#if i see one more kid (older teen young 20s i. not actually mad at children) walking around with a $300 board they dont know how to use

[olderthannetfic]

The teenage fandom puritanism really confuses me. To be honest I don't know what to think. For the most part, the antis I've come across aren't sex repulsed, or sex negative or anything like that, they're just extremely, extremely uncomfortable with people older than them making explicit content of characters they like. These are often characters in their late teens (17/18/19) that the teenage antis identify with.

They feel like they're still kids and minors and fragile so they project this onto their blorbos and demonize anyone basically over 20, and the outrage seems to get worse the older one gets, making explicit fan content of them.

The antis I know reblog, create, post about sexually explicit writing and fanart themselves and they give a pass to anyone 18 or under making such content but as soon as your age ticks over that magical year, it's over.

A tiny part of me can kind of see it from the point of view of a young person who's grown up in a society where hysterical reactions to everything are normal and encouraged and where pedophile is the absolute worst thing you can call someone...It seems like to their minds any adult creating fictional sexy content of a 'teen character' must be acting on some vile real life impulse to harass and abuse real life teenagers because clearly there's no separation between fiction and reality /s.

So knowing they've grown up in that sort of environment I kind of get why they'd be so scared and distrustful of any adult having fun with fictional characters but it also still blows my mind.

I remember devouring as much smutty fiction as I could when I was in high school, some of which was about teenage or young adult characters, all of which were published books written by adults, and never once did it cross my mind 'This person must be writing this story because they're getting their sick jollies imagining kids having sex' (because antis conveniently refer to anyone under 18 as a kid, as if a 17 year old was the mental and emotional equivalent of a 7 year old. They conveniently forget that adolescence exists.) Actually, the authors didn't really enter my mind at all because I'd be too busy getting lost in the story, imagining it was me the sexy times were happening to and having a very good time.

I always thought these people can write these stories because they were that age once, they know what it was like. I've always thought of writing like this, that you write because you know what it was like, not because you necessarily want to be there right now.

So this terrible fear the young antis have of adults creating written or visual content of fictional young adults having sex or thinking about sex or craving sex is kind of wild and alien to me.

I think it's something they won't understand themselves until they hit mid-20s, 30s, 40s themselves, that when adults make that sort of explicit content it's not because they are horny for teens in real life and making fiction is just some sort of cheap cope, but because they're having fun reimagining their own youth or because now that they're removed from those turbulent teenage years they can look back with fondness, or horror, and can write about that period of life with more clarity and nuance. Or maybe, just maybe, they just think the characters are roaring good fun and are trying to create some content that will bring something entertaining, meaningful and just blimmin' good to read to that same audience that wants them pilloried.

Who knows. I'm just an old person who has no business having any erotic thoughts about nothing and anything I say can be discarded ^.^

--

You give them massively too much credit.

They are emotional children who have trouble sharing their blorbos with others and who are Big Mad some older person is a better writer and/or ships their blorbo in a more interesting ship and gets way more attention for doing so.

[spicybylerpolls]

while people are on the topic of finn, a little appreciation for our will byers' actor! noah!

i feel like he could have turned out like a model or something, if you see when he was younger, he was all in proportion and like very pretty boy, a traditional, good looking young man. but now thats he's older and grown into his features a little more - he's not entirely there, that wont happen until they finish growing at like 25 ish, but he is more oddly proportioned now in a nice way. he's EVER so slightly chubbier. he's also mega goofy, but in a different way to finn (although not THAT different actually). he gets away with it more cos he's still handsome in a traditional western way except for the obvious jewish features that im sure lots of bigots hate (see all the toxic milevens on twitter). his teeth are kinda goofy but also cute, but it's his smile that does it. it's kind of contained and shy, down-turned as though he has internalised not wanting to smile too widely, or perhaps just feeling shy and bashful when he's happy. which is VERY will. i think they are more similar than he let's on tbh. i think he's secretly a shy one, just like when he was a kid.

whereas finn seems to burst with light and laughter, then sudddenly realise he's in public and become self conscious again, and his face just turns sour af lmaooooo bless him

mad props to the casting director tbh - these are two performers with faces that are endlessly mesmerising, and acting skills to match. i feel so grateful to be watching their portrayals of this story unfold in real time. the fact that it may break new ground is a bonus, but even if fit doesn't, i've had a ball for the past couple of years! if nothing else, having their first adult scene together could work wonders for their professional confidence. if i was a pro actor, i would love to do an intimate scene with a close friend of mine, we would have a ball and the trust would be unreal.

and lastly, here's a funny little story...

years before i joined the fandom proper in 2022, when s2 was just coming out, my friend (who was very mainstream) showed me some pictures of a photoshoot with noah and finn. we were in our early 20s, fresh from college and no clue what to do with life. and my friend showed me this black and white photoshoot on insta (i think its the one noah recently posted to show his excitement of working with finn again for finn's birthday?), and she was quiet as i looked, waiting to hear what i would say.

and i was like... they look....

*massive pause while I look at her, incredulous and mildly disturbed*

and she said '... hot.'

and I was like YES, WTFFFFFFF

and she was like WTFFFFFF

and we were so uncomfortable and confused! they were young teens! but the fact that it was my mainstream friend who had literally just discovered the 80s through this show, who had a first class English degree from Edinburgh university, who had just started working at a prestigious publishing house in the city, who had a rather gorgeous boyfriend... i mean she was the most down-the-line person you ever met. and i was just so surprised and grateful she had trusted me to say this, and we proceeded to discuss wtf was going on.

basically - photoshoots, esp when the cast were teens, kind of passively sexualised them. im not talking explicit, but rather encouraging pensive brooding stares and poses that are something you would see in a couture magazine. they looked older because they werent smiling, and were emulating these poses that adult men would do.

on top of that, finn esp really reminded me of the first boy i ever had a proper crush on at 13. i remember it so clearly because its not the hair or the skin or whatever superficial stuff, but rather his expressions and attitude (and the freckles). finn, when younger, had this arrogant (and therefore irresistible) teen boy vibe which exactly matched this boy i fell in love with at 13. i realise now that thats all probably from a place of insecurity on finn + the boy's part, but even at 22 sitting in this cafe with my friend, browsing insta innocently, i could remember exactly what it was like to be 13 and my heart was just beating. whenever i think of that crush on that boy, i am 13 again. i am not a grown woman perving on a young boy. i am 13.

so i think, maybe, thats how many of us here connect with spicy byler tumblr.

and now, of course, watching them grow up on my screen (having rejoined the fandom post s4) has been a very... interesting experience for me. i think byler sex discussion on here speaks volumes about how we are all from different walks of life. if i wasn't an art major who has literally been drawing naked bodies from life since I was 16 at school, and a psychology student, i might not understand how to discuss all this stuff. as it is, i've got too much emotional education under my belt, and i know how to embrace my shadow self as long as im not hurting myself or anyone else. (vecna would take one look at me and say NOPE lol.)

sorry for the ramble! thanks for hosting me.

p.s. sadly im not friends with that girl anymore, but this will always be a legacy of our friendship (plus the fact that she was so grateful for my pre-existing knowledge of 80s music lol. & we both bought corduroy sheepskin jackets immediately after watching s1, lucas KILLED it. fashion king)

Thank you for sharing your story and adding to the discussion!

Your cafe story raises so many interesting psychological ideas about the nature of storytelling and connecting to coming-of-age narratives or even writing it/creating it, as the Duffers have done. As you put it, "Even at 22 sitting in this cafe with my friend, browsing insta innocently, I could remember exactly what it was like to be 13 and my heart was just beating. Whenever i think of that crush on that boy, i am 13 again. i am not a grown woman perving on a young boy. i am 13. So i think, maybe, thats how many of us here connect with spicy byler tumblr," and I think there's a lot of intrigue there.

Even though your story is related to Finn IRL, I'd say a part of writing/reading a story is putting yourself in the shoes of the characters and seeing things from their eyes. And that includes temporarily "becoming 13 again" (or becoming the age of the characters you're exploring). And that's not creepy. It's just a part of the process. Art itself is messy and psychologically layered.

A lot of Bylers seem to believe the Duffers would be creepy for including a sex scene in S5, even with the characters aged up, because they watched Finn and Noah (and by extension Mike and Will) grow up. But really, it's all a part of them engaging with the coming-of-age themes they've set up and "becoming 17 again" to properly tell this story how it's meant to be told, wherever that journey takes them. And in the context of a gay coming-of-age tale, it just might include sexual exploration and discovery. *Gasps*

[beevean]

might just be me but I find the willing infantilization some fans put basically the entire cast through HIGHLY disturbing. "oh Sonic would be in high school!! Amy would be in middle school!! Vector is Espio's D A D so DON'T you dare ship them you pedo!!!! let them be kids I will kill anyone who even dares think that they shouldn't act more like kids and don't act their age anyway!!!! D:< D:<" it's likey they are just MAKING up a bogyman to be mad at while getting to call everyone under the sun pedofiles.

It is. It's both annoying and yes, kind of disturbing. Many (younger?) fans hyperfixate on the characters' ages and act as if they're in any way shape or form realistic.

Guys. A real 18 yo would never be a spy working under the president of the US. Classic Amy, at 8, drove a car. Jet and Blaze are both 14, but can you tell? Can you really tell? Can you look at Blaze the Cat and actually determine that she's a 14 yo girl?

It doesn't matter. It really does not. Ages used to be (before Sonic Channels took them down, bless them) a vague reference, mostly on who is older than whom, or who belongs in a certain age group. The only characters who actually act their ages are Cream, Charmy and Tails. Sonic himself could act anywhere from 12 to 18 depending on the game.

And the infantilization reaches its peak when it comes to ships. Saying that Sonamy is problematic because "Amy would be in middle school and Sonic would be in high school" is both very stupid (they would if they were real, but they're cartoon hedgehogs and they are peers) and also comes with gross implications about how you see Sonic. Why do you believe that he'd groom and manipulate his friend? That's what you're implying, that the age difference is so big that Sonic would take advantage of that, or that Amy is too young and stupid to know what she's doing. Is that how you see your faves? Have you like. played any of the games? and actually witnessed their dynamic?

I also remember a post of someone who got really angry and threatened people who headcanon Sonic and Shadow as being in their 20s. Why are you so bothered, man? Why do you get so offended at the idea of characters being aged up? What disgusts you so much at the idea of cartoon hedgehogs being shipped? Why do you take cartoon hedgehogs being seen in a romantic/sexual light so personally?

You do see the pattern here, don't you?

There is this widespread belief that "problematic" ships are the perfect tool for predators to groom teens, and that's why I believe these fans are so viscerally repulsed by characters not being treated like their canon ages, and feel the need to shout it from the rooftop. This is wrong! And I know it's wrong! You can't hurt me! I am a minor and I deserve to be treated as such, and so do minor characters who are just like me fr fr (read: I heavily project to)! And if you like these gross ships allegedly used to groom minors like me, you're one of the Bad People and you deserve to be hated!

It sounds hyperbolic, but when you put the pieces together...

[societysonlooker]

Lmfao hot take but if you skate and like cops you're a fucking poser😂

[beckface]

Addendum to this au where there’s actually been a longer line of superhero’s training the next in line and just kinda screwing each other up. I like mentorship stuff

Miss Power->Amazo Guy

Okay so in this version we start with Amazo Guy, who at the time is the main superhero of Fair City. He and Steven are NOT the same age in this au, Steven’s actually a kid who looks up to Amazo Guy! He’s a big fan

forgive me for the Amazo Guy slander </3 but he’s going to be kindof an asshole. Partially due to his own training and partially due to his ego never being checked he really only fights crime for the attention and glory, and he likes feeling like he’s the most powerful.

Amazo Guy’s mentor was Miss Power, who came to earth in her childhood with her family to escape a war. Her first impression of the earth people was when they ran her parents out of the planet out of fear, and she was taken in by a kind older woman who eventually passed on when Power grew up.

Miss Power decided to become a superhero in her teens, when she felt like she had to do something to cleanse the world she now lived in from all of it’s evil, still traumatized from losing her parents.

Miss Power found Amazo, a young wannabe hero when she was around her 20s, and basically taught him that to be a hero you have to be callous towards your enemies and look down on your citizens. She grew more and more disillusioned with earth as time went on and eventually abandoned him to try and take over for herself in a desperate attempt to “fix” everything. Calling him useless and saying that he’ll never be more powerful or loved then her, really just spitting out whatever insults she could think of. He eventually won against her and banished her for decades to another galaxy

What she said to him struck him hard however, and he based his whole career on proving her wrong. Destroying himself internally in the process.

When Miss Power finally makes it back to earth years later, she knows to not make the same mistake again, deciding that she needs to have any possible threats to her mission on her side. She is delighted to find that Amazo is gone and a Wordgirl, a new, impressionable child has taken his place

Amazo Guy -> Steven Boxlietner

Steven is a 13-year old boy genius when one of his experiments goes wrong and he’s given superpowers. Steven panics when this happens and quickly realizes he’s unable to control it, and accidentally starts destroying the city. Amazo of course goes to stop the chaos, and is surprised to find that instead of a malicious villain, it’s a scared kid who is clearly not in control of whatever he’s doing.

Amazo manages to catch him and help him calm down and takes Steven under his wing as his sidekick, and future hero in training, thinking that being seen as a wise mentor would do his image good as many people have started calling him plastic and selfish

Steven is excited at first to be a superhero, but quickly sees Amazo for his true colors as a paranoid, bitter man who wants Steven to do whatever he says. Steven’s basically a glorified intern, and whenever he messes up or gets distracted Amazo gets mad at him, and impresses upon him how important it is to be perfect. “If you’re not perfect they won’t love you. If you’re not perfect your enemies can take advantage of you.” Steven takes this to heart, as his image in the public eye slowly becomes more and more important to him

He takes this obsession with image into his adulthood and his villain years. Cue Steve McClean episode

Steven, still trying to do a good job as a hero, starts doing community service that Amazo was taught was beneath him, making Steven more beloved as a hero then Amazo is. This causes Amazo to panic, and he starts sending Steven into more and more dangerous battles alone

It gets to the point where one of the top villains, an inventor ironically, starts going after Steven and even takes his family hostage, saying that if Steven didn’t willingly give up his powers in this new machine they built, then he could say bye-bye to his family! Steven, in tears, agrees to these terms and begs for his family to be safe.

As he steps in the machine, wishing that he had the luxury of a secret identity, as the villain cackles manically. Steven sees the unmistakable outline of his mentor. Just standing there and watching, doing nothing. Steven feels an anger like he’s never felt before rise up in his gut while his powers are drained from his body.

Steven does his best to be on good terms with Amazo, not wanting to believe his mentor would really just abandon him like that, and does some mental gymnastics to start blaming the city instead. Mans started his joker arc “it’s all societies’ fault >:( dad would love me otherwise >:(( why did we have to be heroes anyways.” He writes Superheros and You: a Practical Guide to try and keep down everything he learned from being a hero.

Steven finds himself missing the attention and validation from being a hero, and missing Amazo Guy despite still feeling angry at him, and distracts himself with his projects hoping that one day he’ll invent something that will really make a difference in his life again.

Steven Boxlietner ->Wordgirl

One day Steven is in the woods doing his weird science man things when a tiny five-year-old child just like crashes into a tree next to him. He goes to check if she’s okay, and when she’s completely fine he asks how she managed to go that fast. She starts talking about how her best monkey friend told her she needs to practice flying if she’s gonna be a superhero like Amazo Guy, and Steven under his breath is like “Yeah I dunno if you wanna be one like him, ha” and the kid is all “:D why?”

Steven just shakes his head, and tells her she can be whatever she wants, assuming that it’s just some kid playing pretend until she actually starts flying out of excitement in front of him. He realizes that this is, in fact, a super-powered child. His blood runs cold as all of the pent up emotions he has towards Amazo and towards the concept of superheros all come flowing back

At first he thinks that it’s not his business and he should just leave it alone, but suddenly he realizes that he’s been chatting and walking (well, she’s floating) with this kid for like an hour in the woods and oops he got attached

He decides to try and hide her from Amazo, for now at least, and tells Becky about how he was actually a superhero too for a little while! To which Becky is like “WOW this is awesome!”

So Steven tells her where his little lab is and invites her to come by any time for superhero training, and to bring her monkey too! So now he’s got his own little superhero pupil and nothing could possibly go wrong

Eventually Amazo Guy has to leave earth, his home planet contacted him and they need him to help. Steven is upset and also really relieved about this. And without Amazo Guy actually there he starts to develop some genuine internal hatred for the man, and for the book Steven wrote that has his face plastered all over it. Steven ignores it because thats what we do with feelings on my tumblr blog

Steven gives WG lessons about being a good hero and helps her physically train the best he can without powers of his own. Steven never really liked how mean Amazo could be to the villains, but always kept quiet about it. So in a weird act of rebellion Steven makes sure Becky is aware that yes, villains are people too. He also makes sure she knows that, unfortunately, the view of the public is going to mean quite a lot to her inevitably, even if it doesn’t right now.

One day Becky mentions to Steven how she told her parents that she’s getting better at fighting and he just flips for a second, getting flashbacks to his final battle. He grabs her shoulders like “NO. Your family can not know. Your friends can not know. It will put you and them in horrible danger, hell i’m in danger just by training you, as few people need to know as possible. Understand?” And Becky is just terrified at the outburst and like “yes sir understood…”

Eventually Becky does debut as the newest Fair City hero, and the people are just too happy to finally have one after Amazo left. Steven is proud but starts getting worried that she might start getting a big head like Amazo had and accidentally starts leaving Becky a bit desperate for validation, which she overcompensates for with her ego ironically

All the while Steven has been obsessively indulging in his scientific curiosity still, and then the day comes that it goes too far. Enter Doctor Twobrains.

Doctor Twobrains vs Wordgirl

Steven doesn’t want to be a villain. He’s been on the hero side his whole life! And he definitely doesn’t want to hurt Wordgirl. At least, he thinks he doesn’t, his memories of her are not as clear as they were before for some reason, same goes with everyone he knows. However, as he looks at the original copy of Superhero’s and You a familiar anger boils inside him, he starts to think that maybe this won’t be so bad.

Wordgirl just deals with the new transformation best she can, not really processing that this is her mentor until the night after his first attack, when she lets herself cry. It’s mostly out of confusion and guilt, she blames herself and doesn’t really get why he’s not even trying to turn back, in her perspective he just stopped caring about her and abandoned her to be her enemy.

Over time Dtb makes friends in the villain league. Friends his own age for once, and even starts dating and discovers that he had absolutely been missing out on these kinds of human interactions his whole life. He had gone to college and he did the whole party animal thing but he has never put his social life before his various projects. He goes a little crazy and becomes THE social butterfly of the gang, dating around quite a lot. He starts healing a lot of the loneliness and desperation that had plagued him for so long, and within that starts realizing that there is someone that was really overdue with some kindness from him.

I love how as the show progresses it feels like she gets closer with a lot of the villains so thats canon here, as DTB starts finding himself he also starts trying to be good to his former student, to the point where she felt comfortable coming over again, even if he never intended on being a “good guy” again

Before that completes though, theres some other things that occurred.

Miss Power -> Wordgirl

Amazo guy’s former mentor returns. She sees that there’s a new young hero and wants to trick her into taking over the earth together, yadda yadda

Dtb has heard about Miss Power from Amazo and immediately doesn’t trust her, but he’s still bitter to Amazo so he doesn’t really tell WG anything, and trusts that she can make the right decision which ofc she does in the end

Not before Wordgirl takes some trauma from her time with crazy though! She’s haunted by how she treated everyone and she feels terrified of Miss Power even after she’s gone, not sure how much of her training was genuine and how much would actually be good to apply

Also seeing your unstable notdad and your abusive notmom arguing and feeling like you have to take a side even though both sides are objectively bad for you can take a toll

Becky takes a note from Steven’s journal and buries that experience deep in her psyche and hopes it doesn’t ever come out in any bad way

Wordgirl -> Kid Math

Kid Math comes to earth and Becky is freaking the fuck out the entire time, because if she ever learned anything from Steven it’s that you should NEVER GIVE AWAY YOUR SECRET IDENTITY, and Kid Math is having a really hard time learning that.

Kid Math struggling to process earth things generally frustrates Becky, and considering the fact that every mentor before her was a full adult who had done this for years she feels like she’s not living up to the standards set by the past because she struggles with being a teacher.

