#and while I'm reading orv and liking it a lot it feels like too much. too complicated. idk I don't feel like drawing for it right now

[meliohy]

.

[microwaving-tesilid-argente]

Honestly i have so much sympathy for Ailette and the way she mischaracterises Tesilid.

like i myself also fixate on certain parts of the story and extrapolate maybe a bit too much - although in my defence i've only read like half the story.

-but the same can kind of be said of Ailette? This Tesilid is having a new, currently-being-written chapter of his life. In fact she kind of has things even worse, because her characterisation of Tesilid is based off OG!Tesilid, but current Tesilid had his life and outlook irreversibly changed when they met aged 10. But they never really interacted enough afterwards for Ailette to realise just how much of an impact she made on him. She hasn't really had a strong reason to rethink her characterisation of him. Not to mention that she first read the book with her middle school reading comprehension, which. Probably coloured her interpretation for the worse, at least a little.

I really wish Ailette would go into more detail about her own experience as a reader, to really see better how she's viewing this world and its people.

Which paragraphs are the ones that she thinks defines Tesilid's character? (Mine is "I'm praying that they'll all fail the test and go home".)

Which are the ones that made her cry? (Mine's "Right... you're on the side of this world.")

Which are her favourite silly Tesilid moments that make her so fond of teasing Tesilid? (iliac bones)

Which are the ones that reverberate in her head and which won't leave her alone? (Mine is "Please... show me some of that petty mercy too.")

I feel like the fun part of these kinds of isekai story is that. Whatever reaction you had towards Tesilid, be it "wow what a cute kid" or "i'm going to cry, i need to wrap him in a blanket where the world can't hurt him anymore" or "actually he should just destroy the world tbh i would support him", she's been there first and has been doing for at least 10 years, she's the OG. And she's super intense about it too. Like she can say "I need to save him because the story dictates it" all she wants, but the way she reacts so intensely and immediately to Tesilid in danger really speaks volumes of how much emotional investment she has in this guy. Like idk if she really rotates him in her head as much as I do - that might be a me problem - but if you rotate a character in your head enough times while fixating on certain moments and not others, you probably would end up with a biased interpretation of the character. Especially if you don't have someone else to bounce ideas off. And this gets worse if you're actually living in the character's world, because characters in stories serve certain narrative functions, so all their actions which get included in the narration are inherently biased towards portraying them in a certain way that serves said narrative function. But humans are a lot messier and more dynamic.

i just. shakes her up and down. love the concept of an isekai protagonist and the OG protagonist that they love so much.

anyway this whole post is a testament to how much Omniscient Reader's Viewpoint changed the way I interpret fiction and especially isekai stories. Not me anthromorphozing Ailette as if she's really a person and fellow fan who exists and isn't a character lmaoo, i'm definitely not having a "we're all fragments of kim dokja" moment, no sir. i definitely didn't subconsciously draw connections between ORV's isekai'd MC and myself and S-Class Heroine's isekai'd MC and our commonalities as readers who rotate the same story in their heads very many times, and suddenly make a realisation that's actually more relevant to ORV than the actual story that prompted all this. one whole year after i last read ORV, because ORV's story is So Much and so monumental that i'm still haunted by it and figuring it out and it lowkey never left my mind, even after a whole year. (please read orv.) like there are a lot of otome isekai stories about isekai'd MCs realising that the people in their lives don't line up with the OG characters, but none of these stories ever made me viscerally realise what it was probably like for kim dokja, because none of them had isekai'd MCs be that unironically obsessed with their OG protags, and more importantly none of them made me constantly rotate the OG protagonist in my head the way S-Class Heroine does. Han Sooyoung was right, you get as much out of a story as you put in to reading it and re-reading it and re-interpreting it. By putting so much time into S-Class Heroine I accidentally made some relevations about the other story that I was always trying to figure out at the back of my mind. Holy shit.

[the-music-maniac]

I'm relatively new to ORV, I got into it a while back and then ran out of time to continue (the novel is long AF lol) but as I'm getting back into it, I've realized that ORV is one of the most main character centric fandoms I have ever encountered before.

And tbh I think that's why I've been having so many issues getting invested in ORV fanworks. Specifically shipping ones. It's super rare for me because usually I love reading fanfics.

Before I start talking about my thoughts I just wanna make a disclaimer that I'm not trying to attack anyone. You should interact with media and create stuff however you wish to! Lord knows that I'm not exactly unbiased about my blorbos (I would die for them and you can tell from my posts) but I just kinda wanna talk about this because it's such a unique experience. Never before have I encountered a fandom that is so centered on one character.

Like I hope y'all know what I'm talking about and that I'm not just talking out of my ass. Everything in the ORV fandom is super Kim Dokja centric. On one hand, I really do get it, he's a great character. He's not my favourite character but he's a lil rat bastard and I think he's so fucking neat. And how centred the storyline and moreover the people in the story are on Kim Dokja is to a certain extent, canon. He's their leader and also the person keeping them safe. He's the one who reached out in their darkest moments and pulled them to the light. And he's a traumatized little bitch. Oof. A certain amount of hero worship and protectiveness is valid.

What I can't really wrap my head around though, is the lack of development between other members of the group in a lot of fanworks. This is specifically fandom interpretations of the characters btw, I haven't finished the story fully, so I can't speak on how they are canonically but I have seen people's stories and thoughts. And this isn't always the case of course, I have read fics before where our protagonists all appear to have relations with each other outside of their care for Dokja but it... wasn't as much as I was expecting. Which is weird to me because ORV is super good at writing like. Well written and thought out characters that would be super fun to play with in writing. In developing connections and care for each other - creating a found family. At the beginning they're all tied in by the need for survival and circumstance, they don't even necessarily like each other, and so of course they all gravitate to Dokja, that's to be expected, that's who they're familiar with. But eventually I expect they would learn to care about each other too, y'know? It's difficult to not get to know each other when you're living together daily, fighting alongside each other to survive. I don't believe that they wouldn't develop care for the other members of the group, and people who care about each other don't tend to genuinely threaten each other anytime Dokja gets hurt, especially when it's not anyone's fault - like usually it's in response to one of them "not doing enough to protect him" which makes no sense to me. You don't guilt trip people you care about for things outside their control. Moreover, Dokja is his own person - he will do what he will do and you can try and prevent it because you care about him, sure, but it's also unreasonable for others to expect anyone to be his keeper enough that they get angry when Dokja gets hurt due to his own actions or to situations outside of their control. People in general also don't have their entire character and world centered on loving one person. There are fics I've read where all the characters don't even seem to have any hobbies outside of spending time with Dokja, and I say this because they all literally fight, tooth and nail, over Dokja's time. It feels out of character to me. And yet this characterization is also so common???

