#Bobby Singer meta

[thefabledpheasant]

One of the things about Supernatural that drives me crazy is the theme about horrible biological families (with a huge emphasis on fathers) and the monologues given on this topic because it’s one of the examples of how the supernatural writers could be SO good.

The monologue Metatron gives to God is unbelievable. We just see him as evil and then he delivers this devastating monologue that paints him as nothing more than a heartbroken child desperate for his father’s attention.

And this theme is seen so often and it’s gut wrenching every time. Bobby. Sam. Dean. Lucifer. Claire. Crowley. Etc. It’s an integral part of every main characters upbringing and subsequent personality.

And then we get to see the beauty that is picking your own family and being truly loved. Bobby adopts Sam and Dean. Castiel becomes family. Jack is adopted by the boys. Charlie is like a sister. (And many other examples)

And all of this makes the endings focus on biological family all the more infuriating because they just abandoned this beautiful development they built for 15 seasons. The ending should’ve encapsulated the beautiful quote they literally wrote and had one of the main characters deliver:

“Family doesn’t end with blood. But it doesn’t start there, either.”

[starlite-png]

Sometimes, I think about that journal entry of John's where he took dean hunting and dean couldn't bring himself to shoot a deer, only for Sam (who was a young child at the time) to shoot the deer himself because he thought it was going to hurt dean. Then, I immediately think about Bobby killing his abusive father to protect his mother, and, you know, I kinda lose my mind a bit.

[t00muchheart]

Things I’ve picked up on while watching Supernatural for the first time after hearing about it for so many years:

I’ll be honest, I assumed that the Destiel would be more of a stretch. It’s just right there. It’s even in the dialogue—I mean, “when Castiel first laid a hand on you in hell, he was lost” ? “Cas, not for nothing, but the last person who looked at me like that…I got laid” (winks) ? “Cas, get out of my ass” “I was never in your…” (visible confusion) ?

Apparently the show spells Cas “Cass.” That’s incorrect. Everyone seems to agree on this. (Why would you add another s? Castiel is spelled with one s only)

I knew people died a lot but honestly people come back so much more than I would have thought. Like I knew those were Winchester rules but I was honestly expecting Bobby to stay dead in Swan Song

I did not know Kevin Tran existed. I love Kevin. (rip—the moment he said “I always trust you. And I always get screwed” I was like oh nooooo Kevin is going to dieee)

I knew Crowley was a character that mostly tried to kill them and they tried to kill but they sometimes worked together but not much else, and I also love him.

Just as a sidenote it’s really funny to see this having watched good omens, because while watching good omens I would be like “oh, pretty sure that’s also a character in supernatural” and now I’m like “oh there they are” when i see them here

[xxc0reyxx]

god the spn fandom makes me so tired.

look, people are gonna shit on this post saying that i should just leave if i don’t like it. the thing is, fandom should be a space where people can be themselves and talk about this thing they like. they shouldn’t be so frustrated by the people in the fandom that they have to leave.

we have different opinions. we have different thoughts and feelings concerning the show and the actors and the writers.

and that’s fine. having different opinions and discussing those different opinions is good and healthy for fandom as a whole. we should be able to have these open discussions without snipes and jibes towards each other. open discussion is healthy and good.

but recently i’ve seen a lot more of people harassing others with different opinions, insulting them, and this actually gets very personal at points.

i can’t believe i have to say this, but no matter what, harassing people is not okay. if you don’t like them, don’t engage.

and if you do harass someone else, they have a right to call you out. they have a right to defend themselves. everyone from fanartists to fanfic writers to just normal bloggers. if you harass them, don’t expect them to take that shit lying down.

also, don’t harass actors. if you don’t like them, post about it, but don’t directly harass them. that’s not cool, not chill. it’s stalkerish and weird.

but the spn fandom is so toxic and full of all this bullshit. it’s stupid and unnecessary. it feels like high school drama just with adults. it’s infuriating.

just, please.

supernatural fandom, do better.

[deancasforcutie]

The Winchesters + Time Periods

Or why I can't begin to describe the stroke of genius it was to follow up 15 years of vicarious nostalgia for an era one was never part of with a series set in that era, laying bare the illusions our original unreliable narrators learned to recognize as such with us in real time

The vision of the 1970s, more earnest than the whitewashed myths younger generations had to deconstruct for ourselves, representing that shining moment where queer liberation started speaking its name. The funhouse mirror of the white picket Fifties, once again set in stark contrast to a countercultural merry band led by our holy goof unstuck in time. The quite literal representation of how generational trauma unravels linear timelines, as the parentified wayward son passes his inheritance back down to break the circle in a spiral wheel inside a wheel never ending or beginning on an ever spinning reel-

I just think it's groovy

[ananke-xiii]

My ranking of SPN seasons (based only on their PLOT) pt. 1

Okay so I've finally watched all 15 seasons of Supernatural and, I must say, what a journey!

