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rigelmejo · 2 years

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I see posts all the time on languagelearning Reddit saying "I'm building a language learning app, what features would you like to see."

And while my niche interest means I'm always interested in specifically click-dictionary tools like LingQ, Idiom, Pleco, Redlang, Languagecrush... the reality is those apps already exist, and already are good enough for what they're used for. I even can set up a Reader app not intended for language learning, Moonreader Pro, to give me click definitions and read text aloud using text to speech. So more reader apps wouldn't really fill any missing need. Sure, a better designed reader app might have better dictionaries and some graded reading content with real person recorded audio, but it would just be offering some changes within an app niche which is already filled.

Then, I see a lot of app makers always go for making a beginner app. This niche is oversaturated to hell, and if you make an app here then it's unlikely to be successful if the language you make it for already has a course on Duolingo, Lingodeer, or Babbel. So while this may be a worthwhile endeavor if you want to make an app for a language with no other easy to find resources, it's not going to be anything special if you do it for languages already on the above 3 apps.

App makers consider making flashcard SRS type apps. There is potential appeal to this if they can make something offering unique better resources. But for many languages, Anki or Memrise or Clozemaster is going to have courses already which cover 2,000 words to 20,000 words in sentence format, with audio. User made courses on anki and memrise cover a plethora of niche needs, clozemaster has made updates to show some grammar info and a radio mode where you can listen to sentences (which are features I like a lot). There's also already specialty apps for learning Kanji for Japanese and hanzi for chinese, if a user doesn't like anki or memrise for studying characters, and those specialty apps work fairly well. Skritter for hanzi, WaniKani for japanese.

Areas where there is room for more apps and a need for more apps:

Grammar guides. It's considered a "boring" part of language learning, and maybe that's why so few apps teach it. You can occasionally find a memrise or anki user made course addressing grammar, but aside from bunpro for Japanese I have not seen many apps purposely aim to teach most of the necessary grammar points for X level of ability in a given language. Lingodeer aims to teach some grammar, but like duolingo it teaches a pathetically small amount. So more apps which have goals of actually covering all grammar points in Beginner language use A1 A2 (HSK 1-4, etc), and ideally Intermediate language use B1 B2, would serve a need that other apps aren't covering much.

Parallel texts, graded readers, with audio, for Intermediate Learners (B1 level at least). Do you see a pattern? That most apps are catered to beginners only, unless it's a flashcard app? Yeah. Now again, in this area many tools can be used to serve this need. I can make most eReader apps do this if I put in a lot of my own work finding my own graded reader, my own audio or use text to speech, and finding a click dictionary. LingQ serves this need and I have heard has pre-made content that goes up from beginner to Intermediate, but also that content is not equally good quality for all languages. Just like how duolingo has good stories for some languages and not others. Apps fitting this niche like du Chinese work great for their specialized languages but not for others, so there is some need for more apps overall which cover this kind of content up into Intermediate language learning levels.

