#and a king bran truther as well

[nightswatchdisbandmentera]

I think just think the fandom gets quite unimaginative when it comes to Bran, like there's a literal apocalypse coming with creatures that westeros thinks are long gone and Bran will play a vital role to stop it and also on top of it is a magical boy, is it that unreasonable for him for westerosi smallfolk and nobles alike to see him as someone who rebuild the realm.

Right. Plus Westeros is quite nearly a failed state. It’s on the brink of collapse, not to mention the upcoming doom brought by the Others. Is it too far fetched to expect that the political structure shifts to a point that allows for Bran’s ascension?

Bran is so central to the resolution of ASOIAF. It’s often ignored that he is right there with Jon at the front lines of the upcoming conflict. He’s where he is, beyond the wall and facing a northern threat, for a reason. GRRM also identifies him as the most magic-heavy character. It certainly seems that we as a fandom get so caught up on AA/tptwp, that we forget Bran is a walking, talking, glaring Last Hero allegory. And yes, he’s a greenseer and a magic boy. But he’s also heir to the largest kingdom in Westeros. Somehow people forget that…

And the strangest thing is, people often acknowledged that he would be the last POV character since he was the first. It makes sense for the story to start and end with Bran, but that was often the extent of his importance in the story.

Bran staying in that cave was the dominant endgame theory for him for many, many years. But I do think a part of it was people thinking that a disabled kid couldn’t become plot relevant; he can’t move so he might as well remain stagnant where he is. It’s how a lot of the complaints re not being able to have kids start. Sure, it is a problem but like…Rickon exists? His plot relevance so far has literally just been him occupying that position once Bran became Robb’s heir. Imo the point of Rickon is to be Bran’s successor and the one who carries the Stark line forward (and GRRM has been adamant that he’ll play a big part in upcoming books). If GRRM wants to make Bran king, I don’t see how it can’t be resolved satisfactorily. But Bran is a character who doesn’t have a large fandom and one whose importance is always written out that people twist themselves into knots denying that.

[cappymightwrite]

I don't think Jon gonna love Dany in books if jonsa is endgame. Even if he is conflicted about his feelings for his half sister, the torment isn't suddenly going away if he would meet Dany. It's because those feelings are going to be strong. Dany is basically foil to Sansa character and even starks in general. Considering he had met people who reminded Jon of dany but in negative light going to affect his viewpoint. He had to forget everything to love her.

This is a very old ask, apologies! I'm going to attempt to catch up with a few of them, now that I've got a free weekend 😅 Anyway...

I think more and more now, I agree. They are fundamentally too different for love to grow there, certainly from Jon's side because through the characters of Stannis and Melisandre, especially, we start to get a real sense of how D*ny and Jon's politics will likely rub each other the wrong way. Death by fire is truly horrifying and it's through Jon's eyes that we see that horror firsthand:

Jon watched unblinking. He dare not appear squeamish before his brothers [...] The horn crashed amongst the logs and leaves and kindling. Within three heartbeats the whole pit was aflame. Clutching the bars of his cage with bound hands, Mance sobbed and begged. When the fire reached him he did a little dance. His screams became one long, wordless shriek of fear and pain. Within his cage, he fluttered like a burning leaf, a moth caught in a candle flame. – ADWD, Jon III

The imagery of the burning of the glamoured Mance used above goes some way to mask its real horror by describing his writhing in excruciating pain as like "a little dance," his catching on fire as like "a burning leaf" or a "moth caught in a candle flame." These are far more palatable images, small, inconsequential things to make this horror smaller too, to make it easier to withstand and to watch, unblinking. It's a very human response, on Jon's part, because how else to you go on, having witnessed something so horrifying, if you don't attempt to minimise it in some way, if only for yourself?

And this is just one person. One burning. I think you're quite right, Jon would have to erase this experience from his mind in order to love a person so cavalier with fire. And actually, even if he hadn't witnessed this, I don't think it's in his character to fall in love with D*ny, especially because Jon has also had the experience of somewhat being part of a democratic system at the Watch. I say somewhat because obviously it's flawed, but you know, they attempt to vote fairly on things, decisions aren't always down to one person. With D*ny, there is no taking a vote, it is her judgement at the end of the day and if she thinks you deserve to burn, then honey, you're burning, without any need to busy about setting up a pyre too.

