#anti antishippers

[nepobabyeurydice]

are you a proshipper ? i’m not following you if you are .

….I'm in the song of ice and fire fandom

[runs-red]

Another big reason it's so hard to take anti-fiction arguments seriously is because I have reading comprehension, can read critically, and can enjoy fiction without having it radically change me.

I've never read any fiction with dark themes, no matter how sexualized, glorified, or whatever, that even began to make me think about condoning or supporting it in real life.

It's to the point where I'm genuinely confused by what point anti-fiction people are trying to make. Do they think that people are so brainless that they just support everything they read? of that somehow, if you read it enough, it just washes away all of your morals and core beliefs?

[dastardly-crows]

my reaction to seeing people compare the real and horrifying reality of childhood SA and violence to fictional characters who will never experience pain or emotion:

[chekhovs-nailgun]

fun new drinking game: look through some antis’ arguments and take a shot every time they use a subjective word with clear bias (ex. disgusting, freak, weird, degenerate, etc). i promise you that you will wake up not remembering what happened last night

[dstrider-3]

antis acting like youre going to die or youre a terrible person for things you consume fictionally or thoughts you have remind me of terrible christians/catholics who say youll die and go to hell for xyz

[missunstxble]

Remember to make out sloppy-style with your F/Os!

"Borrowed" from a rude anti.

Blinkie made by me in Blinkies.cafe.

[pro-sipper]

"Dead Dove: Do Not Eat"

About the tag, the origin, and why I think no one on either side of the fandom divide knows how to use it

First of all, I'm crosstagging because I think it's a general issue, not just something for pro or anti shippers. I see the tag get misused on both sides and I just wanted to throw my two cents in

So, where did the term originate? Like all culturally significant things online, it started as a meme. More specifically, a meme from the television show Arrested Development. Character A has put a dead dove into a brown paper bag to store in the family's fridge. On the bag, he has taped a sign that reads, in big bold letters, "DEAD DOVE. Do Not Eat!"

Character B comes across the bag, reads the warning, and opens it anyway. When he's met with, you guessed it, a dead dove, he proclaims "I don't know what I expected".

This is an example of (and has since basically become the spiritual successor to) the "Exactly What It Says On The Tin" trope.

If you want to check out the full history and countless examples of the trope, please check out the page on tvtropes. But for a slightly shorter history - it originated in a British commercial for Ronseal's Quick Drying Woodstain, which the tin claimed "dried quickly". And in the commercial they told you "It does exactly what it says on the tin!" So, the tin says what the product does, then the product does it. You get the idea.

In fandom spaces, the trope just means that the title of Thing (be it movie, show, fanfic, etc) tells you exactly what happens IN Thing. If a show is called "Buffy The Vampire Slayer", you already know it's about a girl named Buffy who slays vampires. If the movie is called "Cocaine Bear", you can bet a bear will get into some cocaine at some point. If there's a fanfic called "Fluttershy Has Tea With Jesus"... you get the idea.

While both tags started out with the same intentions and meaning, I don't think it's any wonder that "dead dove do not eat" has been so easy to misinterpret. For one, "exactly what it says on the tin" sounds more straightforward. You don't have to understand the specific reference to infer it means to check the label (in this case, tags) before purchasing (opening) the product (fanfic)

But dead dove is harder to understand if you don't know the reference. And at a glance, it sounds much darker. Doves have symbolism in multiple religions, and are seen as a symbol of peace. A dead dove evokes images of gore, violence, general unpleasantness. It must only apply to something sinister, right?

The thing about "exactly what it says on the tin" is that the tin needs to say something. You can't point at a blank label and say "here's what you can expect". People would be much less likely to engage with your product if that were the case

In the same vein, slapping "dead dove do not eat" on a fic with no other tags can lead to confusion. In this tag's case, it's a warning. But what are you warning about if you don't also put it in the tags? It leaves people's minds to conjure up only grim and upsetting images of what might be in your fic. Especially when, as it's also common to do, the tag gets shortened to simply "dead dove".

And while, yes, the tag is most likely to get slapped onto fics with dark or upsetting subject matter, that means something different for everyone who comes across it.

Most people seem to think it only applies to inappropriate relationships (age gap, incest, etc). But I've seen it applied to a variety of things, from potentially triggering material (like suicide) to things that simply may not be everyone's cup of tea (like excessive gross-out toilet humor).

In the end, "dead dove do not eat" is a tag that, in my opinion, should not be used as a descriptor as to what type of content your story contains. But rather, a gentle warning to say "hey, I'm specifically telling you what you're about to encounter, so whatever happens next is up to you".

After all, if you read the warning and still open the bag to find something you don't like...

I don't know what you were expecting.

