#if it was like tvd and the friendships were actually genuine

[haylijahtilldeath]

What are your top 5s in anything TVDU related? (Characters, ships, friendships, familial bonds, episodes, etc.)

Ooh, my first question. Thank you for asking!

Even though I've watched tvd first, but I prefer the originals to it. So, my answer is going to be mostly about them.

I'm going to do the characters separately.

First, characters from T.O

Elijah Mikaelson (because he was the calm before the storm, I don't know how to describe him, he was just so resilient and holding onto his brother when the entire world could only see a monster in him, and for all his complex layers.) and Hayley Marshall (because she was a BAMF, the best mother you could have) fighting for first place, but none of them can win.

Camille O'Connell because she was such a ray of sunshine. (Caroline stans do not come at me, this is about two characters who have literally never met.)

Freya Mikaelson was such a badass.

Klaus Mikaelson because he had the best retorts and sarcasm.

Gia because she was so down to earth about everything. (Putting her after Klaus feels so wrong lmao.)

Now, Tvd characters. I can't conjure any explanation for them.

Caroline Forbes

Enzo St. John

Stefan Salvatore

Rayna Cruz

Rose from S2

Ships.

Haylijah, because have you seen them? The chemistry, the compatibility, the love and all the respect. (S5 never happened.)

Bonenzo because they were so good together, and Enzo actually loved Bonnie and didn't spend his time using her.

Klamille, because Camille could see beyond 'evil Klaus' and understood him like no one else ever did, and Klaus saw so much light in her, and he cared about her.

Steroline because they were also good together.

Gialijah because they had so much chemistry and there was just something about them

Friendships.

Caroline & Enzo, because he stepped up for her and they had something special about them.

Camille & Vincent, because they related to one another after all damage they got because of the Mikaelson family, and they made something good out of it.

Freya & Hayley because they spent years together raising Hope, and they bonded so well.

Stefan and Lexi because they do supportive besties better than anyone.

Bonnie and Damon because they have managed to go from sworn enemies to best friends.

Familial bonds.

Hayley and Hope. No one does mother and daughter better than them.

Elijah and Rebekah. We saw so many times how Elijah cared for her and how she looked up to him. I believe he was her favorite brother, even if the show wanted to make us believe it was Klaus.

Marcel & Davina. They're not family by blood, but the way he was her family more than her real family and tried to protect her meant so much.

Elijah and Hope. We did not get much of them, but they had so much potential. If the show didn't completely destroy Elijah to redeem Klaus, we might have seen him be the best uncle out there.

Freya/ Rebekah and Hope. These aunt/niece relationships were so good. Rebekah cared for her for months, and kept her safe, and Freya raised her with Hayley and taught her so much.

Finding episodes that I genuinely love from beginning to end is difficult.

TO S2E9: The Map of Moments. We had family, we had bickering and we had love.

TVD S3E14: Dangerous Liaisons. We had a ball straight out from a fantasy, do I need to say more?

TO S1E20: A Closer Walk with Thee. It was not a happy episode, but we had our first Haylijah kiss, and it's good enough to be in my top 5.

TO S5E8 : The Kindness of Strangers. As much as I hated S5, but this episode was so good. We saw the Mikaelson family reunited, and every time I watch Elijah break down after remembering Hayley's death, I can't help but cry.

TO S1E1: Always and Forever. This feels like such a basic answer, but I love this episode. It was the beginning of an epic tv show, and it's just so nostalgic.

These are the ones you mentioned, and I can't for the life of me think about anything else to rank. Anyway, I am awkward most of the time, and it includes this answer. So, don't judge me too harshly!

[malka-lisitsa]

What are ships you think have potential but didn't happen in canon

Like..... for Katherine.... or in like the general TVD world? I'll answer for both I guess.

For Katherine-

Katholine had a LOT of potential, like if not for a romantic ship than definitely a friendship. Especially once Katherine was human and the bonded a lot more. You can really tell that Katherine felt a connection to Caroline because she shut it down HARD. When Caoline thanked her for helping out, she snapped so fast "Don't. I killed you once remember, we still hate each other." That was Katherine being scared because she genuinely cares about Caroline, which means Caroline can hurt her. So, mega ship energy there.

If Bonnie and Katherine had teamed up not even romantically the show would have just been over, bc that is a power duo right there.

I think if Elena had pulled her head out of her ass and tried to see Katherine as a person BEFORE SHE WAS ON HER FUCKING DEATH BED- that could have been a really interesting friendship. I do not think Katherine would have ever stopped going after Stefan, but I think Elena would have understood it more.

For the show in general-

BAMON BAMON BAMON BAMON. I mean it's pretty much canon. Just shy of a kiss scene seriously. It should have been canon, literally it would have been his healthiest relationship.

DENZO. Again just shy of being actually canon, the actors put all the subtext there on purpose- all that was missing was a kiss scene.

Elena and making good decisions, my favourite potential ship that just never happened. R.I.P

Carelena also had some underlying subtext on occasion and they would have been cute granted elena stop treating her poorly.

And you didnt ask for this but im a very opinionated girl so-

Ships that were canon and should never have been bc they're terrible and an affront to one or both of the characters involved!!

Delena

Ster0line

Whatever Valerie was (we do not recognize that gross creepy on this blog)

Vicki and Jeremy

tyler and his hybrid vendetta

[bluesadansey]

tvd for the ask game!

since you said TVD specifically I’m going to not count legacies or originals answers here

My favorite parent-child relationship: Katherine and Nadia :):):( best part of s5 To Me

My favorite sibling relationship: Klaus and Rebekah totally counts especially since I prefer how their dynamic is written in TVD to most of them in TO (not counting specific highlights like Farewell to Storyville) in any case, but anyway obsessed with whatever they have going on xd (if we were going General TVDu it would definitely definitely be the Saltzman Twins for this one but anyway)

My favorite family relationship (other): Jenna and Elena I love them my rewatch of the first two seasons was basically just me going ‘is Jenna the best TVD char (besides Kat ofc ) actually?’ semi-seriously growing more seriously with each episode what a woman…

My favorite friendship between two people: TVDu friendships aren’t great tbh there’s very few that feel genuine And I enjoy them as friendships specifically. would say specifically early seasons Bonnie and Elena, alternately …. ig I’ll say Tyler and Jeremy

My favorite friendship between a group: s1-2 Barolena since I do think at the beginning they were sometimes awful to each other but compelling and felt like actual friends and s3 is where that started to fade. Tried to think of an alternative but all the other dynamics between 3 or more chars I find compelling are antagonistic and/or psuedo love triangle and/or psuedo throuple or some combination thereof lolll (examples: Kai-Bonnie-Damon, Bamenzo, Stefan-Katherine-Caroline, Klafaroline, whatever Rebekah-Stefan-Klaus had going on in the 20s and parts of s3&4….)

My favorite mentorship: Shiela and Bonnie :(( also despite the questionable writing did enjoy Abby and Bonnie briefly working together

My favorite rivalry: Elena/Rebekah and Klaus/Stefan but I ship both of those so it doesn’t totally work for the ‘Gen’ aspect but can’t really think of another rn

My favorite hatred/antipathy: Elena and Katherine although that feels like an over-simplification of everything in their dynamic, but it’s how the two girls would define it so. Anyway they’re the most compelling obsessed with them always

My favorite potential relationship between characters who never talk in canon: Bonnie and Rebekah wecouldhavehaditall :/

(send me a fandom and I’ll answer these Gen relationship questions)

[handonhaven]

“I don’t wanna come between you or any of our friends ever again.” Poor Landon. Does he not know that none of their “friends” cared when they thought he had died and when Hope was suffering? Does he not know that they were more than willing to let him die in the prison world? Does he not see how they treat him? How they treat both of them? Yet he still feels he and Hope have to make huge efforts for them. Landon is very aware and we saw in season 1 that he knows when he’s not being treated right, and he used to stand up for himself. But now they have him putting up with everything and going out of his way to be nice to these people. This is just...not right.

[kiirrby]

Now, I understand the grey area when it comes to poly relationships in TV. Poly representation is extremely lacking when it comes to media, and is practically unheard of in the TVD writing room. That being said, I think these 3 might genuinely have a shot at becoming a real couple! Past poly ships in TVD realistically had no shot in working. For example, Bonnie, Caroline and Elena had too strong of a relationship and theres the fact that they showed no cannon signs of being lgbtq at all. And yk Julie Plec sucks. Another example is Bonnie, Damon and Kai, these 3 were constantly at each others throat and barely had a stable line of normal friendship at all. Where they all fail Lizzie, MG and Ethan shine. Most of them have/had a basic solid line of friendship established.

