#discource cw

[tommyssupercoolblog]

IM SORRY THIS ISNT MEANT TO BE AGGRESSIVE i have not been on this part of the internet in a long time so things might have changed but.... last i heard the proship label encompassed things (in fiction) like inc/st, abusive relationships, p/do shit, etc... is that still correct? idk if thats what you were talking about in your tags because i do not know Anything about minecraft youtubers but usually when people put proship in their dni theyre denouncing that stuff. just wanted to clarify im understanding your complaints, no harm intended!

No problem!! it can be confusing lol, nothing wrong with being unsure. All-in-all, you're kinda close with that idea, but still not on target. explanations of proship vs anti, the d/mp fandom's take on it, and my thoughts on it all under the cut:

So proship as a philosophy is about wether or not things like that (in fiction) translate to real life, which is why it's connected to censorship like i mentioned in the post- if you believe that watching or reading something problematic will make more problematic things happen, that someone reading a book with a child/adult relationship makes them more likely to (or is on it's own already the same as) a person pursuing that in real life, that makes you an anti; and it also gives you a big reason to push for works like that being taken down or removed, and for people who make or read that stuff to be put in real prisons or face other real life consequences for fictional acts- because the idea is that, to an anti, these things bleed into each other.

being proship isn't equivalent to enjoying dark fiction like that, but it IS equivalent to believing that, similar to fictional violence, fictional crimes or acts of any kind can be created and consumed by artists and audiences without people actually condoning it IRL. a proshipper would say that if someone plays a video game where they murder someone, and then does it IRL, thats on the PERSON, not the media- and they hold the same position for fictional portrayals of incest, abusive relationships, and pedophilic relationships. the name comes from being pro- as in for- ships, and other content, as a whole; without it having to meet IRL moral criteria.

dark fiction freaks me out personally; the biggest ick (and actually a trigger for me) being incest; It bothers me and i stay away from it. but I don't think that people who read or make it are going to condone it IRL directly because of that media, and I believe that if they WERE to do something bad like abusing someone, it'd be an unrelated/seperate issue: an independent choice that only they are responsible for, not anything they made or watched or read.

That makes me fall under proship, even though I don't like any problematic (as in incest, abuse, adult/minor) ships. Personally, I literally follow people who like things that bother me in that way: i just block the tags so when they post something i really don't wanna see, tumblr tells me, hey, this post has this thing in it so we've spoilered it. If someone likes shipping their silly little blorbos and those silly little blorbos are kinda fucked up in a way that makes their brain go brrr, that's totally chill with me as long as they aren't hurting anyone- which, because i don't think fiction equates to reality, I believe they aren't when they're playing with their blorbos. (and since i'm pro-rpf, it's worth mentioning i feel the same about that. rpf is still FICTION, at the end of the day. you don't actually expect those people to do the things you write or draw. it's still removed from reality. that's personal preference though, many proshippers would disagree.)

So basically proship or Anti is a label that represents your philosophy on how human thoughts and behavior link to fiction. anti means you believe that consuming something fictional is equivalent to doing it in real life, or at least will make you do it IRL later, while proship means you believe that consuming something fictional is unrelated to doing it IRL, and you can enjoy something fictionally without actually enjoying it or condoning it when it's real people.

you will, of course, see more people who enjoy dark fiction under proship, and that's because they themselves consume it- so of course they're going to say it's not the same as doing it IRL. You will also, of course, see more people who don't like dark fiction at all under anti, because when you're disgusted by something like that then that reaction can be taken as "evidence" that it's morally bad. (personally, disgust-based morality doesn't hold up as a concept for me- it's a big reason why bigots believe the things they do, so using the same logic path makes me uncomfortable, but it is still common for people to use it as a way to measure wether something is okay or not.)

so, the part about silly block game.

there's lots of censoring in this part to avoid harassment, so bear with me.

In the early days of the d/mp, people decided that creating romantic content around the b-nchtr-o (Tmmy, tvbb0, and rnb00, who were all around 16 at the time) was inherently problematic. I'm not sure why, exactly, but the idea became that a fan crushing on one of them (at the exact same age!!!) or shipping them with each other, even as characters, was equivalent to being a real life child predator. again, even if the person doing it was ALSO a minor.

because it was seen as inherently problematic, behaviors like those were lumped in with other things problematic- shipping characters on the smp who had fought or killed each other, shipping characters who were related or were minor/adult, etc. there was no distinction; i was there!! it was all problematic, and all of it was seen as evidence that you were a real life predator of some kind regardless of age or disclaimers put under your content.

the label that developed for this group of "problematic content" enjoyers within the fandom became "poppytwt" or "ppytwt". (twt being there because it was mainly localized around twitter). as i explained above, because it could be because of dark fiction OR be//htr/o content, poppytwt content and ships doesn't even require it being dark fiction necessarily, nor does it require it being b//chtr/o; just one or the other, although usually the assumption is that it's both, since that combines the two reasons for being under that label. some people also call any proshippers in the fandom poppy even if they don't engage in anything problematic in-fandom, but that's generally the antis and not people themselves. if someone self describes as poppy, it's for the two main reasons above.