Kid Math already having a handle on his superpowers messes with Becky too, because it’s a different type of mentorship then she had. It’s not about training much here, it’s about teaching Rex’s mind to be prepared to be a superhero and to handle his hero duties well, which is something that Becky herself still struggles with

She kinda infantilizes Rex a bit and doesn’t really respect his intelligence the way she should, and he starts getting frustrated and starts feeling bad. He wants to impress her and he wants her to trust his hero instincts, but if she thinks that he’s not ready to take charge yet then he must not be working hard enough surely?

Becky feels like she should be teaching him about physical fighting too, but since he’s already got a handle on that she ends up taking a page from Miss Power’s book and going too hard on Rex. He’s even younger then her and it exhausts him quickly, to which she gets annoyed at. She takes any limitations, mental or physical, that he has as something that SHE did wrong.

One day Rex just stops in the middle of an exercise and he starts crying, and just yells at her that he can’t be enough for her, and he must not fit in the earth equation well enough to be a superhero, and he’ll never get the people to like him enough. Becky takes this as him rejecting her, she wants to comfort him but something in her doesn’t want to apologize and admit that she was wrong. She says fine and flies off, abandoning him.

She can’t help but feel really guilty and finds herself going to DTB’s lab. He’s confused but trying to be more sympathetic towards her, especially since he’s not doing an evil plan right now. He has no idea why she’s here but sees that she’s upset, and at some point she explodes on him. “Why did you leave!”

He’s taken aback by this and sits down, explaining all he can to her and apologizes. Through this, Becky realizes how she’s been treating Rex, and flies back to him. He looks at her like he’s expecting her to be upset but she just tackles him in a hug and says “I’m sorry. You’re doing perfect, I’m the one who was messing up.”

He forgives her and they make up, Rex is really happy now and says something corny like “You + Me = Best crimefighting team!” and Becky just smiles and agrees, “Yeah, we’re the best team”

The end OR IS IT

[littlerockerao3]

Prompt 47, if you have time

I know I’m late but here it is!

