#Lore theories

[ideas-on-paper]

The origin of the term "Sweepers"

Lies of P fun fact of the day: The name of the Sweepers probably originates from the crossing sweepers of Victorian times - usually destitute children, disabled or elderly people who swept the pathways for well-off pedestrians.

19th century streets were commonly teeming with dirt, mainly horse dung due to all the carriages on the roads (you can see a fair bit of broken-down carriages in Krat), but also food waste and other kinds of refuse. This “mud” created an inconvenience for rich folks - particularly ladies with their long dresses - who wanted to cross the streets without soiling their fine clothes.

This is where the crossing sweepers came in, who stood at the ready to clear a path for any passersby with their broom, receiving a tip in return for their service (unless the lady or gentleman was particularly stingy). Being a crossing sweeper was considered as just one step above begging, and it was one of the last resorts for poor people to earn a “honest living”.

With Krat being the City of Puppets, however, you’d have to wonder whether this wouldn’t be a job for puppets to take over - it’s quite probable they had public street sweeping puppets, and rich people surely had their own butler puppets that accompanied them whenever they went out on the town.

But perhaps, the name “Sweepers” is a vestige from the past, applied to this subgroup of Stalkers in a more figurative way: They are recruited from the lowest classes and slums, and they get paid by aristocrats and upper-class people to clean up their “filth” (as in eliminating their adversaries and similar kinds of dirty work). On one hand, they’re at the opposite end of society than the rich folks that they work for, but at the same time, they’re unable to live without them.

[bytewire]

Let’s talk about Architect math!

Considering that Precursors don’t have hands like we do, how do they format their math? Our current 10-decimal system is based on our ten fingers, so I wonder what the math of the Architects looks like, considering they don't have hands like we do. (Though AL-AN does note the usefulness of the opposable thumb.)

Architects have mechanical arms—two of which have hands with three fingers—but we know that they were originally a fully biological species before inventing their synthetic vessels. As stated in the databank entry AL-AN provides on the Architect storage media, their vessels resemble their pre-civilized forms. They had to have had a math system before inventing their synthetic vessels.

So… what would their math look like?

Precursors may use a base four system in which they only use 0, 1, 2, and 3 based on the digits of their claws on their organic arms. (Assuming they had similar claws on their pre-civilized bodies.)

I mean, humans have used base 4 selectively. It’s not entirely unheard of or out of the realm of possibility. Quaternary numeral systems are found in select languages throughout history and even have some modern code applications.

I’m leaning towards pre-civilization Precursors having a base four system, whereas current Precursors opt to use a binary system instead.

Obviously, as their species exists in its current form a binary system would be much more efficient. Existing as data means that a binary system would compute a lot smoother; especially as a network.

They could even use something else entirely different to what we commonly think of as math. We know Architect senses do not work in the same way humans do.

…or maybe I’m just a nerd overthinking alien math systems

[melit0n]

I wanted to add on to this ask done by an anon on ST confessions, because they are so right and they made something click in my brain. Do go read it before you read this.

First, off, heavy agree that Fall for Me is designed to be a lonely song, both lyrically, and quite smartly, musically. In every single other song Sleep Token has ever done there is music. There is noise, always. Even in times where there should be silence, there never is any. Instead, it's filled by sounds of birds, a taught guitar chord or chewing and biting.

Fall for Me, however, is utter silence. There's no musical reply. No SFX, no subtle drums or bass; no nothing. It's the one of the few songs (along with Missing Limbs, Take Aim and Drag me Under) in which Vessel directly addresses the love he holds for this person. It's not layered in metaphors, prose and an eloquent vernacular, it's straightforward. While his poetry in other songs is used to draw Them in, decorate his love and entice Them, he's done with getting nothing. He wants to be an equal, a lover, but he gets naught.

The reason why, other than the obvious choice of acapella instead of instruments, the song feels so lonely is because it's the only song—overall—that he doesn't get a response to. Sugar is the response to The Offering, Say That You Will is the response to Take Aim etc., but here? Cold, dead silence. No gesture in tongues, no crushing 'affection'; no nothing.

So, to the rhythm of eternity, he will be on that beach, stumbling, crawling and shouting out the same question that he will never get an answer to; won't you fall for me?

However, even though, unlike most songs that get an answer within their album, Vessel gets one in the next. Take Me Back To Eden, therefore, becomes the answer to that question. As well as Vessel's action against it.

@lifemod17 saw you reblog the ask as well, thought you might like this :]

[bellepeppergirl]

Mohg the Empyrean

I've mentioned this once before in a previous post, but I'm in the mood to go more in-depth with the idea, and I believe that Mohg is an Empyrean.

