#plumbing the depths

[spewagepipe]

Plumbing the Depths: Ben Milton rates his subscribers' hot takes

My experience is that Ben Milton is among the "oftener right". I don't have much to add about his ideas in this video, but I have a lot to say about the hot takes themselves.

My responses are long enough that it seems better to me to publish them one at a time, so here is just the first hot take:

The 5e community has a toxic problem where it offloads all of the system's problems on DMs. The game isn't too easy, it's just the DM's fault for not being creative enough with combat encounters! Darkvision isn't OP, you just need to build your encounters around its very narrow limitations! Want your characters to think outside the box and not spam abilities? Design situations specifically tailored to that!

I want to take a brief aside to talk about terms like "toxic", which get thrown around an awful lot in ways that I don't think are accurate or helpful. If the community is mocking and berating these struggling DMs, then yes, that merits the term – but if that's really a common occurrence, then I must admit that I'm ignorant of it. What I do often see is advice that is framed in a dismissive, "If I were in [situation X], I would simply [solution Y]" sort of way. That's obviously unhelpful, but it's not really hazardous to anyone's psychological health.

But whether or not it is "toxic", the phenomenon being described in the take here is both real and commonplace. Among my pals, I coined the phrase "cherchez le maître du jeu" to describe this trend. In old noir fiction, detectives would "cherchez la femme" (transl. "look for the woman"). Somehow, every dead man was either killed by a woman, killed by that woman's associates, killed by that woman's rival lover, or whatever – the specifics didn't matter, but somehow "the woman" was always the cause, no matter how ridiculous (and misogynistic) that assumption might be.

In the same fashion, it seems like no matter what the problem is with someone's RPG experience, the D&D community always asks "what was the GM's mistake?" and then proceeds to engage in whatever mental gymnastics are necessary to somehow attribute the problem to GM error.

There is some truth to the idea that some GMs can sometimes work within any given set of rules in order to achieve some arbitrary creative goals – but if the system is at odds with those goals, then the GM will find that it's a struggle to accomplish. Much of the output of the D&D-advice cottage industry amounts to exactly this: helping GMs figure out how to fit the "square peg" of their stated creative goals into the "round hole" that is the D&D system.

The easiest solution, in almost all cases, is to change the system itself with either a house rule, home-brewed subsystem, a new set of special procedures, or by swapping to a different game altogether. Once your system is in harmony with your creative agenda, these problems just evaporate and the game begins to effortlessly behave as desired. This idea – that changing your system is the chief way to fix the problems with your game – is going to be a common theme here on Plumbing the Depths.

[lokisgoodgirl]

Okay there was no cute emoji for this one but now I'm curious:

You say you're waiting for the LGG hook for Rasputin!Loki - I find inspiration points fascinating. What were the LGG hooks for Clandestine and Hostile fucks?

I am so so excited that you asked this! Thanks for caring 🤣 ok…so. There are two things here.

The Image

This is the LGG Hook 🤣In any one shot, or basically anything I write..there is one, centralised image. If you imagine the fic as a movie trailer, that would be the moment there would be a key change.

So whether it’s Loki making his leathers disappear at the beat drop as an unexpectedly good stripper, Loki walking out the ocean stark naked bold as brass with a sea of people watching, or simply him soaking wet in a towel. There has to be one image I can see clear as goddam day that sets everything else on fire. Then I build everything around that.

I don’t have that image for Rasputin! Loki yet. I know a lot about him. But I don’t have his movie trailer shot that sets my brain alight.

The Collections

For Clandestine F*cks, it was a combination of my adoration of forbidden stuff and how that would play out with one Loki and YN. Forbidden places, relationship, secrecy…all very hot. And I thought to myself…how many ridiculously hot shenanigans can you make for these fools?🤣 For every instalment of CF, there was one of those movie trailer images.

Hostile F*cks is slightly different. It was all about the mini personas aka outfits or some kind of tactile element. It started with wetsuit! Loki because I just really wanted him in that wetsuit. Then I thought of biker! Loki and kilted! Loki and there’s a few others we’re still to meet.

