#and what lwj would do with that information

[gravitywonagain]

thinking about jiang cheng during those three months he carried his brother’s sealed sword, all the time having the ability to draw it and never knowing.

imagine that he did, though. imagine that late one night, lying in his bedroll, keeping his eyes open to ward off the nightmares, he picks suibian up, wraps his hands around the scabbard, around the hilt, and pulls.

he does it because he wants to feel it resist. he wants to feel what lan wangji felt, feel the power of wei wuxian’s sword — its loyalty, its stubbornness.

instead, he feels it give. the blade gleams in the moonlight as it slides free.

now what the hell is he supposed to make of that?

[poorly-drawn-mdzs]

Archery Nemesis.

[First] Prev <–-> Next

[leatherbookmark]

actually i have discovered the only true and correct reading of md/zs: wgxn are the true Evil Men of mdzs. just look at how they’re dealing with lxc post-guanyin

[runespoor7]

hello!! for the ask game -- any more details about that post where wei wuxian finds out that wen ning and jiang cheng are hooking up post-canon 👀

the background for this is that WWX hears about WN/JC a while after WN/JC has been a thing - they've had time to phase out of the hate-sex phase, the phase where they're surprised that they have a cordial acquaintance interspersed with moment of kinship outside of sex, and are in the phase where they're willing to see where this takes them. it's been a few years since the end of canon, so WWX and JC have crossed paths since then.

WWX goes through some truly embarrassing denial. Because clearly what WN and JC gave been having isn't sex, it's not like, y'know, sex-sex. They must have been cutely holding hands and cuddling.

or, well, actually WWX isn't even thinking about that part too much either because the idea of JC cuddling makes his heart twinge and his throat go tight and actually what matters here is that what WN and JC are doing is fake sex and can't be real or correct or good!! They're probably too embarrassed to even hold hands, WN's too nice to push and JC is awful!!!

for the record LWJ hates this and is glaring at WN whenever they meet because WN is the one who stumblingly and delicately mentioned that he and SLJ are seeing one another, thank you WN.

2. for a while WWX manages to keep his obnoxiousness under enough wraps that WN can ignore it.

then one day WWX makes the mistake of switching targets for his random bout of fretting, and instead of bothering his husband he talks at WN about his ConcernTM regarding JC having sex WN having sex WWX not being there JC not being good at cuddling while WN needs someone who'll be nice to him.

WN awkwardly conveys the information that oh, hm, actually, that is not an issue, JC is a very good cuddler.

and then some demon must have taken over WN's mouth for a moment, probably invited by WWX's moue of disbelief because WN adds, very neatly cutting through WWX's exclamation that ah, that's just like WN to be so nice, but he's just saying that because he doesn't know better, because in fact--, "i just get him tired enough."

3. denial comes crashing down violently around WWX's ears and so does his peace of mind.

(there's a lot WWX hasn't made his peace with. JC never let him cuddle when they swapped handjobs as teens.)

suddenly WWX starts treating WN like a rival. it's unexpectedly thrilling for WN, and the fact that WWX's moods make it clear that in WWX's mind, WN is winning, makes it even sweeter. WN isn't used to winning. (WN wouldn't have thought of JC as a prize, it's complicated, the thing with JC. and yet. WWX thinks of JC as a prize. Even if he's not admitting it to himself.)

(LWJ is hating this even more but if he'd made a habit of trying to enforce his boundaries with WWX he wouldn't be WWX's regular, would he. he does try to distract WWX! with his dick! it has admirable success for the duration of coitus and then WWX starts getting the same look again. Distracting WWX with a mystery and a night-hunt just ends with WWX musing about looking up specific legends in YunmengJiang, at which point LWJ recognizes that they're going to have to go to Lotus Pier and hope for the best.)

4. They go to Lotus Pier, where: JC has so far been blissfully ignorant of this entire farce.

There's some new tension between he and WN because JC misinterpreted some mentions of WWX WN made, and WWX is an extremely fraught topic between them, one that they've avoided since they rolled out of their hate-sex phase. Originally JC doesn't link WWX's visit to WN's presence, he's too busy being taken aback (and distrustful) (and happy) at WWX being there, WWX trying to recall their history, WWX acting almost as close as they did once.

WN - who was already here! funny how these things work out! - is wincing throughout out these proceedings. WN himself isn't invited to stay in Lotus Pier proper, it's one of these things. YMJ doesn't have dogs for SLJ to unleash on WN, but he wouldn't want to take the risk, it seemed like a boundary worth respecting. There's something particularly awful about seeing WWX ingratiate himself - the word that comes to WN's mind is woo, really - with JC with JC unaware of the reason why it's happening.

Telling JC the truth keeps being the role WN stumbles into, time and again. At least this time he isn't trying to hurt JC on purpose. Even though talking about WWX is another of those boundaries of JC, another of those things that WN knows hurts JC, but--

at least this time he didn't wait years before telling JC either.

5. JC reacts by immediately being furious at everyone involved, but mostly at WWX, and there's a HUGE DRAMATIC SHOUTING MATCH.

JC acts like WWX returning like that, because of this, is some horrible betrayal.

WWX is outraged that WN told JC. (WWX's actual problem is that he's atrociously jealous of someone, anyone, getting somewhere with JC that he never got, by which I mean not just sex but also cuddling and a stable relationship that you can tell the people close to you about, and desperately needs to be higher in JC's priorities. he knows better, he really does, but WN's revelations turned his world upside down and.)

JC is also outraged that WN told WWX about-- *angrily cuts himself off* "--about you two fucking," WWX finishes, so incensed he's that close to calling JC by his courtesy name. And how is that any of WWX's concern exactly, to which WWX retorts something along the lines of "making sure they're not hurting one another," or something equally untrue. There's accusations of WWX playing games (JC - about WWX's return; then WN - about WWX trying to seduce JC, which gets JC snapping at WN and LWJ grimly nodding), there's an attempt from LWJ (who is throwing poisonous looks at both JC and WN) to convince boo that they're not worth it, let's just go, and WWX spits out in a fit of atrocious jealousy that it's his business because they're his, WN is his, and WWX had JC first, so why does JC let WN cuddle him--

at which point JC throws everyone out for the night. WWX and LWJ have to find a room at an inn, and WWX feels the disgrace acutely from having a guest room. (LWJ is indispensable in dragging WWX away, for the record. LWJ doesn't drag WWX all the way back to Cloud Recesses, because WWX "needs" to have JC, as he stresses to LWJ. But he thought about it before WWX started tugging on his heartstrings.)

5.5 - that same night

WWX slinks back out of the inn and beelines straight for LP. he needs to talk to JC, to fix things - JC always thinks the worst of things, it all went topsy turvy. There were too many people! This conversation he should have had without WN. (there's another conversation he needs to have with WN, but WWX's been putting that off forever and isn't going to stop now.) Even LWJ, bless him, of course JC would take everything the wrong way, given how he is with LWJ around.

WN intercepts him just as he's about to enter LP. And isn't budging on not letting him in. ("He said no, Wei-gongzi.") there's something very ironic about WN acting like JC's watchdog without being asked but WWX isn't unpacking all that - it feels like if he did he would entirely unravel.

A couple of WWX's arguments erode WN's resolve - "he threw you out too; you know you need to convince him to take you back or he'll keep a grudge and he won't take you back before forever" and "WN, we both care about JC," and "we need to dissipate this misunderstanding" - and if he'd had just a little more time he's sure he could have gotten through to him but JC finds them before that can happen. (people who trust in WWX's ability to take no for an answer: 0) Eyes slit, looking unhappy, all "what are you doing here."

"We came to see you."

Grudgingly, JC takes them in.

(He, too, thinks it's something unfinished. And his weak point was always fear of abandonment. What if he pushes away too much. They returned tonight. It would be foolish to push them away again; what if they change their minds?)

they're more tired than earlier, and quieter, so despite JC taking them to his office and not his bedroom after the confessions of caring and hurt they'll manoeuver themselves into a successful threesome before the night is out. (despite WWX tempting fate or at least JC's temper by asking whether it's truly so bad that WWX didn't say why he was back now? and no, for JC of course it's not, it's about WWX never telling the truth.)

After all, they came back.

[pakhnokh]

Wei Wuxian not knowing about the Lan Forehead Ribbon in "House of Gentians"

What LWJ says in this part is the HoG-verse assumption regarding WWX not knowing the meaning of the forehead ribbon. The idea/opinion is mine, it's how I see it based on my reading, so it might not be true! But this is the setting for HoG nonetheless.

Please take into consideration that this is me explaining the technical behind the scenes of my thought process to make these pages. I base my work on the novel and what is written there only. This is not me trying to explain the novel, but only what I, as a creator of an AU, thought that I can use for it to work.

So please, read till the end and if you have your own insights to share, do it!

So what is the explanation for Wei Wuxian not knowing the meaning of the ribbon and finding it out in canon? We have 2 versions.

Novel version (also Manhua and audio drama): WWX doesn’t know the meaning of the forehead ribbon, and the cause is unknown. He learns about it from the Lan juniors in his second life.

Donghua version: The source of information about the ribbon is the Lan rule book, and WWX copied that part wrong. Only in his second life, when he flipped through LWJ’s notes, he found the mistake and the correct meaning written by LWJ.

I believe donghua had its own reasons to bend the plot this way (especially since censorship laws would forbid presenting the meaning of the ribbon so straightforwardly fearing the possibility of hinting on wangxian relationship, so showing it as one second shot of a notebook with tons of text was a good choice on their part to both deal with the censorship and still maintain the main idea).

HoG-verse follows the novel, therefore it does not assume that WWX knew, or could know the meaning of the ribbon from the Lan rules. We don’t even know if it’s IN the Lan rules. According to the novel, WWX had to copy about four fifths of the entire Lan rule book, see here:

And we do know that WWX remembered quite a lot of the rules, as he says to Jin Ling in the temple:

(In fact WWX is shown as someone with good memory, especially of things he read. He excels in his class in CR showing that he knows a lot of stuff compared to his classmates, he remembered phrases he read once from Wen Mao’s book,and he remembers the Lan rules he copied many times).

I also don’t think he has “selective memory” cause the only times WWX was shown as forgetting something (as far as I recall) is the times he was feverish (Tulu Xuanwu cave, forgetting the song the LWJ played to him) and devastated/not caring about what’s going on around him (after the massacre on Nightless City, after his Shijie died, didn’t remember LWJ saving him and confessing to him).