Mohg spent his entire life in the sewers due to Marika's oppressive rule over the Lands Between, which scorned those born with horns, who they deemed as "Omens." The "omen" in question was, in my belief, likely one of the Hornsent, Marika's enemy's, return. In order to not allow this return to happen, anything that reminded Marika of the Hornsent or the Crucible was punished; Misbegotten were enslaved, Omen were massacred or had their horns removed, and royal Omen were confined to the sewers for their entire life. This included Marika's own children, Morgott and Mohg.

Now, most of Marika's direct offspring seem to be Empyreans; Miquella and Malenia are confirmed to be Empyreans, Melina seems to hold the power of Destined Death, and Messmer has the power of the Fell God within him. We can assume Godwynn was also likely an Empyrean and, in a way, he sort of did ascend into godhood by becoming the Prince of Death, though this could be considered coincidental.

Onto Morgott and Mohg, while I'm not sure if anything could possibly tie Morgott into being an Empyrean, Mohg himself seems to have Empyrean traits. For starters, Empyreans all seem to have things going on with their eyes.

Malenia is entirely blind, with the Outer God of Rot's influence having taken her eye, leaving only disgusting and decayed flesh where they used to be.

Ranni's right eye is sealed, and while we have not seen her original form, only the doll form she took after sacrificing her flesh, I am willing to assume that her original form was in a similar state.

Melina also has a sealed eye, this time on her left side. When Melina opens that eye during the Frenzied Flame ending, we see a deep purple iris. It seems she inherited the power of the Outer God of Death, which was possibly the Deathbird Mother.

Messmer is in a similar state to both Melina and Malenia. He seems to be entirely blind, with one eye sealed and the other containing what appears to be a glass eye given to him by his mother. Behind this glass eye, we see a strange abyss. Messmer also seems to have been blessed with an Outer God's power, that being the Fell God's and possibly even the Base Serpent's, if we were to consider that being to also be an Outer God.

Miquella and St. Trina, another confirmed Empyrean, is never seen to open their eyes. This could indicate that they are also blind, or hiding some form of Outer God-blessed eyes.

Mohg can be seen with a horn piercing his right eye. On top of that, we know he came into contact with a confirmed Outer God, that being the Formless Mother, who gave him the power of Bloodflame and spurred on his desire to start his own dynasty.

Initially, this theory of Mohg being an Empyrean could have been debunked because, if he was an Empyrean, why would he need Miquella? But with the reveals from the DLC, this potential debunking has itself been debunked, as we now know that Miquella had been controlling Mohg the entire time so that he could use the Omen's remains to resurrect Radahn and make him his consort so that Miquella could bring about his own age.

That being said, I don't think we can entirely throw out the "Mohg needing an Empyrean" thing, because I believe that itself now also serves as evidence that Mohg is an Empyrean. With us being led to believe that Mohg wanted a consort that was an Empyrean he could corrupt for his own age, it seems like this was Miquella's own plan being leaked out.

Miquella wanted an Empyrean, Mohg, that he could corrupt by using their body to remake Radahn, who was not an Empyrean initially, to create a consort for Miquella's new age. Having two Empyreans creating a new age would ensure their own power for likely much longer than having only one.

Mohg himself seems to also have wanted to bring his own age. In the DLC, we can find more information about the Formless Mother. Namely, we learn of the Bloodfiends. The Bloodfiends were once, and debatably still are, an oppressed tribe that came into contact with the Formless Mother. They began to worship her and were slowly warped into the creatures they are today and carry her power.

Similarly, Mohg is an Omen; another oppressed group that was massacred and locked away. I think the Formless Mother favors the oppressed. Whether this is because she cares about them or just thinks it's funny to shake things up by giving the oppressed power, I can't say, but regardless, her giving them power allows for them to fight for their rights and a new age.

Throughout Mohgwynn Palace, we can find a lot of Albinaurics. The Albinaurics are another group that is oppressed thanks to them being artificial, and thus not considered holy since they bear no connection to the Erdtree. But perhaps, under Mohg and the Formless Mother's rule, they could find or create a new world where they are not treated poorly, tortured, or killed for the heinous crime of simply existing. The Albinaurics here, and the Sanguine Nobles we meet, also seem to be changing into new beings, similar to how the Bloodfiends did, as they can be seen covered in or growing horns.

