#but i really like yang’s v4 arc

[bestworstcase]

hi, found your post about Yang and Salem. Didn't know that she, out of all people in team rwby, is the one who foils Salem the most. Like she's the most normal member in team rwby.

Which led me thinking, Yang has a lot of parallels with the villains, notably, Adam, Cinder, and Salem. What do you think is the ideal route of Yang during volume 4?

well that’s the thing about salem, isn’t it? she wasn’t anyone special. her father was a lord in a world ruled by kings and queens, and he abused and isolated her so viciously that whatever notional privilege she might have had by virtue of noble birth was stripped away from her; after she and ozma murdered her father and escaped, she was a commoner. the raw magical power that sets her apart on remnant was commonplace then. there was nothing extraordinary about her at all.

but she was brave. passionate. determined. angry. she walked into the domain of gods and refused to flinch.

who does that sound like?

anyway, yang’s core allusion is goldilocks. too hot, too cold, too hard, too soft, just right. balance. compromise. scathing eyes ask that we be symmetrical, one-sided and easily processed. rwby is a story about complexity and nuance. every dichotomy is false. yang is a good person—good to the bone—but she’s also strong-willed and not inclined to be forgiving. who would she have become if, say, ruby died on one of those occasions they were left home alone as children? what would it have done to her if she watched adam kill blake during the battle for beacon?

it took millions and millions of years for salem to break. she tried so hard not to become a monster. cinder bowed her head and endured years of torture because rhodes told her it was the right thing to do. before adam lost his way, he fought to protect others; the first time he killed, it was in defense of his leader.

the difference isn’t as simple as a choice to be good or bad. yang has always had ruby and now she has blake and weiss, too, and—bluntly, her trauma is of a lesser order of magnitude than her villainous foils. yang has endured a lot of suffering—parental abandonment, childhood neglect, the vytal tournament and the battle that followed, losing her arm, being left behind by her sister and friends—but she wasn’t enslaved and tortured as a child. she isn’t the sole survivor of a genocide. she did not spend millions of years alone.

if you put yang in salem’s or cinder’s or adam’s shoes, would she have turned out different than they did? would she make better choices? would she still be a good person?

would she even know how?

and if you put salem or cinder or adam in her shoes, would it make a difference? if salem wasn’t alone, if cinder had even the smallest taste of genuine love, if sienna had seen adam’s increasing anger for what it was years earlier—would they still have become what they are now?

yang’s gone through her own personal hell and back, but she wasn’t alone. she had role models and a loving sister and a father who provided for them and at least made some effort to be involved—he read bedtime stories and trained yang, tai is far from the worst parent in the story. it was bad. it could have been so much worse. how much of a difference did it make for yang that she had these crumbs of support?

as the blacksmith says, even the smallest act kindness can change a life. no one is an island. everyone is responsible for their own choices, but sometimes our choices are limited by forces beyond our control. sometimes there is no right thing to do.

everyone has breaking points.

everyone has a limit.

yang… in addition to having all these villainous character foils, is also the heroic character most inclined to ask why. why did raven leave her? why did ozpin lie? why did he make the branwen twins into birds? why did raven sell them out to salem? why is she the spring maiden? why did blake run away? why did ozpin think it was okay to hide so much from everyone? why shouldn’t she and blake think critically and follow their consciences instead of blindly obeying orders? why is salem waging this war? why why why

yang isn’t the most empathetic character—she can get too tangled up in her own feelings to see clearly where other people are coming from. she isn’t the most compassionate, either—she can, in fact, be rather ruthless. but yang does care, a lot, about why people make the choices they do.

and i think that is because yang knows her own darkness. she sees herself clearly; she knows she’s capable of cruelty, of being vindictive, of hurting people in anger. the reason yang isn’t an angry person is she works fucking hard not to be. i think yang is self-aware of these similarities between herself and adam, or raven, and maybe even cinder and salem too, and the question of why she didn’t end up like them bothers her. what made her different? what saved her? if she could have been like them, then doesn’t that mean they could have been like her? why aren’t they? what made the difference?

so she keeps asking. why. why.

weiss helped her understand why blake ran, but yang has never gotten a satisfying explanation from anyone else. the resolution of ruby’s arc in v9 leaves her asking why summer chose to leave; the natural trajectory is toward answers. why did summer leave, and why didn’t she come back? why did raven keep her secrets? why has salem gone to war? why did ozpin hide so much? it’s all tangled together. it all needs to be answered together. i think, if the olive branch comes from the heroes, it’ll be yang who plants the seed—what if we just ask salem what she wants? it’s not like we have any better ideas. and if salem’s the one to make the first move, it wouldn’t surprise me for yang to be the most open to hearing her side of the story.

after all, yang’s the one who asked.

[dokidokitsuna]

Goldilocks in Grimmland

This is so, so premature...but my muses have been with me from start to finish on this idea and I adore it, so I'm talking about it now! :D

So in the RWBY NeverFell AU, Yang's little mishap during the Vytal Festival actually follows her around for quite a while; with pretty much everyone but her closest friends whispering behind her back about what she did to Mercury. This is very isolating and frustrating for her, especially since she knows from Ruby's eye-witness account that Merc was definitely faking his injury. She's determined to figure out how and why she saw that illusion, and also kinda wants revenge against Mercury for low-key ruining her life. ^^; And her investigation eventually leads her back to him...except, he looks a bit different now. Shocked by his Grimmification and eager to know more, she dives even deeper into the mystery.

Unfortunately, by this time, Salem has arrived at Beacon, parking her giant whale outside the premises similarly to the way she did in Volume 8. ^^ And upon landing, it creates a Grimm-based ecosystem-- a dark forest that gradually spreads outwards the longer it stays there, only adding to the population of Grimm overrunning the area. That's a whole other issue, that the rest of Team RWBY will probably be helping with. For Yang, it's mostly just a giant hindrance to her investigation. She's got suspicions about Mercury (and knowing he's a silver-eyed warrior, suspicions about her deceased mother) and she's sure that the answers are somewhere in that Grimm-whale. But with the death-forest of Grimm surrounding it, it seems impossible for her to get there.

Until, she remembers she knows someone with a semblance that's perfect for the job. ^^

+++

There are several reasons why I love this idea: it gives Yang the spotlight for once in her life; it makes Mercury relevant; it provides an opportunity to get members of the main cast close to Salem.

But the biggest one is: IT GIVES ME AN EXCUSE TO USE REN!!!!! (≧∇≦)ﾉ

I've always loved Lie Ren; like Penny, he's one of those characters who's just impossible to screw up (in basic concept, anyway...). Across RWBY's many adaptations and spinoffs, he's always adorable and always looks cool in combat.

The only problem with him, and the reason I've rarely spoken about him, is that...people don't seem to care about him?? ;_; Specifically, in the source material, he's given so little to do that there just isn't much of a reason to care about him. He barely has any motivations that don't boil down to some variant of "protect Nora". Even Nora herself is given character connections and talking points outside of "her man", but Ren has no one and nothing else. He gets a couple episodes of spotlight in Volume 4, and that's it for the whole series. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I mean, just think about this: Ren is the only member of the main cast who doesn't have a character song. o_o Look it up, it's true. I had to look it up just to make sure, because I found it appalling...this is a character who was originally voiced by the creator of the show; why is he such an afterthought???

So I decided, if I don't like this, I gotta do right by him in NeverFell, somehow. And it was REALLY hard to think of a place to put him, until I suddenly struck gold with this idea. ^^ Yang's little 'detective story arc' had been a thing for a while, and although I wanted her to be separate from Team RWBY, I never really liked the idea of her being alone. A character like her works best with someone to bounce off, and Ren's coolness is a great contrast for her bubbly personality.

Plus, I think putting Ren in a position like this could service him, too: not only does it give me an opportunity to add his semblance, backstory, and maybe even a Nuckelavee fight to the plot in the absence of a V4 timeline; it could give him a chance to "flesh himself out" the way Nora did in V7. Y'know, allow him to really connect with someone besides Nora-- and then, maybe seeing how similar-yet-different Yang is to his childhood friend is what'll get him to realize that he's never done this before. That maybe he's stuck to the familiar dynamic of that early relationship for so long, that there are different sides of his own personality that he's forgotten about. Sides that are coming out now that he's on this new adventure, with a new friend~.

[notmaplemable]

Opinion on DragonSlayer?

Ah, Dragonslayer. Definitely has one of the better ship names in the RWBY fandom. Also I'm just going to you DS from now on because I'm tired.

Values and personality wise, I think they work well together. With Yang pushing Jaune out of his comfort zone, and being there for him when he falls down. And Jaune being there for Yang when she's feeling vulnerable and needs some support. They both have a way of keeping each other going in tough times. They're both very family oriented. Plus they can probably bond over being an older sibling, and maybe having some parental troubles depending on how you write the Arcs.

And yeah, the comparisons between Jaune and Taiyang are obvious.

Though personally I break DS down into two eras. Beacon era DS and post Beacon DS.

During their time at Beacon, I don't really see them getting together. I can absolutely see Jaune having a thing for Yang. You could even convince me that Yang has feelings for him as well, but I still don't really think she would. And even if she did I don't see her really perusing that relationship.

Mostly because I don't really think Yang would be perusing a romantic relationship during their first year at Beacon. She's looking for Raven. Trying to balance getting a bit a freedom and still taking care of Ruby while still giving her enough space to grow on her own a little bit. Not to mention just making sure Ruby doesn't get herself hurt. While also making sure Blake doesn't run off and do anything crazy again.

You don't have much time for relationships when your the team mom.

And if she was going to get into a romantic relationship, it would be with someone like Sun, Blake, Ren, or Pyrrha. Simply because Jaune hasn't really had a chance to show off the traits that would make them work well together to her, and she wouldn't value those traits as much as she would later on. She would just views Jaune as Ruby's friend and the guy who threw up on her boots.

But that doesn't mean that it can't happen, but you would need to force them together often and in ways where Jaune could show those positive traits of his. I've read fics that have done that. Or you could do an AU where they're partners, childhood friends, etc.