47. “I thought it was a one-night stand… and now we’re married”.

~~~

Robb knows Theon was expecting this the moment he rolls his eyes at the sight of Robb entering into the kitchen carrying the cake on a paper tray.

“Happy birthday babe!” Robb happily sings, resting the cake in front of Theon’s seat and pulling a lighter out his pocket to lit up the candle. It’s a pretty cake: Robb and the baker had planned on how this cake should have looked like for days. In the end, they opted for a vanilla and strawberry cake with pink and red mousse roses decorating it all over. There’s a chocolate bar in the middle of it with the words “30s are the new 20s” written in frosting. A small red and white striped candle is right behind it, and now it’s lit up.

“Blow the candle, come on” Robb says, smiling widely at how Theon is trying his best to hold back a smirk.

“Yay!” he claps his hands like a little kid when Theon’s lips finally blow over the candle and set it off and Robb considers that the perfect time to kiss his cheek and sit on his lap. “Happy birthday, hon”.

“Thanks babe”

Robb rolls his eyes at that face and tap his index finger on Theon’s lower lip, “Oh, stop pouting. You’re cuter when you smile”.

Theon just huffs in response, looking so conflicted Robb almost laughs.

“I can’t believe I just turned… thirty.” He says, “That’s old. What’s next, grey hair?”

“Oh you have no idea how hot you’d look” it’s the first thing Robb says, cause he knows that’s true: Theon would look good with grey hair. It’s naturally black so it would turn to a dark grey, maybe it would start with just a streak and Robb’s sure as hell that would be such a turn on for him.

“Oh I’ll return the favor when you’ll be the one turning this old” Theon says, his pout still not daring to leave his face.

“Still got five years left though.” Robb winks at him and kisses his nose, “I’ll keep reminding you of how older and older you’re getting in the meantime”.

Theon rolls his eyes, slips his hands inside Robb’s back pockets and kisses his nose in return.

“You’re lucky you’re cute.” He says, then makes a weird face, “Why are you wearing jeans in the house?”

“I had to go and take the cake from the bakery” Robb explains.

“And you wore jeans?”

“Uhm yes?” He really wants to chuckle: Theon used to love wearing jeans. He still wears them, but not that often, only when they have to go somewhere special, otherwise he’ll just wear sweatpants everyday, says they’re comfier, which is true. A few years ago, though, he couldn’t help wearing skinny jeans cause he claimed they made his legs look good, which was true.

“Okay but why are they still on? They’re so uncomfortable, take them off” Theon’s hand try to unzip Robb’s pants but the redhead quickly swats them away. “Nope, we have all day for sexy times, let’s just enjoy this cake now”.

Theon glances at it, and finally smirks, “It’s too pretty to be eaten”.

“Oh so you don’t want it?”

“I never said that” he kisses Robb’s cheek and wraps his arms around his waist, pulling him closer and then rubbing his nose against his jaw. “Do you remember this day six years ago?”

Robb smiles, and caresses Theon’s hair: of course he remembers that day, he could never forget it, cause that’s where it all started.

“Oh yeah, we slept in and had brunch and we didn’t talk about how we had drunk sex the night before even though we’ve always been just best friends until the evening. And by the evening we had had sex like, three more times” he explains.

The memory is still vivid in his brain: he was nineteen, college was just starting to look normal, and Theon was his best friend. Five years older than him and with a job at a restaurant that had him wearing a black shirt that made him look adorable when it was all buttoned. The night before Theon’s twenty-fourth birthday he had asked Robb to come over to help him decide which alcoholic games to play at the party the following day. Then Theon asked Robb to stay for dinner and after a few beers they were kissing all of sudden. And all of sudden none of them was wearing clothes.

The following day they had ignored their respective headaches, though Robb couldn’t, at least silently, ignore the fact that Theon had made them something to eat: as far as he knew, Theon had never made his one night stands something to eat the morning after sex. Cause that was what it was right? A one night stand.

Well, it wasn’t.

“Can you believe it?” Theon says, “I thought it was a one-night stand… and now we’re married”.

He brushes Robb’s ring finger, where a small T is tattooed. It had been Theon’s idea to get matching tattoos instead of wedding bands and even though it hurt like hell, Robb has to admit he loves them.

“You were such a sexy twenty-four year old back then… not even in your mid twenties yet” Robb teases, laughing out loud when Theon rolls his eyes so hard they almost turn out completely the other way.

“Oh fuck off”.

Robb brushes some black locks out of Theon’s face, “Why are you complaining about getting older? You know I like older guys”.

Theon’s grip tightens even more around Robb’s waist, as he gently pulls him closer, chests now touching each other, “You don’t like older guys, you just like me”.

Their noses are touching, Robb’s thumbs are caressing Theon’s jaw as he presses his mouth on the corner of his husband’s lips.

“Untrue” he corrects. “I love you”.

Theon’s dimples aren’t exactly in the shape of a small circle, unlike the ones Robb has seen more often: they look more like a long line engraved in his cheeks, which looks just so good with Theon’s sharp features. They don’t make him look younger nor cuter (Sansa’s dimples are basically two little commas that make her look seven when she smiles without showing her teeth), they just make him look… sexy as hell.

And that smile is all Robb is staring at as Theon says, “I have to admit that even though I adored young Robb who still had baby fat at nineteen, I must say this older version of you in your mid twenties, is much hotter”.

Robb gently swats away the hand poking his side with a roll of his eyes, “Is it because of the beard?”

“And because you let your curls grow longer”

He smiles: if he’s obsessed with Theon’s dimples and legs, then Theon’s definitely obsessed with his hair.

“I used to be chubbier back then” Robb states at some point, and Theon nods right back, “You used to be adorable”.

Yeah, Robb knows he really thinks that: he remembers how Theon used to hold his hips, or thighs, and whispering how much he loved how soft they were.

“And you used to wear such skinny ripped jeans that made your legs look so sexy” he claims afterwards, bouncing lightly on Theon’s lap.

“My legs are still sexy”.

“I never said they weren’t anymore.”

They chuckle some more. Robb lays his chin on Theon’s shoulder, as he feels him playing with the curls on his nape.

“Actually how is it even possible that we didn’t hook up sooner?” Robb asks at some point, “I mean, I was totally into you”.

He can’t remember not being into Theon, not even when he was just a kid: Theon had always had this charming aura surrounding him, something that made it impossible for Robb to take his eyes off him.

“Cause we’re dumb and slow, babe.” The answer comes out Theon’s mouth not even after a second Robb asked his question. “Did you forget how much it took us to actually decide we were in a serious relationship after we hooked up?”

Robb loves how thinking about it now, years later, makes him laugh so hard, cause back in the days, not knowing what he and Theon really were drove him mad. He used to spend sleepless nights thinking about how he should have brought up a conversation about it, how to decide what they were, if they were something. When it was actually so easy to understand.

“We literally went on for months calling it a friendship with benefits when we just kept going on dates and cuddling all the time and talking about everything” he smiles.

Theon smiles back, “And everyone started screaming like we fucking won the World Cup for the first time in a century after we told them we were a thing”.

Oh yeah, he’s definitely never forgetting Arya running to the fridge to break out the sparkling wine as she yelled something like “it was about time!”

“Feels like ages ago” he whispers, and suddenly he realizes what Theon means when he says he’s getting old: when he was nineteen, the things he did at thirteen seemed to have happened just a few months ago to him. Now it’s a whole different story, cause he’s no longer a teen, and many things have changed.

“Yeah, back when Loras and Renly didn’t have to bring the baby on double dates cause they didn’t have a baby” Theon mumbles.

Robb nods, although it’s not a surprise that Loras and Renly were the first one becoming parents, in their crew: they’ve been together since anyone can remember, they probably lost count of how many years they’ve been together. Robb has to admit, he had always envied them for that.

“It’s funny cause every time I looked at them I knew they would’ve lasted forever, like, I just knew they would have always been together”, he says, “And I’ve always hoped it could have been the same for us too”.

Theon’s eyes are staring right into Robb’s, one hand massaging his thigh. He shrugs, “Well, look at us now babe. I am an old man and you are a hottie in his mid 20s”.

“You’re only thirty, for fuck‘s sake” Robb can’t help but lightly smack the back of Theon’s head.

“Yeah exactly!” Theon exclaims, like that can explain it all. “First I start getting old. Then I’ll grow grey hair. And then? Then what’s next?”

Robb shrugs, “Then I’ll get older too!”

“And then?”

“And then, I don’t know, then maybe we could have a baby or-“

Robb shuts up the moment he sees Theon’s eyes widening. He doesn’t know how he’s come up with something like this, they never talked about it. Well, Robb did think about it, but never too seriously. Why shouldn’t he, after all? They’re married, and Theon’s always been surprisingly good with kids, even if he says he doesn’t like them. And Robb would like to have a (or some) little munchkin to take care of.

But maybe that wasn’t the right way to bring it up.

“I’m sorry” he says, “I’ve rushed things, sorry. Let’s have some cake, shall we?”

He gets up, grab two small plates, two small forks and a knife and lets Theon cut the cake, since it’s his cake. He still sit back down on his husband’s lap, though, and Theon seems happy to welcome him back by wrapping his free arm around his waist.

“It’s delicious.” He says, after a few bites. Robb nods.

And then they stay silent. Robb’s tense and hopes his fuck up won’t make them fight. He just hope they can pretend nothing happened and eventually start talking about it some day, possibly in a better way.

But then, Theon rests the fork on the plate, cake still to be finished, and turns to Robb. “I would actually love to.”

Robb feels some weird, relieved, happy, feeling grow inside of him, making its way from his stomach to his throat.

“What?” he asks, just in case he’s all imagining this.

Theon rolls his eyes and smacks a hand lightly on Robb’s thigh, “Oh don’t play dumb. I’d love to have a baby with you”.

Robb has to blink a few times, smiling so wide his cheeks hurt, “You would?”

“Yes”.

He really wants to kiss him, he really does. He actually doesn’t know how he’s managing to stay this calm cause the one they’re about to take is a huge step, probably the hugest of their lives.

“Maybe we should take it slow and… try and figure a lot of things out.” He says, “Like, are we adopting or are we going to look for a surrogate or-“

Theon grabs his hand, nodding. He’s surprisingly calm too.

“There’s time for that” he agrees. “Let’s take it slow, of course. Just know that we’re adults, we have jobs, a roof above our heads… we can afford it. We can afford to do anything”

Robb nods, “So, we’re going to be parents at some point. We agreed on this.”

When Theon nods in return, then Robb does kiss him. Fondly. He can’t believe it, he can’t believe how this feels like the proof that Theon is and will always be the only one meant for him: cause Robb wants to spend the rest of his life with him, and their kid. Or kids. And he can’t believe that they actually decided they are going to be parents at some point.

It’s so unbelievable he can hardly imagine it: Theon holding a baby, wrapped in a small blanket. Theon and Robb raising a kid, for the rest of their lives. He wants it, and he loves that Theon wants it just as much.

“We’re really getting older, aren’t we?” he says when he pull away, as Theon reaches over to wipe a tear away from Robb’s cheek.

He winks, and starts whispering, “Yeah but… we’ll never be too old for sexy times”.

And suddenly Theon stands up so quickly Robb doesn’t even realize he scooped him up at first.

“Thee! For fuck’s sake I’m usually the one who picks you up!” He yells, as Theon quickly leads them to the living room. Sometimes he still feels like they’re just kids, though. And he loves it. He’ll still be loving it when they will actually grow old, cause he knows deep inside they’ll always be those two stupid kids.

“Turning thirty made me stronger babe” Theon says, as he lays Robb down on the couch.

Robb looks up at him, smiling. Funny how life works: they hooked up once and now they just said they want kids.

It all started with some drunk birthday sex and it’s still going on, it’s still evolving. And Robb knows, it’s also never going to end.

[xhuth]

anyway going back to my tag rant in that post about teens thinking anything 20+ is “old” like i dont know how to describe why that makes me so mad lol. just extremely resent the prevalent notion people lose worth or potential after a very arbitrarily young age which is totally entrenched in some greater shit.

my other roommate (same age) was disagreeing (politely because emotional maturity is what actually matters—) over some ages like 30+ being “old” by definition or somethinf and it just hits me in a weirdly personal way for no particular reason, maybe because of the older parents thing or spending the majority of my childhood interacting with much older ppl online (under the guise of being the same age lmfao) plus finding myself resonate a lot more with those older than me as a child, between those internet friends and my parents’ friends, than with my own classmates in elementary/middle school who i was only kinda “friends” with in proximity but not actually really friends with at all. also the “growing up faster” due to childhood parental abuse lol. but yeah even if you act like 60s is “elderly”, or even in the case of some kids, “ancient”, im gonna side-eye u lmfao

just super hate the really prevalent idea of it being “too late” to do things because of age and i think it does an immense amount of harm and holds so many ppl back arbitrarily. also not to mention the misogynist shit that also gets paired with ageism where shitty ass teens or even early 20s ppl see a woman over 25 in fandom and think theyre so funny going “haha shouldnt you be taking care of ur kids 🤪” or whatever like that isnt one of the most blatantly textbook misogynist things ever

[laurawritesandgames]

A Day Late, Sorry!

Title: Reefer Madness

Fandom: Beetlejuice (Musical)

Rating: PG-13

Pairing: Beetlejuice/Adam/Barbara, mention of Charles/Delia

Prompt: Parenting

Content Warning: Set during coronavirus pandemic, underage drug use

Summary: When Lydia is caught smoking pot, the Maitland-Deetz household has to come up with a punishment. But how do you discipline a teen during a pandemic? And will Beetlejuice even let the parents (and ghostly parental figures) punish his BFF? 

The door to the Maitland-Deetz home opened. Lydia came in, wearing her mask and gloves, with Beetlejuice hovering beside her.

Barbara stopped mixing cookie dough to say hello. “How did it go?” The Maitland-Deetz adults had agonized about letting Lydia go to a class picnic organized by Claire Brewster’s mother during a pandemic.

Claire’s mother had tried to make the picnic as safe as possible. She and a few other parents were chaperones, everyone was required to test negative for coronavirus before showing up, the picnic was outdoors, everyone was expected to wear a mask and socially distance, and Winter River High’s Grade 10 class was only 20 kids. Charles had gone with Lydia to a few Black Lives Matter protests, and those had had many more people than this picnic.

Lydia had been so bored of quarantine that she’d actually wanted to engage with her classmates, which had been the deciding factor.

“It went well.” Lydia threw her disposable mask and gloves into the trash bin by the door. “It was nice to see everyone.”

Beetlejuice’s smell of rotting flesh was worse than usual. Barbara winced, waving her hand in front of her face. “Can you turn it down, please?”

“Turn what down?” Beetlejuice said too innocently.

“Anyway,” Lydia said, walking up the stairs, “my introvert battery is drained. I need to recharge.”

Beetlejuice followed her. “And I need the hot goss!”

Barbara let the two friends have their time together, though she was a little disappointed she hadn’t gotten more out of Lydia. That’s teenagers, I guess. I’ll try again later.

As Lydia washed her hands, Delia’s voice sounded in the hallway upstairs. Lydia responded back. Barbara returned to the kitchen, and had just picked up the mixing bowl when Delia’s shocked “Lydia Lilith Deetz!” rang through the house.

Barbara teleported up to the second floor of the house to see Delia and Lydia glaring at each other in the hallway with Beetlejuice floating beside Lydia. Adam teleported up a moment later.

“Young lady,” Delia said, “I can’t believe you. Smoking weed? Really? I thought you were smarter than that.”

Weed? Barbara sniffed the air, but couldn’t smell anything beyond Beetlejuice’s stink.

“It’s faint, but it’s there,” Delia insisted. She patted her faintly bulging stomach. “I have smell sensitivity, thanks to the child. And I have certainly smelled enough weed in my day!”

Lydia opened her mouth, closed it, then shrugged. “So what? Weed’s legal in tons of countries except for most of this fascist dictatorship.”

“What?” Barbara blurted out as Adam gasped.

“Where pot is legal, it’s legal for adults over 25,” Delia said. “You’re 16! Your mind is still developing.”

“Because you never, ever did pot when you were my age, Delia.”

“And it’s hardly something I’m proud of! Years from now, do you want to be looking for your underwear after a night with a drummer from a Duran Duran cover band? This is how it starts!”

Lydia snorted while Beetlejuice said, “I mean, if the drummer’s hot, yeah, sign me up.” He paused. “Who am I kidding? The drummer doesn’t even need to be that hot.”

Adam frowned at Beetlejuice. “And you’re covering for Lydia. When did you find out about this?”

Beetlejuice glanced at Lydia, who shrugged and gestured him forward. “Lyds flagged me down when she got near the house.”

“And you helped her cover this up without a second thought.”

“’Course I did! Oh nooooo, a teen did some weed. Who cares?”

“You’re the adult in this situation—”

Beetlejuice floated backward, gasping and clutching his chest. “You take that back, sir! I am not!” He paused. “Well, not an adult like you mean it.” Anxious, he bobbed in front of Lydia. “I’m a cool adult. Right, kid?”

“Totally.” There was a faint sarcastic edge to her voice, but he didn’t appear to catch it.

“You all heard her say it!” Beetlejuice said proudly.

A terrible thought occurred to Barbara. “You didn’t share the joint, did you?”

Lydia looked hurt. “I’m not risking coronavirus to get high!” Reluctantly, she added, “We each had our own joint.”

“And who brought them?” Adam asked.

“A goat-footed man offered them to us for the price of signing our name in his book. He said he would visit us again on the dark of the moon to complete his dark pact.” She smirked. “I’m sure it’s nothing.”

“Lydia….” Delia said.

“Or maybe we found them on the ground and smoked them like the reckless teens that we are. I can’t remember.”

“Where is this attitude coming from?” Barbara asked. “This isn’t like you.”

Lydia glared at her, so angry that Barbara almost took a step back. “’Not like me’? We met four months ago! You don’t even know me. At least this one,” she jabbed a finger at Delia, “was supposed to be my life coach, so Daddy filled her in on the basics. Not that she ever bothered to get to know me, either.”

Beetlejuice laughed. “Aw, man, she burned you guys so good.”

“We’re going to talk with your father,” Delia said, “and come up with your punishment.”

Barbara was touched that she’d included Barbara and Adam.

Lydia laughed coldly. “Good luck getting Daddy to punish his little girl.” She strode confidently over to her room and closed the door.

“I’m gonna grab Lyds some chips,” Beetlejuice said. “She’s probably got the munchies!”

“You know,” Barbara said, “you could stay and—”

“Deuces, nerds!” He teleported away. A few moments later, his voice sounded in Lydia’s room along with the crinkling of a plastic bag.

Disappointing but not surprising. When Beetlejuice returned from the Netherworld, he’d made it clear he wasn’t interested in parenting Lydia or any Deetz children that came along.

As they walked downstairs to Charles’s office, Delia said, “My parents never punished me for anything in my life. They let me drink and smoke as long as I was in the basement, where they could keep an eye on me.”

“I went to some parties and stayed out past curfew in Grade 12,” Barbara said. “Mom and Dad grounded me. This one,” she nodded to Adam, “never saw a punishment in his life.”

“That’s not true, honey,” Adam said. “One time, I was doing math homework and I looked up my answers in the back of the textbook. I confessed an hour later and got extra chores for the rest of the week.” He looked thoughtful. “Grounding Lydia seems pretty redundant. Unless someone else holds another picnic, it probably won’t come up. The living are all stuck inside anyway.”

Delia sighed. “I know! And we can’t take away her phone. It’s her lifeline to the outside world! I don’t want to affect her mental health.” She bit her lower lip and stopped walking. “Perhaps we should let this go. She’s still healing from losing Emily. And no way am I going to be the evil stepmother! If Charles punishes her, she’ll probably blame me!” She glanced anxiously between Adam and Barbara.

“We won’t let her do that,” Barbara said. “We’ll be a united front.”

“Using marijuana recreationally is illegal,” Adam said. “I know not all of us agree with that law,” he nodded to Delia, “but it is the law, and she deliberately broke it. She could’ve been arrested! It’s our duty to show her there are consequences for her actions.”

“As soon as we figure out what those consequences are,” Barbara said. “You know, I read a parenting blog that said parents could ask their older teens to suggest their own punishments. Maybe she’ll come up with a good one.”

Delia rubbed her temples. The pregnancy was taking a lot out of her; she was tired and achey most of the time. “Well...let’s go see what Charles thinks.”

She knocked on the door to his office. After a few moments, Charles opened it. Seeing the looks on their faces, he frowned. “What did the demon do this time?”

“Surprisingly,” Barbara said, “he’s not the problem. It’s Lydia.”

*

Charles took charge immediately. After explaining his plan and getting everyone’s agreement, he asked to see Lydia in the living room.

Lydia came downstairs and Beetlejuice phased through the floor to hover by her side. While Beetlejuice slouched and scowled at everyone, Lydia looked totally confident. She didn’t blush or frown as she faced her entire family.

When Barbara had come home from Miranda’s party, she’d frozen and stammered when she’d seen her father in the living room. I wonder what Dad felt when I stayed out past curfew? Did he expect something like this? Was he grateful I wasn’t coming home drunk? I wish I’d asked him. She’d never know, now. It stung, but she had more important things to focus on.

Like whatever chaos Beetlejuice had in mind. He wasn’t going to take his best friend getting punished without a fight.

“Lydia,” Charles said, “Delia, Adam and Barbara told me what happened at the picnic. You smoked marijuana, breaking both a law and a house rule. I want to see a 5,000-word essay on my desk by the end of the week about the effects of marijuana on a young person’s development. This essay must be the same quality as one you’d do for school. Use the Chicago Manual of Style for reference and citations.”

Lydia chuckled. “You can’t be serious.”

“We’ll just plagiarize it anyway!” Beetlejuice said.

“I can Google an essay just as well as you can,” Charles said, unperturbed. “I’ll be sure to check that your work is your own.”

Her eyes narrowed. “It was just one joint, Daddy. It’s not a big deal. I’m not going to become the school drug dealer or anything—if we’re even going back to school in the fall.”

“Delia, the Maitlands and I disagree. We think it is a big deal. And since you live in our house, you have to follow our rules.”

Beetlejuice turned to Lydia. “Kid, I can get us out of this house anytime you want with a snap of my fingers.”

“And go where, Beej?” Lydia crossed her arms over her stomach. “I know you’re trying, but c’mon. It’s a global pandemic.”

Beetlejuice’s spiky hair deflated a little bit. “Oh, right.”

Charles took a step toward his daughter. More gently, he said, “Lydia, I’m not insensible that you’re facing more stress than anything I ever felt at your age. First, Emily died, then the pandemic happened, and now quarantine…. Not to mention the changes that have happened to our family.” Lydia’s gaze flicked to Delia’s stomach. “If you want to talk about what led you to make this decision, we’d all welcome that.”

Beetlejuice scoffed. “Why she did it? To be a badass!” He held out his fist for a fistbump. Lydia didn’t reciprocate, but watched her father thoughtfully instead. Good. Barbara began to relax. That means she’s listening.

“If you don’t want to talk to us,” Adam said, “we can increase your therapy sessions to two times a week.”

“I’m sick of journaling and breathing exercises!” Lydia snapped. “Nothing works! Even that stupid joint didn’t! I’ve been stuck inside for months because of a pandemic our country’s leaders are too chickenshit to deal with. I’m a privileged beneficiary of a racist, capitalist system that’s destroying the world. And I’ve literally seen what’s on the other side. Nothing gets better. This life is all we get, and it’s shit.”

She stepped closer to her father, her eyes never leaving his face. “And now, I have to do a stupid essay because I did something I thought would make it all bearable for one fucking minute!”

Her family had to do more for her. Lydia had taken antidepressants for months on the advice of her doctor—perhaps she needed her dose readjusted. If this therapist wasn’t helping, they’d find another. Adam and I could make an activity schedule to give her day some more structure, so it’s not just scrolling through social media. And Beetlejuice can probably think of lots of fun things to do—well, fun and slightly terrifying things, but Lydia loves that kind of stuff.

Charles reached out for a hug, but Lydia stepped back, hands out to push him away if he tried.

“Oh, Lydia, sweetheart, I know things are tough right now—” Barbara began.

“Mom wouldn’t do this to me!”

Charles recoiled slightly, his arms dropping.

Even Lydia seemed surprised that she’d said that, but she quickly added, “Mom wouldn’t have punished me for one joint. She would’ve understood me. She would’ve cared. And you know it.”

Charles raised his eyebrows. “Lydia, you’ve built Emily up in your mind as this creative, anarchic madwoman, and she certainly was. But do you seriously think she would be unconcerned if you started doing drugs? We had countless conversations about how to parent you, particularly in those final months when we knew…we knew she wouldn’t be around. This is the punishment we worked out together.”

“You’re lying.”

“I’m not. This is literally what she would have wanted me to do.”

Lydia stared at her father. Her chin began quivering as tears welled up in her eyes. Barbara almost teleported to her, but stopped. Is it my place? I’m just the ghost parent, not her real one….