I was enjoying writing a more snide and..well, hostile Loki and YN than Clandestine at that time so I thought fuck it. Let’s do another collection, could be fun! And it also means there’s a base for me to properly explore the rampant thirst and ‘random’ ideas in a familiar arc.

That’s more information than you asked for, and more than I intended to share, but it is what it is 🤣❤️❤️ I really appreciate the interest honestly, and I admire your writing so so much it means a lot to me ( Hugs)

You might be interested @simplyholl @fictive-sl0th @holdmytesseract @joyful-enchantress @ijuststareatstuffhereok89

[guiltknight-gaming]

Dead Island 2 Episode 26: Plumbing The Depths

[knockknockitsnickels]

Old Warly & Webber doodle based on a quote I thought was cute <3

[tiktaalic]

Harrow the ninth is great for me, someone who spent the entirety of Gideon the ninth going I don’t really care what Gideon thinks about all this I want to hear harrow’s thoughts as she summons so many skeletons that she passes out on the floor

[notbecauseofvictories]

Hello, would you happen to have any book recs on arthurian retellings? I've read th white, malory, tolkien and steinbeck and was wondering if there's anymore around that leans into the more fantastical or weird. Either way, any recs would be appreciated please and thank you!

Retellings, no---unfortunately, once you move outside of Malory and de Troyes etc., you're largely in the world of literary classics (e.g., White) or YA novels (e.g., Gerald Morris, my beloved). There was a brief period of resurgence in the 70s with authors like Mary Stewart and Thomas Berger trying their hand at Arthuriana, and the 90s were lousy with juvenilia (I was there, I remember!) but few of them lean into the fantastical in the way you mean.

....that said, there's an unexpected wealth of novels that aren't straight adaptations, but do play with the mythos in interesting ways.

My actual reason for reblogging that post was that I just finished Perilous Times, by Thomas D. Lee. It's set in a future world when the UK is being swallowed by rising seas, half the country has been sold to private corporations, and the other half has devolved into factionalist infighting---oh, and this is about when Sir Kay is roused from his eternal slumber, and told to go kill a dragon. (Slowly, you discover that eternal slumber isn't really "eternal"; he and his fellow knights have been called up a dozen times, each worse, bloodier, and more morally implicating than the last.)

It is a weird as hell set up, and it doesn't get any less weird once you throw in the fay, Welsh independents, refugee camps, and explosions. Nevertheless, I enjoyed myself immensely.

I think that's my takeaway---if you've already read the greats, you can branch out into those authors using Arthuriana as a tool rather than an end in itself. For example, I just started Donald Barthelme's The King, which is the Arthurian cycle transliterated to WWII. I've only read the first bit, but this exchange had me in hysterics:

In the end, I've already read Malory, etc. I'd love a truly mystical Arthurian retelling, that takes advantage of how wide, deep, and unexplained, inexplicable, the world was around the Round Table. However, barring that, I like it when an author does something with all the paper dolls left behind---even if it involves Merlin licking mushrooms, or Lancelot's bloody mace being stolen from the pub washroom.

[metanarrates]

I'm interested to know what "protagonist" is defined as here. usually a protagonist is a character who gets major plot focus and whose viewpoint drives the bulk of narrative involving them. (im speaking in basic terms here; the definition of "protagonist" is one that can be endlessly litigated.) a character can be the protagonist of a subplot without appearing again in the main narrative, but...

it's interesting to me that, before now and after the events of this arc, kim dokja rarely speaks or thinks about jang hayoung at all. this is really weird, considering that she is a protagonist in his favorite novel. he thinks WAY more about characters like lee jihye and lee hyunsung than he ever does about her. granted, part of this is due to their membership in his party, but I would argue that even kim namwoon seems to be more emotionally significant to kim dokja, and that guy has been dead since the start of orv. what's the reason for this?