In both cases, he eventually remembers. He remembers by himself the song LWJ played in the end of the novel, and about the events of Nightless City, when LXC tells him about what happened, he admits that his memory is clouded:

Meaning he eventually recalls the things he forgot. This is opposed to his reaction when he finds out about the Lan ribbon from the Lan juniors. It’s really something he hears for the first time. If WWX really copied this from the rule book and forgot, he should’ve remembered it at this point, but he’s too surprised, excited and embarrassed.

PLUS, if WWX had copied the meaning of the forehead ribbon from the Lan rule book, I don’t think he would forget it. He always thought the Lans to be strict, boring and uptight, so such a “juicy” piece of information would by no means go unnoticed by him. He’d use this info to tease the hell out of young LWJ hahaha…notice how he is surprised that the Lans could have a romantic side:

ANYWAYS this is just to show that the donghua version isn’t exactly possible in novel-verse.

In fact, in the novel, WWX does know only one meaning of the forehead ribbon, or maybe its purpose:

Maybe THIS was what he read in the Lan Rule book, but it’s still not as in the donghua, where he eventually came to know that the ribbon is supposed to be given to one’s fated other. If this knowledge about the ribbon being a tool for self-regulation was what he learned from the Lan book, then he is still left in the dark because he suspects there is another meaning to the ribbon and he just doesn’t know it:

According to these parts, it doesn’t seem that WWX knew and forgot, but that he really didn’t know the whole story behind the ribbon. Again, his reaction is very strong:

Again, this is different from him realizing that his memory was clouded after the events of Nightless City. This is REALLY something he NEVER knew. Anyways back to the conversation with the juniors, where WWX finds the truth, LSZ tells that:

Apparently this meaning of the ribbon is something that was passed down the generations. We don’t know if it was passed down by script or orally, or both, but it is something that has turned into a custom for the Lans.

And since it is a major custom in such a major sect such as theirs, I believe that it was known among other sects too.

There’s the opinion that this meaning of the forehead ribbon was known to Lans only, but I personally don’t think so, because the Lans themselves had no problem of telling about it to outsiders.

Recall the text I added before where JL says to WWX that he learned its meaning:

And also, LSZ and LJY have no problem revealing it to WWX, who they still think is Mo Xuanyu at this point.

Also, in his first life, back on Phoenix Mountain, it seems that LXC was willing to tell WWX the meaning:

(ok this is personally my head canon but I think that LWJ stopped LXC from revealing the meaning of the ribbon because he kinda lowkey wanted WWX to continue touching/asking to touch it, and was afraid that by learning what the ribbon means, WWX would feel ashamed and stop. I mean, if I was LWJ and my crush would constantly touch or ask to touch the object that is supposed to be given to my fated other I’D DEVELOP HOPES AND THINK WHAT IF THIS IS FATE??? And eventually I’d want it to become true. :’) )

Anyways back to the matter at hand, the Lans seem to have no problem telling others what’s the meaning of the ribbon is. I also don’t think that taking one’s ribbon off has an immediate sexual association. IT CAN HAVE, AND IT IS, but it’s not the main idea of it, in my opinion. It’s an object that’s supposed to be given only to the other’s beloved no matter in which situation. Meaning, that the moment they are together, or wed, the moment they know they love each other, then it gives the fated person the validity to touch the ribbon. If it had a solely sexual association then I guess this scene wouldn’t happen:

LWJ enters a wine shop without his forehead ribbon, and WWX plays with it. You can say that this is them acting SUPERRRR shamelessly, but I really believe there’s nothing so scandalizing about it. LWJ feels comfortable giving him the ribbon because they are finally together. WWX accepted his feelings, and therefore, LWJ can take it off and give it to him, and (correct me if I’m wrong) nowhere is it mentioned that it’s something that’s supposed to be done only at the couple’s private chambers.

(That’s also why I felt confident enough to have LWJ remove his ribbon and tie it on WWX in front of everyone at the inn, even though it DID have a strong meaning of letting go of self regulation, but in my eyes this was possible also because WWX is his beloved one, even though his feelings aren’t returned yet.)

ANYWAYS it seems that the Lans have no problem telling about the meaning to outsiders, because (in my eyes) there’s really nothing TOO sensitive about the fact that the meaning of the ribbon is that you can give it only to your loved one. I don’t think it’s THAT grave to be kept a secret from the world. On the contrary, in a world such as theirs, which is built on honor and respect to customs and traditions, I guess it’s important for others to know about such a custom, if only so that they’d know not to touch the ribbon accidentally or on purpose, to avoid offending the Lan member. (I don’t know if it’s true but in my eyes the Lans make this ceremony of giving their ribbon to their loved one on their wedding hehehe so yeah, I do imagine that if outsiders attended a Lan wedding, they’d see this custom happening).

And as I believe happened in all periods of our real world, that there were books and records written about history, cultures and traditions of peoples, the same exists in MDZS verse. I believe that there would exist books and records about the history and customs of different sects, and I think that it's not impossible that the meaning of the Lan forehead ribbon is also mentioned briefly somewhere in a book about the Lan Clan/Sect, or elsewhere.

And this finally brings me to this page of HoG that LWJ asks Wei Wuxian this question. WWX wants to know the meaning of the ribbon for the first time, after so many times of touching or wanting to touch it.

I think that younger LWJ didn’t even KNOW that WWX doesn’t know the meaning of the ribbon. Hell, in his eyes it could have been just another malicious prank done by this shameless boy who has no respect. Maybe only later did LWJ realize that WWX really didn’t know the meaning.

Hearing WWX’s question finally being asked, LWJ isn’t ready to answer him yet. He gave him the ribbon, yes, but it was something he did as a statement to his Shishu and others. As I mentioned before, he didn’t give WWX his ribbon during their wedding, nor after it. Because he knows that WWX doesn’t return his feelings and that this marriage isn’t really out of love.

That’s why he isn’t willing to answer his question right away. Instead, he just teases WWX by answering with a question of his own. And since WWX brought their past, with how he touched his ribbon and was rejected, LWJ also brings his perspective on the past - like, how could you do all that, and not even know what’s the meaning of what you do?

LWJ was a student with WWX in cloud recesses and heard how he answered all questions correctly and fast. WWX was outstanding compared to his classmates, showing that he did some reading. LOL as I was making this there was this picture of WWX’s room running on twitter, and I really loved that private library/study corner he had there with tons of books.

It was clear that WWX did read about the cultivation world, including random sects’ history, traditions etc. This is where I’m sure that such a book would exist about the Lan Sect too.

And LWJ asks him if he didn’t read anything about the Lans as he was reading about all other sects. What’s the answer to that? In HoG-verse, I guess WWX missed this information somehow. He really didn’t know the meaning of the ribbon from any source, and he still doesn’t know.

BUT HE’S GONNA FIND OUT I PROMISE HEHEHE SO….there you have it! This is HoG’s version of dealing with the forehead ribbon matter, where WWX stayed alive and dared raise the question before HGJ himself.

ANOTHER IMPORTANT NOTE

I need to clarify one more thing, guys. This isn't me stating an idea about the novel, this is me sharing my thought process in order to make my AU work. Let me explain:

Even if the info about the Lan ribbon is written in the rule book, I couldn't be sure about that because it isn't specified in a clear manner. The only certain source for that is the donghua, which, as I'm sure you can understand, I can't use since it made many changes to the original story. I couldn't be sure if the info about the ribbon in the Lan rule book is a canon possibility or a donghua way of dealing with the plot. So, I DO NOT OPPOSE the idea that the info is in the Lan rule book! But I just needed clear evidence to work with.

LWJ was not about to answer WWX's question in that instant. He wanted to ask him back - just how come he didn't know?

So imagine me having to think about the text (and believe me I put a lot of thinking hahaha), I couldn't make LWJ say "Didn't you copy it in the rules? How could you miss it?" because again, I couldn't be 100% sure it WAS in fact canon that it's written in the rules.

So I made the decision to make him require about WWX's studious character which does 2 things:

based on my assumption that some knowledge about the Lan ribbon was available to the public because it seems to me that the Lans themselves are surprised that WWX doesn't know. imagine that this is like others know not to offer alcohol to the Lans so to not offend them. I'm sure that some basic knowledge about the ribbon was available to the public too, again, from courtesy reasons.

LWJ asking WWX this is my way of making it show that his character DID notice and DOES acknowledge WWX's intelligence. their studying in Gusu days was a chaos of LWJ avoiding WWX or giving him the cold shoulder. >This< LWJ however takes that unfortunate past experience and by this slight sarcastic reply shows WWX that he in fact noticed and appreciated WWX's smart and studious character.

So once again I stress out the fact that this is me creating this idea (which can be untrue!) out of technical reasons to make not only the AU in general work, but also THIS SPECIFIC moment of LWJ answering WWX without telling him the meaning.

[sasukimimochi]

The sound of low, raspy humming of a familiar tune took his attention away, lifting his head to gaze into the nearby forest of Yiling. “Wei Ying?”

Following his siren song, Lan Wangji shook as he brought himself to his feet. He grimaced in pain, taking a few shallow breaths but never able to breathe too deeply. The ache in his back forced him to stop routinely, but he couldn’t give up now… The melody was so close.

He pushed forward, stumbling into dense foliage and pushing it aside painfully. “Wei Ying…?” His body froze, pupils shrinking in shock.

Sitting upright against a tree in the distance was a corpse holding a young child, and not just any corpse and child. It was Wei Wuxian with Wen Yuan. Calmly drifting around the corpse was a thick resentment, moving like a living thing protecting its young. The moment the two were stumbled upon though, the humming came to an abrupt halt and the resentment curled around the two protectively.

Despite Wei Wuxian not turning his head nearly as quickly as he usually would to figure out who had stumbled upon them, the resentment reared itself almost like a feral animal in defense, giving the two a wide berth from the Lan.

“...Wei Ying…A-Yuan?” Lan Wangji managed, his heart falling to his feet.

He was too late.

this first art for TDKW! What do you guys think? v//w//v i rly like this one im proud of it

See More for TDKW below the line!

“The Dead Keep Walking” / TDKW - General rating* *maybe Teen if gross things are described, tbh more likely to be teen but not sure.

TDKW is a short project I have planned centered around LWJ finding the dead body of WWX and A-Yuan is with him- but WWX is undead and walking. WWX may be a corpse, but he is conscious- a bit more like TGCF in that sense for plot reasons, but I may provide a sort of "as canon as possible" answer to fit more into mdzs properly. maybe something like a tag he attached to his skin or something before death combined with resentment from his living body.

