#fandom dynamics

[larrydoinglaundry]

this is your daily reminder that the fanfic you just read, are currently reading or are planning to read, has been brought to you by fellow fans entirely for free. there's weeks, months and sometimes even years of dedication and hard work behind it. there's hours and hours of research and editing. there's endless amount of love poured into those words you're seeing on your screen.

if you don't enjoy a story, that's alright. you can click out of it and move on with your day. tell yourself 'this wasn't for me, i'm gonna find something else'. what you shouldn't do is comment all the flaws you found from it and all the things you thought the story would have needed. you don't have to find the author and tell them to kill themselves because you thought that the story you just read was "disgusting". and you definitely don't have to comment on the author's appearance as it has absolutely nothing to do with the story you just "wasted your time on". and what you really don't need to do is discuss the fic like it's been written by a professional author with professional editors. fanfics are and have always been, written by fans for other fans. we do it as hobbyists. out of love for writing.

i know that talking about this topic is like talking into the void. the hatred this fandom spews on authors who don't write the kind of stories they want is cruel in unimaginable ways. it's been like this for years, people have driven so many authors away, yet nothing ever changes. unfortunately not everyone even wants a change, vice versa. what they want is drive specific authors away because their content is not what they desire. and as unfortunate as that is, they've been successful a lot of times.

to every miserable and sad soul that keeps going after fic authors you dislike: i'm truly sorry you don't have anything else to do in your life than harrass other people. i hope some day you will find some love in your life.

and you, a fellow fic author doing this to another author: i genuinely hope you don't have to experience it ever.

[twopoppies]

Hello Gina, I hope you have a good day, I don't know how to say this, but with Louis' last statement about Larry, it leaves me a little bored on the subject, I mean, the memes and some people on tumblr make it enjoyable, but I dislike them That always with these types of moments as a fandom it leaves us crazy and deranged, I have seen people outside the fandom speak badly of Larry, and I dislike it, I still believe it, but it bothers me that Louis always has to do this, I go to his concerts in Latam, and I was happy to buy merch, in addition to worrying about transportation that day, I know that that day I will forget everything that happened at the press conference, but at this moment Louis bores me a lot.

Sorry i dont speak english

Your English is fine, darling.

I think at various times a lot of people in this fandom feel bored and frustrated with both Harry and Louis. It’s unfortunately a by-product of paying attention to and dissecting every single detail of what they do. Doing that means the curtain is pulled back and we see the very ugly side of the music industry and it’s impossible to remove Harry and Louis’ involvement in the aspects of what we don’t like.

Years ago, it was easy to blame everything on Modest. Or Simon. Or Sony. These days, “the bad guys” are less clear and we have to admit that Harry and Louis both do things that might not align with our own morals or sense of how things should be handled.

For me, I’ve come to realize that I don’t know all the parts of the puzzle. What their careers and opportunities and decisions look like to me, may look completely different to them. And they really are the only ones who can judge whether they’re acting appropriately. I’ve said from day one that I think they are both fundamentally good human beings who are trying to maintain their sense of morality while also trying to be successful and create long term careers in an industry that’s controlled by absolutely vile people who would sell their mothers for a dollar. I still believe that.

But that doesn’t mean it isn’t hard to see them do some of the things they do. To be very honest, I think we would all be a lot happier if we pulled back a few degrees and enjoyed the music and the appearances and various interviews, but didn’t consume and analyze every single breath they take 24/7.

None of that is easy when you’ve been super involved for a long time. But everything about fandom, their careers, and most likely their goals, has changed and I’m not interested in stubbornly digging my heels in and insisting on it all being the same as it was 10 years ago. I’d rather adapt with the time and mourn my losses, but still be able to love these boys and their music like I always have.

