#cis privilege

[redditreceipts]

"there is no way to define "woman" without leaving out some cis women" so how do you define "cis woman" then? if you're so sure about who is and who isn't a cis woman, your definition of "cis woman" is my definition of "woman" :)

[wild-aspen]

Saying that cis women don't have to go through certain things isn't a privilege dynamic. And all the things you mentioned, women are also discriminated against in those areas such as medicine has lack of research into female bodies, employment standards and so on. Like female only shelters being open to cis women isn't a privilege, they were created specifically bc women are oppressed under patriarchy.

How you sound right now:

Yes, having things you don't go through that other people do is a privilege dynamic. Privilege is often described as "obstacles one group of people face that you do not". I don't really care how you personally define privilege; the rest of the world disagrees with you. Privilege also makes it so you can't see the challenges other people face; their burdens are invisible to you. You see YOUR burden clearly, but you can't visualize anyone else suffering.

And yes, cis women are discriminated against in all those fields. I picked them on purpose. Yes, cis women face challenges in those situations - but trans people face ADDITIONAL challenges cis women do not, based on the fact that they are trans.

The same thing goes for black women vs white women, by the way. They're both women, but the white woman will have privileges the black woman does not.

And so yes, cis women have advantages trans people do not have.

Imagine a cis woman and a trans woman are going to the bathroom in Florida. The cis woman gets to pee; the trans woman is arrested. That is cis privilege. Imagine a cis woman and a trans woman are applying for an apartment. The trans woman is rejected specifically because she's trans, but the cis woman is not. That is cis privilege.

Imagine a trans man and a cis woman both go to the gynecologist. The cis woman goes into the waiting room, is gendered correctly by staff, is not dead named, is not stared at, and is not refused coverage by her insurance because her gender and her sex are congruent and pap smears are considered necessary for females.

The trans man walks in and is told he's in the wrong place. He corrects the staff quietly, informing them he is a trans man. The nurse at the desk looks at his id and his paperwork and deadnames him and misgenders him. He sits down and is given dirty looks while he waits. The nurse calls him back by his dead name a few minutes later. The doctor asks him intrusive and inappropriate questions while performing his pap smear. He finally leaves, relived the ordeal is over. But it's not - because a few weeks later he gets a letter from his insurance. They've denied to cover the procedure because pap smears are for females, and his paperwork says he's male.

A cis woman doesn't have to deal with any of that. That's cis privilege.

[paperlessprinter]

I picked a hell of a time to start questioning more gender stuff. I don't even think it's worth pursuing it.

[tempo-takoyaki]

Listen, I love the "XL helps HC to see how beautiful he is" scenario as much as the next person... But I also see it like this.

[lazylittledragon]

y'know every time i feel guilty about bothering someone by singing along when i'm listening to music, i just remember that i have to tolerate my dirtbag brother screaming at his ps5 for hours every day so listening to muffled off-key fall out boy is probably preferable

[chronicsymptomsyndrome]

For example having a degree is a privilege even though you work really hard for it, because a lot of people work equally hard and still cannot earn a degree.

Does this mean they didn’t work as hard? they are less deserving? not good enough? No!!

It means our world is deeply flawed and inequitable, and an advantage is still an advantage even if you have to earn it, because others were never even given the chance.

Some people will get soooo offended if you say they are privileged ???what’s the deal with that

privileged=undeserving? it’s morally ambiguous?? privilege=malice??? evil intent?? no!

[ghostboyravenight]

“trans men have access to male privilege” no. some trans men have access to some male privilege if they are somehow indistinguishable from their cis male counterparts. If they outwardly pass as a man, if they have had surgery to change their internal anatomy (and it matches perisex cis male anatomy) and if no one around them knows they’re trans, then they might have a superficial access to male privilege dependent solely on where they are and the people around them.

That is a tiny minority of trans men, and you are excluding a huge number of trans men who do not fit into the necessary criteria to access some kind of male privilege.

“But people mistake them for men, so they get the benefits of male privilege” oh okay. so you’re not talking about systemic privilege. you’re not talking about the patriarchy. you’re not talking about medical discrimination that most trans men will still face regardless of how well they pass. you’re saying that your guy friends treated you better because they thought you were one of the bros. got it.

[ravingsofacripple]

Saying trans men don’t have male privilege is not saying they aren’t free from misogynistic views.

It’s not a purely male thing to be misogynistic guys.

It’s not a male privilege to be misogynistic.

You can be a woman and be misogynistic.

Misogyny is not limited to men, it’s not a male only thing.

Trans men don’t have male privilege ≠ trans men can’t be misogynistic!

These are two different statements.

My post saying you can’t hold trans men and cis men in the same category IS NOT ABOUT FUCKING MISOGYNY.