Ethan and MG were best friends, and even though Ethan keeps getting compelled he always gets stuck back to MG somehow. Where you might find romance in that is how close they are, Ethan ALWAYS comes back to MG. No matter the compulsion or the danger they always find a way back to one another somehow.

MG and Lizzie have a decent friendship established, although through most of the friendship MG had a huge big ol crush on Lizzie. These 2 were good friends for many years and although MG might like her he still considers her as a good friend. In recent episodes we see that Lizzie has deeper feelings for MG, so the creators established a friendship AND romantic relationship.

Ethan and Lizzie have sort of a friendship going, but I believe its mostly romantic.

Gifs are not mine

———————

Legacies has been very progressive so far with the diversity in LGBTQ characters in the show. Polyamory has become more well-known within the years and, now more than ever, its being more accepted within society. Example as the poly relationship in Gossip Girl with Max Aki and Audrey, polyamory is getting more into media. I think these 3 have the most shot of getting an actual poly relationship due to 2 mutual romantic attractions and strong friendship that can develop into attraction.

I for one root for these 3!!!

[margoshansons]

Can you expand on the whole Bridgerton, internalised misogyny love triangle thing. With the whole Edwina and Kate and Anthony thing. I would love to hear your analysis.

Sure! I'll try to do my best without repeating myself.

The definition of Internalized Misogyny/Sexism is a series of sexist and misogynistic behaviors exhibited toward women by other women.

The best example I can think of are songs like Misery Business by Paramore and Better than Revenge by Taylor Swift, basically it was RAMPANT in the early 2000s and 2010s.

And love triangles, in my opinion, are responsible for a lot of internalized misogyny because it directly pits one woman against another. Think of Elena/Caroline/Stefan from TVD or Serena/Nate/Blair from GG or Rachel/Finn/Quinn from Glee or Brooke/Lucas/Peyton from OTH the list is literally endless. Two women are in direct competition with one another for another man's interest and often times this man is white, privileged and playing with one girl's feelings over the other. Now why does this sound familiar...?

Essentially over the last ten or so years, however, there's been a movement to include love triangles without having the two women involved hate each other or to re-examine previous love triangles and try to understand why the two women couldn't be friends even though they were previously. As feminism evolved and we grew up we began to realize that pitting women against each other did more harm than good and those friendships that were ruined were often a result of shitty writing instead of genuinely thinking about how those characters would react in that situation.

The best example I can think of is Serena and Blair from gossip girl and Rachel and Quinn from Glee. As people rewatched the show they began to see how the women were characterized and felt sympathetic to their situation. Rachel was needy and had never been loved, Quinn was ostracized and needed someone she could rely on for both fatherhood and popularity. They had their flaws sure, but eventually the fandom discourse evolved from Rachel vs Quinn to, "Why couldn't these two be friends or talk to one another?"

Same with Blair and Serena. Both girls were lonely and Serena wanted a familiar relationship that would boost her social status imo, while Blair was tired of living in Serena's shadow and finally taking what was hers. And once we understood their motivations, we understood why they felt in competition with one another.

We get no such thing with Kate and Edwina. I've talked about this before, but both Kate and Edwina are woefully under explored in a season that was supposed to be all about them. We get no scenes from their POV, no mention of what informs their motivation. Why does Kate feel the need to shield Edwina so? Why does Edwina feel stifled by Kate? And because we don't get their motivations, we don't understand why they get mad at each other. We cannot feel sympathetic for either one because we did not spend enough time with them.

The most we get is Kate having to pick up the reins because of Mary's grief and Edwina is burdened by the expectations Kate places on her but we're never shown any of that. There is more time spent on Anthony's backstory instead, which makes us more sympathetic to him.

Now, I don't know if you know this, but a majority of the Bridgerton fandom is women and the reaction to Edwina's outburst toward Kate went two ways. People immediately chose sides and began exhibiting sexist behavior toward both women. Calling Edwina a brat, ungrateful, and naive while lifting Kate up, or calling Kate controlling, toxic, and projecting her own wants onto Edwina while lifting Edwina up. The fandom has been split into two different camps essentially, with many people unable to voice their criticisms of each character without being accused of being racist/sexist. But what really happened is we fell prey to our own internalized misogyny.

We lift one woman up while tearing the other down instead of actually critiquing what the issue is. Some people want Edwina to grovel and cry and roll over without saying a word and Others want Kate to be frozen out and yelled at and suffer more than she already has. It's remarkably like the ASOIAF fandom when it comes to Sansa and Arya, claiming that one is better than the other because of the behaviors they perform and the roles they were forced to fit into.

Kate is more masculine, Edwina is more feminine, therefore one must be superior to the other. It reduces both women to props instead of dynamic, complex characters with their own agency and that is internalized misogyny.

anyway, I hope this made sense!

[takaraphoenix]

I see you like TVA and BTVS both. I’ve read the Vampire Diaries books but didn’t watch much of the show but I heard someone recently say that it was better than Buffy. First thought was to puff up and be offended for the show, because from what I’ve seen and read I still don’t feel this is true, BUT I am very curious to see how someone who *has* watched both feels on this topic? What do you think?

Sorry for the book above lol, just curious! ☺️

*offended BtVS fan noises* It is NOT better than Buffy what the fuq.

Like. It's a good show. It is genuinely, after BtVS, my favorite vampire show. There certainly are parallels to be drawn where you can tell the author definitely watched BtVS. But it's not better than that.

The fact alone that this show shelved its lead for an entire season and awkwardly shifted POVs gives it quite some point reductions, imo. And sure sure there are people who claim that that's not the case because Stefan is the "real" protagonist but... he's not. Not in the narrative this show had built up. It was always centered around Elena and the boys were always the two ends of her love-triangle and Stefan had never had the equal level of protagonist-focus as Elena.

That would have been as if BtVS would have had a whole season between 5 and 6, where we just follow the Scoobies around without Buffy while she's dead, until they bring her back. Sure, as a die-hard BtVS fan I would have actually watched the hell out of that (and I still demand they give me at least a comic run about that time), but it'd have felt majorly off and just... wrong, to do that to your lead.

(And don't at me about how this wasn't really planned and about IRL stuff and the actress. The show, genuinely, could have ended that season too, imo. It was about the money and making more.) Another major-major reason why TVD is inferior to BtVS is the queer rep. BtVS had two main characters who were lesbians, one of them one of the three core members of the show that stuck throughout all of its run, the other who admittedly did get bury-your-gayed (which I still consider one of BtVS’s biggest flaws), but they introduced another queer character after her death and didn’t just have that be it. TVD had two throwaway minor wlw characters and one mlm character who were introduced late in the show, lasted less than a full season and were all killed off (not counting the SUPER minor gays in either because... let's be real, they barely count anyway). Not one queer character survived the entire show (or, heck, a whole season), much less was an actual main character. To be en par, Bonnie should have been queer, presently queer too. But Bonnie, even as a straight character, barely had a love-life, compared to the constant drama around her white co-leads' love-lives. Both shows have Bianca Lawson looking gorgeous though. But at this point in time, I also think that Bianca Lawson's presence is like a must for a supernatural show. *looks at Teen Wolf* So yeah, I don't want to turn this into a twenty slide power point presentation on why BtVS is the superior show and I do think that tastes differ and to some people, TVD might genuinely be more enjoyable and come off as better, but I do think that in writing/execution, BtVS definitely has TVD beat. But I love them both and think that we shouldn't really pitch what few female-led shows in general - much less so in the supernatural genre - we have against each other. Seriously, this genre is very "strong man kill monsters/strong man struggles with being a man and a monster" dominated and I just love to see women thrive and see some female friendships and women lead a supernatural show.