The show has releaved itself to be a pleasant surprise, I've learned a lot thanks to it. I must confess that I had strong prejudices against it and had been avoiding it all these years because I thought it was... well, tbh not worthy.

Of course, since now I am here writing about it, it's useless to say that I was wrong. It's not the perfect show, sometimes it's not even a good show, but for sure it's an enjoyable, interesting and exciting show.

The following ranking is based solely on the plot (and subplot) of each seasons and my personal opinion about it.

15. Season 14: Frankly, I don't know what to say about this season, LOL. There is no real plot. We are led to believe that the story will revolve around Dean being possessed by Michael, okay. Basically Michael!Dean from the AU goes to Earth 1 to create an army of monsters (?) but then says bye bye to Dean and leaves (??), but oh wait, no, he re-possesses him (???), and then the army disappears (???) and then he gets trapped in Dean's mind and then he posseses Rowena (???????????). In the mean time, Jack is sick, dies, gets rescued by Castiel who makes a crazy deal with The Empty, then kinda goes crazy and starts killing angels (?????) and then gets killed by God. He also accidentally kills Mary Winchester (???????) in the process. I dont' get it, okay? Maybe it's just me! At any rate, we discover that Michael can possess whoever he wants since he easily changes his vessel without consent multiple times. This fact alone contradicts the whole of season 5 (Dean is the chosen one, the one and only Michael's vessel, hello writers?). Finally, the whole Nick/Lucifer thing. I get it, Mark Pellegrino was GREAT as Lucifer, I loved him, I wanted to see more of him. But his subplot was nonsense and meh. So, yes, the plot was bad. Reeeeeal bad.

14. Season 15: One of the the fun things about Supernatural is, for me, the fact that it doesn't take itself too seriously. Throughout the whole series we have continuous meta incursions and I find that extremely interesting. However, I think that with the final season they went too far. The plot (kiling the manipulative and frankly insufferable God) is stimulating enough until the episode named "The Trap". After that, I felt like the writers didn't know how to fill the remaining episodes until the end and just wasted half of the show on basically nothing really noteworthy. Also, one could totally see that the main worry was not the plot but trying to tie all loose ends off. It was unsuccessful. I would have preferred a well-executed plot rather than a plot that aimed at"filling in" all the gaps of a 15-year-old TV show (read: it's almost impossible, also unnecessary). The final episode was just bad, like really really bad. The plot was resolved by episode 19, so the last episode really felt like something made to end the show forever, kill everyone off and never talk about them anymore. It didn't make any sense at all.

13. Season 7: I didn't hate season 7 per se, but the plot was not great. Like season 15, the season starts off strong with the main event but then it drags itself out until the end. There's no meat in between. The gist is to kill the Leviathans, the subplot is Sam's confronting Lucifer's mental abuse. The most interesting stuff (aka the introduction of the Word of God) happens around the last 3 episodes. This is one of those seasons that are needed to "connect" different points in the myth-arc, however it was not done brilliantly. I felt like Bobby's death was not necessary to the events, it was poorly done for emotional sake. The"Dick jokes" are funny at first, then they are tiresome. After a while I couldn't take the characters seriously, it was all one big dick joke after another, please stop. At the end, we find out that the whole subplot was utterly useless: Castiel shifts the Sam's mental problem from Sam's mind to his, goes crazy in exchange, ultimately to be cured once he's in Purgatory. I'm sorry, what? Also: the Leviathans (the close-to unkillable monsters the heroes have been fighting for the whole series) become just "regular monsters" and that's it. I'm sorry, WHAT?!

12. Season 3: This season contains arguably some of the best episodes of the whole show. The 2007-2008 Writers Guild of America Strike affected the way the plot was planned (I presume) but I think it was for good. As a result, the plot is clean, simple, easy: the heroes need to rescue Deam from the demonic deal he has made. I like when there's a sort of "deadline" in the plot, it keeps things interesing for me. That's it, that's the plot. There's no subplot either. So why this low in the ranking? WELL. The first half of the show made me very uncomfortable. The jokes sounded very, very problematic and I had a very hard time finishing the episodes. Now I know this has nothing to do with the plot, but hey. It made me feel uneasy and the ranking is mine so ranking n. 12 it is!