I'm a Jonsa truther, but even excluding that... I think some readers are a little too happy to discount the politics of individual characters and families in favour of what would be "cool" for their fave — I'm talking about D*ny and Arya, D*ny and Arianne, getting along like besties, or just generally the idea of a Targ restoration.

You know, Ned had a very defined set of personal politics, of principles, an adherene to an "older way", and in Jon, as well as the rest of the Starklings, we see a continuation of those principles.

"King Robert has a headsman," he said, uncertainly. "He does," his father admitted. "As did the Targaryen kings before him. Yet our way is the older way. The blood of the First Men still flows in the veins of the Starks, and we hold to the belief that the man who passes the sentence should swing the sword. If you would take a man's life, you owe it to him to look into his eyes and hear his final words. And if you cannot bear to do that, then perhaps the man does not deserve to die. "One day, Bran, you will be Robb's bannerman, holding a keep of your own for your brother and your king, and justice will fall to you. When that day comes, you must take no pleasure in the task, but neither must you look away. A ruler who hides behind paid executioners soon forgets what death is." – AGOT, Bran I

Now, D*ny doesn't have a paid executioner, but like Targ kings before her, she is not the one swinging the sword either. It is her dragons who are her executioners with fire as their sword, and it makes you wonder... "a ruler who hides behind [dragons] soon forgets what death is." Contrast this with Ned and the Stark boys at the very beginning of AGOT, and then again, with Jon not only witnessing the burning of (the latter revealed to be glamoured) Mance, but also ordering archers to mercy kill him:

One arrow took Mance Rayder in the chest, one in the gut, one in the throat. The fourth struck one of the cage's wooden bars, and quivered for an instant before catching fire. A woman's sobs echoed off the Wall as the wildling king slid bonelessly to the floor of his cage, wreathed in fire. "And now his Watch is done," Jon murmured softly. Mance Rayder had been a man of the Night's Watch once, before he changed his black cloak for one slashed with bright red silk. Up on the platform, Stannis was scowling. Jon refused to meet his eyes. – ADWD, Jon III

And to bring this back round to Jonsa:

The smile that Lord Janos Slynt smiled then had all the sweetness of rancid butter. Until Jon said, "Edd, fetch me a block," and unsheathed Longclaw. – ADWD, Jon II

So... I'm sorry but, ya know, Targs and Starks, they're chalk and cheese really, and Jon is a true Stark, no matter his name or parentage. As the story progresses, D*ny is leaning more and more into the exceptionalist T*rg, fire and blood way, whereas Jon will always adhere to that "older way," a way that reveres ones duty to others, to what is fair and just, above all, and often the following of these principles comes at the cost of your own personal longings:

He wanted it, Jon knew then. He wanted it as much as he had ever wanted anything. I have always wanted it, he thought, guiltily. May the gods forgive me. It was a hunger inside him, sharp as a dragonglass blade. – ASOS, Jon XII Jon said, "Winterfell belongs to my sister Sansa." – ADWD, Jon IV

You're right, D*ny and the T*rgs are very much foils to the Starks and we know how much Jon loves the Starks through his execution of Janos Slynt (who took part in Ned's execution), his defence of Sansa's inheritance, he striving to save (who he believes to be) Arya etc., etc. D*ny could be the messiah with bells on and even then she wouldn't come out on top over Jon's loyalty to and love of the Starks. It's just in him, deep in the very marrow of him:

"[...] you must do what needs be done," Qhorin Halfhand said. "You are the blood of Winterfell and a man of the Night's Watch." – ACOK, Jon VI

Jon knows who he is in the sense that he knows what kind of man he is, what kind of man he hopes to be (one like Ned). A lot of people have fallen under D*ny's dragon goddess spell, both in the books and outside of them, but I don't think Jon is going to be one of them.

Thanks for the ask and apologies for taking so long to answer it!

[fromtheseventhhell]

Asoiaf TikTok is the worst when it comes to people skipping chapters, the amount of people boasting about how they skip bran chapters then complaining about how they can't understand skinchanging, greenseers etc.

That's not surprising considering this fandom is built on accommodating people who haven't read the books. There are a lot of self-proclaimed experts and neutrals who haven't entirely read the books, or at all, and the only thing they're actually well-versed in are popular fandom ideas. People skip entire sections and plotlines and then come to the conclusion that they're inconsequential. You can really track what parts get skipped by the discussions in fandom too. I even have a post in my drafts talking about how little speculation there is on warging, greenseers, the direwolves, etc. because people don't see those as particularly important. It's so notable and it's obvious why.

