#introducing himself as janus.

[blackoutbugza]

quick! show me your design for one of the sides as kids!

i’ll go first :)

[specialagentartemis]

Something always fascinating to me is the "character who thinks they're in a different genre" phenomenon. The theme of the story you are telling determines what the right and wrong actions to take are; but the characters, reacting in-universe to the situation, don't know what story they're in, and the exact same responses can be what saves you or damns you depending on what kind of story the author is telling and what the story's message is about what life is like.

In Wolf 359, Warren Kepler approaches the mysterious and powerful aliens with threats; he kills their liaison and tries to position himself as a powerful opponent. However, he's shown to be wrong and making things worse: his preemptive aggression is unwarranted and unhelpful and bites him in the ass. The aliens want to communicate and understand humanity and share our music. It's Doug Eiffel, the pacifistic (and kind of scaredy-cat) communications officer who loves to talk and share pop culture, who talks to them and understands that the aliens are scary not because they want to kill us but because they don't understand the concepts of individuals and death. Talking to them, communicating with them, understanding where they're coming from and and bringing them to understand a human point of view, is what succeeds. Openness rather than suspicion, trust rather than aggression. Kepler thinks he's a dramatic space marine protecting the Earth from the alien threat by showing them humans are tough and can take them, but that's not the kind of story this is.

Conversely, in Janus Descending, Chel is in awe of the strange and beautiful alien world around her. She wants to touch it, understand it, get up close to it. When she sees a crystal alien dog, she wants to befriend it, despite Peter's warning. But when she gets close to it, extending her arm in greeting, it attacks her and drags her down into the cave to try to eat her. This sets the inevitable tragedy in motion. Suspicion is warranted; trust will get you killed. Because this is a sci-fi horror, with a major running thematic reading about how racism and sexism will destroy your brain and your society, and how the people who think they're too smart to be prejudiced don't see their own prejudice and will end up ruining the lives of the people they still don't fully see as equals, this kind of trust that Chel shows this strange alien is tragic. However it is also a horror story where there are very real hibernating space snakes ready to wake up and eat the fresh meat that has landed on their planet, and by being too trusting Chel has accidentally introduced herself to one.

Kepler, suspicious and ready to shoot any alien he doesn't understand, would likely have survived Janus Descending; Chel, with her enthusiasm for learning about and meeting aliens, would have been a wonderful and helpful member of the Wolf 359 crew.

In a similar manner, in Alien, Ellen Ripley yells to the rest of her crew not to bring the attacked crewmember with the alien on his face back on the ship and into the medical bay, you don't know what contamination that thing might have; she's ignored. She tells them not to let the crewmember out of quarantine even though he seems fine; she's ignored again. Ripley is the one person protesting this isn't safe, we don't know what's going on, and she is consistently ignored, until an alien bursts out of her crewmate's chest and then eats everyone and Ripley is proven to be right and also the only survivor. (And it turns out that the science officer consistently overriding her protests was an android sent by the company that contracted them, and said android was given orders to bring the alien back so the company could study it and do weapons development with it, try not to let the crew find out about it, and kill them if he had to in order to do so!)

Ripley's paranoia and mistrust of the situation was correct, because Alien is a space horror and the theme is in space no one can hear you scream (also corporations consider you expendable).

Conversely, in All Systems Red, we have a damaged and almost-combat-overridden Murderbot being brought back into the PreservationAux hab medical bay after being attacked by other SecUnits. Gurathin becomes the one person protesting this isn't safe, we don't know what's going on, he doesn't want to let Murderbot out because it's hacked and probably sabotaging them for the company contracted their security and sent it with them. Gurathin thinks he is the Ellen Ripley here! He is trying to warn his teammates not to make a dangerous mistake that will get everyone killed!

However, All Systems Red is a very different story than Alien, and Murderbot is neither a traitor on behalf of the company to sabotage them and steal alien remnants for weapons development, nor a threat to the humans - it's a friend, it's a good person, and it wants to help them against both companies willing to screw them over. Trusting it and helping it is the right thing to do and is what saves their lives. Gurathin is proven to be wrong.

If everyone on the Nostromo crew had listened to Ellen Ripley, they would still be alive (except Kane. RIP Kane), because this is a horror story about being isolated and hunted and going up against this horrifying thing that wants to kill and eat you and just keeps getting stronger. If everyone on the PreservationAux team listened to Gurathin, they would all be dead, because this is a story about friendship and teamwork and trust and overcoming trauma and accepting the personhood of someone very different from you.

Same responses. Different context. And so very different moral conclusions.

Warren Kepler was about how the brash violent over-confident approach to things you don't understand is wrong, and that openness and developing that understanding between people is what's important; Chel was about the tragedy of trust destroying a Black woman who wanted so much to believe in a world that could be kind and beautiful. Ripley was about a woman whose expertise and safety warnings were ignored and brushed aside and everyone who did so died because of it; Gurathin was about how even justified fear shouldn't mean you make someone else a scapegoat and mistrust them because they seem scary.

Sometimes you're in the wrong genre because you need to be, because the author is trying to show how not to react to the situation they set up in order to build the mood and the theme they're trying to convey.

[let-roman-bite-someone]

it's been a while since i made an analysis here but as anyone else in this fandom, i've been speculating on orange. i know that by now, most people are convinced that orange is anger or something related to that.

however, we need to look at the previous patterns in order to figure out who orange might be. “the dark sides” were all facets of c!thomas that he was unwilling to accept or acknowledge. his anxiety, his ability and capacity for deception and probably the most jarring for him, the violent and/or disgusting thoughts that pop into his head without warning.

despite virgil's arc, anxiety was probably the easiest for thomas to accept. virgil didn't even have to introduce himself; thomas already knew he existed and while he was not happy about that, thomas had already accepted by that point that anxiety was a part of him. janus's existence was a harder pill to swallow and remus's was even harder.

so with all this, orange turning out to be anger (or wrath, rage, whatever you want to call it) would be a little underwhelming. while anger is not an emotion that is always encouraged, it's certainly not that hard to accept. especially compared to having repetitive intrusive thoughts about murdering people.

besides, thomas has already acknowledged his own capacity for anger before.

here, he refers to logan and roman having short tempers. they've shown this multiple times in the series too. if logan and roman are prone to anger, then it follows that thomas is also prone to anger and that he is aware of it. and regarding the nonchalant way he addressed it, i doubt he's troubled about his temper at all.

since there were only two short episodes before the introduction of virgil, we don't have enough context as to whether thomas was aware of his anxiety or how accepting he was of it. for janus and remus however, we have several instances of thomas either being in denial or being completely unaware of their existence.

regarding the concept of lying, thomas chose not to lie to people to the best of his ability. regarding intrusive thoughts, while there's no instances of thomas straight-up refusing to feed into them, he was a lot more "clean" before remus came along. he didn't swear as much and when he did, usually censored the swears (probably a conscious decision from thomas & co. but i think it had a canon reason too) and using more technical terms for sexual activities.