I don't usually mind fics that so clearly have a bias towards one character because it's valid to write what you wanna see, but I think it's how saturated the fandom is with those types of works that makes me feel weird. It makes me stop seeing all the characters as individuals in their own right. Having no wants or needs or hobbies outside of Dokja makes it seem like they're just accessories to the story of Dokja's life. The story itself becomes less compelling to me, because it becomes less of a narrative of how Dokja has helped these people and their responses, and more of a world that bends over backwards to worship this one character, using all the other characters as tools to do so. Because if this is meant to convey gratitude and love, its illogical to how it usually works. Specifically in that, you don't lose your own identity or your connections to other people because of it. And I find it hard to interact with this level of saturation of those tropes because at a certain point, I start losing sight of the canonical writing of these individual characters as their own people. I start losing the idea I have in my mind of their canonical personalities. And I don't like that feeling. And because Dokja also isn't my favourite character in this story - I still like him, don't get me wrong - I start feeling indignant on the behalf of all the other characters that are not getting development BC of the concentration on Dokja.

I also don't like it when the banter goes away. Like you can care about people and still enjoy messing with them, I'm not sure why caring about dokja translates to hero worship??? I annoy my friends all the time, and they do it back. It's fun. Like that thing the group does where they can't see Dokja's face and just unanimously decide to tell him he looks bad when he asks about it? That's peak friendship. Peak messing with your sibling energy. As far as I've seen Dokja isn't self conscious about that either (then again I haven't read the entire story yet), so like. What gives? It's canonical that they mess with Dokja - but a lot of fics just get rid of that element.

I also find it especially hard when it comes to shipping, specifically Joonghyuk and Dokja. The reason why I love Joonghyuk and Dokja's dynamic so much in the first place is because they view each other as equals. It would be very easy to place either Joonghyuk or Dokja onto a pedestal - but they don't do that to each other. They know each other pretty damn well and they care about each other even though they're so in denial about it. And you know that thing they do where they act like the other is the worst person in existence and then negates it all by repeatedly devoting themselves to saving them? That's my shit. That whole "you're so fucking annoying but if you died I would kill everything in this room and then myself." The whole "what was that?" "Affection." "Disgusting. Do it again." THAT SHIT. I love that about them. And like the platonic relationships, a lot of shipping works get rid of that type of banter when they shift to a romantic relationship. Like yeah, sweet talk and honesty is important. You should let your partner know you love them. But that's not gonna be all there is. I don't see a need to get rid of the banter because as the story goes on, it's clear that even in canon, eventually the harsh words they say to each other stop being genuine because their actions negate the words. They don't mean them in the first place, so why would that banter change once their care shifts from a platonic to a romantic one? And I could perhaps be okay with that shift from banter to sweet talk if it was MUTUAL, but too often I see a situation where Dokja continues to insult Joonghyuk but he doesn't return it in kind. Joonghyuk is very blunt about his love for Dokja - which is good - but Dokja doesn't do the same back, and for some reason that's fine, and then Joonghyuk also no longer has those very human moments of annoyance when Dokja does some stupid shit. Like I guess I could understand the characterization of Dokja being emotionally constipated cause he's kind of a traumatized control freak and I can see how getting him to talk about his feelings is like trying to get a cat into a bathtub, but it's not like Joonghyuk isn't also like that? It's not really as much of a compelling relationship if one person is telling the other everything, giving care in words of affection and the other person isn't returning it. And you could depict that returned care in other ways, absolutely, but again I don't see it in other ways either, because those stories are still so Dokja centric.

Another factor is that I find that I can't really like a ship in a work where one of the characters is elevated to a point where they can't do anything wrong. Where their own needs are always at the forefront and their partner is always catering to it. Like a relationship is a give and take. We focus a lot on Dokja's trauma - which I love, that man needs sO MUCH THERAPY and it's an interesting topic to explore - but we don't focus on the amount of shit Joonghyuk has had to go through. I very rarely see a shipping fic where Dokja tries to address Joonghyuk's trauma or his hurt. Physical hurt sure, maybe, but that other shit that Joonghyuk bottles up?? Never talked about. My man has had to keep living lives over and over again. Has had to see people he love die, make hard choices. There is no way he's not traumatized to shit, and I'd like that to be a focus some of the time, y'know? Moreover, of all people, Dokja would be the one to understand him the most? One, he's the only one who really knows the whole truth about Joonghyuk, or as much of it as you can, and two, they both have taken on very burdensome leadership roles in a situation where few would be able to understand their position - it makes sense for them to lean on each other mutually, and so far there's a very prominent skew, only an exploration on one side.

And I pretty much haven't seen a shipping fic with Dokja and Joonghyuk where Joonghyuk has recieved any form of platonic comfort from the other characters. I've seen plenty for Dokja. Where he gets comforted/helped by both Joonghyuk and all the other characters. But not for Joonghyuk. If y'all have any recs where Joonghyuk has that, PLEASE recommend it because I need. And sure, it can be argued that Joonghyuk is a hard man to know considering his prickliness but regardless, he DOES have canonical platonic relationships. People who care for him. Who would be protective over him if he were to get hurt. That is not something only Dokja has, and yet it's something I only ever see written for Dokja. Y'all need to remember that technically Dokja doesn't act like any less of an asshole sometimes than Joonghyuk. He's more outwardly approachable sure, but he's not necessarily sweet 100% of the time - he has grit and he's a rat bastard and that's my FAVOURITE FUCKING PART ABOUT HIM. The fact that he's a rat bastard and the fact that not everyone likes him. His interactions in a world where he does have to make hard choices or say things that put people at odds, or hurts others when he didn't mean to. I love that about Joonghyuk too. They suck and they both have so much capacity to be kind despite all the shit they've gone through, but they're not able to see that in themselves and they do bad things because they have to, and I think they're so fascinating.

Y'know out of all of this, I think what cracks me up is, knowing Dokja's character, he would be absolutely appalled at how centred all of it is on him only. Like. Like that's literally the opposite of what he wants 🤣🤣. Like I get that makes people want to do it more because he deserves it and whatnot which is valid but like. He would be quite disgruntled 🤣🤣🤣

[absolutebl]

Hi, absolutebl.......Do you mind if I ask you some random thing? I used to love shoujo/josei manga and het romance kdrama equally....But ever since I found BL manga 3 years ago, my interest in shoujo and het romance decrese a lot, and what I search for is just the dynamic between mc (male) and male lead...I don't want to read or watch mc (female) and male lead or mc (male) and female lead...

What do you think happen to me? (Sorry for this weird ask)

Really love your blog....Thank you so much, for sharing your BL analyses, reviews and recs. I learn a lot from you. Some of my fav BL series, I found them from you.....Thanks.....

Do you mind if I ask again for BL recs? Because I know here are users that did not want to receive different asks from the same person.....

Also, have you watched dmbj or read orv? Both series based on a novels that have very strong bromance vibe.....

Do you know that sotus, manner of death and 2together are adapted into manga? Before I found your blog, BL that I read are from manga and manhwa, and I was surprised when I knew that the series above are from thai drama (I know the manga first, sorry).....

Last ask, what do you think about BL or GL that make it better than het romance? Do you feel that too?

Sorry for this very long ask, if you mind, I will not ask again......Hope you have a wonderful day.....

Honestly I don't know. But I can say it happened to me with manga a very long time ago. I switched from reading bodice rippers to yaoi and pretty much stopped reading anything het romance after that. (I still read scifi & fantasy that's not primarily romance, although not as much as I once did.)

Fortunately for me, the M/M self publishing revolution, and then BL, came along.