I hope you can find a way back to enjoying Louis the way you used to. ❤️

[skepticalarrie]

Hey Allie! Missed you loads. Seeing you here again makes me so happy! I've got a bit of a random question, but you always give the best answers for stuff like this. So, do you reckon 2023 was a tough year for larries? Ily <3

Hello nonnie! I miss you guys, too 🤗

Well, I guess it all comes down to your perspective and what you take away from the whole experience. It's impossible and unfair to talk for *all* the larries, especially these days. But I think 2023 was a year that many people got tired of the same old dynamics, whether it was Harry's stunts or Louis' documentary. It hit everyone differently. Personally, I realized I can't dive into certain things anymore; it just gets me too upset, and I can't stomach it after all this time. On the bright side, there were some awesome moments, like Louis' tour. Plus, there's a portion of this fandom that knows how to have a great time and stay positive no matter what, and that's pretty inspiring to witness IMO, HL aside.

[awesomefringey]

I'm a twitter larrie, although not a twarrie, even though I'm a recent member of the fandom (around 1.5 years in).

But I agree, twitter timeline is getting really toxic around these days, especially if people don't follow the right people, or they check the "for you" part. I do think it's very important to mute or block people who we think constantly provide into the chaos on twitter, otherwise it's really easy to get surrounded with toxic people or crazy theories, even if those people are larries.

To be honest lately I almost spend no time on the timeline, I'm a member of some really nice groupchats, and I even met some people from there personally on shows. I'm not saying we agree on everything, but the major points (Larry, L not a dad) are not questioned there.

Unfortunately new larries (regardless if they're on twitter, tiktok or even here) don't do any research, they just love the theory of Larry (I think they're more Larry shippers than real larries), and eat up everything they're presented to. And one of the most complex thing to understand is bbg, and it seems they're not willing to dive into it.

And tbh I could understand why. If there's a twitter larrie with a really good and detailed thread of bbg, but their next thread is about L watching the sunset in an adidas hoodie means the day before yesterday he was together with H, which is an utter nonsense, people tend to think the bbg thread was nonsense too. And unfortunately it happens a lot.

I spend most of my larrie time on twitter, because that's where I have my lovely groupchats, and I also post some stuff regularly, but if I need to factcheck anything, I always come to tumblr.

Hi nonnie, thank you for chiming in. I hate to add to the fandom division, so your perspective is so very welcome and shows there are like-minded people on every app who don’t want to participate in berating and fighting each other.

You made some very good points there about Larries being shippers for the cute idea of it but also feeling too uncomfortable reading up on babygate.

To be fair, I would very much love for us all to settle the battles about this kid and NEVER speak about him again. Let’s agree to disagree and move forward NOT ever discussing Louis’ questionable fatherhood, Briana’s questionable pregnancy, Freddie’s questionable name and upbringing ever again.

But I don’t think that will people stop from trying to make a child a celebrity, stalking his whereabouts, making fan accounts for a little boy (and have Stanley Tucci follow them). Because those who are so rEspECtFuL accepting Freddie as Louis’ son are out there memefying a minor and use him to quench their thirst for super dad Louis content. And honestly that’s just a problematic.

[indiaalphawhiskey]

India your last tags!! It's driving me bonkers. People are just throwing around the word misogyny willy-nilly and think they are doing something. What is so damn hard to understand about the fact that some woman can be shitty people and I don't have to like them? Am I supposed to like JK Rowling because she's a woman? Is me calling out the shitty things she's done misogynistic? Now granted I don't think Olivia and JK's actions and behaviors are comparable but you get my point lmao.

Misogyny is always a contentious topic in this fandom, and I’m really hesitant to get into it, because for the most part, people will hear what they want to hear and use it as they see fit.

But I will say this:

There are undeniably contexts where feminism is a blanket policy, there’s no discussion on that. All women should be respected as human beings. All women should have a right to bodily autonomy. All women should have equal opportunities in education and the work place. All women who identify as women should be respected as women. These are universal, and are intrinsically deserved, regardless of any individual moral or ethical performance, based solely on the fact that women are human and nothing else, because they are human rights. All humans deserve them, and unfortunately, we live in a reality where, apparently, that’s still debatable.