At some point, Beetlejuice had floated over to her and Adam. He was watching Lydia and Charles intently, as if looking for something.

Lydia sniffled, swallowed, then said, “Fine, I’ll do your dumbass essay.”

“What? C’mon, kid!” Beetlejuice gestured to Charles. “Don’t give in to The Man!”

Lydia gave him a small smile. “Not everyone has the energy of an undead demon, Beej.” She tossed her hair. “Besides, Dad, all the research that’s out there says pot should be legalized for recreational use, anyway.”

“Not for 16-year-olds.”

“We’ll see.” She turned around and went upstairs.

“Bet you loved that, fascists,” Beetlejuice said to the parents and parental figures. But Beetlejuice usually got over things quickly as long as they didn’t directly involve him, so it wasn’t surprising when he slung his arms over Barbara and Adam’s shoulders and smirked. “Babs, Sexy, if you wanna make out to forget your guilt that you made Lydia hate you, you where know I be.”

Lydia stopped halfway up the stairs. “‘Hate you’? God, BJ, you’re so dramatic. I don’t hate them. They’re completely overreacting, but they’re just being parents. It’s their job.”

That threw him—he blinked at her a few moments, then shrugged. “So it wasn’t my best pickup line. Instead of criticizing my game, go…I dunno, cry about your dead mom some more.”

“Beetlejuice!”

At least Lydia didn’t appear hurt. She rolled her eyes and raised her middle finger at Beetlejuice before going upstairs.

Charles huffed. “I think the next thing we’re going to work on is crude language and gestures. I’ve been quite lax about that and someone—” he eyed Beetlejuice “—has been a bad influence.”

“We should also not joke about people’s traumas, Bug,” Adam said.

Beetlejuice grunted. To Barbara’s surprise, he didn’t say ‘She started it!’ He was legitimately thinking about something.

Delia sat down on the living room couch, sighing in exhaustion. “Well! We got through it. Huzzah, everyone!” She glanced at Beetlejuice. “Except you,” she said coolly.

“Things got pretty tense there,” Adam said. “It’s lucky I don’t have a body, or I might have had a small panic attack.”

“Most of the thanks goes to Charles,” Barbara said.

“I was happy to take the lead on this one. I have the most experience, after all. Unfortunately, this is hardly the first time I’ve had to discipline her. She’s not always the most attentive to her studies.”

“Really?” Adam asked. “But she’s so intelligent.”

“Which means she doesn’t always feel challenged, so she puts off her homework and assumes she can complete it the evening before it’s due.”

“Wow, I had no idea.” Barbara had pictured Lydia as a young woman much like Adam, eager to learn and devoted to school. Lydia is right. We don’t know each other that well.

“Do you think we should talk to her psychiatrist again?” Barbara asked.

Charles nodded. “I was thinking that, as well.”

Beetlejuice poofed away in the puff of smoke as the parenting talk continued. Remembering his unusual thoughtfulness, Barbara resolved to speak to him later.

*

Beetlejuice appeared as if summoned when, an hour later, Barbara pulled her chocolate chip cookies out of the oven.

“Ooo! They’re all goopy!” Beetlejuice snagged one, and didn’t seem to mind that it was hot.

“We got some news on where the weed came from,” Barbara said as he ate. “Claire’s mom called Charles during our meeting. Near the end of the picnic, five of the kids said they wanted to check out the empty school. Lydia was one of them. They disappeared from view for around 10 minutes. The chaperones figured they just wanted to get out of cleaning duty, and nobody thought much of it because the party was wrapping up. Claire’s mom apologized over and over again. I don’t think she’s going to be hosting any more class picnics. Poor woman. We still don’t know who brought the drugs, though.

“Er, I hate to ask, but…it wasn’t you, right?” Beetlejuice was quite casual about drug use, and Lydia could talk him into anything.

Beetlejuice didn’t mind being suspected of providing drugs to children. Maybe to a demon, that was a mark of pride? “I was watching Farscape with Adam during the picnic. I only teleported away when I heard Lyds say my name.” He could always hear the living say it, for some reason.

“The person watching Farscape could’ve been a clone, though.”

“Ooo, now you’re thinking like a demon, babe! But for real—no way would I bring joints for some teens and not for myself. Am I really that generous?”

“You’re right. Sorry, I just had to make sure.”

He winked at her. “I wouldn’t trust me either, baby.” He bit into his third cookie.

“You seemed caught off guard earlier when Lydia said she didn’t hate us. What was that about?”

He shrugged. “Just trying to make myself fart to break the tension.”

“Well, I know that’s a fib. You’re always able to fart.”

He stopped chewing, thought for a moment, swallowed, then said, “Eh…guess I’m just not used to kids and parents not hating each other.”

She touched his free hand. When he didn’t pull away, she wrapped her fingers around it. “That’s awful.”

“That’s life. And the afterlife, I guess, since Ma was there too.” He frowned. The hand she was holding twitched, like he wanted to start fiddling with something like he always did when he was upset or anxious. “Whatever. I killed her with a sandworm, the scene ended on my hilarious joke, and the audience got a happy ending. It all worked out.”

“If you want to talk some more about your mother, Bug—”

“Why, so I can cry about my dead mom, like Lyds? Sing a song about it? Not my brand, babes. I don’t even think about Mom.” He focused very intently on the cookies on the baking tray as he said, “I think about you and Sexy and Lyds, sometimes Chuck and Delia. You’re the people I care about, not that bi—sorry, sorry, that was gonna be a gendered slur, but I caught myself.”

“I’m proud of you.” Barbara leaned over and kissed his cheek.

He grinned. “You know, I don’t think I hear that enough from you guys. I could kill so many people, and I never do. A little more ‘good job, Beetlejuice!’ would be nice.”

“We’ll try.” She kissed his lips. As she pulled back, he leaned closer and kept the kiss going. Then a goopy finger brushed her nose, leaving a trail of warmth down it.

Beetlejuice pulled away, chuckling. “You look like you ate poop.”

She rolled her eyes (was she picking that up from Lydia?) and wiped the melted chocolate off her nose. Beetlejuice hadn’t used the kiss as an excuse to grab all the cookies on the tray, which was surprising.

Not that Beetlejuice was done with the cookies. He grabbed two more then floated out of her reach.

“Do you mind if I tell Adam about this conversation?” she asked. Adam, Barbara and Beetlejuice hadn’t been in a polyamorous relationship long; Barbara wanted boundaries to be extra clear to avoid hurt feelings and miscommunication.

“Girl, you know I love when people talk about me.”

“Even stuff about your mother, which might be a little more complicated than you’re pretending it is?”

“Or maybe it’s not complicated at all? I’m a simple guy, babes.”

“You do like to say that, yes.”

“But, eh, don’t tell Sexy all the crap I said about kids and parents and shit. He’ll just wanna talk. Bleh. Pretend I was always my normal awesome self.”

“Hey, Bug,” she said lightly, “I think opening up to someone you care about is pretty awesome. So, to me, you were always your normal awesome self.”

“Dork.” But he was smiling as he poofed away.

When the cookies cooled, she put two on a plate, poured a glass of milk, and went upstairs.

She checked in on Adam next. She’d left him reading in their bedroom, but now he was staring out the window at the cemetery.

“Hi, sweetie,” she said.

“Hi.” He didn’t turn around.

“Do you want to go visit them?” That cemetery held his parents’ graves. They’d died in a car crash coming home from a Christmas party five years ago.

He nodded. “I know we can’t stay for long because of the sandworms, but just for a few minutes….”

“When Lydia’s done her essay, maybe she could come, too. She’s mentioned wanting to have a solo picnic in the graveyard sometime.”

“That’d be nice. I hope Mom and Dad approved of how we handled Lydia. They probably would’ve liked a good prayer circle, but the Deetzes aren’t that kind of family.” He sighed, rubbing at his eyes. “They were good people, in their way. They knew farm life wasn’t for me, and they never made me feel bad about choosing my own path.”

“Your family was so welcoming when we started dating.”

He chuckled, smiling at her over his shoulder. “Most of that was shock, I think. They bent over backwards because they knew you were too good for me.”

They’d told this joke at parties before. Barbara laughed dutifully. “Your mom never gossiped. You’ve lived here your whole life—you know how rare that is. Most people just can’t wait to spill the beans. But I could tell her anything.”

Adam’s smile dropped. “I couldn’t.”

His parents had probably been part of the reason he hadn’t come out as bisexual until after his death. Barbara set the plate and glass down and joined him at the window, resting her hand on his shoulder.

“I have no idea what I’m going to tell them when we find them in the Netherworld,” Adam said. “’Hi, Mom and Dad, here’s my wife and my boyfriend. I have an open marriage now! I’ve slept with a man who’s not actually a man! He’s a demon.’”

“Well, saying it all at once is a bit much,” she said lightly. “You might need to lead up to it.”

A smile twitched the corners of his lips before he sighed and stared out the window again.

She rubbed at his shoulder, tense under her hand. “We have time to figure it out. We’re not going anywhere for a while. And maybe their perspective will have shifted in all those years in the Netherworld?”

“You’re right. I shouldn’t worry about it. And maybe the fact that we sort of have a child now means they’ll overlook a few sins.”

No, we live with a child. She’s not ours in any way. Barbara said, “Actually, I wanted to talk to you about that.”

Adam turned away from the window and looked at her, concerned.

*

Barbara and Adam approached Lydia’s room 20 minutes later. Lydia’s door stood out against the pale gray wall; she’d had her door wallpapered to make it look like a dingy, cobwebbed hallway with a mysterious figure at the end of it. Barbara knocked; Lydia groaned.

Opening the door, Lydia looked unenthused. “Is this the real punishment—everyone coming to check up on me?” The cookies didn’t even elicit a smile, though she took them with a curt, “Thank you.” She waved them in. “Shut the door, take a seat. Let’s get this over with.”

Her room was messier than Barbara would’ve preferred, with socks everywhere and a pile of folded laundry still in its hamper. Lydia set the cookies and milk down next to a new pile of books on her nightstand. There were already bookmarks in The New Jim Crow: Mass Incarceration in the Age of Colorblindness and Yes You Can! Your Guide to Becoming an Activist. Lydia had been ordering books from local bookstores like crazy during the pandemic.

“You missed Delia.” Lydia half-sat, half-fell onto her bed, bouncing a little. “‘Peep these stones, girl! They’ll unblock your chakras because they’re fire. But they’re actually stones.’ I got her out of here by hissing some words in Klingon over her stomach. She thought I was cursing her unborn child—it was great! And, no.” She swung her legs up to stretch out. “That doesn’t mean I hate the fetus. They can’t help being incubated in the world’s worst person. So you can tell Beetlejuice that, if he’ll listen to you. He thinks he knows me so well.” She chuckled. “He only thinks that because he thinks I’m a human version of him. Everything’s a Mommy-or-Daddy issue with that guy.”

She laced her hands behind her head. Her black dress blended in with her black duvet cover and the rooms black walls, making the pale white skin of her face stand out sharply. “And, of course, Daddy dearest came by. Did we cry a bit over my dead mother? I plead the fifth.” She looked at Barbara and Adam, waving a hand. “Speak! Impart to me your undead wisdom. Cure this troubled child of her afflictions.”

Barbara and Adam had worked on what they were going to say, but it took a few moments to absorb everything Lydia had just said. She’d be good in theatre. Maybe we could look into Zoom classes….

Adam sucked in a breath. “Lydia, we’ve been talking about what you said to Barbara earlier today. About how we’ve only known each other for a few months.”

Lydia’s eyebrows twitched up. “Oh…kay?”

Barbara spoke next. “You’re completely right. We don’t actually know you. And once I realized that, I realized it was presumptuous of us to join in with your father and stepmother while they were disciplining you today. It made me think about how we joined this family in the first place. You agreed to let us stay, and we’ll always be grateful. But you also agreed after a very traumatic experience, and none of us really knew what it meant to share our lives together, living and dead.

“We all sort of fell into these roles after Beetlejuice left. We became like your second set of parents. We’ve been calling you our adopted child and everything. But…well, you’re not. And you already have a father and a stepmother.”

Lydia sat up on her bed, facing the ghosts, her jaw tense. “You’re—you’re not leaving, right? For the Netherworld?” She swallowed, gaze darting between the two of them.

Adam shook his head. “Of course not, Lydia,” he said gently. “Our boyfriend hates that place, for one thing. And we want to be here for you and the new baby.” He nodded to Barbara to continue.

“But,” Barbara said, “that doesn’t mean we need to be in your life as parents. We could just be two roommates. We could chat over dinner, watch TV together, maybe bake something once in a while. But if you don’t want us to be, we don’t need to be so involved in how you’re raised. That’s Charles’s and Delia’s job.”

Lydia was clutching her fingers together tightly. “I never even bothered to ask—did you want kids while you were alive?”

“We did…theoretically,” Adam said. “That’s the next step in the life plan once you own a home, right? Some of our friends had four kids already. But in practice, we had a lot of fears holding us back. If we’d been braver….” He looked away, sighing, before he looked back at her. “But we weren’t, and we can’t change that now.”

“Or we might have had a child and hated it,” Barbara added. “Who’s to say?” She patted Adam’s hand. “It’s a bit of a complicated topic for us. You’re a child, Lydia. You shouldn’t have to carry a dead couple’s wishes and regrets.”

Lydia’s gaze dropped to her hands, still gripping each other on her lap. It wasn’t an easy thing they were asking. Barbara gave her silence and space to think.

“You’re not who I want,” Lydia said, looking up at them. “I’ll always want my mother. I apologize for the bluntness, but Mom always made friends with the elephant in the room, and I’m my mother’s daughter.”

“Of course, sweetie—ah, Lydia.” Barbara cleared her throat. “It’s only natural.”

“But you two…. You made me feel normal even when I was so alone.” Her voice was getting quieter and quieter. “You always listened to me talk about her. And you’re…you’re part of the reason I came back from the Netherworld.”

Barbara chuckled softly. “You’re the reason we stayed in the world of the living, originally. We had to defeat Beetlejuice and keep you safe. But that doesn’t mean we need to act as a second set of parents. I’m not sure that’s fair to you.

“Lydia, we don’t have to decide anything right now. We can talk about this tomorrow, or a week from now, or a month.”

Lydia’s dark gaze locked on Barbara. Her eyes shone with tears under a heavy frown. “You probably don’t even want me as a daughter,” she spat. “You probably dreamed of some little girl in pretty pink dresses who played with dolls instead of skulls. I’m too complicated, too messy. But you don’t want to say it. That’s not nice, and you two are nothing but nice. Just stop being cowards! Make it easy on us!”

“Oh, Lydia, honey….” Barbara couldn’t stop herself from reaching out to her. She held Lydia as the girl’s tears started falling. Adam sat down on Lydia’s other side, stroking her back. She rested her head on Barbara’s shoulder.

“I love you guys,” Lydia whispered thickly.

“And here I go,” Barbara said as she started crying, too. “We love you too, sweetie.”

“We would’ve been honoured to have a daughter like you,” Adam said, tearing up. He hovered the Kleenex box over to them, so they could wipe their eyes and noses without breaking the hug.

“I am so fucking sick of crying,” Lydia grumbled as she dabbed her nose.

Barbara wiped her eyes. “Language.”

“Right. Daddy said he wanted to tackle that next.” She smiled. “I’m sorry you got a daughter at this intemperate age, Maitlands. I was a real peach when I was four.”

“You’re perfect,” Barbara assured her. “You make bad decisions sometimes, but you’re perfect.”

Lydia’s eyeroll was somewhat undercut by the fresh batch of tears.

Adam commented, “I guess we’ll need to work on a parenting schedule with Charles and Delia. See what we can figure out.” Adam sounded cheerful at the thought. He always loved making plans.

Lydia raised an eyebrow. “You’re dating Beetlejuice, but you still love rules and order. You’re a mystery, Adam Maitland. In fact,” she sniffled again, “we’re all mysteries to each other. That’s what started this conversation, isn’t it?

“So, hello, Maitlands. My name’s Lydia Deetz.”

“Hi, Lydia. I’m Barbara Maitland.”

It was time for the Maitlands to get to know their daughter.

[crossdressingdeath]

You know, for people that try to act like JC killing/torturing demonic cultivators was justified...we really don't know anything about the people that he was killing, whether they were actually dangerous people like XY, or people who really had no idea what they were doing and probably needed a good lecture, and not...a death sentence and/or torture. I doubt everyone who used demonic cultivation was some evil mastermind, especially since, unlike in the tv show, WWX actually creates 1/9

demonic cultivation, so it's not like it's been around for years, with big bads like WRH and co. being known for using it like in the show. It's something new, and there are undoubtedly people who probably tried to be copycats of the Yiling Patriarch and had bad intentions, but there were also probably a lot of people who stumbled into it having no idea what they were doing. JC does not discriminate between these groups. When he first meets WWX, and thinks that he is MXY, JC's 2/9

immediate reaction is to say "If you see this sort of evil and crooked practice, kill the cultivator and feed him to your dogs!” At this point what exactly has 'MXY' done to warrant this? He hasn't hurt anyone. He used demonic cultivation to…trip someone over. I'd hardly call that 'evil.' To add to that, MXY is very young (in his 20s I think?), potentially even looking younger because of his smaller stature. So (as far as JC knows), here is a young man, only a few years older than 3/9

some of the Juniors in the novel, who hasn't tried to physically harm anyone, and JC's immediate reaction is to kill him without even trying to figure out his intentions, or question him, or anything. Even worse, he is TEACHING this to an impressionable teenager who will one day be the leader of his sect. He is telling his nephew to brutally murder people with no fair trial, or questioning, and he is using what could essentially be a prank as an example of this 'evil' behaviour. 4/9

…JC, wtf is wrong with you. JL, don't listen to your uncle. People who claim that every single person who used demonic cultivation (or was suspected of it, since it obviously doesn't take much to convince JC) are evil are kidding themselves. And, even worse, people who claim that it's all down to rumours! Seriously, we not only see JL himself acknowledging that it happens - and he saves 'MXY' from his uncle, regardless of the demonic cultivation, because even a teenager can acknowledge that 5/9

things aren't so black and white that everyone who touches demonic cultivation is evil and must be killed - but we also hear it FROM JC's MOUTH. JC all but implies that this is something he regularly does! So don't turn around and write poor uwu JC, a victim of rumours, because he LITERALLY confirms it! And just...JC has this awful habit of putting everyone into one category. There's no grey area with him, no inbetween. He did this with the Wens, where EVERYONE with the last name Wen was 6/9

supposedly evil and deserved to die, and now he's doing it again, where EVERYONE who uses demonic cultivation is evil and needs to die. I'm not saying that them using demonic cultivation is a good thing! We know it can be dangerous, and if even WWX, the person who created it, lost control, then people who probably have no idea what they're doing should not be using it. But like I said, there are probably a lot of misguided, young people using this thing for various reasons, who might not 7/9

realise that they're in over their heads, or just how dangerous resentful energy really is, and if JC really wants to make a difference he should try to EDUCATE these people. Especially if they haven't done anything particularly abhorrent, like 'MXY' who's dastardly deeds at that point had consisted of tripping JL over. JC could talk to these people, try and make them realise that they were doing something wrong, and, if that didn't work, THEN take more physical action. But nope, he's 8/9

Just going to straight up kill them. …Yeah. Just…the fact that this guy sin charge on one of the most prominent sects in the cultivation world, and raising the future of another of the most prominent sects, is genuinely kind of terrifying. This sort of behaviour, this inability to have a more nuanced view of the world, is a very dangerous thing. And view hasn’t changed at all since his teens/early twenties just shows a worrying lack of character growth. 9/9

Oh, JC telling JL to kill ‘MXY’ gets even better, because remember, MXY was JL’s uncle. JC isn’t just getting mad at JL, a thirteen year old, for not cutting a young man who hadn’t actually hurt anyone down without hesitation; he’s getting mad at JL for not killing his uncle. That entire scene is incredibly fucked up. Like, I feel the need to restate this to make it perfectly clear: JC is getting angry at his thirteen year old nephew for not murdering his uncle in cold blood. It’s genuinely horrifying, but it’s completely glossed over so often.

Anyway, you’re right that it’s incredibly unlikely that all demonic cultivators are evil; hell, we know they’re not. WWX is right there. And other than XY and WWX himself, we don’t hear of a single threat coming from a demonic cultivator. The biggest threats to our heroes are righteous cultivators, in fact. There is nothing to suggest the sort of widespread demonic cultivation threat that would even begin to justify JC’s actions. He’s killing them because he wants to kill them, not because they’re a threat. And both JL and JC acknowledge that these demonic cultivators aren’t a threat; JL is willing to free WWX from JC on the grounds that he doesn’t deserve what JC will do to him! The fact that JL is sure JC will do something horrible to WWX if he stays suggests both that the “rumours” are actually fact and that at least some of the demonic cultivators JC catches haven’t done anything to deserve being tortured to death. At least evidence suggests JL is not following in JC’s footsteps.

JC doesn’t want to teach young and foolish demonic cultivators the error of their ways. That could’ve been a very sweet thing; trying to turn people like WWX from following his path to its horrible end. But that’s not what he wants. He wants twisted revenge-by-proxy on the brother who died before he got the chance to do these things to him. It’s like how once WC died JC was no longer interested in justice against the Wen sect, only revenge. Genocide for genocide. JC wants to assuage his own feelings even if it means slaughtering innocents. It’s childish, in a twisted sort of way, like XY’s insistence that anything he does to avenge his own pain is justified no matter how much he does.

...You know, all this makes me wonder if JC becomes another bogeyman for the civilians of the area. “The way you’re acting, Sect Leader Jiang would accuse you of demonic cultivation!” That sort of thing.

[luciferpens]

( HARRY SHUM JR, MALE, HE/HIM ) ⌇ have you seen KAI YEOH around icaria? they are the 35 year old child of HERMES. they remind me of a THOUSANDS OF FILLED BOOK SHELVES, SLIPPERY FINGERS WRAPPED AROUND A LOCKPICK, INFALLIBLE MEMORY, and A CARING NATURE. They’ve been on the island for 18 years.

BASICS

FULL NAME: Kai yeoh

NICKNAMES: K

FACE CLAIM: Harry Shum Jr.

AGE: Thirty-five

SEXUALITY: pansexual & panromantic

DATE OF BIRTH: June 1, 1985

GENDER/PRONOUNS: cis male he/him

EDUCATION: H.S. Diploma. 

OCCUPATION: Librarian

GODLY PARENT: Hermes

GODLY POWERS: Enhanced thievery; he can steal practically anything without being seen. Prophecy & intelligence: These two combined into one allowing Kai to have a perfect memory and ability to tell people small glimpses into their future or their past depending on what he needs to know to help them get to what they need. Persuasion: He can sometimes persuade people into doing whatever he wants or pushing people to do what they actually want to do without inhibitions. 

BIO + BULLET POINTS

Orphan -- dropped off the day he was born or within a day or so

Had a habit of leading parents to their perfect child -- even, no especially, if it wasn’t himself.  Think Good Luck Chuck.

He was a bit chaotic as a little kid -- either soulful guide or a pickpocket trickster. 

TW: Child abuse

At nine he was fostered; but he saw something he shouldn’t have and him, along with the bio kids, were all sent back to the foster system (they were trafficking foster kids)

Was bullied as a kid in school for being a foster kid. 

His second foster home (12) screamed and yelled. so he stole money from them

The third (13) abused him; he was sent into the hospital four times most on life support or something similar. 

The fourth (16) got him addicted to perception drugs. When he was pulled out he went through severe withdrawals but is doing good now.

The fifth (17) he doesn’t even try to think of. Its just dark. He refuses to talk about it. 

End TW

He found out around 17.5 years old that he was a hermes kid after a slip up from a caregiver. Hermes appeared after a prayer and moved him to Icaria

He met Angelia the librarian. His older sister. She treated him like a son and took care of him while also teaching him the ways of the infinite library that moves around the world. (Think TARDIS but just a huge library) 

At 24 he adopted another foster from his old home who he realized was a demigod. Her name is Dory. He’s raised her as his little girl since she was 10.

Angela died when he was 25 and he has since been the head librarian. 

Kai has no earthly idea who his parents are. Or, well at least who his mother is. He arrived at the orphanage’s doorstep on the first of June wrapped in a blanket with talaria embroidered on the blanket. All throughout his infancy he was a calm and quiet child. Why he hadn’t been adopted out right, when babies are usually the first to go? He’s got no idea. All he knows is that for the first five years of his life? Things were relatively normal for someone living in the american orphanage system. He learned to take care of himself, how to bathe, wipe his own ass, how to dress and look semi-decent. No one was going to help him do it -- not really. But, he made friends -- then saw them get adopted and rarely ever saw them again after that. The average life of an orphan in the system.

When he was five though, things started to change. It all started with a simple sentence. “I’M NOT THE ONE YOU WANT, HE IS.” It slipped out of Kai’s mouth before he understood what he was saying, his finger pointed to a boy playing with a toy a few feet away. The parents were confused but took it as a sign Kai didn’t want to go with them. They adopted the kid not long after. This started a chain of events, parents would come in, they’d look at Kai and think “I want him” but Kai would point them to a child they actually wanted, the one that would fit their family best. Think Good Luck Chuck but with adoption instead. This was a trait he kept up for the next 12 years that he was in the foster care system.