Now post fall DS is where it's at.

They've both had opportunities to mature over V4 and 5. Yang would certainly appreciate Jaune keeping Ruby safe when she couldn't. And I think would start to see more of Jaune's good traits, while certainly relating to a few of his problems in those volumes. Certainly the anger and charging in problems.

So I think that spark would be lit there, probably soon after they deal with all the Haven stuff. With some awkward flirting before they get to Argus. Once Jaune gets a little bit of closure with Pyrrha, then I'd think they would have a talk and try to figure something out there. With Saphron listening in of course.

So yeah.

DS has a lot to like about it. Jaune and Yang work well together and are both very family focused. While also having a good few areas of contrast to not make it feel like it's two versions of the same character dating. It just needs a little time to mature to really reach to peak of it's potential.

7/10 at Beacon.

9/10 after Beacon.

[kitkatopinions]

The RWBY writers: *Writes five seasons of Blake being stubborn, feisty, active, and passionate, standing up for herself, calling out Weiss when she's anti-faunus, speaking her mind, doing what she wants and only changing her mind if she's been given a good argument, being willing to call out others, trying to take a more realistic approach, has broken away from a toxic and controlling person she's stood up to repeatedly since then, yells "he's mine" while attacking someone she thinks is actively hurting her people, has opened up about her feelings repeatedly, doesn't back down from a challenge, acts openly exasperated when her friends or acquaintances are being stupid, is mature enough to recognize that even when her friend is reminding her of Adam that it doesn't mean that she is Adam and calmly explains her initial hesitance and explains what reassurance she needs before deciding to believe her friend anyway, saw her horrible ex trying to kill people and jumped into a fight with him while proclaiming she wouldn't run away, and then when her friend got hurt gave him this look

And only ran away when it was Yang's life on the line after tricking him and saving Yang despite having been suffering from a stab wound, etcetera, etcetera.

The RWBY writers: *Writes Weiss to say she'd been used to Blake being 'the quiet one' at the end of V5, implying that the writers want us to think that Blake's behavior in the early seasons had been muted and that now that she'd had a growth arc in V4 and V5 (badly done or not) that she would be more feisty, more outspoken, more self-assured, more passionate, and even more action driven than ever. Which would make sense considering that we saw her take Sun's words to heart concerning the personal growth she needed to do, and seemed to start moving in the direction of shedding her self-hate and blaming herself and start learning to accept love and care instead of pushing people away. And the writers also seemed to want us to believe that she was becoming more of a leader and V5 seemed to mark her finally fully moving on from what had happened with Adam.*

Also the RWBY writers: *Proceeds to write Blake to randomly turn into a meek wallflower who doesn't usually stand up for herself, needs frequent help in fights, gets insecure when she thinks people are unjustly mad at her, plays peacekeeper with her friends while trying to manage their angry moods with soft tones like a mother attempting to corral toddlers in the middle of temper tantrums, doesn't fight or argue when people make anti-faunus cracks at her or call her cat ignorantly or otherwise, flinches and grimaces when Yang gets angry, hides behind Yang when she feels threatened, doesn't really talk things through, is no longer active and is content to wait for her friends to tell her what they should do, the closest she's gotten to active has been in V9 where she was telling her friends about a story they all already knew, hasn't called out or even casually argued with her friends on anything iirc since V6, doesn't care to attend rallies against Jacques Schnee, is characterized like a sweet, caring, shy girl who needs reassurance when her romantic interest goes on a different mission than her, has no problem at all with Yang going red-eyed at the mere suggestion that they should ever take missions apart, acts like she thinks she's going to be hit all the time and wouldn't be able to do anything if she was hit.*

Some RWBY fans: "I am just so happy that Blake is healthy now and gets to be her true self now."

Like, Blake prior to the end of V5 was not "the quiet one" who was so so so super not confident and wasn't her true self. Her relationship with Yang didn't "fix" her and make her confident. The writers haven't actually shown her to be better and healthier and stronger and more sure of herself than before. If anything, they've given us the exact opposite.

How the hell am I meant to think Blake has gotten better when the writers specifically now write her to act this way ever since the beginning of V6? How am I meant to take their 'you used to be the quiet one' seriously when it isn't true? When the opposite is true and she becomes the quiet one in V6? It really just feels like they and a lot of their fans literally forgot who Blake was and replaced her with a whole new person and I'm sitting here like

How is she now "Not the quiet one" and before she was "the quiet one" when she was five times more outspoken and acted more confident and passionate and feisty before? I do not get it, I do not understand how I'm supposed to think she's more healthy now. I do not know how I'm supposed to think that she's done all her growing and is now much better when she actively seems worse off than she did in V freaking 1.

[invested-in-your-future]

What was it exactly that ruined RWBY after volume 3? Was it the death of the author or the creators simply lost touch with their work?

I think I talked about the changes and issues within the narrative before, so I'll just stick to the overall problems with the shift from V3 to V4.

Honestly? The author's passing might have an impact, but it shouldn't have this level of impact.

It's easy to attribute all the success to Monty and just pretend the show was doomed without him. Then why did V3 still come out extremely good? Clearly, there was still talent here - Dillon Goo carried V3 fights on his back, and the story continued - nothing instantly fell apart.

And yet the show did fall apart.

So, what happened?

Were they blindsided by Monty's passing? Were they too inexperienced? Did the hard shift in direction destroy the show's setting? How about the employee burnout?

In reality, I think it's a combination of all of those and more.

They were caught off-guard.

No matter how big Monty's actual role was, people at RT are still human beings.

Death of a friend can turn one's life upside down and fast - understandably, the company would struggle to continue after losing someone so integral to their identity back then.

The way Volume 4 is structured instantly shows that the rest of the staff got blindsided by having to continue the show - V4 is designed to spin its wheels, buying them time while they try to figure out what to do. It's averse to any characterization for the lead four or any change in status quo, and even the lore bits we DO get during V4 are very vague (because the showrunners have no idea what to do).

You can literally imagine them all running around behind the scenes frantically trying to see how they can pick up from where v3 left off and delaying, delaying, delaying.

The issue, however, is that at some point, that kind of stalling becomes their whole MO rather than a temporary thing.

The show effectively stalls any sort of payoff for anything from the first three volumes, shying away from addressing anything within its original identity.

After a while, it's not like they didn't have time to figure things out or turn things around yet - it's that they decided this stalling issue works fine as-is - even as far as V9.

The relationships never quite progress - Blake and Yang have been in limbo since V3, for example.

The characters never progress or regress - how many times did the show "hint" at Ruby's distress for years, promise Blake's growth, or have Yang on the verge of some big moment of self-reflection?

It's not even JUST that it shifted away from its original identity as a contemporary tech-fantasy show - while it absolutely DID do that, the issue is that the showrunners have no idea what shape the show's identity OR aesthetic should take OR how to do it.

The show just stalls because it works even if viewers start to dwindle, and they don't have to do anything that would "alienate" people (Like, let's say, addressing the elephant in the room that is Yang and Blake).

A staggering amount of effort is made to NOT progress things and to have characters go through all these locations without really changing at all.

Things happen but not really.

What did Ruby's journey from Patch to Mistral accomplish for her as a character? What did Blake's journey to Menagerie accomplish? How about Yang's journey to find her offscreen bandit mother? How about Weiss getting taken back by her father?

Nothing.

What did the conflict in Atlas accomplish? Were characters affected or changed in any way? Did Weiss finally have her story arc? Did Ruby face herself?

Nothing.

You could literally change up the end of V3 with them dropping into the future of Vacuo and you wouldn't miss a single story beat.

We don't know MORE about the world OR the characters, really - the dumb Brother Gods plotline revelations can be summed up in half an episode.

Mistral's fate, Vale's fate, Atlas falling? That can be done offscreen - it's not like the show hasn't already offscreened far more important things

Of course, the show DIDN'T just skip that padding so it still has to get the major story beats in as everyone moves through locations.

But those story beats happen in the weirdest way possible.

Why?

There is ego involved, yes.

Miles didn't have to add up the brother gods subplot he had dreamt up one day.

Miles didn't have to keep pushing Jaune into the front of the show at the cost of the actual leads.

It's no secret that the show would always work this way where one of the people involved would posit an idea of how they think something could be cool if it happened - Monty was pretty notable for wanting to have Raven fight Team JNPR in the Fall of Beacon for example, and he refused to elaborate.

Is it so surprising someone like Miles or Kerry would want to "add their own touch"? So what if those ideas clashed with literally everything in the setting before - be it narratively or aesthetically?

But there was something else that changed.

Before V4 the people involved would come up with something and then work it into the plot. While imperfect, there was a possibility of a somewhat healthy dynamic where, with, likely, actual pushback between those involved - Monty never did get his "Raven fights everyone" scene after all, no matter how cool it could have been.

After V3 that dynamic was gone, obviously.

The creative element of the show fell apart, but Miles and co seemed to keep going like nothing happened - and at some point rather than a bunch of people discussing possible paths for the show, it turned into a situation where Miles or someone else would propose an idea and then it would happen.

As the show grew in scope so did the necessity for actually making those desired elements fit into the story. It was no longer about "hey we can't really justify Raven randomly showing up and fighting team JNPR" - there were Kingdoms and multiple locations and dozens of characters involved now.

They just lost their friend who proposed the show in the first place, they struggled to make the show continue and they were clearly inexperienced running something as big as this.

Yet instead of growing, learning, or hiring people, they seem to have been content with just dumping what Miles wanted into the show without worrying about narrative structure, set-ups, payoffs, characterization, and so on.

The weird medieval aesthetic of various locations no longer fits the contemporary modern setting of the first three Volumes? So what.

The magicky ridiculous cheese of brother gods was the polar opposite of a more grounded setting before it? So what.

The decision to not show actual character progression and growth that could be Yang's recovery arc because "it was boring"? This would make any writer or college professor scream because that's now how you characterization, that's not how you do pay off or ANYTHING, but yet again -so what?

Why?

They were unwilling to learn and to accept critique.