[philtatosbuck]

hello, it's me, i've returned. i see a LOT of people criticizing the fact rebekah became friends with cami/davina/hayley but not the girls from tvd (ngl, it's mostly just people complaining she isn't friends with caroline) and apparently they chalk it up to those three being mary sues instead of them having personalities that don't clash rebekah's as violently as caroline does soooooo this is gonna be a post discussing that! it's not necessarily anti anyone, but it's critical of caroline's slut-shaming tendencies.

caroline and rebekah already started off on the wrong foot, and rebekah deliberately antagonized her for fun but even when they were on a neutral ground, they could barely stand each other. caroline made a point of repeatedly slut-shaming rebekah (among other female characters but that's another post) or using klaus' 'feelings' for her against him in order to hurt their family. the ONE moment of decency the two had for each other was when they shared condolences over esther and alaric. the only other time they 'got along' was when matt was around and they didn't get along so much at all, rebekah was being civil while caroline made her dislike of her very clear.

just because they both clearly like to be in control and have 'party planner' tendencies (as that's often a BIG point of people claiming they'd be best friends) doesn't mean they'll automatically get along. in fact, i'd argue that it's a contender for one of the biggest reasons they wouldn't get on as well as people like to think. caroline isn’t very mature during the point in her life where she knows rebekah, and rebekah does nothing but pointedly enrage her even more.

to caroline's credit, she was a teenager, it's whatever. maybe seasons 7-8 caroline (regardless of your opinion of her character at that point) who had matured quite a bit would have been able to get along with rebekah but slut-shaming, immature, shrieking use-klaus'-feelings-for-me-against-him/his family caroline? yeah right.

now let's discuss a few reasons rebekah potentially gets along with hayley, cami, davina, etc.

hayley; let me just say i don't think hayley and rebekah would have sought each other out to be friends if hayley hadn't gotten pregnant. i am acknowledging that they wouldn't run in the same circles or would have made an effort to protect each other, but she did get pregnant, so let's just talk about it. right at that first meeting, hayley establishes herself to rebekah as someone who is blunt, uninterested in petty high school feuds and quite frankly doesn't plan to let klaus control her. she further warms rebekah up to her by giving her the daggers, establishing to rebekah that she understands why she's so upset at klaus and doesn't try to excuse it like elijah so often has. while searching for elijah, they are each other's only allies because neither one of them truly trusts klaus. to hayley, rebekah has established herself as someone who will do anything for her family and will take on any fight, even one against klaus, for the people she loves. i mean, honestly? it kind of explains itself. hayley grew to like rebekah's brash personality despite the fact she "has klaus' manners" because it's clear to hayley that there is MORE to rebekah than just that and rebekah grew to respect hayley as more than just the mother of her niece because hayley was headstrong, she fought for her loved ones just as much as rebekah did and she was well and truly on her side when it mattered. their friendship was built on understanding, begrudging respect and genuine care on both sides.

cami; i'm pretty sure they sort of disliked each other at first? rebekah was jealous of cami because of marcel and cami could kind of tell, feel it out. i actually wouldn't classify them as 'friends' so much as they know each other and care for each other on the basis of them mattering to the people they love. that being said, rebekah clearly likes cami after a certain point and values her in her family's life. i'd argue this is because cami has come to fight for her family despite having no obligation to do so. i'm glad their friendship didn't actually become more to the point of best friends. to me, that would have been unrealistic. i think their "we know each other, and we would fight for each other, but we're definitely the type of friends who never hang even though we could" fits them perfectly. rebekah will ultimately always be a little bit jealous of a special woman in klaus' life as she was the only one for a thousand years (none of the others lasted) but she respects cami to a point where she doesn't bash, antagonize or try to hurt her.

davina; their friendship was.... Shaky at best. but rebekah did see a bit of herself in davina, and even said as much. she ultimately grew to care for her, and truly liked the girl. beyond kol, rebekah is the mikaelson davina "respects" the most (it's ultimately back and forth as hell, but she certainly respects her more than klaus, elijah, finn or freya). they aren't truly close by any means but they are at least openly friendly with each other when they aren't on opposing sides. which again, i think is realistic considering everything that happened with them.

[supercharmed-forever-mine]

On the rating of 10, how do you rate the writing of each legacies characters, why and who deserves better? What aspects should be improved?

I updated some of the opinion for clarity and also added Finch because I forgot her originally

I'll just make a list and go down it and I'm sorry in advance I love responding but I'm horrible at grammar/punctuation and also I might tend to ramble but I'll try to be as concise as possible. It should also be noted anything I state that might possibly relate to ships is a personal opinion and I have nothing against any ships/characters gay or straight/Good or Evil. However would it be said that I definitely mean more towards the gay/Badass with a Golden heart side of shipping with any fandom.

Hope Mikaelson- As of now I would rate her writing at about a 6. And I only say that because as we know a majority of her characters personality slightly has always but this season especially related to her relationship with Landon. And I wish we would see the Badass Tribrid Hope we've been promised since season 1 I mean sure there are no lack of examples of her bravery and martyrdom. But I am tired of her always feeling down on herself and like she's a cosmic mistake when it has literally been proven by Lizzie's wish in season 1 that their life would be infinitely shittier without her. What they can do to improve it is have her focus on friendship and herself instead of trying to always focus on Landon. She deserves more than just to be a boy obsessed character I mean she's the daughter of Klaus F****** Mikaelson for Pete sakes she literally descends from the most powerful supernatural family ever to exist and is rightfully the most powerful being on the f****** planet.

Note: I found Handon's relationship cutesy in season 1 but now not so much especially since they use him dying as a plot line way too often it just doesn't have the same effect that used to***

Josie Saltzman-As of now I would rate her writing at about an 8. I like how her character at least for a while had her own storyline going off the mystic falls High School plotline and how she lived with delena because it was a good call back for us TVD fans but I think it could have definitely lasted longer than a few episodes. We all know it was just used as a lot device to introduce Ethan as a series regular and as an introduction for her to Finch's character. But overall I feel throughout the seasons she has experienced at least some personal growth as exhibited even in 3x15 where she admitted she has to stop saying sorry especially to Lizzie for not always jumping to do what she needs / she wants all the time. Whereas before Android AU version aside because she literally had to do what she was programmed to do. She has an exhibited that she's starting to do what she needs to do for Josie before others most of the time or she's trying to. And as far as her relationship to Finch well I don't see them being endgame I have no problem with them and I do see Finch being one of her major loves of the series that teaches her whatever lesson she needs that leads her to whoever her endgame love is. With her relationships I will always miss Posie and I wish they could get Lulu back at least just for one episode. Also I feel these last two episodes of the girls being a trio they have a really Been serving Hosie with the looks but also I feel like in general Josie and Hope have been really in f****** tune. In conclusion I just don't know because Kaylee's acting skills and just turning general I would rate a billion she could choke me and I would literally thank her.

Lizzie Saltzman-as of now I would rate her at about a 7. I feel as if she has had great personal growth over the series and hell even this season. I also like hell despite everything in her life especially her eternal struggle with her mental illness she is always trying to do better and not just for herself but mainly for others and some people would say that's not good but I like it because it truly shows what she stated in 1x03 during the gargoyle incident that she never wants to be the bad or evil one. She has all this s*** thrown at her being called broken, being seen as the lesser than sister, and not to mention the absentee parents. Yet through all this she manages to only get stronger especially once she builds a genuine friendship with hope. However what I will say is that I don't like the regression of her friendship with Hope in correlation to her progress of especially her mental illness. And what I mean by that is it's almost been shown that once she had even the seeds of a true friendship with Hope that Hope would never give up on her hell not but like even an episode or two into their newly formed friendship in S1 Hope went to Josie when she Lizzie was on the verge of a bad episode and "sweet" Josie was basically like fuck her she needs to fall on her ass for once and Hope ass was appalled y'all she was like Lizzie can't control her brain chemistry and was so defensive/protective it's like once they got over that hurdle that mainly Josie gave them everything clicked into place and they were almost instant bff's. So for them to do so good in season 2 and then it seems like it showed especially in these last several episodes black magic incident to bring Landon back aside that Lizzie's old issues of resentment and jealousy towards hope are starting to come back and I don't like that because the more Lizzie had A Friend in Hope it seems like the better she got at coping and doing better mentally.(sorry if this has been a confusing several sentences). And no by that I do not mean that Lizzie is mental progress has solely relied on Hope but I do think it has helped significantly for her to have a true friend. Also let it be noted now out of every ship though I should Hosie too HIZZIE is my #1 ship on Legacies two phenomenally beautiful woman also the enemies to friends to lovers trope *chef's kiss*which might be plausible as I always wondered what they meant in the Hosie crush confession scene of season 1 when Josie said that she always went after everybody josie liked hinting that Lizzie might be at least bisexual or maybe that was just what Josie perceived at like 12/13 years old. Also on the note of relationships Mizzie was a cute concept at the beginning but I do love the fact that MG is finally finding himself and standing up for himself but he did also do it and I kind of a******-ish way towards Lizzie. And that's all I can say for her. Actually I could probably write a novel on this women and also Hizzie but I won't lol.