Strangely enough -- Kai was okay with it. It kept him out of bad situations with parents who would have ended up sending him back, it kept him with others and helped them find good homes. Sure, it was lonely, it was depressing and quiet at times, but he knew he was doing some good in the world by being there. Besides? Who wouldn’t want to find their perfect family? All those kids got it… he wanted it too. So he worked on himself, he tried to be a model kid, tried to be a happy-go-lucky despite being in the system. As a young boy he was highly intelligent, curious, playful and quick. He was known around the orphanage as both a leader and a trickster. His siblings never quite sure which version of him they were going to get on any given day. Would he be the clever trickster that could steal anything out from under your nose or would he be the soulful guide that helped families find their perfect child? No one knew, hell he didn’t even know.

At 9 he was fostered for the first time, unable to convince the family that he wasn’t who they wanted. (He had no recommendation because no child jumped out to him as being perfect for that family) They took him home and for the first time in his 9 years he saw what a somewhat normal family was like. It started so simply, so happily. Kai was enjoying being part of a family, of having siblings and a mom and dad. The new family took him to the doctors, took him to camps, he had sleepovers with class friends, he played sports. He actually felt like a normal child. Things had been going so well… but life had other plans and he now knows… was trying to protect him. The thing that would end up with him back in foster care, was his insane memory. He could recite anything he ever read, almost any conversation he had. This by itself, not a bad thing, a bit of a burden, but not horrible. (Imagine remembering every word someone ever said to you and feeling like your brain could be overly full at times) The issue came when his mischievous trickster side reared its head and he snuck around the house in the middle of the night when they had a babysitter.

TW: CHILD ABUSE He found things he shouldn’t have, files that talked about how the money they got was spent, files that documented previous children -- ones he saw no proof of around the house. Files that lead a curious 9 year old to recite word for word to his social worker one day on a check up -- and ended with all of the children, even the family’s biological ones being taken away from them. He wouldn’t find out till he was a teen that the family had been “losing” teens for over a decade; claiming they ran away from home and just ended up back in foster care…. When in reality they were trafficking them. Selling the foster kids to the highest bidder; he wouldn’t find out until his mid 20s that most of those kids? They ended up addicted to drugs or dead, abuse of all types having driven them mad.

Back in the home, now 10 going on 11, Kai fell back into old habits; Pointing families to the perfect kid, helping out around the orphanage by taking care of the younger kids, pulling little tricks, stealing small things when he was out and about. Kai was -- back to his normal. An orphan who did his best to hide that fact at school. The kid who stole and lied his way into any clothing or food he would possibly want. An orphan who did his best to look normal. Trying not to get bullied for the oversized, dirty clothes that were a standard of being an orphan. He went in and out of four more foster homes before he aged out of the system. Each one having their own serious issues; It had started with the yelling in the first family since almost being sold. They yelled and screamed and called him all sorts of names. Soon Kai had stopped caring what people said and only cared how they acted. And his own acts? Well he stole money all the time from the family since he felt it was a good payment for dealing with their yelling. Soon he was taken then placed in another home…. This time it was physical, they said little to him and if they did it was always cold and mean. They hit him though, bet the ever living hell out of him. He ended up in the hospital four times on life support before they took him away. The third family had actually been decent -- but the bio kids in the house abused drugs and -- well soon Kai had fallen into that as well. Luckily for Kai he was ripped from that family after a couple of months, and while withdrawal had been hell on earth, he got past it. The fourth? He was 17 when he was put into his fourth and last foster home. And, well the fourth he was there for ten days before he ran away and showed back up at the orphanage. Kai doesn’t talk about what happened in that home, he’ll ignore any references to the last home.

TW END After each incident Kai became a bit colder, a bit more closed off. He went from a happy boy to a teen who’s look could cut you, whose words made you fork over your money and who’s memory you could never doubt and never wanted to go up against (people tried but they always lost that bet.) Once he was back at the orphanage and now 17.4 years old he spent all his free time at school and trying to avoid the home. To avoid seeing kids get their happy endings with their perfect family while he was left without. He made a family of friends and spent much of his free time sleeping over at their houses but -- it was never the same. No place felt quite right. It was around this time that he came back to the home and the oldest care worker was cleaning the kitchen. She started to talk about the night he had shown up. How his blanket had talaria on it and how they almost named him Hermes until they saw the name Kai scribbled onto the blanket. She pulled the blanket out of a closet and handed it over to him. That night he spent hours looking up mythos around Hermes, about where the blanket could have come from and who his mother might have been.

The research -- revealed some interesting things. Little things he had always noticed about himself stuck out as similar to Hermes. The ridiculous ability he had to steal anything without ever being noticed, how easily he could convince people do do whatever he asked, his -- insane memory. Now, Kai had never been a religious kid, but seeing how similar he was to Hermes? He prayed that night to the greek god knowing nothing would happen….. Except it did. Hermes showed up the next morning pretending to be a parent wanting a kid and asked to see the teens. He found Kai and the two spent the next day together -- and that's when Kai learned all about the greek gods, about how HE was a demi-god, about how he had powers and skills and how there was a whole island of people like him. Those who had powers and those who would allow him to -- live his life how he wanted without the shackles of the foster system and american government.

Without a second thought Kai said he wanted to go, he had no skills, no real job experience but -- well it had to be better than this. So Hermes’ took him, he was 17.5 years old when he arrived on the island. Hermes set him up in a house and then -- introduced him to the library. A building that comes and goes as its needed. It can appear anywhere in the world at any moment, it appears, always, as a small one story building that looks like it’d be one -- maybe two medium sized rooms; but when you open the door? It’s massive, as far as the eye can see, floors reaching for the sky, thousands and thousands of rows of shelves. It was bigger on the inside. Just like the TARDIS from his favorite TV show. He was instantly greeted by the librarian, an elderly woman with a sweet smile who grabbed him by the cheeks and said “AH, MY NEW ASSISTANT. NICE TO MEET ANOTHER HERMES KID.” She was like him, able to tell what it was people needed then to give it to them. He was left with her -- and for the first time in his life he actually was home. The stacks of books and this old lady -- this was where he was meant to be.

Angelia became the mother he never had, she taught him how to control his skills; they played games of stealing things from one another without being caught, Angelia taught him languages, she tested his memory, tested his ability to figure out what people really needed -- and then she taught him how to predict the future a derivative power of what people needed and wanted but more precise. Angelia taught him how to cook, how to do basic “adulting” things, she treated him like a human and for the first time in his life? As a kid -- She let him just have fun without worrying about food, about safety and others. And Kai? Kai finally learned to relax -- just a little. He learned to trust… just a little. In Kai’s mind, there was no one better on this earth than Angelia. She was a saint of a demi-god.

For the first time in his life Kai was also able to explore who he was as a person, he came out as bisexual, slept around and actually got himself a boyfriend for a short period of time. The two were quite happy but all good things must come to and end and around the age of 24 the two broke up and went their separate ways. Since then Kai hasn’t settled back down, he’s enjoyed being single and is a frequent face in Phryne much to the dismay of Angelia who wanted nothing more than to see him settle down and get married.

When he turned 23 he met the Larsen kids and realized that one of the children back at the home was irrily similar. After a talk with their father he knew what he had to do. He rushed back and within a week had adopted Dory. Dory had been a child he had seen come in and out of the home since he was 13. A cute little girl who wanted nothing more than to be loved and understood. Her love of bees needng to be appreciated as well. But she kept getting sent back, her love and understanding of bees being to much for most families. He knew she was a demi-god like him and just needed the right family -- and and -- he was the right family. Now she was his. His 10 year old to take care of. He brought her back to the library, set her up in her own room, and spoiled her like he had always wanted to be as a kid himself.

When dory was just hitting 11 she called him papa -- and his heart melted. He became even more wrapped around her finger. He'd do anything for that little girl. Between Angelia and Dory Kai had finally found himself a family and a home. Angelia did her best to try and set Kai up on dates, trying to find him that last little bit of a missing family she wanted so desperatly to see him have. She didn't care if it was a man, a woman or someone non-binary. She just wanted to see her own "adopted" son get something she never had; a true love. Someone to share it all with. A wedding.....

Sadly, Angelia would never get to see him marry. She died just three weeks after his 25th birthday. Kai had had 8 long wonderful years with his older sister/mother. But he had to step up and become the librarian. Before she passed she had trained him in every aspect that was the library. That they had the position and honor of gathering the history of the world in written text. It wasn’t something they actually wrote so much as it was -- like a digital download. The library would appear in a country, a new book would appear on the proper shelf and they’d leave to go onto the next. Over and over again. People came and went to the library -- never questioning why they could only see it once a month, or why they seemed to forget it existed until the day it appeared. They never questioned why they always had to trade knowledge for knowledge they just -- accepted it and moved along.

Kai now is the head and only librarian. He is looking for a pupil, someone to train and help him run the library. A part of him hopes it's another Hermes’ kid… or another orphan. One he can help like Angelia helped him. Kai lives in a smallish apartment inside the library. Kai is an eccentric, fashionable and all around chill guy. He cares deeply about others but does a good job of hiding it behind a facade.

[luobingmeis]

share your mama thoughts!!!! (if you would like to)

you’re gonna look at these and, within 2.5 seconds, say “wow jords the self-projection is strong tn”

or more so “wow jords we really see the dynamics that u yearn for and yet cannot find so u project them onto fictional characters who u look up to in a way u can’t quite understand”

post-writing notes: this got way longer than i expected (the jords ohsweetflips story), so this is going under the cut, but enjoy my huge mama backstory headcanons!!!

first things first, i hc mama as a lesbian, bc i am a lesbian, and i feel very attached to mama, so i hc her as a lesbian (but also i believe that anyone can hc her to be anything that they damn well please)

and, forgive me, i don’t know shit abt west virginian geography, but i think she grew up in a town like aubrey’s? like i know we didn’t get a lot of description of aubrey’s younger life outside her home, but i kinda see mama as having this “old money” type homelife

and bc i, jords ohsweetflips, wish i had a group of lesbian friends so that i could’ve had some guidance in my teen years, i hc that, in her town, she found her way into the small yet secure lesbian “scene” that was just a couple girls around her age (i see her as 15 at this time, with others ranging 15-18) along with a couple who were, like, 19/20

and tbh, just the vibe i get from mama and how she seems much more inclined towards found family than blood relatives, i don’t think she had the nicest folks so, when she came out, that was it, you know?

and tbh i completely see mama (well, madeline at this point) as someone who is very like “i don’t need help, i can do things on my own,” even as a young teen, so i think for, like, a week or two, she did the whole “on her own” things

but bc her friends were absolute angels, and also found out that she had been essentially homeless, two of the girls who are 19 and 20 and have an apartment are like “fuck no, you’re staying with us”

and madeline is at first like “no, really, i’m fine” but the thought of an actually loving home is too tempting to ignore

so from the ages of 15 to 18, she lives with her friends!!! she was fairly good at art at this point so she was able to get some in to the local galleries and shops and make some money off of it, and then when she was around 17, her friends were able to get her a job bussing at the bar they worked in

she also liked to whittle a lot!!! she made a lot of ducks

she was 18 when she decided to move out, and that’s when she heard of kepler. or, more so, she heard of it from another one of her friends who dubbed it as “a place fit for you, mads”

so she managed to save up enough money for an apartment and she moved out of her hometown and absolutely the friends she lived with cried their eyes out when they were helping her move in and tbh even madeline got a bit teary eyed bc they were like family, you know?

and so basically, from the ages of 18-24, she lived in kepler and got her bearings and this was when she started to get really into wood carving!!! she was able to get some pieces out there and get some recognition and, by her mid20s, she was actually making decent money, or at least enough to not be living paycheck to paycheck

in this phase of living in kepler, i think she was in a very “people knew her but she didn’t know them that well” just bc i don’t see her as the type of person to be a “social butterfly”? i think she mostly, tho, became friendly with the man who ran kepler’s local coffee shop, and the wives who owned the little dipper back before it was the hornet’s nest. she’s also def met leo and thacker, but only in passing, mostly. i think, once she got closer to her late 20s/early 30s, she would have heard of duck and juno but, in her being 18-24, they were probably still kids/young teenagers.

WAIT I CAN’T FORGET 1980S MAMA AESTHETIC: whole lot of jackets. she did a lot of thrift shopping so she has so many huge jackets. lot of denim. and leather. work boots. flannel. patches. are you picking up on the self projection yet.

and then, in november of 1988, when she was 24, the gate went up. she encountered her first abomination by accident. she had been out in the woods, just trekking back to her apartment and deciding to take the scenic route, when all of a sudden.... one of the smaller trees started moving? and she was like “well that’s not what trees do” and then she saw that the tree had a jagged mouth dripping with sap and branches acting like long, clawed hands, and she was like “well that ain’t no normal tree”

i don’t have my Big Brave Madeline “Mama” Cobb Origin Battle Story yet but she definitely just chopped the shit out of the tree and it managed to work

i think it would be Very Funny if, very shortly after that, her first sylph was barclay. like, i have a feeling that age works a bit different for sylphs, and honestly i have no clue where they would get the disguises from? maybe heathcliff? but the thought of madeline running into Literal Bigfoot and barclay, maybe like 20yo in sylph age, being like “WAIT DON’T KILL ME” bc this young woman already looks ready for leather is very entertaining

and that’s when mama learns abt the sylphs, and how they’re not abominations, and barclay shows her the gate 

and also yes barclay absolutely stays in her apartment except he is So Hidden bc imagine the chaos of Literal Bigfoot being in her apartment! hysterical!

but, soon, mama crosses over into sylvain and figures out Everything that has gone on and knows abt the crystal shattering and the wars and she realizes that there have been sylphs exiled to earth and she’s like “well that ain’t gonna fly”

so she starts the pineguard and, for that first year, it’s mostly just her? and, at that point, it’s harder to locate sylphs, so she only has barclay and one or two others staying with her and it’s cramped but they’re safe so she’s happy

she meets thacker around... april 1989, i think? i know it was spring. so he helps out, and then they recruit another guy, mike (canonically mentioned in the water arc), and a couple others, and, suddenly, the pineguard is turning into an actual thing

and then, one of the ski lodges up on topside closes, now leaving a completely empty inn just... taking up space...... and it’s only a half mile from the gate........... and she has been making a decent amount of money from her sculptures

before the end of 1989, amnesty lodge is set up and running and, all of a sudden, it’s like she has another real home again. she loves the sylphs she meets and they can be safe with her!!

thacker absolutely has a bunch of “home videos” where, really, he’s just messing around with madeline. it’s almost like a “madeline cobb nature documentary” as she finishes up the lodge and treks through the woods. there’s also some of barclay and moira, and other pineguard members, and other sylphs that show up. he also has his journals and pictures and other books and, at one point, the cellar looks like thacker’s library

also the ballad of bigfoot is absolutely canonical and, after stephanie & griffin & C.M. leave the lodge, thacker has never seen madeline go off like she did on barclay that night. barclay still has some residual fear for hearing mama (who’s a big woman but he is Big Foot so he is definitely just Big) scream up at him “I WILL PUT YOU BACK IN THE WOODS WHERE I FOUND YOU, DON’T YOU TEST ME, BARCLAY”

even tho the two of them don’t talk abt it much, and might not even realize it that early on (picturing like late 20s/early 30s), thacker and mama really are best friends and, tbh, every sylph can see it in the way they bicker yet unconditionally care for each other

madeline almost kicked thacker out of the pineguard when she first found out what he put in his gorp

dani showed up in 2009 and, at the age of 12, she was the youngest sylph amnesty lodge had by a fucking landslide, and that made madeline so angry yet so sad bc this child had been exiled from her home and that was just a thing that could happen

(madeline never got along too well with woodbridge but, after that, knowing that he is the one in charge of the exiles, she could never even be civil with him)

she was immediately protective of dani and was ready to really step in as a parental figure bc she wasn’t abt to let this young girl be without guidance

and she gave dani handmedowns and took her shopping and would make sure that she felt safe and comfortable bc, really, she was the only sylph in the lodge who wasn’t an adult. and, fortunately, barclay was basically an older brother to her and moira looked out for her and i think dani coming into the lodge was what really gave everyone a very big reality check bc, like. she’s a kid

(is it obvious that i’m a bit attached to mama and dani)

and so it should come as no shock that, within a year of dani being in amnesty lodge, madeline became “mama”

and then, in 2011, jake, age 16, showed up, and by then mama was like “alright time to adopt him”

but also, real talk, mama looks out for all her sylphs so much, she’d lay down her life for any of them

when thacker leaves in 2013, she’s at first okay, doing just fine. he promised that he would come back, and she has faith in him. and then months pass. and then a year. and then two. and, all of a sudden, it’s the spring of 2016 and kepler expeditions is officially shut down and mama realizes just how much she misses her best friend.

and, not to mention, the waning of the pineguard.

by the time it gets to the summer of 2018, it’s just her and barclay, the both of them hoping things stay the same, but hope hasn’t gotten them too far

and then they have a fire magician, and a forest ranger with a talking sword, and ned fucking chicane

and now we have reached canon!!! thank u for coming to my ted talk!!!!

also tho, post-finale during the big reunion, thacker is just talking with aubrey and all of a sudden is like “holy shit, you really are like her, aren’t you?” and aubrey is just like “???” and thacker says, “don’t go tellin’ her, because she’ll kick my ass, but talkin’ to you is just like talkin’ to maddie when she was your age” and aubrey is a bit :’)

[dramallamadingdang]

I was going to do this with "in-line" replies, but it just got unwieldy and doing the mentions in a multi-reply reply is a PITA. So we do it this way. A really long (sorry!) post of replies for @taylors-simblr, @niamh-sims, @hugelunatic, @mustluvcatz-reloaded, @simaddicted-sue, @dunne-ias, @pensblr, @mdpthatsme, and @yuichen about kids and stuff...

taylors-simblr replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

I am very happy that Christmas is over, we went to my mums. I had decided it would be lovely, and it was to an extent, but we were there for 5 days and there were too many people and kids and by day 3, I was peopled out and just wanted to get home. Daughter had her 3rd birthday on Friday too and was a horrible mess of over excitement ��, but that’s all over and things are getting back to normal. Except for the piles of toys people bought us, that I have no where to put...

I always feel bad for kids with Xmas-time birthdays. Their special day gets lost in the madness. That’s part of the reason why I always made more fuss over birthdays than Xmas, since my son’s birthday is December 17. Mini-Taylor is young enough not to be resentful, but I hope she'll be OK as she gets older. :)

But yeah, for me, the main problem is that everyone was at my house and stayed here because lodging in this area is scarce and the affordable options have to be booked months or sometimes even years in advance. My son is in the Army and he’s only just home after a long deployment, and the timing of his going home was always in question. When they knew (more or less) for sure when they’d be coming, all of the lodging in the area had long been booked. (This is why we have frequent (adult) houseguests, which I'm perfectly fine with.) The original plan was for my son and his family to stay with his wife's family, which is literally next door because my son married the literal girl next door. That would have been better. Theirs is an enormous family -- 14 kids, 3 bio ones and the rest fosters that were taken in and adopted, most of them still teens and younger -- so they have a huge house and they're well used to little-kid chaos and sort of revel in it. But right before people were scheduled to arrive, their house came down with some severe plumbing problems, and stuffing it with 30+ people was just a no-go. So, they ended up here, at more or less the last minute.

The kids are 4, just past 2, and 7 months old, all in the age range that I can't tolerate. I'm OK with tiny, non-mobile babies, but after they're mobile, I do not want until they're about 8-to-10 or so. So, since they were here, if I wanted peace, I was the one who had to leave my own house. Which isn't terrible or anything in the grand scheme of things, but it is annoying. Plus, the 7-month-old had an ear infection, and flying cross-country didn't help it. They almost cancelled coming out because of it, but the 4-year-old had been promised learning how to snowboard and would have been totally crushed. So then daughter-in-law was going to stay back with 7-month-old, but that seemed unfair to DIL to be deprived of her family, and I and the other grandparents hadn't even seen the younger two kids in person. So, they drugged 7-month-old up to his eyeballs, and did the thing. So 7-month-old was just crabby and awful and had trouble nursing the whole time, which only added to the crabby awfulness, which in turn made 2-year-old awful. (Four-year-old was actually pretty OK the whole time, did learn to snowboard, and sort of fell in love with my husband. Which, you know, I understand. *laugh* They both cried when she left. :) ) I understood that the baby didn’t feel well and the 2-year-old was upset by it, of course, but that doesn't make it any less annoying when they're both screaming more or less 24/7. Gave me terrible flashbacks to my daughter's preemie-baby/toddlerhood. *sigh*

But yeah, I survived to rant about it. :) 

niamh-sims replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

I am a woman who doesn't want my own children (much to the chagrin of many people I speak with), and I struggle with other people's kids. In saying that though, I absolutely adore my 5 year old nephew, he is a dude, and my 9 year old step-son is an old soul and extremely mature with a wicked sense of humour. They're all I need!

I hate the presents aspect of it! 

See, 9-year-olds I'm (usually) fine with. My window of intolerance is from about 6 months through the little-kid years. It seems like when a kid hits 8 or 10 or so that a switch flips in them and their behavior changes from little-kid to big-kid. Sometimes that happens earlier, often with girls; I've known 5-or-6-year-old girls (and a few boys, too) that I've been just fine with. I’ll probably be fine with my son’s eldest when she’s 5 or 6 because she was pretty OK even at 4 under trying circumstances. But mostly it seems to happen in the 8-to-10 window. It's the start of "tweenhood," I guess. I'm fine with "big kids" even if their chronological age is a little younger than normal to be a "big kid." I'm also perfectly fine with teens, even when they're really surly. I'll take a super-surly 14-year-old over a "cute," bouncy, loud 2-year-old, even if well-behaved, any day. Which is weird, I guess, but there it is. Someone has to deal with the teens. :)