Listening to staff commentary for the show (even before Monty's passing) there's one thought that would persist - "Wow, they sure sound content and prideful with not knowing their things and just going with the flow."

RT drank their own Kool-Aid - "Oh we are just a small indie group of friends - look how scuffed our production and decision-making is."

It was impossible not to notice back then - people would point that out all the time.

Yet instead of improving and changing and learning and, honestly, growing up, Miles or someone else would just throw some backhanded remark and continue.

A group of amateur film-makers can grow and develop, but RT were so proud of their status as being this industry underdog where it's just a group of friends(despite that not being the case for YEARS at that point), that they were unwilling to make necessary changes in their work culture, approach or, well, anything.

I keep coming back to Miles watching Land of Lustrous and going "Oh, I don't get it." and that's it - there's no self-betterment or willingness to "get it" showcased and that's emblematic of RT culture as a whole.

Whether there was talent in the company (there was), it wouldn't matter if people at the top would stomp their feet and refuse to learn or improve. Even V9 staff had quite a few talented animators involved - did not help.

They were too caught up in the "youtube machinima bro culture" RT's size had long since grown out of.

They were "a bunch of friends, just a bunch of indie amateur people creating content", and they were proud of it and of how scuffed everything was.

So what if at that scale of the company, the culture would end up creating genuine issues with power dynamics, harassment, over-work, inefficient production, employee burnout, resource wasting, and so on?

The working conditions drove away most of the talent they had left over the course of next few years.

(Un)Surprisingly being stuck in a frathouse mentality lasting decades is a really good motivator for actual talented people within the company to quit and work elsewhere. Who would have thought?

One logical path forward would be to hire actual industry professionals, right? They could have created a writer's room, hired management experts, a proper HR department, hired sensitivity readers, outsourced researching various topics, etc, right? Miles and Co could keep pretending to be auteurs while competent people would get paid to do what needs to be done and course-correct them.

Easy, right?

Well.

They were unwilling to hire professionals.

Reminder that it took RT till around Atlas arc to have anything resembling a writers' room, they still refused to hire actual sensitivity readers to ensure they don't end up writing something blatantly ableist or just outright all-around problematic.

In the cases where professionals were involved, the people in charge just ignored all suggestions (otherwise Volume 8 and 9 would have been stopped at brainstorming phase and changed - I refuse to believe no one took a look at it and said "this will crash harder than Genlock Season Two")

I have no doubts people at the core of RT wanted to honor their friend's legacy and make right by them, but...

If "everything was fine" and who they were was fine and no critique mattered then why change anything or listen to outside voices?

And thus they continued.

Overall

It's a mix of variety of issues, really. It's actually kind of fascinating RT managed to have so many things go wrong.

[chaikachi]

Grief, Guilt, and Bloodied Hands

cross posted from twitter I want to talk about this episode's use of 'bloodied hands' and how it ties into Ruby as well as Rosegarden. This post does get *dark* tho & includes shots from some of the more distressing scenes of v9e8 so please tread with caution.

I don't really have to get into detail with how this episode was framed with saving Oscar until last being what pushed Ruby over the edge and why that's important. It's very clear to everyone that saw it. But let's talk about how we get there.

Ruby's aura broke when she fell from the chandelier and then she was tossed around by a few of Neo's puppets while Oz is left out of frame until the very end. It is only then that she starts to show welts and bruises, at the other end of Long Memory. Before vs After:

We can see she's got her own blood on her hands here. The way they use this particular visual cue is threefold.

The first thing it's symbolic of is her own inner wounds. How much they've hurt her, how they've led her here, & where they're leading her next. Also in the most literal meaning of the metaphor, this is emphasized by Ruby's 'death' being on her own hands by the end of the episode.

The second is that those 'inner wounds' of hers are partially the lives of all the people she couldn't save. Her grief and her guilt.

And the third association is being symbolic of the people she hasn't lost yet. Specifically Oscar. Which we can tell because immediately after that last image (the first time we're shown the blood), we see her hand grabs her weapon before she defends herself.

This is followed by the cane falling before we're shown that the blood on her hands is now Oscar's. The first time she's able to use Crescent Rose all volume and this is how she's rewarded for it.

At the beginning of this episode, she pushes Little away because she's convinced that if they stay with her, they'll end up dead too. I will get to them next, but first this confirms something very strongly:

That Ruby is afraid to move forward. Not just because of her past, but also because of her fear for the future.

In her monologue in the v4 finale, she says the following:

"Believe me when I say I know it can feel impossible. Like every single day is a struggle against some unstoppable monster we can never hope to beat... but we have to try. If not for us, then for the people we've already-... for the people we haven't lost yet."

This sequence is literally all of Ruby's motivations and fears combined into one torturous nightmare.

"If you stay with me, you're going to end up dead too."

She is being tricked into believing that if she stays with her friends, with Oscar, the same will happen to them.

That idea is what breaks her for the first time this episode before she's interrupted by the cat.

Brief sidestep to mention that the way they frame this particular shot implies that Yang is of similar if not equal importance to Ruby here. Cause yes I'm looking at this specifically through an RG lens, but it is very important to acknowledge this scene included more than just 'shipping fuel' in how much Oscar means to her. This is her character arc, her fatal flaws, and the importance of multiple relationships she has. It started with her grief toward Pyrrha & co., an emphasis on her grief and closeness to Penny, wrapped up with the fear of losing Oscar, and then everyone else.

Ruby first reaches for the tea after watching Oscar fall & is interrupted by the cat. But even when she later comes back to her choice, we are not allowed to forget just how much that scene hurt her. Because as Little is begging her to get up and run, they are holding onto that bloodied left hand that pulled the trigger.

When Neo... does what she does to them, the narrative is telling us that Little as well as the blood on Ruby's hands (and all the things it's associated with) combined together to steal all her remaining light away.

"The light of hope is taken."

"If you stay with me, you're going to end up dead too."

She is proven right twofold.

First, with the illusion of Oscar.

Then again with Little who is very much not a mirage. "If I stay or go back home, my friends will die. I stayed here, and another did die."

And she, quite literally, can't live with that thought.

-

I don't thinkg Oscar's very loud absence or the similarities between him and Little as I've mentioned in other posts, compounded with both of them being used by Neo as the last piece to get Ruby to 'break' are a coincidence. And while I'll admit this episode was flawlessly executed, I am manifesting that this show never gets that dark again because I don't think I can take it.

Thank you for reading, and pls manifest that reunion hug. 😭 🌹🌲

[blue-cheeseinmyoffwhites]

Very late, but, https://www.tumblr.com/blue-cheeseinmyoffwhites/756639587329277952/rwby-asks-are-open-im-bored?source=share

Who's you're favorite character?

Quick shoutout to the lovely @tumblingxelian for their amazing RWBY content check them out on YT

Let’s do Top 5

Mercury Black

This is solely because of his fighting style. If I could fuck up some stuff with my legs I’d probably be a dick about it too. I started RWBY during V2 & he was one of the first faces I met. I remember LOVING his design & liking his cool laid-back attitude. He started gaining my attention in Volume 3 after his fight with Coco & Yatsu, then won me over after his fight with Yang. I remember being baffled after his prosthetic reveal, & after learning about his allusion it all came together. For the longest time I was trying to decode his semblance (I thought it was something to do with wind manipulation) then V6 came around & shut all that down. I understand he hasn’t been very popular as of late, but I think he has so much potential & they just need to give him more screentime in V10+

Sun Wukong

I appreciate an unconditionally positive character. Sun & Mercury have always just been so cool to me. His design is great too, I like his monkey traits & how he shows his abs. His weapon is genuinely top 5 in the series, & his semblance matches his bright personality. One of my favorite fight scenes is Blake & Sun vs Sea Feilong & his contribution played a big part of that. I did like his appearance in V4-V5 & I was excited to see his gun-chucks return against Ilia. I think he is a great foil to Blake & serves her character arc really well.

Cinder Fall

Sorry but Cinder Fall is just that bitch. I hate everything she does & that’s why I love her. She knows what she wants & can easily get people on her side to do her bidding. She actually pushes the narrative & I consider her to be the main antagonist. The animators take real care when it comes to her battles. She has not missed a SINGLE fight she has been in. Seriously every one has been a hit: Glynda, Amber, Ozpin, Pyrrha, Raven, Neo, Winter, Penny, etc etc. Anytime there is a fight involving Cinder it’s going to be rememberable in some way, especially the Raven vs Cinder fight. I vividly remember my mind going numb watching it for the first time. I do feel they made her a little OP but it’s whatever. I really like her character arc & how she’s slowly turning into a Grimm. I loved her backstory, a lot of people didn’t because it’s just “Cinderella but dark” but like…..that’s kinda the entire point of this series, dark retellings of fairytales. She’s a great foil to Ruby & actually learns from her to gain victory in V8. I just want them to have a proper fight.

Qrow Branwen

Qrow Qrow Qrow. I love their man & want to give him hugs. If there’s one thing RWBY does amazingly, it is setup & payoff. I love his they slowly teased him in V1-V2 as a badass & then finally let us visualize it in V3. He doesn’t take crap from anyone & says what’s on his mind. Love Love LOVE his relationship with Ruby (forever holding onto my cracktheory that he’s her real dad). He acts as her mentor & influenced her fighting style. I like how he became the leader of the team for some time & how his laid-back attitude conflicts with him suddenly having to take care of 8 kids. But he does it anyway. His fight scenes are also amazing. He always looks so confident. His first appearance in V3 he had that super dynamic fight against Winter. In V4 he fought Tyrian & showed Team RNJR (& us) the difference between students & Huntsmen. V7 is where he really shined for me. He finally had a relationship that wasn’t affected by his semblance & can just chill for a while. I very much enjoyed his relationship with Clover & was heartbroken by what happened after. But those last 2 fights with them were pretty great. I hope his semblance evolves into Good Luck as well.

