#JayIsabel

[haravatat-slime]

@jayisabells ty for the comments!! you're right about the Decarabian thing, which I forgot about and was reminded of by my wife (and proceeded to forget, again, once I told myself I was going to edit the post...) - he does in fact have a connection to birds after all!!

As far as the Paimon theory goes...the "Istaroth has shrunk and forgotten who she is after a huge expulsion of energy" is also my preferred theory. (⁠｡⁠•̀⁠ᴗ⁠-⁠)⁠✧ That said, I'm starting to wonder if that may be true IN ADDITION TO her being a Seelie. There's been so much overlap between past/current Archons and the Moon Sisters/Seelie Court that I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility.

[animalpetcel]

On some level, I feel kinda bad for all the people getting attached to the Jason ships that will probably never return/die bc the writers suck

This includes both his m/f ships and m/m ones

[atasteforsuicidal]

my entry for @jason-rarepairs weekend day 3 ♥

[m00nslippers]

Isabel gets a lot of flack but in the comics Jason reciprocated her interest. Even now he stated he regrets how things ended. Why do you think Jason pursued her? In 52 another girl asked him to call her too. Was only because he wanted something normal and she was an attractive blond who made herself available?

Eh, I think Isabel gets a lot of flak because she’s just…a very unfinished character. Despite people suggesting she doesn’t have a personality–she actually does, she’s extremely practical and cool-headed in an emergency, makes good decisions, is thoughtful but outspoken about what she wants, I can see exactly why Jason likes her. She actually is a pretty good fit for him. I think what she’s missing is anything about her personal life and likes or dislikes, how she got to the place she was when we met her in the story. If we were able to say, “She enjoys drinking wine and watching action movies, has a pet mossball that won’t have to feed when she’s away for a day or two on flights, plays the flute but as a kid she wanted to learn the harp but it was too expensive to buy one, likes 90s soft rock and grew up in the foster system so she took the first job she could find that didn’t need a degree she couldn’t afford and would take her away from Gotham City–airline stewardess,” then I think people would like her a lot better.

I don’t remember when someone else gave Jason her number, so I can’t tell you why he didn’t pursue that girl, but I’ll tell you why I think he pursued Isabel–Roy and Kori. Isabel gave Jason her number before Roy and Kori got together, but by the time Jason had visited Gotham city for the Court of Owls event, his two friends were together and I think Jason figured he should also find someone, both to have an excuse to give them more time together and because he wanted what they had and maybe it just felt like something he ‘should’ do, “I’m twenty, I should date, that’s a thing normal people do, right?” So at that time, Isabel was just convenient. At that point Jason thought she was pretty and everything, but he wasn’t exactly invested yet–and then they all got kidnapped by the Omega Men and roped into a space adventure and the way Isabel just ran with it and stepped up really made Jason fall in love with her.

Jason likes reliable, practical, brave women who can handle themselves in a bad situation, that’s like Jason’s kink, lol. Look at all the girls he’s been with or crushed on (Talia, Barbara, Artemis, Kara, maybe Essence and Rose deviate a little because even if they are badasses they seem a bit erratic but there’s a reason neither relationship worked out) and that’s kind of what you get. It’s never said anywhere, but I think Jason’s mother was quite unreliable and he was taking care of her more than she took care of him, so when he sees a girl who is independent, strong, dependable even when bad stuff is happening, that really hits home for him. Like if there’s ever a moment when he isn’t strong enough, she would take care of him, or if he had to leave her for some reason, she’d still be okay, life would go on.

A bit of a tangent, but I was reading the scene where Isabel and Jason first meet and…Isabel is really putting herself out there trying to get Jason’s attention. I feel like through the whole flight she was eyeing this crazy-hot twenty-something guy in a suit who looked like he had his shit together and she was really interested in Jason, so she tries to be flirty. Gives eye contact, smiles, asks him if he needs anything maybe a little more often than she does for the other passengers–you know, the type of behavior the average guy would interpret in a woman as flirting even if she was just being nice and didn’t intend to flirt at all. But Jason just didn’t even react.