And yeah, the presents thing. In my own, nuclear family, starting when it was just me and my little kids, we don't do presents other than small hand-made gifts if someone feels like making them. We just did stockings on the morning of Xmas Eve. They were filled with little things, small toys and candy and as they got older some more practical things, like makeup/nail polish or small bits of sports equipment and stuff. When they hit tweenhood, we'd each fill each other's stockings, not just me filling theirs. We developed a tradition of exchanging goofy toothbrushes that way, of all things. :) It wasn't that we couldn't afford to do big gifts; I just didn't want to instill that kind of mindset in them. Our tradition from the time my youngest was about 8 was to spend Xmas Day at the local shelter/kitchen for homeless/transient people, which did both Xmas breakfast and dinner. We'd be there, kids included, from pre-dawn until after midnight, prepping, cooking, serving, eating with the people the kitchen served, and cleaning up. It was actually really fun (the kids even looked forward to it) and really fulfilling and, to me, that's what Xmas ought to be about. Not the consumer frenzy. I have no interest in feeding and perpetuating that frenzy and while it caused some problems as the kids grew up when they found that their peers got showered with extravagant gifts, they also realized that they’d get gift-showered for their birthdays, and they've both said that they prefer the more low-key way we did Xmas as a family as well as the more service-oriented mindset, which they both have continued. Aside from this Xmas just past, which we did more "traditionally," but still without extravagant gifts.

hugelunatic replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

I love my granddaughter to pieces! But I can only stand being around her without her parents around. LoL

And hello my fellow Grinch! *loves*

They are definitely better without their parents! :) We took 4-year-old to the slopes on the day after Xmas without her parents, and it was a ton of fun. Spent the whole morning teaching her how to snowboard, had lunch in town, boarded bunny slopes/courses with her, would have done dinner out, too, but she was crashing by that point, etc., and it was all great. None of us, including the 4-year-old, wanted to go home to the screaming baby and toddler. *laugh* 

I will be fine when the kids are older. I'm fine with my other set of three grandkids -- the kids of my firstborn, whom I don't call "my son" because he was adopted at birth, so I don't feel that I am his parent for all that he's my bio-son -- the youngest of whom is 8 and the eldest almost 15 (and a Simmer, along with his next-younger sibling :) ). They live in Botswana, but they come over to the states fairly often and will be here this coming fall for a month and will stay with us, and I'm perfectly fine with that. The problem is, my son and his wife want a large family -- She comes from one, they're conservative Christians, etc. -- so by the time they're done having/adopting them, it'll be a long time -- probably longer than I'll live -- that they'll all be older. So then I'm put in the position of wanting to be around some of them but not all of them, which is not fair to them, but...yeah. In some ways, it's good that they live far away. I'm good with visiting with all of them via Skype. :) But they might not always be far. When my son retires from the Army after he puts in his 20 years, they plan to move back out here. But I might not be alive by then or at least I might no longer be able to live at altitude, so there's that. :)

And...GRINCHES UNITE! *high five*

mustluvcatz-reloaded replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

And there I was.. Happy as hell to see my grands and sad to see them leave. But I rarely see them so.. *back to being a Scroogy Grinch*

I think most people are happy to see their grands and sad to see them leave. I'm an outlier, I know. I've never actually liked little kids, despite raising two of my own. In truth, my husband and I were pressured into it, he more so than me, but I was trying to be a "good, obedient Christian wife." It's not surprising that I struggled and that it all contributed to the end of that marriage. I did not enjoy my kids when they were little. I gave up my career because I felt that I had to (Husband didn’t want me to, actually, but I couldn’t imagine living the life we lived dragging a kid around, which was another nail in the marriage’s coffin), and there’s a part of me that will always regret that. And I resented that my husband didn’t have to give up his career, that of course it fell to me to do so. I mean, I loved my kids, of course, but that's a different thing from wanting to be around them all the time and always enjoying their company. It was a huge struggle for me, and I'm glad it’s over. Teen/adult kids are great, though, and I'm thankful they both turned out well. Because, yeah, I’m a mom who doesn’t like kids, and worse I was a single mom who didn’t like kids, which could’ve been utterly disastrous, but I muddled through, living for the day when they’d be grown-ups.

And more for the Grinch Club, woo! :) (Also, I am only just now reading about what you're going through. I am so, so sorry. :( )

simaddicted-sue replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

I feel your pain and raise you 14 grandkids I love them dearly especially when they are not here lol

*sigh* Should I live long enough, I'll have at least 14 grandkids. My firstborn and his wife are done. They only wanted two, especially because there were problems with the second pregnancy. The third was an IUD fail, and then both got surgically sterilized in the aftermath, just to be safe. But my son and his wife....They want 8, minimum. They're planning on 4 bio kids (and will gladly accept more if they happen), and then they want to adopt, just as her family did. And then there's my daughter and her partner. They will marry in a few years and they're both anti-kid right now...but they're also only in their early 20s and when their mutual female biological clocks kick in, who knows what might happen? They might be like me and remain uninterested in kids for life or they might not. In any case, my health is not the best and will only get worse as time goes on, so I will have that as an excuse not to have littles around much, at least. There are silver linings to chronic conditions! :)

dunne-ias replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

meh, stay healthy and you'll live to have a relationship you might even enjoy when they're older. Not everyone has to like kids, even it they're related to you. I had my nephews visiting for a few days, which meant 4 days of almost non-stop Zelda-playing, but they're in just the right age for a visit, as in mature enough to handle their basic needs on their own.

Yeah, older kids can be a lot of fun, and I have no -- or at least a lot fewer -- problems with them. My firstborn's two eldest kids play Sims (The eldest plays TS4, but the 13-year-old prefers TS3. :) ), so sometimes we'll be on Skype together, all playing our games and yakking at each other about it, for hours, and we have a lot of fun that way. The TS3-playing kid and I are playing Dragon Valley concurrently, cycling through the premade households and doing different things with them, which is fun. And my son's four-year-old sat on my lap while I played TS2 a bit to chill out this past week, and she was fascinated and “helped” me a little, so now I plan to "groom" her as best I can going forward. ;) Video games are a good way to bond with kids. :) And when the firstborn's family is here, I'm sure we'll be doing plenty of that, as a group, since all of us love video games of various types. The Mortal Kombat tournament will be vicious and I will undoubtedly lose, but I will have fun while I am repeatedly, violently killed. :) 

We'll just have to see what happens with my son and his planned never-ending parade of children who aren't allowed a lot of screen time and "educational" video games are only allowed in very limited doses. *sigh* I have to come up with a sales pitch that makes TS2 “educational.” Well, it did make my daughter interested in the Middle Ages, since she played a medieval game, and she is now working on a graduate degree in Medieval Studies and has a talent for writing well-researched historical fiction as well as interesting narrative non-fiction, so....

pensblr replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

My husband and I really chuckle quite a bit (as we continue to happily enjoy our child-free lives) when we are judged for not doing the whole kid thing by people who always seem stressed-out trying to juggle everything. I'm like 'I don't judge you for wanting children. So don't judge me for not wanting them.'  Recently had a male colleague tell me that God put men and women here to have children, and if we didn't "What's the whole purpose of life then?"

Yeah, child-free is a great way to live! Especially if you're double income/no kids, I'd imagine. IF you can deal with the constant judgment and the pressure from people who want grandkids or nieces/nephews and the accusations of being selfish and pressures from one's religion, if that's a factor, and all that crap, of course. :\ 

Since my husband is almost 20 years younger than me, has no children, and I'm past menopause, I get a lot of side-eyes not just for our age difference (though with my gray hair dyed and a general lack of wrinkles because I’ve never been able to expose myself to much sunlight, I look (and act) younger than I am, so at least that helps with that) but also for our inability to procreate. I get a lot of "But what about when he wants kids? It's not fair to him to be married to someone who can't have kids!" (Which is a lovely argument to lob at anyone! I mean, I guess involuntarily infertile young people shouldn't marry fertile people then? *eyeroll* ) But he doesn't want kids. His own father died suddenly at 39 of a massive coronary, and when it happened his mom checked out for a bit, leaving him to deal with his grief and mostly raise his three younger siblings -- the youngest of whom was only 2 -- until she got her shit together, which took her years to do because she got addicted to the tranquilizers the dumbass doctors prescribed and had to do rehab, etc.. He did his time parenting starting when he was 14 until he was about 22. He has zero interest in having his own kids and can’t imagine that changing, though he loves being around other people's kids that he can give back to their parents. He absolutely loves being a step-grandparent of 6 at the age of 37, in addition to being an uncle to his siblings' kids. :) Even if he does eventually want his own kids, it'll probably be after I'm gone and then he'll be free to find someone to procreate with, if he and that partner want to spawn. So, I tell those people to just fuck right off.

And ugh, that "God put men and women on Earth to be fruitful and multiply and if you don't do it you're just selfish -- and having “sinful” sex -- and going against God's will and there's no point to your life" thing. That's why I had kids. That's NOT the right reason to have kids, but I was so brainwashed at the time that I didn't think that way. Or at all, really, at least not about that subject. Ugh. Ugh ugh UGH! I wish I'd responded with a polite-but-mighty "fuck off," too...but I DO like my kids and am thankful that they exist, so...yeah. 

Rant! Sorry! :)

mdpthatsme replied to your post “OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

28 years old, don't like children, don't want to have children because I know this about myself and I'm ok with it. People tell me it's a phase and I'll want children soon enough. I'm like, uh, no. Family and friends get aggravated with me when I don't hold their babies or don't want to watch their children. Like has the point not come across yet?

Yeah, everyone tells under-30 women who don't want kids that they'll change their mind. So many women want to be sterilized but doctors won't do it because "they might change their mind." Some have the nerve to get them to get permission from their husband, if they're married. My daughter suffers from terrible endometriosis is in almost constant pain from it. Over the years she's gone through all the treatments short of hysterectomy and nothing has worked, at least not permanently. She badly wants that hysterectomy but to date has found no doctor -- at least here in the States; I’m thinking she might have better luck in Europe -- who will do one because she's only 22 and unmarried. They think she'll marry a man (which she won't do; she's pretty firmly declared herself a femme lesbian) and then magically want kids. They even have the balls to tell her that if she goes ahead and births a kid, that might cure her condition because GOD FORBID they just do the relatively easy procedure that will likely cure her. Instead, they'd rather saddle her with a kid or at best make her go through a pregnancy and then have the kid adopted. At which point the endo might just come back again. 

I really can't believe how misogynistic gynecologists can be, even the female ones. Maybe their brains are warped by the women who desperately want kids but can't have them. I have enormous sympathy for those women, truly I do, but their plight should not prevent women who don't want kids from taking more drastic steps to not have them and certainly shouldn't force women to suffer through medical conditions that would be cured or at least made better by being completely sterile.

And yeah, the family constantly pushing babies at you and wanting you to babysit, just because you happen to have a pair of boobs. Nope. I'm thankful that my gay brother and his husband are not interested in kids and wouldn’t have cared if I didn’t have any, and that my mother is indifferent to the concept of grandchildren, but I DO have a lot of kid-crazy cousins that I did my best to avoid like the plague but when I couldn't were constantly trying to "convert" me by shoving their "adorable" babies in my face. They don't do it anymore with our advanced age and all, but when they were actively popping them out before I had any, as an older teen/young adult saying I had no interest in kids, it was like they were on a freakin' crusade, complete with forced conversion. *eye roll* Even though at that point I HAD birthed a kid not at all by choice and had given him up for adoption. Nope, not good enough. I had to have one that I wanted, I guess. And when I did have kids, they were all smug and, “See, we knew you’d change your mind!” Even though I really hadn’t. It's sick. Not every woman loves babies/kids.

MOAR RANT! More sorry. :)

yuichen

replied to your post

“OMG, I'M GLAD THAT'S OVER!”

36, no kids. I like my brother's but probably because they're older and I missed most of their early lives. My cousins' kids, however? Fuck no. I avoid the whole massive family gathering because they weren't taught to have respect for people's things, or how to not act like little psychos. I'm talking jumping on the furniture and running around screaming while their parents do absolutely nothing. In a small house. Fuck. That.

Oh yeah. In my experience, the most adamant baby-pushers were the ones who had the worst-behaved kids. They "loved" them so much that they never established/enforced boundaries and thought that any kind of discipline would damage them somehow. *eye roll* One of my cousins never made her kids sit down to eat. They just wandered around the table grabbing food (with their hands!) from serving dishes or, worse, from other people's plates. They let them do that in restaurants, even. It was disgusting. Or, the most adamant baby-pushers were the ones who were also complaining about how stressful their life/marriage was and who could be heard pining for the pre-kid years of their relationships. And I'd just give them a meaningful look. But if you point out that you just don't want to complicate your relationship/life by adding spawn to it, well then you're just “selfish.” 

Yup. I was at some point, at least in that regard. Being a more fundamentalist-type Christian in my 20s/30s warped my brain on the subject, but down in my heart-of-hearts...I would've been perfectly happy being that kind of "selfish." No, I wouldn’t give up my kids now, but if I’d never had them, I would’ve been perfectly OK, too.

[dew-line]

Life, death, and rebirth – developing and redeveloping a personality on a progressing timeline

So. I had a little fun today. The last task on the psychology course was to write an essay on personality development based(ish) on Mischels theories about personality development. The guidelines were a tad loose, and I choose to run with it. The text below is what I submitted, hopefully I’ll get som feedback on it tomorrow or in a few days and I’ll keep you posted on that. :D //Jimmy How does one begin to describe, in any relatable fashion, the development of one’s personality, especially as it is a work of perpetual process? One must, I assume, begin at the beginning: I was born. Then there was nothing until I developed a basic sense of self awareness and the ability to define myself in relation to other people and objects. In that very moment I created the world; but you may rest easy, for I am a humble god. Especially so since I stopped demanding the immediate satisfaction of my basic needs and allowed myself to be shaped into this present form by the mold created by my parents and by society; by boundaries drawn by cultural and linguistic traits Thus, like the Christian God I was made flesh and blood – now writing before you as this maculate conception, ever learning as I progressed over the years, constantly striving to fill out this rudimentary sketch of “me” drawn by my parents with ever more content and subject matter. I learnt of poetry and philosophy – the power of word and thought, and thus, in my late teens, I entered a new phase. Let it begin with these words from the gospel [abridged] of St. Charles the Inebriated.

  ”Born like this

Into this

Into these carefully mad wars

Into the sight of broken factory windows of emptiness

Into bars where people no longer speak to each other

Into fist fights that end as shootings and knifings

Born into this

Into hospitals which are so expensive that it's cheaper to die

Into lawyers who charge so much it's cheaper to plead guilty

Into a country where the jails are full and the madhouses closed

Into a place where the masses elevate fools into rich heroes

Born into this

Walking and living through this

Dying because of this

Muted because of this

Castrated

Debauched

Disinherited

Because of this

Fooled by this

Used by this

Pissed on by this

Made crazy and sick by this

Made violent

Made inhuman

By this

[…]”

Charles Bukowski – ”Dinosauria, We”.

Now, I may not have turned out quite as bitter and fatalistic as the aged Bukowski, but I do confess to a certain faiblesse for the absurd, in Camus’s use of the term, that existence is without meaning and purpose, and that beauty lies in –the absurd– meeting between this knowledge and continuing to striving too, despite this knowledge, fill life with love, beauty and personal meaning.

I was born into a classical working class home at 09:28, December 25th 1974, the first child of  a young mother and an alcoholic and controlling father; two parents that had the unusually common sense for their time to realise that they should not be together, and thus early becoming a child of separation – my parents were not married. I was doomed to the life of bi-weekend migrations between families – as this was long before the enlightened era where parents manage to handle child care in an adult fashion and share the weeks equally – a conduct that, in my case, created a feeling or rootlessness and a sense of drifting rather than establishing solid connections within either family – my mother and my father’s new families respectively. This rootlessness in turn created the foundation of a lifelong fear of abandonment and also of a shyness that manifested itself in an extroverted way – acting like the class clown, hiding emotions behind first erratic behavior and later, as I grew older and developed an arsenal of wit and amassed at least a modicum of knowledge – in early attempts at humor. I also developed the foundation of a contrarian mindset that is still present to this day. I despise the consensus – mainly because a consensus promotes a lack of progress and a lack of progress is the base definition of death. However, when I was a child the main reason for causing disruption, even if I was not aware of it at the time, was that it is easier to hide where there is disorder. Being judged by one’s behavior was far more preferable to being judged on who I actually was.

 It was at this age, around the age of seven or eight, that I came to the conclusion that religion was not the answer. Being introduced to a light version of Christianity in an after-school setting, being taught the core concepts of the New Testament, I promptly told the teacher that it was nonsense and, if I recall correctly, was not invited back for the second semester. Much to my mother’s dismay, I presume. By this time, we had left Uppsala and moved out into the countryside, a move that lead to an increased isolation on my behalf – this suited me perfectly as my main interests, especially as I started fourth grade, turned into literature and music. My mother had always read out loud for us when we were little, and I have always had a strong imagination – making the immersion into literature both smooth and welcome. Music also became an important present at this early age – literature and music has followed me ever since. The main part of the eighties was spent in my room reading and listening to music.

What beautiful time it was. 

Reading has had a huge impact on the forming of the person that I am today. All adults that I was surrounded by, in a formative sense – part from teachers – lacked any higher education and we did not really discuss much at, particularly not on my mother’s side, where I spent most of my time. My father, on the other hand – and this is based on long term memories, I cannot vouch for the validity of these memories as I have not spoken to the man in over 20 years – had a creative side – he tried to keep up to date, enjoyed certain intellectual activities. And whisky. And to listen to music. And whisky. And occasionally to beat his kids. Personally, I can’t remember to have ever being beaten by him, that seem to have developed later. My two brothers on my father’s side got to take the brunt of it as I can remember, however – he also had a knack for the words and was happy to share his opinions on how useless we were. That one has stuck with me. As I grew up and became older, and also stronger, this abuse increasingly became a greater and greater problem for me – culminating in me eventually starting to step between my father and my younger siblings when he got ”into the mood”. Eventually, however, I came to the point where I could not keep doing this and as I neared adulthood the relationship with my father and also my father’s side of the family slowly ebbed out. Initially, and for some years I felt that I had let my siblings to fend for themselves, but that feeling is long since passed. I have processed this, and I have moved on. It had to be done. 

I once asked my mother why they did not put any pressure on us when we were younger. Why they never pushed us to do better in school or had any opinions on what we choose to study in high school. The answer was that they wanted to let us choose for ourselves, that we should study what we wanted. The guidance counselor, I remember, told me to look find a job in a warehouse. Packing vegetables at the COOP.  The direct result of that was that I ended up studying for two years to become a bricklayer. I had no ambitions. I choose what I knew, since my stepfather and my father both worked in construction. I should not have been there. My only proper skills after being through the Swedish school system in the 80’s and early 90’s was a decent grasp of English. There were no jobs for me in construction, nor would I have been interested if there were any. If change was to come it was not through family, the school system or anything else. It was through me.

Looking back, however, it is interesting to see how much my life has been formed from the experiences of these formative years. I have no friends or acquaintances from before I started studying at university for the first time in 1998. Non whatsoever. I was social, I had friends – but I have never been sentimental – and I would rather let friendships run out from time or distance. No strong ties, no risk for emotional trauma. One might say that I started to reconstruct my life in my early twenties, I got into a new profession, I applied and got accepted into Grythyttan, Sweden’s premier hospitality industry education, a higher education under the management of the university of Örebro. This pretty much meant everything. Getting away from Uppsala and then – by the slight detour of three years in Grythyttan – to Stockholm meant everything. There is a reason why the Stockholm tends to draw people to it: the chance to rebuild yourself, to turn you into the person you want to be, to let yourself take center stage, if you will. Those were the formative years. They were great years. Working in the restaurant business in Stockholm in the early 2000’s was a smorgasbord of hedonism; food, wine, spirits, drugs. The sky was the limit. What a time to be young. And had not an underlying feeling that there must be more to life kept on nagging me I’d probably still be there today, standing on the brink of being a burned out wreck – but instead I got out, I diversified and got into wine import, into copywriting, photography – always searching; and I think that I am finally starting to get an idea.

I woke up one morning in December 2018, taking stock of my life. What I had done, where I had been, where I was and what I wanted to do. The same day I applied for a late admission course at Södertörn and started studying the very next month. I am very curious to see where I will end up. 

[punkscowardschampions]

Gen 4 Ideas