That said, I did pick up Kdramas (via Kpop), and they are now the only het I watch.

I've gone through phases where yaoi or m/m or BL was ALL I was consuming for a couple years. And then just stopped. Stared reading more widely for a while. (I'm making the comparison with books because I have never had the opportunity to do this level of obsession with cinema before, there has never before been enough on screen queer romances for me to just watch those and nothing else until 2020. Now there is.

Honestly, I don't know why this happened or me, or anyone else.

To understand why we like a thing, let alone obsesses or fixate on a thing, is so complex. Maybe it's because I come out of kink but I've learned to just go with the fetish... as it were.

It's like trying to understand why you like a particular dish, song, fashion, color, painting, architecture, even a plant or animal. I mean we can come up with explanations, flavor profiles, childhood formation of taste, family backgrounds, and so forth. Or academic analysis to do with disenfranchisement and the psychological appeal of narrative and beauty.

But sometimes often we like a thing because we like a thing.

I know, for humans, the "why" is our most powerful question. (Marketing also knows this, incidentally.) One of the reasons we tell stories AT ALL (to ourselves, to others, around a campfire in ancient times) is our search for the eternal why. It gave us mythology. It gave us religion.

But sometimes, especially with art, I feel like it's better just to dwell in wonder and grey spaces. The awe and the enjoyment itself, without understanding, it part of the experience.

Worship at the church of BL? Is that what this is? Maybe?

Some kinda thoughts anyway?

Generally these narratives provide a sense of comfort. Perhaps our love is something to do with characters who normally struggle (and usually are marginalized, tortured, killed and/or miserable) getting their happy evers? Perhaps it's because it's pure fantasy in terms of relationship. (I think for a lot of straight women there is something profoundly alluring in a gay relationship that they had/have no chance of every experiencing or being part of, the otherness itself is part of the appeal.) Perhaps its the lack, we never before had enough content to get obsessed over it to this level. (Let's not talk about the number of times I rewatched Latter Days after I got it on DVD, okay?)

I mean it's worth putting yourself through a thought experiment. Write down a list of ten things you like about BL that make it differnet from other kinds of media.

But you may find it's just like "why do I eat at Wendy's instead of Burger King?"

Because I like it better. They do the thing I like. (Spicy chicken sandwitch, FYI).

Perhaps it's something more profound, a kind of narrative sexual identity. It's the thing you desire. Then again, I'm pretty fluid in my desires, so I am comfortable with the idea of being attracted to different people at different points in my life. Just like being into different kinds of media at different times in my life.

I wouldn't worry about it if I were you, so long as:

It's not to addition level (damaging your emotional/financial well being)

You're comfortable with the notion that your tastes may change again

Other Questions

Do you mind if I ask again for BL recs? Because I know here are users that did not want to receive different asks from the same person.....

I am always happy to give out BL recs! The more specific the better. I consider it my primary service to humanity, at this juncture.

Also, no offense but I get so many asks from so many people I rarely remember who's asked me stuff before. Unless you have a very notable icon or style of writing, or interact with me regularly in comments & DMs. My memory is CRAPTASTIC. And I run multiple social media accounts several of which have much higher volume interactions than this one. It's not you it's the law of Dunbar's number. The human brain only really has the capacity for 150 social connections. And frankly, I don't know if I can manage even that many anymore.

Also, have you watched dmbj or read orv? Both series based on a novels that have very strong bromance vibe…..

Nope. I don't watch bromances if I can help it. Too much actual kissing these days to distract me, and I am one of those who wants some kissing for my queers.

Do you know that sotus, manner of death and 2together are adapted into manga? Before I found your blog, BL that I read are from manga and manhwa, and I was surprised when I knew that the series above are from thai drama (I know the manga first, sorry)…..

Yes and Yen Press picked up SOTUS for the USA print market. I'm hope to read that someday. I haven't tried MoD or 2g. I tend not to read reverse adaptations in general, not sure why. Also, I went off manga when it went primarily online. Never even experienced the manwha revolution. I'm old school enough to not enjoy graphic media scrolling. I miss turning pages "backwards" and getting amused my misstranslations.

Last ask, what do you think about BL or GL that make it better than het romance? Do you feel that too?

I don't like a value judgement like "better" on pop culture. I would just say "I personally enjoy it more" so I guess "better for me" would be how I might put it?

In my case? I think it's primarily that I spend so much of my life with little to no queer romance in it. And I mean modern romance all sappy and happy and cheesy and safe. It's just pure joy to have it available to me in such volume on my screen with such pretty trappings, flawed as it may be.

But also.

I just like it.

[lee-hakhyun]

Hi! I really want to write a fanfic about lee hakhyun but I’m a bit nervous about characterizing him (I’ve only read a bit of the side series but I’ve be been spoiled a lot) do you have any advice ?

first of all. thank you thinking about writing lee hakhyun!!

i'm not a writer, so it's a bit hard for me to characterize him.. but i'll list a few things i noticed/think about him (clouded by my own interpretation of him, ofc)

it feels like his reactions get more intense whenever the conversation relates to his own stories (be it his older stories or orv). he clearly takes pride in his work,,

but at the same time, he's somewhat ashamed of his early web novels. they're probably not bad, seeing as he had fans.. it's just not what would have gotten popular.

he's. a genuinely good person. and by 'good' i mean he cares for people, without expecting anything back. but at the same time.. he takes this too far.. disregarding his own safety to protect others

...and with that he's similar to kdj, which is pointed out many times by his companions. but the difference is, while kdj highly prioritizes his own companions to the point of not caring about others, lhh doesn't do that, instead working to make sure as many people as possible survive.

he's gotten his success with orv, but it feels like he's still unsatisfied with life. his trauma being that he's 'empty', he's had a completely normal life, but it still doesn't feel enough for him.

his relationship with kim dokja is similar to kdj's own with yjh, to a lesser extent. he used kim dokja's story to survive, and compares himself with kdj a lot, though he disagrees on the ways he did things sometimes. and lhh also uses yjh...

he does not want to take control. his goal when he found out he transmigrated wasn't to take control like kdj, but to be subservient to kdj/yjh. relating to this, it seems like he really shows his weakness whenever he's faced with kimcom. when he meets kim dokja, he starts to doubt his own ability. when he meets yoo sangah, he breaks down and asks for help. when he meets han sooyoung and she tells him to back off, he wants to. him being okay with possibly dying to guarantee jung heewon's safety..

lies. he lies so much, be it to himself or others. he's not doing it maliciously, it just seems to be natural for him. and it's about his status as an author of orv.. it's like he can't call himself the author because he doesn't fully believe it himself. even in the original kim dokja's banquet, while ji eunyu puts her tag as [genius editor] lee hakhyun writes [■■■] instead of his actual name or title.

if you end up finishing that fanfic, send it to me. please. i would love to read it!