WWX is not completely right in the head; he repeats things a lot, has lost the ability partially to actually debate with people (he will just repeat himself when he knows he's correct or wants something) has an uncharacteristically flat expression because of his state and his movements aren't always too fluid. he is however still good at protecting, as his resentment still resides with him in death. he has become more unapologetically feral as a result.

There's not a lot of information I can share yet for this fic, but I wanted to share it since I have been thinking about it for quite some time!

A R T:

Broken Lullaby Sparkles and fretting

Music Playlist!

Find more MDZS art/projects on my masterpost! ❤

[withthewindinherfootsteps]

I love how so many interpersonal conflict in MDZS aren't caused by simple 'miscommunication' – they're caused by people being too quick to judge things based on rumours or one-sided information, without consideration for the actual evidence behind that.

The soup incident? JZX only believed the guest cultivator's side of things without consideration of JYL's words. 3zun's fate? LXC only considered JGY's side of the story, without considering NMJ's may have some truth to it (because in his mind, JGY had a justifiable reason for all his actions). Sunshot-era Wangxian conflict? LWJ believed the unfounded* narrative he was taught around what guidao does, contrary to what the only source of evidence was saying, and it's this that leads to WWX constructing a barrier between them. Their final confrontation at Nightless City? WWX came to the conclusion that LWJ was against him, hated him too, despite the fact that "any sane person would be able to tell that Lan WangJi’s voice was clearly shaking" (EXR, Chapter 78), due to his mental state at the time.

This same mindset is also leveraged by other people, for varying purposes – whether it be JGS blatantly lying about WWX's words in the hopes people would believe him, or NHS spreading false rumours about the man-eating castles at Xinglu Ridge in order to stop people disturbing the sabre spirits (of course he uses this mindset in his plan to utterly destroy JGY as well, both directly and to contribute to the view NHS is useless). And that mindset also creates the main driving antagonistic force – the rumour-driven mob mentality so present in the world.

I just love how present this theme (the harm of coming to conclusions based on incomplete evidence) is in the novel, even when it's not drawn attention to**!

(more discussion under the cut)

Now, there are obviously other factors to the conflicts above – and in most cases, these reactions are understandable (WWX's misreadings due to his mental state at Nightless City, for one thing, but others, too). For example there was evidence that appeared to be there supporting LWJ's views on guidao: WWX did appear paler, there would definitely have been differences in his health vs the health of those with a working Golden Core, and he was quick to anger and did seem more arrogant than before, even though that was moreso a combination of trauma and constructing an image that meant nobody would look into the matter of his Golden Core too closely. So argubaly, he did weigh the evidence he had, and it just led him to the wrong conclusion! But none of that means this aspect wasn't a major factor in those conflicts – just as it doesn't mean that LWJ didn't instantly disregard the other side of the story (WWX's words), and came to the wrong conclusion partially because of it.

That also doesn't mean the characters can't learn from this or change their conclusion – LWJ comes to accept WWX's words towards the end of WWX's first life, LXC does open up to the potential flaws within JGY when Wangxian raise it, and after he's seen NMJ's corpse, due to receiving strong evidence (the wrong melody and cleanly missing pages in the Collection of Turmoil, for instance). If he only started suspecting JGY after he shows his cards at the Guanyin Temple, he wouldn't have done things like block JGY from the Cloud Recesses, for instance.

(And, a final note: the problem isn't that these characters chose the 'wrong side' of the issue to see it from – their process would still have been flawed even if they came to the right conclusion from its other side. The problem here is that none of them consider both and weigh them up to judge.)

––

*Regardless of whether you believe guidao has an adverse effect on mental state, and it isn't just trauma – WWX is the inventor of guidao! So any pre-invention speculation about the effects of guidao was, by the word's definition, unfounded... and these teachings were certainly pre-invention! So though I do have an opinion regarding this, it doesn't affect the point.

**Chapter 30 is a good example of when it is: '[LWJ:] “One should not comment without understanding the whole picture.”' (EXR) – but it appears in many of Wangxian's actions throughout the present day section of the novel (especially in regard to teaching the Juniors).

[wangxianficfinder]

Fic Finder

Feb 6th

~*~

1. Hi!

I've been watching your content for a while and I really liked it, so I would like you to please help me find a fic.

This fic is a One shot with a/b/o theme (wwx omega LWJ alpha) where wwx lived a "house" for omegas (where he is a friend of mm) and they "borrow" it for prince Lwj, Lxc ( alpha) is the emperor and JGY (omega) is his partner.

In Gusu, omegas are not considered for cultivation, however, wwx doesn't care much about that and there is a scene where he along with LWJ fight in a cave with a monster. The final scene of the one shot occurs when WWX runs away from Gusu to the beach, LWJ follows him because they promised to visit the sea one day together.

the wangxian relationship is slow and with lwj's problems to express his feelings 😓

I would appreciate your help, if you need more information, I will gladly try to remember more things😊 and sorry for the grammar, my native language is not English (google translator)

FOUND? Rattling our cages by danegen (E, 69k, wangxian, A/B/O, but like polite, Slow Burn, Pining while fucking, so much hair combing, WWX has a vagina, POV WWX, no yin iron or wars or plot really, Canon Era, spiders--see the notes, Spanish Translation Available)

~*~

2. Heya! Can y'all help me find a fic?

The part of the plot i remember is that WWX uses an array to erase himself and the wens from the memory of the cultivation world. The array stops one day, and a bunch of people go to the burial mounds to see what's up. It was on ao3, probably.

and that's ~all i remember~

a nice fic but not the one i remember. pretty sure wwx was hiding in the burial mounds with the wens. thanks for this fic tho!

NOT FOUND! Second Summer by Anonymous (M, 152k, WangXian, canon, Post-Sunshot Campaign, Mystery, Amnesia, Memory Loss, Curses, Somebody Lives/Not Everyone Dies, somebody lives/somebody else dies, Golden Core Reveal, canon-typical lack of lube, Ambiguous/Open Ending)

NOT FOUND! you've heard that melody before by Stratisphyre (M, 66k, wangxian, JL & LSZ & LJY, JC/WQ, Canon Divergence, Hurt/Comfort, Memory Loss, POV Multiple, Multiple Canon Character Deaths, Depictions of depression, Light Dom/sub, Not Everyone Dies AU, Twin Prides of Yúnmèng Dynamics)

FOUND? Run Off The World by Sapphire_Roses (M, 271k, wangxian, JYL/JZX, SL/XXC, WIP, Not Everyone Dies AU, Canon Divergence, Wen Remnants Live, Flashbacks, YLLZ WWX, WWX Creates a Sect | Yiling Wei Sect, Sect Leader WWX, Married WangXian, OCs, POV Outsider, Morally Grey Characters, (Do Take That Tag Seriously), Angst, Hurt/Comfort, Family Feels, Developing Friendships, Fluff, Attempt at Humor, Yunmeng Siblings Feels, Gusu Siblings Feels, Sibling Bonding, Pining, Character Study, Tenderness, Mild Smut, POV Alternating, It Gets Worse Before It Gets Better, Minor Character Death)

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3. Hi, i was looking for a fic i think i found in your blog? It was a wip and it was something along the line of wwx as yilling patriarch and the sects sent lan wangji for tribute. But they already knew each other.

I remember this one scene where lan wangji finds bunnies inside the burial mounds but wwx captures them to eat and lwj is sad.

I don't remember the title or anything because i think i directly clicked the link and started reading but then i forgot to bookmark it and lost the link.

Please help me find it, i really wanna know what happened next.🙏😔

FOUND? The Jade Bride by lanwangjibo (Not rated, 16k, wangxian, WIP, Pining LWJ, YLLZ WWX, Misunderstandings, POV WWX, POV LWJ, Fluff and Angst, WQ Lives, Wēn Remnants Live, LSZ is a Wēn, WWX is Bad at Feelings, LWJ is Bad at Communicating, SS Being an Asshole, Pining WWX, Hurt LWJ, BAMF WWX, Angst with a Happy Ending)

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4. fic finder request! looking for two fics that i can't seem to locate in my bookmarks - A) in the first one, sizhui (and the rest of the juniors?) somehow reach through time and rescue wwx (i think dead in present time), bringing him into their present! in the process they create a lot of trouble, due to the power expended and released, i believe they turned a mountain into a crater or something.

B) the second fic I'm looking for takes place during the sunshot campaign, when baoshan sanren decides to join the fight and intervenes. she restores both jc and wwx's cores, by reaching back into time and removing jc's core right before it's melted by wzl, she also returns wwx's core from jc's to wwx's body. she does this in her tent, which is also a dimension travel portal or something which iirc links back to her home on the mountain.

thank you very much!! @potatokunst

4A)

FOUND! Would You Come Home? by s6115 (Not rated, 46k, WangXian, Junior Quartet Centric, Time Travel Fix-It, Canon Divergence, Junior Quartet Dynamics)

4B)

FOUND! Can't Tell Me Nothin by natacup82 (T, 35k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, Everybody Lives, Family Feels, Communication, BAMF Women) Baoshan Sanren return Jiang Cheng's core from the past in chapter 4

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5. hi! gosh, i have had this fic stuck in my head for the past weeks but for the life of me, i just cannot remember the name. i really hope you can help me find it!

the fic is about how modern wei wuxian is a researcher/scientist and he got his hands on a shady book written by baoshan sanren, accidentally triggers a talisman/array and somehow being transported into the wuxia version and it involves the people who died coming back to life and they all watch/read the past and it just sort of becomes one big therapy session.

i think i remember there being a part in the fic where modern wei wuxian mentions transferring/donating his organ to modern jiang cheng in reference to how og wei wuxian transfered his gold core to og jiang cheng.

and also a part where it was mention that for modern wei wuxian, it was madam yu who found and brought him back to the jiang family to be raised and not sect leader jiang; also it was implied that the modern jiang family is actually a loving happy family in contrast to the sort of dysfunctional og one because modern wei wuxian address's madam yu and sect leader jiang as mother and father.

i wish i could remember more, i hope this would be enough to go on. please help me and thank you so much in advance! @lilith--14

I believe this fic has been deleted but please correct me if I'm wrong - Mod C

FOUND? Yes the fic was deleted. It's "Loving Future, Distant Past" by yareyarejojosan. Here is a link to a folder that contains all of the author's fics

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6. For a fic finder, there was this nsfw kinda darkji (probably pwp) fic that haunts me and might have been deleted, becaused i’ve searched in every way I know how: (post?)canon, wwx can’t get hard anymore for some reason. He is embarrassed to admit it to lwj, who then calms him and says it’s normal and that he doesn’t use it for much anyway. Turns out lwj was the one who started and keeps giving him the tea for impotence. The lan doctors are in on this(?) Thanks if anyone can identify this one!