Bran isn't... completely ignored in fandom, but he is definitely one of the characters whose importance gets downplayed. When he gets talked about it's often as an accessory to someone else's plot instead of being given his own focus. He's just gonna be some emotionless tree who's gonna use his powers in some capacity to save the day, and that's all people care to come up with for him. Even show truthers who think the books are gonna follow the same story think the biggest change is that he isn't going to be King. People will skip his chapters, some of the most magical chapters in the books, and then talk about how unimportant magic is to the plot😑. It just blows my mind that this has just become an acceptable way to "read" the books. People skip chapters and then think that what they don't know isn't important. And it somehow seems to be the most acceptable when it comes to the key five characters.

[atopvisenyashill]

🇵🇸 🇵🇷🐢🏝️ i got tired of complaining constantly on my main blog (@thewingedwolf is me!) about how sansa and rhaenyra did nothing wrong and also i needed a way to organize my theories and stuff. yes i have read all the books. yes i have (unfortunately) seen the whole show. yes i have seen all of hotd as well. so here we go. my stances are this, so you have an idea what to expect:

i am a catelyn, sansa, brienne, elia, and rhaenyra stan FIRST and a person SECOND

i would die Gaemon Palehair, Lady Essie, and Sylvenna Sand, those are my canon OCs, and that’s why they’re my header.

Sansa and Bran are my favorites! I am a Sansa will be Queen in the North truther and a Bran will be the King in Harrenhal conspiracy theorist, It Is Heavily Foreshadowed In The Text and I stand on that!!

I'm well aware Rhaenyra has plenty of faults, I am simply saying that the greens (as in, the characters) do not like her because of her gender, and not for stuff she does that’s actually wrong, also, idc that she did all of that i simply think she’s neat.

Helaena really IS the one who did nothing wrong tho.

i am a Dark Daenerys believer. no, i don’t hate her - in fact, i really love her, although i do hate her show counterpart - I just think her arc is heading towards a dark path and being a villain protagonist is the more interesting route for her character.

House Martell will rise or I will piss in old man germ’s cornflakes.

I Will talk about the racism Dorne faces in the text and outside of it and neither your favorite house nor my favorite house is exempt from this. If you have a problem with that, keep it to yourself bc i do not care 🙏🏽

i multiship!! just bc i ship it doesn’t mean i think it’s gonna happen in the series, i just like the dynamic!!

i am in fact the annoying book jonsa truther they warned you about. i will Stay bitter about this. argue with the wall.

with that said, i also like theonsa, throbb, daemyra, laenyra, rhaewin, nedcat, braime, briensa, and a million other ones. faves listed here. several of them are dead dove-esque; what can i say, that's just george's style.

you decide whether it’s romantic or platonic when it’s an incest one, my opinion changes by the hour & im gonna fight grrm for making me think this much about incest.

i don’t like jonerys!!!!!! i'm sansan & sanrion ambivalent and i simply do not care about littlefucker like that. i would say i’ve thought positively about basically every other ship.

i’m in the middle of a reread, as of this moment (april 2024) i’ve kinda stalled on the beginning of a dance with dragons but i Have started a rewatch of the tv series as a form of torture.

i first read this series when i was 16 in like 2012-2013. i love to bitch about the takes i’ve seen. i sometimes reblog really old ass graphics bc they deserve new life even tho the creators are long since deactivated. i sometimes make graphics that look like they’re from 2014 bc we should bring that style back dammit i hate the typography movement going on rn.

big on tagging triggers so lmk (i’ll tag for all characters & major triggers but i’m fine with adding a specific one if asked and don't worry about it being a "weird" trigger - if sean bean's face or knives or wolves or whatever trigger you, i'm happy to tag for that!).

i have a tag page that is more organized than the slapdash nonsense on this post, feel free to check it out here.

i may sound angry but i promise i am genuinely just here for a laugh. i just have resting bitch voice and no feel for tone and use the word fuck too much. it’s fine and unserious.