Alaric Saltzman- As of now I would give him a rating of like a 4 . In the last several episodes I think he's been trying to make progress at being a better person but that's about all I can say I'm not an anti. But he definitely will not be winning the father of the year award anytime soon and like many people have pointed out he was a great guardian to Elena and Jeremy so he has the potential in parenting he obviously just ain't using it or lost it over the decades. I don't hate him but I do believe they're doing a discredit towards the better man he was in The vampire Diaries especially at the beginning.

Landon Kirby-His writing is like a 3. He is just there to be arm candy for hope. Until the last couple episodes where he became this for once realistic not optimistic hardened badass he literally brought nothing to The season other than someone for Hope to obsess over. And to be someone that they repeatedly kill for shock value even though it literally shocks no one anymore. I don't hate his character but he doesn't tickle My Fancy as much anymore. His character has a lot of potentialy especially if they ever bring back in his Phoenix side and truly explore it beyond his almost endless ability to revive and being a "Bird Boy" lol. I mean truthfully they're doing him a disservice Aria is a phenomenal actor who could take his character places if they just let him be more than a basic ass plot device. Also can we talk about how gorgeous of a man Aria is especially in these last few episodes looking love it and fine as f***.

As it has become apparent to me I ramble too much and I just don't have the capacity as it is now almost 1:00 in the morning my time to do anymore characters in depth so I will be doing a simple excerpt for the rest now that I have done the main 5 people.

Kaleb Hawkins- His writing is a 8. I do like how he's coming to himself over the years and is a a right hand man to Alaric now instead of being just a uncontrollable vampire(the only hate on this part not towards Kaleb but Alaric is that it shows he will virtually mentor/uplift almost any teen that ain't his own daughters). Though in my opinion he always kind of had a point on some things especially about the hypocrisy of Alaric in season 1 especially on the bmood drinking thing. Him and Mg's relationship is awesome I'm glad they made up in the last episode and our brothers again. Also I was rooting for him and Cleo I think they would be a cute little couple. Also I need his backstory immediately especially after saying to Cleo the last time he was vulnerable he died I need to know how he turned.

Milton Greasley(MG)- His writing is a 9 the season. I say that because he is really came into his own and stopped being the punching bag. Though I think the idea or used to think at least that him and Lizzie would be cute together I am proud of him for standing up to Lizzie finally even though I liked him always being there for her I was tired of him being a fallback for her when it didn't work with whoever however I do think he could have went about the rejection a little bit gentler especially with how he knows of Lizzie's emotional problems. And don't even get me started on Alyssa that was just a disaster that should have never even been brought to fruition her cheating with Jed was probably the best thing that could have happened. I liked his little side adventure with Ethan though I do think they could have wrote it a little better I was sad when he had to compel the memories away like they still could have been friends he just couldn't have known about the supernatural stuff also I'm still not convinced Ethan won't become supernatural later in the series if he stays on. And that's all I have to say on that one love my baby.

Jed Tien-His writing I can't really give a writing I don't think it's horrible but I do think overall they could give him a better plot line as a series regular other than just being used for the comical relief eye candy/mentioning how he's the alpha. Though it was funny the whole pool tournament to decide who was alpha will Finch was just exactly that so bad it was laughable. However I do respect the fact that he even admitted to her that he knew she threw the game and that he is a genuine man of his word and has become better over the series from like this dumb jock stereotype to this genuine dude the Alyssa incident aside. He is a cinnamon roll and I will protect him at all cost.

Ethan- Again as he just became a series regular this season and barely showed up in his premiere season. I will not be rating him in any traditional sense. His writing is not totally horrible I liked his adventures with mg they could have been written better and they still could have let him be MG's friend without supernatural knowledge instead of compelling the friendship completely away. And I am still not convinced he will not become supernatural in some way depending on how long he stays in the series truthfully it's actually almost inevitable unless they go the whole route of making him the Matt/Token Human of the show which I really hope they don't I mean he can stay human but don't make him a supernatural hater.

Cleo-her writing is 10. I say that because she has been a phenomenal character and I've never seen the actress before but she is obviously phenomenal as well. I like her whole connection to Malivore and how it's a legitimate one that seems to be interwoven with the story that's already been presented and add something new. I also like how she tried and really wanted to genuinely be friends with all the characters especially hope but at the same time she was also very realistic and new probably and truthfully the only way for Malivore to be defeated was for Hope to Go full Tribrid and she wasn't above actually trying to murder hope to save herself and just get rid of Malivore which I can't blame her.

Malivore-after the end of season 3 / the first couple episodes of season 4 which were supposed to be the original ending to season 3 I better never hear the name again I am so tired of it this should have ended like at least a season ago at this point it's dragging on. This was supposed to be a monster of the week type of series which is okay me personally I have always appreciated having one big bad of the season and then a couple of minor baddies that get their characters arcs and take a few episodes to defeat or something as like a B or C plot. Point being is that this character and plot line has gotten stiff as can be. To be honest I think half of us aren't even here for plot line anymore we just want to see which of our ships get together.

Finch-I am loving her character and I do think she's cute with Josie. Also I stan anyone who is a sarcastic b**** Queen. I think it's nice how her will backstory was different than the traditional one but also I hated how sad it was like she literally didn't even know what she was doing. Though I will say calling Lizzie the "evil" twin that she can fight me because you don't talk about my blonde cinnamon roll like that is based on one impression from something that was only meant and done out of a good place and Lizzie's heart trying to find out her backstory. But other than that I have no real qualms with this character and it is too early to have a real in-depth analysis/opinion of her.

Thank you for reading this long rant hope I answered your question well enough if not PM me on anything specific.

[insertsexualitypun]

Some things I want from Legacies S3

This is going to be all over the place and pretty long. This’ll start with the general storyline things, then get down into smaller character arcs and whatnot. I’ll try to keep it somewhat organized and grouped by character but I make no promises. Also if you wanna talk about any of these feel free to dm! I’m incredibly bored in quarantine and would love to chat

- An introduction of a greater storyline past Malivore and moving away from the monster of the week thing. I know Legacies is supposed to be something different from TVD and TO, and the monster of the week concept is an interesting way to explore the universe past what we already knew, but with the premise as it exists and has been carried out now, it’s hard to develop the characters and relationships. If the characters are fighting new things every week, that makes it hard to give characters like MG and Kaleb their own stories. With a villain to anchor the season as the Big Bad, we can get characters that haven’t been given much of their own storyline a way to get more screentime as they go try and find someone or something with answers.

- GIVE HOPE HER OWN STORYLINE PAST BEING THE HERO/MARTYR AND BEING IN LOVE WITH LANDON. Hope is supposed to be the main character but this doesn’t feel like her story. As awesome as it is seeing Hope be a badass and fight monsters, I want more development from her as a person.

- Kind of ties back into the last one, but let Hope have more Dark moments like the Death Spell incident. Moments that show that while she isn’t just another Klaus, she still shares some of his tendencies towards violence and lashing out. This could work really well if they decide to keep Landon out of the picture for a few episodes.

- Let Hope and Landon break up amicably (assuming Landon isn’t really dead which let’s be real he probably isn’t) so that, again, they can grow as people. Then, if you want, they can get back together. Or just stay broken up and be friends

-  A resolution to the Necromancer - he’s a fun character and while I think he’d be fun to have around for a bit, I don’t think he’s an anchoring villain for a season. Plus to me I kinda figured that they were gonna wrap up his storyline in the last 3 episodes that they didn’t get to film before the production shutdown so chances are we’re getting this anyway.

- Either bring back Ethan, Maya and Mac more prominently, or don’t bring them back at all. Don’t get me wrong, I like the town normies storyline when it comes up, but it doesn’t come up much. Apparently, they were supposed to be in the last 3 episodes more but who knows. With the show already feeling kinda crowded (because again, the format of the show now doesn’t really allow for a ton of characters since they aren’t significantly developing, especially when these characters are in a setting completely removed from the main action of the show’s narrative), either have the normies for more than just getting caught in a magical crossfire, or put them to the side and focus on who you have at the school.

- The TVDU has progressed past the need for Alaric. That’s all I’ll say.