[metanarrates]

What you wrote about letting the Poster in your mind die struck a cord in me. Lately when I'm writing I can't help but censor myself & add a tone of irony to it & lampshade cliches. Do you have any advice on how to write earnestly? Do you have any favorite media that is written with sincerity you would suggest?

my opinion is that if you're trying to cut out your own urges to be ironic and detached DURING the process of writing, you may end up overly scrutinizing your writing while it's happening, and that's usually what gets you too trapped in your own head to even get many words out. my advice is to simply let it happen in the first draft of whatever you come up with, and then have it be one of the things you look for while going over it in editing. ask yourself when you edit: am I saying what I actually want to say? am I being ironic for a reason, or is it because I don't know how to write anything else? can I try to do something less ironic? if I feel like I want to write something funny, can I come up with jokes that aren't "hey look at this cliche?"

above all else, when editing your own work, I find it valuable to think about whether this is the sort of story you really want to tell. if you feel passionate about it, why do you find it necessary to censor yourself? and if you find that you don't feel passionate about it, maybe you should restructure the work to make it more enjoyable to you. of course, not every scene in a story is fun to write, and not every moment of irony or lampshading is necessarily a bad thing. but if you find that irony is becoming a major habit in a work, it might be worth thinking about whether or not you're actually enjoying your own story.

as for the sincere media - most good media is very sincere! i actually think irony poisoning is the exception rather than the rule, though it is common enough in big blockbusters and the like that I do feel I have to complain about it. I would say most works I've read and enjoyed have been quite sincere. there's good stuff out there if you look.

that said, the works that come to my mind as being particularly upfront in their sincerity are:

mob psycho 100 - you've probably heard of this one. middle schooler with psychic powers and a severe case of emotional repression dispels a lot of ghosts with his con artist mentor and also figures out how to be a more well-adjusted person. mp100 has had a LOT of very eloquent reviews, so I won't say too much about it. it's just an extremely funny and shockingly emotionally resonant work.

witch hat atelier - absolutely gorgeous manga about a little girl who becomes an apprentice witch after discovering that magic is not exclusive to those who were born witches as she thought, but instead a teachable skill that has deliberately been kept in the hands of a few. the art in this is stellar, and its moments of horror are just as well-captured as its moments of gentleness. one of the themes of witch hat atelier is the beauty of art/magic and the joy an artist finds in its creation, and the artwork of the manga REALLY reinforces this theme. it's beautiful to look at and there's a quality of sincere love for both the work itself and its audience that suffuses the manga. though I will give a general tw for child harm - another major theme of the story is the responsibility adults, particularly teachers, have towards children, and this theme necessitates showing the ways that children can be harmed by teachers, as well as showing the ways that a good teacher can affect a child. it's very good!

omniscient reader's viewpoint: this one is LONG (over a million words) but is a great example of what I would call "post-cringe." a guy ends up seeing the events of his favorite fantasy-apocalypse action novel be recreated around him, and is determined to survive in this world where only he knows everything. one of the most charming things about orv, to me, is that the novel read by the main character is pretty obviously "cringe." it's a badly written escapist webnovel that is sometimes overly edgy, relies a lot on clichés, and can be very dense. the story points out sometimes how facts of the novel's world are kind of stupid or contrived. and yet, our protagonist loves that novel, and the story VERY much validates his love of it. despite him having at times a little bit of that ironic detachment towards the novel he loves, it's always clear that he thinks the cool monsters etc. are The Shit and that he is enthralled by the events playing out around him. the writing leans into how cool its setting and set pieces can be. hell, one of the big themes is how a story, no matter what kind of story it is, can mean everything to the reader who loves it. it's a good example of a work that can poke fun at its own clichés sometimes WHILE still loving those cliches and wanting the audience to enjoy those exact clichés.

again, there's a lot of good stuff out there! these are just my picks for having notable sincerity. if you read a lot, chances are that you will find a lot of great, earnest work. personally, I would recommend figuring out what genre you enjoy reading or watching, and then trying out some highly rated works in that genre. it's a great way to try out shit you haven't tried before! I would also recommend trying out stuff from 15 or more years ago, generally, if you're looking at more mainstream novels, movies, and TV series rather than specific genre fiction. the irony poisoning problem wasn't so prevalent then.

hope this helps!

edit: I FORGOT EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE. please watch eeaao, it's a deeply sincere and whimsical piece of art

[yellowocaballero]

literally shrieking. i stumbled on ur 100k stephanie brown fic by complete chance, loved it, found your tumblr only to discover you are also READING ORV??? THE SERIES EVER????

god. have so much fun. have so so much fun. i cannot wait to see what you come up with for the series

HAHA YUP. I'm 80% through I swear to God I'll finish it. I just found out some choice facts about the Secretive Plotter and my brain is breaking. It's definitely The Most Thing Ever. Every time I open it it's like getting blasted by a fire hose of parental abandonment and alternate timelines.

I'm facing a problem I've had before, which my brain very much wants to write something for it, and I have plenty of ideas, but absolutely none of them are good. If the inevitable orv fic isn't incredible I'm committing seppuku. It feels stupid to have no good ideas for orv, which by the logic of orv can hold almost any idea there is, but hitting the characters right is fucking difficult and you have to hit a hard balance of hitting exactly like orv while also being better (or just differently) structured than orv. I don't want to write it just like orv, but if I don't then there's no point. Maybe likely nothing'll get written because I'll be too perfectionist about it.

Relatedly, now I'm reading a lot of other #gamer manwha. And I finally found another one which matches up to orv for me, which is SSS Class Suicide Hunter. It's not a hydraulic press to the skull like orv but in many ways it's better done. That was probably the hardest I've cried at a work of fiction since I was a teenager. I won't write fic for it, it's like painting on the Mona Lisa, but Jesus it's incredible. If you're an orv fan check it out. If you aren't hyper-familiar with Buddhist philosophy you'll miss a lot, though.

[unpretty]

Hi, did you read all of omniscient reader's viewpoint? I've hit the transphobia bs (with the pink kids) and i can't tell whether it's gonna keep going (the fact they keep misgendering the character and the whole "he can be rehabilitated" bs is not a good sign), and I'm sorry for asking you but idk anyone else who might have read all of it 😅

Btw i am SO intrigued by astielle, those quotes you asked for were extremely effective. Also i would die for your excel fic. I show it to all my friends. I have romantic feelings for it.

there is a lot of weird gender stuff happening in orv but the final layer of gender weirdness through which all else must be filtered is that, if you are reading a translation from korean into english, the translator picked gendered pronouns based on vibes. even when it made no sense to use gendered pronouns. it often seems like they default to 'he' unless something happens that would make that gay. sometimes they would go back and change the pronouns based on what happened later. i think one time they gave an angel 'she' pronouns just long enough to no-homo before going back to 'he' for what i must assume are also no-homo reasons. their determination to use 'he' pronouns for gods, eldritch horrors, little girls, and anyone kim dokja happened to find confusing was. well. it was something. spoilers after the cut

the stuff with the pink kids is cringe as hell BUT. iirc by the end of that little mini side arc it becomes pretty clear that while the pink kids are basically a video game catfishing gang, kim yongpal wasn't there to catfish or do crimes, she just wanted to fit in and they were the only ones she could fit in with. by her last appearance she's referred to as a woman and the translator gets their shit together wrt pronouns. kim yongpal's last appearance is in chapter 161 out of 551 so my memory isn't GREAT, and i'm pretty sure hsy and kdj continue to call her 'ahjussi'. which sucks but so do they. regardless of whether i'm giving that segment too much leeway due to translator issues, it's thankfully relatively brief.