So yes; I believe Mohg was an Empyrean. He is the child of Marika, and Empyrean who has birthed numerous Empyreans herself, has a similar eye situation to other confirmed or quasi-confirmed Empyreans, and is confirmed to have the power and blessing of an Outer God with the goals and capability of bringing about a new age. Miquella then took his body to make Radahn and Empyrean so they could create the Unalloyed Age.

[witherking001]

The Voidic People of the End

My first proper Youtube video is out! In this one, I talk about the endermen, the other creatures of the End, what their "biology" may mean for them, as well as analyzing how they relate to their environment! I hope you all enjoy! Come and support me! :D

[redredribbon]

I have scoured my posts and I can't find where I originally posted about it so I want to put the theories I had after Trespasser here for posterity to see how wrong or right I end up being:

The Black City is Arlathan

The Black City was blighted long before the magisters ever touched it

Solas, or another of the Evanuris, or a combination, sealed the Black City and sundered the Veil to seal the Blight away

The magisters ruined that plan by cracking the Fade and entering the City, re-unleashing the Blight on the world outside the Fade

Solas, or another of the Evanuris, or a combination, used some incredibly strong and powerful magic to make the Black City unreachable in the Fade, or to at least make it far more difficult to reach (the Eluvians are definitely involved)

The eluvian from the Mahariel origin (and the one that became Merrill's) led to the Black City, or to another sealed, blighted stronghold from the Arlathan days.

[chiefexecutiveofnir]

I have recently realized that my The-Greater-Will-isn’t-a-god-or-even-sentient theory kind of puts a wrench in one of my other favourite theories, that being the theory that the Greater Will split Marika in half because she started having doubts about the Golden Order.

But then I remembered Miquella and St. Trina. Miquella divested himself of St. Trina because he couldn’t complete his goals with certain emotions and feelings. So he put all those feelings into St. Trina and threw her into a really deep pit.

Now, imagine you are Marika, and you are having doubts about your religion, but you have spent a big portion of your life building this religion and committing atrocities with/for it. It would be hard to break out of it after having committed so hard. Unless you sever the part of yourself that was so certain your religion was right and just. But to your knowledge no one has ever done this before, and you underestimate just how bad splitting your psyche is for you. Your other half fervently wants to keep your religion together, it has had its doubts cut away, and you can’t quite control it.

This is what Marika did, and I think this is what Miquella improved upon. Miquella fully divested himself, so much so as to make a second body and throw that body so far away that it could never stop him. Marika shared the same body as Radagon, she could not lock him up, so she tried to kill him.

Unfortunately for Marika, nothing goes right for her and instead her beloved son Godwyn is killed and she’s still stuck with her religious fanatic alter self.

[splatfest3ever]

I’m really disappointed in CosmicCloud. He made an amazing video about why Octo Expansion was such a good DLC story and about nostalgia… but then he turns around and does THIS.

I have been so confused with why so many game theorists have refused to engage with media lately. From Tears of the Kingdom to Splatoon 3, there seems to be this rejection from fans for ambiguous storytelling.

See the way Nintendo often works is that they don’t give you concrete answers for anything. Instead the details are more abstract. There are hints, and clues, and inferences you can make to draw your own conclusions from sprinkled throughout their games.

And that’s where the FUN of lore theorizing comes from! It’s FUN to take these weird seemingly inconsistencies and explain why they exist!

But for some reason fans are refusing to do that now. They had no problem doing it for Splatoon 1 and 2, but ever since Octo Expansion came out they’ve been VERY resistant to engaging with this style of storytelling and wordbuilding. The most infamous being fans reacting poorly to the reveal that Mr. Grizz was actually a bear.

Throughout this whole video CosmicCloud just uses terms like “for some reason” to dismiss anything that’s even remotely out of the ordinary in Alterna. And every time he does it I wanna scream at him because he’s not even TRYING to engage with the media in any way!

What happened that made lore theorists give up on theorizing? What changed between then and now? I don’t get it. I feel like I’m going crazy. Why doesn’t anyone want to have FUN piecing together the pieces anymore? Isn’t that the whole point of being a theorist????

[freyaloi]

You know... I can't help but feel that Orb is talking about Junior and his father here. (also possibly referring to the royal family from their own era but anyway) Time to get my brain worms out.

When Junior's animations changed a few months ago, I've been pondering the meaning of it ever since.

I may be fairly new to the game and not particularly active but it's the story, and more specifically Junior that caught my eye and made me want to play, even if sporadically.

When I first saw him, he was a lot more confident, standing tall and proud, flourishing his cutlass as if he didn't have a care in the world.