11. Season 6: I appreciated the writers' attempt with this season. Basically, both the plot and the two main subplots make zero to no sense until the end, when we discover "the truth". As a matter of fact, until episode 19 we don't really understand what's going on. The plot seems to be the hunting of the Alphas and, eventually, of the Mother of them all: Eve. One subplot seems to be a civil war in Heaven, although we are only told about it and never see anything. The other subplots is Sam being soulless + the fact that now he's been hunting with his resurrected grandfather who, in turn, was resurrected by Crowley and now works under him (LOL). For the plot and the first subplot to make sense the missing link is this: Castiel and Crowley have been pulling the strings all along without the heroes' knowing. For the subplot... well, for the subplot (Sam being soulless), too LOL. Cas and Crowley are having an "affair of sorts" and plan to open the door to Purgatory to take souls from there and use them as... energy? Yeaaah. I liked the "whoaa I didn't see it coming" factor. HOWEVER, for it to REALLY make sense one needs to acknowledge Cas and Crowley relationship. Like, seriously, the reason why everything starts to go wrong (and interesting) is because Dean feels "betrayed" by Cas. Which makes zero sense. But I digress. What I want to say is that the turning point of the plot is understated unless you get the "romantic" implications. It's left to the audience to get it but, honestly, I didn't get it at first so I didn't get why the characters were so angry at Cas and why Cas didn't tell Dean about his affair with Crowley. Then when you get it, you get it but anyway the plot is not the best the show has to offer.

[blue-chimera]

I've seen people suggest that Dean or Bobby should've caught on to soulless!Sam a lot faster. I don't think that's entirely fair.

First, Bobby: I don't think soulless!Sam spent much time with him before the start of the season. He wouldn't have had a reason to. But as far as Dean goes, well, Dean suspects that something's wrong pretty early on. He just doesn't know what. And it muddies the water enormously when Sam tells him that he remembers his time in the Cage, leading Dean (at first!) to the pretty reasonable conclusion that Hell & hunting solo have just hardened Sam, made him a lot more callous since Dean last saw him.

Further complicating matters is the fact that soulless!Sam went through all the standard tests to prove himself when he first showed up (silver, salt, holy water), ruling out any of the obvious suspects for altered behavior right off the bat. Still...

despite having no good evidence of anything supernatural afoot, Dean is noticeably disturbed by Sam's attitude when they hunt together in E2 & in E3 "The Third Man" (when Cas inflicts excruciating pain on a child for information & Sam hardly blinks).

Then, we only get a glimpse of them in E4 "Weekend at Bobby's," but what we do see is Dean continuing to express his concerns about Sam (while Bobby is — reasonably enough! — distracted by his own concerns). And then, of course, by the end of E5 "Live Free or Twihard," Dean finally has what he feels is sufficient proof to say, "Whatever he is, he's not my brother." And at this point, Dean seems confident enough about everything he's seen/heard to want to kill Sam. (Or rather, what he thinks is an imposter using Sam's body.)

Bobby temporarily persuades Dean to hold off, but by the end of E6, the jig is up.

IMO, what it boils down to is this: Dean is suspicious of Sam's behavior almost from the very beginning, but, well, it's Sam. Sam, who he thought was dead (and trapped in Hell with Lucifer himself) for an entire year. And he really just wants to believe that Sam is back & that he's okay. He wants it so bad he can't even stand to question it at first. That's why Dean doesn't do any of the standard tests on him when Sam first shows up (and why Soulless!Sam ends up doing them all on himself). Dean says it's because he just "knows" it's really Sam, but he's not stupid. He knows the (now-standard) precautions. So that's 100% his heart talking, not his head.

When he's finally recovered enough from the shock to start being suspicious, the suspicions pile up quick. But Dean doesn't have enough information to act on them (when "acting on them" means turning on Sam). Until, finally, in E5, he gets what he feels is cold, hard proof.

[It's also worth pointing out that a lot of Dean's mental & emotional energy is focused on his relationship with Lisa & Ben at this time. He loves Sam. He wants to hunt with him. And he wants to know what's going on with him. But he's also trying to integrate a long-distance relationship (with a family) into hunting. And that's not easy.]

[mad-as-a-box-of-frogs]

If I go with you . . . can you promise that this time it will be final? That if I'm dead, I stay dead. Nobody can reverse it, nobody can deal it away, and nobody else can get hurt because of me.

