#the show is running out of villains because they keep having harley girl power murder them

[automaticstarlightcomputer]

the hbo harley Quinn show is such a flaming pile of steamy dog shit that seeing it in any context or capacity actually makes me angry

[taiblogcomics]

Mulling Over the Culling

Hey there, moving day. Oh boy. Well, here we go. If you thought the last issue was bad and a character assassination, this issue is even worse~

Here's the cover:

Ah, the boring "team versus shot yelling at each other" cover. It's a really boring cover, especially for an annual. I will also point out that this annual came out after issue 8. So it hasn't actually been a year yet. That's one of the major problems with this story. The New 52 wasn't even a year old yet, and they're doing huge event crossovers between books. A lot of books didn't even make it past this point. Lots of them, like Static Shock, were cancelled after issue 8. So a good third or so of the books were being cancelled, while the others were engaging in unnecessary crossovers. And that's where this story comes in!

Anyway, the cover's awful, let's see how awful the story is too. So, since it's not obvious from the cover (another mark against it), this storyline is a crossover between Teen Titans, Superboy, and Legion Lost. The short description for that is that a few members of the Legion of Super-Heroes come back from the 31st century to find some sort of cure they need in the future. So in addition to the Titans and Superboy--not to mention all the villains and other characters we're going to introduce in this--now you have to keep track of and presumably care about Gates, Dawnstar, Timberwolf, Tyroc, Tellus, Wildfire, and Chameleon Girl. Good luck getting off any sort of emotional resonance with a cast list in the 20s!

So we open with Tim Drake on his back with a boot on his chest. The boot belongs to Artemis, making her comics debut here, following her appearance in the Young Justice cartoon series. Also here are new versions of Thunder and Lightning, a pair of minor Teen Titans characters. In the old continuity, they were Vietnamese twins, but in the New 52, now they're a caucasian brother/sister pair. Lightning's pissed because Artemis is expositing to Tim, because Tim "wears the colours of Harvest". Thunder and Lightning have exactly the same Tron suits as the Titans do.

The backgrounds are horrendous. I hope radioactive lava orange is your favourite, because you're going to be seeing it for a week after reading this. After Tim forces Artemis off him, he suitably impresses the group, and they run off together. Artemis exposits all the way, mentioning she's also not a metahuman, making it really weird that Harvest would want to kidnap her to join his army. They then run into a grungy-looking cyborg guy named Fist Point. He and his goon squad demand a toll, which is stupid. Tim tries the whole "we have to work together!" shtick that might work better on Saturday morning cartoons, but such comraderie has no place in the New 52. They beat up Fist Point and reunite with the other Titans.

This is also where Superboy joins the party. Like, this whole annual could've been about getting Superboy to join up and him working to earn the trust of each member. That would've been really good! Instead we get this, where Superboy agrees to work with the team, and Cassie tells him nobody cares about his opinion. Cassie's continued attitude is one of the most frustrating things about this series. We then cut over to a brief scene with the Legion Lost--remember them? They're in this crossover too!--determining that Gates' warping powers can't seem to get them out of this place. They resolve to keep working together, however. I already like them better than the Titans, since they're not being pissy at each other. This is a bad sign for a crossover~

This then cuts over to Harvest and his goons (including Omen and Leash from the last issue), gloating over how their plans are going to turn out great. He sends out Leash again to torment them, and we can talk about this guy now. He's got a glowing purple ribcage, a leather bodysuit, and assless chaps over that. He's also wearing a do-rag, has pale white skin and red lipstick. Unique among Harvest's goons, he appears to have been made entirely for this series. If this is the kind of guy they could come up with as new characters, maybe making terrible versions of previous characters is the better choice. Anyway, Leash ties them all up with his powers and torments them.

So hey, you remember Skitter? Was she your favourite character? I hope not, because a mysterious person we don't see offers her hand to Skitter and removes her from the comic. No, seriously. Skitter won't appear or even be mentioned again until the very last issue of the series. Anyway, Leash gathers up the Legion and the Titans and pits them against each other. A terrible fight scene ensues. It's really hard to look at, mostly due to the bright orange backgrounds. The fight with Wildfire and Superboy is particularly eye-searing. It's this fight, though, that the pair put together than neither side is working for NOWHERE and probably shouldn't be fighting each other.

Harvest and friends note that neither group is going for the kill, and thus it's time for the Culling to officially begin. What have I been reading up to this point, then? We cut over to another group of metahuman kids, including Thunder, Terra, and Beast Boy. These names are only significant if you know the previous continuity, so any new readers they were hoping to attract are just gonna be confused. Beast Boy is also red now, because the New 52 makes everything edgy. Like, there's an actual explanation that ties him to Animal Man's mythos, but let's face the truth. The New 52 loved it some edgelord '90s designs, and this is just another example.