So, for the most part, I get it. We get defensive because we live our lives on the defensive. We’re attuned to every minor slight because we’re a predominantly female-identifying fandom focused on the inner workings of lives of male celebrities, and naturally it’s going to get hairy in the moments where we’re forced to navigate things like beards and stunts, etc, because it very much feels counterintuitive to our known feminism, and like we’re being purposefully primed to be pitted against these women.

So, again, I get it. I get being cautious. I get having heightened alarm bells. I get watching our mouths and each other’s backs. That’s our trauma response, as women. That’s us not wanting to contribute to a system we’re still battling.

But refusing to acknowledge that a person is doing harmful things (a lot of them to other women, in fact) just because they’re a woman isn’t feminism. Giving women a pass, and lowering an objective moral and ethical standard for them isn’t feminism. Allowing them to treat other people poorly, especially in professional settings, or allowing them to make everything about sex to the detriment of other people’s comfort (I’m talking about Flo’s comfort, btw), and worse, people who are their subordinates, isn’t feminism.

The crux of feminism is that we are all human, we are all equal, and therefore deserve to be treated as such. Humans do good things and bad things, humans make strategic decisions that sometimes hurt other people, humans misfire, and humans face consequences, and denying women that complexity is actually dehumanizing them.

Do women, particularly, face unique pressures that affect these decisions, and make it harder to make the right one? Of course. Are some of Olivia’s bad decisions directly attributable to the patriarchy? Absolutely. That doesn’t make them right. That doesn’t mean we should ignore them. That doesn’t mean she’s due a moral pass, because again, women do not need an objective moral standard to be lowered in order for them to meet it.

Basically, the problem with refusing to acknowledge individual context and nuance when arguing against misogyny is that it makes the argument performative. It’s a way to cover your ass, because you know that people on the internet only have enough attention span for a snapshot, and it’s much easier to stay on the right side of history when you say something consistent and definitive like “don’t criticize women at all!” as opposed to actually delving into the intricacies of the situation, because, let’s face it, who has the time, right?

(And, because I’m sure it needs to be said: none of this absolves Harry from his part in these bad decisions. None of this infantalizes him, or assumes he was somehow chained to a basement pipe forced into this stunt. He is also human. He also makes good and bad decisions. He also misfires, in the name of strategy, and I’m aware of that. Agreeing to this stunt was a misfire, in every way possible, but in this situation, his responsibilities are to himself. He’s not the director of this movie. He has no relationship with her children, or control over how she chooses to leverage them in media. He hasn’t actively pushed DWD to the public as a movie about female hunger, or focused it on his sex scenes. In fact, he’s barely marketed it directly at all. And that’s why this post isn’t about him.)

[faithinlouisfuture]

yall getting happy some larries are turning solo louies... he doesn't need that, those people will always be hung up on harry anyway and bring him up at the most odd times resulting in louis getting hate (and without mentioning I know some converted "solo" louies who still listen to harrys music) he needs new fans, locals or from other fandoms but new fans period.

absolutely agree with your last sentence, that’s what louies have been screaming about for years now, unfortunately his team and label don’t seem to want to work towards that

also about people who still listen to Harry even if they say they’re solo louies; it’s not a crime to have questionable taste in music/art, as long as they’re not disrespecting Louis and connecting his every breath to that ogre, they can listen to whatever tf they want

the term “solo louie” itself is something that needs to go extinct in my opinion, either you’re a louie or you’re not, it’s as simple as that

[fansplaining]

We just released our newest episode—our 16th (!) Ask Fansplaining Anything—to patrons at $2 a month and up. 📨 Pledge to get early access to this and all future episodes!

