#what a deeply flawed

[ventique18]

Malleus is literally contender for most pitiful character in twst... Dead parents (mandatory for male leads, I fear), grandmother who couldn't bring herself to love him enough to hatch him herself, foster father who he can't even say I love you to because of their difference in status, foster brother/s who are mortal and will die before he physically turns 30, everybody dislikes him because his own mom accidentally cursed him, his first organically-met friend and potential love interest wants to go home to their own world and leave him behind, and if he chooses not to marry and have kids he's doomed to overwork until he either dies of loneliness or everyone else dies so he wouldn't have anyone to rule over anymore-- whichever comes first.

But even through all the shit the world's putting him through, he's still always so very grateful for any morsel of affection he does receive. Despite having all the reasons to be permanently afflicted with sad boy syndrome, he'd still grin and laugh the widest he could with anyone willing to share some with him. He wouldn't understand jokes and you may have to explain it to him, but he will laugh the moment he realizes you're being silly for him. He will adore that cheap bracelet you made for home economics. He will finish and love that plain omelette you made for him.

He's someone larger than life itself, but he's also someone who thinks little moments and memories and the people who gave them to him are more precious than even his very life. And he is genuinely thankful for every single one of them.

[cruelplatonic]

my personal headcanon is the vees were unremarkable nobodies when they were alive. i just love it as a thematic throughline for them. they love to let the public of hell speculate on them being famed and acclaimed since before death, but the the truth is they were a d-list failed influencer that got by on cheap controversey and scamming, a broke junkie who burned every shaky bridge he ever had, and a worn-out broadcast production assistant with more rejected auditions and tossed out script pitches than he could count. nobody missed them when they were gone, nobody cared who they were until they were dead.

[gunsatthaphan]

🤓🚩🫶🏻

[kindlythevoid]

I have read Fellowship of the Ring more times than I have cared to keep count and every time I read Boromir’s, well, possession for lack of a better word, I have read it in fear, in discomfort, in horror, indifferently.

This was, I think, the first time I read it in pity. I looked at all the plans Boromir was making, how he would save his beloved city, how obstinate he was in his belief that the men of Minas Tirith would not be corrupted when wielding the Ring against Sauron —and I felt sad. He’s waving his hands and hollering and part of him is desperate just for the Ring, of course he is, he’s been traveling beside it with no hope for months, but he’s also desperate for hope. He’s desperate for a chance to save his people, save his brother, save his city.

Moreover, every time he calls out the Elves or the Wizards, you have to remember that he doesn’t know them. All he knows is that he traveled almost a full year to get their advice and they send him on, in his eyes, a hopeless venture. The one hope they give him is Aragorn, who promises to return and help save Minas Tirith with him, but even that all changes once Gandalf dies. They come to Lothlorien and of course it’s a welcome break, but they cannot, or maybe in Boromir’s eyes will not, help his people. And once they leave, Aragorn assumes his role as leader of the Fellowship in Gandalf’s stead more permanently and suddenly even that one, brief, uncertain hope of his is gone. Aragorn will follow Frodo. And it’s almost certain that Frodo will not go to Minas Tirith.

So is it any wonder, really, that tired, desperate, hopeless Boromir, out of his realm, out of his depth, already hanging by a thread when he joins the Fellowship and having been gnawed on by the Ring for months upon months afterwards, finally snaps once it’s clear that he will have to return home empty-handed and almost certain that somewhere far away Sauron is capturing the Ring and killing the companions that he had bonded with? Of course part of the Ring is making him lust for power, but it’s also his only “reliable” (in his mind) source of hope left to save his city.

And so I read Boromir’s (intelligent and thought out, mind you) raving and I don’t feel scared for Frodo, not after reading it so many times and knowing what ultimately happens, but sorrow for Boromir.

[oneluckydragon]

Thinking about how these two met. Get adopted, idiot.

More human!Echo.

[the-lonelybarricade]

Sometimes I want to shake people by the shoulders and scream, you need conflict to make a story interesting!

If every character got along perfectly and acted in everyone’s best interest, that would be unrealistic to the human condition but more importantly—so fucking boring

[herotune]

so much shadow around us. to think we almost missed the light...

(a belated entry for wyll week day 6! favorite ship...i adore them ok)

[herbofgraceandpeace]

Re: Flavian’s outburst to Christopher about how he (Christopher) has been an unfeeling, stuck-up brat—Flavian’s not exactly right or wrong here. I think Jones is demonstrating that Christopher is so caught up in his (very real) powerlessness to control his situation, he doesn’t realize that he DOES have the power to really and truly hurt others. He’s so caught up in his own misery that he (selfishly) forgets that others might be miserable too.

This is part of growing up! Christopher hasn’t really been taught empathy, and he hasn’t really had it modeled for him either, outside of Tacroy caring for him, but that doesn’t excuse his behavior. He’s so focused on how the people at the castle aren’t caring for his conscious wants that he entirely ignores the ways they ARE intentionally and deliberately attempting to care for him (I think at least a little classism privilege is at play in him ignoring the maids—he’s only ever known his parents’ mistreatment of servants, but presumably he should have been paying attention to how the castle folk treat the maids differently)

However, I think the adults at Chrestomanci Castle are guilty of the exact same kind of blindness and self-focus as Christopher. They HAVEN’T been meeting his needs emotionally (which has led to their inability to physically protect him either), and whatever their intentions throughout his stay, they did not try to get to know or understand Christopher as a person at his arrival, and they’re paying for that first impression. He’s a CHILD. a child from an unloving and neglectful home, who’s just been ripped away from his friends and his home at school, a child’s just DIED for the second time, and he’s a child with hopes and dreams and self-will, all of which have just been casually, thoughtlessly stripped from him. The castle folk are so focused on their OWN need of a successor for Gabriel that they treat Christopher as an object to be formed to meet their needs instead of a person with needs of his own. They’re so focused on their search for the Wraith and the hell he’s wreaking on others that they miss the very real hell they’re imposing on Christopher. All of their attempts at care are based solely on their perception of what he SHOULD need and want because! They never! Ask him! What he needs or wants!!!!!

What’s that post about how some people act like “if you don’t give me the respect I think I deserve as an authority figure, I won’t give you the respect you deserve as a person”? I think that’s basically how the otherwise decent and well-meaning adults of Chrestomanci Castle treat little Christopher Chant. Confident in their own virtue, they presume that of course this boy who doesn’t know them will trust them immediately. Confident in their work for the greater good, they are indifferent to the suffering of the individual before them. It’s clear that they care about him and his well-being, but without treating him like a real person at all, and it’s never more obvious than in the scene where Gabriel takes his spare life away. They are taking tangible, drastic steps to protect him because they are very worried on his behalf, but throughout the whole process they have no real knowledge of the horror and terror he is experiencing because they are too busy making choices for him to ask him why he’s making the choices he does (and again, Christopher doesn’t TRUST them. But they never empathize with him enough to realize that.) Another example is how Miss Rosalie and the others keep chasing Throgmorton away from Christopher when he’s laid up. They’re so focused on how uncomfortable Throgmorton makes them feel that they don’t care at all they’re isolating Christopher and depriving him of his only companionship.

But none of their bad conduct exonerates Christopher of Flavian’s charges of being rude and unfeeling towards them, even though Flavian is STILL presuming to know and understand Christopher’s motivations and choices despite being completely in the dark about them. The very personhood Christopher wants the others to acknowledge in him is the reason that Christopher is responsible for his own actions towards the castle folk.

And that’s the tea on human responsibility in The Lives of Christopher Chant. (thanks for coming to my ted talk)

[guayabana]

elden ring attracting so much attention from audiences that usually wouldn't touch a fromsoft game has been so annoying when it comes to discussions about its story.

like maybe ironic considering grrm was involved in the writing this time, but the response to elden ring & specifically SOTE feels very similar to what happened with game of thrones, where the story is pretty explicitly about the dangers & violence & cruelty inherent in certain systems of power, and 95% of the audience response is to look at that & be like "wow i hope my fave character gets to be the good ruler who fixes everything because they're so cool & nice :D"

[shorthaltsjester]

i do not want to dig a hole but i am too much of a laura bailey pc enjoyer to not make this post so:

selfishness ≠ a lack of kindness 

selfishness is a theme that has come up with all of laura's main campaign pcs. that doesn't mean that her characters are always making selfish choices or that they don't care about the rest of the people they're with or that they're not good. it's just that, for the most part, the first thing they're thinking of when they take action or make choices is themselves. 

