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gralunaisland · 2 years

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Part 3 of "Why Gray is NOT a Tsundere"

(An Anti-gr///via Post)

[Links to Part 1 and Part 2 are linked here.]

Some Instances of Gray's Lack of Tsundere-ness:

I went and found some moments where Gray is clearly showing how uncomfortable he is. I think it's fitting to provide my own evidence since Author did, but I was going to add examples anyway even if I hadn't read Author's post. Anyway, in anime and manga, the mangaka always makes it clear when someone is a tsundere, always makes the little details show that the tsundere actually likes the other individual. I see no such details in these panels.

Come on, look at how his hair is standing up in the last panel. His hair is literally standing on its end, which is indicative of chills running up your spine and being completely unnerved and freaked out. He's not joking that she's scary, he's not trying to cutely cover it up that he secretly enjoys this. The voice actors do a great job of showing how distraught Gray is by this in the anime too.

Yeah, Gray's face says it all. Those vertical lines on his face are used in manga to show when someone's uncomfortable or feeling some sort of negative downer feeling. And wow just look at her language. Gray right out says he's not into this type of thing, it's not something he's comfortable with, that he doesn't have these perverted hobbies, and yet she responds with "But I doooo~", showing very clearly that she doesn't care whatsoever about what makes Gray happy or at peace of mind, just that her own fetishes and fantasies are being fulfilled. Wow. The more I investigate juvia, the more I am disgusted. I didn't think it was possible tbh, but I suppose I should've known since it's juvia we're talking about, queen of toxicity and creepiness.

Just look how disgruntled and aggrieved Gray is here. He's literally sweating bullets. No ounce of blush, no once of him trying to hide any underlying feeling, just pure unadulterated discomfort and unease. juvia's not even denying what he's saying here (her deplorable behind is actually proud of her actions, which you can see on her disgusting smug expression). He obviously didn't invite her or happily let her in; she literally barged in and would NOT leave his house, which just means that she followed him to his new home, so yeah, the stalking never ends, people!!

I don't even remember which episode this is, but Gray's expression is full of distress and absolutely freaking the heck out. He doesn't find this endearing or cute at all, and he makes it clear that he doesn't even want to be associated with her by others nor to have to deal with her.

Also don't remember which episode, but c'mon, she's a naked chick rubbing up against him, and he's STILL disgusted. Those lines of discomfort on his face and those sweat drops again. Not even juvia's superficial paltry looks can make him interested.

Ah yes, I'm pretty sure this was from an Omake after the GMG where the losing FT team had to do a punishment game or something or other. Again, juvia's naked breast has been whipped out despite no one wanting to see it, what an actual disturbing pervert. (And no, this is not comparable to Gray's stripping habit in the slightest because juvia has full control of herself despite never using self-control, whereas Gray's stripping is sort of an instinct [I've seen some people say it might be a trauma response/coping mechanism, and I think it could very well be that] ingrained into him by his deceased mentor where he actually gets really embarrassed once he finds himself down to his boxers, as he does it unconsciously. juvia however has no shame and is actively sexually harassing Gray by doing this, not to mention just plain copying him with a complete lack of dignity, and she is showing that she literally has no personality outside of Gray and is literally amalgamating with him.) And instead of liking the view, Gray's utterly creeped out. You might think that Gray just doesn't appreciate the female form like that, but Gray shows that to be false through him going gooey-eyed when Virgo changed Lucy in front of him, or when he was excited to check the shower for Lucy when they were looking for her, or how he fantasized about Lucy in a skimpy paper outfit, or even how he blushed really hard when Virgo was helping keep Lucy's skirt down in high winds while her own was flashing him. All in all, Gray likes the female form, just not THIS female form because it comes with a psychopath.

Again, no blush, all freaking out, despite, again, a nigh naked woman glomping onto him full force (which is sexual harassment might I add since he doesn't consent.)

Note here, what's funny is Author used the first panel in their "proof", and yet they coincidentally decided to leave out the very next panel where Gray is clearly creeped out by juvia's refusal to face reality and her refusal of acknowledging his boundaries. Again, all sweat and all seriousness. Nothing about her reaction to his rejection is funny to him, nothing is being hidden, he's genuinely creeped by her (and honestly who wouldn't be?? Pros, think about it. If someone kept pursuing you despite you not being interested and despite you telling them you're not, would you not be creeped out? Why do you support this witch again?)