I can think of two:

1. "protagonist" is defined very loosely here. twsa, from kim dokja's descriptions, sounds very oddly structured as a novel. jang hayoung is considered a protagonist by the novel because she stars in her own subplot and because she represents one of the three ways to survive. however, she might not get a ton of screen time in twsa itself.

2. kim dokja is just fucking weird about jhy. since he had a hand in creating her character, he has almost shameful emotions towards her. maybe he's embarrassed by how she reflects his youthful cringiness, similar to how he feels about knw. or maybe she reflects something else about him that he doesn't like to see. we'll get back to this later in my reread, since I'll have a much better grasp on how he views her by then. regardless of his reasoning, though, and regardless of how much screentime she has in twsa, the end result is that kdj doesn't like to think about her.

i suspect it's a mix of both, but I can't say for sure. this is going to be something I'll keep mulling over during this arc. it is an arc i don't remember very well, for the record, so I'm interested to see what happens here.

(as an aside, it is REALLY interesting for me to think about how twsa is written and structured. there's not a ton of info given on how it actually functioned as a novel, since most of the story is filtered through kdj's perception of it. i wonder what kind of arcs it had and how character focus was handled...)

[visions--of--collisions]

for @jennsterjay who went with 5 (PG)

EXCERPT: remember when we didn't know who to be? (Spiderverse, Hobie/Miles, G, Post-Canon)

A welcome sight greets him at the kitchen table. Billie’s in her high chair with Miles’ tablet - judging by the stickers - propped on the table in front of her, waving a tiny fist in the vague direction of her mouth as her eyes follow something on the screen. She does a startled little flail when she notices him. ‘Ibby!’ she says, and drops what she was holding to reach for him; it’s mangled beyond recognition, but there’s cubes of mango scattered across the tray in front of her, and one or two in the bottom of her moulded bib, so he knows those little hands are a sticky, pulpy nightmare.

Hobie couldn’t give less of a shit, frankly. ‘Young Bill!’

Billie squeals in response, and he reaches out to let her grip his fingers in a pincer hold he swears gets tighter every time he sees her. She promptly uses them to start trying to leverage herself out of her chair, huffing determinedly. Hobie laughs, delightedly. A girl after his own heart. 'Alright, easy, I ain’t going nowhere,' he soothes, and works his hands free to lift her out. Billie kicks her feet excitedly, even getting a few decent hits in on him while Hobie settles her on his hip, whereupon she gets straight to work on widening the holes in his jumper.

The water stops running at the kitchen sink. Hobie glances over just as Miles’ Dad turns to meet him, wiping his hands dry on a tea towel.

Hobie has to give it to him; the man’s got an eloquent way of raising his eyebrows. ‘Ay, and here’s the Old Bill!’ He clicks and makes a finger gun with his free hand. Billie turns in his hold and reaches for it. Hobie resists the urge to comment on her being her Father’s daughter, even though he knows Miles would laugh (despite himself). ‘Afternoon, Mr. Morales.’

‘Hobart,’ Jefferson drawls. He side-eyes Miles, who’s cramming the last few plates into the dishwasher beside him. ‘You going ahead with your little plan, then?’

'Yep.' Miles straightens and accepts the towel Jefferson passes to him. 'See, it'll be fine! I can't be Spiderman if I'm dragging my baby sister around, but there'll still be one here - you know, if something comes up while we're out there.'

'Wiya,' Billie agrees. Hobie rearranges his fingers into web-slinging formation and grins when she reaches for them with both hands, this time.

Miles points at her. 'Exactly.'

Jefferson scoffs and tugs the towel out of his hands. 'Dragging her around,' he mutters. 'You better not be dragging my baby girl around out there.'

‘Dad. Come on.’ Miles flashes Hobie a disbelieving look even as he’s trying to maintain his patented Good Mama’s Boy smile. Hobie helps himself to a piece of Billie’s mango without comment. ‘I’ve done this a dozen times already. It’s literally just for the afternoon. We’re gonna take a cab there and back, so we’ll be out on the street for a fraction of that …’

Hobie pops some fruit into Billie’s mouth, which she chews on with the renewed enthusiasm of someone seeing another person enjoying the same food. ‘Whereabouts we headed, then? A bit nippy for the park, ain’t it?’

This is, apparently, the wrong question to ask. Miles’ nose wrinkles in a wince as Jeff cranes his head around the fridge door he’s just opened. The man looks at Hobie with round eyes before he turns them on his son. ‘And you’re telling me this boy doesn’t even know what the plan is?’

‘Well - the broad strokes!’ Miles insists. He’s doing his best not to get sharp or defensive about it, Hobie can tell. Billie makes a querulous noise, and Miles lowers his arms as his attention diverts her way. Hobie turns the hip she’s perched on towards him, and he exhales loudly, crossing the kitchen to take her.

Hobie’s a bit too conscious of Jeff’s eyes on them as they pass her between them. He tucks his hands into his back pockets, pushing out his chest like someone who’s confident and unworried and not excruciatingly aware of the pocket fluff migrating towards his mango-sticky fingers. ‘The plan was to give your Mum some time to rest, weren’t it?’ he asks, trying not to sound too pointed about it. Miles nods like it wasn’t his idea in the first place; like he even needs the reminder. Hobie curbs the instinct to put his shoulder in between them - to give Miles shelter he doesn’t need. ‘While we’re running the Mayday Contingency, obviously,’ he adds, like it’s an afterthought and not the first thing Miles texted him about this morning. ‘Bills not being a Spiderbaby makes that twice as easy, I expect.’

He glances over at Jeff and is a bit surprised to see him watching Miles with his brows drawn. He meets Hobie’s eye for a stilted moment and then leans back, his chest expanding with a sigh. ‘Mayday … as in, Parker’s kid, Mayday? Or is this one of those situations where the name’s pulling double duty?’

Hobie grimaces slightly and tilts a hand from side to side. ‘Bit of both, yeah.’

‘You already asked me this question, Dad, the last time we talked about this.’ Hobie blinks, and turns to find Miles seated at the table, arranging Billie in his lap so she can sit back against him, her little arms looped overtop his. He gives her some fingers to clutch at; bends down and sideways so she can see his face. Hobie knows his expression is doing something truly stupid when Billie looks at her brother and smiles, automatic, like a little lightbulb going on, so he keeps his back to Jeff as he squats down and catches one of her kicking feet. Miles grins at her visible distraction and leans in to kiss her cheek. He very determinedly keeps his eyes on his sister when he says: 'You really think I'd let anything happen to her?'

The kitchen is quiet for a bit, even with the noise of Miles’ tablet and Billie telling Hobie exactly how she feels about having her toes tugged on (the reviews are in and they agree: he should get kicked in the chin.) Jefferson mutters to himself before the fridge door thunks shut. ‘It’s not about anything you’d let happen, Miles. You know that.’

Hobie tries to control his expression when he looks up at his friend, because Miles already knows how he feels about so-called authority figures having opinions on personal autonomy and influence. Jeff himself knows, at this point. Besides that, Miles should always know Hobie’s on his side, but he doesn’t want to give him any reason to doubt it.

Miles’ eyes are still flicking across his face when Hobie feels Jeff’s presence behind him, and he sees him glance up like he can’t help himself before refocusing on Billie. Jeff reaches past Hobie’s shoulder to gather up the condiments left out on the table; he bites down on the urge to offer a hand that spending any amount of time in the Morales’ kitchen quickly makes second nature - even and especially when it means Miles’ Mom gets to tease her son about his friends “showing him up” until he’s flustered and whiny. Oblivious to the mood, Billie coos up at her Dad as Miles grabs his tablet and turns it to face her, and Hobie spends a good minute or so wondering whether they’re actually going to be leaving the flat today before Jeff bends down to kiss his daughter’s head and elbow his son as he straightens up again. ‘Cool it with that,’ he scolds him quietly. ‘Your Mom already said you could go, didn’t she?’