It’s about the fact that the one of the only ways a trans man could potentially ever have some semblance of the same male privilege a cis man has in this society is if they are white, post op and have been on T for years, have an M gender marker and do not reveal they are transgender to anyone but their partner(s).

Pre-T trans men, trans men who like to be open about their identity, pre-op trans men, trans men who like being feminine sometimes. None of them have the male privilege we’re talking about here but they’re still all men.

There is a fundamental difference between cis and trans men/mascs in this society. You CANNOT hold them in the same category.

Nobody, not even a trans man, is free from being a misogynist.

But trying to claim that saying trans men/mascs don’t have male privilege is saying they can’t be misogynistic is wild.

Misogynistic views ≠ male privilege

Because it’s not male privilege to get away with/not get away with saying misogynistic statements.

Cis men can be misogynistic

Cis women can be misogynistic

Trans men can be misogynistic

Trans women can be misogynistic

GNC people can be misogynistic

It is not a male privilege to spout misogyny.

[theamphibianmen]

Hot take apparently but I don't think conversations about trans men's oppression should have to center women.

[jakeperalta]

the taylor swift ai porn issue is such a bleak reminder of how inescapable the horrors of misogyny are. like obviously there's the talk of sort of "celebrity problems" like treatment by the tabloids etc, but beyond that there's just the constant heinous shit that women seemingly cannot escape no matter what. it doesn't matter that she (as well as other female celebrities) is extremely rich and famous and successful and has basically as much privilege and power as it is possible for any person to have, ultimately that's still not enough to escape the revenge porn and sexual assault and stalking and harassment. like there is literally no level of power a woman can have that puts her out of reach of all the men who hate women and want to control and humiliate and subjugate us in any way they can.

[she-is-ovarit]

"Cis priivlege" is used because "female privilege" didn't work too well for incels and MRAs.

[gayhenrycreel]

how do i explain to certain trans men that being considered one of the bros does not mean they have access to something that definitionally means having systemic power over every woman and trans person. no you dont have male privilige. try arguing that again when you create a world in which trans men dont face misogyny. you cant have male privilige if you are still in a world where you are barred from abortion

[orfeolookback]

wrt the male loneliness epidemic bs i think it's important to discuss how strongly the current western state of affairs isolates everyone. not "just" men. the thing is that men believe they are entitled to their loneliness being amended by women. and when feminism began to show that women didn't have to suffer being in that position, instead of making certain to be someone people (women included) would want to be around, already-radicalized men hated those women, and non-radicalized men became prime targets of radicalization. that's what, in praxis, it means to be a feminist man (or an ally, or a deconstructed masculinity), though: it entails giving up that which you believe is owed to you by virtue of being a man. that's why deconstructed masculinities are as much of a goal as empowered feminities and trans identities.

so, to summarize. men are lonely because everyone is. capitalism, white supremacy, misogyny and other axis of the kyriarchy are set in motion to retain status quo by punishing community and solidarity. men are not especially touched by this phenomenon. but since there is a dissonance between what they were promised by patriarchy and what they effectively access in this case their entitlement flares up, ravenous for upholding the patriarchal edict of "men must be tended to by women, in detriment of women"

there is a general loneliness epidemic. it just so happens that it impugns pre conceived promises of the patriarchy. the answer should in every case be to build community and form bonds that enable us to struggle against isolation and individualism; never to demand that another person or a collective tends to our needs in their own detriment.

[trixxedheart]

It is amazing how the "people that love and uplift transwomen" website will instantly fucking maul a transwoman if she even remotely insinuate that using radfem rhetoric harms trans people

[this-is-exorsexism]

why do binary trans people feel the need to qualify their supposed support for nonbinary people? it's never "i support nonbinary people", but "i support nonbinary people, as long as [they don't do something obviously shitty]".

why do you feel the need to mention that? do you think nonbinary people are inherently more likely to be bigoted assholes? you should examine that.

also 9 times out of 10 it's a self-identified transsexual with binary privilege saying this about how they "support nonbinary people as long as they support people who ACTUALLY medically transition" as if nonbinary and medical transition were mutually exclusive, and as if nonbinary people who don't medically transition are somehow more of a threat to medical transition access than, you know, cis people, rather than advocating for bodily autonomy.

nonbinary people never qualify our support for binary trans people like this, always speak up for our trans brothers and sisters and then all we get is whatever in the exorsexist truscummery this is.

they're just making up some nonbinary stereotype to hold onto so they feel justified in revoking their fake support whenever.

also bonus points because that was under a post about why some nonbinary people don't identify as trans and i shared my experience of previously not identifying as trans due to exorsexism from binary trans people and then a binary trans person comes in doing this to show their supposed support, like try sounding any less supportive. attitudes like this are part of why many of us don't feel welcome.