Junie B Jones: Alright so golden boy lucked out in all the ways the others didn't, is he a dick with it or a good egg? Embert: In my head, he's always been not a dick about it but obviously in relating to his sibs/fam, there's only so much he could do when Indie's resentment is already real so maybe her kids wouldn't fuck with him by the side of the story they've been told? Junie B Jones: ooh that's a good idea Embert: Astrid would've been mad as a kid but now they could be pretty close, obvs there's still the age gap and obvious reasons why not besties but I think they'd get on Junie B Jones: Yeah I vibe that she'd love him and like wanna look after him even though it'd lowkey be him looking after her more Embert: Exactly Embert: his mum, in my head is about early- mid 30s to Drew's 47 when he's born, as you say not much older than Indie but not like a bimbo 20 something and she's always been really mothering, like everything Ro ain't tbh so Callum is probably spoilt by her but not in a financial way like some but with love Junie B Jones: Indie would not fuck with her obvs but Astrid would so that adds to their closeness Embert: Exactly, like its too late for Indie literally she's having her own kids at the same time so she doesn't need a mum now and I reckon the woman would respect that, she's a good egg, like she knows Drew has been shit and ain't gonna make apologies for it, ahem, Ro, ahem Junie B Jones: I like the sound of her tbh soz we killing your son Embert: Maybe she should have kids from a previous? Because if he's her only son like I'm so sorry lol Junie B Jones: Yasss I love that because more interactions we can do Junie B Jones: [potentially one of Indie's sons get with I assume they are straight? Callum's half sisters even if it's not like a lasting ship should defs happen] Embert: Perhaps this mum goes for like bad eggs so this sister was old enough to remember like however many partners before Drew so then when she gets with him and he's clearly him she's like nah and makes his life difficult 'cos don't wanna do it again Embert: [If she's 5/6 when Callum that makes her 7/8 years older than Dash] Junie B Jones: [early 20s sudden death situ] Junie B Jones: he should have a boyfriend/girlfriend whatever when he dies who's also lowkey part of the fam cos then it's awks like do I stay or go Embert: ooh that's a good idea Embert: he's probably straight but maybe we could do bi so he's a less annoying example of a gay than most we've done whoops Junie B Jones: a mood Embert: so a girlfriend who is really close to his fam Junie B Jones: and really pretty damn Embert: he probably has a job I think, I can't see him being super academic Embert: maybe something like an estate agent or in a bank, a job where you show up and wear a suit Junie B Jones: his girlfriend could work there too cos that couple Junie B Jones: so when he dies she's not gonna wanna go back there either Embert: what fun Embert: but real Embert: they're just pretty and living their best life but in a chill way Junie B Jones: we all know the vibe Embert: Cosmo, same age as Callum, Indie's 1st Embert: so in my head the dad always plays football with them both and without intending to be pushy, does push him into that field, clearly Dash weren't as good/arsed whatever so it kinda all ends up on him because say he does get into an academy/on a junior team Embert: so then that becomes his life, training and matches and all that intenseness that comes with Embert: not to mention lad lifestyle, getting with WAG type girls, always going out partying, you know the vibe Junie B Jones: whereas Dash be like nah this ain't fun anymore I'm out Junie B Jones: cos I don't think he sticks with anything Embert: what if, their dad gets injured Embert: or tbh, is too lowkey old 'cos they put them out to pasture real quick Embert: I think by the time they're 19/17 when we start it, he'd already be too old to be a professional himself, so he could be a coach, hence he'd be even more pushy 'cos he could be on a professional team by now, they're ridiculously young like Junie B Jones: yeah it's usually like 30s at the latest isn't it unless you're like famous af which we ain't going that hard Embert: exactly, so without intending to its like, take on your dad's legacy Embert: 'cos in my mind he isn't naturally inclined to be like a ladladlad and is just doing it to be the full-package Junie B Jones: poor boy, again we all know the vibe Embert: 21st bday breakdown Embert: I think the zoe kravitz girl should still exist in some way, obviously not the way before Embert: because she's so anti-wag and clearly what he's actually into Junie B Jones: we could stay that Dash fucked her and that's how they cross paths if we want Junie B Jones: but he's clearly not interested and they are into each other Embert: it has potential to be different from other ships we've done 'cos he'd be tryna keep her on the dl which is shady but not just being an out and out dick Embert: like, I like you but no one can know don't ask why Junie B Jones: I agree, it'd be really interesting Embert: 'cos from her POV, casual headfuck Embert: used to boys being like Dash and just being like bye but not like showing you they like you then blanking you Junie B Jones: exactly dr phil I'm invested already tbh Junie B Jones: I also imagine Dash hanging at the commune so there's potential for lots of different dynamics there and he could be there when the fire too if we want/need but obvs not hurt or anything Junie B Jones: I'm also lowkey debating having Jules from Euphoria as one of his many love interests cos like her face and we've never done trans but it'd be a good way without it being someone's whole identity Embert: OH Embert: this is a tangent based on that thought which I also feel btw Embert: but Astrid's face is like bffs with the Kat face from Euphoria irl, so I'm thinking what if that's her gf and she's the one with an eating disorder, bulimia vibes, and then 'cos Astrid is her she's like okay you must be right Imma support you in this and accidentally enables her/joins in too Junie B Jones: YAAS I WAS GONNA SAY I WANNA USE HER FACE TOO BECAUSE SHE'S BEAUTIFUL BUT I DIDN'T KNOW WHERE/HOW Junie B Jones: this makes so much sense Embert: exactly, with Ro as a mum she wouldn't even question it, like oh yeah I guess you are fat you probably should, even though she'd think she's so pretty and perfect Junie B Jones: Boo you are so smart Embert: also, when we killing Ro, by this point she's like 54 Embert: okay, so Ro is 34/35 when Astrid is born so if we kill her off when she's 9 that would make Ro 43, so 2044, so when we're doing Astrid's story at 19, its about 10 years ago Junie B Jones: I like that cos it's not raw for these characters Junie B Jones: we're actually gonna let you recover though ladies, fuck you ghost Ro Embert: Seriously, like I don't want it to be full-blown its more of a deep insecurity thing but one she can get past Junie B Jones: 100% feel that Junie B Jones: [so yeah like I said just gonna write this down so we don't forget the Jules girl lives at the commune and probably has done for quite a few years by the time the fire happens so then she's got nowhere to go and goes to stay with Dash cos step up for someone dickhead and they are either otp or brotp to be decided] Junie B Jones: because I think he wouldn't be as supportive as he should be to Cosmo's whole breakdown in the sort of ableist vein of oh well you overreacted Embert: it fits, 'cos in my head its a very Nick and Matty vibe where they don't acknowledge each other Embert: like the whole 'how is that your brother' moment from his footie friends and being like yeah I know Junie B Jones: same tbh cos Dash's friends would be like damn your bro is uptight Embert: exactly so they aren't close anyway Junie B Jones: and never are [evil laugh] Embert: soz Indie Junie B Jones: not your fault babe they are just too different it happens Embert: although part of the breakdown is obvious resentment that he's just allowed to be a fuckup and he feels like he has to do all this shit and be perfect so Embert: that kinda does need to be acknowledged if we're going recovery Junie B Jones: family therapy time Embert: 'cos like if Dash just continues to be him and shit it'll come to brawl even if he has to stop being this footballer moment and do what he wants, its still about how its all come down on him, you know Junie B Jones: they totally should have a fight cos what a moment Embert: yeah, like it either fixes or breaks totally, I don't think they can just be meh Junie B Jones: agreed Junie B Jones: maybe we could do like a Joe mood of him distancing himself from the whole fam but then ultimately a more healthy resolution for everyone Embert: We could work that Junie B Jones: and obvs him ultimately getting with his gf and figuring out what he wants to do with his life and all that jazz Embert: exactly dr phil Junie B Jones: and Dash can work out what he cares about whatever the hell that turns out to be Embert: Jac is born 48, (year after Callum and Cosmo and same year as Ollie's girl, Mila) Jude is 49, as is Lily's 1st boy Adi and dash, Jameson is 51, same year as Lily's girl Priya, a year after Ollie's boy Ash, Iggy's 1st Arlo, Diego's kid Tayo and Bobby's teen pregnancy girl Cammie Embert: My characters, Callum, Cosmo, Mila, Jac, Adi, Jameson Embert: My boos, Dash, Jude, Priya, Ash, Arlo, Tayo & Cammie Embert: Potentials, Jac, Jameson and Cammie, would've been raised together, essentially Embert: Jimmy is a photographer for advertising, Bobby a graphic designer for same and Janis as a massage therapist moment Embert: Cammie has 2 younger brothers born 60 and 62 so they exist but we aren't playing Junie B Jones: lots of dogs please Embert: all the dogs lmao Embert: so my initial vibe for Jac is that she's like JJ in the sense she's quite grumpy and anti-social 'cos it suits her face but also with a more shy but not shy if you know what I mean vibe, 'cos they're both quite self-assured and I don't see that for her, I potentially see Jude having that element though? Junie B Jones: I agree, like I don't wanna shamelessly Miley but I defs see her as being that self assured kid Embert: the most out of anyway Embert: Jameson should be their nerdy side because the Cammie face has a very Cara silly side when you peep her socials so that could be those two Junie B Jones: Cute cos he looks like such a bad boy but he's actually a babe Embert: I know we said this for Adonis so either need to change it to him or not go as hard but what if he gets a gf that's like really jealous and doesn't let him hang with Cammie 'cos she's a girl even though they're like siblings and have been besties long before you came Embert: and like she could try and change his personality like be really unimpressed and like 'you're embarrassing me' if he tries to be a cute nerd Junie B Jones: I love that because always such a thing like boys and girls can't be friends like bitch we're related calm down we're not incesting again Junie B Jones: like she thought he was such a badass or whatever soz hun Embert: yeah like the mood of, you're fit so i'll just make you what I want you to be Embert: and she could be a real cunt to Cammie in sly bitchy ways 'cos clearly the mood and that's a throwback to how Mia and co treated Janis without us like putting this fam through too much trauma, you know? Embert: esp if Cammie is less like Janis and Cass in a way she's not like, fuck you, I'll just deck you Junie B Jones: I fuck with this heavily Embert: and obviously, it can be resolved in the end, he can get rid and they can be friends again, so I feel its a good level of angst and drama for them both, 'cos it is serious but not like, well there's nothing to be done, vibes Junie B Jones: and we can potentially ramp up the angst when things are at their worst cos maybe Cammie's mum gets a new job and she's like come live with me in wherever (not far but like far enough she would've been like no cos close to them all and not wanting to change schools) but she's like maybe I shall but then of course won't cos it's like the peppa pig when her mum don't get the job and gets mugged off Junie B Jones: but they all think she's going and it's like noooo Embert: are Bobby and this mum still together, like is she the boys mum too? Embert: but yes, I fuck with that Junie B Jones: In my head they would've been together for ages so it depends how far back we go into their childhood/teens but maybe she isn't the mum to the boys Embert: Okay just so we know Junie B Jones: but they always on good terms we don't need that drama again Embert: yeah I feel you, and she's chill with the boys mum, 'cos she's only 10 when the first one is born so she's been around since then? Junie B Jones: Yeah exactly Junie B Jones: We can potentially give her more younger sibs on the mums side if we want but they'd also only be ref-ed Embert: defs plausible Junie B Jones: Like let's say they broke up when Cammie's like 7 so it's all chill on both sides Embert: I vibe Junie B Jones: she could totally spend half the week at her mum's house and half at her dad's but same school cos nearby so again no drama Embert: that makes sense like its all in the area 'til she wanna pull a suzy sheep Junie B Jones: hahaha yeah Embert: so that's a start for those two Junie B Jones: I really like that Junie B Jones: it's just what we wanna do with the girls Embert: I was thinking Embert: and I'm just speaking it out now Embert: we've done people being shunned out of their friendship group/being the bullied Embert: but what if we do someone being the sort of ringleader of the shunning Embert: I'm vibing like you know that story we listened to/all teen girl murder stories, like Jac has a friend that she's really too close with (Grace and Mia vibes) and we show them like ditching a third Embert: maybe something happens, not murder but like you know, an action serious enough that she's like I need to sort my shit/we can redeem in the end Embert: but she's the Mia, not the Grace, you feel me, like its her pushing it Junie B Jones: Oh snap I never even thought of that but we haven't actually that's such a good point even if Janis would be so triggered by the ghost of Mia lol Junie B Jones: Like yeah there could totally be some kind of accident like how baby Ali and Ro but she's not a child Junie B Jones: I also like it cos Jude is the louder one so you'd think it'd be her but it's the quiet ones you've gotta watch Junie B Jones: and it's a nice contrast to how Cammie and Jameson are literally being bullied so Junie B Jones: maybe we should have jude as like more of a background character then? cos don't want too much drama in one fam unless it's as big as Cali's Embert: Yeah she can be more chill, like a Tommy vibe, like we use her but only when we need lowkey Junie B Jones: Yeah like obvs I'll still try and flesh her out into a character and who knows what could happen like we could think of a cool ship or whatever but Junie B Jones: it makes sense as of now Embert: agreed Embert: like obvs this twosome vibe has a lesbian one 'cos always do but I maintain she shouldn't ever like get with her it should just be friends that are too obsessed with each other, regardless of what's behind it Embert: like maybe the other girl is closeted or whatever but it ain't happening lol Junie B Jones: I agree she gives me straight vibes Embert: plus it would be easy to make her gay 'cos everyone does ala Lily Junie B Jones: not doing it on principle Junie B Jones: they all seem straight to me in this group Embert: I think so Embert: 'cos like you said, you don't wanna make Miley Junie B Jones: it would be so easy to make her a musician but I must not Junie B Jones: I might make her a tattoo artist though professionally cos Ali and Iggy both dabbled but it was never a thing Embert: That's a good idea, she fits that well Embert: okay so my random idea, which we could attach to anyone really but let's see who we vibe Embert: we did a teacher crush, what if we did a crush on a friend's parent Embert: so Arlo having a crush on a commune mum and thinking he can go there 'cos why not and then the shitstorm that can ensue from that Junie B Jones: such a good idea Junie B Jones: like maybe his friend is a girl so peeps be like aw he likes you he's trying to get your mum on side Embert: yas again, always a thing like maybe he's just lowkey using you soz babe Junie B Jones: and maybe the friend actually fancies him secretly even though they 'just friends' so it's awks af Embert: yeah and if Barley's boyf is with this fam and they leave Embert: she could be the one (or one of the ones) like I said that wants to be normal and already hates living here so its like well you took the one thing Embert: 'cos we said dating within the commune for the kids wouldn't be encouraged obvs 'cos one big family, so the fact she was was already like no no missy Embert: then we said about her not acknowledging the other mum/the two kids that are from that woman as family and just generally fucking with your hippie paradise 'cos its coming to and end lads Junie B Jones: 10000% and she could still be sneaky seeing him long distance behind their backs/ get back with him after the fire when they have to leave themselves/both if long distance is too hard Embert: I vibe with this 'voice of reason' character for you Embert: like no wonder he fucked up you can't give us 'no rules' but then have all these unspoken ones that contradict how you wanna live like, loads of this hippie bullshit is so hypocritical read 'em tbh Junie B Jones: it makes sense cos Arlo as the oldest buys in totally and then the two kids she don't fuck with come after her in quick succession so it's logical Embert: exactly, and then Shea is her biological sister and the baby so she don't know nothing about nothing Junie B Jones: Okay so Echo is like a Naomi vibe v passionate and studious and does not fuck with commune life etc Junie B Jones: wants to be some kind of researcher/ lecturer kind of vibe in like philosophy but a nihilist not hippie bullshit Junie B Jones: Arlo and Dash should be friends I say even though I play them both but just acknowledged Embert: I thought the same Embert: Dash would probs encourage him with this crush lbr like thanks Junie B Jones: I was just gonna say that cos he's always getting with older girls and generally being a hoe Embert: Exactly Embert: right, so circling back a lil, we can do Cass' Embert: what do you reckon her relationship status is and her career Junie B Jones: her career should be like we said she's set up a charity organisation to look for missing people Junie B Jones: she should still be with her man cos everyone's breaking up looking at you bobert Junie B Jones: maybe their marriage is lowkey a bit dead though and its a stay together til the kids move out mood cos we've never Embert: I vibe, 'cos casually triggering Jimmy but not in an OTT way just like well that's sad Junie B Jones: yeah like neither of them would cheat or be violent or any of that Ian shit but they obvs not in love anymore Embert: its a good way to do it 'cos idc what you say the kids always know and obvs we're unlikely to ever do that in a ship 'cos if they make it to adulthood they're OTP and teens don't stick together just 'cos like lol Junie B Jones: exactly my thought and like she would wanna hold it together and think that she was doing it well cos of Ian like Embert: exactly like it is sad but when that's your standard you would think you were slaying it Embert: like the positive she can see with JJ she might just think that's one-off and she can't have that 'cos obvs around the time she has the boys, Bobby's first has fallen apart Junie B Jones: and because JJ are such a good couple you wouldn't wanna be like my relationship has failed bye Embert: samesies babe lol Junie B Jones: ooh and maybe they aren't married so if one of them leaves the other gets fuck all Embert: which assumedly, is her because as much as you do get salary for charity work, if its a smaller one, she wouldn't be bringing in the bulk so the mortgage could be in his name Embert: so she'd be in the position of moving out into a one bed flat, two if she was lucky so the boys could at least come see her, it happens that way a lot Junie B Jones: precisely what I was thinking Junie B Jones: it's sad but real Embert: idea though, although this is suddenly just becoming about Cass not her kids lmao, what if her lil boyfriend from back in the day was Tylers face and then they can reconnect later but its actually a positive and not drow Junie B Jones: He was and they should cos I'm screaming Embert: again, he can bring kids into the mix for faces and stories should we wanna Embert: but it'd be a nice way to take a situ that is sad and shit for her, and for her boys to see, and then have a happy but realistic ending like yeah you do need to leave your man but you can be happy and it'll be alright Junie B Jones: I love it Embert: Alex having anger issues like Cass did and also due to the home situ as mentioned, Max, as the older brother trying to hold it down in a very Jimothy way and not causing more trouble as he sees it Embert: Alex ending up in young offenders but actually turning it around/ending up okay too Junie B Jones: and there's potential for characters he could interact with when he's in there, before and after Junie B Jones: like remember on DG when Electra was in that gang and then the bitch came back around like Embert: yes I do FAT mood Embert: also Max should get help too 'cos it ain't just the one that causes trouble that needs it and its nice full circle for that fam to have that Embert: but my idea, could be related to Alex but I think is big enough we could give this to another character entirely Embert: you remember on this is england when combo turned it around and he saved lol and he was working with the young people and making a difference but then milky set his fam on him for what he did to him when he was a racist and was like you have to pay and he was like okay Embert: what if something like that happened like, Alex DID hurt someone, or like I said, another character did, and did do something bad Embert: but then turned it around but sometimes you do for yourself but you still have to pay and the person you wronged could call that at any moment and you just being good now isn't good enough for them Junie B Jones: OKAY YES because what if another character is doing that shit with Alex but don't get caught and so they carry on and escalate and yeah they do hurt someone and yeah it's like that Embert: what about Israel 'cos he's the same age Embert: and it can be another sins of the father moment, 'cos Pablo is a dick especially to women like he's 34 when he has his one child 'cos he's still being a fuckboy very Drew Embert: so he is not a good role model in anyway Junie B Jones: and like we said that'd make sense like if he started out stealing and shit because Pablo's debts and being bankrupt but he wants nice things like it all ties in he has his own motivations Embert: right, fully Embert: maybe he ends up doing something to a girl, like something Pablo would never but shows how your kids see you isn't how you see yourself if you often show a bad side of you to the world Embert: 'cos then the girls family/friends/boyfriend anything could come for him and its like, fair Junie B Jones: OMG THO that's so legit Embert: 'cos we said an assault moment 'cos that's something that's indefensible Embert: like stealing and drugs and what have you, its scummy but you see why, like we all get why Tess has to deal etc Junie B Jones: we have to Embert: so if we want a family death, that could be one, again, leaves you conflicted Embert: 'cos no one obvs wants him to die but then he did do a bad thing so you can't blame her family fully Junie B Jones: yeah instead of killing of fam in the fire we could kill him instead that's so much more interesting Embert: *** in said commune fire, Dash gets burnt, severely, face/neck area, and changes his life 'cos people change around you, you can't rely on your looks and you aren't gonna just sit around and get stoned when you nearly die, Jules can and will still fuck with him Embert: Zelda having Crohns or UC and having a stoma and meeting someone brotp or otp at a support group/hospital moment, dealing with people being shady/saying you aren't disabled etc all those fun times and then the person dying and losing that understanding you only get from someone who also has the thing you have Embert: ALSO I've had another idea whilst we're just spitballing Junie B Jones: Me too because we mentioned Tayo and like yeah I've said about K-stew being a carer to her mum but we could do some of that too in a different way like maybe unlike her he really doesn't wanna be/is scared of having to cope alone with his mum's fits and shit like Embert: I'm so about that Embert: 'cos so many kids have to and its really hard and thankless, so he 100% needs a confidant whether its within the fam or a friend or OTP moment Junie B Jones: like maybe he doesn't ever wanna be alone with her now in case and it's like putting a strain on their whole relationship obvs Embert: 'cos Diego has his own things like he gotta work etc he's not like a replacement carer Junie B Jones: yeah like he'd do a lot of course but he also works a lot Embert: so Adi because his mum also has a disability like it isn't the same but he'd get it enough to not be totally clueless and annoying Junie B Jones: yeah and they can have fun together it'd be cute Embert: Wid it Embert: so my idea, completely unrelated but I was thinking we need to give someone an addiction issue but someone who gets over it and is within the fam 'cos like Joe and Ronnie do but you know they're still like, fucked and not here lowkey so Embert: I was like hmm who can I and then I was like, it NEEDS to be a ruster child Embert: because its canon that Fraze drinks too much and doesn't address it and Buster is v similar Embert: so yeah genetic and also if it was drink, they'd not take it serious just like oh slow down a bit but you're fine but then it affects the kid in the ways it didn't affect them like not functioning and not going to work etc so they have to take it serious Embert: also think it should be one of the girls 'cos double standard of being like a lad Embert: is going to be Sekhmet, okay Junie B Jones: because the twins and their younger sister could all be lowkey party girls because rich so they'd all have to deal with the change in their social lives and behaviour Junie B Jones: since she'd need to not drink ever again let's assume Junie B Jones: we know the whole fam is about that party and entertaining life Embert: exactly so like, they're all gonna be put out like really, just don't go as hard and ruin it for yourself and us Embert: hence it can get to a problematic stage like they just think she's being a typical teen/20-something 'cos it is socially acceptable to binge and be a mess like ok Embert: my vibe is she's in uni but also has an internship that she royally fucks up 'cos she can't get in on time and then maybe there's like a work dinner like on can't cope won't cope and she is wrecked and embarrasses herself and the boss is like goodbye 'cos no one fails in this fam its not an option and if you do its all on you so Junie B Jones: and maybe one of her sister's is a DJ cos literally a lifestyle and they'll have to be like excuse me while I go straight edge to support my sister Embert: I can see that for her twin Embert: my idea for her is fashion but actually designing and buying and the business side of it, not like, imma just model 'cos I'm pretty, no shade Junie B Jones: Yeah the aesthetic feels real for both of those tbh Junie B Jones: Their sister is a holiday rep so loads of travel loads of club promo etc Embert: Jay is a PT, mommy issues for commitment etc, travels a lot, ultimately will get over commitment phobia; is 6 when Chloe admits Buster is her dad (as Ruster was outed around the time she was born, Chloe denied it and went with James, James goes uni and finds someone else so that being over etc can prompt her to change her mind) and allows access, at 11, moves in with Ruster for good (Chloe has new man and babies what have you so allows it without argument which also fucks her up duh) Saint is 8, King is 6, Venus is 5, Adonis is 4, the twins are 2 and Nefertari is 1 Embert: so when all the Venus drama is unfolding, surprise you have a child too Buster lol, Saint is 3, King is 1, Venus is baby Embert: so Saint Embert: firstborn son, their first child too which is relevant 'cos both Jay and Venus would get doubly spoiled either side of him for not being Embert: so then he'd probably get spoiled too 'cos just a mess of a time really Embert: like he can't not be a bit of a prick really 'cos he can do no wrong and no offense to the other two boys but he's the most masc and conventionally 'perfect' so that's obvs going to your head too Embert: okay so mood, Leilani is 15 when her mum (works with Grace, close) dies in 2053 and Grace, 30, takes her in so she doesn't have to do a care moment or be homeless and struggling alone Embert: is friends with Stevie from joining this fam, can also know Janis' kids before this even but is 6/7/8 years older than them so knows them more in a protective capacity than a friend vibe Embert: comes in Saint who is 3 years older, thinks he's god's gift, tries to sleep with her just 'cos lbr and when he gets a no his world is shooketh 'cos no one tells him no for all the reasons Embert: can end up friends when he's humbled etc Junie B Jones: oh but maybe King is little and really fierce like 🥊 Junie B Jones: don't be underestimating him so hard dickheads Junie B Jones: he should be the angry one lol Embert: you would be if people treated you like that so I buy it Junie B Jones: all of y'all stop being extra and let him live Embert: and no one takes your anger seriously if you can't do anything about it so again, real Junie B Jones: so rude Embert: Next up is Venus good lord Junie B Jones: we know what the story is, her dad only cares when she's little and cute and lives in Paris anyway pretending he's still in his 20s forever instead of a grown ass man Junie B Jones: would obvs be proud when she's gay though even though can't relate to anything about the female form cos that kind of gay Junie B Jones: like Saint she thinks she's gods gift but unlike him how are we backing that up hun cos unlike him you aren't talented at anything you're just pretentious Junie B Jones: like okay you're beautiful but JESUS you know it and can't take any criticism again like Saint but you're never getting humbled Junie B Jones: instead you're getting a gf who looks like you and probably a fine arts degree pop off sis Junie B Jones: only wanna be part of the fam when it suits you which is when you're getting spoilt Embert: but I think we don't have to redeem her 'cos like, its not