anyway, all of this is just a complicated way to get to the point, so i won't bore you any longer. my point is that orange would have to be something bigger, something more terrifying and that thomas would likely be in denial about.

one thing thomas has constantly been shown to fear is losing his friends and loved ones. this has surprisingly been a consistent theme from the early stages of the series.

a lot of the episodes like Making Some Changes, Can Lying Be Good and the SvS duology were centered around thomas's fear of losing his friends. friendship is very important to thomas and different situations in his life often feeds into the fear of being left behind.

now what is a common theme in all the scenes that orange has been hinted at?

the feeling of being ignored or belittled. logan gets mad at roman because roman mocks his attempts at trying to communicate honestly. SvS Redux has thomas feeling irritated and upset that lee and mary lee barely paid attention to him during the wedding. the intrusive thoughts asides video, of course, has both thomas and logan getting angry over being ignored.

so, with all this, i conclude that orange is desperation (n; a state of despair, typically one which results in rash or extreme behaviour). a need for validation, a need for attention and affection. thomas, at this point, is especially disturbed by a lot of things going on in his life. but a recurring theme throughout the show, especially after the introduction of janus and remus, is thomas's fear of driving away his friends. he is overly judgmental of each of his actions, worried that they may lead to him being lonely and left behind.

and again, in WTIT, thomas is also desperate to be noticed by nico. he fears dying alone but at the same time, he struggles to reach out to people. still, he makes the first move by texting nico but the fact that nico doesn't reply makes thomas more and more fearful of ending up alone. he is desperate for love and support, he is desperate for validation; but he needs to focus on himself and fix his own issues, if he wants to maintain a healthy relationship with other people.

like all the other sides, i think that orange is also only trying to help thomas. he's trying to get thomas to come to terms with the fact that nothing is stagnant. most things in life are temporary and the sooner you accept that, the sooner you'll be able to let go of any worries weighing you down. thomas just needs to face that fact and focus on living in the moment, instead of worrying about what could be. he also needs to have a little trust in himself and know that he's trying his best to be a good person.

and logan is the right person to target for this. because first off, logan himself is suffering from the desperate need for validation, he is visibly struggling to get to thomas. secondly, a sign of deteriorating mental health is when logic becomes clouded due to emotions and this affects a person's basic functioning, such as decision making, problem solving and if gone too far, even everyday activities. the one time logan temporarily left the group, we saw how much of a chaos the others were. i believe orange thinks that this is the only way to make thomas understand how dire the situation is.

so yeah, that's just my take on this whole orange deal. i could be completely wrong but it's still fun analyzing these things.

[part-time-zombie]

Has anyone else noticed that virgil has been awfully mean to patton in these recent videos?

After remus was introduced virgil has been noticeably more inclined to badmouth and sass patton, even in front of the others.

At first I thought he was just a little more stressed out because of the now regular presence of the dark sides, but the remarks he's been making at patton sounds much more deliberate, targeted and intentional, not like some harmlessly sarcastic quip.

This change in behavior started getting noticeable in ATHD, when theyre debating on if a distraction is a good way to handle Thomas's dilemma. Virgil makes a comment here implying patton is capable of and responsible for thomas feeling bad, maybe not in this particular scenario but definitely on other occasions.

This is fairly understandable, seeing as patton himself pointed out that he is at the core of Thomas's feelings, the good and the bad, but I think this exchange suggests more than just that. It sounds like virgil is saying that pattons Actions are at fault, not his role.

We get even more insight in the WTIT end card, where patton tells the others to be supportive of thomas and virgil responds like this:

Now that is a much more direct comment, blaming patton for telling thomas what he can and can't do.

I remembered this scene in DWIT, when logan revealed the cause of remus's intimidating effect. He admitted vrigil was part of the problem, but also addressed pattons involvement in the situation.

Patton is too strict on thomas, trying to control what and how he thinks, acts, and feels. But how does this tie in with virgil?

Virgil wouldn't think to be afraid of remus or even to resent janus unless he felt they were a detriment to thomas. I'm sure he has personal history with the dark sides thar complicates/exacerbates the matter, but being a (former) dark side himself, he shouldn't feel so strongly compelled to defend thomas from them unless he was convinced that they were bad for him.

Patton believed the dark sides were evil, and his insistence on that belief pushed virgil to follow his ideals. Comparing virgils behavior at the start of the series to now, I'd assume he and the others would have been friends, or at least friendly to each other. But when virgil joined the light side, he also joined their mentality.

Virgil believed patton when he said the dark sides, his former friends, were bad, and acted to defend Thomas from them. Now that it's revealed that patton is not only setting an unreasonably high standard for thomas, but that he also is second-guessing himself and his views on "good" and "bad", virgil is resentful of him. He's angry that he let himself believe that the dark sides, and himself by association, is bad, especially when the person who convinced him of this is proven to be wrong about it.

This is virgil, angry about vilifying himself and others at the hand of someone who only thought he was a hero.

[dustylogicalityrat]

hello, hello! I have sort of an idea/rant/question.

(about the whole Patton casting the "Dark Sides" out thing.)

so, like, did he?

because obviously, it'd make sense if Thomas' Morality disapproved of Deceit and Dark Creativity, but,,,

in Can Lying Be Good?, it's explained that Janus kept everyone's "mouths shut" about himself and Remus.

and in Dealing With Intrusive Thoughts, Remus sings about how Janus basically sent him off to fuck with everyone.

and Patton was VERY clearly offset by Remus' appearance. (i mean, come on.)

but in Can Lying Be Good?, the very episode that introduced the concept of the "Dark Sides", Patton seems super unaware of what's going on. and when he sees Janus (who's in his spot), he really isn't surprised to see him at all. just sorta oblivious but confused? but i'm guessing Patton understood that it was Deceit, because when Thomas worried about Janus calling him a good person, Patton realized that meant Janus tried telling him that he wasn't.

still, though, Patton didn't really hate that Janus kept appearing. he was just always the one to be challenged. and he definitely aimed that anger from his own actions at himself. (i mean, it led to him turning into a buff video game frog, so..)

and if Patton was the one to have hidden the "Dark Sides", how?

and how come Virgil was able to appear?

i dunno, something about Janus controlling when the Sides can talk about them sorta throws a wrench into this.

[delimeful]

the roots of something greener (1)

G/T July Day 9: Rainy Day

patreon prompt: kid logan trying to make a deal with fae janus for nyn! hope you enjoy :)

warnings: magical deals, threats, unwilling transformation, implied parental neglect, mentions of starvation and abandonment

-

The first time the child found him, Janus was already in a foul mood.

The day had started out with a light drizzle, and as the hours crept by, it had slowly grown into a far more irritating downpour.