[takenquicklys]

i think that’s there’s a really interesting fandom dynamic going on where people have gotten the idea that any kind of engagement with an author is a good thing, and it’s not. this post talks about comments, but i’ve noticed that (esp with really friendly authors) it extends beyond comments. authors are not content machines. we as readers need to remember that, “i need more now!” “omg when is this coming” “when is your next ___ being published,” especially with no other commentary attached, is not kind, or helpful, or actually expressive of your thoughts about their work. i get it- we say these kinds of things because we enjoyed what we read so much that we’d consume more of it in an instant. i know that most of the time the person behind these kinds of remarks is trying to be nice. but it attaches value to the author’s ability to create more content, rather than to them as a person or what they’ve already created. if you liked a fic and would read more, leave a kudos. or even a five word, “i liked this it was good” comment. that’s more encouraging than demanding new content will ever be.

[twopoppies]

https://x.com/teaandfrozenpea/status/1715702786392789371?s=46

🥲am tired… is this like normal occurrence every couple of weeks that someone or the other come and refuse larry being real?? I sometimes feel pissed at HL as they made sure everyone were aware that they’re together and fought for it for a while and someday decided that its their personal life and refused to say or indicate anything about it..

I don’t understand why you care what some idiot opening act thinks about anything involving Louis’ personal life. And just to be clear, Louis did not flip off a Larry sign.

But, beyond that, I’m going to guess that you haven’t been around for all that long, so I’d like to just take a minute to give you my opinion on a few things.

“Larry” isn’t a game or a mystery to solve. Harry’s and Louis’ personal lives aren’t a puzzle to solve where we win at the end when we were right. None of us have the right to be angry at them for the interpretations we made and chose to believe.

If you have any empathy at all, try to imagine yourself in their shoes. Imagine being as young as they were when they fell in love. Imagine having every aspect of your life controlled and being constantly punished for who you are and who you love. Imagine how that level of control was all you’d really know for five solid years. I don’t know how old you are, but I know that when I was their age I wasn’t capable of understanding how my life might change 10, 20+ years down the road. So what I wanted when I was 16-23 was not the same as when I was 29-31. And it absolutely wasn’t the same as when I was 40. Or 50. Things change. That doesn’t mean that what I wanted when I was 20 was wrong.

I don’t blame them for one second for wanting to express themselves, for wanting to show the world who they were. And I don’t blame them for realizing how much the scrutiny of the world negatively affected them and for deciding to “claw back” some sense of privacy once they were allowed to.

If the main reason you’re in this fandom is for them to come out so you can celebrate how it affects you, then I think you probably should find something better to do with your free time. You’re never going to be happy with them because their purpose isn’t to give you constant reassurance that they’re queer or that they’re dating.

[skepticalarrie]

Hey, I haven't been around for that long, but has there ever been an attempt in the fandom to just not pay the stunts any mind? I always thought, it's working because the fans make it work by talking about it. And another question: Is this the longest Louis has been without a stunt?

Yes, IIRC there was an attempt ages ago (at least on tumblr), mostly when Louis’ stuff was happening and we felt like we were the majority and no one believed that shit or Harry’s stunts whatsoever. I totally get what you're saying – the fans are the ones making everything happen. But trying to have this kind of control over it is absolutely unrealistic and frustrating. Like I said, even when things were very different around here, it was useless trying to ignore it. If one person is giving attention and being loud about it is already enough to keep it going. Not to mention that a) those stunts aren't aimed at us, who are the ones worrying about that. So whether we're discussing it or not, it probably won't change much. And b) you can't really tell people how to handle their feelings about these stunts. Some people just need to talk through every tiny detail to deal with it, I’ve been there myself. So I mean, we can’t single-handed control it, especially now that the fandom's split into all these different categories with their own vibes.

As for Louis, I think you meant without any romantic PR stunt.. and yes, I think it’s safe to say this is the longest he’s been without being connected with anyone romantically. But there’s a compensation with babygate so yeah the price you have to pay, I guess.

[awesomefringey]

WOW

I’M WHEEZING!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Hoping Naomi gets the very special forces sent her way!!!

