#anti obitine

[antianakin]

Honestly the Voyage of Temptation episode would've been way funnier and more interesting if Obi-Wan just... hadn't had any weird latent feelings about Satine, if he hadn't ever regretted leaving her and he was just totally fine about it all.

Just IMAGINE a scenario where both Obi-Wan and Satine are just... normal and professional around each other and at some point Anakin asks about their history and Obi-Wan's like "yeah and Satine asked me to stay with her, but I obviously said no and that was that" and Anakin just EXPLODES because WHAT?? When he and Padme first saw each other again, he'd nearly burst a blood vessel and he'd been so awkward and weird and he could barely manage to be in the same room as her, how is Obi-Wan so CALM about it all, he never would've guessed that Obi-Wan had had feelings for her. And Obi-Wan just kinda shrugs and is like, "I dunno, it was like 20 years ago, people grow up and move on and I like being a Jedi, it's not that big a deal." Anakin spends the rest of the episode trying desperately to get Obi-Wan to admit that he still has feelings for Satine, that he regrets having left her, or SOMETHING and it just never happens.

For one, it's fucking hilarious. Obi-Wan being a font of calm as Anakin runs around trying to force Obi-Wan NOT to be calm because HOW DARE Obi-Wan be normal about something Anakin is incapable of being normal about himself.

For two, it provides a really interesting and obvious counterpoint to Anakin in a way that I personally feel works WAY better than what canon actually did. Obi-Wan had feelings for someone, they were real, but he was a Jedi who actually LIKED being a Jedi and so he said no when his partner asked him for more than he was capable of giving and it just didn't cause him all that much distress. That contrasts SO WELL with Anakin who can't let go of anything or anyone ever, who literally held onto a childhood crush for TEN YEARS and was incapable of not being a creepy idiot around his crush for more than the first like 2 seconds of their interaction. Romance just doesn't have to be some big impactful thing for Obi-Wan in the way that it is for Anakin. It can be nice, sure, it can be fun, but it's not something he NEEDS the way Anakin does. He doesn't have any remorse or regret about choosing the Jedi. He never wonders about what might've been because he knows it would've just been way less satisfying of a life for him.

[kanansdume]

Of course, thinking about how Bo-Katan and Satine's father's treatment of them influenced Bo-Katan's terrible choices actually starts to shed some light on SATINE'S terrible choices, too.

Because as much as Bo-Katan would've dug her heels in and refused to compromise on her beliefs regarding traditional Mandalorian values and what their father would've wanted, Satine would've dug her heels in just the same and refused to compromise on her OWN opposite beliefs.

Which leads us to how Satine treats Obi-Wan and her disregard and dismissal of the Jedi and the situation they're in. There is nothing Obi-Wan could ever say that would convince Satine that the Jedi fighting in the war is a necessary evil. Nothing. He'll NEVER be able to convince her otherwise because Satine likely got completely dismissed by her father for her choice to be a pacifist or her arguments that Mandalorian infighting was supremely stupid. She was her father's EMBARRASSMENT and she likely knew it just as well as Bo-Katan did. I imagine she was asked to change her mind a lot or to just give up and compromise because she was the heir or something to that effect and she never ever allowed herself to because she knew that she was RIGHT.

But this leads to her refusing to see any kind of nuance in the Jedi's situation. It leads to a VERY limited definition of what it means to be a "peacekeeper" that doesn't take into account what you do what someone else attacks YOU. She claims she's not against the idea of defending herself, but cannot wrap her head around the idea that the Jedi fighting on behalf of the Republic IS them defending themselves and their people. Obi-Wan TRIES to argue his side of it, tries to make her see that refusing to fight would do nothing but allow the Separatists to kill and enslave and oppress everyone in the Republic, and Satine will hear NONE of it. She's completely and entirely convinced that she's right and refuses to budge on the topic to the point that she's willing to get into a screaming match with Obi-Wan about it in public.

This doesn't excuse or condone her arrogance and refusal to compromise or understand someone else's situation, but it at least adds some context to it to help make that unfortunate aspect of her personality make more SENSE. I know where it comes from now, and that lets me see it in a different light even if I still don't agree with her. Because while she was right about the Mandalorians (mostly), she was WRONG about the Jedi. She was wrong about the Separatists.

[currentlyobsessedwithobi-wan]

I don’t hate Satine. I don’t like her either, I’m just let’s say neutral. And I don’t care what people ship (as I’ve said, I’ll read about any ship if the story is interesting enough). However I’m very much not a fan of the “Korkie is their secret child” theory. I guess I’m just not fan of the illegitimate children tropes to begin with. And maybe I’m biased, but I just can’t imagine Obi-wan having a child then acting as if they didn’t exist.

[cyare-fi]

10, 16 annnnnnd lets do 23! for the choose violence asks <3

10: worst part of fanon

Hmm... I think the worst part of fanon is the headcanon that Korkie Kryze is Obi-Wan's child. It infuriates me to no end. I really hate Satine, but I also think she just wouldn't keep a child made so illicitly. Whether that means having an abortion, which feels more unlikely, or sending the kid off to some other planet to be far away from her.

16: You can't understand why so many people like this thing

Tying into my previous answer, I can't understand why so many people like Obitine. Satine is the most frustrating character to me, from the way she treats her people to the way she treats those around her. I think her and Obi-Wan could never be more than what it was; a short-lived whirlwind romance. I much prefer ships like Codywan, because those are two people who feel like they could actually work in a way that is meaningful.

23: ship you've unwillingly come around to

For this, I would have to also say Codywan. At first, I was skeptical, because I didn't know much about Cody and I wasn't that immersed in the Clone side of the fandom yet. I didn't dislike it, per se, but I just wasn't warmed up to it. And then I saw all the beautiful fanart, and the fics, and the love people poured into these characters. People like my favorite Codywan artist (who I am too afraid to actually tag, but it's Journen) and also some of the really heartbreaking fics and edits that I saw, really made it something I grew to love.