So the Culling officially begins, and all the metahumans begin fighting among themselves. And you really have to wonder why. Like, nobody's being mind controlled or possessed or anything. All Harvest is promising is a chance to join his side, which isn't exactly appealing to the people you have kidnapped and tortured. So fighting for Harvest isn't exactly great incentive. And yet, even Lightning is out here, begging Beast Boy "Don't make me kill you!" Nobody has to kill anyone, you idiot! Except those who are even bigger idiots, I guess. Remember that Fist Point mook? He shows up and murders Artemis.

Yeah.

They used this series to introduce a new version of a popular character from a popular TV show, to make the character's debut in comics--and then they killed her off in the same issue. That's absolutely disgusting. This is why I hated the New 52. They could've done anything in the world with these characters. Instead, they reinvented them to either be assholes, villains, or dead. This is not restricted to just this book either, but it seems pretty excessive doing this here.

So Tim swears vengeance for Artemis, despite having only met her this issue. The Titans and Legion officially team up and beat back their foes, to Harvest's consternation. Don't they know better not to fight back, he's asking as he destroys his equipment in a Kylo Ren-style tantrum. Can't they tell he's already won? With the fodder dealt with, Harvest sends in his big guns, his personal Ravagers team. This includes Omen, that gold guy from the cover of issue 7, and that Templar guy also from the same issue. There's a couple others, but I'm gonna save the rants about them for their more full appearances in later issues. Next issue, though? More fighting! That's all this crossover is!

And now we’re truly on the downward plummet. I think I’ve said what I need to about Artemis, but please never forget that they did this. Imagine if they murdered Harley Quinn the first time she showed up in comics, in a crossover in someone else’s story. That’s what this is like. It’s stupid and awful and should never happen.

And don’t worry, dear readers. We won’t miss any of The Culling, because I actually followed Teen Titans back when it was coming out. So I even have the issues of Superboy and Legion Lost that make up more of the crossover. We’ll get to that next time~

[cursed-to-be-a-sidekick]

DC Ladies and Why They're so Awesome

Barbara Gordan: So of course Im going to start of with a good part. Babs is probably one of the smartest people in the entire DC universe. She graduated high school early (at like sixteen) and went to college. She got her masters degree so she could be a librarian. In her 20's she became a congresswoman but apparently was too liberal to get re-elected. On top of this all she was batgirl. When the Killing Joke happened the DC universe thought they lost Babs. Not only did Babs stick around she became stronger. Babs used everything she had and built up the Birds of Prey using her quick thinking and computer knowledge to keep her team safe. Not only that but as Oracle Babs was the information keeper for the Justice League. She had every single superheroes number easily accessible and knows them all personally. Also Babs became a Green Lantern! Like thats awesome. Babs has been at war with the Calculator for forever and has won every time. You can not tell me Babs isnt one of the best DC characters hands down.

Diana Prince: Okay I bet you're all surprised I didn't start off with Diana. I love Wonder Woman so much and there's so many reasons why. First off Wonder Woman defied her Amazonian sisters and went out to the real world. She didn't know what was out there and didn't really care. She wanted to promote peace and be a diplomat and that's what she was at least for a while. When Diana killed Maxwell Lord she regretted it so much that she decided not to be Wonder Woman anymore. Even though everyone told her that her reasoning was just (cause like yeah it was). Wonder Woman has this huge sense of responsibility and like how can you not love her for it. Also the fact she's more powerful than most of the Justice League and the Justice League knows and admires it. Yeah that's definitely a plus.

Mary Batson: Okay I love Mary and honestly I don't know much about her but I'm going to take a stab. Mary carries this sense of responsibility, she wants to be a hero and she's damn good at it too. When she lost her powers around Countdown she was devastated. When she got them back and become "Black Mary" that absolutely sucked. But she came back became Mary Marvel again and built herself back up. Mary is a key part of the Marvel family and I don't know what Billy would do without her. She's also still a kid. Like an actual kid. A teenager and she's out helping save the world. Yeah I have respect for that.

Kara Zor-El: Of course Supergirls on this list. Why would she not be? Okay supergirl has an interesting story. She's the sole survivor of not one but to planets. When she arrived on earth she knew nothing about the planet at all. She had to trust her cousin knew what he was doing to help her. She wanted to build a whole life away from being a superhero too. She just wanted to be a normal kid. She has her ups and downs but ultimately Kara is probably one of the best characters because she's realistic. She's written to be an angsty teenage girl who is still trying to figure herself out. Sure she's chronologically 30 years older than Superman (depends on what story you read) but that doesn't make her any less of a kid. Also she fought Darkseid and Lex Luthor while still figuring out her powers, she single handedly took down the entire Justice League and she's more powerful than Superman. I think that's pretty cool.