So Isabel’s mind is racing like, is he gay? Not hitting my gaydar but he sure is bantering a lot with the guy with him, so maybe that’s it. I usually get hit on left and right even when I’m trying to be cold, it’s irritating actually and the one time I actually try to flirt the guy is ignoring me. He isn’t wearing a ring, he’s probably not married. Maybe he’s just not interested in me? Am I being too subtle? Am I crazy for being this attracted to a passenger I might never see again? So she decides to be overt as fuck and hope that gets his attention, lol. And as it turns out, Jason is both respectful enough to women that he doesn’t think normal polite behavior is flirting and is goddamn oblivious to people being interested in him so he barely notices even if it’s obvious.

Like Jason following Isabel to the drink cart could easily have been some creepy guy thinking he was going to join the mile high club, you know? But no he really just wanted to walk and get his drink he didn’t pull anything weird. I’m sure Isabel was just like, okay I have to spell it out for this guy, he’s too nice and too polite, he really just doesn’t get it. So she gave him her number.

And like, look at this dork. Jason gets a girl’s number and he’s just so very confused like, “Huh? Why would a girl give me her number? Why would anyone be interested in me?”

Jason is just too precious.

[joyce-stick]

Hi, I just saw your post about the talentless nana killing the gays trope. I agree with Michiru's death being one of the few times a queer character dying was done well. Koharu being in an incest relationship was more insulting trope than her death. After Michiru death I thought the manga was going more for "Nana can't have nice things" cuz' she's a murderer and happiness in her life dies as some sorta karma, instead of bad tropes. I don't think Nana will get a happy ending.

mmmmhm! i mean mmm. yeah. it being bad tropes didn’t occur to me till Koharu died. just cause y’know, kill a lesbian twice in two consecutive plotlines, I’m gonna start raising eyebrows. looseboy can have Nana have anything good in her life be doomed to fail/die without that thing always being a lesbian.

and yeah the incest thing did kinda have me going what seriously is this necessary but this Monogatari fan is used to that shit.

[forallhavesinned]

Jason and Isabel?

((I ship it. These two are super cute. :D She is actually the first person in the comics that Jason is ever shown dating. And that alone makes her pretty awesome.

Why do I ship it? OBSERVE:

That would be Jason and Isabel’s first meeting. He’s on a plane with Roy and Kori and she’s the flight attendant, and she gives him her phone number. He’s never been hit on, obviously because Dick gets all the ladies and he just doesn’t even know what to do with himself. :D

And this is them in space, being adorable.

And thus, I ship it. xD))

[animalpetcel]

Jason Todd and Ships & My feelings on them

(Because a friend dared me to)

JayRoy: I used to ship it, but then I read up on Roy’s post reboot personality and history and I felt too weird about it to continue (But DickRoy looks nicer now)

JayKyle: I read their Search for Ray Palmer series with Donna. The potential is there, but they never interacted beyond that so I don’t have strong feeling for it (Also I love ConnorKyle more)

JayEddie: The two are supposed to be friends & penpals, but beyond that one crossover story they had in Blue Devil #19 & Eddie’s comments in Teen Titans (2003) #42, they haven’t talked about each other or interacted at all. Since DC doesn’t care enough about Eddie to develop his relationships with Blue Devil, Rose Wilson and Jason, this ship remains a rarepair, though if DC decided to use Eddie instead of Roy for New52 RHATO, JayEddie would have eclipsed JayRoy & JayKyle in terms of popularity

Batcest ships: Disgusting. Adopted families are real families.

JayTalia: Also disgusting, she’s his mentor figure, the mother of one of his brothers and is around Bruce’s age. It was a bad idea all around.