I Think I'm Gonna Like It Here (9x01): Supernatural (2005-2020) [127 / ?]

[watching-sam-and-dean-again]

Season 7: Deaths Door

So, I’m watching a reactor who just got to this episode. Yes, this is another post based around reaction videos. No it’s not the same one I wrote about last time (if I have any followers who keep track). Yes, I have a reactors on the go currently, and sadly, two of them are on seasons I don’t like much (Season 7 and Season 15), so it’s a bit rough going right now.

Anyway, I think the episode where Bobby dies is a good one, though it is definitely sad. There are quite a few moments that really stand out for me. First, Dean punching the glass when the organ donor guy comes to talk to him while Bobby is still alive is really impactful. You understand and empathize with Dean so hard in that moment, and I think he showed unusual restraint in punching the glass rather than the man. My guy, what the hell are you doing asking someone about organs while their loved one is fighting for their life? Next, Sam pressing on his palm while he tries to wrestle with the reality of Bobby dying is heartbreaking to me. I think this is a moment that some people miss, but it hurts so much while it reminds me that Sam, while he mostly looks okay on the outside, is still dealing with the aftermath of his soul being locked in the cage with Lucifer for 180 years. The guy is struggling with reality on a daily basis, thinks he doesn’t have it so bad just because others experience "worse," and is now losing his surrogate dad. Finally, Bobby's memories of the boys being just totally average little moments of them acting like typical brothers is very wholesome. Though, I enjoy all of Bobby’s memories (Rufus!) and what they show us about Bobby. Really good episode overall.

Now, here is where my … problem (I guess I’ll go with that term) comes in. I like this reactor because they are entertaining, and they tend to try look at things from both brothers' points of view most of the time, but they said two things that irked me a bit while watching the episode, especially because they seem to be opinions shared by a lot of viewers. Obviously opinions are going to be subjective, so I don’t think this reactor is being unfair. I just don’t fully agree. First, they said that they feel especially bad for Dean in this episode because he has been through so much. Second, they suggest that Bobby's death might be harder on the boys because Bobby was more of a father to them than John was.

Please see my thought under the cut

So, tackling the first idea, I don’t object to feeling bad for Dean this season or the idea that he has been through too mich. At all. I object to the implied idea that he has somehow been through more or worse than Sam at this point in the show, and thus deserves more sympathy. Excuse me, but, what!? Let’s not delve all the way back through their history because that could go on forever, instead let’s just look at Season 6 and Season 7 (up to this point).

Let’s start with Dean. He experienced the pain of having a soulless Sam back, who didn’t particularly care about him. This is essentially one of his worst nightmares, so I understand him reeling from this for a while. He gained and lost a family, and picked up a heap more loss and guilt to deal with from leaving them. He was betrayed by his "best friend," who also hurt his brother just to stop Dean from interfering with his purgatory plan. He has to "deal with" Sam suffering from hallucinations. He broke a leg. He’s had to temporarily give up his baby. And now Bobby, his surrogate dad, is dying. These are all very hard things, and I truly feel bad for Dean having to go through them, but he’s also done things to add to his own misery this season, like kill Amy and lie to Sam about it and drink his face off instead of coping with his depression and guilt. Dean is his own worst enemy, and it sometimes affects the empathy I have for him.

Now, let’s look at Sam. Since Season 6, Sam has to come to terms with the fact that while he was soulless he did absolutely terrible things, things that he has to now remember and live with, even though in his normal state he never would have done them. He was also betrayed by Cas. First, Cas brought him back soulless, and while I don’t think he knew what exactly was wrong with Sam, he knew something was off and then proceeded to ignore Sam when he reached out to him about it. Then, he betrayed him by breaking his hell-wall just to distract Dean; he risked destroying Sam's mind entirely just to get Dean out of his way. Now, Sam is the one who is actually suffering from hallucinations, which have never gone away up to this point, rather he just learns to distinguish them from reality and go about his business. The show doesn’t remind us of this constantly, so I kind of understand audiences not actively thinking about this. Still, what Sam is experiencing in Season 7 is horrific. On top of all this, he’s worrying about Dean because of his drinking and depression. And now he too is losing Bobby, and he didn’t even have a sweet one-on-one memory to fall back on with Bobby unless he did and it just wasn’t significant enough for Bobby to remember. While Cas' betrayal probably hurt Dean more because Cas was closer to him at this point, what he did still has to hurt Sam, too; it even made him wonder if Cas brought him back soulless on purpose.