This last picture is even from the 100yq, something I don't even consider to be canon thanks to Gray being completely OOC, where gr///via has been hammered into being 'canon', and even here there are still scenes where Gray is just grossed out by juvia and completely uncomfortable, in a nervous sweat to boot. You can still commit sexual harassment even if you're dating, I hope y'all know that.

I would love to post more evidence, really, I would, but the internet actually just hates all things Anti gr//////via unfortunately. Looking up anti gruvia just brings up mostly anti-anti gr///via content because of course that makes sense, and I don't feel like rewatching all their "moments" right now because I value my sanity a little bit.

Oh well. That's why I run this blog. Gotta represent.

Whenever I do my next re-watch, maybe I'll take screenshots of all the times Gray is grossed out by her. Does NOT sound fun because I don't want to have juvia's pictures on my phone, but it might just have to be done.

Anyway, all that I put into these three posts (and probably more tbh but my brain is fried from thinking about juvia so much rn) is why I think Gray is NOT a tsundere.

Thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.

Closing Notes:

I think I'll just end this trilogy of posts quite unceremoniously here. I've spent hours and hours working on it, so I really just want feedback on it at this point. I hope I don't sound too mean throughout the posts; I tried to be transparent and honest though.

Please do let me know your thoughts on the subject of Gray being or not being a tsundere, and please give me your thoughts on my post! Discussion helps get us closer to the truth! Please remain respectful even if you disagree with what I said, though.

(Also, I would like to know whether my readers like these long, in depth studies into different aspects of Pro gr///vian arguments, or if y'all like my shorter responses to asks instead. If you don't care, that's fine too. I don't do much of these longer posts anymore because I have so many actually amazing asks, so maybe that's for the better, idk, lmk.)

Anyway, thank you for your time, and I hope you enjoyed my analysis! Have a wonderful day/night!

#anti gruvia #anti juvia #fairy tail #anti juvia lockser #anti juvia loxar #defend gray fullbuster #gray fullbuster #anti gray x juvia #fairy tail debate #fairy tail discourse #fairy tail discussion #gray isn't a tsundere #gray is not a tsundere #tsundere #tsunderes #fairytail #gralunaessay

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gralunaisland · 2 years

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Part 2 of "Why Gray is NOT a Tsundere"

(An Anti-gr///via Post)

[Links to Part 1 and Part 3 are linked here.]

Refuting the @f*ckyeahgr*via post:

Again, this is the post I read that tries to prove Gray is a tsundere which I will be analyzing and countering to prove that Gray is in fact not a tsundere.

Anyway, first, I will say I agree with the Anon that suggested this to me all those months ago. This post seems to be quite reasonable at first glance, at least compared to other Pro gr///vian arguments which tend not to be.

However, I gave it careful thought, and I believe I have a response to each of their points.

Also, remember, as I said in Part 1, I refer to the Pro gr///vian writer of this post as "Author", and their quotes are in orange. Lastly, this post is the longest of the 3 parts so be prepared.

Onto the Author's post:

"Yes, there is a difference [between being a tsundere and not returning someone's feelings]. But, it’s a shame when shipping preferences get in the way of people seeing obvious character traits for what they are."

This is what Author basically starts out by saying, and it's really a baffling thing for a Pro gr//vian to say.

I mean... in the nicest way possible... look at the pot calling the kettle black.

Pros are literally the ones whose shipping preferences get in the way of them seeing juvia's glaring, painfully obvious traits (flaws, they're flaws) for what they are (again, flaws).

The hypocrisy is pretty baffling to me, even if it's accidental.

Because Pros just ship Gray and juvia together with no real thought as to the healthiness of the relationship, they usually flat out ignore her toxic traits:

from the stalking ("she only did it a few timessss" or "it's not stalking, she's just watching the guy she likesss even if she's following him across the country without his knowledge"),

to the emotional manipulation ("noo she wasn't making Silver's death all about her and her selfish love of Gray, she was just apologizinggg", ignoring the fact that she never said sorry and ignoring the fact that she said she had no right to love him but she continues to “love” him afterward because she didn’t actually believe that, she just wanted Gray to make her feel better even though he’s heavily grieving right now etc.),

to the ignoring him whenever he is obviously uncomfortable or when he literally rejected her ("nahhh his clear rejection of her and her feelings was just a red herring, he obviously just adores her, no doesn’t mean no, and consent is all subjective anyway" etc.),

to ignoring all his boundaries ("awww isn't it so sweet that they lived together after FT disbanded?? let's just forget the fact that she trespassed, refused to leave, and then tried to sleep with him" etc.),

to creating creepy merchandise all with Gray's face on it and using it to get off ("heyyy, don't kink shame! it's perfectly healthy to do this even if the person she based all the merch off of doesn't know she's doing this and doesn't like her back" etc.)

etc. etc. etc!!!

