#also the only people who dislike her are e/riels

[famouscyclenerd]

If you forget about Gwyn after (actually) reading A Court of Silver Flames...

Where Gwyn is Nesta's first proper friend. She is the first to sign up for training. Where they make friendship bracelets together and have sleepovers. Where they train together almost everyday and become valkyries. Where Gwyn is the first to cut the ribbon. Where they went into the blood rite and won it together. Where Gwyn confesses to Nesta and Emerie about her struggles with losing her twin sister and the guilt she feels surrounding it. How she still refuses to wear the stone because she doesn't feel worthy of it. Where it ended with Sarah telling us that even though Gwyn would love to do more, she still went back to the library. Handing us that shit on a silverplatter that Gwyn's journey is not yet over.

Where, in Az' bonus chapter, she was in the second half of it, smiling at his shadows and teasing him. Where it ended with Az thinking about her (Gwyn), and her joy and how he had to stop himself from smiling when he thought of her teal eyes.

...Then maybe... you just.... didn't.... read the book... nor the bc...

[venusin-aries]

Anti’s coming into the Gwyneth Berdara tag and accusing Gwynriel’s of the mischaracterization of Gwyn or only liking Gwyn because of Gwynriel is fucking LAUGHABLE. 

All I've seen are posts singing praises about Gwyn (just Gwyn!) and I have NOT ONCE seen a Gwynriel shipper characterize Gwyn wrongly.

What are we mischaracterizing her for? 

Being brave as fuck for choosing to train to be a Valkyrie? Nesta’s admiration and fondness of her? For saying she’s resilient for being able to enjoy herself and laugh with her friends after experiencing some fucked up shit? THAT SHE'S LIKABLE?? Being strategic and patient FOR DAYS and spying on the Illaryian males before sending the beasts after them ruthlessly? Being smart and witty? Her interests in sex and smut and stating she doesn’t want to be coddled? Her willingness to sacrifice herself on the bridge? Her determination to finish the blood rite even though she was injured as fuck? Her unwavering loyalty toward Nesta and Emerie? That Nesta thinks her beauty is comparable to Mor and Merrill?

The fact that she’s not judgemental and she immediately accepted Nesta when they were sharing their stories? Her own struggle with guilt and self hate? Her immediately witnessing what Azriel is capable of when they first met? Azriel’s shadows reacting POSITIVELY towards her and yeah, the thought of her joy glowing in his chest? That she teases him and challenges him? That she hasn't seen him torture someone yet but she's seen worse shit soooo why would she be fazed??

She's canonly more suitable for Azriel than anybody else in the series and THAT'S why people dislike her as a character even though on her own she's a great character.

Those are only SOME of her positives we got in ONE book. Notice, some of those positives include Azriel, but most don’t 🤷🏻‍♀️. 

Allllllll of those points have textual evidence to support them. And these are allllllll the points Gwynriel shippers love to make about her. 

The only charactization of her anti’s will accept is if she goes back to the library, stays there and is never seen or heard of in canon again. Or if she’s evil which she’s likely not going to be. Stop being so petty. If anything SJM has her set up for a HEALING journey. 

However some people obviously like to see a female character STAY broken and let her trauma define her.

Getting mad when she's so obviously such a fun character? She has fun and laughs and teases her friends and Cassian and Azriel and enjoys herself but there's something wrong with that and you think its annoying????

Fanon Gwyn and Canon Gwyn are basically the same. If you don’t like fanon Gwyn, you probably don’t like canon Gwyn and that’s fine, whatever, I think you have totally shit taste but whatever just STAY OUT OF THE GWYNETH BERDARA TAG.

I see the shit ya'll tag and then delete.

I’m a Gwyn stan first and foremost but I have not seen one single other Gwynriel shipper mischaracterize her. 

Fanon is fun until it melts your brain and you start believing ONLY fanon and wrongly remembering canon and then attacking others for using canon to support their points. 

It’s crazy to me that anti’s can dislike a fictional character so much that the idea of potentially seeing more of said character in the canon universe and getting more fandom love honestly upsets them.

Like holy shit, I don’t like E/riel, but I have enough tact not to take that out on either Elain OR Azriel. And I don’t go looking to start shit with shippers because I'm not pathetic. Too bad some people can’t extend that same class to Gwyn. 

Also, I feel like some people forget about this fucking scene. 

Gwyn studied Ramiel's craggy, unforgiving slope. Not much snow graced its sides. Like the wind had whipped it all away. Or the storms had avoided its peak entirely. “Is it living, though? To take the safe road?”

“You’re the one who's been living in a library for two years,” Emerie said.

Gwyn didn't flinch. “I have. And I am tired of it.” She surveyed the blood-soaked leather along her thigh. “I don't want to take the safe road.” She pointed to the mountain, to the slender path upward. “I want to take that road.” Her voice thickened. “I want to take the road that no one dares travel, and I want to travel it with you two. No matter what may befall us. Not as Illyrians, not for their titles, but as something new. To prove to them, to everyone, that something new and different might triumph over their rules and restrictions.”

A cold wind blew off Ramiel's sides. 

Whispering, murmuring.

“They call this climb the Breaking for a reason,”Emerie countered gravely.

Nesta added, “Wehaven't eaten in days. We're down to the last of our water. To climb that mountain-“

“I have been broken once before,” Gwyn said, her voice clear. “I survived it. And I will not be broken again- not even by this mountain.”

Look at me and tell me this is a character we’ll never hear from again. Go right a fucking head. 

You can't come into the Gwyneth Berdara tag claiming we mischaracterize her. We take her as is. No need to pick her apart or give her little unnecessary traits to fit her better with any one.

It's not possible to make her out to be something she's not when every little thing we love about her is canon.

You can be salty over us comparing Bryce/Hunt and Azriel/Gwyn but oh wait! SJM uses similar language to describe them ON PURPOSE in canon as fucking well!!!

On purpose.

In fucking canon.

But we’re reaching.

Do not come into the Gwyneth Berdara tag and say Gwynriel’s make it hard to like her but oh, you do like her you do! And then go on to say she’s nothing more special than a Valkyrie or Nesta’s friend. Yeah, I fucking saw that shit.

People are weirdly jealous over a ship/inspiring character a lot of people relate to.

Gwyn is not stealing Azriel from any one because there’s NO ONE to steal him from.

These character's are fake but the hate and vitriol ya'll are spewing at people who like her are very real.

Just stay out of the Gwyneth Berdara tag if you don't like her.