Now, my whole point with this is not that people should feel worse for Sam than Dean, but that it seems crazy to me to feel more empathy for Dean than Sam at this point. Dean has to worry about Sam's mental state, but Sam is the one living it. Meanwhile, Sam is worried about Dean's mental state, which is poor partially because of what’s happening with Sam these codependent boys have both been through way too much in the last Season and a half alone. Just because Sam isn’t as demonstrative with his emotions as Dean a lot of the time doesn’t mean he isn’t also in pain. So, I empathize strong,y with both of them in this situation of losing Bobby on top of everything else.

Finally, the idea that Bobby is Sam and Dean "real" dad is one I always take issue with. John is not perfect by any means, but he did love his sons. He literally sold his soul to save Dean. This is not nothing. Dean has fond memories of him, and Sam had a nice moment with him and laughed with him in "Dead Man's Blood." When John first sees his boys after months (years for Sam) apart, he hugs them both. This is not a dad who doesn’t love his kids. His harshness was a result of fear for the boys most of the time, not unlike how Dean treated Ben when he was worried about him and Lisa at the end of Season 6. I’m not saying this is right, or that he couldn’t be too harsh, but they are living extraordinary experiences. John raised his kids like soldiers, but if he hadn’t they’d probably have died sooner. And the fact that they called him Sir, didn’t mean that he was only a Drill Sargent to them. Moreover, even though John made a ton of mistakes, his death was absolutely devastating for both Sam and Dean. Bobby on the other hand, may have "adopted two boys" in his heart, but he wasn’t perfect either. He’s been harsh with both of them at times, sometimes fairly, other times not as fairly, and he clearly has a favorite, which isn’t ideal in a father figure. Yes, he brought Dean to play catch, but an uncle might do that too, and did he ever do something like that for Sam? I like Bobby, I really do, and I think he’s a good surrogate but he is not their "real" dad, either. And while a terrible blow, I don’t think his death has equal impact on the boys to John’s.

Anyway, that’s it on this one. Thanks for reading, if you made it this far.

What are your thought any of this?

[sallysetoncore]

other than like. the weird obvious problem with "party on, garth". it's such a well constructed episode. like we have this really fun basic concept of "a monster you can only see when you're drunk" but the execution actually pays off?

like we open the episode and it looks like a fucking normal case episode but instead of sam and dean, it's garth. and he's standing over the bones saying "you've been garthed" and playing "poison" and you're like. this is high art. i would watch fifteen years of this.

but like i'm also really transfixed by the existence of garth as a hunter on his own. he does not play into the toxic masculinity that we've seen from hunters like john and sam and dean. he's goofy and silly and that does not stop him from being good at his job. he gets the little girl to open up about seeing the monster (note: i do think dean could have also done this. dean being good with kids is like, a key part of his personality.) and figures out that baxter's the father. like he fucking solves it. and he does it without being a dick. him being an antithesis to the Classic American Hunter does not make him a bad hunter.

i also fucking LOVE the bobby plot. you as the viewer get to play hunter. you know the lore about ghosts since season one (that you gotta burn the bones, but even if you did that, they can attach onto an object). like you can figure it out. you have all the clues. and they've been sprinkling them in for like ten episodes. you can connect the dots and that's so fucking fun. and the scene when dean goes back into the motel is crazy heartbreaking (also the scene in the brewery, obviously, where he lets himself like, hope for a second? because in this episode, for the first time, all of his grief is for bobby. he got cas back. so. maybe. just maybe. he can let himself hope he gets bobby back).

and it's the first episode this season that sam doesn't have lucifer in his brain, which is pretty slay.

[italwayshadtobeyou]

@eisforeidolon I'm making a new post here, at this point it's bordering on derailment of your original post, but I do have thoughts about the comparison between John and Bobby as father figures to Dean.

It's possible that the writers intended for you to read Bobby as having become Dean's main template for a hunter, I just don't see it in the series' execution. Compare how Dean reacts to Bobby's demon deal with how he reacted to John's in season 2. When Dean realized that John had sold his soul to save him, he was furious and heartbroken. He appeared tempted by a crossroads demon's offer to swap them out.

In season 6, Dean knows that Bobby has made a deal with Crowley. I would say he assumes that their deal would've forced Crowley to return Bobby's soul at the allotted time (which would make sense), except that he evinces no surprise at Bobby's predicament when Bobby talks about it. He's only surprised that Bobby is taking time to chew him out over his lack of interest. I can't imagine Dean finding out that John was Hellbound, and then basically going ::shrug.::

Granted, I think that "Weekend at Bobby's" is a weak episode, probably the worst of season 6. All those hidden sub-clauses contradict the workings of demon deals from season 2, and "best efforts" absolutely should have already compelled Crowley to return Bobby's soul. Still, it is how season 6 goes, and it does, to me, argue against the idea that Bobby has replaced John in Dean's esteem.