I'm sorry, Author, but you are describing yourself when you're trying to call out Antis. Your adoration of the ship gr///via blinds you from seeing juvia's obvious traits as what they are, detestable, as well as from seeing that Gray is a victim here, not a willing participant and most certainly not the bad guy here.

But let's continue.

Author moves on by claiming Mashima proclaimed Gray's "tsundere-ness" himself by highlighting it on the manga cover with the words "You've never seen Gray make this face before!", as if that proves the face Gray was making was tsundere. I also found another translation of what I think Author was referring to on the gross title page of juvia for 413 Days, which says "This will be the first time Gray shows this side of himself", which would directly contradict certain things that this Author says that I will get to later on.

To be honest, the face he makes actually does look pretty tsundere, if we're just going to focus on looks. He's frowning with eyebrows furrowed, and he's got a slight blush on his face.

However, Gray was probably only making that expression because of a combination of being ashamed of his "harsh treatment" (aka rightful treatment) of juvia from that particular day (because he's a nice person and actually he wasn't even being harsh now that I went back to read the stupid chapter), being ashamed that he "treated her badly" when she was "just trying to be nice", being grateful for something cheerful on a dreary day, as well as being embarrassed again that it was juvia, the girl who's made it abundantly clear she desires him and pesters him who was cheering him up despite how much he's told her off.

I'm thinking it's mostly that last thing as the reason why he makes that particular expression. He's a big softie, and yet he's been setting hundreds of boundaries for juvia-- rightfully so-- so it definitely pains/embarrasses him to actually enjoy something she gives him.

In that case, it makes perfect sense why he 'hasn't made that face before' because this is the first time he actually appreciates something juvia does for him.

All that makes abundantly more sense than him “trying desperately not to let anyone know that he likes juvia", which is the whole point of the classic tsundere face where they pretend to hate the person they like in the first place by the way, especially when in the next panel, which Author shows, he's smiling, and especially since he's alone and has no one to prove it to, least of all juvia who isn't even there.

Then Author brings up Erza witnessing Gray smiling and wearing the scarf, saying she "passed by with a knowing smile on her face", as if that proves anything? I honestly don't know what they thought they were proving here, really, because yes, Erza saw Gray wearing the scarf, and she smiled with a blush on her face.

Uh... Like we care what she thinks??

I absolutely hate Erza when she's butting into Gray's personal "love life". On a different occasion, she berates Gray for not giving juvia a clear answer, even though he's made it clear to anyone who's not an imbecile that juvia's actions bother him, basically saying it's his fault that juvia keeps pestering him, actually victim blaming him even though he was just being a nice guy to juvia. She literally encourages juvia's insane and just plain inconsiderate behavior towards Gray and supports her through it all. She really shows that her true loyalties lie with helping juvia ruin his life rather than with the man whom she's been friends with since childhood. Erza is the one who tells juvia she has to give him a gift since it's "their anniversary". If Erza was really Gray's friend, then she should know that that day was the anniversary of Ur's death. But noooo she still puts juvia up to bothering Gray even though she knows how Gray reacts to juvia's antics and even though by then he'd already rejected her. And even if she didn't know that it was Ur's deathday, then after learning, she should've been supporting Gray, not juvia. Oh gosh, the words Erza spouted to juvia while she was crying for ruining Gray's day:

"Besides, I don't think Gray was bothered too much by your gesture. It's just one day. If lives were lost today, then today, lives were also born. How important each and every day is... depends on how important you feel it is to you."

This made me want to rip the red hair out of her head. Not only does she spur juvia on to bother Gray even though she knows Gray already rejected her, she tries to make juvia feel better (instead of comforting Gray) by basically saying, "don't feel bad for annoying Gray on the most important and saddest day for him. People die and are born everyday, so Gray should just get over it."

Onto the next point:

The next thing Author looked at was the panels where juvia made bread with Gray's face on them.

"Prior to that, we had people pointing out that Gray was completely contradicting his own rejection, by being obliging towards Juvia, with his very tsundere-ish line of “Well, since you went to all this trouble…” while BLUSHING and taking one of her breads (who blushes when they eat bread?)"