[acourtofthought]

Your posts about Vassa almost always end up pitting her against Elain, and implying that she’s lesser than her, or not good enough for Lucien. You insinuate that Elain is a much more desirable woman, when the reality is, Elain is easily the character people in the fandom dislike the most - often even more than Tamlin. Even a good chunk of Gwynriel’s dislike (or are neutral towards) Elain.

Even Lucien seems more fond of Vassa, and the beauty is: he doesn’t need a pre-arranged, non-consensual, mating bond to want to save Vassa, or to laugh with her, or to want to live with her. Lucien and Vassa are pulled together of their own volition.

And what happens when Vassa becomes a more prominent character in future books? SJM has spoken about wanting to retell the Vasilisa, firebird and Swan Lake fairytales. Her Pinterest board reflects this. Gwyn became a fan favorite in just one book… the same can happen with Vassa. Given what we’ve seen of her personality so far (confident, brave, carefree), I’d say that would happen very easily.

And consider this: as I just mentioned, SJM is planning a Vasilisa, firebird and Swan Lake retelling. This is very clearly about Vassa… so why would she just be a side character in someone else’s book?

Thus, the only way for Vassa’s story to be told is her as the main character, alongside Lucien — a character readers have been familiar with since book 1, and who everyone knows and loves. In comparison… most casual readers would have no idea who Jurian is (or just remember him as the abusive, stalkerish, eye guy - does anyone even want to read about him as a love interest? 🥴).

A Vassa x Jurian novel is unlikely. A Vassa x Lucien novel, however, would make sense. 😏

So what I'm to understand is a side character can't have their story told in someone else's book?

That's so weird then, how Sarah made sure to include in the actual book a phrase stating how Gwyn's story is worth telling yet somehow she can't have her own book according to e/riels because she is and only ever will be a side character!

And you're right, my posts end up "pitting Vassa against Elain" because my posts are typically in response to those such as yourself coming here trying to prove why Vassa is better for Lucien than his own mate. It doesn't matter if the fandom would date her, it matters who her best match in this fictional world is.

Also, I think she's doing just fine with her desirability in the series considering who her two love interests have been 🤦

But my posts are not pitting Vassa and Elain against one another as individuals, they're explaining why Elain is in fact better for Lucien than Vassa. Pointing out how it's Elain he looks at with longing, not Vassa.

I'm fairly sure if I was oh so lucky to look over your page and liked posts you'd have plenty on there pitting Lucien against Azriel.

Come now, please don't honestly think you can insult my intelligence with your gaslighting.

I think many struggle with Elain's character but that is typically a byproduct of the ship war and how some Gwynriels have been forced to choke down a version of Elain that doesn't actually exist in canon.

People don't actually like Vassa more than Elain because many don't think much about her as a real contender for Lucien's affections. They don't think much on her outside of the very specific role she's played so far.

It's easy to like or feel neutral towards a one dimensional side character because that's really all Vassa is right now. They accept her as being there and accept her as someone who isn't a villain just as they accept Viviane as being there and not a villain but that doesn't mean they actually adore Vassa and can't wait for her to receive a main pov to the point that they want her story with Lucien over an Elucien one.

And yes, SJM is building to something, she's clearly been cursed by Koschei but guess what? Dorians father was cursed by a Valg prince and played an enormous role in the TOG series yet he never took off as anything more than a side character either. He never received a book or his own pov.

If you haven't noticed, SJM already explored the Firebird fairytale when she wrote about Vassa's curse. Some seem to think Sarah goes into a lot of depth with her retellings but she's on record calling them a retelling "light". How much of Hades and Persephone was obvious for Feysand? How much of Beauty and the Beast Feyre and Tamlin? TOG was Cinderella, was it obvious?

She does not need to dedicate an entire book with a Vassa pov for her to explore the fairytale to the depth which she explores most fairytales. Vassa is already written to have a "Russian" accent and we know of her curse which will be broken by someone other than her and probably not Lucien considering neither Helion or Feyre could detect a spell to be broken.

Lucien is not pulled to Vassa of own violation, he went because he had no where else to go:

And if you think it's more beautiful for a couple to be together without a bond than (come a little closer, I want to tell you something) ACOTAR IS NOT FOR YOU - SJM IS A FATED MATES AUTHOR!).

If you don't think fated mates makes for a beautiful love story than what the fuck are you doing here?

And to your point, if a side character can become a fan favorite in one book than why can't Vassa and Jurian receive their own book one day? Where Jurian, also a side character and Vassa have their own love story in the ACOTAR series?

Also, does it matter if Elain is a fan favorite when Sarah seems to like her considering she is on record saying Elain will be getting her own book, how she likes to garden like Elain and would be best friends with Elain in real life? (Nesta wasn't a fan favorite before SF and Sarah said she knew people weren't going to like her yet that's the story she felt she wanted to tell).

Why would the author take a character who could be a best friend in real life, mate her to a male who she wrote to be like Jamie Fraser and who Sarah has also said is one of her favorites yet give them a broken bond that will trail them for their entire lives just so Lucien can end up with a human who literally does not have any interest in the fae world and pays more attention to Jurian because of all the "at each other's throats" bickering they do? That doesn't sound very happy for Lucien at all.

Also, no one knows who Jurian is? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

You're joking, right?

Jurian who was in book 1, who was resurrected in book 2 and "worked" for the King, shot an ash arrow through Az, was there when the sisters were turned, played a prominent role in Spring in ACOWAR, turned out to be a double agent, that Jurian??? The Jurian who was in the war with Mor and Rhys 500 years ago? The Jurian who had way more page time than Vassa yet you think people don't know who he is? The Jurian who shares the same vision as Vassa for leading the humans. The one who is iconic for sitting on a pink couch. The Jurian who would be crowned King because he's keeping everything running and Lucien says he's thankful for him?

You're right, I've got no clue who that guy is. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Penny for your thoughts, if Vassa was clearly meant to have a book with Lucien, than why do you suppose SJM said this?

The second book had to be Elain's at this time, correct? Because in that exact same interview she wrote how she'd already done research for Elain's book. And she was "keeping the door open after that".

That means Vassa was never guaranteed to get her own book. That logically means Koschei was always going to be resolved in the book after Nesta's because she wouldn't just keep him hanging unresolved in the background while she decided who she'd write about after Elain's book.

I guess Sarah never planned on putting as much effort into that Firebird fairytale as you seem to be trying to convince yourself.

[freyjas-musings]

Personally, as of right now I can't see Azriel with either Gwyn or Elain. I definitely think the next book will be Azriel's but I don't find myself rooting for either ship because we weren’t given enough interactions between Azriel and Elain or Az and Gwyn. Since CC 3 is coming out before ACOTAR 5, I'm hoping that will change and we get more details so we can paint a clearer picture.