It doesn't exit in isolation, either. Any of the 3 preceding episodes could've shown Dean asking about the deal, or how Bobby's been, or, y'know, saying something to demonstrate concern for Bobby's well-being. Maybe Dean is (understandably) angry at Bobby for his deception regarding Sam's return, but would that have been enough to make him flat-out quit caring about John? I can't picture it.

So while I think that Bobby does occupy a paternal role in the sense of mentoring and emotional support for Dean, he still isn't ensconced there as firmly as John was. Dean likes Bobby, sure, but does he care about him the way he did about him the way he did about John?

Seasons 8-9 drive home that Dean cares far less about Bobby's soul than he did about John's. Again, "Taxi Driver" is a dumb episode on multiple counts (especially the bribe-able reaper-- imagine stealing from the till when Death is your boss), but the show does run with the idea that Crowley stole Bobby's soul. Keep in mind that Crowley 's a free agent at this point (so, no one to punish him if he doesn't steal souls), and he isn't even getting nominal agreement from his victims. He just wanted to break the rules, so he did.

After Sam quits the Trials, when Crowley has become expendable, does Dean look for revenge? Nope. There's no "This is for my dad, you son of a bitch," or even just a stab with the demon knife. He not only keeps Crowley alive (despite Sam's questioning that decision), he teams up with him to get the Mark of Cain, just half a season later. Would that have been his call if it was John's soul Crowley had stolen?

Even in your example of "Dream a Little Dream of Me," where he tells Bobby he's like a father to him, it isn't Bobby's jacket he's wearing, or Bobby's music he's listening to. As his demon self from his vision tells him, it's John's.

[airplanedemon]

Hell's time dilation: where did it go?

In s4 of Supernatural, we get told pretty clearly that 1 month on Earth is equivalent to 10 years in Hell. Which is a great system for them to turn souls into demons faster. But at some point in the show, Hell stops working like that. Time passes normally there. It stops getting mentioned. Dean was there for 4 months and came out 40 years worth of messed up, but Bobby was there for almost 2 years (the purgatory year, plus most of s8) and came out of it just fine. He was literally just chilling down there. Sam goes down there to get Bobby while Dean remains on Earth, and time seems to pass the same for both of them. They even make a point of giving Sam a time limit.

Hell's time dilation has been shut off.

When and why did this happen?

Well, it's Crowley's fault, as many things are. He's king of hell, but doesn't want to work down there, but he also doesn't want all the demons in hell to have extra time to plot against him, so I think he just turned the time dilation dial all the way down and left it there. This is why he keeps having fewer and fewer demons around to do his bidding as the seasons progress. Hell just isn't producing like it used to.

Also Crowley loves his cellphone and I'm pretty sure Hell has been shown to have cell service, which I doubt would be possible unless it ran on Earth time.

[crowley-the-1-true-king-of-hell]

The Crowley Tour

6x20 "The Man Who Would Be King"

Cas about Crowley

These demons would lead the Winchesters to Crowley, and Crowley would tear their hearts out.

Would is the past of will.

Will expressing a strong intention or assertion about the future.

Cas genuinely believes Crowley will kill them and I find that high praise because it means Cas has a really high esteem of Crowley's abilities

I love how defiant Crowley was in the early seasons lmao. Cas was like I won't let the Winchesters get to you and Crowley was like let them get to me!

I also appreciated that Crowley gave Cas help with Raphael and when Crowley freed Cas from the holy fire, what was interesting is that Crowley was genuinely glad to have freed Cas from the holy fire. I've seen sarcastic Crowley in 12x03 He wasn't there to be thanked or appreciated. He came to free Cas, because Cas is his partner and he didn't want his partner in danger. Would have been nice if Cas was grateful though

Crowley was glad he freed Cas because it was the right thing to do

Bobby's view of Crowley finding Purgatory is so funny. Sam & Dean's attitude is like wow Crowley is doing the evil of opening Purgatory. Whereas Bobby's view is

We got to find Crowley now, before the damn fool cracks open Purgatory

It's hilarious because with Sam and Dean they want to stop Crowley because Crowley is a demon. With Bobby he wants to stop Crowley because he believes Crowley is being a dumbass