I think there are so many good ships in Star Wars, including canon ones such as Anidala and Hanleia (is that the name for that one?) And ones that absolutely should have been canon, like Finnpoe/Stormpilot.

Thank you for the ask!!! This was so fun, I love nothing more than talking about Star Wars <3

[blueboobutterfly]

Ya know what I’m not being nice anymore! Here’s Star Wars characters I hate and little reasons why

Qui-Gon Jinn, because Fuck that bitch in legends and even in the movies cause he’s a total dick to Obi-Wan. Like leaving him a war torn planet to save his girlfriend when literal children were dying, and not sending any help.

Satine because she’s a shit leader and she commited cultural genocide among other atrocities. Fuck her bitch ass and I’m glad she died.

Bo-Katan because she’s a fucking terroist and helped get her sister murdered. And she’s annoying as fuck and critizes Obi-Wan she literally is one of people who helped her sister get killed.

Pre Vizsla because he’s Pre Vizsla and he can go die in a hole and his fake bleach blonde ass.

Palpatine because if you don’t hate him even a tiny bit i don’t wanna know you. Fuck him and all the bullshit with the clones, my poor bois.

And finally Tarkin. Because he’s a dick and a creepy asshole. Fuck that bastard.

No I will not elaborate on these because Fuck these hoes.

[jessicas-pi]

Korkie Kenobi is fun and all, but have you considered all the potential in Korkie not-Kenobi?

have you considered Korkie seeing a picture of Obi-Wan and thinking that maybe—maybe—maybe his parents are alive, maybe his mother has been there all along, maybe his father is an amazing hero out there in the galaxy saving people, and he's wrong, his parents are dead and he never knew them and it really is his aunt who is raising him, and Korkie knows this but he hopes, oh, he hopes—

have you considered Obi-Wan panicking when he sees Korkie on his trip to Mandalore, because even though he and Satine were never together, never so much as spoke about their feelings, for a split second he still wonders, and Satine laughs behind her hand because she knows what Obi-Wan was thinking, and Korkie is blissfully ignorant of it all because in this universe he never even imagined Obi-Wan could be his father—

have you considered Korkie making jokes about it, laughing with his friends over holonet conspiracy theories, and never in public, never where people could hear, never where it could get in the gossip magazines, because he's careful, and Satine had worried it might hurt him but he knows who his parents were and he thinks it's funny when his friends call him Obi-Two—

have you considered Satine being seventeen and pregnant and too ashamed to tell her parents, and then she's seventeen and pregnant and she has no parents to tell because they're dead, and then she's eighteen with a newborn and on the run for her life, and the young Jedi who helped save her rips up his own cloak to make a birikad and he sings lullabies on the restless nights and he changes the baby's soiled diapers, he does it all without hesitating, and Obi-Wan didn't father Korkie but he is the closest thing Korkie will ever have to a father—

have you considered Korkie being picked up early from his first day at school, sobbing and hiding in his Auntie Satine's arms, because one of the children was calling him a mean name and saying things about his parents and his auntie and someone named Ke-no-bi, and he doesn't know why, he doesn't understand, and he won't tell his auntie what the children called him because it's a bad word, but Satine knows exactly what they were calling her nephew, and she knows that he will be called it for the rest of his life—

have you considered Korkie with a single glass marble, stretching out his hand and reaching for a power he does not have, and nothing happens and his friends encourage him to try harder because if your dad can do it, you can too but Obi-Wan isn't his dad and he can't do it—

have you considered Korkie living in the shadow of a legacy that isn't even his, because nobody believes he is who he says he is, and his instructors all grade him a little more harshly because the son of a Jedi should be at the top of the class, and his friends all one-by-one find ways of asking if Obi-Wan Kenobi is his father and he says no but he knows they don't really believe him, and Korkie will never ever be who his people expect him to be, because they expect him to be the son of a Jedi but he's only Korkie—

have you considered what it would mean for Korkie to not be a Kenobi?

[shootingstarpilot]

CHARACTER ASK GAME!!! Asks

Cody and/or Obi, #8 - "what's something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you despise?"

EYYYYY THANK YOU <3333

Obi-Wan:

I simply do not see this man ever leaving the Order. I just don't. Part of the appeal of his character for me is that he is the Ultimate Jedi, and the occasional insistence I see that he would leave the Order to be with [insert love interest of your choice here] just... doesn't sit right with me.

(Do not get me STARTED on what the writers did with him and Satine...)

Cody:

Really, really not a fan of the whole clones-as-Mandalorian schtick, and when it comes to Cody, I have strong feelings about the fanon that his name is actually Kote. The clones' names are so important to them, and taking Cody's name from him for the sake of making it cool Mandalorian... bleargh. Not for me.

(Of course, write what you like, I'll never come onto someone's fic and start yelling about them for doing either of the above, but they're not interpretations that I'll generally seek out.)

[survivalove]

about me

fandoms

star wars: rebels, rogue one, clone wars, old republic

pjo

atla (ugh!) & lok (that means some. times.)

bleach (halfway through)

arcane (knew i was forgetting one. been avoiding this fandom the most)

fave characters

ahsoka, sabine wren, satele shan, obi-wan kenobi, the daughter, ezra bridger, jyn erso, cassian andor

annabeth chase, percy jackson

katara, sokka, yangchen, aang, korra, KANNA (you guys just don’t get it)

toshiro, orihime, rukia, ichigo

mel, jinx, vi

ships in order

kataang

percabeth

obitine

yangvik (casual)

ichihime

any other orihime ship (platonic or romantic)

any toshiro ship (within reason)

sabezra (not an anti but don’t ship it romantically that much)

renruki (for now)

some posts of mine

colonization of the southern water tribe

katara & tropes

who is the best female fighter in atla?

air temple island - architectural digest edition

katara vs sokka

katara & yue

random interests

sleeping beauty (the most beautiful animation ever)

beyoncé (not really random as she’s the queen of my life) follow abitmodish

fashion: versace, valentino, christy turlington follow abitmodish

dnis

katara antis

zuko stans***

zutara shippers***

zukka shippers***

proshippers

kuruk stans***

mel antis

fire nation stans in general

anyone man obsessed

feel free to follow, unfollow or block ✨

[jedi-enthusiast]

If I may, for the Choose Violence Ask Game : 2, 6, 8 and 25 ?