[birb-reblogs]

Re. self-censorship and virtue signaling in younger generations-

The amount of discord servers I've poked my head into that require using spoilertext for words like 'killing', 'death', 'nazis', 'drugs', or 'dehumanization' is wild. Just the Scary Word itself censored and the surrounding context intact. It's goofy and performative. I don't know if there are people out there who go into real hysterics over seeing the word 'drugs' and feel benefited by rules like this, but even if they do it seems so... unhealthy in the long-term.

I feel like overzealous self-censorship and constantly walking on eggshells leads to maladaptive coping skills. It's like how exposure to some germs is good for children's immune systems as they grow, and kids raised in perfectly clean and sterile conditions are actually more vulnerable to infection and sickness. If someone requires the mere mention of an scary idea to be censored- what kind of tolerance level are they creating for themselves? How do they expect to cope in the real world or potentially discuss and confront difficult issues in their life?

There's no capacity to talk about why these subjects are uncomfortable or engage with them in a safe and thoughtful environment, and the onus is placed on the community and not the individual to manage their discomfort curate their own experience.

[statementlou]

Can you help me explain what rads thought was gospel? And that algorithm thing what was that? Thank you!!

oof I'm not going to really do this justice, but the whole party line of this huge segment of fandom (which bleeds heavily into discourse in larrie circles without people really realizing it- people will accept certain things as fact and then use them to base arguments off of without realizing that those ideas are just things said without basis by people who also believe, for example, that Harry is actively working to sabotage Louis' career because he hates him) is that Louis is constantly fighting his label and team because they force him to do things (like for example the reason he talks about stunt stuff is because otherwise 'THEY' won't 'LET' him tour rather than, the choices and trade offs a closeted person makes to make it in the industry are complex and sometimes shitty) and that his label and team don't do the things they should to support him and that powerful people in the industry are actively working to sabotage his career to the extent of paying radio stations NOT to play his songs because he crossed people while in 1D. And so they are very protective of him, which is nice right like aren't we all, but specifically with an inflated sense of self importance-- we have to do promo for Louis because NO ONE ELSE WILL, his label doesn't do anything the only reason any of his releases have any success at all is fan projects (yes people seriously believe this)-- and with feeling sorry for him like POOR LOUIS HE IS SO OPRESSED BY THE POWERS THAT BE (and by Harry, lol) OUR POOR HELPLESS VICTIM BABY. Louis himself, in contrast, has spent the last few years repeating that he would rather people did not feel sorry for him in a way its hard not to feel is pointed, and telling us that he has chosen to do something other than chase number ones in a way that also feels pointed (especially that he would keep repeating that while occasionally also admitting that well... it would be all right if it happened! and making some efforts to see if he can make it happen without compromising what he wants to do), and we have seen firsthand all the things his label and team are doing (including A LOT of promo) and how well it is all working. But you still get folks who will say that he's lying, he's being made to say that stuff, that his team are lying- I literally saw a post saying that the head of BMG Italy was lying about the capacity of the Milan show, that it wasn't really 17k or whatever it was, to make it look like Louis was doing well when really his tour was flopping because BMG didn't want to do their job, or, something. IDEK. So when someone says 'wow look the algorithm put Louis on a spotify indie playlist!', maybe they just don't understand how spotify/promo/capitalism work and think that's how you get a new single on spotify playlists (it's not; your label/ team pay them) but just as likely they are coming from a place of, we know his team doesn't do promo (because some people on tumblr said so) so this must be how it got there!

In today’s article we learn tons about exactly what is being done behind the scenes, and we get Louis saying how he chose the people he works with and is happy with that choice and that it bothers him to be pitied. But I can tell you with certainty that at least one person will unfollow me for this, 3 others I don’t know about will block me, and nothing will change any more than it has at any other point over the last 3 years when he told us the same stuff :/  it’s always simpler to have a villain to be mad at when things happen that aren't what you want (Louis coming out, Louis being the biggest pop star in the world, whatever) after all

[ladyaj-13]

I posted a little thousand word Ted Lasso one shot, and in the eight hours it’s been on AO3 it’s racked up more hits and kudos than anything else I’ve written this year 😳