- The show being a little more self aware at the ridiculousness of it all. Like yeah, it’s not completely without that, but the last thing we need is the show devolving into a Riverdale, where the first season was aware of the ridiculous nature of itself, and then it started to take itself way too seriously.

- MORE LGBTQ+ REP. The show has done fairly well thus far compared to other CW shows but there’s still so much than can be done. The show doesn’t need to have show-stopping coming out storylines or anything - it’s actually the opposite. We get the casual drop of Josie having dated Penelope in the first episode of the show which was great. So let’s have more simple stuff like that. More mentions at crushes and other past romances - for all characters - that just allow for other sexualities to be normalized and not some earth shattering thing. 

- This ties into the last one but I felt like it deserved its own bullet, but also what is V NEEDED is rep of trans, genderfluid and non-binary characters. Again, it doesn’t have to be a huge storyline, but it’d be nice to have some recurring characters who are not cis. The show is meant to be set in a near future, so I think it’d be nice to show a normalized view on differing gender expression and sexuality as sort of a hope that such a future will exist.

- Hope loving beignets, eating/wanting to eat them all the time, and getting powdered sugar all over her dark clothes from them. Chances are, if you’re from/have been to NOLA, you’ve tried beignets and loved them because they’re amazing. SO LET HOPE HAVE HER BEIGNETS DAMN IT.

- More Wolf Hope moments. Let her turn more and just run because it let’s her feel more connected to Hayley :’( also the Crescent birth mark if that was ever a thing for Hope... I can’t remember, I’ve seen different things about it, lmk (politely) if that was ever a thing that Hope had

- Hope painting and sketching. It’s one of the few connections she still has with Klaus, SO LET HER EXPRESS HERSELF DAMN IT. (Yes, any time I say SO in all caps I need to end the sentence with DAMN IT, it’s a Thing now)

- MIKAELSON FAMILY MENTIONS AND APPEARANCES. Granted this one is different because there are real life schedules and whatnot that need to align, but even just more mentions of Mikaelson family members and others like Vincent would be nice. Yeah we’ve had some in the past, but it would still be nice to get some more. Also at least a mention of Rebekah and Kol checking in on Hope (assuming the writers aren’t going to pull something dumb like ‘oh the memory spell doesn’t work long distance like that so they still don’t remember her’)

- Hope also talking more about Hayley, Elijah, and Klaus. Again, feeling connected to her mom every time she’s a wolf. Always and forever, like Elijah always said. Telling stories about her father that put him in a better light than just being “The Great Evil” of storybooks.

- Hope being open with her friends about her past and how TERRIBLE it was a lot of the time like, y’know, people trying to kill her before she was even BORN.

- I’ve said this before in a separate post (which I’ll link at some point so expect an edit to this post) but I’d love for something to happen and for Hope to leave the school and go to NOLA and stay with Freya, Keelin and Nik because she’s tired of having to be the savior and still not saving everyone. (Also in that post it says Alaric comes and gets her and brings her back to the Salvatore School but we’ve progressed past the need for him in the TVDU so instead it’ll be the twins)

- Hizzie moments because whether you like them as romantically or just as friends, they are a DUO and we deserve more iconic sarcasm as well as genuine moments of friendship and caring

- Lizzie being the absolute Queen of Comedy

- But more importantly, Lizzie being more open about her issues and taking steps to have better mental health.

- Lizzie and MG having more open conversations and letting a relationship develop naturally - yes there has been a lot of development since season 1 but I feel like they both have a bit of growth to go before they should enter a relationship, if that’s something that happens

- Lizzie being happily single for a bit and not going for a guy that’s going to try and turn her into a vamp and keep her in a prison world 

- MG and Kaleb getting proper storylines or at least more play than just being the Local Vampires who help depending on the situation. They deserve WAY more than that

- ALSO MG and Kaleb backstories. How did they die and how did they get vampire blood in their system to keep them from dying permanently?

- Josie dealing with what happened pre and post Dark Josie and facing that she has always had some darkness in her. Yeah the dark magic definitely didn’t help, but she was willing to perform a spell that she didn’t know on a human over a football game and ended up breaking his arm. Not to mention, she was setting Penelope on fire as early as the first episode. It seems like we’re getting this since Josie locked away her magic in the last episode, but still, I don’t want this to just be a one episode reflection and then move on like she didn’t cause a lot of harm.

- More Hosie crumbs

- More Jade. OK admittedly this is probably really due to the fact that Giorgia Whigham is a Big Crush for me, but also the show really did start integrating her in a bit more with the black and white episode, which makes me think they’re keeping her around at least for a little bit. And I think she and Josie dating at least for a little while would be good for both of them. Jade was a ripper for 10 years in the prison world, and Josie was just consumed by dark magic and is now coming back from that. I think they’re a good (probably short-term) pairing that will help each other grow, but eventually break up because they just aren’t it for each other. And I saw this elsewhere on here, but someone pointed out that Jade could do what Penelope tried to do, but in a healthier way. Yes, Penelope was trying to put Josie first and show her her power and importance, but there’s a way to do that without gaslighting her sister and being manipulative. Sorry, I did not mean for this one to be so long.

- More Specialty episodes. The black and white episode was really fun in my opinion, and the show doesn’t have to be like that all the time, but stuff like that keeps the show interesting, as long as it makes sense within the context of the episode and storyline.

- Josie wearing the necklace Hope gave her

- I haven’t mentioned Rafael much and that’s because, despite being a main character, he hasn’t really done much besides run away with Landon, and feel guilty about having a crush on Hope. He’s personally not a favorite character of mine, but I think if he got more of a storyline - likely revolving around the fact that he was dead and being used as a pawn, as well as the fact that he possibly (but probably didn’t) kill Landon - it’d help give more to like about him.

- Caroline having a better reason for being away from the school than just researching the Merge. Like, her daughters have been fighting monsters, Josie almost died at the end of season 1, they were trapped in a prison world, Josie succumbed to Dark Magic, THEY LITERALLY HAD A MERGE EVENT and she’s still gone??? That’s not the Caroline we know. If she’s going to be gone (because like I said before, it all depends on Candice’s availability and willingness to come back), at least come up with something different than researching something her daughters have already done by this point.

- Since Landon’s not dead, let him unlock his full Phoenix powers. It’d be cool.

- Let’s have one season where Landon doesn’t run away like we don’t all know that he’s gonna be back within like 2 episodes if that

- More Dorian. I actually really like his character, he’s kind of a breath of fresh air sometimes so I’d like more scenes with him when possible

- A conclusion to Malivore and intro of a new villain. I kinda covered this earlier, but at this point, unless Malivore is going to become a tangible entity to fight instead of some black goo, it’s not a very interesting story thread to keep around for the next however many seasons Legacies goes on for.

Whew.

Ok, that’s all I can think of, but feel free to reblog and add more if there’s other stuff you’d like to see!

[livlepretre]

Okay, for the ask I just sent in, on the topic of Elena’s friends not really loving her unconditionally or caring about her for her, Damon and Stefan both started caring about Elena simply because she looks like Katherine (also, how much danger do you think Elena was in the night she technically met Damon, being human and wearing Katherine’s face? It must have been terrifying in retrospect for her, knowing he didn’t love her then and she looked exactly like the woman he’d been obsessed with for over 100 years, but was human and compellable). Maybe they grew to care for Elena later, but it was always about Katherine at the start. When Damon forced Elena to shut off her humanity, Elena straight up didn’t give a fuck about any of them (love that for her) and actually demonstrated her anger at her friends, that she’d never shown them before. She tried to kill Caroline and Bonnie, and while she loved them with her humanity on, there was no denying that there had been some deep underlying issues there. She lost her brother, whom she loved more than anybody or anything else, and was pretty much her last tether to the girl she’d been at the start of everything. It’s Jeremy’s death that shatters her completely, because he’s the only person that would always be there for her. Jeremy wanted the cure for Elena, since he thought she wanted it and also because it probably would’ve been nice for him to not worry about killing her after he became a hunter (didn’t he become a hunter because Elena was suffering from the hunter’s curse and he wanted to save her from that?) Everyone else wanted the cure because they didn’t like vampire Elena and wanted her human and fragile again, or because they wanted her blood useful again. At the beginning of season 4, everyone’s telling Elena how to be a vampire, giving conflicting pieces of advice, and telling her that she’s doing it wrong, without really telling her how to do it right. She gets in from all sides then, and then she can’t really be around her brother, since he keeps trying to kill her (those two love each other so much, I could ramble forever, but their relationship slowly grows warped through out the show (~vampirism is a curse~). Elena has Damon compel him to get out of the city in an attempt to keep Jeremy safe from the vampires and hybrids surrounding her (her mere existence brought them to town. How much must she blame herself for what happens throughout the show?), Jeremy helped trap her in the house in season 2 when she wanted to surrender to Klaus, Jeremy drugs her in an attempt to get her out of Mystic Falls, they both fight against what they are to be around each other safely again. They love each other, but holy shit, do they do terrible things to each other. They know their love is so ingrained and reciprocated that the only way they’d leave the other is through outside forces, like drugging or compulsion). Then, Rebekah, who’s tried to kill her multiple times and then really did kill her, is the only person who accepts her without her humanity. Everyone else, who accepted Damon despite the shitty things he did without his humanity and the numerous murders he committed, decided they didn’t like her that way and wouldn’t be there for her until she got hers back (and yeah, everyone was going through shit in season 4, but the Salvatores really decided that even though they forced her to turn it off, they hated that she no longer cared about them, and wouldn’t accept her that way (does anyone honestly think they would’ve accepted if Elena decided she didn’t want either of them? Stefan might have, but Damon would’ve flipped his shit). They both did horrific things without their humanity, but Elena’s a bitch to her friends and kills one cheerleader, and she’s off the rails and needs to be stopped (this arc in TVD is otherwise called the hypocrisy arc)). The Salvatores legitimately torture Elena and murder one of her oldest friends to get her to turn her humanity on again. Elena should’ve never forgiven that, and should’ve just left Mystic Falls entirely