in jester and vex both it is more typical and obvious selfishness. vex's developed because she needed it to keep herself and vax alive and as safe as possible and it grew into a behaviour that she had to actively work to avoid. it's evident in her greed, her theft of the broom, her reaction to her own death which relied heavily on i'm okay/i survived to which keyleth reminded her that she wasn't the only one who had to witness and reckon with her death. in jester's case, she grew up in an environment that literally trained her to make every decision based on two things - her mother's opinion and her own. so, when she's out in the world without marion for the first time, her choices are those that will benefit her and her actions are those that consider her own thoughts and not really many others' (aside from the traveler's). 

it isn't a criticism of either vex or jester to say that they are characters who act selfishly. in fact, i'd argue that to claim otherwise does a great disservice to exactly how immense both of their character arcs are. because the nuance of both jester and vex is that they are selfish, and they also hold extreme room for self-sacrifice and empathy. vex is much more brash than jester is, and jester is much more trusting than vex, but both of them are characters who begin with selfish impulses who grow with them. neither ever truly shed those impulses, but they use them in new ways, typically transforming them into impulses towards things that are in the best interest of the party. 

you may have noticed the lack of imogen in this post about laura bailey pcs and that's because of two reasons. one, we are an unknown amount of time into her story, i can't analyse her development the same way i can vex and jester's. two, imogen's selfishness isn't the blatant quasi-self-aware selfishness that we see in things like jester complaining about her lack of money to caleb or vex stealing a broom. instead, imogen's is very internal, like a lot of laura's character work with imogen. it is a bit similar to jester’s in the sense that it comes from a lack of awareness moreso than vex’s practiced behaviour, but imogen’s is a lot more tied to inherent beliefs she has about the world and the people in it.

as a consequence of her powers, imogen sees people's thoughts as their entirety, she holds it above their actions to be the truth of who they are - to act against what they think or to say something that doesn’t cohere with what they’ve thought is akin to lying, so for her to act empathetically is to act in tandem with what someone else’s thoughts are, not how they act, which is typically not all that wanted. the same as vex’s greed and jester’s naivety, this is a trait that makes narrative sense and it’s one i find quite compelling, especially when read in the vein of someone struggling through trauma that has made them assume that the world is against them. imogen’s cynicism is coherent cynicism, i can’t say that in a similar situation i wouldn’t have the same predisposition towards the world.

the part that is particularly self-interested comes in if you look at how imogen has actually been treated in the campaign (quite well) in comparison to the cynicism that she’s developed from her past (something that speaks to a world out to get her). certainly, a bunch of shitty things have happened to imogen in the time we’ve known her, but the same can be said for everyone in bell’s hells and pretty much everyone in exandria at this point in time. but, in a fight to save the aforementioned world, imogen’s focus was getting her mother back on her side. which, while very consistent with her character and a choice that i enjoy, is a very selfish one. the fun thing (to me, obviously) about imogen is that she has, more than most, an insight into the opinions of others and she also tends to seek others’ opinions out and genuinely engages with them and supports their choices. but she still very much acts towards what she thinks is best. it’s one reason i enjoy looking at the dynamic between her and orym as one between foils, as orym tends to be stalwart in his beliefs and doesn’t care too much for other’s opinions if he’s already sure of his own, but his actions tend to favour collaboration and protecting others.

as i mentioned earlier, imogen is a harder case to look at because she is still in the process of her story. however, the circlet is clearly influencing how she interacts with the world and in the wake of the solstice, the hostile reaction towards ruidusborn people has started to become more and more apparent and i’m interested to see what route that ends up leading imogen down and how it will influence her relationship with the rest of bell’s hells. (for better, i think, based on recent conversations, but if it's for worse i will be just as seated and excited).

all of this is just to say, please stop assuming that claiming a character has a trait you think is a bad one is criticism or a hate post. in light of the fact that i know that people who don’t believe this will continue to not believe this, i’ll encourage anyone confused about the ability of a character to be good and kind and selfish all at once to look to what the text itself says, specifically scanlan’s words to pelor when asked what vex means to him:

“Her name is Vex, and she is greedy and mean sometimes, and she can steal a lot. She’s a little bit not the greatest person, but her flaws highlight everything that is right about her, which is she does all these things to protect her friends and her family. She would give her life for any of us and for anyone who was truly in need. And she’s not perfect but she’s the most perfect of all of us.”

would you look at that... an ability to be a multitude of things, some in conflict with one another. i know that's hard for fandoms to believe, especially about female characters with agency, but i promise its true!

[sunsetcougar]

It’s like 2 in the morning but here we go! This is probably one of the most anti posts I’ll ever make, I’m generally not the type to post about things I dislike, but this has been on my nerves for a while. Alastor is annoying and the fandom makes it worse.