I do find myself leaning more toward the Gwynriel side, though. Mostly because I like Gwyn more than Elain, not because I prefer either of them with Az (I'd much rather he end up with me lmao). I don’t dislike Elain, but after ACOSAF and seeing how unsupportive she was of Nesta, she left a bad taste in my mouth. It quite literally felt like she was "abandoning" her for Feyra because Nesta was the underdog now, and after everything Nesta had done for her!

I have looked at theories from both sides, and I find the E/riel ones veery far fetched and overall not convincing. But there are two points that keep making me question my belief that Az is gonna end up with Gwyn.

1. That there were two bonus scenes, I will talk about the Feyra and Rhys one. Their conversation seems to be centered around Elain, so that gives me a pause cause why would Sarah just have them randomly talk about her on their bonus scene if she'snot gonna play a major role in the next book?

2. Until Azriel's bonus scene I would’ve never thought there was something romantic between Gwyn and Azriel. So my question is, why wait to give such crucial story details in a bonus scene that most of the avarage readers will likely never read?

I'm not a very meticulous reader, I skim quite a bit, so the fact that I didn’t sense anything brewing between Gwyn and Az throughout ACOSF is on me. I went back and reread their interactions after the bonus scene, and I could sense something there, but not much. I have read a lot of theories on here and the Gwynriel ones sound more convincing to me, the only two things I mentioned above keep me unsure.

Gahh, I can't wait until the next book is out, I'm driving myself mad over here. Miss Sarah sure knows how to capture our attention. I hope Gwynriel happens!

Hey , I just read what you wrote . I understand where you are coming from , it is true that Azriel's interaction with both Elain and Gwyn are limited but I do believe SJM gave us an indication of how the story is going in the bonus and I do believe Gwynriel is end game atleast thats how I see things progressing .

My reason for shipping Gwynriel has absolutely no connection to Elain at all . While I do agree her behaviour with Nesta was cruel and selfish... there are some beautiful qualities about Elain too ... her ability to see a silver lining in the worst situations is one of them. Having flaws is what makes these characters interesting, every single archeron sister is flawed whether it was Feyre while destroying the spring court or Nesta with the way she hurt people around including the way she treated Feyre as a child (while I see why she did it , it doesn't mean it wasn't wrong ) or Elain who is selfish and manipulative , its the Elriels who make Elain unbearable but its important to remember its fanon Elain not Canon.

Why do I ship Gwynriel ? Their potential as a couple is amazing if you look at their individual characters and what they can do for each other it makes for a compelling ship . Honestly I saw crumbs of Gwynriel through out ACOSF not just the bonus , as you read more SJM books you start seeing a pattern and they sure do check all of the end game requirements. Also, there is the whole mate thing that is most likely going to happen and I am interested to see their story.

I wouldn't hold my breath about any indication in CC3 for ship confirmations, while I do think it will be clearer than ever that it will be Azriels book next if some of this fandom hasn't realised it yet I doubt they will realise it then (remember SJMs latest interview where she clearly said Elain in "some form" making it obvious she won't get a POV yet people screamed otherwise) .

As far as the bonus of Feyre and Rhys goes all I got there was , there is more to Elain than what meets the eye she is not all sweet and kind. There is indication that she might do something (getting her hands dirty and hurting herself in the process ) that might hurt the people around her while I don't believe she is evil, she may be misguided . We have to understand SJM will need to set her up for her book so we will get more of her story in " SOME FORM" . I am not really worried about that meaning anything in terms of Gywnriel.

Am I a 100% sure it is Gwynriel? No , because I am not SJM .... but I am 99% sure based on my reading comprehension and from reading all of SJMs books that it will be Gwynriel 🙂...

[bookishlilcorner]

B, C, D for the fandom ask thing ❤

Thank you for asking 💕

B - A pairing you initially didn’t consider but someone changed your mind

It’s more of a crackship, but Nesta x Azriel never crossed my mind until I read a post about them and I kind of like it a lot. Bitchy ice queen x quiet shadow man who understands her rage is quite an interesting pairing to me. I think it’s the way they just gets each other without talking that is making me like it. (It’s not my favourite ship by far, but the idea is interesting)

C - A pairing you have never liked and probably never will

E/riel without any doubts. I never understood how people read their interactions as romantic before the acosf bonus chapter. I never saw it. I remember when only acowar was out and people were shipping them and I was the most confused person on earth because I always saw their interactions as similar to Cassian and Feyre’s. And I probably will never ship them not only for that reason, but also because of how a lot of their shippers act.

D - A pairing you wish you liked but just can’t

I racked my brain about this, but I truly don’t think I have one. I either like, dislike or am neutral about ships.

[bookofmirth]

E/riels are claiming we dislike any theory of Elain that makes her powerful (for example: Spy Elain, Elain defeating Koschei (???), Elain/Az ruling the Dusk Court.) Huh....? I'm pretty sure most of us want to see Elain thrive without her sisters and the IC coddling her, and make friends outside the NC. All the books have been mostly confined to Night or Spring, so wouldn't it make sense to have a different setting at some point?

Personally, I dislike any theory that goes against what we know to be consistent with Elain's character (being a spy or doing anything that could require violence, since she clearly abhors it) or is based on things that aren't canon (the Dusk Court). The main one that annoys me is theories that would require her to start acting ooc, though.

Personally, I think that Elain will:

Be a High Lady or mated to a High Lord/future HL by the end of the series, giving her a position of political power.

Have major diplomatic sway in some way, shape or form. This is consistent with her ability to see what people need and persuade them to her cause. Again, political power.

Retain her seer powers and not only that, but will have better understanding and control of them. Magic power.

Will learn to assert herself, including her wants and needs, to people who had previously underestimated her. Personal agency/power.

I also think she will have a role in saving Vassa - not in defeating Koschei by herself, because Koschei is a much, much bigger issue that everyone in Prythian needs to get in on, and would require skills that Elain does not possess and does not want to possess. But I think that Elain will help to free Vassa, and discover a lot about herself in the process. And hey, maybe her diplomatic skills and seer powers could make her play a major role in actually defeating Koschei! But she's not gonna charge in there like a one-woman army.

People can say all the crap they want about others' ideas. In fact that seems to be the main fandom pastime lately. Talking shit about each other. Doesn't make their mischaracterization of those ideas true.