These days, however, his animations seem a lot more guarded, he's hunched, hiding his face, turning away... He's even putting his cutlass between himself and us. Now to me, that tells me there's something wrong with him or something is going on, and I've always wondered if everything he's done in the name of his father is starting to catch up to him.

In the book where he describes himself, he gives no hint of having any evil nature. Ambitious, overconfident and a bit of an idiot? Absolutely, but not evil... But back then he didn't have any street smarts either, so to speak. Now I know being a skeleton changes things and messes with the mind, but it wasn't until he met Wanda that he fixated on Serving his Father, obsessively so, desperate to prove himself like so many others. That adoration and idealisation he had of Flameheart as a child still persists even though his mental image was reshaped by her.

Flameheart was never a good man, he was a bully and a tyrant and still is, but even though he was an absent father, he still gave Junior the best childhood he could, perhaps reliving his own ideal childhood fantasies through his newly adopted son. (that could be another reason why he adopted the child in the first place because it seems so out of character but anyway) That left Junior with a deep level of affection for him, which of course we know about... (but perhaps some melancholy too)

But the Flameheart we have now isn't the one he knew growing up. He in fact never was, only telling him an idealised version of events and keeping secrets. Junior himself says his father told him he didn't need to know what he saved the boy from. (Flameheart attacked and sank the ship Junior was on as a baby so there's that)

That brings me to my theory...

I can't help but wonder if actually working 'with' his Father has begun to create cracks in that blazing ideal image of his, that those rose-tinted glasses are beginning to slip, no matter which shape they take. He had one idea of his father in his mind as a child, that of a hero, which set him on his journey in the first place. No doubt the Cap'n gave him one too, telling him of the betrayal and the horrors he committed... Then so did Wanda, praising him, lording him, and elevating him to the kingly status Flameheart craves now. (though part of that was obviously her own ambition speaking)

But with them all out of the picture, Junior gets to see his father for who he truly is now, for the bloodthirsty, blazing pit of vicious sadistic hatred that he actually is.

For a while, I could see him obsessively working to serve his father as he said he would, in fact, we've seen this with him creating and being the face of the Reapers we know today, resurrecting his father and being his right-hand man. I'm sure for a while he would have been over the moon to be working alongside his father, the man he adored growing up, his idol, his role model... Well, you know what they say about meeting your idols...

Here we are now, with Flameheart back near his full power and seeking more and yet... You would think Junior would be elated, even with his reserved and tempered mannerisms. Yet to my eyes... He looks the complete opposite, small, retreating... in pain even....

Let's not forget he's a Skeleton Lord, even though he's nowhere near the power level of Flameheart, he's not just a regular old skeleton... So like Duke, like Wanda... He still retains the majority of his mind. And to my knowledge... He is not bound to Flameheart by magic... only by word. Junior is an intelligent man, one who has gained the use of dark magic, and knows a great deal of disciplines from the outside world. He's a studious, patient and learned man who was trained to be very observant.

So is he having second thoughts? Is that why they changed his animations? Is he beginning to see the truth of his actions and having regrets? Has he realised that the man he's working for, isn't the matching up to the ideal image in his head? (whatever that looks like now)

It could also be he's being prepared to be sacrificed in some ritual, I could see Flameheart doing something like that to maintain his status and power... after all, his biggest fear is being beaten... and currently the biggest potential threat to him... is his right-hand man... as always. After all, it wouldn't be out of fashion for a King's closest advisor and Servant to inevitably betray them.

It would be poetic and fitting for Flameheart (should he need to be defeated at some point for plot resolution) to be beaten by his hubris again, at the hand of his second-in-command. After all, Junior had always dreamed of surpassing his father's legend... And betrayal is a founding principle of the Reaper's Bones... A founding act that Flameheart himself initiated three decades ago.

And we all know, Junior is not safe... but then, now that Flameheart is back, with a thirst for vengeance and army at his fingertips... nobody is.

Anyway, this is my long-ass theoretical ramble that I desperately needed to get out of my brain (god there is so much more i could add but this is plenty long enough so props to you if you read this marathon of prattling). I could be completely off the mark, but fair enough, but this is what I do, latch onto a character, learn the lore and theorise. :)

Anyway, let's see where the story goes, as always me and Raven will be watching from the sidelines with popcorn in hand.

[s3znl-gr3znl]

I was playing stratagem hero and noticed something called an "Orbital Illumination Flare" that was common within the first three rounds. Input code is ➡️➡️⬅️⬅️ but i have no idea what its for since its not anywhere in the shops.

Theories?