[lemonhemlock]

I'm a 'Martin won't ever publish another ASOIAF book' truther but in addition to King Bran being profoundly idiotic, Martin has major structural issues that are now too 'big' to 'fix' imo. Namely, the ages of the characters are ridiculous and are all wrong for where their arcs need to go. The characters on the show were aged up and even the younger ones grew up on screen so Bran and Sansa and Arya were at least into late teens/adulthood at the end of the show - one is 13 and other is currently 11 and Bran is like, what, 8 in books? sksksksksk Just absolutely disastrous.

The characters should have been in their mid to late teens at the start of AGOT, at minimum. Especially because Martin essentially treated them, and has them act, like adults. I'm sorry, but I don't think that man has any understanding between the mental and physical developmental differences between, say, a 14 year old girl and a 17 year old girl. Every character appears and acts like they are anywhere from 3 to 5 years older than they are.

Also, the POV structure, while interesting, has also been disastrous in actually getting the story moving because certain characters have to be in certain places for things to happen while others are just sitting around killing time.

Hmmm, I don't really agree about the POV structure. It functioned fine for three books and offered compelling court drama, battles, magical elements and intriguing plot-twists. AGOT / ACOK / ASOS are pretty well paced and I've even seen someone making the case that the series could even have ended in that point and would have been one of the best fictional fantasy experiments. I found myself agreeing and disagreeing. I think the ASOS ending would have still distinguished ASOIAF from other fantasy series in its toppling of the good-guys-win-everything type of wrap-up, but it would be way less ambitious than what GRRM ended up pursuing.

The pacing problems came about with AFFC/ADWD. And I'm not one to talk here, because I'm an AFFC truther and it's always been my favourite of the series, so my two cents on this is that Dany's Slaver's Bay plotline is too damn long. Tyrion is also taking too damn long to get to her. It's a drag. In the book she is supposed to solve the Quaithe riddle,* escape Vaes Dothrak, get herself an army + navy, make the decision to leave Slaver's Bay AND sail to Westeros, so that in TWOW she can fight Young Gryff, face-off the Others, become a mask-off tyrant AND get deposed? It's a lot.

I honestly think he should just give up the 7 book compartmentation, admit defeat and just add another damn book to the series to get Dany to Westeros and fit in his fAegon plotline. It's not like he doesn't have the pages. No one's gonna care if there are 8 books instead of magic no 7. But my guess is that he's hung up over some decisions he's made in the past and kept trying to make the gargantuan plot fit inside this neat box he envisioned - 7 books, King Bran, Caesar!Jon etc. It would explain why he tried a time skip between ASOS and AFFC and had to scrap it - it would make more sense for the Stark children to be older. But he characterized himself as a gardener-style writing who doesn't plan everything in advance and lets the story grow organically. In that case, he should make allowances if the story grew in a direction he did not initially predict and make the required changes! Maybe King Bran made sense when he first wrote the initial three-book outline, but that was a long time ago & many other plot points changed.

My advice is to just stop trying to make the plot fit the previous designs, stay true to the way the characters evolved and respect the themes you've painstakingly developed over the course of nearly 30 years. Otherwise what's the point? If your original ending doesn't fit anymore, think of another ending ffs. The show is irrelevant at this point, so what if the endgame will be different? IDK, I'd be thinking that this is my life's work and I have every right to do it justice. Perhaps that's what he's thinking too and why it's taking him so long.

I agree that the ages of the characters are ridiculous, but if a time skip really, really can't fit anywhere, it's better to compromise on the age issue and leave off with a teen monarch than it would be to impose a surveillance state in Westeros as the solution with all-seeing, all-knowing Bran. That's a starkly dystopic ending, if you ask me.

Not to mention that it clashes directly with the end of magic - how is Bran supposed to be the Tree of Sauron if there's no magic anymore and everything goes back to normal? On what basis does he even get to be king at all if he's just a regular boy? How will he even survive being pulled out of the weirwood net if magic leaves the realm of men?

*“To go north, you must journey south. To reach the west, you must go east. To go forward you must go back, and to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow.” JFC, if Dany has to get to Asshai, I will fucking scream.

[agentrouka-blog]

Okay so as far as Bloodraven’s interference (and I will try to keep this brief, people can get real tinfoil-hatty about him) Basically he is one of many Targaryens who is fixated on prophecy, Azor Ahai, Targaryens saving the world and so on. He is probably in league with the Ghost of High Heart who told Aerys and Rhaella to marry because their line would birth the prince that was promised so they believe not just any Targaryen will do to be Azor Ahai. Bloodraven probably directed Jon to finding Ghost in the snow (he hears something in the rustling wind that Bran doesn’t. Ghost resembles a weirwood so both him and his master would be of particular interest to Bloodraven and TCOF) and is almost certainly warging into Mormont’s Raven who at various points calls Jon a king, mocks Jon’s “father”, and openly endorses Jon for Lord Commander at a critical time, sealing his election and ascent to power.