[highfaelucien]

I completely agree with how you feel towards azriel. Thinking about azriel’s character now vs how I used to view him during acomaf times is just... sad and so so so much more complex. Part of me still wants to love him for the character that was presented to us in acomaf and other small good moments, like his friendship with nesta. And then the other part of me is disgusted, disappointed, and honestly kind of terrified of who he may become if sjm allows him to continue acting predatorily/toxic. The whole mor/az situation really fucked me up. As someone who is also a lesbian and an abuse survivor, it broke my heart to watch the situation unfold in acowar. It still hurts seeing many readers (and sometimes even sjm) take az’s side and paint mor as some sort of liar/two faced character that is playing everyone. I kept thinking that things would be fixed in future books, but instead az has grown worse and mor was, once again, sidelined and written out as a character. And honestly... as much as I love the idea of gwyn x azriel ... I think his books would need a lot more focus on his own recovery/growth and not center on a romantic relationship. If anything, I hope it’s written as friends to lovers so az has a better way of interacting and forming relationships with women. Because right now... well, that shit is borderline predatory and isn’t coming across well. And I really really do not want that for him. Basically, azriel deserves a better arc than what has been written for him. I miss him :( he used to be a character that made me feel safe and now :/ idk anymore

I'm going to quote parts of this/chop it up and reply to them a chunk at a time. because there's a lot going on here and I want to try and reply to as much as I can because I resonate with.....all of it. Please forgive me for the length of this.

I completely agree with how you feel towards azriel. Thinking about azriel’s character now vs how I used to view him during acomaf times is just... sad and so so so much more complex.

He feels like a different character? There was always an anger simmering under the calm surface, we knew that. But it was an anger born of love, deep down, and the desire to protect his family, and his court, at the expense of himself. Az was always the first to volunteer himself for dangerous missions, to spare the others.

Now that anger is directed at his family, and at the world, for not giving him what he feels he 'deserves'. That has NEVER been Azriel. Azriel's deepest issues and insecurities have always stemmed from the feeling of being unworthy, and undeserving of anything.

She's just made him into......Every other dude in this series tbh. Snarling, and possessive, and wanting to fuck anything in a skirt that moves.

Azriel was actually somewhat of an original, complex character initially. It's unusual that we see trauma affect men in the way it did Az. Usually it makes them angry, and vengeful, and eager to prove they are the alpha etc. Seeing them withdraw, and think less of themselves/that they're unworthy is something not explored often enough. But bye bye nuance hello #Drama.

Part of me still wants to love him for the character that was presented to us in acomaf and other small good moments, like his friendship with nesta.

I feel this. I found a lot of comfort in Az's character. Particularly the way he reacted with Mor. I was a big fan of their relationship, and I wrote a few 'missing scenes' style fics in the gap between ACOMAF and ACOWAR. One of them was where Az went to her when she had pushed everyone else away, including Cassian, and comforted and calmed her.

I hate that Maas took that away from Mor. I hate that Az no longer does that for her. I hate that Az was the one to betray her along with Rhys and bring her abuser into her safe space behind her back. I hate that he is no longer a symbol of calm, stable, dependable comfort and support for Mor, but is instead a threat. I HATE it.

Every now and then Az has lovely, gentle moments - his friendship with Nesta is a good example, and something I hoped we'd see. But also quieter times with Rhys, and their similarities being explored. And I adored the flying lessons with Feyre in ACOWAR, and the training he did with Cassian and the others in ACOFS.

But then she goes and twists him and does something else that just makes me want to fucking scream. Like the High Lord scene where he 'frightened' Mor. And his entire POV chapter which is frankly fucking gross.

And then the other part of me is disgusted, disappointed, and honestly kind of terrified of who he may become if sjm allows him to continue acting predatorily/toxic.

I agree.

I don't know how she can write a series that explores the effects of emotional abuse so well with Feyre and Tamlin...And then write what she did with Az?

The possession to a traumatised, still impressionable and desperate young woman, who likely finds the same comfort and safety in him that Mor did. Before that got shot to fucking pieces.

He sounds like a whiny toddler 'Cassian has a mate, and Rhys has a mate, where is mine!?!?!?!?' I DESERVE Elain, because I'm your brother and you guys have her sisters and what the FUCK. Who let that shit get published holy mother of god.

It's just...It's so unhealthy? Like, not even talking ship wars here (which I'm aware are rampant, and which I'm trying my best to stay away from). But that just.

How can that ever be a healthy foundation for a relationship? A man who thinks that he deserves, not only to be in a relationship with her, but to be bonded to her. Not because of HER, not because of who she is, or how she makes him feel. No. Purely because her sisters are mated to his brothers?

The whole thing made me feel so uncomfortable. It's predatory and toxic, just as you said. It's not right, it's not fair. Forget alliances and Lucien, even if none of that was a factor, that sort of thinking is still not right. And it's completely unfair to Elain.

But it also just. It didn't read like Azriel. The first part, where he struggles to sleep, and pushes himself until he passes out, and the insight that his shadows are basically hovering beside him screaming SELF CARE YOU DUMB BITCH at all times was very pleasing.

And the part where he goes to Clotho and leaves an anonymous gift for Gwyn. No fanfair. No audience. No pressure on either of them to react/perform. That felt like Az, too.

But everything in the middle. Everything with Elain, was just...Gross and out of character. And this is not because I dislike E/riel as a ship. I could get on board with it, tbh, if it wasn't written the way it was.

But it's not about ships, for me. It's just. Everything felt out of character. The predatory way he was with her. The fact he lies awake and gets himself off to fantasies of her. How apparently quickly he was aroused by putting a necklace on her. Idk, maybe it's my ace ignorance, but that doesn't sound normal/healthy to me.

Nor does him having to leave a room because he can scent her mating bond with Lucien. Or not being able to control himself to sit and eat dinner with her?

This is the same dude who has, apparently, been in love with Mor for 500 solid years, and who never did a damned thing about it. Who always kept himself in check. Even while she's had other lovers. But he can't control himself through one dinner with Elain?

It just. It doesn't feel like him. It feels like...Honestly not even Cassian. It feels like Tamlin on horny, predatory steroids. And that's not something I ever wanted to see from Azriel's POVs.

She could have explored a darker side to him without making it sexual? And misogynistic. And having him treating Elain as little more than a fucking object that he feels entitled to because 'everyone else got one, where's mine?'. What the FUCK???

The more I write it the more angry I get.

Because SJM has consistently put Az in the position of saving women when they were in danger? He was the one who found Mor near death at Autumn. He was the one who rescued Gwyn from her attackers during the war. He was the one to retrieve Elain when she was taken.

She always puts him in this position and, for better or worse, presents him as a safety figure for these women. The first person who they saw come for them, and fight for them, and protect them.