a fixable situ so you just get to be a shit person 'cos you got fucked over and that is everyone's bad Embert: like they can't take it back, even though you could also blame your father 'cos he's more at fault than anyone else 'cos he should've never but you do you girl Junie B Jones: yeah and not everyone gets redeemed even when they can be so it's real Embert: that said, I think she should have a teen gf that looks like her as we said but then she realizes she can't hack any situ where she potentially might not be the 'prettiest' so she then only dates butches Embert: or androgenous artsy types but no femmes Junie B Jones: I feel that for her Embert: like she literally should be in love with this girl as much as she's capable but dump her 'cos clearly your insecurities are so deep-rooted Embert: then just be with people you lowkey don't even fancy Embert: 'cos then we could play that out, the girl just like what the fuck Junie B Jones: oh honey Embert: we all know hoes that sabotage themselves always and then blame the world Embert: which starts by picking to be on her dad's 'side' even though everyone can see he's most at fault, even you Junie B Jones: bitch #past me I am triggered by this Embert: like a lot of her stuff I feel like we just know at this point so it might not be all here 'cos its well developed within gen 3 Embert: we know that her and Jay just would not get on, mainly 'cos they aren't alike but do you wanna come at it from her POV and then I will Venus' Junie B Jones: I think the way she sees it is like she is so team ruster like she'd refer to Rio as her mum and shit cos Chloe is not the one and so she would not fuck with how Venus treats the fam and doesn't wanna be part of it but is still happy to benefit from it Junie B Jones: And how quick she is to call peeps racist or fatphobic or whatever else would not ever help the situ of course like bitch I'm trying to talk to you Junie B Jones: But also there's some similarities whether they acknowledge them or not in them both not being able to hack relationships that makes it interesting as another reason to avoid talking to/ acknowledging each other seriously Junie B Jones: like she'd so pretend Chloe doesn't exist if someone mentioned her mum she'd be all oh you mean Rio lol lol lol Embert: 100000% all of that Embert: also another reason you cannot fuck with each other, casually never shutting up about your dad Embert: okay, so from her POV I vibe it that as a kid she literally just wanted all the attention and 'til the twins which is when she's 3 so (literally so petty you can't remember) its like I should've been the only girl and you came and took my attention lmao Junie B Jones: Oh god she'd be such an annoying child though Embert: then as they get older and she doesn't want to be part of the fam she'd think its unfair (as if Jay can help it lol) that Jay is obviously not Rio's 'cos she's white whereas she fits Embert: its the anti-Edie of it all Embert: like I fit and I wish I didn't Embert: basically she doesn't wanna be here but she's not a runaway type or willing to not live lavish so she ain't leaving Embert: she needs her dad to take her in but he's said no so like, you'll have to make it happen yourself but how Junie B Jones: sad but true Embert: and you can only feel so bad 'cos she whines like she's dying in all situations but like Embert: it ain't that bad and there's plenty you could do about your situation so Junie B Jones: Grace of this gen I've said it before baby Embert: oh honey Embert: makes you barren to humble is not an option 'cos you wouldn't want kids Embert: the tea of it all like you wanna live like your dad but he had a kid and shouldn't be so pick a better role model tah Junie B Jones: literally this fam is so big you're surrounded by potential worthwhile role models girl Embert: honestly she'll never be satisfied she's that hoe in a very Ro way like my god do something about it but she won't Embert: casually making it your life's work to make everything harder than it needs to just be miserable because something happened to you when you were a baby (again, so Ro) that you couldn't control Junie B Jones: all y'all frustrate me like I wasn't that bitch #tea Embert: loads of peeps are never happy though or are but then lose it so or fuck it up, we gave Ro a kid as a chance and I think Venus should actually love this girl/ she should be good for her in a way that makes her feel #seen hence she has to end it too Junie B Jones: agreed and she never gets her back because sometimes you don't and you can't Embert: mhmm mhmm mhmm Embert: I don't think we need to go as in-depth on any of the other sibs, like Saint would probably tolerate her the best, as mentioned she'd patronize King 'cos just that bitch without it being intentional 'cos self-absorbed, Adonis would do his best to ignore her and she wouldn't fuck with any of the girls 'cos she can't with girls so Junie B Jones: agreed on the legitness of all that Junie B Jones: Oh maybe Xander could be a hypochondriac because his sister is actually ill all the time like remember on skins when Liv thought she was dying Junie B Jones: obvious idea but I'm drawing a blank otherwise like Junie B Jones: also have we ever done online dating? Junie B Jones: because my thought is maybe he's lowkey catfishing someone pretending to be like a badass when obvs not Junie B Jones: like maybe he catfishes loads of peeps as if it's a hobby Junie B Jones: but then someone could find him out Embert: that's a really good idea 'cos we haven't Junie B Jones: like potential for otp/brotp to come from that even in a slow burn way Junie B Jones: if they end up liking who he actually is or whatever Junie B Jones: despite everything that's happened Junie B Jones: oh snap what if he's using pics of one of the other boy characters and whoever he's catfishing finds that person's socials or whatever and are talking to them thinking they are a thing and the person be like um Embert: omg yes Junie B Jones: Jameson was my immediate thought cos badass look and you play him but could be Ollie's boy cos also or whoever else Junie B Jones: cos they don't need to be a you character necessarily could just refer like Embert: that ties in well though 'cos his jealous girlfriend Embert: make it a huge thing so then Xander kinda has to shame himself like that was me 'cos feels bad that he's now getting accused of cheating even though it'd be a blessing to be out of that relationship Junie B Jones: ooh true that'd be good Embert: and the other person/the catfished could have like found his socials and seen he was in a relationship/know 'cos his highkey gf and be like calling him out so less embarrassing on their end 'cos bad enough they're being catfished as is Junie B Jones: that's a really good idea Junie B Jones: even with the age gap between Xander and him I still think we can make it work cos adds to the catfish of it all Junie B Jones: even if we can't then get him with the catfished person we can always do that he's himself online in the future and blah Embert: yah Embert: wid it Embert: so Stevie Embert: Billie is 17 when she has you with another male model in NYC, you live your life with Nancy too so factor that in Embert: moving back to Dublin when you're 10 and like, maybe the dad and her have phonecalls but like, he doesn't make an appropriate amount of effort like Junie B Jones: visit her you dick Embert: and we've said that Billie as a mum is like not the best 'cos Edie only died like 3 years ago when this and she left 'cos not coping so its not like NYC fixed her or anything Embert: she'd take care of her but she'd be distant 'cos giving a shit too much fucked her up so Junie B Jones: sad but true soz Stevie babe Embert: we also said before she'd like take her to work and shenanigans that someone like Venus would think is so cool but she does not 'cos it would actually be so boring if that was your life and you had to Junie B Jones: and on any shoot there's so much sitting around even if you're the person doing it never mind for her Embert: exactly, like in my head they make a ThingTM of them being like a model couple with a model ass child but as soon as she's old enough to have say she's like well I don't wanna do it thanks Junie B Jones: a mood Embert: so my vibe when they go back to Dublin is Billie has to face up to what she's not for the last what, 13 years Embert: so she'd lowkey be a bit of a wreck no offense so I feel like someone else needs to take care of her but I'm like Embert: do we make Nancy come back for a bit like the #lifepartner she is or do we say someone else does lol Junie B Jones: we could because it'd be less traumatic for Stevie or we could make someone in the fam and make it more awks for her Embert: I don't know which way I prefer it lol, also from a Nancy POV Embert: like should you come back or are you good you know Embert: hmm Junie B Jones: yeah I'm not sure what I fuck with more, who would be able to if not her cos that might help us decide Embert: so it would be 48, let us see Embert: Ruster have all their kids, including Jay Embert: hokay so Embert: maybe we bring Nancy back but she's like ehh about it like obviously she can work from wherever anyway but she's dedicating to some time she can't really travel whilst Billie sorts herself so she could be talking to Junie about it 'cos can vent without sounding like a bitch and he's like I'll come help and then she can help him get back in touch with the family properly 'cos low-key avoiding everyone else still and Venus is the same age as Stevie so if this is happening when she's like 10, Junior could actually talk to her and explain what happened from his perspective and answer questions best he can Embert: and like she can pretend it never happened when she's older but it did, like not saying it has to be good enough for you but he did try Junie B Jones: that makes my heart happy cos he's so young still don't be in exile forever boy Embert: and like Nancy can spend the time with all the Ruster kids too and reconnect more herself Embert: like they can both go back 'cos Billie won't be like totally incapable forever but they can both put in the time and feel better about it Junie B Jones: Okay so then she's like 12 ish and back with her mum and shit is better but obvs her dad is still not showing up ever Embert: and you have an accent and a 'famous' (ish) mum and you've been in shoots with her and you're pretty and so to me a vibe of like, this is too much attention and I'm not about it seems real Embert: not even necessarily shy just like, everyone likes me for the wrong reasons vibe and I don't fuck with it Junie B Jones: that's very real Junie B Jones: so if we did do the opposite of Jay and Venus and like I gotta find someone to like me for the right reasons and give it my all I think that would make sense Embert: I see it Embert: and she isn't like woe is me about it 'cos that would be unbearable but she's also not faking it like I'M LOVING LIFE and bad shit has happened so Junie B Jones: Yeah exactly Junie B Jones: and like nobody could blame her for being 'too much' with said person if her mum and dad are both distant Embert: exactly and she'd probably need to have a fair few failed relationships 'cos people aren't about that for loads of reasons like you're too full on too quick, or people would be about that for the wrong, i.e. they sense it and use it against you so then you have to leave which she'd be bad at doing so, in that case, she should have a boyfriend/girlfriend who is equally fucked but in different ways and its just a disaster 'cos she won't be the one to end it Junie B Jones: I feel that, there's loads of potential for doomed relationships there Embert: like, it doesn't even have to be like they're abusive levels of bad, its just it doesn't work and they treat her like crap in a like, do something about it way and then she don't and they're like...why, lowkey what's wrong with you Embert: like it could end up being right but not through the relationship but just by being like, you gotta work on that Junie B Jones: 100% Embert: much like how Grace was with boys like lowkey just love me and I'll deal with whatever tbh Junie B Jones: maybe there's someone on the sidelines watching this like I wish you'd sort your shit cos ILY but we can't be a thingTM Embert: I'd vibe Junie B Jones: idk who or why but like who doesn't love pining from afar while someone fucks their life up Embert: so helpful whoever you are godbless Junie B Jones: honestly Junie B Jones: and they should get together like this man thinking he's gonna fix her and it's like guess what twat you can't Embert: and it takes someone actually wanting you and wanting to to be like hmm, I gotta fix myself 'cos this ain't it Junie B Jones: mhmmmm Embert: I think we can start Junie B Jones: we did it boo *Echo abortion storyline

[vintagegeekculture]

I would love your thoughts on something. When I was younger, I greatly preferred Tales from the Crypt over Goosebumps (books and shows). But as I get older, I feel as though I like Goosebumps way more. I feel like Tales from the Crypt had a cutting-edge significance but it feels dated and formulaic now whereas Goosebumps had an element of unpredictability and the kid-friendly restrictions made extra creativity absolutely necessary. Your thoughts?

One of the most extraordinary developments in GeekCulture specifically, but also the culture more generally…is that we’ve become moreokay with realizing that our guilty pleasures and ironic pleasures are our actualpleasures, and not to maintain a level of distance or disdain from something thathas value not everyone sees.

It felt like this happened in only the past 3 years, andis especially noticeable in the music world. I think people are starting to findthat the boy bands that the edgy music scene folk got mad about in 2001 wereextremely inoffensive and actually had many talented members. Likewise, everyfew months like clockwork, every music journal has a few “hot-take” articlesabout how saying that you hate Insane Clown Posse, Phish, and Nickelback isclassist. I don’t care for Insane Clown Posse’s horror-core rap, but the ideathat class plays a role in the fact their fans are looked down on? Well, it’sabsolutely, inarguably true, and how we talk about them is extremely bound up inthat, which partially explains the deeply raw and visceral reaction to them.

If there’s been a positive development of the past fewyears, it’s that fandom has learned to condemn a lot less, learned to be a lotless mean, and is unlearning the instinct to look down on things, and are moreaware of how our reactions to things are centered on very unpleasant currentsin society. If your reaction to something is intense, raw, and visceral, it’sgood to look under the surface and see what’s driving it because it’s probablydue to a current in society. For instance, one of the perennial punching bagsof the past few years was Twilight, a harmless bunch of romance novels writtenby a goofball Mormon aimed at teenage girls that I can’t imagine getting anyone’s dander up. Now, obviously, I am as far fromthe target audience for a teen girl romance novel as one can get, but as agrown-ass man with a job, even in the early 2010s, the notion of getting rawand mad about them is just…absurd to me, and I am delighted more people arecoming around to that way of thinking. Worst of all, I think a lot of people who hate Twilight getmad at it because they think young girls are silly and subhuman and theirculture is the same way, the same reason they didn’t like the boy bands in theearly 2000s.

Saying you hate Twilight is the adult version of singingsongs about how you want to kill Barney (…and by the way, what did Barney everdo?)

I think we’re seeing that quality is something that canbe achieved regardless of form and audience, which is brings us to Goosebumps,which, within the limits of their audience and form, I remember them as beingactually tight, effective little chillers. It’s harder to write a good shortnovel than a long one, and harder to write for kids than adults. R.L. Stine isa real person, and yes, he wrote nearly all of the books attached to his namewith a productivity that is almost inhuman.

R.L. Stine was always this way. He was an on-call serieswriter, and in that world, it’s more important to be a consummate professionalwho meets deadlines than to be a genius. It reminds me a lot of the pulps,actually…you’re more likely to see guys who can meet deadlines.  He wrote GI Joe tie in novels and knockoffchoose your own adventures, and was a published author on call for a fulldecade before Goosebumps became a hit. These are series where you sometimesneed to turn in a 25k kids’ novel in a single sleepless weekend in a hotelroom.

I hate to “armchair quarterback,” but if I had to identify what kept Goosebumps from being a regular part of our lives and only linked to a specific moment in childhood (and a childhood at a specific time in the 90s, at that), where you put them down, never picked them up again, and 20 years later you rediscover them as “nostalgia,” it’s that Goosebumps never really “grew up with you.” The Harry Potter novels were smart in that they started light and funny, with the characters the same age as the (assumed) reader, only to have a book come out every few years where the heroes were the same age as the characters, where the stakes got higher and the heroes grew up. A more “teen oriented” Goosebumps line might have kept that audience. 

[praphit]

The X-People: DP Degrees of BS

Frickin Phoenix!

(What does that even mean? “Every hero has a DARK side?” She kills people! Are all of our heroes murderers? - but I’ll get to that later.)

I'm mad! That's right, people! I'm mad at MYSELF! Why? Well, I could have taken the kids to go see "The Secret Life of Pets 2", so we could laugh our asses off (Idk what kids I'm talkin about - just randomly picking kids up off the streets and taking them to see movies... prob best I didn't do that). 

I could have seen something cultured like "Late Night" or "THE LAST BLACK MAN IN SAN FRANSISCO"; which I admit is a stupid title, but it seems like it's a good movie. But, no, people! My comic book geekiness would not allow it!

Instead I went to see this bullshit right here - “X-Men: Dark Phoenix”. 

Don't look at me that way, Sansa! You know dag gon well this movie is some ol' bullshit!

You know! The rest of your acting squad knows, the director knows, the writers know - I knew from the first trailer! I knew from the first time they announced that they were taking another crack at a cinematic Phoenix story. Why?? Cuz we've done this before! Yep! 

There it is! - and it was terrible! 

What’s going on with that poster? Apparently, they didn’t have any confidence in that movie either. Why is Wolverine running at me like Sonic the Hedgehog?

I tried to find a better poster, but...

Here they look like they’re posing in some 80′s rock video. TAKE THAT STAND:)

I was mad back then with the first trailer, because I knew that this moment would come. And I actually really liked the first two movies of these particular X-Men. It was Apocalypse that ruined everything. 

People thought that movie was so bad, that it erased all the good that this franchised has done (even going back to the older X-Men):

The ground-breaking 1st movie (tho it prob doesn't hold up),

(Creepy old Magneto is coming for dat ass!)

Wolverine 

(it's hard to imagine anyone playing him better than Hugh Jackman. And he should have won an award for how cut he got... and he was so modest. If I ever  end up looking like that, WHEW! - ladies look out:),  

I loved Patrick Stewart as Prof. X, James McAvoy and Michael Fassbender's intense hot & frigid bromance (though we never got our make-out seen:), Quicksilver (man, I wish we could get more of him), "Logan" (excellent comic book movie), and I'm not sure if we'd have Deadpool without them ruining that first Wolverine movie. Not to mention that they marketed the hell out of this movie franchise and made so much money! But, then this guy showed up and effed it all to hell!

("Everything they built will FALL... ")

- you ain't lyin, jack!

And while that movie was terrible, it wasn't as bad as everyone said. Bullshit sure, but... there are different degrees of bullshit. Apocalypse was forgettable BS, sometimes there's BS that makes us laugh, or think, or cry - what type of bullshit will Dark Phoenix be? -  Let's take a look:

This movie kicks off with the X-Men in space. Yep! SPACE! Since when are the X-Men astronauts? Which movie did they get training for any of that? How did they build an X-Jet for space travel? Did they learn it on YouTube? And even if that were the case, how's the government allowing this? If a group of talented minorities built a functional space craft, do you think President Trump would allow them to come and go as they please? Shiiiiiii In the movie they don't even test it first. Xavier just says that they'll be fine, and sends the kids off.

I think that there needs to be an investigation. Prof. X is trying to kill these kids. He keeps sending them on missions that they shouldn't come back from:

X-Men: "But, professor, we don't know how to disarm a bomb!"

Xavier: "You'll be fine."

X-Men: "But, professor, the X Jet isn't built for deep sea exploration, we don't even know where we're going!"

Xavier: "Y'all will figure it out."

Then, as they come back, he's counting to see if they all made it - "Ten kids left, and coming back, I count... ten DAMMIT! But, wait, one is injured... doesn't look like he'll pull through. YES! (as he drinks some bourbon - which he does at an alarming rate in this movie... prob to block out all the kids he has killed).

While we're on the topic of him - did the movie "Split" ruin James McAvoy's take on Prof X for anybody else? This is all I kept seeing when he was on camera.

But, as you know, cuz they did this exact plot in "X-Men: Last Stand" Jean Grey gets possessed by some space entity while they're up there, and becomes Phoenix.

Jean (played by Sophie Turner, who actually does a good job) is found to have done something horrible. Xavier (and this is no spoiler, cuz again X-Men: Last Stand") blocks out the bad stuff she has done to try to protect her, this eventually wears off, and now we get DARK 

...wait, sorry.

Now we get DARK PHOENIX! 

There we go!

(”Where’s my money?!”)

Now, Jessica Chastain is in this as well seen here, experimenting with bleach,

 who's leading a group of aliens to manipulate Jean (I'll get to them later). But, if JC is in the house, you can be sure that a women's rights message will be in there somewhere (#drinkinggame) And BOOM, there it was - "Don't let some MAN in a chair tell you what you are? - what you can and can not be! Don't let him controoool you!" 

I'm all for girl power, buuuuuut she HAS been on a bit of a carnage streak, and she has been killing people, annnnnnd isn't Jessica Chastain also trying to control her? But, imma let all that go... what do I know?? :)

I gotta be honest, I was digging the first half of this movie. They were capturing everything I love about the X-Men: social issues, political issues, teen struggles. They have lots of real drama going on amongst themselves. There are times when you'll cheer the X-Men on and times when you'll agree with some of the humans that THEY GOTZ TO GO! I love the flaws of the X-Men; it makes them relatable. I even love the struggle with having so much power, and yet having to try to walk a line of morality - which they suck at btw.

The professor sucks at it the most, which made me kinda sad, actually. BUT, to be fair, he has the power to control people's minds... would any of us with that power be able to consistently resist certain temptations?? Def not giving him a pass though. He does a lot of messed up stuff (some things they draw attention to, and others that they don't). Some things that made me cringe, even though MOST of what he was doing was out of love. I can't depend on none of my fave leaders anymore - not even the fictional ones.

We were getting into some deep stuff! BUT, then it was as if some big shot walked on the set and reminded them that they have a "Blow shit up" quota to meet, and that the plot points were slowing them down. Soooooooo, they burn the script and start blowing things up. Some people might say "Praphit, this is a comic book movie, how much script can you expect?" If this were 20 years ago, I'd agree.

Plus, it's more the fact that nothing makes any sense at this point.

Magneto (who's always the voice of reality in these movies, in my opinion) wants to kill Jean (for very good reasons), but he knows that he can't take Phoenix by himself, so why is he trying? He's a smart dude; why not come up with a better plan? Prof X wants to talk to Jean, to reason with her... the problem with that is that they just tried that a few days ago, and that couldn't have gone any more terribly than it did. The aliens in this movie (which lack all personality btw), who's objective is to control Jean, also know that they can't really do that or take her out (which was plan B), so... what the hell are we doing? The aliens are supposed to be the smart ones!

Prof X should have just controlled everyone's minds, and played a big game of immoral chess to take Jean out - that would have been a cool movie. But, this (though the effects are VERY COOL:) simply became a shoot-out! Not to mention, that right before all of this awesome, but confusing damage takes place, they have a big speech about restraint and not doing harm. Literally, a minute later, the X-Men are blowing buses up!

But, all of that is not even what makes this movie bullshit (grade: D+ btw). What makes this movie bullshit is the fact that it's the last one before Disney takes over.

You'd think that they would have given it their best, so that they can go out making us miss them! But, it felt like half way through the movie the team was told that this is all over, and that Mickey Mouse is coming to collect, but instead of going out with their best, they said to themselves "bleep it" and mailed-it-in.

The way that the final battle scene ends doesn't make any sense. It's one of those scenarios where "If you could do that... why didn't you do that earlier and save more destruction?" and a lil bit of "Well, if you had THAT much power, then none of these other altercations should have even been close."

The way it ends after that too! Man! It's like they just fast forwarded through the parts they didn't feel like acting out. This is the last one, people! Just lazy!

Yeah you!

I've got a spoiler, sooooo if you don't want it, skip through the text after Patrick Stewart - and start reading again when you see his handsome face again:)

(this is back when I learned to love this man)

So, Jean is... gone (possibly dead), and the X-Men name the school after her "Institute of Jean Grey" or something like that. Also, Prof X steps down (maybe due to guilt of his misatkes with Jean, who knows for sure, cuz they didn't act it out), and leaves Beast in charge in with the other teen X-Men to instruct the 'young kids at the school. "Other TEEN X-Men" Did they just make these kids professors? And what qualifies Beast (at this stage in his life) to run the school? Plus, Jean Grey was kind of a murderer wasn't she (and this wasn't a secret from the rest of the world)? Come on,kids, let me sign you up for "Ted Bundy's School for gifted youngsters" Would you be onboard for that? Hell no!

(Here’s PS fresh off a bender. “I promise, Timmy, I’ll try to think about never touching the sauce again, but this hair says that I will.”)

So... I'd say, entertaining bullshit. The effects (especially) at the end are great! But, the rest... and to go out like this... ugh.

There's a cool quote in here from Mystique (played by J.Law) who clearly didn't want to be there. It was a quote about how the women in the X-Men seem to be sticking their necks out and saving the day way more than the men, and that  maybe Xavier should change their name to “The X-Women”. I thought that was not only funny, but a damned good point. I say do it!

I'd love it if you had a a big strong manly man of the team go ahead of the action and stand up to the enemy, and when asked "Who are you?" he replies

"We're the X-Women."