This wouldn’t have been anything near a problem for most fae, and certainly a meager handful of years ago, Janus would have hardly spared it a fleeting thought. Even if he didn’t care to waste any magic on a simple repelling spell, he could have simply slipped between realms, abandoning that particular stretch of human land until the storm passed.

Now that he was banished and bound, however, his options were far more limited.

There would be no leaving the human realm, not until his time was served. His sentence wasn’t so harsh as to confine him to a single circle, but being able to jump between this and that ring of mushrooms didn’t help him much when the rainfall was present over the entire forest.

He grit his teeth as a stray drop managed to make it through the leaves above him, the thickest canopy he could find over one of his rings.

Though it was only a single raindrop, it drenched his head and shoulders with ease. His form in mortal realm was limited by the space he was allowed, and the only proper faery rings within these woods were barely large enough for a human to step a single foot into.

He wasn’t sure if only being able to manifest at the same size as a child’s doll was an intentional part of his punishment, or merely a bonus. Either way, it was certainly humiliating enough for him to resent it.

It was in this soaked, resentful mood that he heard the distinct pattern of human footsteps, leaves and other detritus crunching rhythmically underfoot.

“What curious timing,” he muttered irritatedly to himself, turning to face the intruder with a smile that was almost certainly a little too sharp for human tastes.

… And then promptly lowered his expectant gaze a foot or two, because the human approaching him was unquestionably a mere child.

Young, likely barely a decade old, and with the thickest, blockiest pair of spectacles Janus had seen in ages. While the child wasn’t dressed for the weather, he was carefully holding a deep blue umbrella over his head as he picked his way over the muddy forest floor.

The little thing froze for a moment at the sight of him, and for a moment Janus thought perhaps this was some unwise youth that had wandered off from his parents, with no idea what was before him.

Then, he straightened up formally, eyes glinting with excitement, and it became clear that the child knew exactly what Janus was, and likely thought he knew exactly what he was getting into, as well.

(Part of Janus was admittedly relieved. Being locked out of his home realm meant there was no easy defense against humans who stepped into the space of the ring, and he really wasn’t in the mood to dodge the grasping fingers of a toddler who thought him a toy.)

“Salutations,” the child greeted belatedly, quickly reaching up to adjust his rain-splattered glasses with his free hand. The umbrella drooped slightly without the support of both of those undersized arms. “I’m searching for the, um, the fair folk of this wood. I’d like to make a deal.”

How bold, to open with such an attention-grabbing phrase. Janus reclined back slightly, attempting to look regal even with his hair plastered in wet strands across his face. “Well, now. Isn’t it good manners to introduce yourself before making requests of strangers?”

The child’s face pinched slightly, but he’d clearly done at least some research. “You may call me Logic.”

Janus hummed. “Well met, Logic. I go by Deceit.”

“Deceit?” Logic echoed with a frown. “I thought fair folk weren’t able to lie.”

“They’re not,” Janus agreed pleasantly, some of his humor returning to him at the usage of a familiar bit.

For all his flaws, none of the humans he’d tricked over the years could claim they hadn’t been warned from the start.

“Then why,” Logic started, before shaking his head firmly, dismissing the line of questioning in favor of his original goal. Whatever had brought him here, it was clearly important to him.

It always was, when they were willing to make a deal for it.

“I’d like to make a deal,” he repeated, setting his shoulders and stiffening his posture. “I want to learn how to use magic.”

Janus refrained from letting the derisive edge sneak into his smile. “And what could you possibly have to offer in return for that?”

“I can offer you equal knowledge in exchange,” Logic responded, wearing a very serious expression that looked quite amusing on such a young face. “I may be young, but you’ll find that I’m very good at researching.”

The offer was exactly what he should have expected from a human child, especially one that had never dealt with the fae before. It was likely that his little research hobby was the only reason he’d learned enough to make it this far.

“My, you certainly have a lot of confidence in the value of knowledge, don’t you?” Janus mused, distantly glad that it was him that the child had chosen to annoy with this, rather than a more power-hungry sort. “Very well, I accept the terms of your deal.”

He held out a hand, and almost immediately regretted it. He’d forgotten how easily dwarfed he was, like this.

When Logic reached out, however, it was with a slow and careful hand, his face scrunched up intently as he used two fingers to emulate a handshake. There was no pinching pressure or crushing grip, only the distinct warmth of human contact and the slight electric spark of the deal being sealed.

It almost made Janus feel bad for what he was about to do.

“Your first lesson,” he announced, pulling his hand back and flexing his fingers absently, “is to never make such open-ended deals with fae.”

Logic recoiled slightly, looking slightly bewildered, and Janus forced his smile into something crueler as the sting of magic grew sharper.

“An offer of any knowledge I please, so long as it’s of equal value? You haven’t even clarified which kind of magic you’re so desperate to learn.” Janus leaned forward slightly, wrapping his hand around the invisible cord of the deal. “I could request your name, control over the very essence of your being, and all I would be required to do in exchange would be provide you with instruction on magic of suitable power. Your terms are exploitable, little one.”

He let the implied threat linger, watching as the implications sunk in and the child’s worry began to turn to fear. The sight of it was a sour curl in his gut, but this was a lesson better learned here and now, rather than later and with more permanent consequences.

“Of course, I have no particular desire to teach you any magic at all, let alone the complexities of magic strong enough to be equivalent to a name.” Janus slowly released all but the tiniest sliver of the potential the deal held. “Hm. I think a demonstration of simple magic will do, to satisfy both your curiosity and mine.”

Transformation spells were painful and slow when cast a certain way, a fact that many of his kin had taken advantage of when dealing with humans. Janus kept the magic brief and painless, because for all his flaws, enjoying the needless suffering of a child was not one of them.

With a snap of his fingers, the child’s form shifted to something more thematically appropriate.

The umbrella clattered to the ground, catching on the breeze and skittering a few feet away from the kitten that now sat on the ground before him, blinking in disorientation.

“Consider our bargain complete,” Janus informed the kid, finally able to speak to him at eye level. “As the last tidbit of magical knowledge I’ll impart, have this: recognition is the key to returning you to your true form.”

Looking as though he was composed of more fluff than flesh, Logic let out a tiny, confused meow. His eyes were surrounded by distinctive, blocky markings, the spitting image of the chunky square glasses that he wore as a human. It was the easiest possible condition Janus had ever set; it was near-impossible to look at the kitten and not see the resemblance.

With a flick of his hand, the kitten was whisked to the edge of the woods that he’d entered from, where there was surely a guardian nearby to find him and undo the minor curse before the sun had set.

With any luck, the experience would scare the kid off from any further attempts at playing with magic he didn’t understand.

Job done, Janus glanced at the abandoned umbrella, lying far out of reach of his undersized mushroom ring, and then turned away with a sigh.

What a waste.

–

Janus hadn’t been one to keep track of the time, before, but that may have simply been because time was much less linear in the faerie realm. The length between one moment and the next could be stretched or squashed, and so time tended to be more of a feeling than a fact.