anyway. this is not the last time gender fuckery is going to come up, but the character who is introduced later on is MUCH more obviously trans. in that case it's sort of a plot point that kdj, despite literally everything that has happened up to that point, cannot stop himself from thinking that he knows what people are really like because he read the novel.

there are other things on account of the constellation who likes to change gender exists, but i don't recall anything else being as egregious as the pink kids

[your--isgayrights]

re: that ask about barthes/hsy. I feel like it's not an outright framework against the traditional constructed system of classifying media but rather a critique about how it's not always best to solely rely on the author's intentions but rather a mix of both(like not all interpretations are gonna be correct as well too, like you said thats delusion)? and honestly it's interesting because orv also sends the message to not be overly reliant on escapism. This ain't even an ask lmao idk where i'm going with this but yeah

Yeah you're probably right I'm not really a theory expert so my experience of death of the author definitely isn't in directly trying to interpret Barthes' assertions but like seeing how other people have interpreted/applied his framework in their own works. Like I think because I'm a fandom guy and not an academia guy I see a lot of people misinterpreting death of the author or applying it to their experience of like commercial lit/storytelling. I will say tho I am like a mega liberal in terms of what I consider 'literature' because I think folk/pop literature is really special and important to me. Took a lit class once where I argued that a gas station receipt is literature.

That being said I def get that Barthes' in context is critiquing a status quo of his time like you say, and I don't disagree at all that like ultimately lit analysis needs insight from reading the text as well as attempts at understanding the author behind it. In terms of tragedy/the delusion, the aspect I was focusing on is more like the literary/thematic element of death of the author as a tragedy if that makes sense? Bc like while it's cool that source texts are so much easier to find/document in modern storytelling traditions, there's still this mythos/feeling of a story that gets so big it leaves the hands of the author entirely to become its own thing. Like I love humans bc that's the kind of thing that started religions and pantheons in the past, stellar, love how powerful stories can become and the ephemeral nature of true origin in that case, but again the power the story has is then no longer in the hands of the author once the story is viewed by a reader, which is why in ORV KDJ is the one running the universe on his subconscious lol.

Like bc of that evolution of author death in modernity though, like based in the reality of webnovels like ORV as commercial texts that get reinterpreted and transformed by translators and fans over and over again with anonymous authors we might not know much of anything about, the delusion I'm speaking of is that some of those millions of readers may not think of author intent at all and just view the finished work as a Product, something consumable. This is what I meant by apathetic delusion when I got into the part you agree with here of readers who only see text as an outlet for their own escapism.

The feeling you have of 'mix of both' is exactly what I'm trying to convey by the "impossible communication." Because text is ultimately speech, storytelling is conversation, it is an attempt to communicate from one author to however many readers. The writing on the wall idea from ORV is very related to this in that you are trying to convey this thing that you are not sure anyone will ever see just in hopes of one day being understood or seen by others, even if you'll never see those others or know how your words affected them. This is why I felt that orv's emphasis on text as Relationship between author and reader.

[tsururoach]

i was so curious about what yjh’s description said since i saw a few say they got him in your orv poll but no one was posting screenshots, and i am so glad i apparently had enough of a grasp on him to get his result first try

as for what i actually got beforehand; it was kdj, as expected

If other people are curious, this is the result... Honestly I'm super relieved that when trying to get him you managed to! While I did general tests for the Kimcom to see how accurate my answers were, that obviously has innate bias as I was the one who made the quiz.

If you wanted some elaboration... with some spoilers that I couldn't include on the quiz description:

As a general disclaimer, I don't think my quiz is anything final. Not even close to be honest. It's my personal belief that the ORV that we've read is all a different story. Not because difference in translation or distributors, but because of the different readers.

Each of us had our own meaning and our own belief of the characters- and that means we all got a different 'story' from ORV. Clearly, there is some character aspects that are relatively unarguable to what is canon, but there is going to small differences based on how we see Kim Dokja's perspective of the world... and our perspective of him.

Yoo Joonghyuk is a strong, strong character. No, a strong person. He is someone who cares too much, and I feel like it's something not noticed enough. Or, perhaps, can never be noticed enough.

"It is because he is weak that he is strong." or is it "Because he is strong, he is so undeniably weak."

Even before the apocalypse in TWSA, he held this kind of responsibility as well. He had to be steadfast and reliable. He has a sense of responsibility and by god he's not going betray that. But to what cost? What could he rely on?

From the very beginning- from the very start, did Yoo Joonghyuk have anyone to rely on? It was only a man and his younger sister, what could possibly be there for him?

I feel like a lot of people tend to think that YJH is more aloof than he actually is. That nothing matters so long as he achieves his goals. I beg to differ, and I'd do it on my hands on knees.

YJH 'caring about his image' may seem far off... but it really isn't? Perhaps my phrasing was poor, but I don't think YJH knows how to feel weak. Well, he has to learn how to be weak in front of others. And for the record, I don't even think it started because of the apocalypse. YJH is someone tied to responsibility. Not that kind of cold apathic responsibility, but the one made delicately out of love.

YJH's sacrifice and KDJ's sacrifice is kind of funny in that way. YJH tries to save his family by living. KDJ tries to save them by dying instead. YJH needs to live, needs to continue, needs to find the solution, so he can go back to the family and bring them with him.

I'd be hard pressed to call YJH simple, but he definitely defines himself in a way you would call simple? He definitely knows himself enough to know what he wants and what he should do- even if KDJ calls it into question more than he should... I guess you can say he can think well? Even when it's difficult for him to verbalize as such.

Is it too much to say of the main trio, YJH is definitely the one who loves the most. YJH... I feel like probably couldn't handle that 'empathy' or kindness he offers to those he trusts being 'weak.' Which I suppose is why it's such a big deal that he has trust issues. It's honestly why the 1st turn is the one I'm the most curious about (not the 0th!) Because it's the turn that we assume YJH started off of. Which in hindsight, isn't that clever? Starting at 0 instead of 1?

How is that YJH who went through the apocalypse for the 'first' time with little help and no knowledge? How did he cope? Just how much did that infallible protagonist change? Not only that... remember that the YJH we start off is supposed to be the '3rd' turn. What happened to get from point 1 to 3?

Anyways, as for the quiz... Since this has run a bit long, let me review the questions that had YJH in mind. (also to note, since it's been a while, I did actually make sure the results are relatively equal save for the minor minor characters.)

4-5. Love language

YJH to me... It's definitely words of affirmation? Like all things aside, no ship nothing like that- but isn't that what helped him become the YJH we meet at the end of the novel? KDJ talking to him?

The affirmation that he could and should go on? That his life- no, this life matters? That just because he could theoretically continue, doesn't mean 'this' life is worthless?

That there is hope to go on the next day?

While love language isn't absolute- he absolutely could find it in simply just presence alone, it's definitely the most important. It's important for him to hear all of these things and more.

As for the expression of love language... YJH expresses it the most through acts of service, and I kind of expect that to be obvious enough... Though I can see him thinking his words matter a lot as well... Even if it's rougher than he intends, I think that the acts of service is more.. instinctive? While the words are intended.