And on the inside she makes him this vile, predatory monster who just thinks constantly about fucking them? Who isn't actually safe at all?? It's sad. And it's infuriating. Because this isn't about ships anymore. This is about female survivors who have an apparent safe person who's presented as almost as dangerous as the people who attacked them in the first place. And that makes me feel so sick and sad that we've gotten here.

It still hurts seeing many readers (and sometimes even sjm) take az’s side and paint mor as some sort of liar/two faced character that is playing everyone. I kept thinking that things would be fixed in future books, but instead az has grown worse and mor was, once again, sidelined and written out as a character.

This is yet another vile thing SJM has done to queer readers with this whole fiasco. Because it puts me in a position where I want to call out her shitty writing, and what she's done to Mor - sidelining her as soon as she became queer. Undermining her power and her strength. Undermining her role as the survivor to look up to. Saying her power is truth but then making her seem like a liar. Which is all shitty, shitty, shitting writing.

But I'm also a queer person. And I will always always ALWAYS want to defend a queer person's right to remain closeted. Regardless of their reasons for doing so. But in this case it's a concern for their safety/a fear of how those around them will react. And I will NEVER condemn that. I will never say Az is suffering more than Mor for her being closeted. I will never call Mor a liar/a manipulator/two-faced when all she's doing is trying to survive.

I WILL condemn SJM for making this a scenario. For putting homophobia in her world purely to cause pain for queer characters, and drama for her straight ones. And for sidelining Mor as soon as she can't write graphic scenes with her fucking men because now she's a lesbian so we best get her off the page so the guys can get their cocks out some more.

And honestly... as much as I love the idea of gwyn x azriel ... I think his books would need a lot more focus on his own recovery/growth and not center on a romantic relationship. If anything, I hope it’s written as friends to lovers so az has a better way of interacting and forming relationships with women. Because right now... well, that shit is borderline predatory and isn’t coming across well. And I really really do not want that for him.

This is going to sound sarcastic but I actually mean it fully and completely genuinely: 95% of the drama inducing problems in this series could be fixed with some fucking therapy.

But I agree with you. I think it's high time Azriel worked on his own issues. Even if they've apparently made a complete 180 from what they were in ACOMAF.

I...Like the concept of Gwyn/Azriel, but I'm not sold on the ship. Not with the way Maas has been writing Azriel lately. That kind of man shouldn't be with any woman right now. But especially not a rape survivor who sees him as one of the first men she's been able to trust in a long time.

Basically, azriel deserves a better arc than what has been written for him. I miss him :( he used to be a character that made me feel safe and now :/ idk anymore

"he used to be a character that made me feel safe" - This shit hit me like a tonne of bricks because this is EXACTLY how I feel about Az, too. You just managed to say it in a few words instead of 12 pages of rambling, like I do.

And I think this was intention. Azriel was presented as a very dependable character. He rescued Mor, and was respectful enough to keep his distance, despite his feelings, for 500 fucking years. Because he didn't think she was ready/interested.

He had a very calm, and calming air about him. Always in control of himself. Without the expected bursts of aggression and temper we'd seen from...Every other male character in this series. He was stable, and solid, and that was comforting. An anchor. And someone who would quietly, and without fuss, seek out Mor/others when they needed someone to talk to or comfort him.

That was a very soothing, reassuring presence in the book, I felt. And now she's made him seem...volatile, and unstable. With this dangerous anger that he can't control, that he uses not to protect, but to intimidate, and to fuel his entitlement and desires.

it's just sad. It's sad that she's taken this away from Mor, but also from other survivors who found comfort and safety in Az. Because I'm sure we weren't alone in that regard.

I miss him. And I mourn the character he was, and feel anger for the character he should have been. but instead he's become yet another possessive, entitled, snarling cardboard cutout dude like...everyone else.

And I ache for the Az/Mor dynamic that we had in ACOMAF. Even without it becoming romantic, there was no reason for that to be destroyed/ruined.

She could have written it that Az is the only one who knows about her sexuality, and that he pretends he's still in love with her as a shield/buffer, so no one looks too closely/to protect her and make her feel comfortable.

Instead she turned it into a soap opera style drama. And wrote it almost as though her sexuality was her cheating on him? Denying him what he deserved. And now she's just...just pussyfooting around it. And apparently he's just. Just moved on. Without them having any kind of conversation or closure at all. He just wanks off to the thought of Elain instead of Mor, now, problem solved /s

I miss what they were. I miss what he was to Mor. I miss when she had that support system, and that safety net. I miss when he protected her. And looked out for her. And understood her in a way that no one else, not even Rhys, did.

Mor deserved that. Azriel deserved that. WE deserved that. And she nuked it for some fucking twisted drama that punishes a lesbian because a man is thirsting after her. it's a fucking disgrace. I'm so fucking done with SJM, y'all. So fucking done.

[famouscyclenerd]

Eluciens are pro-Elain!!!

Elucien's are not only pro Lucien and "we just want Lucien to be happy!"

If that was the case, I'm sure vassien would have been a way bigger ship but it is literally non-existent at this point. It mainly consists of e/riels in diguise, who wants mr. fire in his blood out of the way.

If someone loved Lucien and hated Elain, it wouldn't make sense to ship them, mating bond or not. Why ship your favorite character with a character you can't stand and think is boring and useless?

I'd say people who thinks Elain doesn't deserve Lucien and only wants him to be happy, are pro Lucien with no ship attached.

I assume that is also why e/riel is a popular ship, because they like Elain but (more or less) dislike Lucien. They simply just like Az more than him. They like them more together. Which is fine, but blatantly saying that eluciens are not all pro elain is ridiculous when she is half of that ship. It makes no sense.

I can understand that people are sceptical of Elain's character because we have yet to see her full potential. She is one of the few (main) characters we have yet read the thoughts of and I am VERY excited for that to happen.

My girl has yet to win some of you over, which is fine. But rest assured that she has won elucien's over already, so no need to fret!

I am looking forward to the healing both she and Lucien will do, together and seperately. And I think Miss Janet agrees ;)

But the absolute pining and ANGST elucien will serve will leave the fandom SHOOKETH!!! I am so excited! Holy hell

**I also wanna add that for me (and most probably) to ship someone, I would look at how those two would work together. Chemistry, things in common, banter etc all comes into play.

I see the potential for that with elucien, and Sarah has already done quite a bit of build up between them with tension and longing.

It is evident that Sarah sees that too. They just work.

[acourtofthought]

“A mating bond can be rejected,” Rhys said mildly".

In order for Elain to make a "choice", there needs to be at least two options.

You can't claim she'll pick Az because her story is about "choice" because if Lucien is not a choice then by definition of the word the argument falls apart. Since a bond can be rejected however, choosing Lucien is a choice.