[pienhime]

this has been on my mind a while (and i think its one of the main reasons the overseas menhera comm is almost dead) but i think that what is "anti recovery" vs what is "pro recovery" vs what is considered those things on social media are very different.

"pro recovery" isnt "dont talk about the ugly side of your illness, dont vent, dont make art thats graphic, and ur not allowed to just exist unless ur constantly every day making the effort for improvement and trying to prove it thru what u post!! and ofc, dont be negative!! uwu medical motifs ONLY in menhera so you dont romanticize", its "do what you need to do to survive the day. use art to cope with your feelings, talk about it, you are allowed to exist and while getting better is a noble goal, its okay to just survive right now".

"anti recovery" isnt just... having a restrictive ED, a self harm addiction, or using drugs, its not "ugh i feel like giving up", its not making fucked up art or talking with others about the more intense of your issues and posting damage reduction. its not making aesthetic textposts to vent out your feelings and urges so you dont actually do the bad thing. it is not anti-recovery to struggle with those things, but it is ableist to shame people who struggle with them. what IS anti-recovery is actively encouraging others to cut deeper, lash out at their loved ones, sending suibait to people, and peddling the idea that making progress in recovery at all makes you less yourself. its okay to vent ab wanting to do those things and feeling those ways, as long as you arent actually encouraging others to do them. but assuming that every coping mechanism people have thats "problematic" makes them a horrible person is anti recovery as hell. we are mentally ill, of course some of us will cope in ways that arent ideal, but its better than nothing.

yet people in mental health spaces somehow have totally changed the meanings of the terms, just like they have with "glorifying" and "demonizing", so that its harder for those of us who struggle with highly stigmatized things to have a place. it almost feels like these "safe spaces" demonize and stigmatize people with EDs, active self harmers, and drug users & addicts more than the outside world sometimes. we are treated like we are somehow problematic for having those symptoms, and as anti-recovery if we dare to talk about them.

and most of all, if you go into mental illness related tags... dont bitch and moan when u see someone acting mentally ill you fucking weirdo

[a-sh1pping-complex]

I made one of those proshipper wanted posters satirically omg go get meee lmfao

[truthfully-system]

Nowadays when I see a callout post- especially one about pedophilia or zoophilia, I skip it, cuz most are talking about fiction or like an artist with 2 followers...

Girl, callouts should ONLY be to allert people of an actual danger, a real groomer, someone drawing bill cipher and dipper pines having the rawest sex imaginable to the human mind is NOT a danger, thats a discomfort, and thats not callout worthy.

Like you DO realize that a LOT less people are looking at callouts now, even if there IS a real child/animal abuser being called out, because you idiots call out drawings, right? Thank god when I was being groomed your movement was minimal cuz my groomer might of gotten futher into grooming me ALL cuz ya all make callouts pointless- HELL- it pains me to know people are being groomed rn because one too many people keep making callouts for pointless shit.

[runs-red]

I don't know who needs to hear this, but even if something bad is romanticised, sexualized, or in some way made to seem good in fiction, people are still aware that it's bad!

[dastardly-crows]

I always found the ageing fictional kids up to "sexualise them" discourse to be so fucking dumb because, buddy, wait until I tell you about this process in real life called ageing and becoming a sexually mature adult

[proficshy]

I don’t even know how to tag this???

[fdq666roadie-blog]

[missunstxble]

For emotionally insecure self-shippers out there with a F/O that has a rough personality:

Worried that your F/O finds you annoying? It's okay to feel that way, but know that they're not annoyed by you. You're never too much or too little for them, and your efforts to show your love for them are more than enough. They cherish all that you do.

It doesn't matter if others think it's out-of-character, your F/O will tone down their mean streak for you and only you. Heck, they wouldn't mind at all if they completely change their ways. Your feelings matter to them, maybe even more than their own, and they'll do anything to make you happy and feel safe.

Maybe you've been hurt by someone/some people that was/were significant to you before, and you tell them. They understand that, and will make compromises for you without any hesitation or reluctance.

You will never be hurt again, they make sure of it.

The road to feeling secure again around someone may be rough and long, but they'll be with you through it all.

[phoenixwrites]

Gen Z has graduated from advocating that icky fanfics should be censored—to any romances that make them feel icky.

Molly X. Chang has a dark fantasy story coming out that antis are ALREADY HARASSING HER ABOUT despite not having read the damn book. Antis are literally ruining what SHOULD be the most exciting amazing time of her life, her debut year. But because one of you purity culture fuckers decided her story (WHICH IS ROOTED IN HER GENERATIONAL TRAUMA AND HER FAMILY’S FOLKLORE” was *problematic* that gave yall carte blanch to attack her.

It makes me sick.

This is why we need to fight back against this anti/purity culture NOW because this mentality is dangerous and always leads to the dehumanization of queer folks.

It starts with fandom and bleeds into Republicans banning queer books.