Dinah Lance: The Black Canary's name has belonged to like three different Dinah's at this point. But that doesn't make her any less awesome. Dinah is trained in all forms of martial arts and is thought to be the second best martial artist in the world. Yeah the entire world. Dinah is hot heated and can be moody at times but she knows what she's doing. Even after losing her Sonic Scream she continued to kick ass with the Birds of Prey. She did get her Sonic Scream back later while in the birds but she never seemed to rely on her powers, she always just used her gut instincts and quick thinking. At one point Dinah adopts a child who was being trained to be an assassin. She kept this child and even stopped being with the birds to settle down with Oliver Queen and have a family. Dinah is undoubtedly one of the best ladies in the whole DC universe.

Helena Bertinelli: Okay not only is Helena a superhero known as the Huntress shes also a school teacher. Helena originally was the daughter of Batman and Catwoman but at some point during Crisis she became a vigilante who was the daughter of a mob boss. After her whole family is murdered in front of her she vows to end the underground crime ring in Gotham. Shes pretty good at it and almost succeeds. Sure her methods arent well liked by Batman but she gets her job done. She joins the Birds at one point and actually gets a family. Babs gets her a job as a school teacher and Helena is happy again. Towards the end of the original Birds run Helena manages to take over the underworld and Gotham and manages to (almost) take it down.

Stephanie Brown: Okay Steph is the daughter of some low class supervillain called the Cluemaster. She becomes Spoiler as a way to make up for all the things that her dad did. She literally built herself up from nothing and became an amazing superhero. Steph might have never had a major standing in the comics but she was there in the background spoiling everyones plans. Also Steph got pregnant as a teenager. Like thats really hard to deal with. And she did it mostly while continuing to be a vigilante. Steph maintained a good friendship with Cass and when Cass ditched the title of Batgirl Steph took it up. While Batman never approved of her actions Steph did everything she could to be an accepted member or the batfamily. Plus she was briefly Robin which is really cool.

Cassandra Cain: Okay daughter of assassins is already cool but the fact she can speak solely with body language is amazing. Cass never learned how to speak and was trained to be the worlds best assassin. When she did learn how to speak she spoke few words. Despite that she maintained a great friendship with Babs and Steph. Babs trained her to be the new Batgirl and Steph ended up being her best friend. Cass is even better at fighting than Batman and she took down the Joker her first time fighting him. Not only did she break the Joker out of Arkham she beat him and sent him back just as easily. Cass had a great character arc and I just love her character. She really brought the name Batgirl to mean something entirely new and when she dropped it and gave the name to Steph she did it with honor. Cass did at one point leave to go run the league of assassins but she eventually came back to Gotham.

Talia Al Ghul: I dont know much about Talia but I think I know enough to write a paragraph about her. Talia is the heir to the demon. She trained as a child to be an assassin alongside her father Ra's Al Ghul. She also fell in love with Batman. But thats probably the least cool thing about her. I mean she is an assassin who will potentially inherit a whole army of assassins and be immortal. Like I dont know about you but I think thats pretty friggin awesome.

Selina Kyle: Okay Catwoman is amazing. She trained to fight under Catman which is pretty cool. Also like she controls part of the Gotham underworld. Selina is an amazing woman who is a great thief and she also has morals. She doesnt do killing (most of the time) and shes even been a hero for a while. Catwoman became a hero alongside Batman but at some point she decided to return back to crime. She's worked alongside the Birds of Prey a few times and at one point was even a member. Selina also decided not to marry Bruce because she knew marrying Batman might give him a reason not to be Batman anymore and she knew people needed Batman more than she needs Bruce. Also Selina helps girls on the street. Like thats a major thing. Helping kids who dont have much. Like thats great. Lastly she feeds and takes in stray cats and thats just wonderful.

Harley Quinn: Okay while I wouldnt consider Harls a hero persay (shut up new 52 and rebirth) she is still an amazing character. Harley is a genius, she blew through med school and became a psychologist. She built herself up from working at Arkham from the bottom all the way to working with the highest class psychos. Harls was also an amazing gymnast and she had tons of medals. After falling in love with the Joker she did some regrettable things but the fact she managed to get herself and she started to redeem herself shows a lot about. Harley now just wants to help people she wants to fix what she did wrong. Harley has a big heart and wants to do right and while she knows her methods arent that great shes trying hard. She just wants to please the people she loves and cares about.

Pamela Isley: Okay Ivy is a tricky character. She doesnt really have a set backstory or anything that I really know of. Ivy was a scientist and something happened that changed her physically. She became connected to the green. Now Ivy isnt really sure who she is. She became the Batman villain known as Poison Ivy and became an ecological terrorist (at least thats what I think they call her). Ivy really just doesnt know her place in the world. Ivy is wicked smart and she has patented a lot of biotech stuff and she made Harley the antidote that made her immune to toxins. She does end up re-entering the field of science a few times and is genuinely trying to turn a new leaf and become a better person. At first she didnt really understand that what she did was wrong she just wanted to help out the plants because she saw all these terrible things happening to them. For the most part Ivy is a misunderstood person who is trying to find her humanity.

Kara Zor-El (Earth Two): Okay Power Girl is a tricky character to figure out because she has so many different backstories due to the destruction and then reformation of the multiverse. Anyways Karen Starr is from another Earth specifically Earth 2. When she arrived on Earth 1 she learned there was already a Supergirl. She took on the name Power Girl and founded a company that focused on software (I think.) Shes older than Earth 1s supergirl and is kind of like a big sister figure at times even though her and Kara are the same person. The two also didnt start off on the right foot with eachother. Karen for a while led the Justice Society of America which is really flipping cool. Karen knows whats right in her heart which is what makes her like Superman in a way. Because like her cousin (even if the two arent really cousins on earth 1) she wants to help people.

Donna Troy: The original Wonder Girl will always hold a special place in my heart but I kid of want to focus on her time as Wonder Woman and also as simply just Donna Troy. When Wonder Woman quit being Wonder Woman Donna took her spot and she made a pretty great Wonder Woman. She doubted herself a lot and didnt think shed ever be as good as Diana she pushed herself up to the top and did it. As Donna Troy she was an amazing Teen Titan and she even cheated death. Her spot in the multiverse has been looked over a few times but her Roy and Jason last I heard were all kicking ass together.

Rachel Roth: Ravens a weird character Im not going to lie. Shes kind of mysterious. Rachel was a key addition to the Teen Titans, her powers are unmatchable in battle a lot of the time. Also shes the child of the demon Trigon. Rachel herself never really knew what to do with herself but while growing up she knew she had to do something and that she has to save people. She spent her teenage years with the Titans and continues to be with the Titans even if shes technically supposed to have aged out by now.

Kate Kane: Kate is one of my favorite characters of all time. Batwoman adds so much to the story and it covers a lot of things Ive never even thought of. Kate was kicked out of Westpoint under Dont Ask Dont Tell. The story talks a lot about her experience with PTSD, being gay and also being in the army. Kate runs a major business and is Batmans cousin. Kate literally gives zero craps about what Batman says and she does what she wants even if he doesnt approve. Kate has a big heart and ultimately she just wants to save her sister. After being kicked out of Westpoint Kate became a party girl and an alcoholic becoming Batwoman changed all of that for her. She became the woman she was meant to be.

Maggie Sawyer: Maggie Sawyer is a badass cop. Shes also Kates girlfriend and shes a mom. Being a cop in Metropolis is one thing but since moving from Metropolis Maggie has joined the GCPD. Being a cop in Gotham versus being a cop in Metropolis are to completely different things. Maggie can do it all and she works well under pressure. Shes an amazing cop and deserves so much more credit that what she gets in the comics.

Renee Montoya: Renee Montoya started out as another Gotham City Cop well until she became The Question. Also one of Kates ex girlfriends Renee has taken up Vic Sage's mantel and become the Question. She's a cop turned vigilante who is trying to do everything she can to keep Gotham safe.

Zatanna Zatara: So Zatanna is a magician. An actually magician with real magic and also a performing magician for kids. She does a lot of volunteering and loves showing her magic to the kids. Shes part of Justice League Dark and her powers are probably some of the most powerful in the whole DC universe. Zatanna can literally do anything just by saying it backwards. She doesnt get as much credit as she deserves but Zatanna is a kid with a big heart and deserves a lot more than she gets. Also did I mention she once climbed Mount Everest?

Courtney Whitmore: Not many people know much about Stargirl but this teenage girl is a key part of the Justice Society. Stargirl is a nobody without her Cosmic Staff but with it she is one of the greatest members of the JSA. Courtney has befriended Supergirl and has run around on all sorts of adventures before she could even vote. Her friendship with Supergirl is strong even if it isnt seen too often in the comics. Stargirl is just another kid who wants to change the world and who does manage to do it.

Lois Lane: Supermans girlfriend has ring to it enough but pulitzer prize winner Lois Lane is so much more than that. Shes an investigative reporter who strives to find the truth no matter the cost. Time and time again she goes undercover and risks her life for her job. She has no powers and no fighting skills just faith and a keen eye for a story. So sure while she's Supermans girlfriend she so much more than that. She's a woman who's going places and will always be independent. (Bonus: the first time Clark meets Lois she's yelling at some guy at the phone for being sexist)

Lana Lang: Supermans other girlfriend. Lana kind of got abandoned for a while but trust me she's still great. Lana takes in Kara while Kara is still struggling to figure her life out. Lana is the most supportive and loving person there is. She really cares about Kara and treats her like a daughter and as a best friend. Her friend ship with Lois Lane is amazing and Lana had an amazing story arc when she became possessed. Moral of the story never mess with any of Supermans girlfriends because they will fight back and theyll fight back hard.

Lady Shiva: If it wasnt for Lady Shiva Black Canary would be the best martial artist in the world. Lady Shiva is a long time Batman villain and not even Batman himself can beat her. Shes said multiple times that the only time he did she let him. She just wanted to know how worthy of an opponent he was. Shiva and Dinah trained under the same sensei together and have a mutual respect for eachother. For a short period of time Shiva even took Dinah under her wing to teach her new techniques no one else in the world even knew.

Mia Dearden: Speedy is hands down the best Green Arrow sidekick. And no Im not talking about Roy I really do mean Mia. Mia was living on the streets for the longest time and as a teenager. Constantly in the comics she talks about what it was like as a teenager being homeless on the streets, doing drugs and even selling her body just to stay alive. She became a great fighter while training with Ollie and Dinah and becomes the second Speedy. Mia is quick thinking and knows how and when to act. Later in the comics before she joins the Teen Titans she gets diagnosed as HIV +. That was the first time the DC universe made a character be HIV + and it hit hard for a lot people. Her backstory is really sad but its meaningful and really tells a lot about things that nobody knows anything about. Mia is a spunky kid with a lot of personality and she wants to help people.

Emiko Queen: Emi wasnt really around until she become the Red Arrow in Rebirth. She had her ups and downs but she stay devoted to Ollie throughout all of it. Emi is a tough character who really wants to be just like her big brother. She does at one point join a cult but then she breaks away from the cult to save her brother. Emi really admires Dinah and their friendship is great. Her story is still just starting to develop and its really cool to see where its going.

Zinda Blake: Lady Blackhawk has been no where in sight since New 52 hit. Im not really sure if theyll bring her back but I hope they do. Zinda is a hotheaded pilot who thinks more with her fists than she does with her brain. Shes a key member to the Birds of Prey and a true hero. After somehow re entering the continuity despite having to have originally been in WW2 Zinda has begun to fit right in with her weird accent and odd slang. I really hope she gets put back in soon.

Charlie Gage-Radcliffe: Misfits not really a well known character but shes a good one. Shes a spunky kid with an obsession with Batgirl. She takes on the mantel of Batgirl briefly before the real Batgirl, Barbara Gordan, stops her. Babs takes her in as one of her Birds and trains her. Charlie is just a kid and Babs knows it. Charlie doesnt get to see much action throughout the series but her character really grows a lot and she molds into this amazing character. Misfit is pretty impulsive and her mind (and body) tend to bounce all over the place. Charlie is just like any other teenager and she does everything she can to look on the bright side of every situation

Cassandra Sandsmark: Cassies Wonder Girl is what got me into Teen Titans. Cassie knows what she wants and knows how to get it. She can be short tempered but she had a really good heart. Her friendship with Supergirl is one of the best friendships in the whole DC universe. Cassie ultimately just wants to impress Wonder Woman. When she's not roaming around with the Teen Titans or on Paradise Island she's like literally every other teenage girl. Sitting at home argueing with her mom. Her power for her lasso comes fron her anger which she seems to carry a lot of. Shes still figuring out how to be Wonder Girl but shes become a valuable asset to the team. Cassie is a really relatable character and I love her for that. Her and Diana are a great pair and seeing them together is amazing. (Bonus: In New 52 Teen Titans she can put up a fight against basically anybody including Tim Drake and she hates the name Wonder girl)

There are more characters but this took me about two hours to write so Im going to cut it here. If anyone wants me to add any more characters let me know in the notes and I'll edit this. Also special shout outs to characters who I didnt have enough info on to put on here but are still equally as awesome: Martha Kent, Director Cameron Chase and Linda Park.

[dalekofchaos]

My problem with DCEU’s Birds Of Prey

I was excited that we are gonna see Black Canary, Huntress and Montoya as the Question and possibly Barbara as Oracle and Cassandra Cain’s live action debut. But then I read the rumored synopsis.

"After splitting up with The Joker, Harley Quinn and three other female superheroes – Black Canary, Huntress and Renee Montoya – come together to save the life of a little girl (Cassandra Cain) from an evil crime lord."

Okay if this rumor is true. I honestly have no interest in this movie. 

It is rumored that Black Mask will be the villain of the movie and are you serious? Do you honestly expect me to believe that Black Mask can subdue and hold Cassandra Cain hostage? It would be ONE THING if this were Lady Shiva or David Cain. But Black Mask? Cassandra Cain would absolutely DESTROY Roman Sionis. The mere thought that Cass needs saving from Sionis is preposterous and idiotic. This is how you’re gonna introduce Cassandra Cain, the best Batgirl, Bruce’s daughter and one of the best combatants in the DCU? What the actual fuck are you even doing?

Now to my issue with Harley.

“Harley joins The Birds Of Prey” Let me stop you right there. It is already canon in the DCEU that Harley Quinn helped The Joker murder Jason Todd. Do you honestly think Barbara and Helena would ever accept Harley’s help? Do you honestly think there is a force alive that could stop Helena Bertinelli from killing Harley Quinn for what she and Joker did to Jason? And if DC chose to keep Zack Snyder’s bullshit of Dick being the Robin who died, do you fucking really expect me to believe Barbara to ever accept Harley Quinn’s help if Dick was the Robin who died? The mere concept that Barbara and Helena would ever accept Harley’s help after what Joker and Harley did to Jason is complete and utter bullshit. Harley has already shown in Suicide Squad that she’s a villain. “We’re bad guys, it’s what we do” Harley and Joker are in love in these movies. Harley willingly went home with The Joker, showing that she loves him. Whether Margot Robbie, WB/DC likes it or not The Joker and Harley love each other.

And now I need to address the real problem I have with how DC treats Harley. 

Harley Quinn is a villain. 

Harleen Quinzel chose to become Harley Quinn.  Harleen Quinzel was not tortured or thrown in chemicals to become Harley Quinn. Harleen Quinzel fell in love with The Joker in therapy. There is a large portion of manipulation on The Joker’s part, but it was Harleen’s choice to become Harley Quinn. She’s not a victim of The Joker’s madness, she chose to become who she is.

Their relationship isn’t one sided abuse it’s an on and off again relationship. The Joker and Harley are both insane and dysfunctional, there is no way this can be a normal and healthy relationship because that is the complete opposite of these two characters. No one is saying the relationship is healthy nor do I suggest it to be healthy or a relationship to strive towards. It’s meant to be a violent, unstable relationship. It’s also fictional. It’s a fictional relationship between two horrible, demented murdering clowns. To pretend the relationship is a run of the mill one that’s portrayed as healthy is just preposterous. Same with pretending the relationship isn’t also filled with a sick, twisted romance. Romanticizing Joker/Harley isn’t the problem. The problem is encouraging the behaviors, which no one is. And I love them together, they are like the psychotic clownish super villain Bonnie And Clyde. The Joker DOES love Harley, he is incapable of showing it normally because he has never felt love for anyone and because he’s trash. If he didn’t love Harley he would have killed her ages ago, if all he needed was a way out of Arkham, Harley would have been killed.  He tries to kill her to push her away because he thinks that romance is a distraction and alien. Really, Joker sees Harley as the perfect partner. and this is according to Harley’s creator Paul Dini, The Joker himself Mark Hamil and Harley herself Arleen Sorkin “He loves her as much as he can. He loves her in his way.” -Paul Dini “…That, to me, is kinda their private life. Joker opens up and in those moments he is whatever he is at his core and all his demons come in. And the only one he trusts with that is Harley, or Harley’s the only one who knows how to deal with him in those moments.” -Paul Dini “Expressing emotion in any way that’s real and meaningful is alien to The Joker, but he’s learning those parts of himself, however unconsciously, through Harley.” -Mark Hamil “Everyone else sees The Joker laugh; only Harley has ever seen him cry.” -Arleen Sorkin She’s completely and utterly obsessed and in love with The Joker. She loves Ivy too, but her heart is primarily with Joker. Hell there was a comic where Joker was all nice and sweet to Harley and eventually Harley became bored and tried to get the old Joker back. Harley is in love with the mad clown, Harley wouldn’t have it any other way.

Harley Quinn is not a hero nor is she a anti-hero as DC has been trying to reshape her as. Harley Quinn IS A VILLAIN! Harley is not this role-model, she is a psychopath and a villain. Harley is not as psychotic as The Joker, Harley Quinn can be just as dangerous. Harley isn’t this precious baby, she isn’t a precious teddy bear and she isn’t someone to coddle regardless of how much you love her.  She doesn’t need to be protected from The Joker when she’s a super villain who has murdered her fair share of people and can hold her own against The Joker. She’s also crazy exuberant and peppy. She’s lighthearted evil.

Harley Quinn isn’t a pushover or defenseless cinnamon roll “that must be protected at all costs”. Harley can defend herself and kick Joker’s ass, she can hold her own against Batman(Harley came the closest to killing Batman) or any of the rouge’s gallery and she can fought Mercy Graves and she won that fight!

Harley works best as a second in command/follower. Why?  Because she became a villain in the first place to follow someone. And she as a villain only follows two people, Joker and Ivy. She has no motivation if she’s not following someone else, and her character is not meant to be heroic or quirky. She’s obsessive, lovesick and is solely devoted to her two loves. She kills for Joker and Ivy, she steals for them, she collaborated with them. If she’s not with one of them, her heart isn’t in it. And having her own solo series had rendered her into just another generic female anti hero. And since she was created to be a sidekick, she really works best in small doses. Trying to overwrite her character weakens the complexities of her.