I don’t think 6 on the last fic finder was it (still a delishiously dark-ish rec, thank you!), it was (probably) a shorter pwp and not modern

NOT FOUND You Sing of Thanatos; I Hear Only Eros by kanonkita (E, 39k, WangXian, MIND THE TAGS, Modern AU, Extremely Dubious Consent, Dark!LWJ, Mild Horror, Omorashi, Tentacles, Rope Bondage, Shibari, Praise Kink, Breeding Kink, Oviposition, Non-Consensual Body Modification, soft pillow talk, Hurt/Comfort, non-consensual emotional healing, Panic Attacks, Wetting, Body Horror, Impotence, Magic, Anal Sex, PIV Sex, Mpreg, Mild Suicidal Ideation, Voyeurism, PWP, Angst, nonconsensual medical treatment)

FOUND? Succumbing to His unconditional love? by MurderRose (E, 2k, wangxian, mildly dom/sub, WWX's floppy little cock, the trials of being utterly loved, LWJ can be a tiny bit dark as a treat, opt in or opt out at your will, its almost invisibly mild, a lil bit of humiliation)

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7. Hello (✿◠‿◠) hope you having a good day! This is for the fic finder, I've been looking for this fic where after his death wwx comes back as a rabbit, it has a glossary at the start for words/terms the rabbits use, I think? I really hope this is enough to go form!

FOUND! Dignity and Animality by quick_cat_tl (G, 31k, WangXian, Watership Down, u know the one with the political/philosophical bunnies, Reincarnation, Lapine language, Rabbit!WWX, Sunny Angst, Pining) Hi, number 7 is probably „Dignity and Animality“ by Anielka. Unfortunately, it seems to be deleted on AO3. / For #7, I remember reading "Dignity and Animality!" When I click the link for it (from the wangxianficrecs tumblr), it redirects to Dignity and Animality by quick_cat_tl - maybe the author changed their AO3 handle? / The question about #7 - I copied the link for the current posting for that story and then took it into the wayback machine where that same link does pull up the story being underneath the original name mentioned back in 2021, so it was a name change and not a repost.

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8. I’m looking for a fic, one chapter, Lan Wangji is a teacher in Cloud Recesses. He takes Wei Wuxian to the Jingshi and it’s implied that he told Wei Wuxian he’d not tell anyone what Wei Wuxian had done so long as Wei Wuxian let him fuck him.

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9. Hi! I hope you can help me find this. All I can remember is that WWX fell asleep in the cold spring and I think Lwj or Lqr saw his body few hours later and wwx is cold as if he is already dead.

FOUND? 🔒 Warming up (to him) by barisan (T, 9k, LQR & WWX, WangXian, Hypothermia, Cloud Recesses Study Arc, Temporary Character Death, Medical Inaccuracies, YZY Abuses WWX, JFM Bashing, pre-wangxian, Good Uncle LQR, Angst with a Happy Ending, Hurt/Comfort)

FOUND? Warmth by Quiet_crash (G, 2k, WangXian, LQR & WWX, Hypothermia, Fluff, Kinda, Implied/Referenced Self-Harm)

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10. Hi! Your work on this blog is absolutely amazing! For fic finder, I've been searching for a fic I read awhile ago. It's post-canon. WWX is traveling and writing to LWJ, but letters stop coming. LWJ searches and finds that to prevent a creature from preying on a local child, WWX took it on himself but to prevent the curse from hurting anyone else, he's hiding in a cave, constantly drinking to dull the effects.

FOUND? Fire in the Blood by Jo Lasalle (Jo_Lasalle) (M, 20k, wangxian, First Time, Post-Canon, Angst with a Happy Ending, hurt/comfort themes)

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11. Hey I read a book recently, in there, there was a scene where, wwx was protecting someone? Or someone was protecting wwx? By standing on one side of fire and the attackers/i think it was jins or someone on the other side of fire. The scene was fierce. They were like us against the world type of scene. Do u know this fic? @constellationdks

#11 for recent fic finder here, thnx for the rec but it's not the one. The one I'm looking for is quite long, I think it was more than 30 or 40k. Also the scene wasn't with a yuan.

I know number 11 and I'm trying to search for it. It's wwx holding a-yuan in his arms in an alleyway when they are attacked by the jin. The premise has something to do with that strength parents get when defending their children? 🤔 let me get back to you!

NOT FOUND Hysterical Strength by covalentbonds (Not Rated, 3k, WIP, WangXian, Canon Divergence, Parent WWX, Fix-It of Sorts, Everybody Lives/Nobody dies) Wwx is out one evening with a-yuan when he is ambushed by the jin.

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12. Fic finder please! 🙏

This would be a hybrid/warprize LWJ where he was a bunny hybrid and WWX was a snake. WRH has LWJ shipped off to WWX, who ends up helping him and eventually gets him reunited with LXC.

I remember there was art of LWJ and rabbits bc WWX was trying to help him calm down. I’ve read this sometime last year and can’t find it anywhere! 😭😭

FOUND! 山水盆景 (Shānshuǐ Pénjǐng) by meicairoubingfan (kiradyn) (M, 64k, WangXian, warprize AU warprize lwj, Slow Burn, Strangers to Lovers, Vers WangXian, Top WWX, Top LWJ/Bottom WWX, Animal Traits, Non-ABO Universe, Snake Demon Lord WWX, Animal Traits, Hand Jobs, Seduction, Found Family, Wedding In The Cloud Recesses, Handfasting In The Cold Spring Cave, Alternate 3Zun, Alternative Sunshot Campaign, Hinted Future ChenLi, YZY is a better mother, JYL Is Not A Wilting Wallflower, empowerment, Side-Character Cameos, Rabbit Sanctuary In The Burial Mounds, Cutest Little Bun MXY, Accidental Child Acquisition, Child MXY)

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13. (First part added to itmf) But I’m looking for a modern au were even though jc’s family is rich they don’t give wwx and jc pocket money and they were hungry in front of a bakery? And wwx used the « orphan in the street card » and lwj bought him food

I don’t know if it’s the same one but I think at some point wwx bought lwj home while he was drunk and waited for lxc to come pick him up and jc saw them talking on the couch and he thought they were dating (they weren’t together yet)

ANYWAY thank you for everything ✨✨✨ @ihaveasoftspotfora-yuan

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14. Hi! for the fic finder please, there was a fic where lz read on a book abt the hannaki disease and he thought it beautiful so he started choking himself on gentian flowers to imitate the feeling @cocoaphil

FOUND? the sweet scent of their tragedy by HeavenlySkyfarer (E, 23k, WangXian, Angst, Cultivation Sect Politics, Depression, Hanahaki Disease, Language of Flowers, Love Confessions, Manipulation, Marriage, Mental Health Issues, Pining, Post-Sunshot Campaign, Rumors, Unhealthy Coping Mechanisms, Whump, Self-Harm, Bittersweet, Self-Blame, Canon-Typical Violence, Blanket Permission, Morally Gray LWJ)

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15. Hello, I am looking for a fic I read some time ago (it could be a few years). I think it was post-canon, Lan WangJi and Wei WuXian were together. LWJ gets cursed and the only thing he has in mind is killing WWX (since he sees him only as the big bad Yiling Laozu). At the end, WWX pretends LWJ killed him and the curse is lifted. It was posted on ao3. Thank you for your hard work! And have a great day!

I think I remember this fic! It starts out with WWX accidentally cursing LWJ with a talisman while they were in the jingshi and ends with WWX running to the burial mounds, finding out there are people who worship him living there, and he uses the incense burner to trick LWJ into thinking he killed him to break the curse, right? I can't recall the name though - Mod C

FOUND? all the broken things that I made by ilip13 (E, 43k, WangXian, Post-Canon, Established Relationship, Angst with a Happy Ending, Angst and Hurt/Comfort, Lovers To Enemies, (then back to lovers I'm not a monster), Dubcon Kissing, Dubious Consent, But mostly not in the way you might expect - see notes for details, Explicit Sexual Content, Bondage, Flirting, Competence Kink) might be this? I haven't read it yet, but the summary sounds like what they are looking for!

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16. Okay I could have easily dreamt this up but I could have sworn there was a fic where either LWJ or WWX was in a orchestra and his band mates thought he was married to wen qing because she was the one to always bring a Yuan to him after school or something only to think he was cheating when his actual husband comes by pls tell me I didn't dream this

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17. Hi! im sorry i lost a fic and i need help. It was an old wangxian fic, where LXC He's emperor (?) and LWJ is engaged to WWX, in this fic they get married and there are problems with the marriage because LWJ was a little bad during their engagement, since they were children. WWX was always trying to get his attention until one day he gave up. In the fic there is a part where Su She shoots WWX with an arrow and LWJ punishes him in some way.I remember it was also a Tumblr AU that later become a fic

NOT FOUND! rebuttable presumption by @sarah-yyy

NOT FOUND! Burning Bridges by Keysmashed (E, 12k, wangxian, arranged marriage, misunderstandings, pining, angst w/ happy ending, family drama, swordfighting, non-graphic smut, emotional rollercoaster, love confessions, everyone lives au) it’s probably not this one because su she is not in it and it’s not royalty but wx are engaged and wy does give up so even if it’s not you might like it

FOUND! permissive presumption by sarahyyy (G, 7k, WangXian, Royalty, Arranged Marriage, Pining, Mutual Pining, Misunderstandings) could also be permissive presumption by sarahyyy, on AO3, which is an AU of the author's fic on tumblr

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18. Hi! This is for fic finder. WWX is killed by SMS in sunshot campaign. He then resurected years later by MXY in JGS order. WWX and LWJ fight together. WWX hand is blackened i think. JGS refused to tell WWX what is MXY wish is. In last chapter, JGS is killed by JGY or Madam Jin and WWX is free from the curse. I think JGS death is because of NHS plot i think. Thank you! @idontknowwhattowriteforusername

Hi! I'am #18 from the latests fic finder. I want to add some details. Not much but i hope someone can recognize it. Jin Ling and Lan Jingyi was sent to Qishan either as a hostage or indocrination. In there, everytime they are punished, Wen Ning and Wen Yuan help them to make the punishment lighter. Sometimes they warned Jin Ling, Lan Jingyi, and other junior everytime other wen sect member (the one that didnt hesitate to punush them harshly) nearby. I think Wen Qing too help everytime the punishment is so harsh that caused injury, she make them stay in infirmary where they are safe

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19. Hello! I’m looking for a fic where mxy and wwx are a couple who take lwj home for a night in a modern AU. The beginning talks about how mxy and wwx looked so similar that when they first met they were worried they were related. Lwj is on the verge of being in love w/ wwx, but he’s hesitant to act on it bc of the relationship between wwx & mxy. Once he’s in bed with them there’s a line about red satin sheets for special guests. It’s such a specific premise but I couldn’t find it on ao3😭

FOUND? you and me alone by plonk (Not rated, 6k, wangxian, MXY/LJW/WWX, modern)

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20. looking for a fic from a prev ff or itmf, modern au, college/research lab? setting, abo dynamics. wwx and lwj participate in some scientific research study and get together in the process. iirc they are not in the same yr at college. i didnt manage to save it then but really want to read it, please help!!