[ideas-on-paper]

Don't mind me, just going slightly feral over the location of the LoP DLC and what it might imply for the story overall.

[Spoilers for the main game + potential story spoilers for the DLC, based on pre-release footage]

[CW body horror]

Y'know, one of the things I appreciate about Lies of P is how it sorta tells its story through gameplay - like the enemies you're fighting are essentially a reflection of Pinocchio himself. I see this as a representation of his inner struggles, as well as the pressure of judgment from the world around him that would consider him a monster if they knew what he truly is.

You start out by fighting puppets, the main enemies for roughly the first quarter of the game, the culmination of which is Pino's trip to their "birthplace", the factory. The irony is, of course, that Pino is a puppet himself - thus, he basically constantly has to look in the mirror when battling his enemies. Undoubtedly, he must realize the hypocrisy of his own actions - "What exactly makes you better than them? You're also just a soulless heap of metal, joints, and cogs! You're also just killing because someone pulled your strings and told you so!" I bet these are the thoughts that might be going through his head.

Then, at the point when Pino is slowly becoming more human, you start fighting carcasses - literally right after the point when the message "The Ergo is whispering" is displayed for the first time, provided you've continuously been lying so far. (In the regions that are infested with carcasses, there's also those faint, eerie whispers in the background.)

For quite some time, I've had the theory that the reason Pino starts displaying such very human features over time - like growing hair and the ability to feel pain - is because the Ergo grows inside of him. It's becoming his equivalent of a nervous system, and that's why he's able to physically change and feel things only a human would.

But wouldn't that put him in the same vein as the carcass monsters? "What an abomination you are! On the outside, you may look like a human, but behind the pretty veneer, you're exactly the same as them: an unnatural monstrosity, born out of twisted experiments."

If we consider that the enemies/environments are essentially confronting Pinocchio with his own self, and if we take it as a metaphor for Pino's own self-worth issues... I wonder what the DLC's relation to taxidermy might imply.

As people familiar with my Lies of P lore ramblings will know, I postulated the theory that Pino has human skin quite a long time ago - and when I saw the note about the missing taxidermist from the Overture gameplay demo, all alarm bells in my head immediately went off.

So, could Pino coming face to face with all the stuffed animals in the museum potentially incite thoughts that he himself is like them? "Well, aren't you just a walking imitation of someone who once lived? You may look alive on the outside, but you're nothing but an empty shell of a person long dead. A husk, wearing the face of another!"

And the most painful thing of all is that Pinocchio chose none of this - he didn't choose to be born as a puppet, he didn't choose to live in the skin of another, and he didn't choose that the way he grows and develops is something that most would consider perverted. And still, he has to face judgment for it from his environment - or rather, the fear of judgment from his environment. Which, at times, can actually feel worse than the real thing.

I am, unfortunately, all too familiar with the feeling of "if other people knew what I truly am, they would despise me" - and to protect yourself, you basically start hiding in broad daylight, never showing anyone your true self. I know that inner voices of doubt can develop a vicious mind of their own. And all of this just makes me want to hug Pino that much more, hold him tight, and tell him that he's loved and accepted.

Anyway. I've no idea if I'm reading the thing about the taxidermy right - but if I am, I'm legitimately going to go insane.

[bytewire]

Let's speculate about Architect Society!

I think there are some misinterpretations about how Precursor society works. It makes sense considering how vague a lot of the canon information is, but let me provide some of my perspective and interpretations on what we get in canon.

Architect society definitely deserves more speculation beyond just characterizing them as a race only focused on progress. The current information we have about how Architects operate is underrated in terms of how interesting it is. They definitely aren't a stereotypical hive mind. How Precursors perceive themselves is different from how they actually appear to function. AL-AN's answers don't lack bias. He is an unreliable narrator and often withholds information, so it's crucial to look deeper into the information given and to read between the lines. Especially as not everything is explicitly stated.

Architects exist as a collective—data points in a network—but people often forget that they do not only strive for efficiency. What they do is try to optimize themselves to perform tasks in the most efficient way possible. They strive to achieve and progress their society. This doesn’t mean that they lack culture. They are certainly more streamlined and orderly than humans, but they do have cultural aspects that impact the way they view things.

Some examples of Architect culture:

Architects produce art as seen by the statue in the Koppa mining site and the statue in the Deep Lilypad Caves Body Cache. Even the alien carving from the first game is an example of Precursors producing art with subjectivity.

Architects cultivate plants in greenhouses even though they do not need to eat. Also, of course, they have the Ancient Ornamental Plants that they cultivate for aesthetic purposes.