Not sure I agree with your general premise. Like, yeah, the Salvatores are initially interested in Elena because of her face... but does anyone really care about any particular stranger until they get to know them? They go pretty quickly from interest piqued to really caring about her in a genuine way (it's fucked up, but honestly I would not have watched the show if it weren't. they're vampires. it should be fucked up). I would have a bigger problem with the show's premise if she were just some random teenager who grabbed their interest, because then it would be a question of why. What could possibly make Elena special enough to avoid getting casually eaten and forgotten about like every other random teenager on the show? The doppelganger thing at least gives us a plausible explanation for how they could get so entangled.

As for Jeremy, I agree with you that they do love each other and look out for each other in an entirely different way from the others, but it's also overlooking the fact that they're brother and sister. Of course they do. Anyone who is lucky enough to be really close with a brother or sister knows that there is literally no other bond like it. That's the kind of love you burn the world down for, that you would die for. One of the things that tvd does best is convey the depth of that particular bond, and the fact that it has the power to supersede every other kind of bond. It would be preposterous to imagine that Jeremy isn't ultimately the person Elena loves the very most. No friendship, no matter how deep, can touch that.

As for the vampire thing, I don't really have a problem with everyone being selfish about not wanting Elena to be a monster. The Salvatores are selfish. It's what I love about them. And it is disturbing when Elena kills that waitress. What are her friends supposed to do... let her go on a killing spree? The show was definitely going for some sort of storyline about going off the rails with depression and grief and anger, they just did it kind of poorly. I would have loved for Elena to go completely dark as a vampire, then to have the cure thrust upon her, the clarity of her humanity restored, and for her to have to live with what she did as a vampire. That would have been a great way to build on and maybe even conclude the arc of Elena's moral decay which we see developed throughout the early seasons.

[imissthembutitwasntadisaster]

002 + your favorite tvd character :)

There are many, so I'll go with the original beloved, Caroline.

How I feel about this character:

So in the first episode she turned up and I thought she was going to be a mean girl? because she was blonde and Elena already had a friend and heaven knows women can only have one other female friend in fiction, so I assumed she was going to be a bitch. And then she was clumsy and awkward but clearly genuine and I fell in love. I love her character development, her growth, her steadfastness, her drive. She's spectacular.

All the people I ship romantically with this character:

Tyler (I genuinely liked them! They were Acts of Service, and that was important to me), and Stefan.

My non-romantic OTP for this character:

Probably Bonnie? Their friendship wasn't particularly focused on, but it was good.

My unpopular opinion about this character:

I hate the idea that all the good aspects of her came due to being turned into a vampire. Partly because she was good when she was human too, but also partly because I hate the idea always when it comes up that the horrifying trauma that a teenage girl, that a child has gone through, is what has made her a good person, or made her better. It's disgusting.

Also I would say, I don't know if this is unpopular, but I think out of the main girl trio, she's the smart one. It comes across as Bonnie being smarter, because Bonnie's powers as a witch are more academic, but there was that time when Caroline needed to get into a class on advanced bacteria or something, about which she knew nothing, and she just memorized the textbook basically. She can gain and retain information at a terrifying speed, see with the gossip she gets in the first season, and out of all the turnings we see, she handles it the most quickly and healthily. She gets like one afternoon of training! and then boom, she's ok. I think she's extremely intelligent and I wish that were focused on more often.

One thing I wish would happen / had happened with this character in canon:

More time with her friends that wasn't related to death. After maybe the second season, she never gets to hang out with Bonnie and Elena normally. There's always some crisis, and it's exhausting. I also wish the fact that she was constantly being abducted and tortured in the earlier seasons was addressed more.

Also, weirdly, I wish she had had a better reconcilement with Damon. They have a number of very similar characteristics, and I feel like they once the power balance had been dealt with, and the rape-y stuff had been actually addressed instead of just ignored, they could have been decent friends.

my OTP:

Stefan and Caroline. For sure. They're both so happy when they're actually together. I can stand Stefan's later season writing when they're together!

my cross over ship:

I genuinely don't have one. Mostly I don't actually care about her romantic relationships. I just want her to be at peace a little.

a headcanon fact:

Caroline and Bonnie travel together, and heal their wounds a little bit at a time. It's hard to move on from being weaponised so young, even if you slip into it easily, but they drink a lot of coffee in tiny European cafes and it's getting easier.

Thank you! I always love talking about her.

Ship/character ask game

[zalrb]

sorry! i was the anon who asked bout xander and willow....i forgot to explain why....

well i don't condone cheating at all, i just want to know if you think it was understandable since willow liked xander for so long despite of ozwillow being the sweetest thing ever.

and as for their chemistry....i actually just started btvs (i knew bout ozwillow before i satrted watching the show since i saw it on your blog and only realized it was from btvs when i saw willow on the screen lol) and i don't exactly see a charged romantic pulse or sexual tension yet. i believe they have nice platonic chemistry cos i love their vibe like how they play around one another but still care for each other very much. i love the scene in which xander says "nobody hurts my willow" and willow even knows his heart rate and they both get very worried and protective over one another like when xander crushes on that teacher who was a giant preying mantis or when xander gets super iffy about "malcolm"

i also like the cute hugs and connection in their friendship. (however, i do think xander is a bit of an arse. moreover, the stuff he did when the hyena possessed his soul was just.....disturbing.) do you also think they have good platonic chemistry?

anyway my main question is, when you saw it, did you get a vibe that their friendship could transcend into a relationship? or did you only think that they have platonic chemistry...

i am so sorry that this is so messily explained and it is not exactly precise. i am pretty new to tv shows and on screen chemistry...

Hi, anon! Thank you for this, not messily explained at all :)

I’ll start with Willow and Xander’s chemistry. One of the reasons why BTVS stands the test of the time and why I talk about it so much is that for the most part, and especially in seasons 1-3, everyone had the exact right chemistry with each other, everyone worked incredibly well together. I say this because Alyson and Nick do have non-platonic chemistry, and I was surprised because you don’t see it until you’re meant to see it, which is literally the moment they cheat. Although I think you see a glimpse of it in When She Was Bad

But Nick and Alyson are very fluid because it starts super friendly

and then they change and then they dance and it’s like a flip has been switched which is what happens narratively, they put on a dress and a suit and are like whoaaaa and are drawn together

and I see them being drawn and then their kisses are like, good deep kisses

There’s the scene where they can’t help but kiss in the library and I get that because look at that kiss

he starts off by rubbing her temples and she tells him to stop but the moment he does, she grabs him by the face and their attraction is supposed to be this kind of chemical thing and I think they did it well

And when they have to play a dark vampire couple, I mean it’s like they relish it

and I mean, I speak about BTVS friendships all the time, if you want something more in depth, there are posts in the SE masterlist under TVD friendships, but they absolutely had I’ve-known-you-forever-you’re-my-best-friend chemistry

it all works.