Yang Xiao Long

I like all members of Team RWBY but Yang stands out for obvious reasons. She had the best Trailer for one. Also her fighting style is the most different from her teammates. They’re all swing-swing-slash & she’s all punch-punch-kick. Like Cinder, Yang gets the best treatment when it comes to fight scenes. She’s been marketed as the strongest member & it shows over & over again. Her semblance is super cool & makes her look like a Goddess. I like how her character arc revolves around her fighting style & we can actually see her improvement throughout the volumes. I like how she is the most vocal about the whole trust situation in V5-V8. She lost her arm for this war, she of all people deserves some answers. I really adore her relationship with Blake & I think their story is perfect. She’s the heart of the team & it’s most present in V5 when she is the one reuniting the team.

[strqyr]

I don't know if this is appropriate to ask since it's been years already but I really can't let go of Yang's arc at volume 4. It leaves a bad taste to my mouth. Anyways, do you think that there are things that should have been added to Yang's arc at volume 4 or not?

i don't know about should have, but if i was given an option to have more of something, my answer to that will always be Yes, Please.

yang's arc in V4 is... let's say interesting for the lack of a better word, to me, because it's very straight to the point, no "fluff" or extra time spent on anything, like—

okay, to explain myself better, excluding the montage part from the V4 finale where everyone appears, yang appears in four (4) episodes in a 12 episode long volume. her first and second appearances are back to back in episodes 3 & 4, which could basically be summed up as 3: this is how yang's been doing since the fall of beacon, and 4: this is what yang's 'problem' (i.e. why she hasn't left the house / started training again) is. after that, she's 'gone' for four episodes until she makes another appearance in episode 9, in which she's now training and getting back on her feet; then comes episode 11, where yang is about to leave patch.

basically, yang's arc hits all the points it absolutely needs to hit, and no more. it's the bare minimum, and that can feel a bit... underwhelming when talking about one of the four main and title characters who, by far, had the most obvious and possibly the most anticipated arc set up from V3 after she lost her arm.

and while i don't know if there's anything that should have been added, personally i would have liked to see yang training and preparing for her upcoming journey more by, say, going to vale with tai to aid glynda and the rest with their attempts at reclaiming beacon. that way she would have had more time to get up to speed again after being inactive for months that isn't just sparring, but still in a bit more controlled environment than going out in the wilderness alone, with plenty of professionals around her.

and, like. idk this is just an even more of a personally i wish but like. out of all the teacher characters i feel like glynda is the only one who hasn't actually had any kind of one-on-one chat with any member of team rwby while ozpin, port, and oobleck have and all i'm saying is it would be. nice. to have that :)

(also as a bonus: glynda and tai talking about inner circle stuff in roundabout ways. i would eat that up.)

[jj411]

My analysis on Bumblebee (Yang x Blake)

To analyze BB we need to look at both Blake and Yang separately at their different arcs. Also we will need to look at Sun for a bit.

I've seen some people say that BB was love at first sight, or it came out of nowhere, or any other thing. I don't agree with those. Let's start by looking at V2.

During the early parts of V2, before the dance, Blake and Yang seem to just be normal friends and combat partners. Which I like. I prefer to see a relationship start as friends and grow deeper over time rather than instant romance at first sight. After a certain point Blake starts to overwork herself which causes everybody to worry about her. Then Sun shows up and was hoping he could invite her to the dance. Sun is very obvious in his attraction to Blake. Yang decides to help out and we get the scene where Yang explains about her mom and how everybody needs a break or they will burn out. She then says she will save Blake a dance and givers her a wink.

Now here is where I think Yang is showing that she is also attracted to Blake. Doesn't really mean love yet, but she is dropping hints of her attraction. Problem is Blake is still too wound up and distracted from White Fang activity so she doesn't seem to pick up on the hints. She goes to the dance and enjoys herself.

We then have that little campfire scene at Mt. Glenn where Yang tries to lift Blake's spirits about her always running away. I don't see this romantic. To me this was just Yang being a good friend and partner.

Now in V3 we don't get a lot until the end. We do get a Blake blushing at Sun early on though. Which shows mutual attraction between the two. But to me this feels more like puppy love, no pun intended. Basically like a high school crush. There is an attraction, but it never went all that deep.

Now we get to the fall of Beacon. Adam attacks Blake and says I will destroy everything you love. Blake hears Yang and sees her; and looks terrified. Adam see's her reaction and says 'Starting with her.'

Now I could be reading too much into, but here is what I think happened with Blake here since she never really showed any romantic thoughts towards Yang before. In this moment, Blake is beginning to realize that she does care about Yang on a deeper level. She just never would have thought about it before because her romantic thought's were on Sun before and she could never imagine her past coming back to attack Yang specifically. These feelings made Blake more aware of what she actually thought of Yang. I could be over analyzing that part.

The fall happens and Yang loses her arm defending Blake. Blake then runs back home with Sun tailing her. After the event Blake's romance towards Sun is basically gone, which to me just supports it was a high school romance type thing. No real depth was there. Now through out V4 and V5 we see Blake think about Yang from time to time. Even Sun brings her up. But Blake's feelings towards Yang is now mixed with a lot of guilt. We know Blake things of Yang on a deeper level, but guilt is now mixed in with that. So it's hard to say just how deep those feelings would really go.

Switching over to Yang, we see her think of Blake from time to time (when she looks at the pile of books). But Yang doesn't dwell on those thoughts too much in V4 as she has to deal with her own PTSD from loosing her arm. We don't get a lot of thoughts on what she thinks of Blake until V5 when she talks to Weiss. Yang makes it clear that she cares deeply for Blake, but Blake really hurt her by running. At this point they both stop thinking about each other as other arcs of the story needs their attention. (Haven and the White Fang attack)

Now we get to V6. The team is back and Blake is ready to jump at a moments notice when it seems like Yang needs something. Yang tells Blake it will be fine, but they will have to get used to things before they hopefully go back to normal. Blake is wanting to help Yang out of guilt and Yang is trying to keep Blake at arms length.

We see that a lot during V6. It especially comes to a head at the Apathy farm where Blake says she will protect Yang, which pisses her off. We learned in V4 that Yang does not like feeling inept. She can still be plenty capable, arm or no arm. To me it seemed like Yang wished Blake would have understood that about her. But they couldn't really talk about as they were on creepy death farm. It wasn't until they both killed Adam where it seemed like they were finally on the same page. Blake wasn't doing things out of guilt anymore and remembers to trust that Yang can handle herself. And Yang felt that trust from Blake.

In V7 we get to the awkward part of their relationship. I feel they each know they like each other but none of them want to really say it out loud. So they do the awkward flirt stuff. V8 had some strong moments and even stronger moments of pining. Then we get to V9 where there were more signs of physical touches until we get to the moment where they both declare that they both love each other.

So where Black Sun felt more shallow and like a high school crush. BB has far more depth to it because of it's buildup and realization from Blake. It's the fact that the relationship came back after Blake ran which is what adds the depth to their feelings towards each other. They were all able to forgive.

This is all just my analysis and I skimmed over some things and may have forgotten other things. But this is just my synopsis on BB's relationship. You may not agree with me, and that's fine. But this is how it looks to me and how I see how it happened. Ramble over.

[citadelofmythoughts]

Here’s a tough question. Top 3 favorite and least favorite things about each RWBY volume?

Sorry for the delay, this is something I've had to really think about.

V1 Faves

The initiation/Nevermore fight. Let's be honest this is where these legends started.

Blake & Yang meeting for the first time

Weiss and Blake coming to terms with each other

V`1 least faves

The animation. I know it was Poser, they had no budget, etc. That doesn't make it any easier to watch

That one line from Yang about boys that has haunted the discourse for nearly a decade.

TBH barely anyone had a character any deeper than surface level

V2 Faves

Yang talking to Blake in Burning The Candle. This is where their relationship became more than partners, deeper than just friendship

The talk between Weiss, Blake and Yang at Mountain Glenn. Something that would be directly referenced much later in V9

"Best Day Ever" - the food fight between RWBY and JNPR is just big dumb fun

V2 least faves

Jaune and his pursuit of Weiss. Obnoxious to the extreme.

Sun - that's it

"Breach" in general was kind of a mess and really was there to have a giant fight scene.

V3 Faves

"Heroes And Monsters" - It feels weird listing something so horrible and tragic as a favorite thing but what happened between Yang, Blake and Adam in this chapter would define these characters going forward all the way until almost the end of V6 and was a significant point in Blake & Yang's relationship

Also from "Heroes And Monsters" - Velvet unleashing Anesidora with "I May Fall" blasting is still so amazing to this day.

Yang being framed for injuring Mercury and Blake deciding to trust in her.

(I really could go on about V3 with many more positives.)

V3 least faves

SSSN vs NDGO - I DON'T CARE

Might be controversial but Pyrrha's death. I understood the narrative need for it but it doesn't mean I liked it

Same for Penny

V4 Faves

Meeting Blake's parents. Ghira and Kali are treasures.

The fight with Tyrian

Yang getting her new arm and starting her healing process

(Honorable mention to Blake, with Sun's help, starting to understand that sometimes you have to let people in and it's THEIR choice to want to be in your life. Also honorable mention to Ruby's letter in "No Safe Haven")

V4 least faves

Tai's "advice" both in "Family" and "One Step Forward..."

Sun. (I didn't start to be able to tolerate him unti V5)

Not nearly enough Yang

V5 Faves

Yang and Ruby reuniting - I always cry

Weiss' talk with Yang in "Alone Together" (which is also when I'm convinced she realized that Yang loved Blake)

"Yang...?" *Dumbfounded stare from Yang

(Honorable mention to Yang reading Raven for filth)

V5 least faves

The pacing wasn't great and yeah the big fight was lackluster

While the animation was fine the colors always felt very muted to me

Lionheart (not that I resented his use in the story, I just hate the dude)

V6 faves:

The Bees Vs Adam (was I gonna say anything else?)

The Brunswick Arc (why is CRWBY so good at horror?)

The fight with the Leviathan.