JayHelena: Huntress has been stated to like gentler men and is working harder to be a better, non-murdery hero so people who say that they have a lot in common are ignoring Helena’s development and personality to turn her into the “girlfriend heals boyfriend” cliche (which I hate)

JayHarley: Bad idea. Not only does Harley have Ivy, but the only thing those two have in common is the Joker. I seriously can’t even imagine how this would even work

JayBabs: Again, the only thing they share is the Joker connection, and if people hated New52 RHATO because they felt that Lobdell was trying to turn Jason into Dick, JayBabs being canon would just make things worse

Jaysabel: While I have nothing against Isabel Ardila, I have to agree with others when they say that she’s a nothing character. Other than being a reference to Death in the Family, Lobdell has done little to make her stand out against other popular civilian love interest (ex:Linda Park, Iris West & Lois Lane) or even convince the audience that we should support their relationship. I even forgot that she was present in the Alien arc of New52 RHATO and she hasn’t done anything noteworthy in Rebirth RHATO. If Lobdell leaves and DC decides to continue RHATO with a different writer, unless some miracle happens, I have no doubt that Isabel will be forgotten.

Jaytemis: At the time I’m writing this, Jason x Artemis is still a rather new ship, maybe a little over a year or two since we learned that they’re even into each other. I again don’t think that Lobdell did a good job at setting up this relationship, as many RHATO fans before the kiss believed that the were strong friends, and afterwards, I’ve only seen a handful of RHATO & Jason fans support the idea of their romantic relationship, and many (me included) would rather they remain strong friends. It feels like Lobdell is coasting off of Wonderbats fans to support this ship instead of really working on making a believable romance, and I’m not positive that the relationship will start to pick up more traction even after Artemis & Bizarro return. However, while I’m not hopeful that Jaytemis will become a mainstay in Jason’s canon like Dickori, Dickbabs, Timsteph or *cough* Timkon *cough* there is a chance that if another writer wants to continue it after he’s finished, that it could become another mainstay Batship

Update: Upon learning that Jaytemis is Editorial mandate and Lobdell doesn’t actually care for it, I know understand why it feels so forced to me. Yeah, I have no idea if they’ll keep trying to make it happen after Lobdell leaves, but I don’t have a lot of confidence in it.

JayKara: with almost every prominent Batfam member having their own alien (often Kryptonian) friend. (Dick & Kori, Tim & Connor, Damian & Jon and Babs & Kara again) it was only a matter of time until something like this happened. However, I prefer Kara’s more friendly interactions with Barbara, and as of Rebirth, Jay’s kryptonian is (at least for now) a Bizarro clone named (?) Bizz by fans, though who knows if this (at the time of this post) current RHATO team of the Dark Trinity will become a mainstay for Jason’s life outside of the Batfam

JayKorr: Jason x Rankorr (Jack Moore). Mirroring JayKyle, but Rankorr’s philoshphy as a Red Lantern, as well as his storyline revolving around controlling his own rage and need for vengeance, these two can have interesting interactions if they were ever allowed to seriously interact. Jack Moore could be Jason’s boyfriend & reluctant superhero, since Moore does have a desire to be “normal”

JayAugust: If you’ve seen my Twitter, you’d know that I’m one if the many Godspeed fans who want him to crossover with Jason. Often called the “Red Hood of the Flashfam”, August’s belief that killing is a valid option when dealing with criminals, need for revenge since his brother’s murder, and troubled relationship with Barry given a different in the two’s morals (and Barry’s unwillingness to let August go on a Black Hole massacre/August believing that Barry isn’t using his speedster abilities to their fullest and would rather Barry step out of the way to let August do his job), draws some nice parallels between him and Jason, especially when it comes to their troubled history with the mentor figures. And given that every former Robin has their own speedster (Dick=Wally, Tim=Bart, Damien=Wallace), giving Jason one that fits his morals and way of going after criminals (at least pre-New52) would make the most sense.