In terms of their storyline, I understood it.  Willow had been in love with Xander since they were kids and the show is really good at portraying this crush as something that was kind of second-nature for her to have by the point we meet everyone

like when Xander’s love spell goes wrong and all the women in Sunnydale are infatuated with him, first of all Oz punches him because Willow is crying over Xander

second of all, Willow can’t even speak to him after that because she was already in love with him and then he did this

and Xander deeply loves Willow like a friend and it’s genuine

like my favourite Willow and Xander moment, Willow isn’t even physically there, he’s had enough of Buffy’s “issues” and is like

plus I love the moment between them in Inca Mummy Girl when Ampata is going to suck the life out of Willow and Xander’s just not having it, even though it’s an episode that sort of shows Willow’s romantic feelings getting trampled on

(and hope because of Oz’s ‘who IS that girl???’) we also see that Xander loves Willow and when it comes down to it, he will always choose her

but Xander is also a typical boy so he wants Willow when he realizes someone else actually finds her attractive and actually wants to be with her,

that’s when he’s like omg, you’re a girl and you’re pretty!

Like he literally makes out with Cordelia and whines about Willow and Oz while they’re kissing

so I don’t blame Willow for giving in and being “weak” despite the fact that she’s with Oz and loves Oz because even if she had moved on, a part of her had been waiting for this for forever and it’s finally happening so these things combined with the fact that I actually believed their chemistry once it turns lusty makes the narrative make sense to me even if I hate Willow cheating on Oz.

[handonhaven]

I'm actuality glad I'm not the only one not enjoying this season so far. All I want is for the characters to care about each other, especially coming from tvd and to where even if they weren't all that close all the characters worked together to help or save each other (sometimes even just because it would make someone else happy like Damon constantly saving Elena's friends cause he knew it would make her happy). But, like you said, none of them seem concerned with Hope herself, just getting her back so she doesn't hurt anyone/ to use her power. (Though, I think some of that might be Rics fault since he spent so long in the mindset that the Mikaelsons were pure evil and his worry over what Hope might grow into sort of infecting his children/students perception). Its been three seasons the characters should feel like actual friends by this point.

YES! I’ve honestly thought about this so much. Idk why they can’t have these characters caring about each other or being close the way the characters were on TVD and TO. To me, that’s such a huge thing missing from Legacies, the “squad” just doesn’t feel like a genuine group of friends or people who truly care about each other. Which is so ironic since they’ve said this show is supposed to be about friendship like... no, I’d say TVD had the most focus on friendships. And you’re right, with both TVD and TO, those characters would all work together, even if they weren’t necessarily friends. They were still part of a group and would all come up with a plan and do their part, and would often be able to save multiple people at a time. Which is not really a thing in Legacies because it’s all on Hope most of the time and she’s always gotta choose between saving Landon or multiple people when, if they’d all help and communicate and work together, they’d probably be able to save everyone in most of those situations. And exactly! I’m not even a Damon fan, but he knew how to get stuff done! Even if for selfish reasons or just for Elena, at least he would still make the effort and do his part to solve problems and save whoever needed saving. The squad can’t even do that. They shouldn’t have to constantly be calling themselves a squad every episode to try and convince us that they’re a group of people working together/accomplishing something. Because I’m not convinced. That’s something we should actually be seeing all the time rather than just hearing. And right? No one actually cares about Hope herself. Josie just wants her back so that she can save Alaric, Lizzie wants to kill her, and it seems Cleo does too, and the rest just want her back because they’re so used to relying on her I guess? If anyone actually cared about Hope herself, they would have brought up her killing Landon and showing concern for how it affected her and what she’s going through, but they don’t even talk about that. They just want her back to normal so they can use her.

And you make a good point about Alaric, it does make me wonder if his mindset regarding Hope affected the twins or the rest of the students. But I also feel like that may not be something he would have expressed a whole lot? Not until recently, anyway, with Hope becoming the tribrid, so idk. But even then, the squad has seen how good Hope has been all this time, she’s been a friend to all of them, and I had thought they had considered her their friend (even though they don’t treat her like one). So I just don’t understand how they don’t seem to care about her, and her feelings, and when she’s been in so much pain? And it’s been this way since the start of season 3 when she was first struggling after losing Landon. No one cared about what she was going through or tried to help her. And then there’s of course the fact that they treat Landon horribly too, even worse. What’s their reason for that? There doesn’t seem to be one. They’re just heartless when it comes to Landon, and after he had been a friend to them too. Like I don’t get how can you be treated well by someone, even saved by them, and then not even care when something terrible happens to them or when you believe they’re dead? Or make no effort when you could help save them and instead actually try to stop them from being saved, and are willing to let them die while showing no remorse? It’s the total lack of compassion that’s disturbing to me. I truly don’t understand any of it or how they can be like this towards Hope and Landon.

And for sure, they should all feel like actual friends after all this time. Some of them are close, like the twins, or Kaleb and MG, for example, but the group overall doesn’t seem like close friends. It just feels surface-level imo, it’s pretty sad. I had really liked them all in season 1 and had looked forward to seeing everyone becoming close but we never really got that. And it’s all gone so downhill that I don’t even care anymore because I don’t like any of the characters except for Hope and Landon now. They’ve ruined the rest of them for me.

[mrsacklesevansmgk]

My Decade in Ships

In no particular order :P

True Blood: Eric and Sookie - both Books and Show!

I shipped these two from when I started reading the books. I prefer the book version up until a certain point, rather than the show. Show gave too much importance to Bill, whereas in the books, Bill was shown to be a traitor and manipulated Sookie a lot. Eric was genuine with Sookie. I’m so glad we got to see amnesia Eric in like...Season 4 of TB.

TVD: Damon and Elena aka Delena

I shipped this from the books too, although the show is miles different from the books! I never thought that she had that spark with Stefan that she had with Damon, so I’m glad that he ended up with the girl in the end...even though Elena is a dumb character and Nina annoys me haha.

Arrow: Oliver and Felicity

I shipped it before *it* was really happening. I loved their dynamic together in those early seasons. When Oli slipped her the needle, after saying that he cared for her, I was freaking out thinking that it was alllllll a fake out. And I mean, it was. BUT Oli definitely had the feels for Felicity. 

GOT: Jon and Dany

I was a firm believer in R + L = J from quite early on in GOT and while I fully believed that Jon was Dany’s nephew and it creeped me out a little bit, it wasn’t so weird in the world of Game of Thrones or for the Targaryen’s. So when it dropped that R + L = J was legit and canon I was over the moon! Now all I needed was for Dany and Jon to meet and fall in love and swoon...happy ever after!! And I almost got that until D&D fucked it all up! But Jonerys was like my first major major ship that wasn’t canon that I truly believed in, that finally became canon only for it to end in tragedy...still doesn’t make sense!

GOT: Arya and Gendry

Well, I definitely did NOT ship this from the beginning. It was somewhere around Season 4-ish, just before the premiere and I did a re-watch and things changed for me...I was like, wait! Arya is totally into him! So I was proud as punch when they reunited...and Gendry was totally blown away by her and the woman she had become!! It was quite cute watching them flirt around each other! And I’m super chuffed they got their one night together. I was hoping that at the end of it all, Arya would have gone to Gendry and they could have lived together, happily ever after. When you think back to their earlier interactions, she said that him not having a title or status didn’t mean anything to her...and that is 100% true, but now that he did have a title, I was still hoping that she would accept him and marry him. But no :( :( It wasn’t to be...

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D: Skye and Ward

I was late to the AoS bandwagon and by the time I got around to watching it, I had already seen some spoilers of Ward’s betrayal...and I was confused. I didn’t want to like him or love them together...but I couldn’t help it. I wish that they could have been together properly :(

Star Wars: Rey and Kylo/Ben aka Reylo

I hadn’t put much thought into it to be honest. I seen TFA and was interested in their dynamic but hadn’t thought more. I went to TLJ and I left the theatre a full blown Reylo...came home to Tumblr and was lost in the Reylo world and fandom that I didn’t even know existed before! I never believed that they were related...that didn’t make sense to me at all. And even if TRoS went a different way, we still have that connection between them in TLJ. BUT TRoS went above and beyond my expectations...I never expected it to become canon!! But Rey and Ben!! They love each other!!

Charmed: Harry and Macy

These two...this one snuck up on me. I liked Harry. I liked Macy. Never thought of them together...but then their dynamic and chemistry...blew my mind!