Choose Violence Ask Game: Star Wars Edition

2 - What character did you begin to hate, not because of canon, but because of how fandom acts about them?

Ok, so I know I remind everyone that I don't like Anakin every chance I get, so I'll pick a different answer to keep things interesting...

Probably Jango Fett and mandalorians in general.

I think I could get behind Jango and the mandalorians if people, both in fandom and some of the Disney writers, didn't keep trying to use them to bash the Jedi. Like, they're not really my taste but they can be pretty cool, but almost every fic I've read that include mandalorians just end up using them to basically say- "oh look how bad/dogmatic the Jedi are!"

I can still remember that I was once reading an arranged marriage codywan fic and it was really good...all the way up until Cody started bashing the Jedi, Obi-Wan was thinking shit like "oh Jedi can't have emotions or feel love, I'm so conflicted," and the Council was made out to be a bunch of jackasses that pretty much abused Obi-Wan.

So yeah, the only reason I include mandalorians in my fics or go along with the mando!clones thing, is so that I can either-

1. show the mandalorians realizing- "oh wait, we're the problem aren't we?" -and changing for the better.

or 2. to show the clones' development from- "oh we can't trust the Jedi" -and leaning more into mando culture to- "we love/trust the Jedi" -and them choosing to lean more into Jedi culture.

6 - Opinion on canon and/or fanon use of the secret child trope? Discuss.

I'm gonna be honest, I can't stand it lmao

I know this question isn't specifically about it, but this comes up in fandom mainly as the "Korkie Kenobi" theory and I just...it's so stupid, honestly. Plus, it makes either Obi-Wan, Satine, or both look awful.

Option A - Satine kept the fact that she was pregnant a secret from Obi-Wan, therefore not giving him a choice on whether he wanted to be in the child's life. Satine is an asshole.

Option B - Satine told Obi-Wan that she was pregnant and Obi-Wan decided to fuck off and leave her to raise their kid alone. Obi-Wan is an asshole.

Option C - They both decided that Obi-Wan wouldn't be in the child's life and agreed to lie to Korkie and everyone else because...idk, they don't want to face any consequences for their actions. They're both assholes.

Plus, Satine and Obi-Wan would've been like 15/16 when their year on the run happened---so do people seriously want to romanticize the whole "teen pregnancy" thing? Really?

The secret child thing is just a trope that I can't get behind.

8 - There should be more of this type of fic/art...

Staunchly pro-Jedi fics and comics/art.

I just want more of them lol, they're like toast to me---I could eat a whole bag and still want more, I could read every pro-Jedi fic on Ao3 and then go back to the beginning and read them all over again.

25 - What's your opinion on modern AUs? What makes a good one?

I actually really like modern AUs! I think they can be a lot of fun, especially given all the different ways you can mix things up with them!

I think modern AUs are very versatile, so there isn't really anything that definitively makes one a "good" modern AU fic. I do have a couple things that are an immediate DNF for me for Modern AUs, other than the usual grammar/format things:

1. Jedi bashing, obviously.

2. Removing characters' disabilities.

3. When there's racism/homophobia/bigotry in general and the fic handles it shittily.

4. When the characters are changed so much that they're basically unrecognizable.

[wingletblackbird]

Obi-Wan and Satine annoys me, because it seems to be deliberately and unsubtly used as a criticism of Anakin and Padme, and not in any constructive way. Obi-Wan falls in love while protecting the Duchess. He is a "good" Jedi and leaves. Anakin falls in love while protecting the Senator. He is a "bad" Jedi and gets married.

There is nothing wrong with marriage/commitment. That should not be the message you are sending people. Obi-Wan is not morally superior for having abandoned the woman he fell in love with. What kind of moral does this even teach?

It would be one thing if it were some noble sacrifice. Perhaps Obi-Wan knew that it would cause another civil war on Mandalore if Satine married a Jedi. As a result, he did the difficult thing and left. That would be something I could get behind.

But, no, he left because it was the Jedi way. Because "attachment is forbidden." And getting married, no matter how healthy the relationship, is a path to the Dark Side. Sure.

Is this really the message we want to teach kids? Really?

[lightasthesun]

Still sad that there wasn't a Satine mention in the Kenobi series. Yes I understand it was more like the Vader and Obi-Wan show and while that's what I wanted I kinda expected there to be a more general discussion about his traumatic past. I feel like there should've been some kind of mention of her.

If she's only ever brought up in tcw in relation to Obi-Wan then why invent the whole romance plot in the first place? Why joke about the Korkie Kenobi thing (looking at you Filoni)

Give us a second season and have it be about all the other traumatic experiences he still hasn't been able to process.

If you just think about everything that happened in that last year before the fall of the republic... Mauls return. Satine's death and Ahsoka leaving pretty much immediately after that. Order 66 and Operation nightfall. His troops turning against him.

Season 1 was mostly focused around Obi-Wans loss of Anakin and his guilt and grief and his path back to himself through processing that and leaving Anakin behind but that's not all that's happened to him.

There's still much left. In my opinion at least there's still stuff I'd like to see be explored more.

[antianakin]

An AU where Obi-Wan and Satine are somehow forced into an arranged marriage post-Civil War, like Satine can't become Duchess if she's not married because she's a woman or she's too young, or maybe she decides to join the Republic post-Civil War in order to give herself legitimacy as a leader and gain herself enough followers to effectively force a peace without causing another civil war, but the Republic is reluctant to let them in and Satine discovers a workaround where if she marries a Republic citizen or something as a world leader she can use that to gain entry into the Republic. She asks Obi-Wan to help her out and he leaves the Order for her because she has literally no other options available and this will hopefully bring peace to Mandalore and allow Satine the chance to change things for the better, even though it means he loses EVERYTHING and has to give up who he is, his family, his friends, his home, etc.

