#anakin is a good master

[garmaballs]

look it’s master lloyd !!!!!

[forlouren]

Not to be the first soldier on the frontless of the woobification of Qimir (he is a villain, we know this, and I love him for it), but the lack of nuance, or rather the one-dimensional angle people who don't like his relationship with Osha have taken with him, irks me so bad. I get it. He is Sith, right. Treachery is their way; and what are the darksiders, if not self-serving?

But I feel like the specific phrasing of "the Jedi like you would call me Sith" implies so much about his own unique characterization, and I don't understand why we are glossing over it. It's not a self-identifier. It shows it isn't as much as a title he'd give himself, but a badge he'll wear since in the black/white viewpoint of the Jedi, he is not allowed to be anything more or less. His almost catty, "semantics" hammers in this fact for me, personally.

He strikes me as one who takes what he wants of the Sith code, and disregards the rest. I don't think it's a mistake that even after his reveal, we don't see him with the signature dark side eyes.

I say all this to say; Qimir's ultimate goal is not power, it is FREEDOM. *That* is what he is driven by. He craves to live outside the confines he deems as constrictive/oppressive, and have by his side, someone who wants the same.

So even while disregarding Leslye's interview; I honestly don't know how with what we've been shown in the show so far, aside from him being a sith, makes people think otherwise.

[oh-biwan]

mahStah I am so hungry.

[sad-trash-hobo]

You know what. I get why Anakin went to the darkside. You're gonna show me the Phantom Menace and hear Qui Gon tell Anakins mother that he isn't there to free the slaves, just pick up her son on a whim. And then to have him go and return Jabbas son, JABBAS SON, back to him? After he was owned by Gardulla? And no one says that that was inappropriate to have him do. And then in the Zygeria arc for Anakin to be upset about slavers, as he should, and Obi Wan tell Ahsoka that Anakin and his mother were sold into slavery so it's a touchy subject for him. He wasn't even sold into slavery. He was born into it! And this was Obi Wan, Anakins supposed brother? Shocking that Anakin would feel so betrayed and undervalued that he would go to the dark side. Anakin shouldn't have ever been a jedi. He should've been in therapy on Naboo with his wife. I love you Obi Wan, but you really did fail and I also hate you, in this essay I will-

[unspuncreature]

obi-wan should’ve been at the club!!!!!

[kana7o]

May Sketches!

[kingdomvel]

The sacrifice of Obi-Wan Kenobi

He is too far gone.

Obi-Wan hadn’t wanted to admit it, but he can’t continue to deny it.

Anakin is gone.

He barely recognises the man that stands before him now. He has done unspeakable things in the jedi temple, he has hurt Padmé, he has been trying to kill Obi-Wan for the last fifteen minutes, while Obi-Wan tried to tire him out to speak with him.

Now they stand in front of each other, and Obi-Wan has Anakin’s lightsaber in his left hand, his own on his right.

He is not fool enough to think that Anakin is defenceless without his lightsaber, but the fight has stopped for now. Obi-Wan is not sure the change has been for the best, the words that had come out of the man before him hurting him in ways he had never considered possible.

Until now, Obi-Wan had held out hope that Anakin could come back to him but his words, the look on his eyes, so far gone, have crushed the hope in him.

“You can’t kill me Obi-Wan” The man with Anakin’s face says. And Obi-Wan knows that he is right, or at least partly.

Obi-Wan knows that to strike Ankin down would burn his own heart to ash. Obi-Wan knows that he would never be able to kill Anakin Skywalker and then continue with his life, continue living. He also knows that there’s only one way for this to end. Obi-Wan can’t let Anakin continue like this.

“You are right.” Obi-Wan says. Anakin looks at him with surprise, just for a second, and then the frown, full of hatred, is back on his face. Obi-Wan throws Anakin’s lightsaber to the side and sees Anakin following it with his gaze. “I could never kill you. I should have listened to you, I should have helped you. I am sorry Anakin. I’m sorry you didn’t feel like you could trust me, like I was there for you when you needed me.”

