirc matpats wife made a fatphobic joke when they were playing Until Dawn

yalls really makin me post this huh

[aquello-main]

on the matpat thing: i’m not the most informed about it but what i can say personally is that a couple of his theories really didn’t sit well with me, namely the “is jinx racist” theory, about the pokemon and how a lot of people have said it looks like blackface vs arguing that it’s based on ganguro fashion which involves heavy tanning, but like. either way it is just not a theory he should be making as a white guy, yk? there’s a few other things, namely the theory about pyro from tf2’s gender which involved a lot of theorizing about whether they’re a woman or just an effeminate (and by extension gay, apparently) man, and like. a couple theories, like the until dawn and wilbur arg theory off the top of my head, which have really nasty and ableist implications about DID and schizophrenia. also other things im not super clear on so don’t take my word for it: apparently he’s had a lot of issues with misgendering nonbinary characters, like i believe one of the undertale protags.

oh ok yeah i do remember those now, i was recently thinking about how bad the wilbur arg one was and how it was ableist and bad implications about ppl with DID

and i do also remember him misgendering one of the undertale protags, but austin (the 'the science of-' guy) didnt, i was thinking about how that was fucked up as well

havent watched the first two, but based on what you said, yeah, thats not the greatest thing for him to have said

i'll was gonna give him the benefit of the doubt here and say that "oh, yknow, those were a while ago" but the wil one was pretty recent, and i know about a couple of his more recent theories that were stolen/used without credit (the "dolores is the bad guy?!?!" encanto one is the first i can think of)

only reason i still watch mat is bc hes part of my childhood that hasnt really changed, but i dont care for him all that much anymore

[themessafterthemarty]

Up All Night To Get Theories (GTLive Until Dawn) (I’m so sorry for the title) Kicking off the new year with a quite very belated Christmas present commission to a friend. Turned out to be quite the fair trade as I got a “Keep Calm and #BlameJason” t-shirt from him, which I wore as I drew this and - oh, woe is me - had to watch through the GTLive Let’s Play of Until Dawn…. again. Not like the fifteenth time or anything. I was doing hard work and research, I tell you. (update: steph liked this on twitter and life is good) (update2: and mat too) (deviantart link, art tag)

[stephew-trash]

Favorite - Chris Moment - Jason Moment - Stephanie Moment - Mathew Moment - Stephew Moment - CatPat Moment - Guest Moment - Stream - Quote I hope I didn't put too much on here!

Chris: Oh my word just the entire Until Dawn Hidden Agenda stream, he just killed me in it! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd1HTpY0ccA&list=PLl8s6AjdhogT1BJpWB0xFo3eymnlofYT0&index=4) 

Jason: See now that’s a harder one, Jason is one of my favorites. Probably that one dancing stream (Steph’s birthday I believe) where they all danced together (https://youtu.be/j5Mdjwl11cE?t=4914) 

Stephanie: OH MY WORD HANDS DOWN THIS MOMENT BETWEEN JASON AND STEPH ON THE EMILY IS AWAY TOO PART 3 STREAM! “Excuse me?” I COULD FEEL THE SALT FROM MY COLD HOME IN THE EASTERN PART OF THE COUNTRY (https://youtu.be/g44TNRQmKrQ?t=3349) 

Matthew: Oh 100%, during the first Stanley Parable stream. Where in the middle of the game he paused and brought out flowers and her favorite soda (Which is mine as well) Then he talked about the 14 days of valentine’s day and melted into my seat, they are just too gosh darn cute. This moment for me just really showed his love and appreciation for his wife and it just about murdered me on the spot! (https://youtu.be/HJgKjHnzKbs?t=1435) 

Stephew: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuJkt17lY2I Just click the link nuff said.

Catpat: I am a sucker for any Catpat moment but I did love it when during a sheer moment of exhaustion matt collapses and snuggles up to his cat during Steph’s birthday dance stream. (https://youtu.be/j5Mdjwl11cE?t=1859) Guest: TBH Don’t really like the guest streams I always end up feeling second-hand embarrassment (Which is something I’ve been suffering from for years now) But Rosanna’s stream was pretty chill. Also, love Ro so like she’s pretty great in everything she does. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teTIRUy1eys) 

Stream: This is so hard. I love the Kindergarten streams, Until Dawn was amazing, Hello Neighbor is always a hoot, but if I had to pick one stream it would have to be The DDLC steams (I cheated and decided to pick all of them opps) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mlXrSXDpow&list=PLl8s6AjdhogT1BJpWB0xFo3eymnlofYT0&index=26)

Quote: Stephanie: Do you wanna hold hands? MatPat: Yes, oh always. Always, that’s beautiful Steph.(Try Not to Scream Challenge 3) 

[lum1natrix]

His Life is Strange playthrough was frustrating for me because I watched Matpat and Steph play it on GTLive before I watch him play it and they are super thorough game players who click on everything and get more of the story so I was kind of all "click on the things, Jack" and kind of annoyed at some of the choices because I knew ahead of time what the results would be. But I liked some bits of it a lot. My favorite thing ever about Jack is just how empathetic he is.

Aaahhh yeah I completely understand that. I was kind of in that same mindset when I watched him play Until Dawn a few months back! Every play through has some pros and cons, I suppose!

[fnafitup]

until dawn the silver eyes

Dave Miller is a red herring. The robots are culturally appropriated zombies. Carlton shoots a squirrel. Jessica takes hours to draw a bath. Marla has a 4.0 GPA, bitch, honor roll. Charlie is a sympathetic but poorly researched portrayal of a mentally ill person and trying way too hard for her Youtube prank channel. Matpat makes an ableist video about it.

As for the sequel, The Twisted Dawn, I only have two words: Wolf friend.