V6 least faves:

These are mostly really minor complaints

Dee and Dudley - annoying

The big lore dump, while not BAD was a LOT

Oscar vanishing and getting a new set of clothes off camera not that I care that much but I think it could have been handled better

V7 Faves

The makeovers, with the possible exception of Wess I thought everyone looked great and TBH Yang never looked better

The Bees getting ready to go on a date

Nora spilling the tea ABOUT the Bees

(Honorable mention to RBY standing by Weiss when she confronted Jacqass. Also honorable mention to Yang/Blake VS Elm/Vine)

V7 least faves (not writing critical just characters getting on my nerves)

Harriet is annoying

The AceOps being Ironwood's unthinking lapdogs

Ironwood coming out as a complete dumbass.

V8 Faves

Beeunion 2.0

Yang, Jaune and Ren infiltrating Salem's HQ and the fight that ensues. Especially Yang getting to talk smack to Salem and blowing her tits off.

Penny frying Cinder

(Honorable mention to Maria kicking Neo's ass)

V8 least faves

Ironwood continues to be a complete and total dumbass

Ren being a jerk. Thankfully he gets over it

Yang's fall. (not bad on a value level but it HURT)

V9 Faves:

The Bees confession - absolutely perfect. Could not be improved on

The fight scene in Rude, Red and Royal

Ruby getting her groove back and showing CC just how powerful she really is.

V9 least faves: (and I'm allowing for what I know was a difficult production)

We could have used at least another two chapters because some scenes and transitions were way too brief and as a result didn't have the emotional impact they should have

We didn't get the prologue that was shown at RTX

Minor complaint but in Chapter 1 I wish Blake had been shown as being a bit more worried about Yang since she saw her "die"

Wow, this was a LOT!

[tifaisms]

RWBY and Trauma Part 2: Team RWBY

Ruby lost a lot of people that she was close with, and moved forward too much - she ended up hurting people close to her because she refused to process her grief, and it led to her own misery, and that isn't something anyone wants to see. She also lashed out at people close to her in volume 9 as a direct result of her refusing to process her trauma, and seeing everyone else dealing with theirs and moving forward.

Weiss has trauma around her upbringing, and she let it colour her worldview and caused her to hold biases and prejudice that she worked to undo over the course of the show. She also hurt her brother without even realising - a documented phenomenon among children with siblings in abusive households is the complex cocktail of emotions around feelings of leaving, being left behind, being the favourite, etc. so Weiss ultimately made peace with her family, including her brother, because he was as much a victim as she was and he didn't deserve to be treated like a villain for it. they are now on the road to making peace with each other and moving forward as a family.

Blake suffered tremendously at the hands of Adam. She became wrapped up in his twisted view of the world and his twisted sense of justice, and she managed to escape from it, but Blake suffers from a specific trauma response that Ruby also has - she runs away. But where Ruby simply avoids her trauma, Blake physically distances herself from it. The problem is that she hurts people by doing so because she abandons them, and they are left to pick up the pieces by themselves. it takes Ilia, of all people, to help her understand this. Blake worked with Ilia to help her make amends for her actions, because staying behind to patch things up is far better than running away from the past. you need to confront it head on, and Blake realises through helping Ilia that she herself isn't staying behind to make things right. Ilia doesn't run away from her actions, and Blake shouldn't either. She realises that running away only hurts people close to you, and it doesn't help you in the long run. so Blake learns to commit. I'm very curious to rewatch v9 because I don't remember who makes the first move in the BB confession, but I think it works better if it's Blake, so I hope it is, because her whole deal was running away, so for her to CHOOSE to stay, even if things aren't perfect or going great, is a big personal step for her.

side note re Blake, Sun was very important for her arc because he is a shonen protag archetype and that really helps people deal with trauma by simply addressing it directly. He never gives her the answers, but he does push her out of her comfort zone to reach conclusions herself. Excellent supporting character, if a bit messy in the way he was written into v4. He was necessary for Blake to open up and deal with her trauma.

Yang's trauma is around abandonment and anger. Anger is an amoral emotion - it is the ways in which it is directed that lead to negative consequences. And Yang's semblance is representative of her anger manifesting in self destructive ways, because she needs to take the hit to get the payback. After Yang trains, she fights smarter, and learns that her anger, her semblance, is a powerful tool, but it is NOT something you should rely on. Keep a cool head, and you can protect people a lot better. It's also worth noting that Yang has dealt with her abandonment trauma as a result of Blake coming back, because abandonment leads to feelings of inadequacy - did they leave because they don't love me? and when Yang is shown that that is not the case, by blake coming back and making amends, and by disowning Raven instead of the other way around, she realises that she isn't the problem and never was - Blake ran because she was scared, but she came back because she realised it was wrong of her to run and hurt Yang in that way. Raven ran because she was a coward, and chose not to return because she is still running.

I've seen some people point out that team RWBY and team STRQ kinda parallel each other, with Summer and Ruby being the leader with the crushing weight of the world on their shoulders, Tai and Yang having been abandoned by the love of their life, Blake and Raven running from their problems when things look bad, and Weiss and Qrow having trauma related to their loneliness and isolation.

The fundamental difference is that team RWBY grew.

Summer told no one anything, and presumably died on a mission in secret. Ruby never shared her burdens with anyone, and it technically killed her in V9, but she was reborn and now needs to realise that she is not Atlas - the weight of the world is not her burden alone to bear.

Tai was left behind by Raven, and it destroyed him. Yang was left by Blake, and even before Blake came back, she prioritised the people she still had in her life, namely Ruby, and decided to do what she could for them.

Raven ran away from all of her problems and all of the people she cared about out of fear and paranoia, and never stayed in one place for too long. Blake did the same, until she realised that she was hurting people she cared about, and would rather face difficult problems with them than run away without them.

Qrow lets his isolation seclude him from people out of fear of hurting them, and it drives him into a depressive spiral. Weiss is isolated too, and even though their circumstances lead both to solitude, Weiss begins the slow road to making connections. I want to note that Qrow also does this, and eve nthough it kinda blows up in his face, I believe that he will also continue making strides and paralleling Weiss breaking away from terrible family members.

One last thing to touch on then I'm done, I'm sorry this post is so long lmao it's just a LOT to discuss.

I want to talk about Yang's semblance and how it parallels Adam's. Yang's strength comes from her anger. She takes the hit, and gets a rage power up to dish it out twofold, but it is self destructive and risky. Because anger can be directed and used for good, but it is dangerous to YOU. Adam on the other hand has no physical drawbacks to his anger on a magic system level. But that doesn't mean the anger isn't there, and it doesn't mean the anger isn't destroying him. It's jsut not physically destroying him. Having two characters rely on anger in this way, and having them parallel each other in a number of ways, is really cool.

Okay, I'm done for real. Hope you all enjoyed reading.

[bestworstcase]

Thanks for your response ala Ruby & Yang, great stuff!

Idle aside, but do you have any thoughts on Yang's role as the sort of black sheep of the family by dint of Raven associations?

Cos like, Tai overtly favors Ruby, projects Raven onto Yang, resents Raven being rough up and is bad enough about reminders of her Yang feels she has to apologize for his negative reactions. Let alone his... Everything else.

Then there's Qrow who doesn't seem to interact with Yang over much at all and one of if not their most major interaction. Involves him straight up saying he thinks she's either a liar hurting people for fun or "crazy".

I recall someone I was chatting with wondering: Imagine doing everything you can to keep your family from breaking apart & being compared to the woman who left you when you were a baby?

Cos I do wonder how Yang feels about all that given she seems to downplay and or try to work around her family's issues when she can. Let alone what it says about the adults in the room.

smth i think about a lot is the way yang’s narrative about her childhood shifts between v2 to v5

’cause in v2 it’s: “it was tough. ruby was really torn up, my dad kind of shut down. it wasn’t long before i learned why…” all to provide context for this anecdote about putting ruby in a wagon and running away to find her mother. and then her conclusion is “my stubbornness should have gotten us killed that night.”

and while there is a degree here of yang framing the story to emphasize the point she wants blake to understand, it’s also very obvious in her delivery that the emotional reality of this memory for yang is “the time my stupidity and stubbornness almost got me and ruby eaten by grimm”—when she was [checks notes] like five, six years old, and regularly left at home unsupervised.

but in v5, it’s: “my mom left me. ruby’s mom left too. tai was always busy with school, and ruby couldn’t even talk yet; i had to pick up the pieces. i had to pick up the pieces. alone.”

aside from the telling slip (tai, not dad)—yang centers her own feelings and the harm this situation did to her this time. which is something she’s always felt but i don’t think she could have brought herself to say it out loud to anyone during the beacon arc, because it was pressed down under the guilt on display in burning the candle, the feeling of having been inadequate and too stubborn and too selfish and and and–

coughs quietly. “my stubbornness should have gotten us killed that night.” / “you were predictable. and… stubborn. and maybe a little boneheaded.” yang’s narrative about the wagon incident—which happened when she was five or six!—pinning the blame on the thing tai imagines to be her fatal flaw is…probably not coincidental. yang in v4 after a year of being loved by her team and supported by mentors like glynda / oobleck / port has the perspective to know that tai doesn’t know what he’s talking about; but as a small child who’d just had a terrifying near-death experience with her baby sister… 😶

it definitely had a big impact on the way yang sees herself

BUT i do read qrow's talk with yang in 3.8 pretty differently ->

because the context is: yang saw mercury attack her and struck back in self defense, then had like a dozen synthetic soldiers point guns in her face, then looked up and saw the replay footage of herself walking over to shoot a boy who was just kneeling on the ground. and some of the most powerful authority figures in the world are pushing this narrative that stress and adrenaline "clouded her judgment."

like this would make anyone doubt their sanity. bc holy shit.

yang, though...a couple weeks ago, yang after being knocked unconscious woke up and blearily saw someone she thought was her mother walk away from her and disappear in a flash of red light. she hasn't mentioned it to anyone, because it's just so bizarre—yang doesn't know about raven's semblance yet—she must have just been seeing things. right?