And the marriage goes terribly because Satine and Obi-Wan's "tension" or whatever was basically just a trauma bond combined with teenage hormones and while he respects her ambitions, she never truly understands what he's given up for her and she doesn't entirely respect the Jedi culture sometimes and so Obi-Wan is absolutely miserable among the Mandalorians. None of them accept him, hardly any of them even LIKE him, he doesn't have any real power politically because Satine is too worried about people thinking she's letting an outsider rule through her and wanting to establish herself as a competent leader on her own, and Mandalorian culture is just so vastly different from the Jedi. There's a lot he DOES like about it, obviously, every culture has its own beauty to it, but it's not HIS culture and there's a lot about it that goes vastly against what the Jedi believe in and teach that makes it really uncomfortable for him sometimes. Satine and Obi-Wan just end up in screaming arguments all the time and can barely stand each other just a few years into the marriage, but they can't get a divorce because Satine doesn't want to admit to that kind of weakness or mistake or seem like someone who just made a political marriage for her own agenda (even though that's effectively exactly what she did, as Obi-Wan points out).

There's other tensions that come up, as well, like the problem of heirs. Obi-Wan and Satine DO try, but it never seems to actually work, and Satine's worry that she'll have made all of these changes to make Mandalore peaceful only for it to fall into civil war again upon her death if she doesn't have an heir means that she keeps trying to insist on more attempts and getting upset with Obi-Wan when it inevitably doesn't work. They end up in separate bedrooms because of this, despite the gossip this inevitably creates about their relationship fracturing. Eventually, Bo-Katan shows up with the baby she had but refuses to keep and asks Satine to raise in her place, and Satine agrees so long as Bo-Katan allows Satine to name the baby her heir. Bo-Katan agrees, and Satine stops trying to create an heir of her own in favor of raising Korkie as her heir.

Obi-Wan also keeps trying to find work-arounds to Satine's reluctance to let him help her politically. He accepts that she doesn't want him in the room when she's holding council and he can't be ON the council, but even when he suggests something as simple as just discussing things together in the privacy of their own bedroom so he can try to help carry the burden with her, but Satine refuses to do even that much just in case people start suspecting that she's taking advice from him and assume he is ruling through her. Obi-Wan ends up entirely cut off from all political work and decisions, Satine never tells him anything about what's going on at all and never wants his advice on how to lead Mandalore. She barely even allows him near Korkie to make sure no one ever questions Korkie's right to succeed her or his ability to lead Mandalore.

Obi-Wan attempts to stay in contact with some of the Jedi, but they're often busy and can't respond very quickly, if they respond at all, so those relationships start to fade. Only Qui-Gon keeps up any kind of regular communication and even that is still relatively sporadic depending on how his missions go. He tries to cling to the Jedi teachings he remembers as best he can rather than assimilating into Mandalorian culture, something that further alienates him from the Mandalorian people. Satine had given him formal clothing to wear and had told him that, as her spouse, he had to present himself a certain way, which meant he could not continue to wear Jedi or Jedi-style clothing. But he continues to meditate as best he can, at least once a day, reciting the meditation mantra he was taught as a child to ensure he never forgets it: there is no emotion, there is peace.

Satine hates that he seems generally uninterested in most Mandalorian customs, even though he knows them and has studied them as best he can. She sees his continued interest in practicing Jedi culture as a rejection of Mandalorian culture and doesn't really understand Obi-Wan when he says that they often feel diametrically opposed. He cannot do both, and she's asked him to give up enough of his Jedi heritage as it is, it feels cruel to ask him to give up what little is left to him for her own comfort. Satine points out that he wasn't BORN a Jedi, so it shouldn't really matter to let go of it. Obi-Wan doesn't speak to her for weeks after that, and while she does apologize for having hurt him, she still doesn't entirely understand, and Obi-Wan isn't interested in explaining anymore, something that just makes her angry all over again and the two of them have to agree to simply never discuss the topic again.

Obviously all of this creates irreparable damage to their relationship. Satine's youth when she took over Mandalore caused her to focus exclusively on what she believed needed to be done to solidify her position so she could do waht was best for her people, regardless of what that meant for Obi-Wan. She doesn't INTEND to hurt him and abandon him, but she married him for political reasons even if she had feelings for him. Obi-Wan's desire to replace the purpose he'd had as a Jedi with some kind of purpose on Mandalore causes him to push Satine to give things in their relationship that she's unwilling to give, and her refusal to meet him halfway and his alienation from her life creates resentment in him. Even as they grow older and Satine could theoretically try to rectify some of these mistakes and allow him to help her more politically, there is a rift between them that neither one knows how to cross. So they don't; Satine continues to put all of her focus on politics and Obi-Wan keeps his distance. They just continue to grow further and further apart without any way to free themselves from the black hole that is their marriage.

The one time they manage to get along is when Obi-Wan gets word that Qui-Gon died on Naboo. Satine finds him in his room after he didn't show up for something and he's practically catatonic on the floor, the room in a state of disarray. She sits down next to him and just offers him her silent presence until eventually he reaches over to hold her hand and she grasps it back. The two of them sit on that floor for the entire night until she has to leave to go to a meeting in the morning. They never discuss it.

And then TCW comes around and we're just assuming canon went mostly as per usual somehow and so the war still starts and the Jedi are leading the clone army and Death Watch has been building over on Concordia and Ferus Olin shows up on Mandalore to figure out what's going on. Ferus tries to speak to Obi-Wan because he'd heard a lot about Obi-Wan from Siri even though they'd obviously never had a chance to meet and Siri had mostly fallen out of contact with Obi-Wan by the time she took on Ferus, but he has very little time to do much more than tell Obi-Wan who he is and pass on the news that Siri had died recently during the war.