8. Webnovel prompt

To be honest this question was mostly something to lay off of the tediousness of the quiz. Something on the sillier end even though I looked through it... Yoo Joonghyuk.. Definitely is someone who craves normalcy though. Okay. Like I get he's a gamer and all that, but he's just so tired. He deserves it- and that... is kind of what he was looking for, wasn't it? Like Yoo Sangah, even if it didn't have KDJ originally, didn't he crave family and a peaceful way of living?

18. Pick something in the future.

'To keep the future my own'

Yoo Joonghyuk wants to control his own life- his own future. Isn't that why the fact he is the one responsible for writing part of ORV so important? He did it, he escaped the story and became his own person out of the bounds of the constellations. He is a hero, but most importantly, he is himself.

He made that decision and that is what makes him, him.

21. Fanfiction cliffhanger

This one is the one that makes me wish that you can make the questions be worth more or less (though I ended up balancing it out a little.)

However, I will stand by my answer for YJH.

"It'd be fine, to sacrifice mind and soul, if it meant I'd die knowing the love for you."

I... Can see how it's a bit weird, and maybe too romantic for him? But I mostly brought it up here because I think... Yoo Joonghyuk would hate to lose his emotions and care? I think the thought of forgetting who he cares for and forgetting what he did to and for them, is something more painful than dying. It's more painful than regressing so much- because that is a loss that sticks with him more?

I could elaborate more on this, but I'm not the most eloquent person out there.

75. Safe Emotion

For Yoo Joonghyuk, I think he finds anger is a safe emotion. Not because it's the one he's most familiar with nor is it the one he adheres to most- but because it's the one he understands best? Not understand as in he's felt most often, but because it's the most straightforward of emotions to him. He knows when to be angry and what it means to be angry.

83. Does the End Justify the mean.

This is one of the questions where I wish I separated YJH more than just SP, simply because it really is more than that? And honestly I feel like if I'm going to be wrong about characterization, this one would be the question I feel like it's most fair for.

YJH does not think the end justifies the means... I think SP does...? But I also feel like that changes. But I really can't just separate those iterations of YJH in any clean way anyways, so this is what it will be.

84. (not YJH but I'm adding it) Isn't it fucked up for the superpower question I put 'flight' for OD. Isn't that messed up. Looking over the quiz again that's soooo fucked up of me.

95. Boundaries

I feel like YJH is willing to let go of his boundaries but it's not as easy as he can let it seem? I feel like the consequences of him overstepping his own boundaries are definitely a lot more than he exposes, but if he's allowed the time to process the decision, he's willing anyways.

99. Which one is strongest to you?

Hope. YJH is a character who embodies hope. He is hope and he is always in an endless journey to chase it. He is OD's hope. He is KDJ's hope. He is the hope of HSY and the others of the apocalyptic world. In the Epilogue... he's willing to be Kimcom's eternal hope.

He is innately a hopeful person. He faulters, but anyone would. He's human. And humans will hope before they despair- they will hope in despair. Yoo Joonghyuk is hope.

And it makes sense he would understand that.

[xthelastknownsurvivorx]

oooooh noteworthy au for rwrb 👀👀👀

but also orange au? 👀

I already talked about noteworthy au here but here's a bit more that I can give you on character profiles (note that I don't actually have a lot of musical experience, just school chorus up through middle school so be kind if I've gotten anything wrong):

a capella group alex joins, name tbd: 5 members*

alex: goes by gabriel from middle name gabriella?; tenor, musical theatre major

henry: third generation legacy member, face of the group/the hot one; baritone, music major

philip: third generation legacy member, musical director and president; baritone, music major

pez: he and alex get into trouble together, event planner/treasurer; tenor, dance major

liam: also from texas like alex so they bond over that, same year as alex; bass, visual arts major

*originally the a capella group in noteworthy has 8 members but I don't feel like coming up with 3 more male ocs with unique personalities (as hunter and spencer are part of a rival a capella group) so we're leaving it at 5 for now

reading this back, I'm actually now tempted to switch henry and pez in terms of their vocal registers because I think it would be very cool and gender of pez to have a deeper voice while caring fuck all about the gender binary, but I'm also a little attached to alex-pez tenors and all the mischief they get up to

--

as for orange au, this one is based on the manga/anime orange by ichigo takano and is for omniscient reader's viewpoint. I'm not sure how much you (or most of my other followers) know about orv, there are some very light orv spoilers, and orange is a story that deals with some heavy topics, so it's all going below the cut (including the content warnings)

cw: suicide, depression

first, here's a link to a very good overview of orv in terms of what it is, a summary of the plot, why it's special, about the characters/their relationships, and some caveats. it's a little long so feel free to read only as much as you want for context

what you need to know for its relevance to this au idea is that through reading orv you slowly find out that its main character kim dokja is a self-sacrificial piece of shit (affectionate) who is also very much allergic to emotional intimacy due to some childhood trauma. in the world of orv (fantastical, apocalyptic), he often will make his own plans to sacrifice himself in exchange for saving his friends' lives despite their repeated instance that they don't want him to do this and they'd rather figure out alternative plans

so it's very easy to map this tendency to the plot of orange, which is about a high school student who is trying to prevent the death of a friend after receiving letters from her future self in a parallel universe where she (and her larger friend group) lost this friend to suicide. the letters suggest ideas on how to make this friend feel less alone and less suicidal by making different decisions at critical points, as her future self (and the other friends' future selves) is very regretful that she didn't try harder to be there for him because no one realized he was struggling so badly

obviously this story isn't super realistic for a number of reasons, including the fact that the most any of us can take on is trying to be supportive of friends/family/etc who are struggling, not actually be responsible for keeping them alive. that is not a reasonable responsibility to take on and would be far too heavy for the person/people carrying it. also responsible adults and professionals should absolutely be consulted in this type of scenario, which is never brought up in the context of the story. insert many more caveats here that i cannot currently think of

however, at the same time, i also think that the story does a really good job of exploring themes of inevitability, regret, and choice which is why it's stuck with me for 7.5 years now. plus i think it just works really well with the characters of orv which is why I want to make an au of it

ask me about my wips

[aroacehanzawa]

hi it's me again HWUSHHW BUT PLEASE IT'S 1 AM HERE AND I'M CACKLING OVER KIM DOKJA AND GONG PILDU (T — T) he seems to be having his fun exercising command rights from the behind the scenes contract lmao

like i know this is such a minor thing, but i am enjoying dokja’s character so much as i get further into the story, like yes ur so right at first i assumed he'd be someone the viewers can easily project on, or like ur typical protagonist with typical protagonist measures of morality, and lofty principles—but nope, also the fact that his initial action the moment he sees the op protagonist is to hit him at the back of the head too pls

anyways have a lovely day imma go back to reading bye HWUWHESHHWH (also thanks for wishing me luck on my quiz i think it worked hsuwhw)

SORRY FOR THE LATE RESPONSE BUT HI AGAIN

Yes kim dokja is such a menace, i've forgotten a lot of the early chapters but you're right that his interactions with gong pildu were hilarious!!!