Honorable mentions go to:

JayBunker: I’ve only seen two people ship this, but if Lobdell was finally allowed to expand the Outlaws (in a podcast interview he mentioned that Bat Editorial has rejected all of his attempts, which is why Rebirth RHATO is full of temporary team-up & why the Creeper is considered to be an Outlaw despite not showing up often and refusing their offer) and decides to make Miguel a more permanent member (and age him up a teensy bit) than I can see it

JayRose: Some believe that this would be the best canon option for Jason, but they haven’t interacted enough for me to be convinced that they’d be the best fit for one another. They’d be really close friends though if not lovers

Bizzjay: This makes me uncomfortable because canon has stated multiple times that Bizz is mostly inexperienced with the mentality of child (before he temporarily became more intelligent, and who knows if that inspires a change in their dynamic until Bizz & Artemis return is issue 40)

Redcrux: After reading Jasontod’s post, I can imagine it clearly and it sound really soft, funny, energetic and cute, the exact way that I like my ships. If RHATO was ever to reintroduce Crux as a full-time Outlaw (and maybe have a retcon were it was another alien like Lobo instead of Starfire indirectly responsible for the crash), I’d love to see him and Jason get closer

[m00nslippers]

do you prefer jason romantically with isabel or artemis

Well, I’m not going to lie, Isabel is...boring. She’s good for Jason, yeah and she’s a good person but her dynamic is just dull. I think she has potential to be fun, but it isn’t being utilized properly. Her kind of claim to fame is she got sucked on a space adventure and just rolled with it, so they should play that up in her character. Like if she was just thrown into increasingly ridiculous situations and her reaction was just “Huh, okay.” and everyone was just so confused, “You know that’s a fire-breathing mutant rat, how is your reaction just ‘huh, okay!?’ Have you seen one before or something!?” and she was just like, “No, I don’t know, I guess I’m just not impressed,” like that would be funny/interesting. So I do like her with Jason, but at the moment she’s just not interesting in her own right and it really drags down the romance.

Artemis I love in her own right and she has a very cute dynamic with Jason, always giving him crap but also continually impressed by his kindness and skill. Her dry humor is also very funny and she has powers (strength, her weapons etc) and is in the thick of combat. To be honest, even though I like them together, I don’t see them as endgame. Like I have that AU idea where they have a daughter but in it they aren’t married, don’t live together, they love each other but they are also independent and do their own thing, they don’t shack up. Artemis and Jason would never have a white-picket-fence romance and settle down, even if ‘settle down’ just meant they live together and still vigilante around the world. I think they are destined to go their separate ways. She has an amazon’s longevity (or Circe’s magic, either way she’s like immortal) and Jason doesn’t, bar headcanons about the Lazarus pit or any All-Caste shenanigans. She’s also destined to be a ruler of the Amazons and he’s a mortal man. They don’t have a bad breakup, they just understand each other well enough to know that this is just a ‘for now’ romance. It’s still special but it isn’t meant to last forever.

So I like Artemis with Jason better, but if we are talking who I think is better for him in the long run, it’s Isabel. They have a more solid basis for a healthy, long-term relationship.

[m00nslippers]

I know you wrote a whole long thing about Isabel and how she has a personality, but the one thing I took away from that is that you think Jason is in love with her? Is that something you really believe (has been shown)? For all we know they've been dating again for about a month and she's said something like "I don't love you for your money" and called him love. I think he deeply cares about her, but don't personally see it as love or even close to it yet. I do think she'll stay for a while tho

Not to get too philosophical, but some people are willing to call it love when the feelings are still light, like infatuation, other people won’t call it love even when it’s at the I-would-die-if-I-didn’t-have-you stage. I mean, I think love is a spectrum, it’s not a yes or no, either or question. If you care about someone, that’s love, isn’t it? At what point are we allowed to call it ‘love’? I don’t really know, but I would be willing to say Jason is on that road even if he isn’t fully ‘there‘ yet.

So...okay, Jason and Isabel have gone on like four dates, maybe a few more off camera. It doesn’t seem like much, but I think Isabel has proven herself to Jason in a lot of ways. I think you could say Essence’s relationship might have appeared at least to Jason like a manipulation, that she just got with Jason because he was the ‘chosen one’ or so she could manipulate him later on. I’m not sure if Talia is even canon anymore but if it is then that was also manipulative. It’s hard to say what was up with Rose but she might have been a shallow relationship too. Barbara quite clearly was just interested in Jason as a replacement for Dick. Artemis and him never quite got off the ground and she rejected him a few times first.

