just thought of the most awful way a s19 grimmons fic could end
Grif is already standing one foot on the helicopter, ready for liftoff. It’s hard to hear over the whirring of the vehicle, but if you listen close, you can hear the sound of boots clanking, heavy and desperate.
Simmons’ grabs a hold of Grif’s wrist, again. Still unwilling to let go. Hold on.
Grif’s head turns, slow, and with that same care and knowing that he’s always had. They’ve always had strong body language.
He doesn’t say anything. Neither of them say anything. Hesitantly, Simmons pulls his hand back towards himself, like Grif is something to be feared. Maybe they’ve already said all they need to say.
Grif turns away from him once again. Simmons doesn’t know that Grif wants him to beg for him to stay, and Grif doesn’t know that Simmons wants to come with him. But they never say anything out loud.
They’re not looking at each other anymore. But Grif knows he’s still there. And soon, he won’t be.
“…I loved you, too.”
And the past tense means it’s over.
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Ngl, I really think that these bylers that are crying 24/7 about "purity culture" or whatever, are playing dumb when they start with their "but Nancy and Steve were 16 and 17 in that scene of s1!!!1" like... We got introduced to these characters at that age and the people playing them were already adults. So yeah, sorry but I think it's easy to see why most viewers would be uncomfortable with a more sexual scene of Mike and Will and it's not automatically homophobia, I think that would be the case with any of the kids since we got introduced to these characters when they were 12 and the actors were babies as well. We literally saw those kids grow. And I'm not saying byler should only get to peck or hold hands, It'd be cool if they have their epic kiss or whatever, but Will hasn't even had his first kiss yet and some of these people are already talking about sex scenes, like... Be for real 😭
funny you should say that...because i've used the nancy was 15-16 in season one argument (last tag) before while also saying that i understand why people find the sex part of their sexualities uncomfortable to discuss. and i wanna reiterate that, again, i totally understand that people feel like they've seen them grow up etc etc and that they still think of the actors themselves as children even thought they're not anymore.
i don't think it's all homophobia because like you said, people would probably feel the same about lucas and max and discussions of sex (i don't know if anyone is discussing that because there's much less discourse to have there and you can't argue that people are homophobic if they disagree with you) but i don't think it would be justified either. the "but we knew the characters when they were little" argument makes me think me of an ancient disney channel/abc show that old people and girl meets world fans who watched it for the first time in the 2010s will know, boy meets world (1993-2000). classic comic of age show, look at these kids. and eric in the back (he's fifteen).
they're eleven at the start of the show and then, what happens in any coming of age story happens, you guessed it...
they grow up. this is them in the later seasons, when the main characters are still in high school i think. they grow up, they talk about sex and about having sex at prom in season five and then they don't have sex right away because they figure it's not the right time yet or something like that, and then they have sex later and get married, the details don't matter. but my point is, who watches a show for five seasons, over years and years and gets upset at the main characters having sex because "this is crazy they used to be children"? isn't that the point of coming of age stories that cover multiple years or that focus on the latter years of adolescence, that they're not children forever and that at one point the characters "come of age" which usually includes their first sexual experiences?
i don't think the having sex part is particularly important in stranger things but also it doesn't have to be for it to be portrayed (see jonathan and nancy), teenagers have sex, it's just the way the world works. i'm not advocating for sex scenes of any kind especially because stranger things isn't a show that features a lot of sex in general, the only "explicit" sex scene being nancy and steve in season one with cuts to barb dying, but i genuinely don't think the duffers would have any qualms about portraying teenage sexuality in general with the party. if they did, they wouldn't have included erica threatening lucas to tell dustin what she found under his bed (it wasn't the communist manifesto) and they wouldn't have had max looking at a shirtless steve for an amount of time that's supposed to make the audience laugh. it's been 7 years. if they do a time jump, the babies will be about 17, played by actors who will all be around 20, the age natalia was when filming season one. the characters are teenagers, babies grow up. it happens to the best of us. i get why people would find it uncomfortable and maybe i would find it uncomfortable too but i wouldn't be scandalized. the duffers had no problem having a child actor portray everything will goes through in seasons one and especially two, i really feel like sex is fine and...not traumatizing or hard to watch compared to every single thing will's gone through lol. and again, i'm not even expecting them to have sex lmao, but i wouldn't cry myself to sleep if they revealed that everyone in the party actually knows what sex is.