Ah, I see!! That's why I didn't realize what you meant. I actually ascribe most of those direct interferences in the current canon events, whispers on the wind, trees calling names, Ghost, Mormont's raven... to Bran!

Bloodraven seems to prefer messengers like Jojen and Coldhands, as well as some warging and dream communication. We see Bran use the latter too, as well as communication into the past through the trees, which Bloodraven denies is possible. I think Bran is much more powerful than Bloodraven and he has different goals that aren't influenced by the Ghost of High Heart or Prince that was Promised prophecy that drives Bloodraven and so many Targs. Bloodraven is trying to merge these prophecies with the old god bloodmagic of his Blackwood ancestry. Bran is not.

Basically, my theory goes that Bran plays a game of cat and mouse within the current book timeline with Bloodraven (or whoever controls him) to tweak events in a specific way. He can't/won't subvert free will and he has to take care not to get caught subtly manipulating the past and present. Hence all interference being subtle nudges, save the dream he sends Jon and the Election!Raven.

Basically, Bran is creating these manipulations from a point in time within the tree network after he has learned what caused the Others and what is necessary to stop them and before he eventually leaves the cave. From that point on it mostly has to fall into place.

Jon is one vehicle within this plan but far from the only one.

If it's Bloodraven doing all of this, what exactly is the point of Bran? And should we then credit Bloodraven and all the loony prophecy-obsessed Targs with enabling Jon's accomplishments because Uncle Brynden is engaging in supernatural nepotism to give him a boost? Since when is Bloodraven even fond of Targaryen bastards when there's a trueborn Targ to be championed? I think, like prophecy-truther maester Aemon, Bloodraven would see greater promise in a dragonrider.

[istumpysk]

I never saw a meta about the Stark children names and someone need to do it because there definitely a lot of foreshadow in their names.

Robb = named after someone that started a rebelion against a cruel king after the injust execution of a Stark lord. Both were see as perfect king material for the same reasons: warrior qualities, charming, etc. But ended having disappointing ends outside the battle fields. Also both had broken engagements and had marriages that led to their deaths: Cersei giving Lancel a fortified strongwine, three times as potent as normal, to give to Robert during his hunt and Robb' Red Wedding.

Maybe is a coincidence but he is the only one who doesn't have a Stark ancestor with the same name and he is the first (and only i hope) child to die.

Jon = there three Stark men with Jon in their names, two were KitN and the other one is Jonnel who we all are familiar with.

One of the KitN: "when sea raiders landed in the east, Jon drove them out and built a castle, the Wolf's Den, at the mouth of the White Knife, so as to be able to defend the mouth of the river." He is mentioned twice in the books once in the first book in a Bran chapter and other in ADWD in Davos pov, both characters having connections with Jon and possibly his future kingship.

Sansa = we also familiar with Sansa, daughter of Rickon.

Arya = named after Ned grandmother, who was the wife of the Wandering Wolf that served in a sellsword company in the Free Cities.

Bran = the legendary Stark name perfect fitting for the starkling destined to be the King of Westeros. Just like the founder of his house and namesake, Bran will probably be remember as a Builder since when he accept his kingship the seven kingdoms will already be pretty much destroyed after so many wars.

Rickon = poor baby all the other two Rickon died before their times and left some kinda of sucession crisis 😭 But there two Rickard one is Ned father and the other is KitN who took the Neck from the Marsh King and was father to Jon Stark.

Also Theon = named after Theon Stark know as the Hungry Wolf who had some attitudes pretty similar to Greyjoys in general but in the end fought against a King of the Iron Islands that tried to conquer the north and spelled the iron man from his shores after killing the king's son. There lots of information about the Hungry Wolf and all match or can be paralled with Theon arc and personality, there even a history with the Boltons, GRRM really enjoyed the foreshadowing with this one.

The informations about Arya Flint and her husband, Theon Stark backstory and the existence of Sansa and Jonnel are all from TWOIAF so its all GRRM intentional later foreshadow.