And if you truly want what is best for Elain then you shouldn't want her to base her decision on these two things:

Picking the Male she has a bond with.

Picking the Male she doesn't have a bond with.

You should want it to be based on picking the Male who she shares the most in common with and has similar core values.

Core values are:

Communication

Equality

Honesty

Shared beliefs

Trust

Do Az and Elain communicate well considering "he knew she had no idea that he had done unspeakable things?" (and no, Elain and Lucien don't communicate yet but E/riels are claiming Elain and Az are in love which means there should be communication. No Elucien is saying Elain and Lucien are currently in love).

Does Az look at Elain as an equal considering, "“There is an innate darkness to the Dread Trove that Elain should not be exposed to.” yet he himself would have no issues doing something dangerous?

Do Az and Elain seem to be hitting one another with the Hard Truths in his POV Bonus Chapter? Do we see them talk about anything of substance?

Do they seem to have shared beliefs what with her dislike of cruelty and his indifference to who he kills? The fact that she appreciates tradition and he only goes along with tradition because he knows it means something to Rhys? He says holidays are a time to pause and reflect and gather, yes. And yes, he also says holidays are not stupid. But....he then says the only reason he came is because it mattered to Rhys. That Az not getting a bond with the "third sister" because his brothers are with the other two would have kept him away as it bothered him over the fact that he actually enjoys the celebration and wanted to be with his friends and family regardless of his lack of a Mating Bond. Something that I've noted about the difference between Az and Elain / Lucien is that Az is perceptive about human behavior because he's observed it. However he does not consider himself a part of it. He sees what others do and why it's important to them but it doesn't have the same meaning to him. Like tradition. He understands why it's important for others but he doesn't feel the same. Elain and Lucien also understand things like tradition and the importance of it but where they are different is they embody it. They enjoy traditions because they personally feel the importance of them.

Did it seem like Az trusted Elain enough to let her see his darkness? Or does he constantly act different around her than he does around Rhys and the others who know of his anger issues?

As far as sharing things in common:

Does Az love nature? Because Elain and Lucien do.

Does Az enjoy parties and socializing? Because Elain and Lucien do.

Is Az good at talking to people? Because Elain and Lucien are.

Does Az mind being a warrior? Because neither Elain or Elucien want that life.

Does Az like shadows and solitude? Because neither Elain or Lucien do.

Do Azriel’s shadows like sunshine? Because Elain does and Lucien is literally the son of the Sun personified.

Does Az enjoy revenge? Because neither Elain or Lucien have ever sought it.

Arguments that include Elain choosing Az because she doesn't have a Mating Bond with him seem to be the result of someone not understanding what's actually important to a lasting relationship.

It doesn't matter whether Elain and Az are physically into one another. I've been attracted to a lot of people I didn't end up having a lasting relationship with. What matters is all the other stuff. Not who she had a bond with. Not who she's willing to kiss (for the wrong reasons) right now. But the Male who she will share more of the same values with, the Male who she already shares common interests with, the Male who already gives her credit for doing some dangerous, and not the Male who has proven he can't be honest with her after a year and who doesn't consider her an equal.

[acourtofthought]

So what you say in your answer is that SJM will do Elucien and Gwynriel for fanservice? She said that she didn't care what others wanted.

Is that how you took my response?

I hope that's not how it came across at all because the ask was "will SJM go the route of E/riel to make Elain more likeable?

And I responded as to why I actually think that would have a reverse effect. More than half the fandom already dislikes E/riel because of how the author herself has written their story so far, leading a lot of readers to feel Az is interested in Elain for all the wrong reasons, so there's no way pairing her with Az to make her "more likeable" would work, regardless of Az being popular. Otherwise, more than 50% of the fandom would already ship E/riel.

It's not just about that though. Regardless of who she ends up with, readers are still going to need to see more from her character to truly like her (not that I need that but I have seen complaints others have had). And I'm adding this now but E/riel wouldn't make Elain more likeable because it would them seem like SJM rewrote her entire character in order to make her a match for Az, pushing the narrative that the female who dislikes cruelty must suddenly change who she is in order to accept a life with a torturer. I also never said SJM couldn't still go the route of E/riel if that's what she wanted, I simply said going the route of E/riel wouldn't be something that in my opinion, would make Elain "more likeable" for a few reasons.

The question wasn't "who do you think SJM has always intended as endgame?"

The question wasn't, "do you think SJM will go the route of E/riel because they're compatible?" (which they're not but again, wasn't the question).

The question wasn't, "do you think SJM will write Elucien just to appease fans?"

It was a very specific question which I answered directly.

I'm sure over half the fandom was rooting for Nessian to end up together, same with Feysand but that doesn't mean SJM did fanservice to make that happen. I think it goes to show that sometimes what SJM plans and what the majority of readers want CAN in fact match up. It shows that a good portion of the readers are picking up on what she's trying to tell us while simultaneously still making it look like a "will they, won't they" scenario?

I don't think Elucien is fanservice as I think they are always who SJM intended as endgame (just with a rocky journey to get there). The point of Elain's journey is to have her question where Fate has brought her to decide if it's what she wants. To me, SJM always knew Elain was going to need a rebound of sorts (after Graysen) and that's the role Az played but it doesn't change that eventually she and Lucien will find their way to one another. I mean she did mention the tension, growth and healing they'd have together way back when (before she was signed on for the spinoffs) so I don't know how anyone could cry fanservice if they are endgame when she spoke about them in interviews from the very start.

People can dislike or like a specific pairing without someone needing to bring the fanservice argument into things, they are not mutually exclusive. Me saying over half the fandom wouldn't like Elain ending with Az and would prefer her with someone else has nothing to do with fanservice. It's just common sense that if they don't care for E/riel, they're not going to like Elain more simply because she ends up with him since he's a popular character.

Fanservice seems to be something only E/riels bring up because they can't admit that maybe, just maybe, SJM has planned on an Elucien endgame all this time (despite where Elain is currently at) and they need an argument in place if Elucien does happen, one where they don't have to admit they may have been reading the clues wrong all along.

If SJM truly paid any mind to fanservice than I think she'd be less worried about the likability of who Elain ends up with a decide to go the route of E/riel simply because she's more concerned about the death threats she receives from E/riels 🤷

[acourtofthought]

I sometimes hate Azriel so fkn much... like I know I'm gonna love him at some point, there is no chance I wouldn't. sjm has a way with words but my god... right now... I HATE HIM SO FKN MUCH!!!