Isabel is the only person who has ever shown attraction to Jason who hasn’t seemed to be trying to use him. That means a lot to him. And even when she broke up with Jason, she told him why--she couldn't deal with life threatening situations all the time. It was reasonable, it wasn’t a judgement on him. She didn’t try to change him, I don’t think she even suggested he should ever stop being Red Hood for her, didn’t say anything about him killing. Even when they ran into each other again, she stood her ground. As soon as the danger didn’t appear to be an issue anymore, she came back. She never tried to take anything away from him, suggest he be something else for her and she was honest about what she wanted and spoke the truth. She’s made herself someone safe for Jason and that is so rare for him.

This might be surprising to some people, but it’s clear to me that Jason is someone who ‘loves’ very quickly, very easily. He tries not to because he’s easily hurt, he’s been betrayed so often, but even when he avoids caring about people he fails over and over and ends up caring anyway. I don’t think that would be any different for him in a romantic relationship as opposed to a platonic one. So Jason loving Isabel even this soon, especially after she’s demonstrated that she’s a safe harbor for him, wouldn’t be that unlikely to me.

Also, I think what really drives home for me that he he loves her is the first few pages of Issue #35. Jason just...tells Isabel so much about what he’s thinking, about his worries and his past. He talks to her a lot about some really personal stuff. It kind of blows my mind. He trusts her a lot. It’s the kind of stuff he only ever talked about with Roy and Kori--not even Artemis and Bizarro know so much, he kept pretty much the whole issue with his father’s letters to himself and here he is mentioning his father to Isabel. Maybe Jason doesn’t engage in a lot of the behavior we tend to see in characters when they are ‘in love’, but his trust in telling Isabel so much, in letting her see his pain, just says it all to me. Jason loves Isabel. But is he in love with her? Jason might not admit it but I think he probably is starting to be.

But truthfully I think he’s probably trying not to fall in love with Isabel, because he knows it’s doomed. Red Hood was her line in the sand and he’s still vigilante-ing despite what he let her believe. She’s been honest with him but he hasn’t with her. And unless she gets killed off, which I think is possible, or she has a change of heart, unlikely but maybe possible, she’s most likely going to leave him again as soon as she finds out he lied to her. And when that happens, I think we will really see the depth of his love for her. I think it’s going to surprise even Jason, how much he really did love her.

[m00nslippers]

i think who works as jason's love interest depends on the tone of his book. if dc is doing something like what they're doing now, isabel is better with jason imo and once/if she gets further developed they have potential to have a wally/linda relationship. (i dont like comparing to clois b/c i dont see any other couple ever having that dynamic). artemis and jason would be good together in a situation like the beginning of rebirth as that couple that loves each other but also hate each other

Aw, come on, Artemis and Jason don’t hate each other they just enjoy razzing each other. It’s playful banter. But yeah, I think Isabel works better as a love interest with the current comics because Jason has a civilian identity now and is pretty much exclusively living as his civilian self (or so he wants her to believe). Before, Jason didn’t have a civilian identity, he was just Red Hood all the time so someone who wasn’t connected to the civilian world at all worked out pretty well.

I think Jason’s primary issue with finding someone is that he’s killing people again now. I think most of the people who would be okay with knowing he does that aren’t necessarily the kind of people he would want to date (like assassins and villains, even most other anti-heroes and heroes that kill are more squeamish than he is).

[jayisabellsart]

Main blog:

@jayisabells

Hi, I'm Jay (any pronouns). This blog is for my art only. Everything here will most likely be either my own posts, reblogs of my art from my main blog or crossposted. Any reblogged art that is not mine will be appropiately tagged.

I also have an instagram that I only post art on, but I have not done so recently (jayisabells)

Hope you enjoy!

(to be honest there are some things I did not reblog from my main blog because I don't like them now, improving now though (: )