They hold pride in maintaining and improving a vessel for a long time. If a storage medium gets damaged, they wouldn’t opt to immediately make another vessel—even if it would be the most efficient.

They don’t all use the most popular format for their bodies; there are certain Architects that opt for different styles of storage medium.

Architects consider it rude to duplicate themselves.

All of their technology has similar aesthetic characteristics and design.

Precursors are cybernetic and composed of biotechnological components, yet they start out life as organic beings. They choose to incorporate biological tissues in their vessels suggesting they hold some sort of social ties to being organics. They actively make the choice to incorporate organic components.

Precursors potentially carry some nostalgia for their pre-civilized bodies, considering they model their vessels after them.

Architects have a concept of prestige. AL-AN is noted as the lead scientist for the Kharaa research project.

They have special training for certain young Architects and a Temple of Research that they are inducted into if they are distinct enough from other broodlings.

So, Precursors do not necessarily always do what is the most practical. They can and do practice certain things for subjective reasons. They have emotions that influence their actions. These emotions may not equate to human emotional behavior, but they certainly have them. AL-AN himself expresses shame many times.

While Precursors are a hive mind, they aren’t entirely unfamiliar with the concept of an individual. AL-AN merely says that they don’t see themselves as distinct. However, it is acknowledged at many points that a mind within the collective can have its own traits. Perspectives that either come with a body or ideas and needs that a mind has. They are able to act autonomously. The biggest example is AL-AN himself ignoring the network.

Though a mind having its own ideas doesn’t negate Architects being a collective. Especially when those minds work in conjunction with thousands of other minds to support the needs of the whole. AL-AN is just a very rare case where an Architect gets the opportunity to act as an individual. Even then, AL-AN expresses that being disconnected from the network is lonely and uncomfortable. Aiming to regain connection despite what he did in the past. AL-AN only uses the singular because he's present with Robin.

Precursors being so advanced makes things a little more complicated when trying to discern aspects of their species. We can't push human ideals onto a race so separate from us. Architects—being connected by the mind—do not have the same social structures as humans, so it's unfair to anthropomorphize them with our standards. We can only speculate on how they might work. Just because one mind can have differing traits doesn’t seem to make them distinct enough to classify as singular (within their species’ definition anyway). I'd love for there to eventually be more information given to us about their society.

Besides, all of this isn’t even considering the many unused voice lines that remain in the files that I’d love to go over…

[citrine-elephant]

thinking about the ancient cities in minecraft.

i love the idea of the cities - ancient cities. these rundown finds at the bottom of the world, covered in some fungus type.... thing. things? the warden with their souls..... filled with experience points. spreading like a mycelium

the idea of these places being so old and forgotten. you may find pottery sherds that has the warden inscribed on them. carved into the deepslate, too. but these little hints, these small remnants of what was and what is left... the player, they know what to carve into the deepslate... (to dip my toes into a seperate theory: "steve"/"alex"/all of the new folks/ just 'the player", they are a type of golem that can gather experience points/souls, and maybe from this they understand pieces of the past via the soul memories.... ???)

the idea that the cities are so old they are so very nearly forgotten.

maybe the centerpiece of them are portals... maybe. but maybe the way to open them has been lost to time.

i just. like the idea of never reaching through that monument into the otherside because of lost and destroyed knowledge.... BUT I WOULD SO LOVE A NEW DIMENSION OMFG. imagine gathering exp and needing to find specific sources and gathering it all in one place to powe- *shot*

[bellepeppergirl]

Marika Was the Gloam-Eyed Queen

So, the most popular theory regarding the GEQ was that it was Melina. This does make sense; in the Flame of Frenzy ending, she promises to deliver Destined Death to us and reveals her sealed eye, which is gloam colored. Case solved? I don't think so.

As stated in the title, I believe Marika was the GEQ.

We know Marika comes from the Shaman/Miko Village and that her people were horrifically abducted and crammed into jars into to create "saints." This was likely a part of the Hornsent religion, whatever that may have been, likely relating to the Crucible. I feel like it would be understandable to wish to get revenge on whoever the god of the Hornsent may be, so she creates the Godskin Covenant.

The idea of taking the skin of the gods and melding them together to create clothes is very similar to what happened to the Shamans in the jars; a fitting way to seek retribution I think.

We can also see that the Rune of Death is an inverse of Marika's rune.

Interestingly, the statues of Marika that we can find in the Lands of Shadow, while initially looking identical to those from the Lands Between, albeit headless, are actually forming the shape of the Rune of Death, while those we were originally familiar with form Marika's rune.