NCIS: LA: Deeks and Kensie

Totally shipped this before it was a thing, so when they got together I was sooo excited! I’m glad that it didn’t change the dynamics of the team at all too like it usually does when 2 people get together. But it was also good when they paired them up with the others.

TVD: Klaroline aka Klaus and Caroline

Ohhhh these two, these two had some major chemistry!! I wanted them to be together sooo badly! And I had high hopes for it when TVD finished, that Caroline would eventually find her way to Klaus after she got over the headbreak of losing Stefan and she could find happiness with Klaus again. I haven’t actually watched the rest of the Originals so I have no idea what happens...I’ll watch it eventually haha

Criminal Minds: JJ and Reid

Ohhhh....I’ve been wanting this one for a while now! I’ve always felt they’ve had a great friendship, that, if given the opportunity could have grown into something more, but JJ was married and she was happy. BUT this latest season...WOWZA! I can’t wait to see where that goes next season!

Alright, that’s all I can think of atm.

[oetravia]

elizabeth chynoweth, og max evans, tess harding, rnm kyle valenti

Oooh, you’re trying to make me controversial??

Elizabeth Chynoweth

How I feel about this character?

Sad. Sad is my main feeling when it comes to Elizabeth. She made a lot of mistakes, many of which were definitely avoidable, but, more than anything, she was simply a product of her time. Which apparently an abhorrent crime where a lot the Poldark fandom is concerned.

All the people I ship romantically with this character

I’m not sure how much I ship her with any of the men she’s romantically connected with, if I’m being perfectly honest. None of them had a clear picture of her, and actually coveted whatever ideal they had created in their heads rather than Elizabeth herself, and that’s just tragic. 

With Ross, I wish so much in their relationship had gone differently, and more than anything, I wish they’d both had the strength to let the other go completely.

With Francis, I wish they’d had a better chance. Once Ross came back their’s was never going to be a happy marriage, but they could’ve had a chance if Francis in particular had gotten out of his own way. I genuinely think if he’d lived, they’d have ended up okay. They’re such an almost relationship it’s painful.

With George, I just wish Ross hadn’t gone to Trenwith that night, I wish Agatha had thought of the broader consequences of her actions than just hurting George, and I wish George himself had had a clearer understanding of Elizabeth when he’d married her (and that part of his desire for her hadn’t been about hurting Ross - because, while I genuinely believe he did love her, I think that was always part of what made her so desirable to him).

My non-romantic OTP for this character

I don’t think I have one. I just wish show!Elizabeth’s friendships hadn’t been all about other narratives (particularly Ross). I especially wish her dynamics with the other female characters had been more positive; especially Caroline.

My unpopular opinion about this character

Ross’s visit to Trenwith wasn’t her fault. Could she have handled the whole situation with Ross finding out about her engagement to George better, absolutely, but the placing the entirety of the blame for that night on Elizabeth’s shoulders is absolutely unfair.

One thing I wish had happened with this character in canon?

I wish she’d gotten to raise her daughter. I wish Valentine hadn’t lost his mother, and been left to deal with George’s shifts in attitude towards him alone. I wish she’d gotten to meet Amadora. 

Max Evans (OG)

How I feel about this character?

He deserves a LOT of the criticism thrown at him, but I think a lot of it being directed at the character is unfair, and should instead be levelled at the uneven writing and characterisation of S2/3

All the people I ship romantically with this character

Liz Parker. That’s it. Sorry. He was so focused on Liz, even when they weren’t together that I don’t think any other relationship would’ve ended happily.

My non-romantic OTP for this character

Michael, obviously. Their bond is absolutely incredible, and they make me cry so many times over the series.

And also Maria, because Maria. The development of their relationship between S1/2 was so unexpected, but so welcome. It’s such a gorgeous dynamic. I love that they not only support each other, but are 100% willing to challenge one another. It’s incredible. I wish we’d gotten the pea-pod scene from the books.

My unpopular opinion about this character.

Max made a whole bunch of mistakes, and behaved like a five star prat a lot during s2/3, but I think a lot of people forget how young the character is supposed to be. He’s, what, 17/18 by the time the series ends. Imagine yourself at seventeen, could you have dealt with all the pressure he was placed under without screwing up, and being an utter muppet sometimes? I highly doubt it. I certainly couldn’t have dealt with everything he had to deal with at 17.

That’s without mentioning the fact that he spends a large amount of S2 being manipulated by many of the other characters (even Liz; though her actions in 2x05 came from a good place. But she ensures he sees her with Kyle, effectively breaking his heart, and quickly wants back into his good graces). By the time Alex dies, he probably doesn’t know if he’s coming or going.

And bonus mention; he never gets to properly deal with the trauma of the white room. Granted, we see he’s in therapy (at least, I assume as much from the start of S2), but it’s not as if he can be honest about his problems, is it? We see that in the cold open of S2. Even in therapy, he is having to lie about his trauma. And, as we hear in the Christmas episode, the trauma of what was done to him lingers through S2.

Now, none of this is to negate his actions or behaviour, but context is important.

One thing I wish had happened with this character in canon?

A real frank discussion with everyone about what had happened during s2, and again during S3. We never really got one, just quick apologies that were pretty quickly forgotten. 

Tess Harding

How I feel about this character?

She was unfairly treated by the writers, and I’m still bitter about how her character development was thrown out the window like that. But…I loved Alex, so I’ll never be able to like her. 

All the people I ship this character with romantically

I did like her with Kyle…but I loved the family dynamic she had with the Valenti family more.

My non-romantic OTP for this character

The Valenti family + Tess was so heartwarming. 

I also wish she’d been allowed to have a better relationship with all the female characters. I think it would’ve been really good for her - especially if she’d been able to have a relationship with Liz (and Maria) that wasn’t about their respective feelings (or imagined feelings - sorry but I don’t believe for a second Tess ever really cared for Max as a person. She’d been told she loved him, and so she thought she did. I don’t think she ever really wanted to get to know him as a person, as Max…she only cared about who he had been, and who she hoped he would be again when they got back to their planet. Max with added humanity was of no consequence to her - only to enable her plan to get home) for Max.

My unpopular opinion about this character

I honestly don’t think I have any unpopular opinions about her. Other than maybe what I said above about her feelings (or lack thereof) for Max? But I don’t think even that would be particularly unpopular.

One thing I wish had happened to this character in canon?

I wish she hadn’t had to sacrifice herself to have some sort of redemption arc. 

I wish she’d realised it was okay to care for humans, and to feel safe and happy around them, the way she did with the Valentis, and had a realisation, like Michael’s, that home didn’t have to be their planet. It could be Roswell, where she’d found a family.

Kyle Valenti (RNM)

How I feel about this character

Kyle Valenti is the best person in Roswell, and we don’t deserve him. I said what I said.

Honestly though, he’s just the greatest isn’t he? Wonderful character development, both on screen and off it during the ten years we haven’t seen yet. And he’s not afraid to admit he was wrong, or own up to his mistakes. A MAN.

(I mean…the boy does get confused between Star Wars and Star Trek, so he does have some flaws…)

All the people I ship this character with romantically

Hmmm, I still ship Kyle/Liz a little bit, even though Max/Liz are the clear winners there. The fact that he supports her no matter what is lovely, and he makes her feel safe which is so tender, and important. I just love their dynamic, romantic or otherwise.

And how could I not ship Kyle/Alex. Their relationship is just so great to watch, and now that he’s done the necessary growing since high school (and apologised sincerely for his behaviour towards Alex during those years), I genuinely think they could have an interesting, healthy, and meaningful relationship. And Alex could get him to actually watch Star Wars, because BOY.

My non-romantic OTP for this character

Also Kyle/Liz and Kyle/Alex, to be perfectly honest. 

Make it Kyle/Alex/Michael because that dynamic was hilarious, and I very much hope we get to see more of it!

My unpopular opinion about this character

Again, I don’t have any, I don’t think.

I mean, he’s probably the character I feel has most in common with his OG counterpart, and it works very well (in a way that making the other characters more like their OG selves wouldn’t), but I don’t think that’s unpopular…

One thing I wish would happen with this character?

Give Kyle a love interest worthy of him! Don’t leave him as Liz’s second choice/handy on call hookup. Trevino’s acting is too good for that, please don’t waste his potential the way it was wasted in TVD (bitter? me?!)

My gosh this got long! Sorry! But thanks for the characters, Lucie, this was fun!