Honestly i feel like most of the time when i'm talking about orv on here it's like aoughh they make me sick they make me unwell and insane and i need to lie down.. but this book is actually so deeply HILARIOUS and i think it works so well because it never takes itself too seriously, while still being so sincere in the messages it wants to deliver. And i think that's exactly what makes the heartfelt moments stick so well, because you already learn to feel such a strong connection to the novel during its funnier parts. Like it wouldn't be orv without this perfect balance!

[godsspecialestlittleguyskirmish]

looking at both yoo joonghyuk and kim dokja on this tournament and.

[MAJOR SPOILER WARNING FOR THE ORV WEBNOVEL, SPOILERS FOR POLL OPPONENTS]

it's interesting that my personal feelings towards their place in the tournament vs their opponents differ

because while i have no familiarity with kim dokja's opponent, i'm actually a lot more comfortable with the idea of him losing over yjh vs xl - because in the context of orv kdj is the god in the equation. i'm willing to make the concession that tls123, who wrote the story into existence for him, would still make him viable for this tournament, so he's a good choice - but even so, i find myself. strangely comfortable with the idea of him losing out, even without knowing the other character

meanwhile, i actually do have familiarity with xl, to some extent. not nearly as much as with yoo joonghyuk, but enough to know the context - and. and.

part of why i've been making an active effort to avoid these kinds of polls lately is because there are fine lines between objective fact, subjective opinion and straight-up popularity contests, and while i personally believe yjh would be better suited for the concept of 'god's favourite' i am now hesitating to draw out why???

because a different tournament i witnessed had people disparaging the idea of these characters fitting that poll's criteria as well in the sort of dismissive attitude that actually put me off of wanting to engage with the other character's story, even though i had found interest in it prior

so i just want to line that out, because i have personal opinions based on what i know, but that doesn't mean my words are the end all be all or that this one interpretation is right, etc etc etc

so to put it in simple terms, from what i understand of tgcf, xl is god's 'favourite' in the sense that the god in question was so angered that he actively targeted xl over and over and over, in ways that broke him down and destroyed what he loved, in an attempt to break him too. it's delicious angst, and a sure sign of how being the object of a higher power's fixation can be cruel, too

ergo, making it clear, xl should be on this poll

i am biased towards yjh winning though. this has no bearing on the paragraph stated above, especially since my memory of tgcf is limited

i like yjh being on this poll because the entire story of orv is formed because the god loved too much. not just as a cause for conflict, but as the endpoint - the story happened because the god couldn't bear to let go, and so yjh's story repeated over and over and over.

and in the end when yjh (and kdj and hsy and all of kimcom) learned the full extent of this, it's like. the god didn't even know what he was doing. all he did was read, and love the story, and the story came to life simply because he loved the story and the characters within it. yjh most of all. i am very passionate about yjh's being god's favourite, because of how genuine and innocent and cruelly naive that situation was, and would like to see him thrive in a poll with this sort of criteria.

but again, i've been trying to avoid polls like this for a reason, because the lines between subjectivity and objectivity and popularity are not that well-defined in situations like this, and i am no exception to being influenced. i am simply looking at the tournament title and letting my bias run again

i hope everyone's able to see this poll as all in good fun, regardless. not to take things too seriously, understand bias need not be in hostility (and not to force hostility when unneeded). argue for why your favourite characters fit the criteria, the same way i am arguing about why yjh fits the criteria (a really fun thing about these polls is that they give insight into how people enjoy the text, their interpretations, all around glimpses of meta). don't take things too seriousky, be respectful, and have fun!

.

[holygroundgone]

EXTREMELY specific thinking about my favorite pieces of media centered on plurality (umineko spoilers sam DO NOT READ as well as spoilers for orv, dqb2, 2ha)

I was thinking about how most of my favorite media are very fertile grounds for extracanonical plural interpretations and extrapolations- the most obvious one of course is umineko and while i've seen analysis that specifically rejects a dissociative identity disorder reading of sayo i would certainly argue that osdd is a lot closer- as a plural person myself i see a lot of myself in the way sayo has these parts of themself that serve different roles and carry different burdens- even in a purposeful way, such as assigning the heavy burden of attraction to battler to beatrice 🫡😔 thank you for your service queen (no but i love battler)

I was thinking about this kind of nuance with orv recently- how the book and yjh in particular exist on a certain level as an extension of hsy's will (though both escape that retroactively and postcanonically) and how the relation between yjh and hsy feels like it has that nuance of understanding each other especially far better than kind dokja is able to understand either. This extends to the way yjh is a constructed person- the way he can't find his parents, the way there are blanks in his 'backstory', but eventually the weight of his experiences distinguish him as his own person fully in his own right and yet i truly believe a certain degree of intention and feeling of hsy's persist specifically in his fixation on kdj

With dqb2 i've been tossing around the idea in my head for a while for a postcanon malroth to get more in touch with his godly side, experiencing dreams of the past from that perspective, and coming to realize that just like him the god malroth was not inherently evil and had just as much potential as him to become the person he is and was instead twisted by the desires of his worshippers, especially hargon. Destruction isn't inherently evil, and so i don't believe god malroth was either. Now out of the rest of these examples this of course has the least basis in canon but i think a more extreme level of extrapolation and story invention should be allowed as dqb2 is a lot more about the feel and experience than meticulous clockwork storytelling like the rest of these examples wherein there are absolutely things that happen for no good reason (see: most of khrumbul-dun, dqb2's ace attorney third case ass of an island- however, the themes of love and beginning to recognize it are imo very important as one of the key themes to me for dqb2 are the builder teaching malroth to love, also the feel of khrumbul-dun especially living with the miners and how much malroth loves hanging out with them is very comfy)

As for 2ha, i've kind of become so lost in my own sauce with my own extrapolation/interpretation of mo-zongshi and taxian-jun as two parts of one whole to the point that i've become incredibly emotional thinking about it on an absolutely daily basis and constructing my own personal narrative of mo ran's plurality to the point that i kind of worry it'll come off as too noncanonical to other people, but- that's why i'm planning on writing a story piece that will serve as a sort of mo ran plurality manifesto soon. But i might as well get into it a little here:

My theory is that mo ran -aside from magic demon soul induced plurality at the end of canon- had the seeds of plurality in him the entire time. From a young age, having to smile and appeal to people to earn money while restraining and pushing down any sign of anger or resentment, ESPECIALLY by the time he's in the drunken jade, i would posit, left mo ran with two distinct but unaware consciousnesses- the mo ran that has to smile and appease people while bearing unfair punishment and the mo ran that has to hold the anger and resentment towards his mistreatment- ie, easily identifiable as mzs and txj before they ever had their own identities outside of being mo ran.

This embryonic mzs, who, in a plural sense you would call the main host due to his projected identity and behaviors being at the forefront of the way mo ran presents himself to the world, would've been horrified by the dark hunger and violence lurking in the back of his mind, and especially after the fire at the drunken jade would consider himself a monster, a horrible person who has to hide his own nature lest everyone see how dirty and vile he is.