[TBC]

[crtastrophic]

my 4$ thrift store son he has every disease

[gideonisms]

Tamsyn: the iliac crest is like a ragged shoreline

Me, not knowing what the fuck that means: soo true 😭 the cinnamon topography 💯💯💯

[confusedraven1]

i keep watching this just to watch that wig plumb the depths and perform like it’s its last night on earth

[spewagepipe]

Plumbing the Depths: "The Fruitful Void"

Watch the video for context – I can't spare the space to summarize the whole debacle here. What's important for my purposes is that the "fruitful void" that Milton describes around 7m19s is... not what Mulligan is talking about with his tortured "stove" metaphor.

The "fruitful void" refers to the idea that a system should take care not to accidentally answer the focal questions that are supposed to be answered through play. Baker illustrates this with a diagram describing the rules for the now-defunct Dogs in the Vineyard:

At the centre of the diagram are the unanswered questions of the game. The mechanics surround them, support them, and direct play toward them, but the mechanics must never directly answer those questions – or else the game would "play itself" (at least with respect to whatever topics are in the middle of the diagram, there). Like in Snakes & Ladders, the participants would have nothing to add.

Now, Milton is indicating that he thinks that because D&D doesn't have rules for things like "emotions, relationships, and character", that must mean that those things exist within D&D's fruitful void. But what he's not realizing is that, in addition to the fruitful void at the centre of the rules, there's also another, regular-ass, non-fruitful void that exists entirely outside of a game's rules. Here's a diagram for D&D:

Over on the left, the "fruitful void" is, of course, combat. All of D&D's rules surround and support combat, directing us toward it. If we engage with those rules (if we're taking turns in initiative order, using the actions, rolling saving throws, adjusting our hit points, and so on) then we are necessarily also answering D&D's focal questions, like "Will we survive? Will we triumph? How will we do it?" Even when we use those rules to the absolute fullest, we will never be obliged to talk about our characters' emotional journeys or the arc of their relationships.

By contrast: if we are managing to avoid answering the focal combat questions, then we're probably disregarding many or most of the rules of D&D. Perhaps instead we are out over on the right of the diagram, in the space where D&D's rules are largely irrelevant. Trying to use the rules of D&D to play a game in this space is... well, it's a bit like trying to eat your stove. Stoves are related to eating, but they're not for eating – you need other things, like food, to do that.

These metaphorical "other things", of course, include what Milton describes as "the very sophisticated and finely honed set of improv rules that [Mulligan] has running in his head". This system in Mulligan's head – and not D&D – is the primary game system upon which Dimension 20 runs. And that works wonders for Mulligan! But for those of us who are not trained, experienced, professional writer/actors, trying to use a system that only exists in Mulligan's brain is challenging. What the fans of Dimension20 need, and what Mulligan and Milton therefore ought to promote, is a system with a fruitful void that encompasses those emotions and relationships that Mulligan finds so easy.

[who-the-fuck-knows-blog]

how long was izzy waiting in the captain’s cabin for stede to show up just to give him his little dramatic ‘i told you so’ speech? izzy knew this would happen, he warned stede. and stede didn’t listen. i love how izzy places himself in the most drama queen areas when he’s got a point to make.

[james-stark-the-writer]

was just rewatching Jack Saint and Patricia Taxxon's video on Mauler (it's called "Long Critique Is Not Deep Critique" and it's like actually so fucking good) and was so taken aback by hearing Twin Peaks music in there now that i've actually seen Twin Peaks lmao, that Laura Palmer theme is so fucking good, Angelo Badlamenti is just truly on another level, i already wanna rewatch the show now (S02 is good, y'all are just cowards).

[rhaenyratheecruel]

Before I get hate mail (I mean it’s probably inevitable anyway) I wouldn’t really say that I ship Bella and Duncan so much as I just find their dynamic absolutely fascinating and I think she should get to keep him as a pet that she does whatever she wants with :)

I also think Emma Stone and Mark Ruffalo are ridiculously attractive both on their own and together so there’s also that

[slutforstabbings]

Sorry if you didn't like Halloween Ends but it's not for you, David Gordon Green made it like that for me because he loves me.