Harleen Quinzel did not come to Arkham Asylum to help people. Harleen was power hungry and saw the inmates as a get rich quick scheme for a book and wanted to be the one to understand The Joker’s secrets and what made him what he is. In her own words. “I’ve always had an attraction for extreme personalities, they’re more exciting more challenging. You can’t deny there’s an element of glamour to these super criminals.”

Harley’s dad was and is a con artist. He’s been in and out of jail, constantly cheating on Harley’s mom, duping rich women for everything they have. Growing up in Bensonhurst around her constantly cheating and lying father, being left in squalor with her bitter mom and slacker brother, Harley vowed she’d be different, make a difference and actually be somebody. But it’s the classic tale of growing up to be what you hate. Harley loved cutting corners like her dad, though I imagine she always justified that to herself by saying she was actually going to make a difference, unlike her con artist father. And then she also became her mother, by falling in with The Joker, who is scarily a lot like her father.  

Harleen Quinzel  was already traumatized and unstable from her fiance committing suicide right front of her but went into Arkham right after that anyways because she wanted to study the inmates from Arkham Asylum and wanted to study The Joker so she could be famous for  learning his secrets, which we all know what happened. I would say the madness was already in Harley just buried underneath, The Joker just helped it surface.

Like it or not The Joker and Harley are made for each other. Harley’s entire character is built around The Joker. The only way Harley would ever be free from Joker’s influence is if she stripped away the clown aesthetic, stopped calling herself Harley Quinn and became Harleen Quinzel again.  Harley is supposed to be obsessed with the Joker and no one else, she was created for The Joker.  In my opinion, taking away the obsession a character is literally built around will not improve it.  Everything would have been different if Harley hadn’t been built around the Joker, but she was created for him, therefore taking her away from him not only is out of character, but is also bad for the character itself. Joker, like it or not, was and still is what made Harley a special, complex character. Harley Quinn does not work without The Joker and does not work by trying to make her a hero or an anti-hero. She was created to be a villain and taking that away does not work at all

The issue with Harlivy. I love Harley and Ivy together  but I hate what The New 52 and Rebirth and  Jimmy Palmiotti & Amanda Conner have turned them into. This has to do largely because Poison Ivy is no longer Poison Ivy. In the New 52, Poison Ivy is no longer an eco-terrorist/feminist, she no longer hates humans, she has no character and is just a cardboard cutout who is Harley’s love interest. And if you hate Joker/Harley because it’s an abusive relationship that’s fine and dandy but do not act like Harley/Ivy are the perfect girlfriends. Both relationships are not good for Harley. Ivy is abusive and manipulative of Harley. Ivy has beaten Harley, guilt-trips and manipulates Harley to abandon Joker for her, and further toys with her mind, restricts her daily life, and threatens her if she ever shows any interest to leave Ivy to go back to Joker. Ivy has poisoned her, left her for dead, had fantasies about strangling her, and all because Harley annoyed Ivy and either messed up their plans or put her plants in danger. Ivy is not the perfect girlfriend for Harley that the fans choose to picture, Ivy is a super villain who has no regard for human life, Harley is the only exception, but even sometimes Ivy wants to kill Harley and has tried many times to do so. She is not the character The New 52 and Rebirth keeps telling you she is. I love Harley/Ivy but the New 52 and it’s fans have pretty much driven me away, I love them in DCAU and in the pre-DCU but I do not ignore the abuse.

I don’t think some fans love Harley. They are in love with the idea of who they think Harley Quinn is and they reject the previous universe/classic version of Harley. Fans are willing to accept the New 52 version over classic. In the New 52 Harley is no longer the villain we love. She’s a looney toon female deadpool. I love that they made Harley/Ivy a thing but the writers do not understand either character AT ALL. It’s sad really. A character who is so well written in the past but instead the majority of her fandom prefers a watered down version that is not her, but a generic Deadpool clone and prefer to have Ivy be totally out of character just so Harley and her can be in a relationship.

[dangerousimagines]

Joker x Reader

One-shots

Damaged - Imagine being the Jokers Queen. And weeks after being kidnapped and tortured, you’re finally brought back to him.

Dramatic - Imagine the Joker being dramatic after you go out without telling him. 

Fame - Imagine being a writer for the Gotham Gazette and you try to get perfect picture of the Joker for your article, but you get caught. 

Tease (NSFW)- Imagine spending a lustful evening with Mister J at the club   

Weakness - Imagine returning home with the Joker after a run in with the Batman. The two of you start drinking and you can’t help but tease the green haired villain once you learn his weakness.   

Sweet Valentine - It’s Valentines Day and you’re bitter that the Joker would rather have business meetings with Gotham’s criminals then spend time with you. So you find a way to keep him home.

The Last Time -  Imagine being the Jokers wife who was killed by one of his enemies. Though he has Harley now, he still mourns you on the anniversary of your death.