In the human realm, things were much simpler. The sun rose and fell and rose again, and that was a day, every time without fail. He could hardly lose track of something like that.

As such, Janus knew that two full days had passed when he next saw Logic.

Logic, not the child, because he was still, inexplicably, in the form of that tiny, barely-weaned kitten.

It had been sheer luck that Janus spotted him; he’d been moving between one ring and the next throughout the day, absently looking for any stray detritus that had fallen close enough to his ring to be tugged fully inside. Any shelter made from such impermanent materials was destined to be temporary, but Janus was tired of the chill, and willing to take any reprieve from the elements he was offered.

Looking at the soggy little beast that was crouched a few meters away, Janus felt an odd sense of guilt crop up within him. Clearly, he wasn’t the only one who had been enduring the weather.

Fur matted and damp from the on and off rain that had plagued the area, body trembling from cold or hunger or a combination of the two, Logic looked like the definition of pitiful.

And why wouldn’t he? For all intents and purposes, the child apparently spent the last couple of days trapped in an unfamiliar body and stuck in a hostile environment, with no aid to be found.

… Why hadn’t someone recognized him? For that matter, why weren’t there humans traipsing about through the trees in search of a missing child?

Logic sneezed miserably, interrupting what seemed to be an attempt to use his new, keener nose to track down a meal. His tiny ears angled back in a distinctly feline form of frustration, a gesture that would have undoubtedly been cuter if he hadn’t been so visibly on the brink of starving.

Well. Janus wouldn’t get his answers if he just left the child there, would he?

“I know you, child,” he said, voice carrying enough to make the kitten’s head snap around toward him. “I didn’t expect you to still be scurrying about like this. Why in the world would you not simply go home?”

Acknowledging his true form did the trick. The spell unraveled like he’d pulled on a loose thread in a knit blanket, the magic falling away with ease and leaving the child in his oversized spectacles sitting there in the dew-dappled grass.

For a moment, he remained like that, folded over on himself like a baby deer laying still and hoping that predators’ eyes would skip over him.

Janus met his gaze and raised a prompting eyebrow, waiting for an explanation on how such a simple curse had gone so wrong that the fae who laid it, of all people, had to be the one to free him from it.

In the next second, Logic had sprung to his feet and bolted. His steps were wobbly and likely fueled by panic alone, but adrenaline was undeniably effective in getting him very far away, very quickly.

“Rude,” Janus muttered to the empty air he’d left behind, and then followed the kid as far as he could manage through his rings, making certain this time that he’d actually left the forest behind.

There still wasn’t a single other human around, let alone one that appeared to be looking for something as valuable as lost offspring. Janus tried not to let the information grate against his scales, with only mild success.

In the end, he still wouldn’t get his answers. It didn’t matter. The child had clearly been scared off for good, so there was no use pursuing the issue further.

He shouldn’t dwell on things he couldn’t change, anyhow.

–

The third time Janus encountered Logic, the child found him first.

It was another overcast day, with a light sprinkling of rain that was certain to become something miserably damp within an hour or two.

He hadn’t expected any more visitors, and certainly not any that would make it to one of his rings and lurk there, so he’d been more puzzled by the relative dryness of the leaves beneath his feet. In fact, he hadn’t realized anyone was near, let alone guessed just who was sitting at the edge of the faerie circle until a tiny, presumptuous throat cleared.

(Such obliviousness was out of character for him. If the kid had been a snake, he could have bit Janus.

Good thing he’d picked a kitten before, instead.

Even if those, too, had fangs of their own.)

Logic waved a hand, showing no signs of his previous panicked flight– except there was a slightly harder set to his shoulders, Janus noticed, like he was preparing for a difficult fight.

He’d brought a bag with him this time. It was partially open, and Janus easily made the connection between the spare pieces spilling from it and the plastic canopy that had been painstakingly assembled over his mushroom ring. Large and durable, it was currently diverting the rain away from Janus’s circle with streamlined ease.

“Hello, Deceit,” the kid greeted. “I’m back for my next lesson.”

Between them, the deal rekindled, sparking dull embers back to life at Logic’s willful insistence. With a willingness to keep providing knowledge, he could theoretically continue to learn for as many lessons as he paid the dues for. It was one of the many loopholes that were applicable to such open-ended deals, but Janus certainly hadn’t anticipated the child using it against him.

How interesting. It seemed there were still things an ages-old fae couldn’t predict, after all.

From beneath the comfortable shelter of an oversized dollhouse gazebo, Janus tipped his head back and laughed.

[studsandmore00]

“Emoc athero dekratis!” Janus said, finishing the third stanza of the spell. His hands glowed as he placed them in his abs. Warmth spread through his body.

Janus felt his phone vibrate in his pocket as the warm feeling subsided. “Yo, dude? Where the fuck are you?” Aaron’s voice said. Janus could hear the club music pounding in the background. “The club is fucking nuts. Get over here.”

Janus tapped Aaron on the shoulder as he got to the club. “Yo dude! You finally made it!” He shouted over the pounding music.

“Yeah! I’m here! What’re you drinking?” Janus shouted back.

“Beer! Go get one and hurry the fuck up. There’s someone I need to introduce you too!”

Janus grabbed his drink from the bar and headed back over to Aaron. Other than the guy in the middle, Aaron was the only guy at the table.

Janus was struck by the presence of the other man at the table. Even in the dark lighting of the club he could see the man’s olive skin and the outline of a body that had spent a lot of time at the gym.

“Hey! This is my friend Janus.” He shouted to the table. “Strange name but cool guy.”

The man in the middle perked up. “As in the two faced Roman god?” He said.

“Yeah, my parents both have Phds in classical mythology.” Janus shrugged. “You’re the first person to get it, by the way.”

The man shrugged. “I get it. My parents named me Apollo. At least yours had an excuse. Mine just liked the name.”

Janus and Apollo talked the rest of the night at the bar while Aaron and the group of women danced like horny chimps.

“Last call guys. Want anything?” The bartender said. Janus looked at his watch and was surprised to see that it was already 3am.

“Nah, I’m good.” Janus said. Apollo nodded as well, indicating he was finished. “Hey where’s Aaron and those girls you were with?” Janus asked as he looked around the club and couldn’t find his friend.

“Oh they left like 2 hours ago.” Apollo said. “I think you were in the bathroom.”

“Ah ok.” Janus said. This wasn’t the first time that Aaron had ditched him at the bar for a girl or two. “I guess it’s time I head home too.” Janus said. He still needed to finish the last part of the spell he’d begun earlier.

“Oh come on. We’re having so much fun.” Apollo said. “You don’t want to go yet. Let’s head back to my place and have another drink.”

Janus felt a wave of influence come over him and before he could turn his new friend down, he found himself in a spacious penthouse apartment.