This character alone is the reason this fandom hate at least three female characters in this series: Mor, Gwyn, Elain

Mor is literally being hated for no reason. And it doesn't help the fact that she's also queer and a (SA) survivor from her abusive family. People say she's been leading Az for 5 century while idk how she could be anymore obvious about her choice on the matter. I mean if I had a little self-respect I wouldn't have chased a woman when it's clear she doesn't want to be chased and I think she did it in the best way to not hurt him and also keep things neutral and still be his friend but as we all know this man is a shadow daddy so he's the one being wronged y'know...

Gwyn being hated bc she's a barrier between two people of a non canon (I repeat NON CANON) ship and again she's a SA survivor and never been given a chance to choose for herself. She's being villainized to make some people feel better and hopeful that one day their ship will be canon and destroy the villain so they can make their way to each other (I'M HYSTERICALLY LAUGHING I CAN'T-) like if you talk about Gwyn alone to someone they would fall in love with her idk how they could put a villain arc in her story...

Elain again having no choice in becoming a high fae and the only character trait they made for her is in the circle of being a housewife for Azriel, if not that they completely forget her desire not to want to be a warrior or spy or anything that has to do with violence and make her a full spymaster (that actually doesn't make a single sense since he's so abundant to keep her safe all the time and not wanting to expose her to troves bc he thinks so little of her and not trusting her in handling these stuffs?) or the high lady of Prison... yeah she would thrive there absolutely!!! We don't know much about this character and still people make it like they do and put their ideas and fantasies in her while we've never been in her head once!!

As you can see why I hate him so much. (I know it's probably not much of his fault really but his stans and I really hate that about this fandom)

ps: I know there are other reasons to dislike Elain but honestly didn't we all hated Nesta before her book? I'm pretty sure sjm would make us love her INDIVIDUALLY and not bc her relationship with someone...

The Mor and Az situation is complicated and messy but at the end of the day, he has had 500 years to ask Mor to sit down and have a real conversation about whether she has interest in him.

Really, it's as easy as that.

It's never easy to want someone who doesn't seem to want you in return and maybe you give it some time to see if that changes. But no one gets to play the victim after 500 years of pining for someone and I'm not sure why the narrative is always "poor Az". Maybe he tried to confess his feelings after her assault but that's not an excuse for never trying again within the last 5 centuries. He's the one who wants to know so he's the one that needs to approach her, not vice versa.

And yeah, Gwyn has done nothing to warrant hatred from anyone. She doesn't have to be someone's favorite character but the agenda to turn her evil or be some cruel seductress trying to lure Az away from Elain is ridiculous. She doesn't even know Az likes Elain. She's never even MET Elain. It doesn't matter if E/riel is canon or not, if Gwyn was being flirtatious with Az, Az never felt it was inappropriate considering he didn't vocalize having feelings for someone else. Instead he raised his brows high in amusement. He didn't feel guilt over the thought of Gwyn's happiness sparking something in his chest. Why is blame being placed on Gwyn when she's completely clueless as to what Az does when he leaves the training ring?

And yes, Elain has a mate. Yes, Elain was about to kiss Az. But so what? Nesta all but declared her love for Cassian then turned around and slept with other males yet I have never seen anyone shame her for that. But Elain being ready to kiss Az when she has never made promises to Lucien makes her a terrible person? People really don't seem to grasp the fact that to the sisters, mate doesn't mean anything to them at the start of their journey's. They were HUMANS for 20 plus years. The mating bond is not sacred to them. If the mating bond is the equivalent to fae religion, then people are attacking Elain for not jumping right on board with fae religion when she was raised to believe in something else. She hasn't embraced being fae yet therefore she is not ready to deal with her mating bond. She just lost her fiance, give the girl some time to play the field before making another life long decision. And again, Lucien has never once said, "Elain, can we sit down and discuss our bond?" He keeps it surface level so she does too. Of course we know he'd like more than that but him desiring more and him actually approaching her with purpose (and not just tiptoeing around waiting for her to give him a sign) means he's being just as complacent.

AZ is the one who was raised to respect the mating bond yet he's the one who knew it was wrong to kiss Elain with Lucien in the house yet he didn't care. He's the one who is willing to burn bridges with an important ally with a female who he's never thought of beyond his sexual fantasies. He's the one who can't even admit to being completely over Mor.

The girls are so young compared to Az (Elain is 24ish and Gwyn is 28) but they are expected to behave impeccably while the 500 year old torturer gets free passes left and right. It makes no sense.

As far as your PS. I don't hate Elain at all. Sure she should have done more in the way of chores in the cabin at the start of the series but really, what has her big crime been since then? She was willing to risk her engagement for Feyre and allowed her to use their house in the human lands to meet with the queens. She's been kind to Feyre's new found family. She didn't blame Feyre for the fact that she was made. She helped Feyre by designing and maintaining her garden. She apologized in front of everyone for failing Feyre. She didn't blame Nesta for her fathers death. She wants to spend time with Feyre AND Nesta. Yes, she was disappointed to find Nesta wasn't getting better but only because Cassian told her he thought the training was helping. And no, she didn't understand what Nesta needed in order to heal but that's because Nesta refused to open up and pushed Elain away. It was easy for Nesta to sit beside Elain's bedside because all she had to do was read her book. Did Nesta EVER ask Elain for something which Elain refused to do? Did Nesta invite her out to the bar with her? Elain did reach out and Nesta, knowing it would hurt Elain and knowing that Elain was also struggling after the war and the death of their father told her to leave her alone.

I'm not going to blame Elain who is also dealing with trauma to not have the answers for Nesta's problems. It's not her job and she did make it known that she wanted to spend time with Nesta. Nesta rejected her offers and only showed up to get rent money for Feyre.

Really, it's funny to me how much hate the females of the series get. They are flawed but so are the males. They are not MORE flawed and actually, for how young they are and how recent (and major) their traumas are, I'd say they don't deserve the hatred coming their way.

[acourtofthought]

I was pretty indifferent toward Elain’s character and then at some point the ship wars made me a bit annoyed of her (not the characters fault) which was crazy bc I never truly disliked her. But I still felt like I didn’t know her no matter how much ppl explained her character. So… after having a good mental break from the internet I came back to see if anyone could analyze her character in a way that made sense to me & wasn’t repetitive or preachy. I just… didn’t want fandom nonsense to affect how I felt about a character, esp one who I knew nothing about (and when it’s regarding a ship bc that’s just worse, not to mention v silly!)