You Don’t Own Me- One-shot based off of the song ‘You Don’t Own Me’.

For Her - Imagine having a child with the Joker but constantly getting into arguments in front of her.

A Set-up - Imagine going with the Joker to a warehouse for a business deal. You try to convince him not to go through with it but he ignores you and you end hurt.

You’re Not Real - You’re just an ordinary girl, writing fanficions on your laptop and obsessing over the new movie ‘Suicide Squad’. After going to see it for the third time, you end up going home with Gotham’s most dangerous criminal, who shouldn't even exist.

Run Away - You’re fed up with the Joker’s bullshit so you turn yourself in and are taken to Belle Reve.

Go Away - Imagine being the new inmate at Arkham Asylum. Its not long before you gain the attention of Clown Prince of Crime, but to his shock, you want nothing to do with him.

Surprising - Imagine your the Jokers new girlfriend. Everything is going fine until Harley tries to get revenge, little does she know that your a force to be reckoned with.

First Kicks - Imagine being pregnant with the Jokers child and in the middle of one of his business deals both of you get excited when the baby starts kicking. 

Enough - Imagine the Joker finding out that your self-harming.

Interview - Imagine being a writer and your boss wants you to write an article about the Joker, no matter how dangerous it could be.

Unbreakable - Imagine being a professional torturer and being hired to torture the Joker. After being unable to break him, you realize that you’re falling for him.

Newlyweds -  Imagine being married to a sane Joker and being pregnant. 

Little Birdie -  You’re the adoptive-daughter of Bruce Wayne. Despite your rebellious attitude, you do what you can to appease him and Gotham, even if you have to fight by his side. One night at a party, you’re taken by the Joker and he sees to use you as a weapon. 

Hurt Me - Imagine being a ordinary girl and being kidnapped by the Joker. He tortures you and after awhile he starts to realize that he is falling in love with you.

One Kiss - Imagine being the new psychiatrist at Arkham. You become good friends with Harley and one night asks you to take over her session with the Joker. He ends up taking interest in you and plans to take you with him when he escapes.

Drugged - Imagine going to the Jokers club and almost getting drugged.

Mine - Imagine the Joker being protective of you and not being happy when Harley tries to kill you.

Missing You - Imagine getting into a argument with the Joker and it ending with you leaving him. But after a few weeks, he shows up at your door injured and you decide to take care of him.

Only You -  Imagine being the Jokers girl and becoming best friends with Frost because he always keeps you company when the Joker is busy. One day, Joker gets angry and accuses you of being in love with Frost. 

Sorry -  Imagine being the Jokers Lover and he finds out that you’ve been raped by one of his henchmen.

What I want -  Imagine being Ricks little sister and working as a doctor at Belle Reve. When the Joker is finally captured, he’s brought there by your brother. He warns you not to fall for anything the Joker says, but what will happen when you fall for Clown Prince of Crime?   

The Deal -  Imagine being the Jokers girlfriend, you’re kidnapped and tortured. To make it all stop, all the Joker has to do is turn himself in to Arkham Asylum and give up his freedom forever. Regardless of what happens, there is going to be a lot of pain 

Forget You -  Imagine getting in an argument with the Joker. In his anger, you get hurt and end up with amnesia. Will your memory come back? Will you forgive him? 

Take Me Away -  Imagine being an inmate in Arkham Asylum and seducing your new blue-eyed doctor to help you escape.” 

The Real You - Chubby!Reader x Joker

Dress Up -  Imagine your a mob bosses daughter, super shy and innocent. The Joker ends up kidnapping you to get your father.

Family Matters (Daughter! Reader) -  Imagine being the Jokers daughter. Because of him, you have power and money but it all comes with a price. You don’t want to be evil like your father. The only chance you have is to team up with Jokers biggest adversary, the Batman.

Me Time -  Imagine trying to have some alone time but the Joker doesn’t know the meaning of space

Distress -  Imagine almost losing your baby when a deal goes wrong and it causing the Joker to go crazy.

The Cure -  Imagine being poisoned and the Joker never leaving your side as you both wait for the cure.

Just Go -  Imagine the Joker breaking up with you because he wants to keep you safe. Only to have you get kidnapped anyway.

The Watcher -  Your life changes after a bank robbery sends you into the arms of Gothams most dangerous criminal. Little do you know, he's had his eyes on you for awhile.

Favorite Doctor -  Imagine being Harley’s psychiatrist and the two of you have become really good friends. When the Joker finally comes to rescue her, she refuses to leave without you.

Uneasy Phobias -  Just a normal movie night with Mister J, until you notice the growing storm outside.

Strictly Business -  Imagine being the princess of a large crime family. One day your brother is murdered, leaving you traumatized and growing to be heartless. You follow lead after lead until you finally learn the name of the name who killed your sibling. But you can’t go after him alone, you’re going to need help.