And finally, the most useful app a person could make? Well in my opinion, it would be an app somewhat like Duolingo or Lingodeer. But it would make sure to actually cover grammar points and words in A1, A2, B1 (and in a dream world also B2 content) and the other languages equivalents. Almost no apps have actual lessons made for B1 levels or above, and B1 is when learners start to be able to learn by simply reading, listening, speaking, writing IN the language. Most apps cover A1 content, maybe up to A2 if lucky, then dedicated learners have to come up with some way to bridge the gap from that beginner zone into Intermediate so they can start trying to read, watch shows, listen to audios, and having conversations about topics beyond tourist stuff/basic info. I would also personally love if such an app had a way to skip levels/test out of levels, so beginners could start the app and keep going while other learners could start wherever their last things learned had left them. I'd also personally love if the app had dense lessons, as in covered a lot of words/grammar points per lesson. I know this could be a negative to some people so it would be fine to not do that, but I know for me anki/memrise/clozemaster type apps cover so much content in a short amount of time compared to apps like Duolingo which cover so little information per minute. That demotivates me, that so little information is learned per time. And since currently such apps like duolingo only tend to go up to A2 beginner information maximum, it feels like it takes a year or more to cover beginner level material that could be covered so much faster. Meanwhile after that year or more, the app is finished and leaves you with no Intermediate level information so you are still going to need to self study some more to get to a point of comfortably being able to read or watch things. Duolingo and Lingodeer also tend to teach 2000 or less words in an entire course (some of duolingos best courses like Spanish may contain 3000 words). 2000 common words is the minimum to try breaking into B1 type activities, and duolingo lingodeer etc don't particularly teach the most common words... just 1000-3000 words generally. For a learner trying to speed through A1 and A2 material so they can get to Intermediate study, it's more efficient to get a Teach Yourself book with audio (usually has 2000 useful words and teaches some grammar) or a textbook for A1 and A2 that includes enough vocab, and work through the books. The books will take maybe 3-6 months each (or less if you do them faster), and by the end you'd have covered more information than duolingo in a typical years use, be prepared for an A2 type test, and be as close to B1 as you can be so when you start studying at the Intermediate level you have less gaps in knowledge (less lacking of some grammar points, less lack of vocabulary).

There's so few apps that actually cover B1 level (or even some of A2 level). So many apps label some content "intermediate" that is A2 kind of content, not B1 kind of content (this happens especially with languages like Chinese and Japanese, I've seen apps labeled intermediate graded reader apps for chinese with stories that only contain 300 characters... when 1000 characters would be more realistic intermediate level). So many apps already make themselves in similar structure to duolingo, lingodeer, babbel. If any of those similar-apps actually covered the information those apps lacks? That new app would fill an unmet need and become the Go To app for the languages it covered. If the app made sure it covered all grammar AT beginner A1 A2 levels, covered grammar at B1, covered all words in the usual A1 A2 B1 type language tests (which to a degree overlaps with most common words but not entirely), then their app would be the best. It would be all people would need as a main study material to pass real fluency tests, to get to B level intermediate where some countries require for going to school or working in said country. It would cover enough material for people to transition to a formal class or book later if needed, to transition to immersion in the language and using the language directly at the end of app usage. Which is what learners need to get to, if they're going to learn a language enough to use it beyond a trip or surface level introduction.

But maybe that's why no such app exists. If an app did get you past A2, you'd know enough to start self studying while using the language somewhat comfortably, know enough to transition to Intermediate classes if you need any particular certification. But if you learn the language enough to use it, then you will go USE it instead of spending more time grinding on an app. Is that why apps only cover beginner material? So you can never learn enough to start learning on your own with some comfortability? But at the same time... plenty of people use anki and memrise well into 20,000 words/sentences, so there's Intermediate and advanced learners who would keep doing lessons on apps and reviews.

If the goal of your app is really to get people to LEARN the language, then eventually you need to offer Intermediate material and help learners get to that point. Duolingo was supposed to be made to fill a niche of schools failing to teach enough for people to use a language they study. Well it doesn't. It teaches some A1, sometimes some A2, but its never enough on its own to make someone able to use a language to enough of a degree to read/write/speak/listen to general things. It may help motivate people to start learning so later they find their own more in depth study materials and make their own progress into Intermediate. But at present it does not teach enough information to take people into the Intermediate range. (*with their most in depth courses with extra words like Spanish, French, that also have cognates for some other language speakers, it may help people get to A2 enough they're willing to attempt to try reading/listening/chatting with people enough to learn from those activities until they're B1, but duolingos content itself doesn't take people to Intermediate level).

#apps #rant #language apps #language learning #article #review #i read an article on duolingo today and it pushed me over the edge.#duolingo is not enough to learn a language enough to use it. its a failure on that front #i find it so annoying theres such a lack of material at a2-b1 level. which is the poiny #when people can start learning from USING the language #so if learners just were taught A2 fully and some B1? theyd learn enough info #to much easier transition into learning by using the language

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