Then Satine goes to speak to Coruscant to convince them that she's NOT the one sending people to attack supply ships and she ends up bringing Obi-Wan with her. Obi-Wan isn't allowed to take part in the political dinner she has with Ferus and the other senators, so he wanders and ends up meeting Ferus's men, including Waxer, Boil, and Cody. Cody is initially more stiff and formal given Obi-Wan's assumed political position as Satine's spouse, but he warms up to Obi-Wan eventually, especially when Obi-Wan is able to sense the spider droids in the cargo area and proves himself a decent shot. Obi-Wan asks for stories of Ferus because he was fairly certain he wouldn't get a chance to really get to know him on this trip, but he'd been close with Ferus's old master and wanted to get to know the student Siri had trained in the only way available to him. Waxer and Boil are more than happy to tell him what stories they know and even Cody joins in eventually. A few other troopers switch out with Waxer and Boil later and Obi-Wan is able to get even more stories. This is the closest Obi-Wan has felt to a group of people in almost 20 years and he feels practically giddy about it.

When they arrive on Coruscant, Obi-Wan is told to stay in the apartments they're given, but when things go sideways for Satine, she has no one else she can call for help that she trusts except Obi-Wan, so he still comes in to help her with the assassins and manages to make his way into the Senate building to pass over the evidence she'd acquired to Padme, someone Satine believed to be trustworthy. It works, and Satine is able to be "neutral" in the war without having to leave the Republic. Before they leave, though, Satine tries to insist that Obi-Wan should go visit the Jedi Temple, try to see if any of his friends are currently there, just experience being there again, but he refuses. When she tries to push the issue, Obi-Wan snaps at her to drop it and insists that they just leave immediately. She does, and they leave without Obi-Wan being able to get anyone's contact information.

However, Satine is different after this. This was perhaps the first time in almost two decades that the two of them had actually worked TOGETHER on something and it reminded her of how they had used to be. It reminds her of the person Obi-Wan used to be, and the person he was supposed to become, the person he'd chosen to give up for her and her goals for Mandalore. And she hates the person she sees now, this defeated, jaded man she's helped create. So she goes back to him when they arrive on Mandalore and tries to talk to him again about why he didn't want to visit the Jedi Temple. Obi-Wan isn't receptive initially, asking her why she cares and rolling his eyes at her when she claims that she cares because she cares about him. But eventually, her gentle nudging gets him to admit that it would've hurt more than he could bear to walk in his home again knowing he couldn't stay. And it would've been too painful to see his people caught in a war that was killing them, to know just how many of his friends were now dead, and be unable to do anything to help them. It felt almost like it would've been insulting for him to have done so. Satine tells him that she doesn't quite understand, obviously, she'll likely never entirely understand how he feels, but she knows now that she doesn't NEED to understand. She just needs to accept how he feels and be there for him. She asks if there's anything she can do to help, and Obi-Wan is silent for a moment, almost stunned by this changed version of his wife, before telling her that there's nothing she can do to help him with this, but he'll let her know if that changes.

Their relationship doesn't really MEND afterwards, but it becomes less actively hostile. Satine tells him about her day sometimes, including the political things she gets involved in. She asks him questions about his time as a Jedi and listens when he chooses to say something (and when he tells her he'd rather not discuss it). They occasionally take meals together now, although they're often awkward and uncomfortable. Satine starts very VERY quietly looking into the option of a divorce. She doesn't say anything to Obi-Wan in case she can't follow through on it, but she at least wants to know her options.

When Padme shows up, she invites Obi-Wan to dine with them and when they go visit the children's hospital. When the council meets, she invites both Padme AND Obi-Wan, and it's the first time Obi-Wan ever sits in on a meeting with the council. Padme still asks to speak, but Obi-Wan tries to stay as unobtrusive as possible. Even during the rest of Satine's hunt for the perpetrator of the poisoned drinks, he keeps to himself. Right up until she starts threatening the innocent dock worker if he doesn't blow up the warehouse. He steps in and defends the dock worker's insistence that the warehouse could have evidence in it that could actually lead them to who allowed this to happen and while he understands her anger at the situation, making a statement isn't worth losing valuable time and information. Satine almost snaps back at him before his words sink in and she recognizes them to be true and she allows the warehouse to stay, but orders that it be quarantined and blocked off from the public.

Satine still wants to call for Jedi assistance in looking into the issue and Quinlan Vos is sent to help her. Obi-Wan remembers him from before he left, they'd been friends and he remembers being attracted to Quinlan and thinking Quinlan might have similar feelings back, but neither had acted on it and they hadn't quite known each other well enough to keep in contact after he married Satine. Much to Obi-Wan's surprise, he's no less attracted to Quinlan now than he was as a teenager, but it's not something he can actually act on and Quinlan is here to do a job anyway. But Quinlan remembers Obi-Wan, too, and takes the opportunity to get to know him again. His laid-back attitude and sarcastic quips start pulling Obi-Wan out of his shell a little. Satine takes a step back on this one and allows Obi-Wan to be her primary "ambassador" between the government and the Jedi representative, which allows Obi-Wan to get out and do something more productive to actually help Mandalore finally and gives him more time to bond with Quinlan. They discover the Prime Minister's secret black market dealings. Because they're still within the Republic, their supply of goods isn't actually THAT impacted, Almec is just a greedy asshole.

When Quinlan leaves, he insists on leaving his contact information with Obi-Wan and while he does warn that, due to the nature of his work, he likely won't be able to immediately respond very often, he'll make sure to always respond once he's in a position to do so and Obi-Wan should feel free to just keep sending/leaving messages for him. Obi-Wan says he'll think about it, but he sends his first message the next day. The contact is still pretty sporadic, Quinlan sometimes doesn't respond for a week or two at a time, but true to his word, he DOES always respond eventually and always seems happy to have received Obi-Wan's communications.