aside from raven (who isn't here) and yang (who believes she hallucinated), the only other person who knows that yang saw her mom on the train is qrow, because raven told him about it. he also knows that:

tai insisted on not telling yang ANYTHING about her mother, and qrow respected that up until now; so yang doesn't know about raven's semblance and can't make sense of what she saw.

salem's infiltrators are the same people who attacked amber, and qrow didn't get a good look at them because they seemingly vanished into thin air—pretty damn good chance that one of them has a semblance that manipulates what you see.

ozpin wants #2 kept secret, so yang has some very powerful people actively trying to convince her that she's crazy. ironwood is straight up gaslighting her.

qrow also—based on the first thing he says, which is "why'd you do it?"—seems to consider it a possibility that it is what it looked like but yang did have a good reason, and i actually do not think that is an outrageous thing for qrow specifically to think. because qrow was emotionally abused as a child, and he knows yang, and in the event that yang really did suddenly turn around and punch a guy who was kneeling on the ground, why would she do it?

glances at shay d. mann. well. maybe this kid has been harassing her? maybe he said something horrible or threatening to her and in the heat of the moment she just snapped? maybe "he attacked me, i saw him attack me" isn't really a lie per se, she's just scared that "he's been picking on me ever since he got here and he made a disgusting remark and i just couldn't take it anymore" won't be taken seriously? as in, he did attack her—verbally/emotionally.

it's probably worth asking, at least!

so, qrow leads with "why'd you do it?" in case there is some invisible reason justifying the apparent action. yang says "you know why." qrow goes okay, well, i only know what i saw, so you're either lying (i.e., yang had a reason she now isn't telling) or crazy (i.e., yang saw something different from reality that was very real to her).

she says "i'm not lying." qrow believes her: "crazy, got it."

at this point, he knows the most probable explanation is that one of salem's infiltrators fucked with her head. the inner circle's gaslighting doesn't sit right with him; he's not going to buck ozpin by telling her the truth outright, but he wants to make sure yang knows she isn't losing her mind. he also has all the info needed to guess that yang is actually really really scared that she might be crazy.

which is why he kicks off the wall and begins to pace around. the language he uses sounds dismissive, but his tone is mild and his body language implies "let's talk about it, let's figure this out."

leading to:

YANG: Who knows? Maybe I am. QROW: And here I thought your dark-haired friend was the emo one. YANG: I saw my mom. …I- I was in a lot of trouble, took a pretty hard hit. But when I came to, the person attacking me was gone, and I thought I saw… her. Her sword. Like the one in you and dad’s old picture. QROW: You’re not crazy, Yang. That was your mom, alright. Let me guess—she didn’t say a word, did she? YANG: How did you know that? QROW: I don't see my sister very often, but she does try to keep in touch... whenever it suits her. YANG: Wait—you mean you talk to her? That was real!? QROW: Yeah, she found me. Had a tip from my most recent assignment and wanted me to give you a message.

it's really telling that yang responds to him this way. 'cause we've seen how yang acts when she feels dismissed or belittled:

TAI: Well, "normal" is what you make of it. YANG: What is that supposed to mean? Do you want me to just pretend like nothing happened? I lost a part of me. A piece of me is gone. And it's never coming back. TAI: You're right. It's not coming back. But that doesn't have to stop you from becoming who you wanna be. You're Yang Xiao Long, my sunny little dragon. You can do whatever you put your mind to. So whenever you're ready to stop moping, and get back out there? I'll be there for you. YANG: I– I...

she freezes and shuts down! her teachers have to come to her rescue!—but when qrow goes "crazy, got it" and suggests she's being "emo," yang blurts out her big secret. i saw my mom. to me that suggests a level of trust and understanding that isn't there with tai: qrow says stuff like "okay, so you're crazy" and "here i thought your friend was the emo one" but what he means is "hey, i know something's really bugging you, tell me about it," and yang picks up what he's putting down.

it's akin to how ruby goes "did you miss me? DID YOU MISS ME??" and qrow's like "nope" and they both laugh. or the back-and-forth ribbing between him and the girls in 3.4. there's this layer of mild ironic meanness in the way qrow converses with his nieces that all of them are fluent in, and in this scene he's using that mode to signal that "crazy" is not off-limits, that it's okay to talk about openly.

crucially, there's a code-switch in the middle of the conversation: as soon as yang gets real and says "i saw my mom," qrow reflects that seriousness back to her. you're not crazy, that was your mom, she found me afterward and told me about it. it was real. you're okay. qrow's ability to do that—to shift into a more serious mode when irony isn't appropriate—is why yang can have this rapport with him that she doesn't have with tai, because tai isn't... being ironic when he says mean or dismissive things to her.

anyway, qrow passes on raven's terrible message and then kind of annotates it: "raven's got an interesting way of looking at the world that i don't particularly agree with, and she's dangerous." (which is a very diplomatic way of saying he thinks raven is full of shit. lol.) but then he connects this whole conversation about raven back to what happened after the match: "you're a tough egg, kiddo. don't let this tournament thing getcha down. you had a slip-up; sometimes bad things just happen."

implicitly: yang isn't crazy. what she saw on the train was real, a product of raven's personality and her semblance. sometimes bad things just happen. qrow believes that yang had the experience she says she did when she punched mercury. he doesn't know why she had that experience—yang doesn't either!—but he knows she isn't just "crazy." sometimes things that seem crazy are actually real.

remember what he tells the girls in 3.4? "you may be acting like huntresses, but you're not thinking like one." same thing here. he's telling yang, hey, you're not crazy, you know what you saw, but you don't know what or who caused you to see it. "you cut off the head of the king taijitu, but now the second head's calling the shots."

hint, hint.

it's subtler than the hints qrow drops for ruby in 3.12, but very much in the same vein, and yang is plenty smart enough to figure it out. she might... not have? in the couple of hours between this conversation and everything going to straight to hell, but if they'd had literally just one more day, just long enough for the wheels turning in yang's head to click together with what ruby heard from velvet about coco hallucinating during her and yatsu's 2v2 against emerald and mercury, she would've had it.

more... generally, i've never gotten the sense that qrow projects raven's flaws onto yang in the way that tai does; qrow is definitely a lot closer with ruby than yang, but i think that has less to do with favoritism on qrow's part than it does ruby thinking he's like the COOLEST uncle ever and wanting to use a scythe like he does.

'cause like, qrow isn't their parent, he doesn't live with them, he's not responsible for raising these kids like their dad is, so while he obviously did contribute to fucking them both up because: alcoholic, ultimately there just isn't the same degree of betrayal or emotional abandonment; he's not their dad. both times yang talks in detail about her childhood, it's "my mom left, ruby's mom left, tai wasn't really around, ruby couldn't even talk, i was alone"—she doesn't mention qrow. there isn't that deep hurt, that feeling that qrow is someone who left.

when he isn't drunk, yang seems to feel pretty okay around him, and qrow likewise treats her... honestly a lot better than tai does:

he stops by their dorm in v3 to hang out with both his nieces; yang is fully in sister mode—cheers for ruby to beat him until ruby loses, immediately shoves her out of the way like "my turn!! >:D"—and qrow ribs them both, takes ribbing from both of them in good humor, tells both of them "you two are gonna go far."

qrow nicknames to show affection; ruby is "pipsqueak," yang gets "firecracker."

we only see qrow's goodbye to ruby, but in 5.4 yang indicates that qrow came to talk to her before he left, too. she also has complete trust that he's keeping the promise he made to look after ruby.

yang, as noted, opens up to him about seeing her mom; she's also shocked that he's still in contact with raven and indignant that he didn't tell her sooner, but—unlike with tai—she doesn't seem surprised that qrow is willing to talk about raven in general.

which tracks with what tai says in 4.11: "despite asking him numerous times not to, i know qrow told you where you're mother's been at these days"—meaning, this was a point of contention between him and qrow. behind the scenes, while tai refused to discuss raven at all, qrow was going okay well, let me tell her then, she deserves to know. and then ultimately he just bit the bullet and told her behind tai's back. i wouldn't be surprised if it turned out qrow had been straight with yang that her dad wanted to be the one to tell her the important stuff, and he wanted to be respectful of that, but raven wasn't an off-limits topic.

general contrast between yang-tai and yang-qrow dynamics; for example both of them say almost verbatim "you've got a long way to go before you're ready for the real world" (3.4/4.4). from tai it's belittling, he's insulting her; from qrow, it's meant to encourage, it's "remember you're still new to this, you'll make mistakes, just keep learning, keep trying." (rwby does stuff like this all the time, refracting an idea in different directions to highlight contrasts between characters; ozpin's advice to ruby vs port's advice to weiss is another example.)

a lot of qrow's resentment toward raven is centered on her abandonment of yang: "did you know yang lost her arm? [...] rhetorical question, i know you know. it's just obnoxious that you'd bring up family and then carry on like your own daughter doesn't exist. [raven: "i saved her."] once. because that was your rule, right? real mom of the year material, sis." like he is PISSED on yang's behalf that raven won't even try.

my impression is that qrow—although a) often away on long missions in far away places and b) an alcoholic who sometimes got blind drunk and became a burden yang and ruby needed to take care of—when he did manage to be there, made a serious effort to connect with both of them. he ended up being closer to ruby bc she wanted to learn scythe-wielding, but i do think qrow would've trained yang too (or instead) if the girls had different combat interests.

and while his relationship with ruby has a mentorish aspect, i don't get the sense either of the girls see him as a parental figure: he wasn't part of their household, he traveled a lot, his alcoholism in combination with tai's neglect eroded the adult-child boundaries because they had to be responsible for him as often as the reverse. he's a friend who also happens to be related to them. and that's especially true for yang, because he wasn't her teacher.

(i know it's a... pretty common headcanon / fanon that qrow lived with them, but i really don't think that's supported by the text? whenever ruby or yang look back on their childhoods, the family unit is always them + tai, and qrow isolates himself out of fear that his semblance will injure those he cares about. plus ozpin sending him all over the place as the one member of team strq still active. it makes way more sense to think he lived alone, and visited when he had the chance. which is the main reason i'm WAY softer on him than on tai, 'cause qrow wasn't in a caretaker/parent role; at most he was an occasional babysitter. so while his incidents of turning up drunk on the doorstep contributed to the harm... it's like, it would absolutely have been better for them if qrow were sober, but that wouldn't have changed anything about their home life. they'd just have somewhat easier relationships with qrow.)