“Damn dude! How the fuck do you afford this?” Janus gasped.

“Family money.” Apollo said. “What do you want to drink?” Apollo walked over to a bar on the far wall. He started pulling glass bottles off the wall and mixing them together into a drink.”

“You got beer?” Janus asked.

“No.” He said. “Drink this.” Apollo said, turning around with a nondescript brown drink in his hand. “It tastes better than it looks.” He said with a shrug. Janus took a sip of the drink and smiled. It tasted like summer fruits. “So how long have you been practicing magic?” Apollo asked

I nearly spat out my drink. “What?”

“You have the smell of it about you. But here’s the thing about magic…” Apollo said as he stepped closer to Janus. “There’s always a consequence if you don’t complete the spell.” Apollo snapped his fingers and Janus found himself naked on a bed.

Apollo stood across from Janus, equally naked. Janus’ eyes traced the lines of Apollo’s body, admiring the 6 pack of abs. Janus had never considered sleeping with a man before but seeing Apollo in all his glory made his dick hard and his hole wet.

What the fuck is happening to me. Janus thought.

“That would be the consequences of not completing the spell.” Apollo said, stepping closer to Janus. Apollo’s massive dick was rock hard. He lifted Janus’ legs and slid into him.

Janus’ body exploded with pleasure as it took inch after inch of Apollo’s manhood. Janus moaned as the world went white.

“Worship me.” Apollo said as he grabbed Janus’ face and forced the man to look at him. Apollo sat back and flexed.

“You’re amazing.” Janus said as he touched Apollo’s ripped body. “I’ve never met a man like you.” Pleasure continued to flow through his body with each thrust.

“Pray to me.” Apollo said as he picked up speed. “Beg me for pleasure.”

“Apollo, please fuck me harder. I need you inside me.” Janus begged. He’d barely registered the words as he said them. Apollo’s dick seemed to grow longer and thicker inside Janus. Janus gasped as his eyes rolled back in his head.

“Beg me for a child.” Apollo said as he leaned over and looked deep into Janus’ eyes.

“Oh god, breed me. Give me your child.” Janus begged as he grabbed Apollo. “Please, I need your child inside me now.” He said. Apollo exploded inside Janus as he arched his back in pleasure. The warmth of Apollo’s seed filled his body. Janus looked at Apollo as both of them panted.

“Been a long time since I had a child.” Apollo said. “I hope you’re ready.”

Janus laughed. “Well we’ll see…” Janus stopped mid sentence and looked down. His body was already starting to bloat.

“Don’t worry. Demigods are usually born a few months after conception.” Apollo said as he got up from the bed.

Janus rubbed his belly and felt the life growing inside it.

[holdnarrytight]

Sanders Sides current drama/next plotlines for season finale:

- Patton isn't quite ready to move on from c!T's ex and isn't open to Nico yet but he won't speak up cause he doesn't want to ruin it for Roman and Virgil

- Virgil has a secret Janus and Remus know and have been using to get to him. They hint at this in almost every video. This secret is likely to be something Virgil has desperately tried to keep from the other sides out of fear it might change the way they perceive him and turn them against him again. Janus and Remus have both accused him of purposefully keeping information from the other sides, and he never denied it but rather tried to silence them, likely out of guilt

- Virgil and Janus have some kind of history. Virgil despises him but doesn't seem to feel as strongly about Remus who's also a dark side. Ergo, something must have happened between him and Janus specifically.

- If Janus and Remus expose Virgil's secret, there's the possibility one or multiple of the other sides might be really disappointed or upset or take some time to forgive him. It's hard to guess what their reaction might be because we don't know yet the nature of what Virgil might have done. Lot of angst potential here

- Janus and Remus have some kind of secret plot going on that involves breaking Logan, exposing Virgil and introducing the orange side to c!T. I read a really good theory on this by someone here this week. Janus is the mastermind and Remus is following his orders.

- Orange side is revealed with an introduction song

- Logan blames himself for giving the orange side a chance to reveal himself through him

[justyourtypicaltuesday]

So What's Up With Logan? - a speculating post for the season 2 finale

While I, like everyone else, am anticipating the season finale, I thought I might as well summarise my thoughts in a post.

In LNTAO, Logan outright explains he's irritated with being repeatedly ignored.

"There will be times in which I must be heeded and given our... current circumstances... I clearly haven't been."

This really stands out to me. It's no secret that due to being consistently talked over, shut up and disregarded, Logan's struggling to deal with his emotions- and keep up the facade he puts up pretending he doesn't have any. This is only evidenced further when he throws paper at Roman. But this quote almost feels like foreshadowing, suggesting that there will come a time Logan's the only side with the right answer, and because of the sides and c!Thomas' practice, they won't listen to him and will exacerbate the problem doing so.

Another interesting quote from LNTAO is hidden in plain sight- the overlapping verses from Logan and Thomas in Incomplete.

"This just serves as a testament to the fact that you have a temperament, which is fine, you just haven't accepted it, if you'd let them finish they'd get to the-"

"This just serves as a testament to the fact that to me you're negligent, which is fine, it just works to your detriment, you not letting me finish is proving my-"

Both verses here provide context into Logan's character. This confirms that c!Thomas is fully aware that Logan has emotions, specifically a temper, and that, in his eyes, the song was an attempt to get Logan to accept that part of himself. This could be setting up a very powerful scene in the finale, Janus and/or Thomas confronting Logan at a point when Logan pretending he doesn't have emotions is actually damaging Thomas as a whole.

Additionally, Logan feels neglected by Thomas. That's a word which is not used lightly. He points out that being ignored is actively causing detriment to Thomas, which he conveniently doesn't hear as he's talking (singing?) over him at this point in time.

They're both right. Logan is ignored to the point of detriment, but he also thinks highly of himself ("I'm the most important side here!") and often disregards the others' contributions until he's actively proven wrong. This is a repeated character flaw of Logan's. It's also seen Growing Up, Moving On, and even in Asides like Can Plushies Improve Our Health?. While Logan's been the cause of minor conflicts in the series, having him cause a problem on a scale similar to Patton in POF would be intriguing to see from a narrative standpoint. It's clear that in the latest episodes, Logan is struggling and maybe at some point soon, constantly being antagonised by c!Thomas and the other sides is going to have an effect.

This brings me to WTIT. This is the last plot-dependent episode we've had, so it naturally is where a lot of my theories are coming from. While we can see a lot of Logan's progress as a character- specifically in prioritising Thomas' mental health- we also see his lowest point so far. Thomas' mental health has been steadily declining since SvS, introducing Remus, the discussions during POF and this episode all make it obvious. And this is reflected in Logan. Despite taking precautions and relaxing the schedule so Thomas feels comfortable, Logan loses his cool when he yells at Remus. What the orange eyes mean is TBD, but Logan's emotions in that moment say one thing and one thing only: he can't keep it down much longer. Each time we see Logan lately, he's been more and more distressed. In LTNAO, he throws paper at Roman, in SvS he's left out. In DWIT he's exasperated the whole time trying to calm down the others. In POF he's clearly done with exerting any amount of effort getting them to listen to him. And here is the result of all that pent up anger.