Anyway, I came across your blog (and other eluciens) and it has helped me see her character in a way that might not be so easy to notice at first, esp for casual readers (formerly me). It felt like I only ever saw one explanation for why she behaves/reacts a certain way but your blog gives a very diff perspective and I love that bc I couldn’t see it at first. If only I’d ventured out of my gwynriel blogs into elucien blogs back then! I wouldn’t call myself a “Stan” but I do like her very much! And it’s gotten to the point where I now get annoyed when ppl make the same claims about her that i used to think, or they say what’s been said about her for forever. In my head I’m like, “but you don’t know the half of it!” Also, not to mention the fact that it is 100% true that female characters have to “work” a lot harder to be forgiven for even the smallest things and that is absolutely not okay. And idc if it’s a female character (in general) I don’t really like— i still wouldn’t be okay with that.

I’d say biggest thing I got out of your blog (and others) is that I gained a certain amnt of respect for her. And i kno it will only go up for me when her book is out. That was honestly prolly my biggest struggle with her character in the beginning. Her being quiet or enjoying gardening wasn’t a problem to me (although I did wish she’d speak her mind every once in awhile). It was more like.. “Idk what I can respect about her, at least not yet” esp with the comparisons to gwyn. But this is absolutely NOT true for me anymore. I’m finally able to see her outer AND INNER beauty!

I’m so glad though that now I can love both ladies without feeling like they’re up against each other. So thank you!!

Btw the more I think about it the more I’m like.. she reminds me a bit of Penelope from Bridgerton (who I love) so I’m very interested to see her character arc!

Sending lots of love 🫶

Thank you for this message!!! ❤️

It's one of my favorite things to hear, that people that were really not fans of Elain's have come around to her a bit after something I or others might have said.

She's definitely not been as bold as the other FMC SJM has written about and if you like SJMs books, I can understand how that'll turn some people off.

And while she'll never be 100% like Feyre or Nesta or Aelin, you see the little hints that she's already much more than she currently looks to be in the NC.

And I think that's the issue I have with how some view Elain. To them, the thing that makes her happiest is to be gardening and cooking / baking / serving the IC. Where her purpose is to spend her days reassuring Azriel that he's not a big bad man, that he just needs a little love to be the soft gentle boy she knows him as.

And that Elain is horrific to me. I don't read SJM to read about a heroine who's purpose revolves around being a housewife to the male.

There is NOTHING wrong with being a housewife but I'm realistic about what fantasy books with a female POV are about and that's not the point of these kinds of story's. I want to see her grow and become a force to be reckoned with. I don't want her to take a backseat to Azriel, there to make him feel worthy and to tag along for his spy / torture sessions when we get zero hints that's what she wants.

Time will tell but I really hope SJM proves to E/riels that Elain is more than a character used to serve others. A character deserving to have a greater purpose than spending her days reassuring Az over and over that he's not a big bad male whose touch will taint her "immaculate skin". A character deserving of her journey to be told on page and not something that's apparently happened in someone else's book (friends already found, already in love).

[acourtofthought]

I chuckled reading your last anon response, as a gywnriel and elucien I too cringe when I read super cheesy headcanoms, mostly because elriels are so cheesy, I don't want casual readers grouping us with elries. Don't get me wrong, I hope for some sweet, meaningful moments, these are romance books after all but my gooooood, have you read some of the things elriels write; I get second hand embarrassent - like there's cute and romantic and then there's straight up cringey, creepy and cheesy. Also, I hate HATE how they've literally rewritten Azriels personality and turned Elain as a damsel in distress, whos only purpose is to cater Azriel. Like, do they not see that the female is the prize not the male? Like as of right now, Azriel isn't good enough for anyone until he works on himself.

I keep trying to put into words what's "cheesy" versus romantic and I'm struggling to do it because it really is just a feeling when it happens. Where you do want to cover your eyes, groan and look away because it's so corny. SJMs couples have their romantic moments but they usually read as sweet and playful or sarcastic and loving. And they're never out of character for the couple. Like, the way the characters present themselves to others is not drastically different from the way the couple is behind closed doors (i.e., Az is sort of closed off to everyone on a regular basis so it's difficult for me to imagine him writing poetry and being a sappy puppy dog behind closed doors). Rhys is playful and suggestive towards Feyre whether it's in front of everyone or just the two of them. And Nesta is the kind to lovingly smack Cassian on the side of the head in front of the group or when they're alone. I like your comment that "the female is the prize, not the male." That's the point of books targeted at a female audience. We want the female to be the one who is worshipped for her bravery, her strength, her beauty (because to him she's always the most beautiful thing), her intelligence, and so on. I definitely don't want to read about a fantasy heroine whose purpose in the book is to cater to the whims to the male. Equals? Sure. But not where he gets to overshadow her value and E/riels seem to turn Elain into Azriel's permanent sidekick, and beyond that, the female to show him the soft, gentle love the sad lonely boy needs. I really dislike the idea that her love is what will show him his worth. That by her choosing him, he'll finally feel good enough. Also, I think E/riels fail to remember some important information about Az: He may have said this: "We're born hearing the song of the wind."

And: "They pull people together. And bring them joy. They are a time to pause and reflect and gather, and those are never bad things." Which sound poetic and meaningful but......... "You get used to the wording, he'd told me earlier. How often did he have to remind himself to use such words? Did "we" and "our" and "us" taste as foreign on his tongue as they did mine?" II don't really know where I fit in anymore." "I've been alive almost five and a half centuries, and I'm not sure of that either," Azriel said. "The Illyrians are pieces of shit." "Because Rhys wants me here. It'd hurt him if I didn't come." Az talks about "we" and "them" but if I'm correctly reading what SJM is telling us, Az doesn't really include himself in those statements. The Illyrians might have been born hearing the song of the wind but it sounds more like Az is parroting back something he's heard and not telling Elain something he feels. He also talks about the joy of holidays but again, he's only there because it means something to Rhys, not because he feels joy over the holiday. All these things that make Az so sweet in their minds and such a good match for Elain don't actually seem to describe Az at all, it's just Az applying knowledge that he's learned from watching others to the situation. At times, Az scares Rhys. At times he scares Feyre. And we know his actions have scared Mor. Cassian says Az is closed off, that he and Rhys have never been able to get him to open up and Az himself admits to not really knowing who he is. He admits to Elain not knowing who he is. This is not a male anyone can fall in love with right now because he doesn't even know himself and the things he does know of himself (the darkness inside of him) he struggles to accept. So all the E/riel moments they like to use feel fake because soft, gentle and poetic Az doesn't seem like the real Az to me. I'm not sure who Az will be once SJM gives him his healing arc but I don't think it's going to look like the version E/riels have created in their minds. They've created a romance between two characters when neither Az or Elain really knows who they are right now.