NOT FOUND Pairfire by PaidSubscription (E, 65k, wangxian, NMJ/LXC, JC/NHS, WQ/MM, JYL/JZX, Slow Burn, Mutual Pining, Fluff, Relationships 101, Getting Together, First Time, Explicit Consent, Bordering on Kink Levels of Communication, Elements of Assigned-ish Marriage-ish, Non-Traditional A/B/O Dynamics, A/B/O With a twist, Because Cultivators CHOOSE Their Gender During This Course, After Trying Out All Three, It’s a Three Course Meal and WangXian’s Gender Acceptance is the Dessert, But Horny Pining is the Main Meal and the Most of the Snacks, Bottom LWJ, Bossy Bottom/Henpecked Top Energy, Everyone is over 21, Gender Choice Raises Issues for Most But I Promise Happy Endings + Everyone Comfy in Their Own Skin, Side Couple Aro/Ace/Agender Storylines)

FOUND! 🔒 I is for Instinct by beeswaxing (E, 71k, wangxian, LXC/NMJ, JYL/JZX, hualian, A/B/O, Alpha WWX, Omega LWJ, Scenting, Possessive Behavior, Getting Together, First Time, First Kiss, Public Display of Affection, Public Claiming, Good Parent LQR, Alpha YZY, Good Parent YZY, Family Feels, Fluff, Romance, Aftermath of Violence, Slice of Life, Modern, College/University, BAMF WWX, Soft Wangxian, Barebacking, Knotting, Semi-Public Sex, Shameless, Mating Cycles/In Heat, Mpreg)

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[joys-of-everyday]

On the fifty shades of morally grey

So quick thoughts on how MXTX writes morally grey.

Sorry, I mean, excessively long meta post on how MXTX writes morally grey. Light spoilers for all three books.

A gazillion caveats to begin with. Firstly, I don’t want to argue about whether character x is morally good, bad, grey, pink or whatever. In my books, arguing about whether someone is or is not morally grey is like arguing whether a colour is green, blue, teal, or turquoise – we’re arguing definitions. To add to that, I’m not saying that concepts like ‘this person is overall good’ doesn’t exist, but I would posit that a morally unquestionable person does not exist. Secondly, I also don’t want to pass moral judgements on any of the characters. That’s for a different post. I strictly want to focus on the storytelling techniques that make the reader think ‘hang on a second, are they good or bad?’. Thirdly, this whole post is mainly based on How Arcane Writes MORAL AMBIGUITY (9 Methods, 4 Rules) - YouTube. Great video, great channel (no knowledge of Arcane required). Would recommend if you are interested in story writing techniques!

1) The information gap and the poor narrator

Best example is Shen Jiu from SVSSS. We barely know anything about Shen Jiu. Almost everything we know is from SQQ’s notoriously unreliable perspective, so we’re left to fill in the gaps ourselves. Depending on exactly how those gaps are filled, you can get two completely different people. E.g. Did he have designs of NYY, or was he just ridiculously misunderstood? Who knows! We’re never told. Even if we were told, we should doubt it because it’s SQQ telling us.

2) 4D characterisation

Schnee’s video goes into this in more details, but this is where you build two narratives on top of one another. Best example is Jin Guangyao from MDZS. Is he an underdog who did what he could out of his situation and tried his best to be a better person working for the good of the common people? Or is he a selfish, manipulative, ambitious snake who at every stage pretends to be good in order to win the favour of those around him? The point is that both narratives make sense in the story. There are moments that lean more one way or another, but you can never quite pin him down completely.

3) Moments of weakness

Best example is Xie Lian from TGCF. On the whole, XL is a wonderful human being who you 100% want to root for. Except… there was that one time he made a mistake. He let his hurt and pain overcome him; he became hurtful himself. The point here is to add in just a few ‘moments’ which fundamentally impacts how the rest of the world perceives them from that point forwards. They are forever trying to redeem themselves, forever weighed down by what is a tiny proportion of their life. The underlying question is ‘is a moment of weakness a moral failure?’

Another good example is Qi Rong from TGCF. On the whole, he’s a piece of s***. But then there are moments when he’s a genuinely good father to Guzi, and that’s confusing.

4) Well-intentioned idiot

Trying to do the right thing and absolutely failing. Best example is Wei Wuxian from MDZS. His intentions are always good. There are extremely few moments where he is selfish or overly cruel. He is always fighting for justice, always self-sacrificing, always kind. And yet the outcome of his actions is pretty bad. The underlying question is ‘should you judge a person based on their intent, or on the consequences of their actions?’

(btw the name of the method is from schnee’s video. No shade on WWX. He is very smart… well, unless it comes to LWJ’s feelings.)

5) Excuses

Yes, they’re bad. But we feel sorry for them! Almost everyone fits into this boat, because doesn’t MXTX love trauma dumping? As one example, let’s look at Jiang Cheng from MDZS. JC’s behaviour towards WWX is pretty bad on its own. But given the context of his childhood being compared to him, of having his self-esteem brutally crushed by both parents? Knowing how much he’s done and sacrificed for him, how much he truly cared for him as family? It hits different.

A small point: ‘excuses aren’t enough’ we say a lot (and I agree, to an extent). But compare, for example, Jin Guangshan vs Xue Yang. JGS seems to be a power-hungry asshole for absolutely no reason. On the other hand, put XY in different circumstances and we feel like he might have been a better person. Just as food for thought, there was a Japanese monk Honen (1133-1212) who said: ‘The good person can reach the Pure Land, so of course the evil person can as well’. The point being that the people who struggle with anger and hate because of their circumstances are most in need of salvation.

6) World building and presenting hard questions

What is acceptable sacrifice in war?

Is it okay to make a super dangerous weapon for the sake of deterrence?

How much personal responsibility does someone hold for a lifetime of circumstances pushing them towards a morally questionable path?

What are the responsibilities of a leader – to do what is right, or to do what is best for their people?

The world of MDZS is imperfect. It’s full of horrors and disasters, as well as a mob of outsiders all trying to impart their opinions despite knowing little about the situation. An imperfect world presents unanswerable questions. We see the characters struggle with these questions, come to decisions, and make mistakes, all naturally arising within the complex world that’s been presented. 

TGCF does this most explicitly. We literally have Kemo and Pei Xiu arguing about the ethics of war and XL concluding that it’s a Hard Question. In fact, every backstory of every Heavenly Official presents a new Hard Question. I don’t know if I like this method over the more subtle style of MDZS, but I have Thoughts about the storytelling styles of both (long story short, I love them both for different reasons).

7) Worlds are colliding

A slightly complicated method that takes a huge amount of set up. To summarise, set up two arcs that we the reader both feel invested in. Then set up a point where the ‘good’ outcome of one is the ‘bad’ outcome of another. For MDZS, we have 1) JC and WWX’s brotherhood arc. 2) WWX standing up for justice arc. They’re both merrily developing all the way through the conflict with the Wens… right until the moment WWX has to make a choice: stand up for justice and leave JC behind, or to fulfil his promises to JC and turn a blind eye to the injustices against the Wens. The decision is a lose-lose scenario because of the way these arcs have been set up.

8) Spectrums, Spectrums, we love Spectrums

Gongyi Xiao is a cinnamon roll. As is Wen Ning and Quan Yizhen. Meanwhile, the Old Palace Master? Literally no redeeming qualities. Wen Chao? Absolute scum. Then there’s everyone lying somewhere in between. We like Lan Wangji more than JC (I think that seems to be the case for most people?) but we certainly like JC more than JGS. Having a spectrum of morality is important because it gives us reference points to contrast and compare. It also emphasises the moral greyness of everything, because sure, Mu Qing isn’t a noodle like Shi Qingxuan, but is he worse than White No Face?

9) Spectrums aren’t enough – adding depth

Almost all of WWX’s moral ambiguity comes from the fact he has hard decisions to make. And for each of these decisions, the outcome is murky. He developed a new technique to fight against the Wens, but at what cost later down the line? He defended the Wens and gave them a few years of life, but was it worth it?

Compare with JGY. JGY does a lot of good. He also does a lot of bad. The magnitude of both lists is ridiculous. Sure, you wouldn’t usually find someone who’s killed most of their family members in any way likable, but how often do you come across someone who literally ended a war?

So one way of creating moral ambiguity is to make each decision difficult, but another way to go about it is to just… make them do loads of things. Like loads of things. Good things, bad things, all the in between things. Judging each thing is not that hard, but then trying to judge the overall person based on it is extremely difficult.

10) Pulling from the real world

Often, moral questions in fiction is hard because (surprise, surprise) moral questions are just hard full stop. Idk enough Chinese history and culture to accurately pin down all of MXTX’s references, but things like stupid misunderstands leading to conflict, poverty and inequality, less than ideal family situations, the horrors of war… these are all things that happen irl. No matter how fantastical the setting, grounding moral conflicts in reality makes us feel more emotional and invested.

Anyway, I hope that was an enjoyable rundown! This is an imperfect list, so comments, criticisms, suggestions greatly appreciated!