Anon, this is great, you should post this to your own blog! It will never get proper recognition sitting in my ask tag.

I love stuff like this, thank you.

It occurred to me while reading this that it’s a little peculiar that the Greyjoys would name him Theon, given Theon Stark was an adversary to the Iron Islands. Makes it even more obvious that we should pay attention to these little details hiding in the history.

The most interesting thing here, other than Jonnel + King Jon Stark driving out raiders in the East, has to be Arya Flint being married to the Wandering Wolf. Ohhh boy, add that to the list of foreshadowing.

I'm sad about Rickon though. Oh well, I choose denial. I'm a full High Septon Rickon truther now. Try and stop me.

[frazzledsoul]

So I kind of wanted to follow up with my comments yesterday about hardcore ASOIAF fans and their contention that Jon Snow's life has no meaning.

Out of all of the crazy factions in GoT/ASOIAF fandom, I have had the worst problems with the ASOIAF Jonsa/Jon Snow side. They have actively discouraged me from reading further into ASOIAF than a few chapters into ACOK.

I got into a dust-up with several of those fans on here a few months ago for contending that I preferred Show!Jon to Book!Jon as they described him: a ruthless, elitist, Machiavellian character who only pretended to like the Wildings and never loved Ygritte and was a better person than Show!Jon because of those characteristics. I stated that I didn't want to read further about Book!Jon if he was like that and that Show!Jon certainly did not feel that way about Ygritte/The Wildings. I was then told that Book!Jon and Show!Jon were exactly the same character despite Book!Jon being superior (wha?) and I was too stupid to like either of them or to read the books.

I filled in the time I spent not reading ASOIAF by devouring everything in the Jonmund tag. However, I am kind of terrified at this point to get further into ASOIAF because of the culture that has grown up around Book!Jon. I don't at all trust what GRRM will do to him.

There definitely is an elitist mindset to some of these types of fans: Jon must end up in some sort of royal/exalted position or at least on the Wall because he must continue to serve Westeros. Certainly he shouldn't choose to associate himself with those dirty, ugly, trash that call themselves the Free Folk. And since they won't entertain the notion of him leaving the Wall, he must be completely miserable there, doomed forever to suffer for his crimes alone in a place that he hates.

I can't speak for how Book!Jon will view the situation, but none of this bears any connection whatsoever to what happened to Jon in the show.

I've stated many times that I won't deal with Wall Truthers (aka people who believe Jon goes back to the wall). If you needed for Jon to change his clothes while still at the Wall, be explicitly told he was not in the Night's Watch anymore and was a free man, and for him to openly declare he was not coming back after he left with the Wildings in order to believe it, I can't help you. That wasn't the situation Bran and Tyrion set up and Jon really couldn't leave under those terms. This was a quiet desertion or perhaps a release from his vows (hence Jon looking back at the gates one final time and then smiling to himself) once Jon left.

However, let's play Devil's Advocate and assume that Jon stays in the Watch. Is this really such a horrible fate for him?

When Jon is saying goodbye to his siblings to depart for the Wall, he looks happier and more relaxed than he has since the feast in 8.04. He is smiling. He's looking forward to Arya visiting him! He doesn't seem devastated at all.

When he actually gets to the Wall, Tormund is waiting for him. The Free Folk welcome him and are delighted to see him. He jubilantly reunites with Ghost. The Night's Watch open the gates for them to leave, and Jon smiles to himself after he looks back and leads them into the wilderness.

None of any of that seems to indicate that he is miserable. Quite the contrary. Even if Jon goes back, his primary job would be to trade with the Wildings and help them get settled in their communities. He'd still have Ghost. He'd still get to take plenty of naps. He would get to range beyond the Wall like he wanted to do when he first got there. It is not half as terrible as many of Jon's "fans" want it to be.

Now, I don't think any of that happened. I think that look back to the gates was significant, and Jon knew once he rode behind them that he wasn't going back. He'll be allowed to quietly desert and as long as he stays in exile, no one is going to care very much. He'll fade into Wildling society, free of courts and worldly politics and have the life that Show!Jon expressly stated he wanted.

He'll have friends, his dog, Tormund, the chance for leadership if he wants. It's a great life.