Additionally, the d/mp fandom has this concept of "maintagging". what this means is that if you make problematic content, you are NOT ALLOWED to tag it under the fandoms or characters it's about, because people don't want to see it in their results. ao3 has a tag filtering feature for this exact purpose, but people generally disregaurd that; you're still not supposed to tag it on the "main" tags, and doing so is seen almost like "asking for" harassment, like how some people talk about wearing crop tops alone at night.

Tntd/o managed to cross over, actually, from poppy to main/normalized in the fandom as the creators leaned into it with their characters. but for awhile even that was considered poppy.

different members of ppytwt have different opinions on RPF, but RPF was also considered poppy on it's own sometimes depending on who you were talking to and how militant they were on what got a pass and what didn't.

as be/chtr/o aged....it didn't stop?? all of them hit 18, but still, to this day, you can be cancelled for shipping them with each other or ANYONE else. it's why i'm so damn scared of the d/mp fandom, if i tagged a fic about my source with his character tag, with ANYTHING other than platonic relationships for him/me, I run the risk of being sent threats or doxxed- don't get me wrong, many antis keep to themselves, but there are also those who try to play vigilante- remember, if something fictional is equivalent to IRL, then attacking someone for enjoying a "bad" fictional thing becomes a charitable, heroic act; so sometimes antis might pursue proshippers with the goal of keeping people "safe". Many people in related fandoms or under the same creators also adopted the same ideals handed down from the d/mp fandom, so i'm wary of people who just watch my source too, or of people who like the q/mp.

people joke about the old fandom going crazy if they say tvbb0 and tmmy today, and that's because they would. they'd be furious at tmmy for doing this bit and putting himself in danger, they'd be cancelling anyone who ran with the bit in chat or had a photo of them hugging or kissing like in the music video as a profile picture, it'd be a whole mess. even today though it's still...scary.

((paused there to take a strawberry milk break, im back now))

the somewhat exception to this rule is Rnb00- people literally thirst for them and make nsfw comments openly, so while im not sure about the shipping aspect, i do know simping is widely okay- you couldn't even say you wanted to kiss them before, but now people are saying wayyy more than that...

inversely, i feel like my source has it the worst, because people won't even talk about him- or anything related to him- as an adult. it's always child this and child that, "who let him drink" and "get the alcohol away from the baby!", and of couse "don't ship him or his character with anyone that makes you a pedophile!!!" while the grown ass man they're talking about outright says he's alright with sfw fanfiction in a video where he reacts to someone's x-reader and then makes flirty nsfw jokes with every other adult man in the vicinity. every fanfic is platonic and almost all of them both irl and in game write him as sixteen. they take place in the past or, more commonly, they just straight up age him down. hell, sometimes they even age him down to like eight. even in fics where he IS an adult, he gets called a child or a teenager but never an adult.

poppytwt, like the stigma against writing for the creators or their characters, lives on. and even outside of benchtrio, again, ships between other characters that are problematic are poppytwt, so that also is still clinging on for dear life in some corners of the web. most poppytwt posts that are tagged as such usually include b//chtr/o, but not all of them; and it's worth noting many creators avoid tagging at all even if it's just the poppytwt tag, because they don't want to get swarmed.

because I ship myself with my husband of course, and also make fictional content with our sources as an extension of that (think dungeons and dragons but the character is just you...or, actually, SMPs are a great example of this since the appearance/name is generally the same, so think like an SMP!!!!!) I am poppytwt. I will always be poppytwt to most people who don't like poppytwt. and I have friends who are poppytwt and I like art made by people under poppytwt. I don't need to ship incest to be a part of that, i just need to not think the people who do aren't doing anything harmful when they ship that, and to write/draw....well, anything about septicinnit, which i do all the time.

if someone has poppytwt dni in their bio, i can't interact. if someone has proship dni in their bio, i can't interact. it doesn't matter if what they really mean is "people who like abusive ships because that triggers me", I still can't interact.