"I just want to help Thomas become the best version of himself he can be, and in order to do that, he needs to listen to me. Unlike yours, my methods aren't the flashiest, and it's not very often I get the chance to get through to him. Please understand my insistence on the matter."

The words right before his outburst mean a lot too. Logan's been already established as a perfectionist, but here he outwardly admits his goal is to improve Thomas as much as possible. We've already seen c!Thomas second-guessing himself because of difference in opinion between sides, so here's an opportunity to explore Janus v Logan conflict. Logan questioning Janus' advice to Thomas to take it easy could mean that the rest isn't as effective as it could be and cause a problem they'll need to discuss. Logan's been largely absent from Janus-related episodes, so an argument in which Janus explains Thomas has worth as he is while Logan is focused on perfectionism and improvement is not unbelievable at this point in the story.

On the topic of Janus, I believe he's going to play a huge role in Logan's character development. The main thing holding Logan back is that he's lying to himself. He repeatedly insinuates and sometimes outwardly states that he doesn't have feelings, and both c!Thomas and Janus know this is a lie.

"I don't feel anything."

"Oh, of course you don't."

My theory is that Janus, as practically a living lie detector, is going to confront the sides about the lies they tell themselves, and being more truthful about themselves will help Thomas long-term. While this can be explored for each side, I'll save that for a post for another day and point out how specifically Logan's lie about not having feelings is already questioned multiple times in the series, setting it up to be confronted soon.

In conclusion, my speculations for the season finale are:

Logan's going to have another outburst- in full view of c!Thomas and the other sides this time, and it will have to be addressed.

Janus/Thomas and Logan are going to confront each other, Logan over being repeatedly ignored and sidelined, and the others over Logan consistently lying about not feeling emotions.

Logan is going to be the outright antagonist in at least one episode of the finale, along the lines of Patton in POF.

On the contrary, in one episode Logan will have the right answer, but be ignored because... well, duh.

Janus v Logan conflict is going to be a large plot point- addressing perfectionism and to what extent you should accept yourself as you are and to what extent you need to work on growth.

If you got this far, thanks for reading. It's my first post as a blog and I hope you enjoyed reading my guesses to what we'll see surrounding Logan in the finale. I'm planning on continuing with in-depth analysis of other sides and other theories I have, but so far this is what I've gathered in regards to Logan's direction at this point in the series.

[bailey-orphic08]

Okay, so- I have this Sander Sides AU that I've had for a long while now. And I think it would be neat to share it with you. I might also make several posts about it. So let me introduce you to:

Sanders Switched is an AU in which the sides' "roles" are switched around. To elaborate, their function (Logan as logic, Patton as morality, ect.) remains the same. Thomas' perception of them is what changes. So where Logan is the voice of reason in canon, another side would take his place. Here's all the sides in Sanders Switched:

Janus: Janus takes the role of Patton as the kind authority figure. He's seen as Thomas' self-preservation and always puts his safety and well-being above all else. He's a sort of motherly figure to the other sides, constantly caring about their well-being and acting as if he's older than them. He's much sweeter than OG Janus, but he still has a sassy side, and lives for gossip.

Remus: Remus takes Roman's role as Thomas' source of inspiration. He is seen as Thomas' comedic side and encourages Thomas to have as much fun as possible. Rather than being a Duke, he presents as a jester. He has issues with his impulsivity, and his jokes tend to be morbid and often mean, but he's overall harmless and much more tame than OG Remus.

The Orange Side: Obviously, I can't say exactly what the Orange Side will be, since we haven't been introduced to him yet. But based off what we do know, I place him in Logan's role as the voice of reason. Assuming he represents wrath of some sort--which is impossible not to believe at this point--he would probably be seen as Thomas' motivation, pushing him to get his work done.

Roman: Most people would probably switch Roman and Remus and make Remus, "good creativity," and Roman, "bad creativity." BUT YOU KNOW WHAT? I'M COMPLICATED AND UNIQUE. So Roman takes the place of Virgil as the original, "antagonist." He is seen as Thomas' pride that pushes delusions that keep Thomas from growing as a person. He arrogant and rude, and claims he is a King rather than a Prince. Because of this, none of the sides really like him at all, with the exception of Janus. But near the end of season one, we discover that Roman only really wanted Thomas to achieve his dreams, and that most of his cockiness hid his secret insecurities. And after Thomas and the other sides realize how important he is, Roman is officially accepted as part of the group.

Patton: Patton takes the role of Janus as the antagonist to all of Thomas' beliefs and the possible leader of the dark sides. He is seen as Thomas' overbearing moral code that constantly tries push harsh rules rooted in Catholic Christianity onto Thomas and the other sides. He is extremely passive aggressive and overly judgmental towards the sides he deems, "wrong." Almost everything he says is a critisism of something Thomas or the other sides do. Despite being so harsh however, he loves puns and making jokes just as much the OG Patton, and loves to torture Logan with his puns.

Logan: Logan takes Remus' place as the bad influence Thomas tries to ignore. He is seen as Thomas' inner critique who judges Thomas for everything he does. He insists that Thomas' lifestyle is, "childish," and that he should abandon it for a, "mature," way of living so that he can live, "a normal, healthy life." He is extremely judgmental and criticizes all the sides for the smallest of details, making everyone hate him, even Janus. Despite this, he generally harmless, and he can easily be ignored.

Virgil: Virgil takes the Orange Side's place as the mysterious secret side that the fandom makes a million theories about. I can't fully explain who he would be, since, again, we haven't been introduced to the Orange Side yet. But for now, he still represents Thomas' anxiety. And when he reveals himself, he will call Thomas and all the sides out on their BS.

That's all for now. It isn't fully developed, and things will surely change when the Orange Side finally does reveal himself. But there's still a lot of things I would like to share. So please let me know if you want know more!

[intrulogical]

Janus is my fave but Remus is a close second. I find it so interesting how he's the character who's the hardest to get a read on by faaaar. It's actually the reason why I've been looping forbidden fruit so much (alongside it being a bop), because I wanted to try and understand his mindset better.

Something that really jumped out at me is that the very first lines, even before he introduces himself as the duke, are about Adam and Eve eating the forbidden fruit and gain knowledge/self awareness at the price of sinning and eventually dying. He then really goes on about Thomas learning to know himself and how everyone already sins and dies anyways (so it's not like taking a bite from the forbidden fruit will change anything except the gaining of self awareness).

I think that regardless of whatever specific goals Remus has, he's overall guided by the value of wanting to give people knowledge and self awareness, desiring to dig up everything buried and repressed and bring it to light.