TO WRAP THIS BACK AROUND TO THE QUESTION, tai is unfairly judgmental and harsh with yang bc he projects his idea of her mom onto her; yang also has a better relationship with her mom's brother than she does with her dad. how do these two dynamics interact? how does yang feel about hearing from tai that she's too branwen, so to speak, while also getting along better with the branwen side of her family? how might that fuel her desire to find raven?

if her uncle treats her better than tai does, then... maybe her mom would too, if only yang could reach her?—obviously it's not rational, but like. i don't think five year old yang put her baby sister in a wagon and ran away to find her mom because she thought she would ask "why did you leave me?" and then get her answer and go home. as yang grew older and developed a more realistic perspective it shifted to "i just need to know why she left" and she projects that backward onto herself as a child, but at the time what she wanted, what she was looking for, was someone who would take care of them.

[the-incorrigible-chaia]

The White Fang Arc Is Racist

I'm saying this as someone who really, genuinely adores RWBY as a show: The way the White Fang arc was written is racist.

(Note: I'm not saying the writers are racist, I'm saying that the story they wrote, as it stands, has racist elements. Describing people as racist is usually less helpful than describing actions or choices as racist.)

Remember:

Simply put: They should have either a) introduced Sienna Khan much, much earlier, and made it abundantly clear that Adam was going rogue, or b) not killed her off, or c) both.

The problem with Adam Taurus isn't that he's a villain, an abusive piece of shit, or that he ended up being killed by Blake and Yang. The problem is that he's taken as the be-all and end-all of violent Faunus resistance to human persecution. In the show as we have it, Adam's White Fang is the only example we have of Faunus rights activists who are willing to use violence. The show polarizes between the Good Activists who never use violence and instead try to Set An Example and Earn The Humans' Respect, and the Bad Activists who are siding with Salem, who blow up cities and unleash Grimm into schools and cut off Yang's arm - and against whom violence by Team RWBY is therefore justified. This implies that violence against Faunus rights activists is OK as long as they're Bad Activists, but violence by Faunus rights activists is not, because that would make them Bad Activists.

And this is, I think, why they tried to backpedal by introducing Sienna Khan. She is, in my opinion, a great character. Ghira's speech in V5C3 made clear that while he, as a character, doesn't approve of her violent methods, her goal is that of equality. She's a good person with just goals who also uses violence where necessary - the same as Robyn Hill, or Team RWBY themselves.

But she should have been brought up much, much, much earlier. By casting Adam as the leader of the White Fang in Volumes 2 and 3, the entire White Fang is cast as villains who are working with the known evil of Cinder. If they'd even mentioned Sienna Khan earlier - maybe had some White Fang grunts express reservations about going behind her back, or have Adam lie to her about his plans - it would have made it clear that Adam is going rogue and acting on his own personal bullshit.

But they didn't do that.

So V4 rolls around, and Sienna is mentioned by the Albains, only for them to be revealed to also be working for Adam. Bleh. Finally, Sienna appears in V5 - much too late - and dresses down Adam for his bullshit. And this could have been the point where Adam fully goes rogue, splits off on his own, and tries to go after Blake. Hell, he could still have launched a coup, and we could have gotten a season of Sienna and Ghira having to put aside their differences to stop him - since, as Blake points out in V5, Haven falling wouldn't materially help the Faunus at all. It's a plan wholly composed by Salem to get the Relic. That story could have ended with Sienna retaking control of the White Fang, maybe with her and Ghira having both learned from the situation - Sienna learning not to allow the conditions that let someone like Adam's influence grow unchecked, and Ghira learning that sometimes violence is the only viable option. They could both renew their commitment to Faunus equality, and to working together in the future to get it.

But no, they don't do that. Instead, they kill Sienna off, and flatten the nuance back down to Good Activists Who Are Peaceful vs. Bad Activists Against Whom It Is OK To Be Violent (and OK to inflict police violence towards.)

Adam is a good villain, a perfect representation of someone who's decided that justice is impossible, so the next best thing is revenge. But without Sienna Khan present in the story to provide important nuance, Adam's presence as a villain makes him representative of all violent praxis, and in condemning him, the story also condemns that praxis.

And that's racist.

[kob131]

RWBY WA here. Turns out that volume 5 got me...

So, I really loved Qrow, especially episode 1

The Belladonna family's arc was great, although I'm not sure what animal the father is exactly (I guess some kind of feline anyway. Maybe lion?)

Sun was still great.

I loved seeing Yang's development with Raven. It was really great and I hope that when the series end, we get to see her healing her inner child by being an amazing mom.

Speaking of Raven, I was like that all season: "I'm sure the Fall Maiden is Raven. Oh, the way they talk about it, probably not. Ah, I see, it's the woman from the opening. It probably won't end well so I guess that Raven will be transferred the power. Oh oh... I KNEW IT!"

(Turns out that this info never stuck to my brain, so I was half surprised by it but now that I'm thinking about it, I must have read somewhere that she was the Maiden)

I'm happy to see Weiss growing her power like that, along with how Jaune found his semblance. I also kind of wished I didn't know who are still alive by volume 9 because there was no tension for when Weiss got hit by Cinder... (and I'm also not worried about Cinder's fate for example...)

Strangely, I feel like there haven't really been a lot in this volume. It didn't feel like 14 episodes but more like... 8. It was a nice volume, and I'm still highly enjoying the show.

Will see when I start volume 6, but I'm confident that that after 5 volumes, I cannot be disappointed.

Well, I'm glad you liked it. Volume 5 is the roughest spot in the whole show due to the higher ups, one guy in particular, being dicks which exasperated RWBY's issues. So that's a big sticking point.

Once again- Qrow is great. He's a very versatile character who can act as the cool mentor, the cynical professional, the overly jaded broken man and the powerhouse of the team.

I actually really do like the Belladonnas. They're loving parents to Blake even after she ran away, which kind of shows why she's so ashamed to come back: she kind of spat in their faces when they were kind of right all along. Kali's great acting as the subtle jokester to Ghira's very serious and somewhat awkward demeanor, especially when she pushed for them to talk in Volume 4. Kind of reflects what Sun did. And Ghira's an upstanding, moral guy who actually shows were Blake got her personality from...and it logically leads to them being very awkward around each other until they finally have an understanding.

Yeah, Sun's great once again. He's a fucking great contrast with Blake with his louder vocal delivery, jokester personality and little to no knowledge about the WF. A better contrast (specifically) than Yang whose a little more soft spoken, moody and just isn't connected to the WF though is more connected to Adam than Sun is. I love that: the two characters contrasting Blake do so in subtly different ways.

So fun fact: I'm not a big fan of Raven. Granted, this is partially because her fanbase loved to bash on Taiyang during V4-5's run but I'm just not a fan of her cowardice, hypocrisy or her utter use of her family (Qrow and Yang) as bait.

Though don't get me wrong- she's not badly written. Raven is MEANT to be cowardly and hypocritical. Those are intentional character flaws that catch up to her in the finale, as her hypocrisy is due to her just doing whatever benefits her. Meaning she has no reason to think things through, like taking a Relic Salem wants to get out of the conflict. Or how her cowardice leads her to being unable to stand with her own daughter and brother, leaving her to run away to the only place she has left- Patch. And even that probably didn't give her solace, given Tai's look. And it does make sense that she cares about Yang with the context of her watching over Yang for a long time now alongside her Semblance so she is set up for a redemption. But-

I just like the heroes in RWBY better than the villains. I like about two villains and one of them was a former hero.

I'm not surprised you may have heard that- The fanbase FLIPPED when Raven revealed it. Because the writers did a REALLY good job using misdirection and common narrative build up to convince us Vernal was the Spring Maiden. So you likely caught some of that from the aftermath of that big flip out.

All I can add is- Jaune's Semblence fits his arc perfectly in recognizing that he ISN'T the big, proud hero and...yeah, spoilers can suck.

Really now? I guess I can see that- the episodes do flow together very well so it may have made it a breeze.

Before you go to V6 though, make sure to check the Adam Character Short before you do. It's important supplementary material.

P.S. I'm surprised there's no talk of Illa. Because I think she's still one of the best written characters in the show. She demonstrates why someone would join the WF, how their pain and the slow progress of equality would lead someone to radicalism and how even her feelings for Blake gave her a mirror image to Adam and how it really drives home that Adam could have been good once upon a time...but he choose to be malicious and petty.

[invested-in-your-future]

Just because I got few similar asks asking about that

The issue with "Fixing" a writing of a show is that you are naturally assuming you are only fixing specific "season" and that there will be a point in the show when the writing "goes back" to being coherent and proper.

So for example, if you are trying to fix Volume 4 as Volume 5 is airing, you might, consciously or subconsciously, hope that V5 ending is where everything once again "clicks" and thus you just need to alter what doesn't work in V4 and what doesn't in V5.

So you think up of which parts should be changed. And sure that might mean entirety of Menagerie location needs to go (because real world implications of that whole arc are just...NO and you can probably think up a better WF storyline in half a hour with how bad that was) and Port needs to disappear off the face of this fictional story and pointless empty scenes of Ruby and Co walking through exact same forest textures need to be changed, but the structure might still work right? They are still traveling towards a specific goal right? So you just have to change HOW they get to that goal, because there is a goal right??? And then You just need to tweak the elements that don't work in V5 up to the ending where you hope things might get shaken up a bit more and go back on track.

But then V5 ends and the writing's still a mess. And before you manage to quite think through what to do, V6 starts and the writing is STILL a mess and what's more, it has a whole new set of problems and by this point you realize that for example, the entire structure of Kingdom of Mistral doesn't quite make sense, as if "someone" just plopped bunch of town locations in a straight line and then used Google's translation feature to just make up bunch of names for them, because entire continent is ultimately just an irrelevant detour.