There is doubt in Anakin’s eyes now, like he can’t quite believe what Obi-Wan is saying. Obi-Wan takes a step towards Anakin and when he doesn’t move, he keeps walking. “I love you Anakin” he confesses. There is shock in Anakin’s eyes again and when Obi-Wan finally closes the distance between them and takes him in his arms he doesn’t fight it.

Obi-Wan hugs Anakin closer to him, as hard as he can, and positions his lightsaber facing Anakin’s back.

“I’m sorry.” He whispers.

Obi-Wan lights the lightsaber. Feels it burn his chest.

Anakin moves then. He twitches, trying to move away from Obi-Wan, and he can feel his shock in the force. Obi-Wan holds him against him so he doesn’t move with the last of his strength as he feels the tears run down his face, the blood in his mouth.

Obi-Wan somehow always knew that he would die with Anakin by his side. He just never imagined it would be by his own hand, that he would kill both sides of his soul in the same move.

Not pictured: Anakin's shocked face bc he thought his master had finally understood him

Anakin's hand was in its way to return the hug :(

(This is the og version of the drawing but i changed the background for the better)

[bcitisthelight]

hey remember when we were discussing how weird the whole cliegg thing is in AOTC. and you had thoughts, feelings and emotions. tell me about those XOXO

(Big TW for this post - I discuss human trafficking, sex trafficking, rape, child abuse, slavery, and PTSD in this post. It's about the realities of slavery and Tatooine and how it involves the Skywalkers.) Something that I almost never see in any discussion on the Lars family is how sharply the fanon headcanons and characterizations of diverge from the ones we get in the moves. Like, particularly Cliegg and the prequel trilogy. Like - I feel like there's this automatic assumption that the Lars loved Shmi and that they cared for Luke out of dedication to her and her family, and it's this huge found family vibe but like can I be real. Can I be super real right now. It’s something that I find kind of baffling, because when I watched Attack of the Clones, and on every rewatch since (and there have been many), it always seems kind of obvious to me that Cliegg bought Shmi as a slave, presumably as a house slave, if not outright as a part of sex trafficking. And I don't mean in one of those "He bought her to free her, he's a good guy, etc etc". I mean, he bought her as a slave with the original intention of keeping her as a slave. And what's really interesting, is you can get pretty much all the clues about that from the exchanges between Anakin has with Watto, his and Shmi's former master.

Again, I want to stress that, because I think it's crucial that we see this for what it is - not an exchange between a former employee and his boss, not an exchange between a kid and a member of his former community. His former slavemaster. The man who won him and his mother in a gambling game like so many fancy necklaces. The source and object of Anakin's childhood enslavement. Watto would have beaten them. He made Anakin, a child of 9 - and I read somewhere once that Anakin started in the races at 6 - ride in a pod race that no human has ever won before, with the full expectation that he would die. This is a being whose entire life has revolved around the certainty that society is not only capable of functioning, but functions best, when sentient beings can be bought and sold like property. And, to be real with you, because this is a thing that happens to people who suffer enslavement, he very likely loaned them out temporarily for sex trafficking purposes for a quick buck - a practice that is noted historically in virtually every society that operated on a system involving slaves.

It's important to recap that, because I do think it's impossible to understand how deeply horrifying the conversation they have is without that context. Like, let's look at how he tells Anakin about Shmi -

This scene is....so telling to me. From the outset, Watto said he sold her as a slave. Like, it was a slave exchange. Watto heard about her freedom later - clearly, Cliegg bought her, and behaved in a way - intentional or not - that Watto believed he was buying her as a slave to own as a slave. That part is not subtext, that's just actual text.