Because i think we SHOULD be tagging our content exactly so that we can filter it and find what we personally enjoy (and avoid what we dont), the concept of a DNI is technically something i'm kinda for- it is a way of monitoring and controlling your experience- but it also can be used as an excuse to harass people who forgot to read it, and i have no way of knowing if that's the case in advance.

ADITTIONALLY, because I know and care about people who consume dark fiction, I also don't want to be around people who think that makes them a bad person, regaurdless of wether or not they think i can stay. and "proship dni" is about proship, that fiction isn't reality philosophy- they are saying right out of the gate that they think it DOES make them a bad person. and I don't agree with that. it frustrates me and it makes me upset. those DNIs are based in a place of disgust and hatred for the people I care about, because of content that isn't real, and i'm never going to feel super okay with that...

there's people who don't understand what it means and use it anyway when it's really just about the content; but again, how am i supposed to know which is which?? ESPECIALLY on twitter, the anti philosophy is extremely popular and relevant and yes, trendy. people believe it, HARD, and so i can't assume they don't when they say they do. I've met real flesh and blood people in person who think that way, so if you are using these words, i'm assuming you know what they mean- that way I don't run the risk of making an actual anti upset and violating their boundaries.

you don't have to agree with me on this- if you're anti, then that's your worldview and i'm not going to change that. but that's what those words mean, the history of the block game side of things, and how they're correlated to censorship.

To Summarize:

Anti : Fiction Equals Reality so Fictional Crimes are Real Crimes (ergo we should censor them to stop the crimes)

Proship: Fiction does NOT Equal Reality so Fictional Crimes are Harmless (on their own)

Anti-Anti: Not sure if Fictional Crimes are Harmless, but Don't Like that Antis think Proshippers are The Exact Same Level as IRL Criminals

Poppytwt/ppytwt: Problematic silly block game stuff, OR things that have to do with these three specific block people being hot/dating someone. Sometimes both.

[soupcans]

im not responding to the person but like lmao. if you are lying to your partner off the bat in the relationship your foundation of trust is going to erode and over time you are going to fall out of love with eachother. based on how sneakh and conniving the person in the aita was i would not put it past them to be a cheater. like good job defending randos who make some Pretty Fucked Up And False Allegations on the internet i guess!

[bhallin]

this is my fuck frazor fartland post

dammon belongs to us now

[prospitsdream]

i think there’s def smth to be said about how when you look at a lot of fanfiction about a character and its whump/heavy angst they also happen to be the Transmasculine Character that everyone knows is Transmasc. the combination of “soft tortured boio” transdude stereotype + people tending to be more comfortable to see ppl different from them in pain makes up a real fucked up trope of the soft trans boi being heavily abused and bullied and never being happy. its like borderline fetishy at some point.

btw this also goes for transwomen characters being involved in the most brutal gore fics for whatever reason

[butchdykekondraki]

You do know MOGAI isn't real.. right? And that neither is "xenogenders"?

point and laugh at the clown gang

[orkidays]

why do people in this fandom go to c!dream positive posts/blogs and act like fucking dickheads, if you don't like c!dream just block and move on

[myfatfuckingface]

Femme/Butch are not “lesbian-only” terms

-If you say “femme/butch are lesbian-only terms” I’m just gonna go ahead and assume you’re a crypto-terf. It is absolutely in line with TERF rhetoric to assert that femme/butch are “lesbian-only terms” and that other wlw who use those terms are appropriating lesbian culture.

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-To assert this is to engage in ahistoric revisionism; you’re imagining a time when there were Pure Lesbian spaces that were not also filled with and shaped by bi, queer, pan wlw, trans women and women-aligned enbies

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-There were no Lesbian-Only spaces or culture where identity receipts were checked at the door to make sure everyone participating was a Gold Star Gay TM. Queer, bi, pan, trans women, effeminate gay men, and women-aligned enbies always existed in these spaces even when we didn’t have those words to describe ourselves or were erased and labeled “lesbians” by others. We have always used the terms femme/butch to describe our experiences with gender and sexuality.

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-The kinds of spaces where they identity check at the door are very TERF-friendly spaces. Requiring identity checks to prove the bonafides necessary to use “lesbian-only” terms or access “lesbian-only” spaces doesn’t actually protect lesbians, it mostly just serves to further marginalize trans lesbians and non-lesbian wlw.

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-I am a bisexual trans non-binary femme in a relationship with an ace trans non-binary femme. I’m afab and my partner is afab, we’re in a monogamous relationship, and we don’t have any romantic attraction to men. If you felt uncomfortable with me using the term “femme” to describe myself in the first sentence, but then calmed down by the second sentence because I’m “basically a lesbian” you’re proving my point that policing femme/butch as lesbian-only terms is in line with TERF rhetoric.