We can see in wtit how that seems to be his main purpose as well. All of the intrusive thoughts he gives Thomas betray an underlying anxiety about loneliness and being abandoned by Nico (or maybe the anxiety about being alone is what caused him to latch onto Nico - it's Virgil that ended up pushing Thomas towards Nico after all - but now he's terrified that Nico will ditch him). Remus is trying to bring those issues to the surface to have Thomas begin to work through them in a way, except Logan (with all of his good intentions and care for Thomas) keeps providing distractions and those distractions - as much as they help alleviate the symptoms - allow Thomas to keep repressing the thoughts.

Honestly, the more I think about it the more I love the double meaning of the title of the episode. Thomas isn't really working through his intrusive thoughts and trying to process them. He's working while he has intrusive thoughts, as if he's working through loud and annoying music he has to simply grit his teeth and endure.

...that was a ramble and a half, sorry. I've been really desperate for someone to talk about the series with XD

OH MY GOD, THIS IS PERFECT

i've always loved remus and his role of self-awareness. i always perceived his role as intrusive thoughts to be somewhat of an alarm clock— his general Presence means there's something that thomas is ignoring. i LOVE the idea that remus is connected to self-recognition because we have to remember he is forbidden THOUGHTS. not emotions, THOUGHTS. i kind of see him as a parallel to logan in a way, where they both dispense truths about thomas' way of life, but because they're so harsh and rooted in the reality thomas wants to ignore, they both get ignored. i could go in detail but i'll probs save it since this is technically not a remus logan post

if you need more wtit analysis by the way, @orbmanson7 has some for wtit that i really like! u can go enjoy some juice there. never feel bad about sending me asks like this (or even messaging!) bc i LOVE talking about sasi meta. i sometimes pop into orb's dm's at random just to entertain another thought i have 😭

[lolia21]

Well I feel down a Sanders Sides rabbit hole and now I have one fan fic idea that keeps playing in my head:

Remus and Roman are twins but they don't attend the same school because Remus was... himself and his parents were kindly asked to transfer him to a school that "fits his personality better". So he goes to a school a whole district over. He gets along with Roman and he loves him but they are very different people so they don't hang out a lot. Remus also can't stand the blatant favoritism they're parent give Roman. He thinks it's sweet that Roman tries to tap it down but it doesn't change anything.

Sp Remus spends most of his free time at his friend Janus house with his other friend Virgil. Janus also shouldn't be attending their school cause he's loaded but he hated the prep school he was sent to and transferred behind his parents back. Money can get you literally anything. Expect real friends which is why Janus loves Remus and Virg so much. Virgil is actually living at a near by boys home. As a kid his home situation wasn't great and he doesn't talk about it a lot. He ended up at Sanders House four years ago though and it's not too bad.

So anyway Roman has never meet Remus' friends and Remus has never met Roman's friend Patton and Logan. Whenever they come over is always at Janus' house. He knows they exist just like Roman knows Virgil and Janus do but they've not met in person over the last two years.

So it all starts pm a long weekend because Halloween is Friday. ( fun fact my school in gerogia gave us Halloween and Valentines off and used it as teacher workshop days.)

So of course the dark side trio is hype, roaming the mall, scaring people, judging costumes, and trying to find accessories to improve their own.

The light side trio is also their because Patton waited too late to get a "decent" (Roman's words) costume, and Logan was hoping to avoid getting one at all.

The crowds get so bad that everyone is separated. Luckily both sides actually have designated met spots, tho for very different reasons. The darks sides met spot is the horror section at Barnes and Nobles. It's large enough that Virgil won't feel claustrophobic and he can read some Poe while he waits and not have people constantly asking if he needs assistance. It was a place chosen, so he doesn't have a panic attack while he waits for his friends since he's the only one without a phone.

On the other had the light side trio chose the lgbtq+ teen romance section as their meet spot. Mainly Because it'll distract Roman enough that he won't get bored of waiting and wonder out to find his friends before they get there. Defeating the purpose of the spot all together.

You can see where this is going.

Patton has been trying to get on the elevator for the last five minuets but everyone time he tries to get on the same time as someone else he let's them all go first and theres no room for him. This goes on until a nice but kinda rude stranger just days "oh my gawd" and pulls him in as he in goes in. The stranger honestly looks way to well dressed to be here and doesn't even introduce himself. He just starts playing on his phone and Patton doesn't know whether saying thank you would be annoying or not. Janus on the other hand is texting Remus about how just met someone who reminds him a little of freshman Virgil and how he hopes he's not freaking out.

Logan has decided to take the stairwell because he knows that people arr less likely to use it over the escalators or elevators. He looks a floor above him and someone who kinda sorta looks like Roman sliding down the railing on his ass and laughing the whole time. He barely has time to dodge as someone yells " dodge nerd" and flies past him. Honestly Logans so surprised by whatever the hell that was that it take him two whole ass minutes to start walking again. Remus is just having a blast. He didn't think this would work and he saw a pretty cute nerd on the way down.

Roman is having a complicated time. He lgbtq teen romance section is usually in the front if the store but it's been switched with the horror section for the month. So here is is not being able to decide whether he should just stay here because the ia the physical spot he normals what's at or go the the actual section with all the books about the boys kissing that he likes to read. Virgil on the other hand is on the virge (ha) of kinda freaking out. He's happy that the sectionnis getting more love, even if it's only for money. But he liked that it was in the back and away from the crowds of people coming in and out. Not to mention theirs someone dude dresses like a prince yelling on the phone to someone named Patton about whether he should "go to the section of love and acceptance or stay in emo hell". Virgil is insulted enough by this to tell him Roman to please stop yelling and go to whatever section isn't here. Roman rolls his eyes calls him knock off Gerard way and ignores him. Virgil completely forgets how nervous he was becuase now his piss3d and they get into an arguments.

It ends when Patton walks in and calls for Roman at the same time that Janus calls in and calls for Virgil. They look to their friend seemingly coming in together and are about to complain to their respective friends when Janus, Virgil and Roman here a familiar voice go

"Brobro what are you doing here. Hey Jan, hey virge," and Remus walks in completely unaware of the fighting that was just happening. Virgil tries to actually get a good like at this guy's face and realizes that without the make up and general zanny disposition he does look a lot like Remus. Before anyone can respond tk that, an another person asks

"OH God Roman what did you do? Who are they?" And of course it's Logan.

So now are dark sides are standing on one side and all the lights on the other. As the two siblings and their two different friend groups collide. Teen hurt, comfort and angst ensues.

[thousand-winters]

You know, the way in which Kit feels like he can't talk to anyone, that he doesn't fully belong as part of the family despite Jem and Tessa's reassurances... it really makes me wonder if that'll make him conflicted once he meets Ash.

I used to think it would make no difference because he finally has a family who loves him, but he feels scared and out of place. And Ash, similarly, knows Janus only cares for him because of the loyalty spell and that the Seelie Queen doesn't really care about him.