"But Mikhayla" some will say "he freed her the second he bought her - he bought her in order to free her." Except....there is genuinely nothing in the movies, and off the top of my head, the wider narrative, that ever indicates that that's true. In fact it makes no sense in that case, for Watto to have not known that Cliegg was buying her in order to free her. Why would he have to hide that? Watto presumably doesnt care what happens to her, because he's selling her. In the larger materials, its said that his shop fell on hard times, and in the movies, we can see the proof. The script says he's sitting outside his shop, but at that point it resembles more of a kind of beaten down stand. He's still selling junk, but less and of poorer quality - presumably, he's spent all his money on gambling debts. And the thing is, slaves are expensive. He sold her years prior, and I bet he fed himself on that money for a very long time - he was a very motivated seller, as barbaric as that language is to use about a transaction involving a human person. He's not going to be fussy over why the person buying her wants to buy her. There's also the fact that this is a society that vastly runs on slavery, and large plantation owners would often "rent" out slaves to smaller but still profitable farms. And Cliegg is a moisture farmer with presumably a large tract of land for water vaporizers. If anything, I can see Watto having rented Shmi to her, Cliegg taking a liking to her, and then approaching Watto to buy her. I mean, if he's profitable enough to just buy a slave, then he clearly had at least some money. "He spent his whole savings!" Show me that in the text. "He loved her from the start!" Show me that in the text. "But Mikhayla," yet others will say, "he did free her! And then married her! He clearly meant from the start to free her, and only bought her to get her away from Watto. He could have never seen her as property. Who would marry their slave?" Except, in the real world, this is...another thing we see across multiple historical records, masters buying women as slaves and then later freeing them in order to legally marry them. PARTICULARLY in societies that operate so heavily on an entire caste system involving slaves - we can look to the Roman Empire, for example. Countless Roman officials, merchants, and military officials bought women, fell in love with them, and freed them in order to marry them. "But maybe she said yes!" (I know these are not your objections, but as you know, I'm an attorney, which means I constantly have to find an argument to fight against). So, to this imaginary detractor I say: I feel like it should be rather obvious, but I'll say it just in case - it is impossible for a slave to consent to any action they perform at the request of a slave master. It cannot happen. A woman who is enslaved cannot consent to marrying the man who bought her, and who has very likely been raping her up until this point, and wants to now marry her - usually, to make any children he had by her legally his children, and therefore citizens, rather than slaves themselves.

So really, whether or not Cliegg had a change of heart doesn't actually change my mind about his actions towards Shmi. I don't care if Cliegg DID love her - in fact, I'm sure he DID love her. People can and have convinced themselves of all kinds of moral superiority, people can claim to love someone while owning them as property! Shmi could never consent to marrying a man who held her as a slave. Even if he freed her, and she willing chose to stay there for a few years, and then he asked her to marry him. In my head, you can't overcome that power imbalance. Cliegg will never not be a man who once believed Shmi was a thing to be owned. He will never be a man who didn't see her as property. Like, at some point, it actually becomes kind of more and more unlikely that this is a guy who took up this transaction for non-malicious purposes. Because we simply do not see it in the movie. What I see in the movie is a slave owner saying he fell on hard times and sold his slave to a farmer who probably needed help on his land or in his house - he has no wife, so the latter is probably more likely. I see him saying that at the time of the transaction, he had no idea that Cliegg intended to free her. And for all that Cliegg calls Shmi his darling, his love, his wife - not once do we ever hear of any evidence that Shmi saw this as a love match. In fact, the only thing we find out about her daily life with the Lars family is that in the mornings, she wakes up early and goes to pick mushrooms. You know. A task for the house. An unpleasant task, done before everyone else is awake, that she does absolutely alone. I'm just saying. These implications are not good ones. I will say though, for all this, do you know what really sells me on the idea that the relationship between Shmi and Cliegg is is not a consensual one, is Anakin's reaction to it. This is a boy whose entire hopes and dreams have revolved around his mother's freedom. You have more excellent writing than me on this, but the moral injury Anakin suffers leaving his mother behind is. Intense. All he wants is to one day free her. In a way, a part of him is always that tiny boy who couldn't bear the idea of leaving behind his mom, who swore, the last time he saw her, that he would free her. And at this moment, all of his dreams have seemingly come true! His mother is free. According to Watto, she's found love, and married. For all he knows, she's had other children. Maybe that could involve SOME complicated emotions, but mostly you would expect that he would feel, at the very least, relieved. Happy. Interested, curious. Instead, this is his reaction:

He's grim, business like. He is not happy. He is not relieved. He doesn't even seem to acknowledge that she's still alive - the way he reacts is not a man who thinks his mother is out of danger. To Anakin, who grew up enslaved until 9 and knows how this society works, it seems almost immediately apparent that the Lars are just a different kind of danger. There's also this rather interesting detail:

This is a boy who bleeds, every second of every day, longing for a family. He basically begs at obi-wan's feet day and night, to be acknowledged as a son. His reaction to his wife's pregnancy is radiant joy - his reaction to know she could die, profound existential horror. I mean good god, he basically turns Palpatine aka Satan Himself into a father figure, because he's that desperate for one. And here, this man is claiming him as his family. He's talked about being excited to see him. He talks about planning with Shmi to meet him. He calls him "son". And Anakin doesn't give him another moment of his time, the second those words are out of his mouth. It's silence. For a boy who is so starved for intimacy he genuinely falls in love with the very first girl who was ever nice to him, to react to a claim of relationship this way. It's bizarrely out of character for him. Unless it isn't. UNLESS he's disgusted by that claim, instead of relieved by it. If he thinks his mother has been bought and then forced into marriage, of course he hates Cliegg. I remember when we were watching the movie together, and remember I said to you "You can just tell Anakin is thinking, 'Call me son one more fucking time'" And can I be real, I have so much more to say about this. As you know, I actually have essays of opinions and feelings about Shmi Skywalker and her horrible life, and how Anakin was the one bright point she had in that horrible life. I have feelings about how she gave away her only happiness, because she knew he did not deserve the life of a slave. I had ideas about how you could turn this into a way to actually fix AOTC and make it better, a way you could use it as an excuse to get rid of the Tusken arc entirely without losing the tragedy of his mother's death. But this post is already so fucking long and I'm sure you're tired of me talking xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxoxo

[suja-janee]

Given that bi han canonically has said “you turned Kuai Liang against me” he would no doubt say some edgy shit like

“YOU UNDERESTIMATE MY POWER”

[percabethsong]

One of the discourses I hate the most in Star Wars fandom is the "Anakin wouldn't fall to the Dark Side if Qui-Gon trained him"

He absolutely WOULD, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if he falled EARLY.

If we consider the Legends version of Qui-Gon Anakin would be full dark side at 19. We are talking about the man who left his 14 years old Padawan in a WAR ZONE, alone. So, yeah. He was really a jerk in Legends.

But I do know that any of this is canon, so, ok, let's look at canon Qui-Gon. Was he a bad person? Not, nothing indicates such. Was he a good teacher? Well... Not quite.

Bear with me, ok? I understand that Obi-Wan was indeed ready to be a Knight in TPM. But early in the movie, Qui-Gon leads to believe that HE doesn't think so, saying Obi-Wan still has much to learn. And then, Anakin shows up, Qui-Gon gets invested in the whole "Chosen One" thing and promptly says infront of the Council that he'll take him as his student. Yes, I am aware that he then explains that even though Obi-Wan has still much to learn, he has nothing else to teach him. But think for a minute. How would that look like to Obi-Wan? He didn't have this conversation earlier, explaining what he would do. It would be totally understandable to feel like a second thought in his master's head. Now think about Anakin Skywalker, known to be a jealous and insecure person, in a situation like that. Don't you think he would feel rejected, alienated?

Then we go to the Extend Universe and things get worse. In the Padawan novel, in which Obi-Wan is 16 and struggling with self-worth, he mentions that his master, although calm, is very hard to read. He barely knows when he is doing something that Qui-Gon approves or not. Obi-Wan is constantly criticised in this fandom for being overcritical with Anakin (which I don't fully agree because Anakin was very hard to deal as a teen), but he also praises him a lot when he gets things right, and that's canon. Now imagine Anakin in this situation. He would go insane. Still in the same novel, it's stated that at the time Obi-Wan was 16, Qui-Gon still hadn't move past the basic forms of lightsaber with him, and they basically only did meditation. Now, I don't think that's a bad thing as a Master. But just imagine Anakin Skywalker, the "it's all Obi-Wan fault, he's jealous, he's holding me back" if he had that guy as a Master. Do you really think his relationship with Qui-Gon would be better than his with Obi-Wan? Yes, Anakin and Obi-Wan fought a lot, but they were close. Qui-Gon would be distant, and that is just fertile ground to Palpatine manipulation.