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-The fact that I felt the need to trot out my identity receipts, including my assigned gender at birth, so that I might be allowed to describe myself using a word people like me have always used to describe ourselves directly shows how policing femme/butch as lesbian-only terms is harmful to trans/gnc people and is transphobic.

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-Learn your history with a specific eye to bi and trans erasure, and stop perpetuating intracommunity violence and division.

[coochie-connoisseur]

i better not catch ANY of y'all sayin "q*eer community uwu" when referring to the LGBT community. That's a slur, y'all!

a lot of folks (including myself) are uncomfortable using the slur and having the slur used as an umbrella term for the whole community.

don't do it!

and while I'm here!

Q*eer isn't an identity!!

it's a slur, not your gender or sexuality!! you can't use it as a defining factor for either!

[imapigkid]

can we just... finally leave shlatt behind? like i dont.... aghh idk how to say this properly coz ik people like his content, and he’s a core part of content i enjoy too- just it’s easy enough to say if i don’t like him, i shouldn’t watch him. which i understand, like that’s fair, but why does he keep being added to every server still??!

[quirkycerebralwiring]

Serious discourse though: What’s better the big, poufy cheesies or the small, crunchy ones?

[chickens2cope]

After following u i got recommended a mogai discourse blog bc it's "like chickens2cope" ok how-

I have no idea tbh tumblr's reccommendations have been batshit lately. It keeps reccommendingvweird shit sometimes saying its related to blogs of close friends who I know don't mess with that kind of thing??? In the past week or so Ive been reccommended mormon blogs, jewish blogs, DID blogs, aesthetic blogs, dnd blogs, radfem blogs, political bligs, discource blogs, activist blogs and more. Im getting stressed out by it, Im too stressed out by my own life and bad health and stressors and I'm far too empathetic to actually follow any sort of angry activist discource blog. If I did, my heart would probably combust. I can't even watch the news anymore. Everything is so nuch lately. The point being that if Tumblr reccommends discorsce blogs allegdly based on my blog, that it's..Its just Tumblrs new owners messing shit up. The code has been getting worse and theres ads everywhere and they now have a seperate reccomendation thing for blogs that are just ads???? Like corporate run blogs??? Its ugly. I'm sorry to anyone Tumblr made uncomfortable by claiming I have any association to discource blogs. I hardly reblog activism on main because most tumblr activism is just angerly ranting at someone who won't read it because it's being reblogged in the circles of the people who were hurt by the people they're yelling at. Im talkiny too much opinion here This is uust a chicken blog but jist have tuis advice from a disabled cgicken dad:

Discource blogs are unhealthy and dont help anyone. If you want to and can, vote and join protests or donate to organizations that are doing that more yhan you can yourself but still vote. In the US you can do it by mail I think? If your disabled and going to a voting building isnt something you can handle you could also hand your ballot to a very very trusted able person like a family member you really trust and know well enough to know they wont do something shady. Please dont try to discource in asks or comments aboyf this tho Im mostly bed bound and barely can focus on listening to podcasts I don't have the capacity to be diligent with politics. Just try not to stress yourself out with angry people on the internet because that's not actually helping anyone in any regard.

I hope this eased some minds at least idk take care

[tommyssupercoolblog]

This is a vent post probably no one's going to care about and i haven't slept all night (it's 4 am now) so there's prolly typos. but like.... I like Angel Dust and I Like Poison from Hazbin Hotel, but SO MANY COMMENTS on YouTube refer to the general idea of prostitution (or even "sleeping around" without pay!!! Like just being dtf!!!) as self-harm and it's pissing me off.

There's nothing wrong with having lots of sex, yes even with people you don't know very well or people who are paying you- when you CONSENT.

Angel Dust is being ABUSED by a guy who literally owns him, and on top of that has no way to screen or refuse clients. This isn't "just sex work"- nothing about this is inherent to the premise of him having sex or shooting porn for money- it's abuse WITHIN his line of work, it's RAPE because he can't say no and can't call the shots and can't even refuse to see a client again. Angel Dust has no autonomy in this situation- after he signed he was kept like a pet.

Sex work isn't bad inherently, it's bad when you as a worker have no legal rights or protections to help you stay safe (which sex workers in many parts of the world don't since sex work being criminalized prevents them from doing things like persecuting someone who crossed boundaries, or even just being able to have legal "protections" outside of just getting arrested for their field of work even if it's what they want to do. And of course they get killed and abused by cops too because they're criminals and cops are SHIT), when you're working under a pimp like angel works under Valentino, or when you are forced into it due to poverty or other circumstances and don't want to be there.