What's absolutely hilarious is that a total of five people had blushes on their face in the two panels Author showed. Blush does NOT equal romantic feelings every time it shows up in manga. If it did, then not only did Gray and juvia have romantic feelings in these panels, but so did Cana, Mira, and Elfman. Uh, "who blushes when they eat bread"?? Maybe ELFMAN who literally has blush on his face when he says, "This tastes really manly!" as he eats juvia's bread???

Need I say more on this point? No? Good.

Anyway, onto Author's point of pointing all this out, remember, Gray isn't a mean person.

He's actually never been mean to juvia; he's not mean to people in general. One example is when he was so apologetic and felt so bad that he'd accidentally hurt Mirajane's feelings when he thought a drawing was childish. The closest thing he's gotten to being mean is his rivalry with Natsu, but it's shown time and time again that that's just surface level rivalry and fooling around and that he actually cares about him. Baking bread takes time and effort, which he recognizes with his words (which accounts for the "very tsundere-ish line"), and it's among the marginally less creepy things she's tried to give him, so why wouldn't he accept them, especially since he's nice?

Accepting something she made is not akin to declaring that he actually likes her. He's probably only blushing because she's embarrassing him like usual in front of the whole guild. He's also sweating hard, which shows that it's probably stress from the public humiliation too. Gray's never liked juvia's over the top antics, especially how she's not subtle in public about it, and her baking him bread with their faces on it is definitely embarrassing.

Onto the next point:

"And then there was the 366 moment that he initiated (gripping her hand and intimately telling her he was with her) which again was completely contradictory towards his previous words of rejection towards Juvia, and obviously had romantic implications behind the moment. I mean, how do you go from this (and mind you, the official translation was even harsher than this, as he said refused/rejected, rather than “No thanks.")"

"To this?:"

I'm confused how Pros have the audacity to show Gray's rejection and then to pretend like it didn't matter at all. Notice how they even mention that the official translation was harsher? Gray was making it completely clear that he didn't reciprocate juvia's feelings, without any hint of the classic tsundere blush and stammering, without any of the unease and uncertainty. He was laying it all out in the open. He wasn't even being cold in the tsundere sense; he's not being cold by firmly setting boundaries and by making it clear he doesn't consent to being treated like this by juvia. Why can't they just understand that no means no?

As for the second scene, Gray has always been there for his friends emotionally and physically. Remember in the Phantom Lord arc where Erza was collapsing against his chest in defeat and he held onto her? Remember when Gray was physically supporting Lucy as she used the Book of End? He expresses concern for his friends through physical means many times over the anime, and this time with juvia would be no exception. Just because he lays his hand on juvia's hand, a girl who's a part of the guild he loves so dearly, a girl whom he still considers a friend even though juvia shows time and time again she's not willing to be friends with him, doesn't mean he loves her; he's merely supporting a worried, stressed comrade of his.

Him being kind to juvia and him loving juvia are not mutually inclusive. In other words, him doing the former doesn't necessitate the latter. He's just a kind person in general, as I've said many times, and if you can't see that he's a kind person in general, are you even a fan of Gray's? Honestly, I wouldn't think many Pros are fans of Gray because of how toxic this ship is for him, but I'd love to hear how they reconcile it in their mind.

Onto the next point:

"And Gray’s tsundereness does not just apply to Juvia. He has a HISTORY of being tsundere with people. The first arc he participated in within the series (the Lullaby arc) flat out established him as tsundere, when he acted as such with Natsu, by not wanting to directly tell him to not die (see the embarrassed blush):"

"And before you say, Natsu was acting similarly, no. Natsu has NO PROBLEM telling Gray in the Galuna Island arc to not die. That’s the difference between Gray and Natsu. Natsu has no problem directly showing how much he cares for people."

Well, honestly good for Author, they show that they realize being tsundere doesn't just apply to romantic interests.

Rather than him being tsundere here, though, I think this is literally just a case of "boys being boys". Guys just don't tend to be very emotionally vulnerable. It's not a secret that most of the time Gray and Natsu butt heads. The times where either of them tells the other that they actually care for each other are not often.

Here, Author, you state that you can't say Natsu was acting similarly here, however, I disagree, because while, yes, Natsu made it clear in a very dire moment when Gray was about to kill himself through Iced Shell that he didn't want him to die, in this moment, Natsu acted the same exact way that Gray did, flushing and then quickly turning away, breaking eye contact. I don't think either of them are being tsunderes, they're just not used to showing how much they care for the other on a regular basis, and for guys, it can be especially embarrassing to show it.

You say that's the difference between these guys, that "Natsu has no problem directly showing how much he cares for people", but I mean, think back to the Phantom Lord arc where Gray fights your precious juvia, where Gray declares loudly and proudly that he'd die to save Lucy from them. I'd say that's plenty direct, especially since juvia (though she's an idiot so I wouldn't put much purport to this) mistook his passion for romantic love for Lucy. Also think to how viscerally and visibly angry Natsu, Erza, AND Gray were when Sabertooth's Minerva was brutalizing Lucy in the GMG, and how both Gray and Natsu ran out onto the field in front of everyone to catch her. These are only a couple of examples, but Gray has no issue showing how much he cares for people, even publicly.

It's just more awkward for him to tell these things to his dude friend, especially with a dude friend he bickers with jokingly for the most part, especially when the situation isn't exactly dire yet.

Onto the next point:

"Another example of Gray’s tsundereness was when he first met Erza. He acted tsundere with her too, being antagonist towards her, while obviously caring about her feelings, but trying his best to hide it:"

I feel like here, Author is just misreading it, which I don't blame them since they're only looking at these panels, but to get the full picture, they need to look beyond these panels and at the entire chapter/episode. If you do, you'll see that Gray doesn't "care for Erza's feelings" as soon as he meets her. He's actually annoyed by her and fights with her and picks on her from the get-go because of how standoffish she acts.

He's not acting tsundere here; he's genuinely surprised to see her cry for the first time. He's totally thrown off guard since he's used to her just putting 'em up and fighting him back. He definitely wasn't prepared for her to show her vulnerable side. I don't think the trembles and the nervous sweats show him desperately trying to hide any semblance of sympathy, I think he's just seriously surprised by this turn of events and is woefully unprepared and nervous to deal with a pretty girl crying, and then of course he has to deal with expressing his sympathy, but I definitely don't think hiding the sympathy was the first thing on his mind or even the first instinctual thing he did. The first thing he did was ask her why she's always on her own. He immediately dives right into the deep questions, showing his natural kind side.

Author segues from that into:

"In fact, Gray makes a speech during the TOH arc about how Erza has to be in FT so she wont cry. Do you think Gray EVER told Erza any of this? Not likely."

Sigh.

I'm sorry, but a guy not telling a girl that he doesn't want her to cry doesn't mean he's a tsundere. You see, being a tsundere means you normally act cold and harsh to someone. Gray doesn't with Erza, he just jokes around with her and is usually scared of her, but he's showed plenty that he actually cares for her. Just because he doesn't tell her all his heartfelt emotions about how much he (platonically) loves her doesn't mean he's being a tsundere. I think people forget how guys are in general, not that they act as a monolith, of course, but it's a definite theme amongst men to be more closed off with your emotions, which doesn't necessarily mean you're actively hiding them and covering them up by acting mean and cold like tsunderes do.

In addition, I've already said in Part 1 that you can't take "not talking about your feelings" as equaling tsundere because again, that would mean most everyone in the Fairy Tail universe is a tsundere because no one talks about their feelings all the time except in dire straits like what is depicted in the picture above.

Another segue:

"But again, in comparison, Natsu has no problem saying things directly to Erza in the very same arc, and crying in front of her. Natsu can be immature sometimes, but he’s no tsundere. Gray, however, IS."

IIII just don't get it.

Without even trying to attack them, I honestly feel like Author hasn't read or watched most of Fairy Tail. At the very least, they’ve forgotten most of it. Gray cried for Ur right in front of Natsu, Happy, and Lucy in the Galuna Arc before Natsu ever did. He cries again in front of them when he sees Ultear's sacrifice. And of course, Pros would never forget Gray breaking down crying at his father's grave. And he has very plainly shown how much he cares for his friends on a regular basis, literally in every arc. His anger and his passion to protect them is honestly on full display every fight.

I've already addressed this earlier in this post anyway, but anyway one last thing before I move on, I just have to say that Gray is such expressive character that I am quite actually baffled that viewers could see him and immediately think he's a closed off, harsh, cold-acting tsundere. In my next watch through, I'll be sure to pay more attention to those moments where Gray is being super expressive so I can list them all off, but seriously, that's what these Pros need to be doing, to actually take some time to analyze Gray's behavior and his responses to juvia's actions. Maybe then they'll realize how off-putting and toxic she is, and that maybe before Gray was brainwashed by Mashima, he reacted in a way that made sense and was honest considering those facts.