[thatswhatsushesaid]

strangely enough I'm partway through the novel and so far I've felt way more like jgy is supposed to be Bad And Evil than I ever did watching the show? like in cql you get to know him before all that bad stuff happens and you see him as a tragic character who didn't really have another choice, but in the book it just seems like he's set up as a villain from the beginning. maybe I'll change my mind when I finish the book?

oh no, see, i do think that was rather intentional in the novel! i can't remember who wrote the particular piece of meta i'm thinking about (was it you @labyrynth?) but if i recall the post correctly, it explores how key information about jgy is revealed to the viewer and the reader in both versions of the canon. because you're absolutely right that in cql, we meet jgy as meng yao much earlier in the story, and he is presented to us in such a way as to engender a lot of sympathy and compassion. and then bam!! we find out all of the terrible awful no good very bad details about him via the empathy flashback episode.

in contrast, in the novel, once wwx and lwj begin to suspect that jgy is the one behind nmj's murder, we don't actually know much of anything about jgy beyond his role within the lanling jin, his close friendship with lxc, and his status as a war hero. there are lots of hints scattered throughout the text that indicate just what type of person jgy is once he comes into his own power (e.g., the watchtowers, the decade and a half of peace and safety that his tenure as xiandu ushers in), but these textual observations are blink-and-you'll-miss-them subtle, and i caught most of them on my second re-read. we aren't really hit with the motherlode of painful heartbreak about jgy's life and backstory until the guanyin temple confrontation is nearing its end, and it isn't until jgy is actually dead and sealed in the coffin with nmj's fierce corpse that we find out he was the one who gave jin ling fairy. and it isn't until the extras that we also find out that jgy rooted out political corruption within the jin sect to such an extent that no jin sect officials would ever have considered accepting bribes while he was sect leader.

the tl;dr version is that cql is intentionally set up to (on first viewing, anyway) say to the viewer, "you thought you knew who jgy was, but you were wrong to trust him." in contrast, the question that mdzs asks the reader at the very end of the novel is, imo, "you thought you knew who jgy was--but did you?" and, rather like lan xichen, who is left to wonder about the truth for the rest of his life, this question will never be answered.

[robininthelabyrinth]

My third prompt, which I just think would be Neat: He Kexin didn't die when lxc and lwj were young, and instead it was their father who passed away on a night hunt

A Significant Difference - ao3

Lan Qiren wouldn’t have thought that there was much difference between being acting sect leader and raising one’s nephews because your brother was in permanent seclusion and being acting sect leader as regent for one’s underaged nephews because one’s brother was dead, but apparently there was.

A significant difference.

He meditated on this difference for a while, then went to He Kexin precisely on schedule. It was the start of the month, half a month of time from Lan Xichen and Lan Wangji’s monthly mid-month visits, and it was the first time he had visited since he had broken his scheduled visits with his sister-in-law to inform her of her husband’s death. When he had done so, she had stared at him blankly, dull as if with shock. She had asked, firstly, how it had happened – the official answer was a night-hunt, and the true answer not too far removed from that, only the object of the night-hunt had been festering internally rather than pursued externally – and then, blinking rapidly, what that meant for her.

At the time, Lan Qiren had told her that he did not know, but that she should assume that nothing would change for the immediate moment and that he would inform her promptly of any developments.

He was fairly sure she had listened to him, but he was still cognizant of the fact that there were some differences in her demeanor when he arrived this time. She had been increasingly ill the past few months, her vivaciousness fading like the bloom come off a rose towards the end of summer, and although they had never spoken on the subject, Lan Qiren knew that her illness was not wholly physical, having more to do with the doctor’s too-blunt revelation that she was unlikely to bear more children to accompany her in her seclusion for a few too-short years than it did with any real disease. Now, however, she seemed both better and more anxious, which he could understand.

“Are you really going to make me go through the small talk first?” she asked as he started preparing the tea, and he sighed quietly to himself – He Kexin had never had much appreciation for etiquette, something his brother had found charming and which Lan Qiren had found irritating, finding her manner suggestive of a fundamental selfish disinterest in anything that got in her way rather than merely a careless desire to not waste time with that which seemed to her to be unimportant, the way it was for Cangse Sanren. Though perhaps he was simply biased in favor of the woman who was his friend, and who hadn’t murdered a member of his family and ruined his life.

“I am not,” he said. “But I would prefer to have some tea prepared in advance of this discussion.”

“Why? What’s the reason? Is it bad news?”

“There is no news. Nothing has changed since the last time we spoke, other than that I have investigated the impact of recent events on your situation and have come to you to hear your views on the subject before any decision is ultimately made.”

“Slow and steady, always contemplating,” she said, tone biting and scathingly provocative as always, but her shoulders relaxed. “Why the tea, then, if no decisions have been made?”

“I am making tea,” Lan Qiren said, rigidly controlling himself as always, “because l have observed that you like to have something to sip whenever you don’t want to respond to something I’ve said. I thought it polite to provide the option.”

As always, He Kexin looked taken aback by the notion that someone might do something for someone else when there was no benefit in it for themselves – for the longest time she’d been convinced that Lan Qiren had some sort of infatuation with her, and it had taken considerable time and effort to dissuade her from both the belief and her occasional attempts to take advantage of what she believed he felt. By now he was fairly sure that she had accepted that Lan Qiren genuinely disliked her, lacked any sort of attraction to her whatsoever, and that he would nevertheless advocate for her interests just as stridently as if he loved her, and yet he was also aware that to this day she did not understand why he would do such a strange and pointless thing.

At least she waited with more or less grace until the tea was ready.

“Well?” she asked. “Have your elders decided that I’m officially useless to them now that there’s no hope of any more heirs? Are they going to make me drink poison or order me strangled or something?”

Lan Qiren’s eye twitched. “You read too many novels. And before you ask, no, that isn’t a prelude to me cutting off your access to them.”

“You say that as if you didn’t cut me off from that traveling opera troupe I liked that one time,” she sniffed.

“Firstly, I did not cut you off from opera troupes in general, merely that one in specific. Secondly, I did that because it turned out that they were thieves and the entire purpose of the troupe was a means of gaining access to the Cloud Recesses to scout out our defenses.”

“Thieves or no thieves, they put on a damn good opera.”

Lan Qiren suppressed another sigh.

“The elders are not advocating for your immediate execution,” he said instead. “On the contrary, the situation has shifted in a material manner, which is why I wished to get your thoughts on the subject. If you are amenable?”

He Kexin pointedly took a sip of her tea instead of answering.

Lan Qiren wished that he could be petty and respond in kind, making it clear that he was equally willing to sit in silence for as long as He Kexin’s limited patience could hold out, but he was viscerally aware – he was never not aware – of the power dynamics that underlaid all of their interactions. However unwilling he might be, he was He Kexin’s jailor, and the power was always on his side. It was therefore incumbent upon him to keep his temper on a short leash and to be as obliging as he could be, no matter how obnoxious or deliberately provocative her behavior might be.

“I will assume that you are,” he said neutrally. “Although, as always, if you wish for this conversation to end, you may say so at any time and I will depart at once.”

He paused, but she said nothing – more desperate for company and news than disdainful of it, no doubt. He had tried several times over the years to find a way to allow her some company that she might prefer, perhaps someone of her own gender and age, unburdened by the history between them – someone other than the servants she disdained – but he had never had any success convincing the elders of the necessity. Even his own visits had been hard-fought victories, premised entirely on his insistence that to properly raise his nephews he needed the input of their mother.

It had never sat well with him.

“Very well,” Lan Qiren said, moving on. “With my brother’s death, the role of sect leader has now devolved unto Xichen, although naturally he is too young to accept the role. As a result, I am now officially regent in his stead.”

“Does that change anything?” He Kexin asked, and she sounded genuinely curious.

“It does,” he confirmed. “Before, my role was that of a temporary caretaker –”

“Temporary? For ten years?”

“For as long as it would have taken, yes. As long as my brother lived, he was Sect Leader, regardless of where he was or whether he carried out the duties of the position –”

He ignored He Kexin’s mumble of “Well, that’s bullshit”, even though he privately agreed with the assessment.

“– and as only a temporary caretaker, my ability to implement change was heavily prescribed by tradition, in order to forestall the risk that I seek to take advantage of my brother’s absence.”

He ignored this second “Bullshit!” as well, though he appreciated it.

“However,” he said, trying desperately to get to the point as quickly as his rigid manner could manage, “as regent, my status is different, and so is the scope of my jurisdiction. I have all the rights and powers of a true sect leader, able to implement my will on behalf of my nephews.”

“That distinction makes no sense at all.”

It did if one looked at the historical background behind each type of position, but Lan Qiren didn’t allow himself to be distracted by an academic debate He Kexin wouldn’t care about in the slightest.

“Regardless of how much or how little sense it may make, it means that I have more flexibility in arranging sect matters than I did before,” he said. “Including in regard to sect discipline and justice.”

He Kexin paused with her cup halfway up to her mouth.

“What does that mean?” she asked sharply. “Don’t talk around the subject. My fate was sealed long ago – if I leave this house or break my seclusion in any other way, I die. Is that not still the case?”

Lan Qiren looked at her steadily. “The sect leader has the ability to commute punishments for conduct that he was not involved in, as long as justice remains served.”

She exhaled. Hard.

“You have several options,” Lan Qiren said. “I could lighten the terms of your isolation, whether by allowing you more company here or by allowing you to live in the female quarters of the Cloud Recesses; as you know, men and women are separated here, with the exception of married couples. You would be permitted to see your sons more often – every afternoon, if you so wished.”

He Kexin pursed her lips. “What’s the catch?”

“That approach would only be a lightening of your original punishment. You would still be confined to the Cloud Recesses, and your sentence of execution would still be applicable should you ever depart from our home.”

“An expansion of walls,” she murmured, then frowned. “You said ‘that approach’. What’s the alternative?”

“I could change the nature of the punishment entirely,” he said. “I cannot simply lift it, you understand – you murdered an honored teacher, perverting the rules of both justice and hospitality, and no matter my sympathy to you in regard to the matter of not being permitted to see your sons, my nephews, that does not change what you did. You were wrong then and remain wrong now. To refuse to punish you would be for me to fail in my duty to my ancestors.”

“You’re stepping around the subject,” she observed. “That’s unlike you. What’s the second approach? What would the new punishment be?”

Lan Qiren took a breath, steadying his nerves. “Exile.”

He Kexin blinked, and then she started to smile. “Exile? You mean, leaving this place, never to return, that sort of exile?”

“That is correct,” he said, and before the joy had fully entered her face, he added: “Your sons would, however, remain here.”

Her smile faded.

“That seems unfair,” she said after a moment. “I’m their mother, after all.”

“They have already separated from you and entered the men’s quarters, and their surname is Lan,” Lan Qiren said, a touch censoriously. “They are the heirs of a Great Sect, with all that attends that. You cannot expect to simply take them with you as if you were the rogue cultivator you once were.”

Nor would he permit such a thing. Bad enough to have one Cangse Sanren out there, a rogue cultivator who took husband and child along with her to face whatever dangers there were out there by her side, but his nephews? He would rather die than risk them getting lost or hurt in a moment’s carelessness.

He Kexin tapped her cheek thoughtfully. “Would I still be able to see them at all if I took that option?”

“You would be able to see them outside the Cloud Recesses. Naturally we could arrange something in which I would escort them outside for the purpose of seeing you…assuming you were within reasonable distance.”