And then Maul invades Mandalore with Death Watch. Obi-Wan tries to speak up again when Satine says the people have made their choice, he tries to convince her that this fight is hardly over and if she was able to bring together all of the warring clans and force them into a 20-year-peace, she can fight this and keep Death Watch from outplaying her. She points out that Death Watch is armed while most of her guards were killed when the criminals attacked, but she agrees to at least TRY to negotiate and win back the hearts and minds of the people. When she and Obi-Wan show up to negotiate, Pre Viszla isn't there, Maul is, and he immediately kills her. Obi-Wan is barely able to escape because his use of the Force to hold Maul back shocks him enough to give Obi-Wan an opening and Bo-Katan shows up at the last second and gets him to a ship.

Obi-Wan is devastated by the events, obviously, he never wanted Satine DEAD or Mandalore run by a Sith and they'd just started to fix things between them, but a guilty part of him is also relieved because he's finally free. He goes to Coruscant to request asylum from the Republic and and he ends up staying within the Jedi Temple in order to receive their protection. The Jedi set Obi-Wan up with a mind healer to help him through not just the trauma of Death Watch and Maul's attack on Mandalore, but the impact of the entire last few decades since he left the Order. Obi-Wan immediately sheds his formal Mandalorian clothing and starts wearing Jedi robes again, he spends a lot of time reading in the Archives and meditating in the gardens and just wandering around the Temple and sort-of soaking up the serenity that still exists there despite the war and its effect on the Jedi. It's painful to know how many of his old friends and mentors are already lost, still, but there are still many left alive and the Temple still stands. It's still a bastion of hope. Instead of the painful visit he anticipated the last time he was on Coruscant, he can feel himself beginning to heal the moment he steps foot back in the Temple.

He speaks to Yoda quite a lot and while Yoda does ask if Obi-Wan has considered rejoining the Order, Obi-Wan isn't really sure. He'd obviously be a particularly unorthodox case since he'd need to finish (restart really) his training at a very old age and his old Master is long dead. Yoda tells him that Obi-Wan definitely isn't ready yet, he needs to heal a little more, but he hasn't lost as much of his training as he thinks he has, and after the war, they'll need more good Jedi to help replenish their numbers. Yoda promises to take him on as his last student if he does choose to come back, but also promises him that none of them will think any less of him if he decides it's no longer the right path for him to walk. Obi-Wan agrees to think on it.

Eventually, Obi-Wan meets Quinlan again and the attraction they'd once had for each other as teenagers rekindles and combines with the friendship they'd begun developing the last time they met. Obi-Wan is uncertain about having sex given that his only experiences with it have been the disastrous attempts at creating an heir with Satine that were so emotionally draining and so damaging to their relationship, but Quinlan takes it slow and makes sure they both have a good time and doesn't just walk away afterwards, but stays until the morning. They spend time training together, with Obi-Wan trying to remember what he'd been taught before and Quinlan giving him pointers and offering to spar whenever he's up to it.

One day, Obi-Wan is wandering the halls, just looking at the artwork on the walls of the Temple, when he hears someone address him as "Your Grace" and he turns to see Cody standing nearby. Obi-Wan is exceedingly happy to have confirmation that Cody has survived the intervening time since they'd last seen each other and offers to show Cody around the Temple a little (Cody's been given a tour before, but he opts not to tell Obi-Wan that, besides it's a big place and he'll probably have different places to show Cody than Ferus had). They end up spending all day together at the Temple and agree to meet up again before Cody has to leave. This time, Obi-Wan makes sure to get Cody's contact information before he goes and they continue to keep in contact with each other as often as they can.

Bo-Katan eventually shows up at the Temple and demands that he help her fix and restore Mandalore after Maul and Death Watch's takeover because he may have been an outsider, but he was married to Satine for two decades, he has a responsibility to Mandalore, etc etc. And he refuses. He gave his entire life to Mandalore, he gave up everything to try to help Satine fix Mandalore and look where it led. Satine is dead now, he won't make the same mistake twice. If Bo-Katan wants to try to fix what she broke on her home planet, she can go through the proper channels and ask the Republic Senate for assistance. He owes Mandalore nothing. Bo-Katan asks if he ever even loved Satine at all. He looks her dead in the eye and says, "Did you?" Bo-Katan leaves.

Maybe at one point, he ends up running into Anakin in the Temple, like maybe Anakin sits at Obi-Wan's table for a meal or something and he's clearly agitated, so Obi-Wan tries to be polite and ask if he's okay and because Obi-Wan is a complete stranger, Anakin sort-of snaps and tells Obi-Wan things he likely shouldn't. He's probably sleep deprived and caught up in his head and barely thinking about the ramifications of what he's doing, he's just upset and needs to talk to SOMEONE. Maybe he's had an argument with Padme or thinks she's cheating on him or something to that effect, so he can't talk to Padme and he hasn't been able to make it to Palpatine yet, so he's stuck at the Temple and Obi-Wan kind-of just ends up caught in the crossfire, for better or worse, and figures out not only that Anakin is married to a sitting senator (from a planet that doesn't allow their senators to be married no less), but that he did SOME kind of horrible thing not too long ago that his secret wife is aware of and that definitely breaks the Jedi code. Obi-Wan does his best to navigate the minefield that is this conversation before Anakin just sort-of wanders off and then immediately decides to report what he's learned to the Council.

The Council calls Anakin in and interrogates him about this and they speak to Padme to try to get to the bottom of it. Both of them deny it, but it turns out that the Jedi interrogating Anakin and Padme about it spurs one of Padme's handmaidens into finally bringing the evidence she's been collecting to the attention of the Naboo government. She has evidence of Padme being secretly married to a Jedi, evidence that Padme has used her relationship with Anakin to ensure he prioritizes Naboo, evidence that Padme has ditched her responsibilities as a senator to spend time with Anakin. And while Padme had no issue lying to the Jedi Council, especially when all they had was hearsay from one witness, she can't lie to her own government when it's her own handmaiden who is presenting all of this evidence against her. She HAS to confess and her confession inevitably brings down Anakin, too.