As for sleeping around being self harm...first of all, cut off the goddamn slut shaming. Second of all, yes maybe some people lie about wanting sex (NOT in CNC, that's just actual consent with noncon roleplay) as a way of self harming. But nothing about liking to fuck is self harm in itself. Those specific people might need help but not every neighborhood whore needs a redemption arc- maybe they actually love themselves and just like to fuck??!!!!!

At this rate a part of me hopes that after Angel fucking murders Valentino or otherwise gets freed, he still does sex work in some capacity but in a healthy way where he's happy and able to negotiate for what he's willing to do and when- just so people will stop acting like "sex work is always bad and all sex workers want to be freed" is the only takeaway here. If he doesn't I'm not going to be mad or anything of course, and if that's not the vision for his character then that's not the vision. But it'd certainly help make comment threads less....victim blamey and awful.

There's a good philosophy tube video on Sex Work as well, with interviews included- and there's probably sex workers here on Tumblr you can talk to. But just please stop acting like being a prostitute is self harm inherently.

If I see one more post like "I love Angel Dust because people don't talk about how being slutty is just self destructive" or "Poison is such a good rep of why sex work is so disgusting and shouldnt be allowed" I'M GOING TO FUCKING BREAK SOMETHING.

If you want to protect sex workers, listen to them and help them campaign for legalization (because again they need it for safety and to ensure they can protect themselves from clients) and other things they might need. But for the love of GOD don't act like it's some inherent evil that's always abusive because, ironically, that's the shit that makes it so easy for abuse to happen in that field in the first fucking place.

[tommyminimoff]

So, are Hydra nazi's or fascists cause I hear different versions of this?

Apologies for brevity/lack of sourcing, I'm on mobile. Ymmv on different sects of Hydra and the time period in which they're written.WW2 era Hydra had Nazis in it and was (actually? arguably? source please) a Nazi sect. Red Skull was and is a Nazi. Nick Spencer has gone on the record saying that pre-WW2 Hydra had roots in Japanese Imperialism which I am not well-versed in so I won't expand on that, but it is Not Good either and the concept is Not Good on its own for reasons detailed in a post that is maybe 5 down on my blog right now?The comics through the decades have often and liberally referred to Hydra agents as Nazis, usually specific people, often the Red Skull (who is usually if not always leader of Hydra, source please).Agents of SHIELD (the show) has quite recently called Hydra as a whole Nazis (possibly also fascists? source please). If someone can just add a picture of Red Skull in his Nazi uniform that would be cool. Sourcing and additional/expanded into or corrections would be great. I am not the greatest person at elaborating on a good day and I just got off a 6 hour shift with 4 hours of sleep. My apologies for not being more help.

[thetransintransgenic]

blah Opinion on discource I’ve seen around blah. [Suicide Discussion cw]: (I’m probably gonna misstate people’s positions and stuff. Don’t take this as a particularly accurate look at the situation.)

I don’t have nearly enough context to judge the actual What Is Or Isn’t Going On, but generally on how people are reacting to it:

- While I’m sympathetic to the idea that it would be unhealth for some people, for them to see someone’s suicide be used by them to drive change and accomplish goals, I think it’s kinda rather rude and harmful for that to go to “therefore we, as a group, should all definitely avoid any possibility of listening to her, and especially not changing anything”. (I could be mistaken about how much that step was taken (in full/partially//etc.) (Also especially because part of their note and goals was about “we don’t have any way to give a very costly signal that Things Are Extremely <bleep>ed Up without Getting Suicidal and That’s A Huge Problem”.)

- by a similar token, I think it’s REALLY rude for people who already have their own Opinions as to the cult-y-ness or whatever of that community to use her death and suicide note as a piece to support their arguments, when she in fact was fully supportive of the community and its goals, and her entire suicide note was about improving that community.

(Obligatory reminder though that I’m tangential to BOTH of those discussion so my opinion doesn’t count very much at all and at most should maybe inspire you when you’re taking your own position, if you have a reason to.)

[ghostufos]

Thinking about how my brother has grown ower the years to realize using Jew as an insult is wrong. And adamantly thinking using the n-word is wrong. But shit like fag and the r-word is fine. And when I’m like, don’t say that, he says he gets to say what he wants. Like it’s up to him where we draw the line on what’s too pc???

[butchdykekondraki]

If you don't want proshippers to interact with you, maybe don't put it in their tags.

what. ?????? the fucking trigger warnings?????? proshippers are a triggering topic for some, we're gonna add trigger warnings dickhead.