It wouldn’t be every afternoon, though. It might not even be every month, the way it was now – not unless He Kexin wished to live near the Cloud Recesses, which Lan Qiren assumed she did not.

He remained quiet after that, drinking his tea and waiting for her to think it over. He knew what type of choice he was presenting her with, and he disliked it, though he did not see any other path forward. For his nephews’ sake, he hoped that she chose the first option, or at minimum a delayed exile, choose to stay within the Cloud Recesses until her sons were of age, or at least a little older than they were now – that Lan Xichen and Lan Wangji might have the benefit of their mother for a little longer, and the way they should have had her all along, a constant presence rather than a rarely-seen figure hidden away. Even if it meant that he himself would have to suffer her presence more often, have to look upon the woman who had destroyed his dreams every day rather than merely twice a month, it would be worth it, for their sake.

Yet for her own sake, he felt he had to make her the offer of freedom now. For all that Lan Qiren saw himself firstly as his nephews’ guardian, then as a member of his sect, and only lastly as an individual, He Kexin was in a different situation. She had never wanted to marry his brother in the first place, and she’d borne two children as much for the company they’d given her as because she’d actually wanted them.

She was a person, not merely a mother. She was the one who had to make the decision. Lan Qiren could not decide for her, not even if he believed one choice to be better for his nephews than the other.

“If you would like to think about it for longer, you may,” he said. “Overnight, or even for a few days…”

He Kexin put down her cup with a definitive thunk.

“I’m not a slow plodder like you lot are,” she said, head held high and voice scathing as ever. “I know how to be decisive. I know what I want.”

Lan Qiren braced himself.

“Well?” he asked. “What have you decided?”

She told him.

[gravitywonagain]

so i plotted a thing in the shower the other day... idk if i'll write it or not, but i thought it might be fun to share :)

~ working title: Villains in my Mind Doing Time ~

lwj is a detective who only works cold cases (for Reasons that will come up somewhere in the narrative, probably). he’s almost a year and a half into his latest case when he gets a call from a maximum security prison. they say an inmate there has info on his case and wants to share it. lwj is, understandably, a bit skeptical — especially when he sees the 35 year-old inmate who is supposed to have info on his 50 year-old cold case — but he figures he can check the info after and something is better than the nothing he currently has, even if it does send him on a wild goose chase.

wwx, when lwj meets him, is handsome and well spoken, if a bit angry and… kinda weird? but that’s okay. all of these things are workable. so lwj sits down and — after a rather odd tangent about the sensory experiences of murder, some nonsense about being a medium but only for serial killers, and rambling regrets about starting with the most recent cases because it would have been much easier to prove he wasn't involved in murders he wasn't alive for yet — gets what he came for: the name of the murderer.

(wwx is actually a ghost magnet, of a kind. he attracts serial killers, like, from wherever. idk if his mind is the manifestation of some level of hell through which serial killers atone for their sins or something, i honestly have not thought this that far through, so just bear with me, here.)

lwj takes this info home to follow up on and finds that it’s both more and less than he was hoping for. the name wwx gave him is of a man who was close to the family, certainly, but who was dismissed as a suspect after his first interview. nothing particularly ties him to the case, yet he was also not a man who was discussed in the news where wwx might have stumbled upon his name. there is, lwj finds, some merit to the idea that this person killed at the very least lwj’s victim and in all likelihood — and if wwx is to be believed — several more people.

however none of this information is actionable. it is at best circumstantial, at worst some nonsense accusation from a man who is serving life in maximum security. and the man in question has been dead for several years leaving no living family behind.

lwj goes back to the prison.

wwx is pleased to see him again and even more so to learn that lwj actually believes him and wants to hear more. he shares what he knows, but mostly what he has is a head full of memories that are very difficult to get down on paper. he draws some things, but what lwj really needs, he realizes, is to actually go to the scene, go into all the evidence, speak with family and friends of the victim, etc. all of this will be easier and more fluid if he can just take wwx with him so that he doesn’t have to act as some intermediary between the evidence and the supposed ghost.

lwj still isn’t quite convinced he’s not being taken for a ride, but he’s willing to take the risk of letting wwx out on heavily supervised furlough for a better shot at finally cracking this case and giving the family some peace.

wwx agrees to go on the very strict condition that he be returned to the prison that night. lwj of course agrees to this — that was definitely already the plan — and off they go.

during the first outing, the two are able to get a little bit deeper into the mystery, but they are both quite aware that what they are looking for is going to have been long buried and many people are dead, don’t remember, or don’t want to remember. this is going to take more than one furlough. but, as wwx did not attempt to escape or harm anyone (nobody really expected him to, he’s been a model inmate despite the crazy talk and night terrors for years now), the warden agrees to let lwj take him out again and again.

it’s on the third outing that they run into some trouble and have to spend a night away from home. wwx is intensely worried, but they are able to find a solution with the local municipal jail, borrowing a cell for the night for wwx to sleep in while lwj sleeps at an inn. everything is fine. lwj, out of curiosity, asks the municipal jail for the video of wwx at night and finds out that wwx has horrible nightmares, screaming and flailing in his sleep. this follows if what wwx tells him about hosting the ghosts of serial killers is true, but it also follows if wwx actually has a violent past that he is atoning for in prison. they manage to get a bit more info the next day, but are sure to make it back to the prison that night.

unfortunately, the next bit of information is set to take them much farther away from the city. they will need to road trip out to a pretty small town to meet up with someone, taking multiple days just to get out there, and will probably need to stay multiple days to get the info they need. initially, wwx is adamant that lwj can do this one on his own. lwj, however, has grown to rely on wwx’s unique insight into this case and manages to convince him to come along.

they make a plan, calling up all the jails on their way out there to ensure that they can borrow a cell for the night — not allowing wwx to sleep with anyone else in the room. of course, on their way out there, one of the jails fills up for the night and they have to improvise. they book two rooms at an inn and wwx convinces lwj to restrain him, tie him to the bed — sadly, for non-sexy purposes — and to bar all the exits he can. this is not a foolproof plan… but it works. wwx and lwj both have a rough night of it, but wwx doesn’t escape, doesn’t hurt anyone, and doesn’t hurt himself (too badly). they decide this is an acceptable backup solution, should the need arise again.

the need definitely arises again.

one of the reasons they are out here in this remote area is because the person they are tracking down is slated to attend an art festival nearby. the town hosting the festival is small enough that the draw is not huge, but robust enough to handle the influx of tourism for the next few days. this also means that, when the jail inevitably fills up on their last night in town, lwj and wwx have to share lwj’s reserved room. of course there’s only one bed, this is fanfiction.

so lwj ties wwx to the bed. at this point, he’s mostly sure that wwx at the very least knows things about this case that he shouldn’t be able to know. he’s open to some sort of medium-ship, though uncertain as to what that might mean, entirely. and he is pretty sure that wwx has been requesting such specific sleeping arrangements because he is worried about keeping lwj awake with his night terrors. lwj accepts a bad night’s sleep in return for literally any sleep — they got what they came for but it’s been a long few days — and decides he’s going to sleep in the same room as a bound wwx.

the thing about security cameras in police stations and municipal jails is that they are in black and white.

lwj wakes to a room bathed in a soft red glow and fingers wrapped tightly around his throat. the voice coming from wwx is not the one lwj is familiar with after days and days spent working together, spent talking in the car, over lunch, on the phone. it is deep and guttural, then high and sweet, then laughing and manic. all the while wwx’s body seems to fight itself — not quite strangling lwj, but not quite letting him go either.

luckily, lwj is a strong dude. he manages to break free and subdue wwx. the red fades from wwx’s eyes as soon as they blink open again and wwx shrinks in on himself so deeply lwj isn’t sure he’ll ever find him again.

slowly, painstakingly, lwj is able to coax wwx into the same car as him so they can drive back. wwx is quiet and subdued the entire time, eyes flashing to the bruising around lwj’s neck so much he considers stopping to buy a turtleneck despite the summer heat. each stop goes more or less as planned, though one of the jails has to move some people around to accommodate, and they are clearly less than pleased to do so, but wwx plays up the crazy criminal affect and they make it work.

they’re maybe an hour away from home when wwx suddenly jerks in his seat, eyes rolling back in his head — fully white, not glowing red — and trembling like a leaf. lwj pulls off the road, uncertain.

when wwx gasps back to himself a minute or two later, he’s agitated, urgent. he insists that lwj turn the car around. another killer just died, he says, and this time he’s not too late. the killer died unexpectedly and left some victims alive. he never gets this kind of chance, he says, to make a difference, to actually save someone.

they’re close, is the thing. close to the city, close to finishing lwj’s case. and lwj, fresh off being strangled by a possibly possessed wwx, isn’t the most inclined to veer off the path that will lead him first to his very comfortable bed and second to possibly closing his case. and there’s the niggling fear that wwx, having felt freedom and now being very close to the end of it again, has created a ruse that he will use to ultimately escape.

but wwx is very convincing. and, lwj realizes, he trusts him.

lwj turns the car around and heads in the direction wwx leads him. and wwx is right. they get to the compound just in time to save a young girl from starving alone where she’d been kept. the local police ask questions and wwx ends up almost on the hook for this again, but his whereabouts have been very accounted for over the span of time the crimes were taking place. it looks like he might be charged with accessory again, but given that he was instrumental in saving someone, the local police are fine releasing him back to the prison. they know where to find him, after all.

but, of course, they now have to spend a night in a hotel on the way home.

this time, both of them contend with the added factor that is a combination of the sexual tension between them too long unresolved and the adrenaline high of rushing off to save a life and succeeding. lwj hasn’t been this close to action in a long time, and now (?) is when we learn that he had himself relegated to cold cases and only cold cases because his last imminent case saw him hesitating to fire just long enough to get the victim killed, then opening fire on the suspect in retribution. wwx shares that nobody had ever trusted him like this before, not even his foster parents who had him committed to a mental hospital at fourteen.

and with that kind of day, how can they not have sex about it? it’s sweet and intimate and both of them confess things that the other probably doesn’t believe, but under the cover of night, everything feels like a dream. they fall asleep in each other’s arms.

when lwj wakes, wwx is gone—

just kidding, he’s just freaking out in a corner because he actually slept all night for once and what the fuck does that even mean???

they make it back home — wwx to prison and lwj to his apartment. lwj settles the case, finally able to tell a nephew who killed his uncle and give that family some long awaited closure. wwx settles back in prison, chafing a bit at the loss of freedom and at the loss of time spent with lwj, but pleased he’s been able to make some difference for once. or even twice.

then the prison gets a call from lwj. lwj and wwx smile at each other over the table at which they first met, and lwj lays out several folders while wwx closes his eyes to listen to the voices in his head.