The Council offer Anakin the opportunity to make a different choice, to terminate his marriage with Padme and re-commit to the Order. He'd have to be removed from his position as a General in the GAR and grounded to the Temple to speak to a mind healer until the Council decided his commitment was genuine. Anakin initially refuses, but when he tries to go back to Padme, she turns him away. She chose to admit to having covered up Anakin's massacre of the Tuskens as well and that admission turned the accusations from something fairly simple to something much more heinous. Neither Naboo nor the Republic care about the Tuskens, but they do care about one of the Jedi charged with protecting them having massacred a village down to the last child and a sitting senator not reporting him for it. Palpatine has already laid the groundwork for the people of the galaxy to fear the Jedi, so this new information about Anakin is seen as proof that the Jedi could turn on anybody if sufficiently pushed. Padme is going to face serious consequences for covering it up, but the Queen steps in and promises Padme her protection if she agrees to terminate the relationship and promise she'll never see Anakin again. Padme agrees.

Anakin goes back to the Jedi before Palpatine can get to him and agrees to their terms. The relationship is over with Padme, he'll accept the demotion and the mind healing sessions in order to remain a Jedi because it's all he has left. Palpatine can't really speak to him because Anakin's basically under seclusion in the Temple. He's not really speaking to anybody. He does ultimately figure out that it was Obi-Wan who snitched to the Council about him and hates Obi-Wan for it and never wants to speak to him again. Obi-Wan has no problems with that, but he hopes Anakin figures out how to get better, that much anger can't be good for anyone. Ultimately, the mind healing starts to work. Anakin starts being just a little more mindful and starts accepting certain things about Palpatine so that when the Council offers him a job speaking to Palpatine and basically spying on him for the Council, he accepts in order to earn back their trust. Palpatine still tries to manipulate him, pulls out every trick in the book, but this time, Anakin has just enough of a buffer to keep from falling right back into Palpatine's orbit. He figures out Palpatine's a Sith, informs the Council, and ends up invited along when they go to arrest him. Palpatine doesn't survive.

And after that, it's just a matter of everyone settling into a happy fix-it AU. Anakin leaves the Jedi on amicable terms and goes off to do whatever, who cares. Padme stays on Naboo to reconnect with her family. The war ends, the Separatists probably have to realize how little of their government actually functioned and maybe gain a few clues about the atrocities done in their name. Some of them ultimately rejoin the Republic in the wake of these revelations, others refuse and try to continue their own government together, but this time they're actually able to make a treaty with the Republic. The clones are able to stand up for themselves and refuse to continue to be an army for a Republic no longer at war and the Senate votes to demilitarize. The Jedi's work doesn't end with the war, peacekeeping involves a lot more than just fighting after all and this is the part of the job all of them have been hoping to make it back to.

Obi-Wan decides to take Yoda up on his offer and rejoins the Jedi Order as Yoda's last Padawan to finish the journey he started so long ago.

[kanansdume]

I'm finding my views on Satine Kryze to be really following my views on Padme these days, which seems appropriate given that Satine has always felt like a knock-off Padme anyway and her entire existence is intended to help parallel Padme and Anakin's relationship.

But I really hated Satine when I first watched TCW a few years ago. I couldn't stand the way she treated Obi-Wan, I felt like the entire romance was pretty shoe-horned and ham-fisted and full of a lot of romance tropes between hetero couples that I'm not fond of. And I also interpreted the explanation we get about Mandalore's current peace and what had to be done to make it that way as... not great and kind-of a cultural extermination of some kind.

Since then I've followed a number of people who happen to love and defend Satine and her political choices, read through their metas about why the warriors being exiled to Concordia was a reasonable choice to make at the time. I've also read a few posts that still condemn that choice the way I did initially.

And while I think the INTENTION of the writing here was that this was a reasonable choice for Satine to make, that she was exiling the people who refused to be peaceful and practice their culture without trying to start a war all over again, the way it's said and written does NOT feel like that. At least, not to all of us.

For one, the usage of the term "warriors" in the line. They say they exiled "all the warriors" to a nearby moon. They don't say "we exiled everyone who refused to stop fighting and killing for a war that had already stopped" or "we exiled Death Watch who were a well-known terrorist group" or anything like that. They JUST say "warriors" which does feel vague enough as a description to feel like she is exiling literally everyone who happens to be someone who knows how to fight and has based their culture around being warriors, regardless of whether they were a problem or not. It also then feels hypocritical of her to have done so when she very clearly has guards who can fight on her behalf, so either she didn't exile ALL of the warriors or she managed to get a few people she decided to give exceptions to in order to learn how to protect her.

And because of this vagueness, the natural assumption to make from there is that Satine has basically forbidden everything that WENT ALONG with warrior culture: wearing armor, using weapons, learning how to fight, etc. Everything that we've been told via other media is VERY IMPORTANT to Mandalorian culture. I think we can reasonably decide that this was... PROBABLY not true, there's no canon evidence for this being true that I can recall. She never SAYS anything about forbidding armor or learning how to fight and only forbids OUTSIDERS from carrying weapons. She herself personally refuses to use lethal weapons and doesn't appear to wear any armor ever, but I don't think there's any mention of her not allowing other people to do so. Obviously her guards do in fact wear armor and carry weapons. She doesn't even condemn Padme for picking up a blaster to help fight off some smugglers at one point, despite that theoretically going against the rule of no outsiders carrying/using weapons.

Satine ALSO seems to be someone who does, to some degree, take a lot of pride in Mandalorian culture and traditions. She says as much when Padme shows up. So in some ways, it doesn't make sense that she'd entirely eliminate a portion of that culture so long as those who practiced it weren't using it to actively hurt other people.

That being said, Satine is someone who is... particularly implacable in her beliefs. We see this MOST clearly with Obi-Wan and the way Satine discusses the Jedi and the war with him and the way she condemns his entire people for fighting in the war at all, despite all of the obvious reasons TO fight the war that we have as the audience. It's never made canon in the show itself, but we also know from Lucas's interviews that the Jedi didn't even have a CHOICE about whether to join the war as Generals or not, they got drafted. But Satine appears unwilling to listen to Obi-Wan's reasoning, to hear him out on why they're working to protect people, to re-evaluate her personal definition of "peacekeepers" for someone else's culture. She never budges on this particular issue, not once. She and Obi-Wan basically just stop discussing it at some point.