On top of that, there is another statue we can find of Marika in the Lands of Shadow. This one is located in Messmer's arena and depicts Marika swaddling a baby.

Now, off the top of my head, there is only one other place that we see imagery like this and that is the Godskin Swaddling Cloth.

It mentions that she cradles the newborn apostles that were swaddled in this godly flesh and that they would eventually be raised to fight the gods. It is interesting then that these are the only two mentions of holding a baby in game, and it just so happens to be the place where Marika's statues happen to resemble the Rune of Death. Additionally, the Swaddling Cloth causes successive attacks to restore HP. Now, this could be a stretch, but Marika is also associated with healing. After all, it's her tears that increase the amount of HP we receive from a flask and we can find a healing incantation in her chambers.

Now, the trailers mention the Shadow Lands as the birthplace of Light and Shadow, and something about "the seduction and the betrayal." When it says this, we see Marika holding up a strand of hair at the Divine Gate and, as Quelaag pointed out in her videos, while she does this, we see light through the gate while a gloam-y sky is seen everywhere else.

What I personally think this means is that Marika was seduced by the Greater Will and the prospect of becoming a god, thus betraying the covenant that she herself formed and becoming what they swore to destroy. Furthermore, she continued the cycle of suffering by enacting the same cruelties performed on her people on those like the Omen, the Demihumans, and the Misbegotten.

I believe she then gave her Great Rune to Malekith, who hid it away while Marika pretended to be a completely different person. She would also hide away any signs of her past identity; the Shadowlands, for various reasons, would be sealed away, thus also hiding her past, and her firstborn daughter, Melina, was locked away in the Forbidden Lands. She was likely imprisoned because she bore the same power that Marika once had; the power of Death. Just like she did with the rest of her children, anything that reminded her of the past would be hidden away and forgotten.

The Godskins, feeling betrayed, have come the the Lands Between in order to enact that which they were quite literally born for. After all, the swaddling cloth essentially says that the GEQ raised them, acting as their mother, and teaching them to kill the gods. To have the person who you saw as a mother betray you by becoming what you were raised to hate would be a devastating blow and, of course, this would not be the only time Marika does this. In the Lands Between, the Godskins are seeking out that which they've lost; the sword that was once Marika's, the Rune that was given to Malekith, and the God-Devouring Serpent so that they may continue their goals.

And I believe that Marika shattered the Elden Ring because she realized what was happening; she understood that the past was coming back, no matter what she did. That her goals to create the "perfect world" by killing everyone she didn't like was a failure. She removed death so everyone could be happy and sing kumbaya around the Erdtree forever, but guess what. Her son STILL DIED despite death not even existing anymore. People are miserable being unable to die.

I think she also realizes that, not only was her plans a failure cuz the people she didn't like kept being born, but she was feeding this cycle of hatred. She fucked people over and now they're revolting against her. Why did she fuck them over? Because she was fucked over. And you know what, the Hornsent were probably also fucked over at some point, maybe by the people of Rauh.

I think her shattering the Elden Ring is akin to suicide; we never see her alive, never hear her speak, nothing. She is in pieces, just like the Elden Ring is. She is also impaled with a red spike, which looks oddly similar to the Rune of Death. If all I have said is true, then I believe the implication is she gave into despair, destroyed everything, and then killed herself.

Nothing changed. Nothing ever changed. And she was part of the problem this whole time, but by the time she realized, it was all too late.

But despite everything, hope persists. Despite the horrors inflicted upon Marika's people, Marika persisted. Despite the horrors Marika inflicted upon others, they persisted and continue to be born. As Melina says, the world is full of horrible things, and yet birth and life persists, and there's beauty in that. One day, the cycle will break.

[yournextflame]

Elden Ring Theories: A Retrospective

So, enough time has passed for me to form my opinion on Shadow of the Erdtree and revive this blog. But before posting new theories based on the DLC lore, I decided to take a look at my old speculations and see how well they aged.

Does the Greater Will even exist? ✅ In this post, I compared the Greater Will to the Big Bang and suggested that it might not be an actual deity, but rather an attempt by the people of The Lands Between to explain the world around them: the creation of the universe, the fall of meteors, evolution, and the natural order. The Shadow of the Erdtree continues to present the Greater Will as a scientific concept described by the inhabitants of a fantasy world, allowing players to decide whether it’s a god beyond the microcosm or just an empty circle in Count Ymir’s hat, a mere projection of human imagination

The outer gods are natural forces. ✅ 🟡❔While the Greater Will's cosmic origin was emphasized even further in the DLC, the motives of the outer gods were tied even more strongly to earthly concepts. I have many thoughts about the outer gods and godhood in particular, but one of my ongoing ideas is that they manifest human emotions, given how perception and sacrifices shape reality in a material way in the Lands Between.