[neverdoingmuch]

the comedy of the whole 'lxc calls wwx lwj's biggest mistake' situation is the timing of it all. my man was absolutely in the right to be mad at wwx given the information he knew but the fact that it took like 13 years plus and an entire death to finally get the chance to express his opinion and then like five minutes later he receives new re-contextualising information. like what do you say??? whoops my bad bro, i guess you dont suck that bad?? also that fact that it was jgy, lxc's bestest of bestest friends, who did all that extra bad shit too. like that would be so painfully awkward sadfgrytuyt

[leatherbookmark]

ohhh so three months have passed since the guanyin temple and wgxn spent them just walking around, being whenever the chaos is, helping people, admiring the nature, enjoying new climates and customs, in blissful unawareness of the cultivation world news.

and how IS your honoured brother, hanguang-jun

[runespoor7]

I mean obviously I’m am going to ask you about chengxian, for the ask meme

What made you ship it?

It was the most interesting relationship in the book. I'm a sucker for childhood friends with broken promises, for grief, for misunderstandings over loyalty and love, and for relationships whose resolution in canon is bittersweet.

It still took some time and effort before I started really shipping it. I was theoretically open to shipping it but I hadn't yet read fics that really sold me on it (this was in 2019, I think). Then as an experiment I put a WWX-inspired character in the setting I was GMing for the JC and JYL NPC stand-ins to have him to play off of. Turned out I did ship them.

What are your favorite things about the ship?

😬

*wide, helpless, expansive gesture*

It's never simple with them. It's always fraught. They love one another but they also resent one another. Hunting demonic cultivators is about WWX still maybe being alive. Maybe JC can bring himself to kill WWX this time, or maybe he can find a way to bring WWX back home and forgive him. WWX promises to be with JC but he ends up promising that he won't stay ("like my father served your father") but he didn't mean it with an end. the mess that is the fraughtness of WWX's liminal space when it comes to his social rank.

love hurts, what hurts is love.

the fact that the one 'leading' is WWX, not JC, going against the accepted social order. (tbh, if that wasn't the case, I probably wouldn't be into the ship.) it paints such a picture of WWX being so charismatic, and JC being so taken with him, that JC falls into being WWX's sidekick. no wonder YZY was awful about it.

JC keeping Chenqing like a mad dog and keeping Lotus Pier WWX-safe. I. god. JC rating WWX's attention >>>>>>>>>>>>> JC's self-respect every time, in every way. Amazing.

it's incredible to me how WWX asks JYL about love in a scene framed in a manner to make it subtextually point in the direction of LWJ (it's mdzs; the canon pair in mdzs is wgxn; there are no - explicit - love triangles in mdzs; and yet even WWX's original crush on LWJ is, uh. informed by JC and how WWX is with JC and the fact that LWJ is New and Not The Son of WWX's Benefactor. this is normal.), where it's apparent that WWX is scared of being in love because it changes how you act, it's a limit, it's a cage, you're limiting yourself for someone else - and then WWX does something for JC that is everything he was scared of.

and it does ruin him! it's terrible! so his romance with LWJ is everything his feelings for JC weren't. He's not the one doing the protecting. LWJ doesn't question him. There are no expectations of anything, no discussions of the future, no thoughts of society. LWJ is just such a comfort, just a good thing WWX gets because he wants it. Also LWJ isn't emotionally taxing af (this is a big one). (WWX kinda ends up YZY-ing himself at the end of the book but I'm not thinking about that.)

WWX's utter toxicity toward JC. not a iota of respect for either JC or JC's boundaries to be found, except when convenient for WWX.

they both really, really believe that WWX is better than JC in every way. it's very cool

look. i'm a simple person. arrogant genius jerk/grumpy dutiful tsundere otp.

Is there an unpopular opinion you have on your ship?

I love the joke that chengxian isn't incest but both of them wish it were, but I think the only time one of them wished they were brothers was JC when he decided to sacrifice himself for WWX and he was lying in bed making morbid jokes. At least sacrificing yourself for your brother who is the better cultivator and can lead the sect would be simple. Forgivable. Good.

I also think they might grow to think of one another as brothers at some point post-canon, that's a sort of reconciliation that might happen, but to me it's key that during canon they don't know what they are to one another, they just know they're scarily, terrifyingly important, and there's no word for what they are to one another.

JC refused shixiong-shidi (in a shocking reversal of their normal dynamic, I think he forgot he did that and spent roughly two decades feeling insecure and weird that WWX doesn't call him shidi) and they can be nothing else, socially speaking. The love that dare not speak its name, if you would. And at that same time post-canon they could also decide that what they're to each other is that WWX used to be in love with JC, and maybe JC still is, and they're not brothers. Or maybe both! The point is, the definition of their relationship is uncharted waters and they never thought of each other as 'brothers' (much less called each other that).

2) WWX is incredibly bitter and resentful of giving his core to JC and that colors everything he thinks and says about JC afterwards, including after he's returned to life. Basically, he gave, and gave, and gave, and felt there was no gratitude, and he's unable to live the life he wanted, unable to reap the promises life made him, and JC isn't any more agreeable or tractable than before (less so, in fact!). It's not fair.

[least-carpet]

Pursued by lesser ghosts 😭😭😭😭 are they gonna figure it out. Let JC in there

Hello, anon! Perhaps I will also link Pursued by Lesser Ghosts for context, since it took me so long to answer this ask. (You do need an AO3 account to read it.) It's wangxian with left zhanchengxian. Left in the sense that both chengxian and zhancheng had previously occurred, and they have left Jiang Cheng behind! (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

In my heart, they figure it out, but I’m never going to write that because they are all in WILDLY different places and that would take... so long. This is partly what makes it interesting to rotate to me, because I think it’s a situation where the way any of the people involved would describe the facts in a relatively similar and nonchalant way, but their intellectual frameworks for the facts and emotional experience of the facts are so wildly disconnected that getting all three on the same page would be, uh, challenging. Rough character notes below.

Wei Wuxian:

Feels like JC should be mad at him, since he projects guilt about JYL already on to JC. additionally hates JFM’s treatment of JC but in total denial about both what the treatment means and how he feels about it. LWJ’s rejection and replacement of JC with WWX is going to trigger all of that BECAUSE it brings WWX's past understanding of JC into conflict with his current understanding of JC.

In the past, WWX’s JC feelings were positive; therefore any negative treatment by JFM had to be denied (and also Fixed by WWX).

WWX’s JC feelings are now negative, partly because of the projection and self-blame, and partly because of ongoing resentment about the core transfer (VERY traumatic plus the feeling like that degree of devotion and sacrifice was not reciprocated).

The emotional experience of REPLACING JC AGAIN is an experience that belongs to WWX’s childhood self, who loved JC and was extremely possessive and protective of him (the JZX beatdown was triggered finally by the insult about JC).

Also triggers memories of childhood > adulthood intimacies (some degree of sexual contact as teenagers that both of them “forgot about”).

WWX also terminally unable to leave shit alone, and now there’s a mystery about HIS HUSBAND and HIS SHIDI.

LWJ is just like “oh we had sex sometimes” but JC is a prude who doesn’t do that and only lets WWX touch him??? This is not a sufficient answer for WWX??? [meltdown]

CONFLICT CONFLICT CONFLICT KABOOM

Jiang Cheng:

I mean, Mr. Abandonment and Betrayal Issues got some feedback about what had happened, and that feedback was “it was duty, I never loved you like you loved me, let me go” (WWX) PLUS “now that the person who is better than you, who I really love, is here, I will replace you with him and never look back because you are Bad” (LWJ).

On one hand, closure! On the other hand, what if every childhood belief and fear about yourself all came true at once? Wouldn't that be fun? (I mean, the ones which had not already happened and left most of your family dead.)

Like he worked so hard to be good for love (root of childhood issues -> “if I am very good maybe dad will love me eventually and mom will finally be happy”) and this functions as proof that it has NEVER culminated in that love being returned.

I also don’t know how much he was aware of LWJ’s fixation on WWX before/during the time they were sleeping together. how blindsided he feels would change depending on that.

Also will blame himself for it (see childhood coping mechanisms… so abandonment by LWJ is “his fault” because he “should have expected it”).

He is. He is not doing so good. Genuinely bad to contemplate and I don’t know how you fix that, like, degree of damage.

He also Never Gives Up and JL is still alive so he’s not going to kill himself but like. it ain’t good.

Lan Wangji:

To me, this is the chewiest problem. Because he has these rigid categories of “good” and “bad” but is also missing a lot of information about what happened between JC and WWX (such as the fake fight/removal from the sect), he's made up his mind but it's based on incomplete information.

Also like, he's not particularly empathetic (so questions like “how would you feel if someone you unconditionally trusted accidentally killed your beloved sibling?” are ones he has perhaps never contemplated?)

IMO this intersects in a pretty ugly way with his canon sadism during the period he has a sexual relationship with JC. I would have to make some decisions about how bad that was, but I don’t think it’s good. I think JC goes along with it partly as a form of self-harm and partly because JC is under a lot of stress, touch-starved, and is genuinely pretty submissive in bed? But has no standards about it (healthy!) and doesn't know how to protect himself.

Initially this is fine to LWJ because it “doesn’t count” and “JC is bad” so LWJ doesn’t have to feel bad about how he treats JC.

But if it was a multi-year intermittent thing, I think that might change? Because I don’t think LWJ is actually that cruel, just inflexible and not great at people.

So they hook up semi-often and LWJ perceives JC worrying about JL, about YMJ, and to some degree about him (offers him salve for his scars, inquires semi-rudely about family, feeds him thoughtful vegetarian foods when around each other) and they get comfortable and sometimes they spend the night together and LWJ gets a lot less mean but not any better at talking…

But even as their behaviours change, LWJ’s mental model doesn’t, so when WWX returns, he just, like, ditches JC without any discussion whatsoever.

And he gets everything he thought he wanted!! And he’s happy about a lot of it but feels Weird in a way that he can’t articulate or explain.

So to get him to the throuple, his whole understanding of what they were doing with each other and what JC’s behaviour signified would have to change. On the other hand, he is now married to the nosiest and most determined man in the world and that man is going to ask him a LOT of questions.

He just has SO far to go. I think both WWX and JC at least understand that a loss happened, but LWJ hasn’t worked that out yet. He's feeling it, but hasn't been able to articulate it to himself because of how it conflicts with his beliefs.

So getting them all to kiss would be really hard work. I think they do, though!