last question: do we have any indication that jonathan had talked to more than one other girl (the girl at the halloween party being the one girl i'm counting for him) before he got together with nancy. i'm just asking because of your last sentence, because if we don't he should have slowed down also😭
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My thoughts on ZADR:
I’m completely neutral on it. I don’t hate it, I don’t mind seeing it, but I also don’t actively ship it (although this is mostly because I like the idea of Zim being aroace and not because I dislike the ship itself). And here’s why.
DISCLAIMER! VERY BIG DISCLAIMER!
I am not a proshiper. If you ship pedophilic or incestuous shit, you will get no defence here. Get lost and don’t come back. I’ve seen enough shit in other fandoms already.
I’m saying this because ZADR is believed by many to be a proship, which is why many people dislike it. When in reality, ZADR isn’t a proship and I explain why in this post.
I just wanted to say this to reiterate that I am not a proshiper, nor do I condone proshiping. I’m constantly paranoid about people getting the wrong idea or misinterpreting me and really want to avoid that. I’m not looking for drama or a fight. That being said, if you ship pedophilic stuff, incestuous stuff, beastiality or any of that horrible stuff, get the fuck off my blog. You aren’t welcome here.
DISCLAIMER OVER!
Now onto why ZADR (and other ships involving irkens) isn’t a proship or anything really worth throwing a fit over.
Dib is canonically 12 years old. That’s a fact. But the thing is, while Dib has a canonical age, Zim doesn’t, and never will. Zim’s age is up to viewer interpretation.
Zim’s age, despite what many people believe, isn’t set in stone.
Zim’s age was never mentioned in canon. In fact, not a single irken has ever had their age revealed.
The wiki seems to have pulled the “Zim is 160 in human years and 16 in irken years” fact out of its ass because I can’t find a source for it anywhere, plus the wiki has a tendency to make stuff up and present it as fact with no evidence. So it isn’t a reliable source of information in any way.
Jhonen has stated Zim’s age three different times (that I know of), and he’s changed his answer every time, calling Zim a child, an adult and a teenager. So he obviously doesn’t have a clue of what Zim’s age is and most likely never really meant to give Zim a canonical age in the first place when he created the show. So not even the creator of the show himself is a reliable source of information when it comes to Zim’s age.
Although Zim’s age is never explicitly mentioned, we get some possible small hints in canon. HOWEVER, these hints all contradict each other and can go either way in proving that Zim is a child or an adult.
Zim could be an adult because he has a high ranking military job that seems impossible for a child to achieve (an invader, at least before his first banishment) plus he worked as a scientist before, so he’s held multiple adult jobs. He also seems to be the same height as other (presumably) adult irkens. He also has a long history involving his scientist job, his joining of the military and his entire work up the military hierarchy to become an invader, plus his banishment to Foodcourtia, which probably all happened over a long course of time. He’s also allowed to pilot a ship and other various vehicles, which, assuming that irkens follow the same sort of rules for ships as we do for cars, shouldn’t be given to children. It’s also revealed in The Trial that irkens can live for several centuries.
But on the other hand, Zim could very easily be a child or a teenager because the empire may use child soldiers, which does have some possible evidence like Smeets graduating at the age of 10, irken military equipment seeming similar to video games and the fact that the irken empire is a power hungry dictatorship. It would also explain why Zim chose to infiltrate Earth by posing as a human child attending a human school, along with the immaturity and pettiness that Zim shows throughout the series. Not to mention the fact that Zim is directly implied to be particularly young by irken standards, with the Tallest mentioning in The Trial that Zim is supposed to have a trial in several centuries, but they chose to force it to happen now, implying that Zim hasn’t hit the age where a trial usually happens, which is presumably adulthood or later. Zim being a child or a teenager also explains why the Tallest are so immature, as they are the same age as Zim, so if he’s not an adult but is instead a child/teenager, the Tallest are as well.
So the evidence goes both ways. Zim’s age is entirely up to viewer interpretation. If you believe that Zim is an adult, he’s an adult. If you believe that he’s a child, he’s a child. If you believe that he’s a teenager, he’s a teenager. Zim’s age is a literal question mark, and unless new, official content is released that explicitly confirms Zim’s age, that’s not going to change. As mentioned before, Jhonen Vazquez, despite being the creator of the show, isn’t a reliable source because he’s contradicted himself at least three times now and doesn’t seem to have given Zim (or any irken for that matter) a canonical age in the first place.
And going by those rules when you look at ZADR, you quickly realize that the entire dynamic of ZADR and every other ship involving irkens in any way also depends entirely on viewer interpretation. If you interpret Zim as being a child that’s a similar age to Dib, he’s a child that’s a similar age to Dib. If you interpret Zim as being an adult, he’s an adult. Zim’s age is a blank space that you can fill out however you want.
ZADR is only a pedophilic proship between a child and an adult if you believe that it is a ship between a child and an adult and/or you actively make it that way when making the content, because Zim’s age is whatever you say it is. A random number generator could be used to decide Zim’s age and it would be equally canon as everyone else’s opinions regarding Zim’s age, including the words of Jhonen himself.
So long story short, ZADR isn’t a problematic ship unless you make it a problematic ship or it is explicitly mentioned to be a problematic ship in whatever work of fiction you’re seeing it in. So just don’t make a big deal of it and ignore it if you don’t like it.
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Some Legato thoughts:
He hates humanity, that’s pretty obvious, he wants all humans to die.
But there is this really fascinating disconnect that happens with him sometimes, where you can kind of sort of see the person he could have been peak through, but just barely.
The two most obvious examples of this I can think of is when he shares one of his hot dogs with a child that seemingly didn’t have a reliable access to food and when he frees those enslaved girls. Two things that he really did not have to go out of his way to do, and by all means shouldn’t care for at all considering his hatred for humanity.
But he still did.
And by themselves those seem like very good actions, right?
But then you remember that the hotdog had been kept in a bag with a severed head/tongue, and he wanted to use the kid to spook Vash (but then again he didn’t have to give her food to do that, he could have so easily used his powers to control her, we have seen him do it to entire groups of people with ease).
He violently kills over a dozen people with his powers in front of those slave girls, not because he intended to free them but because the slavers picked a fight with him first (but he spares the girls, none of them are physically harmed at all despite the carnage, and he offers them the closest thing he has to reassurances before he leaves, when he could have just ignored them).
It’s like he almost gets there, but not quite.
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If the PJO show gets renewed for future seasons, I really hope the audience doesn't give the child actors crap for being a little older than their characters in the show. I'm already seeing some people be like "they better film season 2 and 3 ASAP NOW!!!!" and like, I get that as fans you want the characters to still pass as certain ages, but its neither the child actors nor the PJO crew's fault if things get delayed a bit, especially when they haven't even been given the greenlight to film yet.
And another thing: I don't want the cast and crew to feel pressured by being on a deadline, whether its given by Disney themselves or by the audience pressuring them to start filming as soon as possible. Especially the child actors like Walker, Leah, and Aryan. We've seen on how deadlines can affect the overall quality or payoff of a piece of media with Frozen 2. But more importantly is the fact that the cast and crew have lives OUTSIDE of PJO and television that they deserve to experience. They are not machines who exist purely for us, the fans', own benefit. Especially the child actors.
I think it'd be great if we could get a season 2 or 3 renewed soon, but I also know that the PJO people can't do much until given the greenlight. Walker, Leah, and Aryan can't help that they are growing up. And again, putting deadlines on the cast and crew can really effect the quality of a season, as well as be very stressful on said cast and crew, especially the younger actors.
To put it short, be kind guys. If the show is renewed, be kind to the young actors and don't give them crap for being like, 1 or 2 years older than the characters they are portraying. They can't help the fact that they are growing up. And putting a deadline on them and the PJO staff would just add more stress on everyone involved and can effect the quality of the end result. Again, they've all got lives outside of PJO and TV too, and deserve to experience those lives without pressure from fans.
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