I know Crowley is highly intelligent but against my intention Bobby Singer's perspective is funny

I really wished that the Crowley who didn't underestimate those denim wrapped nightmares was more prominent in season 8. However there are trauma reasons to why Crowley behaved impulsively rather than underestimating them

I also find it hilarious and adorable how Crowley beams at Cas when he shows Cas how torturing Eve tortures the vampire. Like Crowley said that there's no point to the torture but he wanted to show off to Cas anyway

Cas is very confident that the plan will work in 6x20 and honestly I think part of that confidence is Cas still seeing himself as the strong, intelligent angel that he is. But also what if it's Cas' faith in Crowley's ability? Cas has faith in Crowley and that's another reason why he believes the purgatory plan will work out

The Crowley parts of the episode? 8 out of 10

[swishyclang]

why was Bobby/Crowley not more of a Thing back in the day? they would make perfect dysfunctional, perpetually divorced parental figures for their beleaguered codependent Winchester kids

[serialadoptersbracket]

Round 2 Polls:

(Projected length: 32 days)

(Bonus Rounds: Here)

Day 1:

1. Ogai Mori vs. Pascal

2. The Doctor vs. Franky

Day 2:

3. Madoc vs. Daenerys Targaryen

4. Inspector Barnes vs. Bright Noa

Day 3:

5. August vs. Claude Frollo

6. Cale Henituse vs. Leif

Day 4:

7. Simon Petrikov vs. Chiron

8. Yami Sukehiro vs. Sei Handa

Day 5:

9. Gintoki Sakata vs. Eithan Arelius

10. Dr. Gregory House vs. Maglor

Day 6:

11. Wolverine vs. Izumi Curtis

12. Roy Mustang vs. Abraham van Helsing

Day 7:

13. Askeladd vs. Rune Saint John

14. Guts vs. Jake Sully

Day 8:

15. Sir Reginald Hargreeves vs. Jean Valjean

16. Kohachi Inugami vs. The Fix

Day 9:

17. Kanan Jarrus and Hera Syndulla vs. Gumpa

18. Aphmau vs. Agent Washington

Day 10:

19. Grace vs. Vector the Crocodile

20. Alec Lightwood-Bane vs. Dadan

Day 11:

21. Bobby Nash vs. William Adama

22. Korosensei vs. The Warrior of Light

Day 12:

23. Kaname Date vs. Jack Starbright

24. Satoru Gojo vs. Dutch Van Der Linde

Day 13:

25. Xie Lian vs. Takashi “Shiro” Shirogane

26. Tom and Maddie Wachowski vs. Sakyo Furuichi

Day 14:

27. Welt Yang vs. Herlock Sholmes

28. Carlisle and Esme Cullen vs. Dracule Mihawk

Day 15:

29. Artemy Burakh vs. Barry and Iris West-Allen

30. Kazuma Kiryu vs. Yuugo and Lucas

Day 16:

31. Master Wu vs. Dave Seville

32. Axel vs. Izumi Tachibana

Day 17:

33. Arlecchino/The Knave vs. Sarah Jane Smith

34. Qifrey vs. Bell-Mere

Day 18:

35. Bobby Singer vs. Cap’n Craig Cuttlefish

36. Professor Hershel Layton vs. Donna Hanscum

Day 19:

37. Giovanni Potage vs. Ingo

38. Miles Edgeworth vs. Vil Shoenheit

Day 20:

39. Nick Fury vs. Dalinar Kholin

40. King Dedede and Meta Knight vs. Kavax au Telemanaus

Day 21:

41. Arataka Reigen vs. Jawbone O’Shaughnessey

42. Gol D. Roger vs. Abigail Pent and Magnus Quinn

Day 22:

43. Toriel Dreemurr vs. Master Kongo

44. Pongo and Perdita vs. Dr. Ivo “Eggman” Robotnik

Day 23:

45. Lance Strongbow vs. Derek Hale

46. Tony Stark vs. Roronoa Zoro

Day 24:

47. Jody Mills vs. Eric Gale

48. “Red-Haired” Shanks vs. Kurogane and Fai D’Flourite

Day 25:

49. Han Muchun vs. Iroh

50. Splinter vs. Lilia Vanrouge

Day 26:

51. Bruce Wayne vs. Thomas O’Malley

52. Jupiter North vs. Keishin Ukai

Day 27:

53. Kim Dokja vs. Roberto de Niro

54. Shōta Aizawa vs. Doctor Carmilla

Day 28:

55. Mendoza vs. Soundwave

56. David Wymack vs. Ash Ketchum

Day 29:

57. Wen Kexing and Zhou Zishu vs. Yondu Udonta

58. Eda Clawthorne vs. Gavroche

Day 30:

59. Fukuzawa Yukichi vs. Optimus Prime

60. Camila Noceda vs. QSMP!Philza

Day 31:

61. Phoenix Wright vs. The Dragonborn

62. Bruno Bucciarati vs. Oliver Queen

Day 32:

63. Whitebeard vs. Otose

64. Sojiro Sakura vs. Yukari Yakumo

[oopsalldadsderby]

The contestants have been finalized! Here's the bracket lineup!

So how this is going to work is, there's going to be 8 polls a day, starting tomorrow, until we hit semifinals. That means we'll do group A, B, C, D, then side AB, then side CD, then all the quarterfinals together. I'll update the images whenever we hit a new round.

Plain text Round 1 matchups under the cut:

(As a reminder, groups are formatted as [Dad name] & [Kid name]. So if there's multiple of either dads or kids, they'll use the word 'and.' Think of the ampersand like a separator.)

Group A

Bruno & Team Bucciarati (JJBA:GW) vs. Kanan & Ezra (SW Rebels)

Tony Stark & Peter Parker (MCU) vs. Lin & Asami, Mako, Bolin, Korra (LoK)

Balsa Yonsa & Chagun (MGotS) vs. Thancred & Ryne (FFXIV)

Aizawa & class 1A (MHA) vs. C!Philza & crew (DSMP)

Sojiro Sakura & the Phantom Thieves (Persona 5) vs. Tommy "Big Man" & Gus (Sweet Tooth)

Finn & Leif (FE) vs. Sandor & Arya (GoT)

Axel/Lea & Roxas and Xion + King Mickey and Riku (KH) vs. Artemy & Sticky and Murky (Pathologic)

Joel & Ellie (TLoU) vs. Darkwing Duck & Gosalyn Mallard (Darkwing Duck)

Group B

Pyrrha & Nona (TLT) vs. Kelsier and Vin (Mistborn)

Fukuzawa & Ranpo (BSD) vs. Miss Honey & Matilda (Matilda)

Jack Wynand & the Little Sisters (Bioshock) vs. Scar & Mei Chang (FMA)

Eda Clawthorne & King and Luz (TOH) vs. John Silver & Jim Hawkins (Treasure Planet)

Logan & Kitty and Jubilee (Wolverine) vs. Geralt & Ciri (Witcher)

Donquixote "Rosinante" Corazon & Law (OP) vs. Rouxls Kaard & Lancer (Deltarune)

Sully & Boo (Monsters Inc) vs. Simon & Marceline (AT)

Din & Grogu (The Mandalorian) vs. Bobby Singer & Sam and Dean (SPN)

Group C

Welt Yang & March 7th and the Trailblazer (Honkai Star Rail) vs. Jim Hopper & Eleven (Stranger Things)

Ingo & Irida and protagonist (PLA) vs. Gregor Samsa & Emil Sinclair (Limbus Company)

Nanami Kento & Itadori Yuuji (JJK) vs. Meta Knight & Kirby (Kirby)

Phoenix Wright & Trucy (AA) vs. Shirou & Michuri (BNA)

Yuugo and Lucas & 50 kids (The Promised Neverland) vs. Stan Pines & Dipper and Mabel (GF)

Date & Mizuki (AI:TSF) vs. Peabody & Sherman

Cabalena and Jowd & Lynne (Ghost Trick) vs. Pigsy and Tang & MK (LMK)

Kiryu & Haruka (+others) (Yakuza) vs. Tenmyouji & Quark (Zero Escape)

Group D

Silco & Jinx (Arcane) vs. Guts & Schierke (Berserk)

RGB & Hero (TPoH) vs. Father Garcia & John (FAITH)

Sam and Max & The Geek (Sam and Max) vs. Tom Wachowski & Sonic (Sonic movie)

Rei and Kazuki & Mira (BD) vs. Daud & Billie Lurk (Dishonored)

Chongi-re, Numeri and Butler (TRPC) vs. Jacob Holland & Maisie (The Sea Beast)

Reigen & Mob (MP100) vs. Maedros and Maglor & Elrond and Elros (Silmarillion)

Jean Valjean & Cosette (Les Miserables) vs. Loid & Anya (Spy x Family)

Batman & Robins (Batman) vs. Kurogane & Syaoran (Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicle)