#grammys discourse

[please-someone-give-me-love]

I just find curious how we got the "cope with it" treatment when we talked about BTS not getting a grammy and how "imature" we look complaining about that situation but when it came for their whiteys it is completely okay to hate on other winners, to question other nominees, how is good looking to feel sad when their fav artists didn't win and how media played them in a respectful and healthy way but we couldn't get to be sad because "it's ridiculous" and yes, hate is not good, no excusing that but people over exaggerate the hate some of those artists got at the moment in comparision on how much hate some artists are getting because other arist won the same category, but they are not calling them toxic or inmaature but they are looked compasive and empathic, BTS couldn't express themselves without getting laughed at their feelings but other artist could and everyone feels sorry.

We can't say anything about their hypocrisy because then "we are making everything about our favs", honey, we couldn't even talk at the moment but we can't talk now, but why not? Why can't we criticize obvious xenophobic and hypocrite reactions from other fandoms and the academy itself? The moment you can understand that even if they gae an award to a black artist and still be racist towards black people and asians then we could actually ggrow tf up

[sammykiszkamyass]

"i don't like taylor sw-" WOMP WOMP‼️

[beautifulpersonpeach]

https://twitter.com/mhereonlyforbts/status/1712181142789542327

Out of all the members, Jimin has the most grammy submissions. After all the noise Bpp, of Hybe favoritism in only submitting JK for awards, after all the chaos and fighting and insults rained on jk, BTS, Hybe, after all the victimizing, fear-mongering, hate, discourse about how Hybe was not submitting Jimin and only pushing JK.

After all that, Jimin has the most Grammy submissions out of every BTS member. I checked some Pjm pages after the full list came out today and all of them are ignoring it. Nary a pip from them Bpp.

Just like how it was when the BB article came out or when Jimin renewed his contracts.

You're right these people really do act like taekookers where the reality has nothing to do with their beliefs. It's just insecurities, anxieties and hate. Thank you for keeping this blog open truly. It's one of the few tethers I have to sanity in this fandom.

***

Your link, Anon.

You can say this now because Jimin has the most submissions, but what do you think would've happened if he had the least or if Like Crazy wasn't submitted?

I'll let you think about that for a bit.

For me, it wouldn't change a thing. Because ultimately this is Jimin's career, I trust that he is intelligent and capable of managing his own affairs and especially achieving the key desires he has for his career. I know that every BTS member values their team and is able to balance their own ambitions with that of their team, and that they are all aware of their own plans and desires more than any group of fans claim to be.

All the hate those fools heap on Jungkook is frankly just copium. They're simply awful people who cannot accept the reality that they know very little and have almost no real influence over Jimin or BTS's choices. They roam the internet looking for an outlet for their frustration and hate. These are people who aren't intelligent enough to recognize their hate of those closest to Jimin won't bring Jimin any closer to achieving his stated goals.

I love that Jungkook is asserting himself however and whenever he likes, I love that he's putting himself out there trying various collabs even if they aren't my taste, I love that he's having his moment, sometimes alongside all the other members.

Joon is getting ready to release his stuff too. He's come live several times in the last few weeks and I can tell he's excited, and that too warms my heart. And then there's Jimin. Blessing, soothing, and turning us on all at the same time during Jimtober.

I've already talked about my views on the Grammys which lean more pessimistic than not, and it's going to take some effort but I will try to treat that event like an afterthought. Even then, it makes me happy to see all the guys able to toss their hats in for a nomination, all while advancing their own projects and putting out new music.

It feels very good to be ARMY right now.

(It's always a lovely day when Jimin Jimins)

[statementlou]

I was just wondering, about Harry's "people like me" line, I know the whole message is about being queer and etc. but the thing that confuses me is that some people is pushing that he was once in the "working class" but isn't H quite "posh" before One-D? Right? I actually don't get the narratives people are pushing tbh, what can you say about it (genuinely asking)

Well in fact I don't think he does mean queer by that, and I don't think it would make any sense if he did, if he was saying queers never get to be famous pop stars! I think that would be extremely wrong if anyone said it, but the idea of Harry saying it is especially ludicrous given his interest in and knowledge of the incredible lineage of queer musicians he is a part of, such as the 70s rockers he takes so much of his aesthetic from like David Bowie, Elton John, Mick Jagger, Freddie Mercury, and all the other artists he pays tribute to in various ways through his outfits and show playlists and so on.

I do believe he means because he's just a regular working class guy from a small town in England who got lucky on a television show. And no, he wasn't posh before TXF. I feel like that's a narrative that comes partially from images pushed by the early 1D machinery and partially from some aspects of the way his accent sounds to non British people, but while his family was not in poverty or hungry, he absolutely did not belong to a class of people who could reasonably expect to have opportunities to find themselves on the grammys stage in California without a one in ten million arrangement of lucky chances. As someone who knows him and has seen him talk many times, it was heartwrenchingly apparent how overwhelmed he was in that moment, he was shaky and had no idea what to say or if he could manage to get it out before he started crying and so he reached for a familiar thing he says every night on stage, choked it out and got off the mic. But the people watching in this case weren't his adoring concert crowd and didn't know and love him or care about that and weren't thinking about him being from a boyband or a reality show and how much people might look down on him in the industry for that, and without context (and in the context of Beyonce being denied yet another AOTY award) it wasn't the best thing he could have said. I'm glad for him that he's free of the 1D managers trying to shut him up from behind every camera, but possibly he could benefit from consulting with experts a little bit here and there. In specific, given that his analysis around his privilege as a white person is, well, not very advanced, if he wants to avoid situations where he pisses people off just like this he should hire a person of color to consult him on such things, which is in fact a thing that some white people in positions where they say things publicly do to avoid saying things that come off very badly/ are offensive on account of just being a bit oblivious.

[clarabowmp3]

The whole temper thing has such double standards imo too because for example — Taylor was absolutely crucified for not giving a hug to Celine Dion on stage, saying she was rude, selfish, oblivious, etc. A bitch! But Travis can scream and shove at a coworker of authority and it’s just that he’s passionate? Taylor was slandered for not hugging somebody in a rushed high pressure moment who has a jumpy health condition - imagine if she was seen screaming at tree, or her dancers, or her band on stage? Would anyone give her any benefit, that she’s just passionate about her show and needs it to go correctly? Why do men get to be VIOLENT and have it excused. Sure football is alr violent in nature but do we see other players behaving that way? If they do they’re usually suspended…..

so late to this i hope ur still around anon 😭😭 and this is SO REALL it reminds me of when the girls in my class would close one eye or make excuses for the guys and the fucked up shit they would do and its so frustrating to see a similar mindset in the general public. but after the johnny depp/amber heard trial its not exactly unexpected either.

in my experience this double standard is typically perpetuated by football bros who just want to pile hate on the woman infesting their games (who has generally been seen as stereotypically feminine/superficial to the public for most of her career) and tbh those kind of ppl dont rlly have anything worth saying so I don't take them seriously. like, if someone is arguing that aggression of that level is in any way or context justified.....they are not going to contribute anything meaningful to the discussion so

kind of off topic but I was talking to some new friends (!!) I made at my uni orientation yesterday and we were all kind of ranting abt the horrible guys we had as classmates and one of them brought up a rlly interesting point on intersectionality; ie things like respecting others regardless of race, gender, sexual orientation being seen as feminine (or in the context of the general public, 'woke') and so these guys do everything they can to seem the exact opposite (such as spewing andrew tate ideologies during class...be sooo ffr right now)

[transnbgenderqueeeeeer]

Hot take: harry styles' queerness or lack of should have no influence on our anger and disappointment in what he said at the awards.

Our outrage should stem from the fact he failed to use his privileges to address the obvious systemic discrimination that was/is literally occurring in the moment.

We are in no place to judge how queer he is and whether the harassment/discrimination he's said he faces/alluded to is legitimate or not.

Honestly with everything that happened with Kit you'd think y'all'd've learned to stop deciding you're the end all be all of someone's identity.

[crmsndragonwngss]

The original post by Discog. Discourse has since been deleted, but the screenshot is still floating around, so I figured I should probably mention it.

Courtney LaPlante did not say this. She’s only ever said that it’s an honor to lose to Metallica and she’s happy to be able to celebrate with her band.

Apparently this podcast also routinely makes digs at Erra, including a recent mean-spirited one that I did not see cuz I don’t follow these clowns and they deleted it, so yeah, maybe they should just stop. Like jokes are fine, but bullying and spreading flat out lies are not

Misinformation isn’t cool, guys. Correct it when you see it

[awesomefringey]

This type of tweet makes Harry look bad and gets more hate. Thanks again Ben. https://twitter.com/musicstruggles1/status/1622497533724446720?s=46&t=Z5zWaXmafNThGPF-dPWh3A

The fact that during Harry’s biggest solo career moment ever, the gp was forced the producer‘s name down their throats like he’s a celeb on his own, is the fame hungriest thing Ben Winston has managed to do in the last years.

He could’ve monitored the direction of the spinning stage instead of his social media. I’m so pissed off at this guy.

(Not even going into the implications of Harry’s album win. People latched onto that information immediately to question Harry’s win.)

[iwatcheditbegin]

I love the amount of chiefs taywarriors I keep seeing

[beautifulpersonpeach]

Thought on the chatter around JK and grannie noms? I feel like I have so many flying around at once I can't even break it down on a more focus question the whole situation gives me indigestion

***

Lmao!

I got an ask some days ago, asking me what event exactly will trigger the worst of the fandom implosion. I didn't answer it, but Anon if you're reading this, one of the things I think is likely to trigger it is Jungkook being nominated for a Grammy. Something I think is guaranteed to set it off though, is Jungkook winning a Grammy or some other k-pop group getting a nomination/win.

So, if you're feeling queasy at the prospect of only JK getting a nom, I totally understand why. People will completely flip out lmaoo. We'll see the most quiet people rain hell against the company, the members (Jungkook), the fandom, everyone will be catching strays and all the 'OT7s' who are currently comfortable with accommodating the opinions of akgaes / solo stans even when they hate other members, all those kinds of ARMYs will turn full solo. K-pop stans will be circling the fandom like sharks who smell blood in the water. It will be the most hilarious, chaotic, mass meltdown in recent times. It will start off slow too, but once those grumblings reach critical mass, it will all go to hell.

Everyone will be playing the blame game. And the people in the minority like me, who don't think this is such a bad thing and would be genuinely overjoyed if JK gets a nomination/win, those of us like that will lose all credibility and social capital. Because the majority is convinced fair = equal in every specific outcome, and that's just not how life works. Much less life in a team of people you trust. At risk of sounding glib. But this is just not something a lot of people get, they're too cynical to think it's a lived reality for many people, which is why I think some people are just kinda destined to be solo stans if they're prone to thinking in a certain way.

Anyway, I think it's worth remembering for the 2024 Grammys, that the world doesn't end before 2026, and that BTS plan to be around for a long, long time. The Grammys are a local award, and BTS may or may never get one in their career as a group (whether or not JK gets one), but they'll have many opportunities to. The hyper-reactionary behaviour of the fandom is unnecessary. BTS are fundamentally talented artists and they will all get their flowers whether or not the Grammys wake up to that fact. I think we'd all be much better off if more people took a wider perspective.

[myfandomrealitea]

The reaction to Harry winning a Grammy literally just proves that people hate him because he's Harry Styles. Its the whole 'resent what's popular' thing in real-time. Beyoncé still made history. She still won, just not that category, and she's still now a literal record-holding POC female artist and you're still not happy because a queer white boy who's ~mainstream~ won something.

Heckling him while he's on stage at an award's ceremony and making him feel guilty for the fact that he's a talented artist who rightfully won an award (because him being friends with someone in charge means literally nothing, Harry's lost out on awards before regardless) is honestly just childish and frankly embarrassing.

I'm not a fan of certain artists. I don't have a good opinion of others. But you don't see me trashing their hard work and their efforts and any well-earned rewards. Beyoncé literally did not "lose out" on anything. She wasn't snubbed from anything. She put her album up for consideration and lost. That's it. If she had been snubbed she wouldn't have attended or been up for anything in the first place.

[clarabowmp3]

My tongue is so bitten by resisting the urge to ask all the Swifties who cannot shut up about Joe Alwyn what their favourite movie and tv show by that guy is! It's clear their really invested in him and his career for some reason.

LOLLL frfr this reminds me I should probably watch normal people (I think he was in an adaptation of that? Unless I’m mixing it up with conversations with friends). I rmb reading it pre-booktok and going ‘absolutely not’ after the first few chapters (I think it’s cuz it felt so pretentious to me, but the way it’s now one of my fav styles of writing after 4 more years of English lit 🤡🤡)

And yea they keep moaning and groaning about joe using taylor for clout but they’re literally the ones who won’t stop discussing him 😭

[itsokbbygrl]

Your reasoned take on Harry’s speech is so refreshing. All the - anyone who thinks he isn’t perfect is the enemy and we must defend him at all costs - energy is so ridiculous and frankly embarrassing for the fandom.

I agree this is a big PR fail by Harry and HSHQ. What I’m thinking about more now is if this isn’t just a PR problem, but that Harry really is mostly oblivious about his privilege. This doesn’t mean he’s not a good guy! But I also think questions and criticism around this are fair, and I think it’s on him to be more aware and educate himself, not just about the PR aspect, but about the underlying substantive issues.

Thank you for your kind words! I completely understand the knee jerk defensive reaction from fans, but there is a seriously needed empathetic maturity in stepping out of our fandom bubble and considering other perspectives when things like this happen. It was a blunder, and I think it was an honest mistake rooted in under-preparedness.

Personally I think Harry is very aware of his privilege and 9 times out of 10 does the right thing by using his platform to elevate marginalized voices. Harry is also notably shy and quieter when he’s not in performance mode. I really think his team just didn’t prep him for speeches, and so when he won AOTY he defaulted to something he might say at one of his shows—a place where he does quick gratitude speeches regularly and where people know his background and can see his perspective and (likely correctly) interpret what he meant. The problem at the Grammys being of course that the audience was not in fact full of his fans who know who he is and where he came from, but average folk who may have heard his music at some point and maybe recognize his name, but just see some rich white boy winning another award, and in doing so snubbing multiple women of color (one of whom has been nominated for that award 4 times and has never won despite likely being the most deserving nominee on more than one occasion). The fact that Harry has connections with Ben Winston and had Ben’s daughter’s voice on the album that won the award didn’t help things either.

My biggest beef is with his team because like, cmon. Not one person thought to hire a speech writer? Harry was nominated for NINE awards, one of which was the biggest of the night, and they didn’t prep a speech if he won?? This doesn’t absolve Harry of any blame, they were his less-than-perfect words after all, but in the grand scheme of things if you’ve hired people to help manage your career, of which this was a part, then that team should’ve had your back and made sure all the I’s were dotted and T’s were crossed to prevent this kind of preventable misstep.

[tim-hoe-wan]

Call them out Viola!