(and yes, Wall Truthers, I'm sure that interview you read with the crafts services lady or the assistant key grip stating that Jon goes back to the Wall is just awesome, but in the end I do trust Kit's opinion on what happened a lot more as well as what I saw as the credits rolled and I don't think when the script said that Jon would lead the Wildings that they just meant on a field trip)

The problem I have here is that even though I can imagine ADOS ending this way with Val by Jon's side instead of Tormund (it is likely this plot point came from GRRM) I know that ASOIAF fans will hate it because of the screeching they've already done. Jon didn't become King, he wasn't the one to vanquish the Others, he ended up with a happy life amongst the friends who appreciated him?!? What a load of crap, right? He might as well stay dead. In fact, many of them now hope he does stay dead. His role in this fandom is to be battered over between Jonerys and Jonsa and Aragorn!Jon stans, with little credence given to his own desires and opinions.

Meanwhile, I'm sitting here wondering what was so wrong with giving Jon Snow exactly what he wanted in life.

I know ASOIAF should be finished but won't be. I know that Jaime/Brienne fans in particular need a better resolution to their storyline. But it also pains me that Jon's best moments in seasons 5 and 6 belonged to that daughter-sacrificing religious fanatic Stannis, and it really chafes at me that he's going to take back Winterfell instead of Jon and Sansa. I don't see the book giving Jon a better ending even if GRRM gets around to it. Maybe it's just as well that he doesn't.

[atopvisenyashill]

omg pls pls post one bran meta 💔

i’ll give a rant for also loving my boy while i polish some stuff up but-

I am very much a “bran will be king” truther, i think there’s a lot of evidence for that that people kinda looked past bc they don’t find him interesting, bc they got into this series for the politics and not like, the fantasy aspects lol, but I do have like several ~scenarios~ for him, it’s just that “king of what’s left of westeros” is my favorite bc of the bittersweet aspect of it.

but part of why i think bran’s ending is kind of hard for everyone to grasp, is bc the show just didn’t give a shit about him (like, STATED they didn’t care about the fantasy aspects & i love to shittalk miguel & ryan & sara but at least they are Aware And Excited about the magic aspects of Terros). book readers tend to overlook him in favor of dany (the other big magical character) because george finds writing bran difficult and writing dany easier so we have like 50 dany chapters for every one of bran’s. but whereas there’s several dany chapters dedicated to world building, character introspection, magic, and politics EACH, bran gets all those themes kinda rolled up into these fleeting, monster chapters that are dense as fuck to read. EYE don’t mind that, but giving him like a third the amount of chapters as dany (or jon or tyrion or arya) is just REALLY setting that kid up to fail. but george has really explicitly stated he struggles with characters that are young, and he’s clearly talking about bran (probably sansa, sometimes arya as well) so it’s kinda. i get his struggle!! but he also clearly loves bran as a character bc the chapters we get are real rich!

but d&d don’t even give us what’s on the page bc they do not care!!! so it’s so hard to really pin down what the fuck is going on with bran, bc i truly think they cut most of the notes george gave them about bran, possibly even gave parts of his story to others bc “it would be cooler”, and then used him almost exclusively for exposition & shock value. like, for all we know, the long night is also very short in the books bc of something bran did while in the north, but those two thought it would be cooler if it was just one battle.

[sidebar but like i mean, also jon is a big magical character, but rn jon is less “a magical character” and more “a character that has magic happen to him” bc he’s still a bit uncomfortable about being a warg, bc the logistics & morality of it freak him out. honestly that’s a good thing for jon, bc look at what “do magic first ask questions later” has gotten dany and bran (and theoretically robb). being inside ghost is certainly going to change his outlook on magic & cause another identity crisis, but i don’t think the magical side is where jon is going to struggle morally]

[also i do think the long night is likely to be a little longer, because i think they’re getting to the trident, but potentially they only fuck the north and riverlands and not anywhere else because of something bran does. idk man. for all he goes on about aragorn’s tax policies, he has done with the wights & others exactly what’s done with the orcs. makes me wonder if there’s some plot about the others that involves bran befriending & humanizing a section of them & d&d went “that’s weird and boring” and cut it, like the way the director for i am legend changed the ending to that suicide grenade scene even tho the book ending is so objectively better that will smith said he’s gonna do a second movie but with the cut ending aksjjd. my evidence so far for that is like, negative evidence, which doesn’t make for good meta, so i’m excited to get to adwd so i can reread bran’s chapters in like, ya know, a year 😭]