So with that in mind, it does feel in character that Satine could be so insistent on keeping a war from happening that she could exile everyone who refused to stop practicing warrior traditions, regardless of whether they were hurting someone else or not. Especially if she was a young traumatized teenager at the time, reacting to a civil war that kept her on the run for a year and appears to have done a lot of damage to the planet.

And then we come to the part where they tell us that EVERYBODY who had been exiled had died out. Everyone. Within a span of TWENTY YEARS, which is not that long of a time. Which calls into question certain things like whether the people who were exiled were allowed to LEAVE it in order to find a place to live that accepted them so long as it wasn't within Mandalorian space. Were they allowed to make contact with other people to bring them resources and supplies or not. If they had just said "everybody left the moon and we assume they have since found refuge elsewhere" that would be different. But they all are supposedly DEAD, which to me speaks of a more concerted effort to not allow those people to leave and an equal effort not to take care of them. While it's entirely probable that this report was a LIE given by Pre Viszla and all of those people have simply now joined Pre's Death Watch, neither Satine nor anyone in her government appears to feel all that upset about it. It's not a tragedy that no one was able to stop in time, a dark spot upon their history and Satine's leadership that she acknowledges.

And that feels particularly condemning to me.

But the problem is that I don't think we're intended to see it that way. I don't think it was intentionally written as something the audience would actually condemn Satine for.

Which means that this is where we hit upon the Padme Problem. Which is when they care so little about their female characters that the nuances that are implied by the dialogue and writing are glossed over to the point that the character ends up seeming more of a terrible person than they were intended to be. Padme's brushing off of Anakin's massacre of the Tuskens makes her seem like a racist whose grand values suddenly don't exist, solely because Padme's motivations aren't the ones that matter in this scene and nobody cared enough about her when writing this to realize exactly how it would come off to an audience. With Satine, it's the unfortunate usage of the vague term "warriors" and the fact that they all died combined with her implacable attitude towards Obi-Wan and the Jedi which is a result of them using bad romcom tropes of the time for that relationship. All of which leads to Satine feeling like a tyrant who advocates for cultural extermination, because it's the only way some of these inconsistencies make any sense sometimes.

Which is too bad, because Satine perhaps COULD'VE been a better written character, could've been more interesting as one of the few characters in Star Wars who is actively advocating for pacifism and looking at how that fits into the world around her. But she just... isn't a better written character. Not unlike Padme. Or her sister.

[jelly-opal]

I keep getting anti-Obitine and anti-Satine content on my Tumblr for you page.

I’m sorry Tumblr, but do you even KNOW me?

[phoenixyfriend]

For the fandom OTP ask game: Star Wars, prequels or originals.

Send me a fandom and I will tell you my:

Gonna do this one for prequels because y'all know I'm a prequels gal

M/F OTP: Anidala. I know, I know, there are so many good ships to play with but I keep coming back to these because they are just so juicy. They love each other a lot and there is so much wrong with them.

M/M OTP: Rexwalker. It's just. Anakin's a lot of fun to write when he's in love.

F/F OTP: [heavy sigh] I know I'm not the only person that ships Padme/Ventress but if you're new here then. Yeah. I have thoughts and feelings about the Potential.

OT3: Unsurprisingly, it is Rexanidala.

Friendship OTP: There are a lot of ways to interpret Rex&Soka, but QPP is definitely up there.

Canon OTP: Not counting the above, let's do Obitine. I have Many feelings about them. [clenches fist] The Yearning.

Crackship OTP: So many but I'm a sucker for time-travel ships and specifically for Jango/Ahsoka.

Anti-OTP: Uhhhh honestly I don't know. I have a few blacklisted but even those I'm willing to read in the right mood or from the right writer. I guess Palpatine ships are a pretty big squick for me.

[blueboobutterfly]

I will die on this fucking hill.

You can enact change without destroying an entire culture, you can enact change without erasing an entire history of people. Satine had many fucking choices to let people continue to practice their culture but still have ways to decrease violence in your own community. Would it be easy? No. But it would have been the best route for Mandalorians when you can still appreciate and practice your heritage/culture. She could have worked with those who were willing to bring peace to Mandalore but still have their rights to their culture, and probably wouldn’t have died. Or have death watch and literal CRIME SYNDICATES RUNNING HER DAMN CITY AND UNDERGROUND. There were other factions of Mandalorians besides Death Watch, like the True Mandalroians (although scattered and smaller) and even Neutral Clans. Or Children of the Watch. All of these different clans to get different perspectives but the terrorist groups and her own. Even after she wasn’t on the run anymore she didn’t wanna learn or understand others, just wanted her own beliefs to be law. You can be a pacifist and still let people celebrate their culture. You can be a pacifist and still defend your people. YOU CANT BE A PACIFIST AND KICK ALL THE PEOPLE WHO OPPOSE YOU OFF THEIR OWN PLANET WHERE YOU SAY THEY MOST LIKELY DIED.

It’s not a good idea exiling anyone who didn’t share the same bullshit ultra pacifism beliefs from their own home world, and then also basically saying that anyone who follows a different belief from you isn’t ‘mandalroian’. That is cultural erasure, and borderline ethnic cleansing. Especially when you say that the exiles most likely died. And that’s not account for the fact most of the probably weren’t Death Watch. When nothing at the end of the day looks like your peoples heritage or culture you know how fucked up it is; not your music, your food, your clothes, your own Fucking people. When you erase and entire group of people from the population, because you don’t like something they do that you don’t is pretty fucked up.

So yea, fuck Satine and her New Mandalroian agenda. It’s a lie. And I also wanna mention I blame like all of the New Mandalroian leaders and hierarchy, they all are to blame for this shit. Especially you Almec. You curdled milk skinned bitch.