Onto the next point:

"And of course, he acted like a little brat with Ur, and lashed out at her, even though she was like a second mother to him, and took care of him. But, of course he cared for her, even before her sacrifice. He was just hurt. As Ur said, there was darkness in his heart because of what happened with Deliora, and she sealed that away for him, but his tsundere quality remained lol. ^-^"

Oh goodness... This point actually made me sad...

Now Pros are trying to say that “the only reason why Gray would possibly reject juvia's disturbing advances is because of how Deliora traumatically scarred him by taking away everyone he loved, which made him into a tsundere”?...

I am almost at a loss for words...

This is beyond delusional. How could they just completely ignore juvia's glaring, toxic, abusive faults and go right to "Oh, well trauma is the only reason Gray wouldn't wanna shack up with someone as wonderful as juvia-sama despite the fact that she ignores consent, she ignores privacy, she ignores Gray's desires and goals, she hates everything he loves, and she just wants herself to be happy"??? This is legit juvia-level delusion, and it's a bit frightening.

I also hate that Author reduced the immensely and deeply and irrevocably traumatized Gray to just “acting like a brat” as well. It’s awful. It just goes to show you how lots of Pros aren’t Gray fans at all, just juvia fans.

To be honest, though, despite all that, this is the closest we've gotten to Gray acting like a tsundere. Here, he does act harsh and temperamental, and he took out his anger and his anguish and his hurt that he got from losing his family on Ur, despite him clearly caring for her at the end and being heartbroken that she sacrificed herself for him.

However, I still don’t think this is an example of Gray being a tsundere.

If I were to split hairs, one could argue that it was this moment where Gray started to care for her, or at least realized it, after seeing what lengths she was willing to go for him, and therefore, he wasn't just acting cold to hide his familial feelings towards her, though I will admit that's probably a reach.

To go a different route, though, this just isn't a case where, quoting one of the definitions of tsundere, "They will occasionally let slip their warm and loving feelings hidden inside. They hide their feelings due to being shy, nervous, insecure." All 3 definitions say it's a gradual process of showing warmer feelings, but right up until the very end, Gray was completely hostile towards Ur. There was nothing gradual about the abrupt wake-up call that was Gray realizing that his mistake would cost this woman, whom he should've felt gratitude towards, her life.

And clearly, Gray was only acting harsh and cold and temperamental because he was just misdirecting his negative feelings at Deliora towards Ur. As a little kid, he didn’t have great control of his emotions, as little kids don’t, and with the great loss he had, he needed an outlet, a scapegoat, and he settled on making Ur his emotional punching bag. He hated Deliora, he hated life for taking away everything he loved, so he projected that hate onto the only person he could express that hate towards: Ur. Acting harsh and cold and temperamental doesn’t mean you’re a tsundere: it could just mean you’re a traumatized individual who desperately needs an outlet to express your grief and anguish. Gray wasn’t “being a tsundere” because “that’s his character trait where he’s just socially awkward and therefore can’t express his feelings”, he was just lashing out at the world that wronged him so badly.

[[And remember at the very beginning of this post, where I said I'd get back to something? Well, it was the translation of the 413 days quote where it said "This will be the first time Gray shows this side of himself" with the picture of Gray making a "tsundere" face. If we're going to take Mashima's word for it, wouldn't it not make sense that Gray has always been a tsundere since he was a kid, as Author suggests here and in the chapter where kid Gray confronts kid Erza, and yet he only acts apparently like a tsundere for the first time in the 413 days chapter?

Something isn't consistent with the facts, and I believe it's Author's assertions. How could Gray “be acting like a tsundere, being a tsundere,” throughout his life, and yet he only starts to act like it in 413 Days?? Either way, it doesn't matter to me because I don't think Gray is acting like a tsundere in 413 days either, nor here with Ur nor with Erza, but it just goes to show how even the text itself disagrees with Author, and it shows that Author’s conclusions are not actually coming from canon material.]]

I'd definitely have to rewatch it and get more insight on it because it's already been a year since my last rewatch, but these are my thoughts on it for now. Please do give me your thoughts on this, or on anything, dear readers!