The embryonic txj on the other hand... I believe his personality and his behaviors and his immense violent aversion to lowering himself and insecurities about his position relative to others- would've formed as a sort of defensive mechanism to the other side of mo ran while not being allowed to vent his violence and anger. when he snaps and kills everyone at the drunken jade i believe it's a result of slowly boiling in the hell fires of the abuse mzs faced and allowed and accepted with a smile because- as long as his belly's full he's happy.

txj is someone who loves to complain and express his discontent and his mistreatment whereas mzs refuses to dwell upon it and refuses to go into detail on these matters even when he's on trial.

and so when they're implanted with the flower... i'd like to imagine that txj both naturally presented more within mo ran but also took the brunt of the flower's effects to protect that softer and kinder and more vulnerable side of himself- especially since due to the flower's effects more and more he couldn't recognize his surroundings as a safe place, becoming paranoid and losing all happy or positive memories.

mzs would've remained inside dormant in most moments and situations, likely coming out to fawn mainly upon shi mei, the one person he is rendered capable of seeing as a comfort, as safe, as trustworthy, as kind.

My theory gets a little complicated when it comes to mo ran's first death as the emperor of the cultivation world. I believe both the zombified taxian-jun and the reincarnated 1.0 mo ran would've still held this implicit but also completely unaware plural divide, though the zombified taxian-jun's mzs side would likely be uhh mentally emaciated and not really capable of presenting in the face of mostly being controlled by hua binan.

1.0 mo ran would've still carried the memories and thus be influenced and so for a while he would still be presenting internally as txj AND as his perceived identity of being This Venerable Taxian-Jun (calling the two identities of mo ran mzs and txj is only going to get more confusing from here unfortunately) but as the flower's influence wanes and especially when cwn sacrifices himself for him and he realizes everything that he was missing, every way he'd misunderstood the reality, the mzs side of him would become dominantly presenting within him once again and he'd again be overcome with horror and the perception of himself that he's a horrible monster

This would be why he overcompensates so much, fawning so heavily on chu wanning, "respect and cherish"- it's not even necessarily a natural state for mo ran- the way that mzs will edge almost towards doglike submissiveness "shizun is right no matter what" would be more of a trauma response than his actual internal personality as mo ran is inherently an extremely dominant person and needs and seeks control whether it's mzs or txj who both express this in different ways.

Onto post-canon once the outer identities of mo-zongshi 2.0 mo ran and zombified emperor taxian-jun mo ran merge into one body, I think that the dominant personalities/inner identities of mzs and txj would identify so much with these specific lives and experiences that despite both bodies initially holding their own internal dual identities I think they would experience a sort of redistribution of memories and pieces of the self over time, mzs and txj becoming more distinct especially as they are explicitly divided in their time by the three days and one system, which i also personally like to interpret as a result of mzs, especially as initially the part of them that holds more control over the souls in their body, suppressing txj for as long as he can, even unconsciously as a continued internal desire not to "become taxian-jun again"- which can be seen in post canon in the way he considers txj completely himself and a part of himself to the point of not ascribing him his own identity, whereas txj very much despises this idea and distinguishes himself from mzs at every point and turn.

Whereas mzs/mo-zongshi 2.0 mo ran initially told taxian-jun to forgive himself in canon i do think he would come to resent the situation presented in post-canon as of 2 years into their seclusion and would have a difficult time not seeing himself and that side of himself as a monster, i'd like to think he eventually realizes that txj really is his own person at this point AND that txj had existed to protect him in a way this entire time.

I think of txj as someone with almost no interiority whatsoever, however possessing an incredibly sharp wit and even sharper instinctual thinking and so I think on some level he would more intuitively understand these things especially as the side of mo ran that in safe non-flower times has been pushed to the hidden side of mo ran's presentation. I think in post canon he would block out mzs's ability to see his days but be more or less capable of sitting in on and seeing mzs's three days. I don't think he would be aware of the intense protectiveness he feels over mzs that causes him to act imperiously and commanding over him, i think his immediate most surface inner narrative would actually be that he wishes he could remove mzs and be in control of the body all the time except for the fact that it would make cwn sad- and actually i think postcanon he would likely struggle a lot with his position between cwn and mzs in their life together as someone more difficult than mzs in mo ran's body- not to mention the ways that he would feel shafted such as the way that cwn hides his brocade pouch away with no indication that he still has it much less treasures it while wearing and using mzs'... all things i want to address in a larger narrative

[aranarumei]

tagged by @heartsdash!

currently watching: very slowly going thru the untamed w/ a friend of mine. also i am "watching" a3 bc i feel like watching the event stories doesn't count as gaming lol. and its not exactly just reading... anyways bc i ended up writing a short fic abt the spring and summer rookies respectively i've like. committed too hard and will not be starting act 2 winter until i finish this azami centric fic. cheers.

last song you listened to: datte by yuyoyuppe. i cannot believe the EP its on was only released at some vocaloid event.

currently reading: ....a3. nah i just said i can't say that. unfortunately not reading much in the way of books at the moment. although i'd love to. i'd say i'm reading witch hat atelier but i haven't picked it up in a couple of months... last month i read orv?

latest obsession: i'd say that i'm getting into honkai star rail but I think like compared to other things i've been pretty normal about it. this is gonna sound self absorbed but most of my brainpower nowadays has been dedicated to thinking abt this one fic i am very very very very slowly writing. it's just like. a bit of a complicated fic and smthing i haven't rly tackled before so i'm having a lot of fun with it and also i deeply need to be satisfied with it. i haven't done this much rigorous self editing in a while!

tagging: uhhhh if anyone sees this and would like an excuse to talk abt the thing they're into etc. go ahead and do it say i tagged you. i'll read whatever u wish to talk abt.

[ot3]

Was the Star Stream in ORV supposed to represent society? Like how the many conditions in which we have to hurt each other to survive are caused by systemic issues? And how society forces us to play roles, again for our survival and that of those around us?

I read a lot into subtext but I've still taken a lot of the main ideas and themes at face value, so I haven't considered allegories or metaphors much.

i think that's definitely a valid interpretation of it. keep in mind it's impossible to ever say with 100% certainty what an author has intended unless they've come out and said it themselves, and it is also still completely legitimate to read something an author Didn't intend in their work if you can make a good case for coming away with that interpretation.

in general, i personally feel like saying that a given System in media is a representation of society is a little bit lacking in terms of analysis, because all Systems in media are derivatives of/allegories for specific systemic elements occurring in society.

IMO you can get a lot out of thinking about the star stream as the state of the media/entertainment industry under late capitalism. technically it's a system anyone can succeed in, but so few people do; luck and nepotism are huge factors. getting picked up by someone with enough money and audience to sustain you. it's a system that is desperate for more, more, more, always, and simultaneously both craving novelty but expecting something that satisfies pre-conceptions about how events Should play out. and the people on top - the constellations - who have had this success aren't quite the shadowy voyeuristic puppetmasters they're made out to be at the beginning. they're desperate and lonely, looking to be comforted and saved by these stories the same way anyone else had been.

this isnt super well phrased or coherent but i'm not feeling too great today. im sure you get the gist though. like everyone has to keep selling themselves and fit into these boxes of being Consumable while still trying to be fresh and interesting so they can make enough money to live and everyone si worse off for the system functioning this way