Ash is an antagonist, yes, but even when he was first introduced it was obvious he was just a kid who wanted to be loved, loved for being himself, not for any damned spell.

They're both lonely. They both crave affection. They're both children between worlds. Even if they both long for connection with a Blackthorn, there's no one who will be able to understand their struggles quite as much as each other.

I wonder if this will unite them. They're already more than Jace and Sebastian's "good and bad duality". They're not black and white.

I look forward to their future interactions.

[the-fandom-nerds]

My orange side dreams (I've had 4)

A description of my multiple orange side dreams and some of my commentary on them.

The first one

I had this dream back in 2022. Logan was sitting in a closet looking into a mirror. But his reflection wasnt himself, it was Thomas with a scraggly beard, dirty grey hoodie, messy hair, etc. Logan was talking to him about backing off, the reflection was mocking him, and all of a sudden the reflection reaches out and pulls Logan into the mirror. He starts laughing evilly and takes on Logan's appearance, walking out of the mirror and out of the closet. The dream changes to me scrolling through the comment sections of youtube trying to look for theories about this video, when i find in the description for the video theres a single name: Julius.

What I find super funny about this dream was that, the original appearance is super similar to an old dark side OC I had before Remus was introduced. He represented procrastination.

The name Julius is also funny because I'm fairly certain my subconscious took it from the drink "orange Julius"

Also lmao me predicting Thomas having facial hair is wild, God damn 2022 Dazey.

The second one

Previously posted elsewhere on my tumblr, I'm basically copying and pasting the post here.

I had a dream that Thomas posted a sander sides video featuring Janus, Remus, and the orange side. The orange side had no defined appearance, he was constantly switching between looking like Patton, Virgil, and Logan.

Janus and Remus didn't like him. The orange side did things in the video that actually made REMUS feel disgusted. I wont describe how (info in the replies of the original post), but he was able to completely shut down other sides. He picked them off one by one and made them faint, disappear, etc...

You could tell by the end of the episode Janus was majorly unhappy but before he could do anything, the orange side rendered him unconscious and Thomas was left alone with him. The episode ended with the orange side laughing as the screen faded to black. The endcard featured Thomas announcing the next episode would come out in 2 years :) (ouch, the accuracy still hurts a bit)

The third one (short and sweet)

Orange side had this ability to influence other sides, like a temporary possession. He wore glasses, which let me tell you, I don't see many orange sides interpretations with glasses so this was just wild.

Despite the fact I know he wore glasses, he also didn't have a set appearance, like he was invisible. Similar to dream 2, he was constantly changing how he looked through this possession concept I brought up.

He was influencing Logan to lash out a lot. Weird huh *gestures vaguely to my complicated feelings to the wrath theory*

Different dream again, the final one

The orange side adopted the appearance and actions of my personal theory for what the orange side should be. Those who have read my orange side theories will already know what im about to say: He represented ignorance, his dark side animal was a bird (some sort of falcon or hawk), his name was Icarus. The entire dream (read: episode) was more or less about how the others fucking suck when it comes to addressing their issues. It felt like they were going in circles. Why did they have to constantly fight?

I've seen the arguments against my particular ignorance theory, saying it's basically just lying to yourself and we can't have two Deceits. But ignorance is more than just 'turning a blind eye.' It's purposefully ignoring new nformation to stay in a comfortable and familiar idea space. Most of the dream works from the angle of Logan not being listened to. The other sides ignorance is what makes Logan angry.

This means nothing but I feel like sharing. In this dream I got to meet Thomas and I asked him "so, Is the orange sides name icarus?" And he looked personally so offended that I guessed it.

[emoprincey]

Is Logan the orange side?

After Logan portrayed Anger in the recent inside-out themed video, this seems relevant again, especially with Logan's pointed remark about how he was cast as anger because they "both wear neckties and for no other reason". Anger is a pretty common theory for the orange side's role, and one that I happen to like, but does this mean Logan actually is the orange side? Let's find out...

There is a pretty strong case for Logan being the orange side. In Working Through Intrusive Thoughts, when Logan yelled at Remus, his eyes literally glowed orange.

However, I have some reasons why this might not be the case.

The first reason is that it would simply be bad writing. The orange side has been hyped up for years at this point. Working Through Intrusive Thoughts came out in the summer of 2021, but the orange side's presence was hinted at in the thumbnail of Selfishness vs Selflessness redux, which came out in 2020. All the sides were shown as selectable options on a screen, along with a seventh greyed out figure.

[Image description: A screenshot of the thumbnail for Selfishness vs Selflessness redux, which shows Patton and Roman on a screen with pixilated avatars of themselves. In the middle are the words "You vs. Yourself". Underneath this are six boxes, each with a picture of one of the Sanders Sides, and a seventh box with a grey silhouette. / End image description.]

I wasn't in the fandom back then, but from what I've heard theories about the orange side actually originated with the colour orange being used in merch along with the colours representing the other sides. All this has led people to believe a new character will be introduced. And if that new character turns out to be one of the already established main characters, that would be pretty underwhelming.

Secondly, it was confirmed in Selfishness vs Selflessness that there are more than two dark sides, not counting Virgil. After Janus leaves, Virgil tells Thomas to "not allow him or any of his friends stick around that long." That's friends, plural. Clearly, he's not talking about himself, since he does want to be around Thomas. He's talking about Janus and two or more other people. Remus is one of these, and from what we can tell, the orange side must be another. Virgil seems to trust Logan, so unless Logan has some kind of secret identity as the orange side that Virgil is unaware of, he wasn't talking about him.

I think Logan was cast as Anger in this video because he is known to have angry outbursts, as seen in Learning New Things About Ourselves and WTIT. I think the orange side is using him as a vessel to channel anger through, rather than Logan actually being the orange side.

Whether the orange side represents anger or not, I think this remark was more about Logan's own emotions and how he tries to hide them, than anything to do with another side.

[casey-complains]

im honestly not even sure what im doing in this fandom anymore like???

What the fuck was the newest asides episode?!?!

Why is Thomas putting so much emphasis on his voice? He’s totally playing it up and I don’t understand why. Virgil didnt sound like himself like without the eyeshadow I wouldn’t have known that that was Virgil. The rest of them were off too Janus was the only one who sounded kind of normal.

I know people talk about this all the time but what is going on with Thomas’s makeup? Remus looked so strange and Janus’s eye was bright pink.

It’s been so long since we’ve had real content for sanders sides and it’s just really sad to me that this is the kind of content we’ve come to expect from him. The video was an AD for Thomas’s merch followed by a couple of minutes of characters I no longer recognize wrapped up with another AD

janus' makeup is SO bad now im not even sorry.. its so ugly and does not look like how it was when he was introduced. theres so many good photos and videos of how he used to look, i dont think it'd be too hard to reference it :/

sasi is just a cashgrab at this point