Anyway, even if Gray was acting a mite tsundere here, and that's a huge if, that doesn't necessitate that Gray would stay that way his whole life, especially considering the impact Ur had on sealing the darkness for him.

To wrap this portion up, I find it rather nutty that Author decided to take Deliora's trauma as the reason for Gray's supposed tsundere-ness, and that they even acknowledged that Ur was sealing away the darkness, and yet they decided to cherry pick what the trauma affected and what part of the trauma stayed and to claim that Gray's now a tsundere in his romantic and platonic pursuits (despite him showing he's definitely not at the very least in the latter case). I wish I knew a psychologist who could analyze Gray (though I've heard from a friend that they showed juvia's profile to a psychology professor and they came to the conclusion that she's actually insane which is fun.)

Onto the next point:

"He even acts tsundere with Lyon. He insults him and is antagonistic towards him all the time, and sees him as a rival, but he clearly loves him like a brother (and in fact, Lyon is the same way, as we saw how broken up he was when Gray died)."

Again, Author doesn't understand the bond of bros. I'm like this with my own brothers: insults are the norm even though we love each other. I think this is how most young guys are too actually. Maybe Author hasn't been around enough guys to understand that.

I suppose that's focusing too much on "personal experiences", but I don't know how to mention it besides saying that that's just the culture of many young men... I don't know what Author expected, that all the guys who aren't tsunderes would have heart-to-hearts on the daily about their feelings and how much they love each other?

But anyway, about what they said. I think Author's words here even agree with my stance on this subject. "He insults him and is antagonistic towards him all the time, and sees him as a rival, but he clearly loves him like a brother". You see... Isn't a tsundere supposed to be warming up to their person of interest? Immediately after their fight on Galuna Island, they showed they did still care for each other. There wasn't really anything gradual, they just had to settle this "disagreement" and to settle the long-standing resentments.

What's more, you have to stay logically consistent, Author.

You said before "But again, in comparison, Natsu has no problem saying things directly to Erza in the very same arc, and crying in front of her. Natsu can be immature sometimes, but he’s no tsundere" and yet you say here that Lyon is the same way (i.e. is a tsundere) like Gray.

Thing is, Natsu has the same exact dynamic with Gray that Gray and Lyon have; they insult, they bicker, they brawl, and they have each other's backs. And yet you acknowledge that Natsu is definitely NOT a tsundere, so why the heck is this proof that both Gray and Lyon are tsunderes? They both make their own feelings clear when it counts, just like Natsu. It's not like Natsu, whom as you mentioned is totally fine with declaring his feelings for his friends, says all those heartfelt things in regular day-to-day life, just out of the blue, like "Erza, you mean the world to me", or "Lucy, I would die for you a million times over," or "Happy, I'd give my left nut to be your friend forever" etc. etc. Gray, and even Lyon for that matter, will say those heartfelt things when the moment is right, just like Natsu does.

AGAIN, by this faulty definition, everyone is a tsundere. Because Erza knocks Gray's and Natsu's heads together on a regular basis, but she loves them, and generally does it for their own good. Lucy will tell the boys to put a sock in it if they're getting out of hand or will send them flying with a Lucy kick for intruding in her house, but she also loves them dearly. And Happy will say the most out of pocket stuff, especially to Lucy, and yet this is all in good fun. They're not purposefully acting harsh or cold, especially not to hide the fact that they actually love each other, and especially not because of a character trait that makes it particularly hard to express their true feelings, they're just acting as friends do in light-hearted times. For the most part, they just hang and chill and laugh as friends should, and what's more, they really do build each other up, even if it's through insults that get Gray and Natsu fired up to compete with their magic.

(No one better bring up juvia and say "oh well juvia also jokes around and doesn't actually hate other girls" because she's never joking in the slightest and she actively tries to drive other women away through her glares and her muttering and tries to demean them for daring to be in the same vicinity as Gray. Nothing about what she does is uplifting, the only feelings she's feeling in these moments are misplaced and manic jealousy, prejudiced hostility, and severe insecurity, and she literally shows that she legit would wish harm on others just so she could get near Gray, and has actually tried to kill women who get too close to Gray as well as Gray himself, so this is NOT the same thing. That's no friend.)

Almost done:

"Again, he is HARSH and TSUNDERE towards those he cares the most about. He has insulted Natsu, Lyon, Ur, Erza (calls her a monster) and JUVIA. And, he also is embarrassed when his true feelings come to the surface, and tries hard to keep them private. He doesn’t want people to know HOW MUCH he cares, and because of that, he rarely talks about his feelings to anyone, let alone directly to the person he’s having those feelings for. This is classic tsundere behavior. "

This is the same quote that I'd shown in the very beginning (in Part 1).