[stealingpotatoes]

Do you know where Yoda is in your Anakin-raises-Leia au?

Is he still chilling on Dagobah, with occasional visits from the X-many greats grandkids?

Did he see Anakin, Ahsoka, and (later) Obi-Wan trying to raise a baby and think Absolutely Not, they need Adult Supervision?

Did he choose to stay near Luke like OT Obi, but as a mysterious bog gremlin instead of sand wizard? is he punking any imperials that try to enter - think Shrek vibes

Is he taking advantage of the Vader free universe to go around looking for their lost padawans?

did he immediately retire to a vacation world, leaving saving the universe in his lineages' hands as he sips space piña coladas and watches the sun set?

Is he doing a mix of everything?

yeah he's pissed off to dagobah as per usual!! so yeah shrek vibes but on dagobah not naboo ): really not much difference, though Anakin and Leia do (carefully) visit a few times to get Jedi guidance or whatever! but yeah just bc vader isn't here doesn't mean yoda's 1. safe or 2. in a mental state to be a jedi after losing so many ppl he taught ): lad's in his depressed swamp boy summer

[dathomirdumpsterfire]

odd tho, that right at the finish line to the revenge of the sith (a thousand years in the making) sheev would send maul to fight some jedi on naboo, right? when by all means he got the result he wanted from the jedi 'winning' that conflict. big risk of discovery innit?

unless that wasn't about the planet at all. unless sheev wanted maul to fight qui-gon, specifically. ya know, sith historically love pitting apprentices against each other...

...and qui-gon was all about the prophecy of the chosen one, right?

and like, there's only a few canon sith, versus a metric ton of jedi. fifty thousand or something?

cool.

... what did everyone think 'balance' meant?

yeah so, what IF qui-gon knew what kind of monster anakin was going to become.

what IF qui-gon was another sith apprentice.

what if that duel was 'who gets to train anakin' and either way the jedi lose?

lil ani, destined to bring balance to the force? well. he did. in a manner of speaking.

anyhoo. sith qui-gon au, amirite?

[tennessoui]

in the hunger games au, i'm a little confused as to why anakin would volunteer at the reaping, out of spite?

good question!!! It’s not out of spite, it’s more like….out of protectiveness

When the handler goes to the victors and asks that one of them pick between the two names she accidentally drew, Anakin knows that Obi-wan will a) not look away/back down from doing this and he will not pass the weight of the decision to one of the other victors. But he also knows b) that obi-wan will be devastated by choosing. He’ll feel guilty as hell for the rest of his life because he personally chose the boy’s name. He isn’t just a forced participant in the Games or a forced spectator anymore, for that kid he would be dooming him to die (/maybe to become a Victor but those odds aren’t good) and Anakin knows that Obi-Wan wouldn’t be able to bear it, that it would make his infinite sadness get wayyyyyy more infinite etc etc

so there’s only one thing he can do which is to volunteer - obi-wan chose one of the names the handler presented to him and Anakin said “nvm you don’t get a choice, it’s going to be me and I’m making that choice”, trying to halve the guilt he’ll feel, trying to make it better and protect him

the hatred he feels towards obi-wan at the end is just like. Impotent rage at the situation. At that obi-wan couldn’t just let himself deny the handler, couldn’t let another victor choose one of the names. because he couldn’t, anakin is going into the arena. And that’s because anakin couldn’t just stand by and watch obi-wan take on more grief when he could step in

[antianakin]

Maybe it's my personal bias, but a dark Ahsoka trying to get back in to the WBW because the whole mess from Anakin and then never actually processing her feelings, grief, anger etc leading her to thinking she can "fix" everything by "saving" Anakin. Not really thinking of the repercussions.

And have it be that she isn't trying to change the timeline for selfless reasons, but because she wants Anakin back. That misplaced sort of blame that comes when you over idolize someone. It was only Palpatine's fault, she tries to believe, Anakin wouldn't have done this all unprompted.