Elden Ring and Color theory: ✅🟡❔ While I disagree with some points I made in this post, many of my observations were quite accurate. One clarification I’d like to make is that the scroll sigils indicate the heritage of magic rather than its source of power. I also appreciate the DLC narrative that suggests all the differences are actually man-made.

Translation of Marika's echoes from JP, ✅ The DLC gives Marika such human and deeply personal motivations that reducing her to a mere puppet of an evil outer god feels like an insult to the collaborative work of GRRM and Miyazaki. I must admit that my initial reading of her character was too harsh; I even questioned why FromSoft would write such a one-dimensional character. However, I’m very glad that The Shadow of the Erdtree gave Marika awesome depth without depriving her of agency.

My musings upon Helphen's Steeple design and DLC predictions ✅ 🟡 Well, the Shadowlands are described as a place where all kinds of death come only to be suppressed, and the Shadowkeep, as pointed out by the community, very much resembles the design of the Helphen. You can even find Tibia Mariners' boats here. It’s not the exact version of the spirit realm I predicted, but it’s very close.

Small bonus: Even though I insisted that the DLC should be centered around the spirit realm, I pointed out that exploring Godwyn's story beyond what was shown in the base game is pretty unnecessary.

What's wrong with Ranni's Two Fingers? ✅🟡❌ Right direction of thinking, wrong conclusions. One of the biggest reveals of the DLC is that everything is wrong with the Fingers and their mother, Metyr.

Children of the Erdtree 🟡❔I'm not sure what to make of it. The DLC continues to toy with the Empyrean connection to plants, from the special properties of Marika's people's flesh to St. Trina being a literal flower, but it never makes any direct conclusions.

Bells and Bell bearings ❔ The connection does exist, but it should be explored in greater detail.

Candletrees, Miquella, Death and Sleep 💡❔✨ Now that the DLC has revealed Miquella's plan to replace Marika all along, it’s astonishing to realize that my earlier discovery about Necromancer Garris — who likely collaborated with the Black Knives — had Miquella's butterfly and candletree in his basement is actually quite wild

What is Crucible? 🟡❌❔Although the nature of the Crucible is still a mystery, I think my old theory that it was a different tree is not exactly right. I’ve even started to wonder if the Crucible and the Primeval Current are just different names for the same thing.

Some of my old takes haven't aged well, but if anything, I'm glad that Mohg isn't the "walking uooohh 😭💢 joke" I used to call him. However, my opinion on Miquella was surprisingly accurate. For two years, the fandom preached that Miquella wanted to abandon his godhood, making me seem like a major contrarian for insisting that godhood was still his ultimate goal (at least because it would be pointless from a writing perspective to create another Ranni).

I still believe that characters like Marika and Miquella are primarily vehicles to deliver Miyazaki's and GRRM's ideas regarding civilization development, human nature, religion, and philosophy. So, whatever faults they have are the faults of the concepts they represent. Nevertheless, *Shadow of the Erdtree* did an awesome job of elevating these characters from mere ideas to something more human and relatable.

My old description of Malenia is so relevant, it hurts.

Mohg, Radahn, Rykard and Snakes 🐍 Honestly, I'm not sure if Messmer was initially planned by FromSoft or created specifically for the DLC, but looking back, it's pretty funny that I noticed something weird going on between the demigod brothers and the serpents.

Elden Ring lore is a disaster 🤡 Elden Ring story is such lackluster that it was rewritten with the first day patch on top of the giant mountain of cut content. I’m not sure that DLC, if there will be any, can fix this mess or give any proper answers as it seems that writers got too much carried with the idea of making story as vague as possible.

Someone was overdosing on doomium.

To my surprise, the DLC managed to address most of my old frustrations. While I do wish certain things had better foreshadowing or were explored more, it still did a good job of filling many gaps in the base game lore that were making me frustrated. Looking back, I think some of my grudges over the lore were no less important than my theories because they served as a good indication that something was intentionally left unexplained. It seems that the gaps and ambiguities were not oversights but deliberate choices.

As I explore the new content in Shadow of the Erdtree and revisit my old theories, I will also share my thoughts on the new lore and its impact on the narrative. This fresh perspective has already sparked some intriguing insights, and I am eager to see how these revelations will reshape our understanding of the game’s world.