Something I'm just noticing now is that Author specifically doesn't include Lucy in the list of people he cares most about. This could be one of a few things or even all of them, but a common trend I've seen among Pros is that they're threatened by Lucy's healthy and solid relationship with Gray so they try to pretend they're not the best of friends.

Another reason for not including her might just be that Gray's relationship with Lucy just doesn't support their narrative. He's definitely not mean to her, though he does keep her vanity in check sometimes, but he shows that he cares for her even from the beginning, from being willing to stake his life to rescue her, to making sure she got home safe since there was a stalker following her around, to, again, since I love this scene so much, the GMG scene where he runs out in front of everyone to catch her and save her from more injury, to his and Lucy's heartfelt conversation after the Avatar arc, to how much time they spend together talking and hanging out. Nothing about his actions towards her is tsundere, so Author can't include her in the list of people Gray loves most because it doesn't coincide with their argument, like so many other things.

Anyway, moving past best girl Lucy reluctantly, I'd love to learn the reasons why Author thinks Gray's cared about juvia "the most" since the beginning. Remember, this Author has been trying to prove Gray's had this tsundere-ness since he was kid in order to prove that all of Gray's rejections of juvia are simply him being too uwu shy uwu to admit he actually loves her and that he's actually liked her this whole time. I've been talking about this in some wonderful recent asks I've gotten, how juvia is quite decidedly not Gray's type considering all the women he's cared about in his life, and I'd genuinely want to hear what reasons Pros could think up that would explain what made Gray fall for the crazy, selfish weirdo who doesn't care about friends like he does, and who certainly doesn't care for Gray's emotional and psychological well-being.

As for the rest of this paragraph, I've already talked about how not talking about your innermost feelings with people on a daily basis doesn't make you a tsundere. I've repeated myself enough.

The last pertinent bit and Conclusion:

"That’s why I also think that anyone at this point who sees Gray’s actions as someone who simply does not return Juvia’s feelings, is someone who is letting their bias cloud their judgement. The evidence for Gray’s feelings towards Juvia has been mounting since at least the Tenroujima arc. To not see where things are clearly headed between them, is just to be in denial. By all means, ship what you like, but don’t deny a blatant character trait, because you don’t like what it implies for something you don’t ship."

I hope my readers could tell me if I'm letting my bias control how I look at all these scenarios. At one point, I was struggling to put my thoughts to paper so to speak, so this post could definitely use some polishing and outside critiques.

In all honesty, though, I don't think I'm letting my bias cloud my judgment. I did my best to look at each instance objectively and to try to stay consistent with my reasoning.

I personally think this Pro as well as Pros like them are letting bias cloud their judgment in terms of how Gray is literally being emotionally, psychologically, and physically abused by juvia and by their contrived, unhealthy, toxic relationship.

Their last words are kind of aggravating, to be perfectly transparent. They are definitely entitled to their opinion. I for one can't complain because I have similar feelings about certain Pros myself. However, it's just insane the amount of hypocrisy in this last paragraph. I've already mentioned the hypocrisy once in this post, but man, cast the first stone, will you? So many Pros continue to be in denial of just how damaging this relationship is for both characters, really, and some Pros would just rather point fingers at everyone else who has even the slightest issue or who points out the slightest discrepancy or criticism and claim we're the crazy ones.

We always knew where the ship was going to be headed (cough headed to hell) because of the might of the Pro fandom. Obviously, Pros wouldn't accept anything less than marriage with 55 babies between the two of them. (Yes, hyperbole, you get my point.) I for one am not in denial that they're an item now in 100yq. My argument is simply that Gray hasn't loved juvia all this time, that he hasn't been a consenting and willing participant in juvia's madness that she calls romancing, and that the only reason he's with juvia now is because of the infinite manipulating and peer pressuring and gaslighting that happened up until this point. That, and Mashima's awful writing and similar peer-pressured self when it comes to this forsaken ship.

All I have to say is, in the words of this Pro Author, don’t deny a blatant character trait. Don't deny juvia's toxicity and abuse. Don't deny the harm she's inflicted upon Gray's psyche. And then we can finally really have a talk on why you support her.

Here's the link for Part 3 of this post!

(Feedback on anything in this post is appreciated!)

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