Whoops, now you have to review what you did with fixing earlier parts and see if new problems arose, change up the geography of the story a bit, etc. You just realized that there's not really "a point" to the adventure of traveling through Mistral anymore so you need to think something up as you realize that the main character of the entire story has absolutely zero character growth from V3. The show is back to status quo yet again and its like V4 through V5 are completely pointless.

You realize, that Ruby Rose, the character that went through some of the most lifechanging events ever, just spent two seasons just ambiguously walking through bunch of forest areas and towns.

What's more, the team is back together but literally nothing that happened has been addressed in anyway and there's no actual growth of the characters at all. That can't be right. Right? Surely at least Yang and Blake w-... Oh no...

Resigned, you go back to your thoughts about what would need to change in V4 and a lot has to change once again to make Mistral anything but one huge pointless detour.

But its okay you th-...wait what's that sound? Its as if, somewhere just outside, a train just went off the rails as it was crossing a bridge and then somehow managed to jump over a shark and then exploded as it hit the ground...Whoopsie daisy.

In this exact moment, the writing throws you the infamous "Salem Flashback Episode", "The Lost Fable", and accidentally entire lore is now broken completely and it might be one of the worst written things in the entire show till that point, that kind of trivializes multiple mysteries people were waiting for and makes the writing for lead villain extremely tropey and honestly (yet again, as you start to notice a pattern in how the show writes women) misogynistic and if you want to make things work you might as well redo that too. Wait..."that" as in what??? As in the entire core of why the show is happening in the first place? THAT's broken? Well F-...

So now you barely started sorting out the mess of V5 (because its entire volume of basically literally nothing happening and whatever interesting happens always gets off-screened) and the show-proper just basically NUKED almost all of it's set-up and more than half of it's mysteries.

You realize you are staring at an episode that honestly can compete with worst seasons of Voltron in how bad it is. You actually start to think it might compete with the second genLOCK season in awfulness, but end up not thinking it can be THAT bad. I mean the show will never go bad as genLOCK S2, riiight?

Its okay, its okay - you have been theorycrafting RWBY stuff since the first trailers hit. You've read all the song lyrics which are filled with all these immaculate hints at the intent behind the show, thoughts of various characters and where things are going, you can maybe piece together something other than another "disgruntled manipulative woman" storyline. The songs having actual lore is great. I mean they wouldn't just suddenly throw that away, right? As that thought hits you, a sense of dread starts to overcome you.

And thus as another disaster closes in. at this point, little does your past self know that in the future, few years latter, the show will deliver a whole season of nothing but train crashes, but this time the sharks being jumped will talk like humans do.

So yeah... you can't really "Fix RWBY". Sure parts like Ren and Nora's backstory episode are nice and there are moments that felt good otherwise, but at that point, pretty much majority of post-V3 stuff is outright unusable. At this point to Fix RWBY means to redo literal core reasons on why the story is happening, how the world and it's lore works, motivations of the characters and, well, everything...

And that's how you end up with a file over hundred pages long that quietly has chronicled both your efforts to make sense of what the show even wants to be, as well as the show's descent into just complete randomness...

After all, when a writing team writes EVERY volume as one huge pointless detour that in no way actually enhances the characterization or story, at some point the whole train is bound to derail and crash...over and over again.

[weatherman667]

RWBY Shipping

Double Rainbow:  Jaune Arc x Ilia Amitola

Comes from my Firen Lhain story (Harem / No Harem)

Putting Ilia in charge of the White Fang was insanely idiotic.  She had no grasp of morality, and no leadership skills.  But, she’s a really interesting character.  So, I decided to keep her.  Blake purposefully kept her distance to not lead her on.

This left Jaune to be the one to teach, guide, and look out for her.  And it just became so magical.  So magical that I rewrote the whole story to break up the Pollinated Knight (JxRWBY) relationship.

Arkos:  Jaune Arc x Pyrrha Nikos

As one commentator pointed out, everyone loves Arkos, because everyone wants Pyrrha to be happy.  Of the canon romances, this is the only good one.  And truthfully, one of the only canon ones from the current generation.  There’s Arkos, and there’s Bumblebee, and Bumblebee is horrendously abusive.  There is Saphron and Terra, and while their relationship is good, they provide nothing to the story at all.  Their addition to the story could have been replaced by a hotel.

As for the previous generation?  Weiss’ parents are a great example of how not to parent.  Ruby and Yang had one mother who abandoned them, and another that went missing on a save-the-world mission.  Tai basically did everything he could to hold them together, and Qrow was a great cool uncle, which means he’s missing most of the time.  Ghira and Kali are excellent.  Who else has a parent?  Seriously?

Pollinated Knight:  Jaune x Ruby, Weiss, Blake, and Yang

With one caveat, I like all of the involved pairings.

Lancaster:  Jaune Arc x Ruby Rose:  They are either incredible romantic or platonic partners.  They can simply say “Nope” to cheer each other up.

White Knight:  Jaune Arc x Weiss Schnee:  One of the only relationship is the series, even if it’s one-sided.  They also did a fantastic job of showing growth for both of the characters, so when they meet again in Haven they are very different people.

Knightshade:  Jaune Arc x Blake Belladonna:  The more I see of Blake, the more I hate her, but this is largely because she had a lot of character growth she would have to make, and never did that.  Which is where Jaune falls in, as he does go through tremendous growth, and provides moral grounding for the story.

Dragonslayer:  Jaune Arc x Yang Xiao Long:  Yang is the first person to support Jaune, and the only one to do so throughout the entire story.  But she’s also a lot more vulnerable than she lets on.  She needs someone to be strong when she’s weak, and someone to step aside when she’s strong, (and pick up the pieces).

White Rose:  Ruby Rose x Weiss Schnee:  The most adorable pairing in RWBY.  Just remember, Weiss nags because she cares.

Ladybug:  Ruby Rose x Blake Belladonna:  Diabetes, in romance form.

Checkmate:  One of the first pieces of character development in RWBY, (the team, not the story).  Often called the Checkmate Arc. Unfortunately, that’s the extent the pairing went.  But, during this arc, the interplay is fantastic.

Freezerburn:  A song of fire and ice.  Too bad for Grr Martin, it’s too poetic to not use.  The interplay of hot and cold, light and darkness, is one of the most potent feelings for Humans.

Bumblebee:  Blake Belladonna x Yang Xiao Long:  The one caveat.  v1-5 Bumblebee good.  B6+ Bumblebee abusive.  All they had to do was talk. But, I’ll focus on the good parts.  Mystery, and motion, and fire and shadow.

Green Lantern’s Knight:  Jaune Arc x Jessica Cruz

There are two things in RWBY post Haven I actually like, Weiss being thirsty for the Rusted Knight, and the fans pairing Jaune Arc with Jessica Cruz.

Black Sun:  Sun Wukong x Blake Belladonna

When this first happened in V4-5, I enjoyed it.  When it was sunk after Haven, I realized the part I liked most about it was Kali.

Anyone with Cinder

Cinder is a villain.  She’s not a woobie, she’s not sympathetic.  She might be being manipulated, but she is doing everything she can to burn the world down.  She needs to be punished, she needs to be humbled, humiliated.  She needs to repent.  If you don’t, you are supporting an unmitigated psychopath because she’s pretty.  My favourite one to do this is Jaune.

Sweet Dreams: Cinder  Fall x Emerald Sustrai

While Cinder is an unmitigated psychopath, and Emerald is her simp, this is the only good thing from any of the main villains.

Any of the other villains:

Salem:  She can be put in a good relationship with Oz if they reconcile.  And, quite frankly, this is likely the only thing that can actually stop her.  Alternatively, if you are feeling perverted, you could have Jaune use his sword to teach her the value of life and death.

Adam:  Of all of the unmitigated villains, he is the worst of the bunch.  He has zero redeemable, charitable, and sympathetic qualities.  They tried and failed to give him any.  Maybe the should have tried to give him sympathetic qualities before turning him into nothing more than an abusive ex and then killing him.  Just saying.

Hazel:  They tried and failed to give him a woobie backstory.  While he’s not as villainous as the rest, he is still willing to destroy the world because his sister died as a Huntress.

Tyrian Callows:  The most psychotic of the lot.

Arthur Watts:  Of the main villains, he’s the only one to have any real good qualities other than Cinder.  Intelligence and charisma.  Still pretty fucked up.

Mercury Black:  Personally, I find him a pretty boring character, but, of the main villains, he has the least investment, and could most easily leave and redeem himself.  The only reason he stayed is because Cinder was slightly nice to him, (at least compared to his father).

Emerald Sustrai:  She loves Cinder, and is pretty, therefore she doesn’t need to redeem herself.  She just needs to be momentarily sad for all to be forgiven.  They could have given her an arc where she realizes that Cinder won’t care for her and she needs to find her own path, but they did not.

Silent Knight:  Jaune Arc x Neopolitan

Don’t consider her to be one of the main villains, because she’s not.  She’s Roman Torchwick’s sidekick.  Roman Torchwick is a low-level criminal who made it big.  He wasn’t in it for the evil, he was in it to become a big man.  It wasn’t until he succeeded that he realized who trapped he was, and died.

This leaves Neopolitan with zero motivation to stay with the villains.  She does because plot.  She is genuinely hurt, she did help to cause Beacon, but she was not trying to.  She was just trying to do well by her man.  This makes her very easy to repent and work to be a better woman.  Who better to help her than Jaune.  She’s also a perverted bastard, so perfect for adding some spice to a fic.

Robotic Knight:  Jaune Arc x PENNY Polendina

I don’t like anything about PENNY’s resurrection and second death.  But there is a missing P from JNpR’s lineup, and she would be a perfect fit.  They are both so socially awkward that they can make an amazing couple.

Nuts and Dolts:  Ruby Rose x PENNY Polendia

I am relatively neutral about this.  Again, I hate what they did V6+ with PENNY, but it could have been handled a different way, and it would make a nice pairing.  They are lovely together, though none of the early interaction seemed especially romantic.  But there is more than enough for shippers to build off of.