In trying to get back to the WBW having her actually process her emotions and the events and realize she's putting herself and her former master on pedestals to cope. Gradually working on herself.

Or not. Idk having Ahsoka unhealthily cope with grief in a way almost paralleling Anakin (trying to cheat death for Padme and failing anyway) sounds cool to me. Or maybe I'm just exhausted.

This would certainly make a real cool AU! The one thing making me hesitate is that she explicitly says while in the WBW in Rebels that Ezra can't save his master just like she can't save hers and never shows any real inclination towards trying to use it to save Anakin. So if you went with this concept, you'd have to figure out why she changed her mind on it or you'd just have to pretend like that moment didn't happen.

But in general I think that the idea really works! Like, I wouldn't want her to actually MAKE IT to the WBW or anything, I don't want any weird time travel shenanigans for her to mess with, but I think the idea of her TRYING to get back to it so she can fix Anakin, or fix what she did wrong or something could be a really interesting goal for her to have throughout a season where she's dealing with her Anakin feelings. Especially if we assume she's slightly fucked up from Malachor and its Sith bullshit in addition to her regular emotional struggles.

And in the she has to give it up. Like maybe she finds a way to do it, a way to open one of those doors, but doing so would have some sort of consequence and she has to choose between her selfish desire to "save" Anakin and fix what she believes are her own mistakes, or keeping that particular consequence from happening. Maybe people she's grown close to over the course of the story will be killed or put at risk if she opens the door, and she has to let it go, let ANAKIN go, in order to protect them.

That version of Anakin is gone, he's dead, and the version of him that exists now is clearly unwilling to be saved, at least by her, and all she can do is accept that and move on. Let go of her guilt, let go of her fears, just... let go. MAYBE her choice to leave the Order spurred him down that path, but maybe it didn't. Maybe Anakin made his own choices based on things entirely unrelated to her. Maybe if she'd been there she could've helped him, but maybe she'd have just been killed with all the rest. She'll never know and she has to come to terms with that before she can move forward with her life. She might've left first, but Anakin left her, too, and he took everything else she loved with him when he did.

In an ideal world, this would lead Ahsoka to do a lot of reflecting on her past with Anakin as she tries to figure out how far back she'd have to go to "save" him and she realizes just how dark he already was when she knew him and ultimately realizes that HE WAS DARK WHEN SHE MET HIM. There were things that happened to him, things he'd probably already chosen to DO, long before she'd met him that were already taking him down the path to darkness, things she'll likely never know or understand. But it allows her to see Anakin so much more truthfully than she'd ever done before. No longer does she view Anakin through the rosy lens of childhood hero worship, she can see how often he struggled with his own darkness and the ways it impacted their relationship, the way it's continuing to impact her NOW.

There were good moments, and she'd loved him, but he was dark long before she knew him and that's something she HAS to accept about him if she's ever going to let him go. There were things Anakin did to her that weren't okay, there were things Anakin taught her that were wrong and caused her to start down her own darker path, and until she can recognize that Anakin FAILED HER, she'll never be able to find her way BACK. She'll never be a Jedi until she acknowledges this very important and vital truth about Anakin and her apprenticeship under him. He WASN'T a good master and he WASN'T a good Jedi. He was sometimes a good PERSON, but he'd ultimately decided to leave that behind, too. He wasn't the person she'd thought he was and unless she wants to become him, she has to acknowledge where he made mistakes so she can keep from making the same ones herself.

So yeah, I think this idea has a LOT of merit and could definitely be a very interesting path to take Ahsoka on!

[grumfield]

You a quiobi fan?

Not my preferred flavor of toxic yaoi so I don’t ship personally but I respect all my quiobiers out there. you’re like a twisted mirror version of me…parallel lines that will never meet…magnets repelling more the closer they are…my sisterwives who I am bonded to on a molecular level but kind of can’t stand to be around

[clonehub]

Jedi Knights refusing to have padawans in the same way that young adults in awful, hostile places refuse to have children.