Like he had the potential to be such a cool character but he kind of comes off as just like, trying too hard to be creepy. Like a middle schooler wanting to be weird and scary and edgy. It’s so obvious to me that all he’s doing is posturing because either he’s that overconfident or he knows he’s outclassed by a lot of people.

The fandom didn’t help with my view of him either. When I was first introduced to Hazbin the people who did so painted a neat picture. I love manipulator characters, watching them pull the strings to make everything fall into place according to their whims is entertaining, so I started out really interested in his character.

Then I started poking around the fandom and found… a bunch of people who fell for his mediocre, middle schooler esc manipulation. (I try not to judge simps since I’m aro and don’t experience those emotions, but some of ya’ll…)

The only time I genuinely enjoyed seeing him on screen was when Adam was beating his ass. Every other time he was just annoying.

Like Adam for example is a horrible person but he’s not annoying, he’s entertaining. Alastor could have been a horrible man but incredibly entertaining, but he’s not.

(Related note, I’ve worked with kids and watching Alastor and Vox fight kind of reminds me of that… Alastor and Lucifer too.)

Okay I’m going to sleep now

[agerasiaa]

Hazbin Hotel ep 5 and 6 spoilers!

I’m sorry but WHAT was that? I loved the first 4 episodes even when I could agree they were a little rushed and introduced us to way too many new characters without really letting us see the main cast. But the new eps were next level. Introducing characters, past reveals, lore left and right. All emotional moments have zero weight because they come out of nowhere. No one is having an actual arc— stuff just happens faster than you can chew the stuff that happened 1 minute before.

Alastor suddenly claiming him and Charlie have a father-daughter relationship? Like yeah he was probably just doing that to piss off Lucifer (WHO HE HAS NO REASON TO DISLIKE AS MUCH AS HE JUST DOES? it’s so funny) but we have literally seen Charlie and him interact like what? Once in the first ep and suddenly they have a dynamic that hasn’t developed at all to how they act around each other. And this is just one example of the many problems I have with the new eps…

The hotel is helping Angel. HOW? We have seen no actual redemption stuff that would help someone out of drug addiction or change his attitude. The one that helped was Husk and the only thing he did was have one conversation with Angel and suddenly Angel has gone through sooo much character development—even standing up to Valentino who he has no reason to suddenly not fear. (To be fair, it has been probably a few months since the events of ep four, but for a watcher it doesn’t feel like that. So the development seems a little sudden.)

Other notes:

Heaven having no rules who gets to heaven and who not, and no one just ever questioned it

Why are we even introduced to Heaven yet? Many types of reveals that happen are not season 1 material at all (or it would be if they had more episodes)

Charlie and Lucifer had a distant relationship and Charlie supposedly had ”daddy issues” and then they are just— so happy with each other and everything is resolved SO EASILY / FAST

The whole premise of the Hotel seems to be meaningless. Charlie’s great plan for redemption was… trust falls. Didn’t work. Now they must get to Heaven bc how could that be!? Like girl…

Everyone needs their own episodes! Lucifer and Alastor and Mimzy stuffed together. Vaggie and Angel Dust again and the entirety of heaven all together in a 20 minute episode—

I really wanted to love this show because I’m invested in the characters due to waiting 4 years, but it’s just… it’s so badly written. The actual plot is likeable, but the pacing and the amount of off-screen stuff is just too much. (From episode 1 to 6, 5 months have passed, but it feels more like a couple of weeks at best.)

(I still love the show tho. For the songs and the characters.)

[steampunk-cowboy]

The beauty of Trigun is realizing that neither the protagonist or antagonist is right actually

[agentc0rn]

Teal Mask: Kieran’s desire for strength - not just becoming strong as a trainer but also as a resilient individual in general. *LONG THREAD WARNING*

Just wanted to contribute further to the teal mask content and all that juicy stuff. As we all know, we all have unfortunately witnessed a poor boy’s down-spiral character arc. It is evident that Kieran wants to attain strength to become a stronger trainer and person as a whole. He outright states that he wants to become independent, capable, and reliable at some point. His motivation and source of support - ogerpon -  more so the legend version of ogerpon than the “real” ogerpon, was once a common innocent fixation that many of us probably had/have in our lives, that was then tragically turned to an unhealthy obsession. It became a poor coping mechanism and desperate means of proving himself that pushed him towards reckless methods and mannerisms.  

Parallels with Loyal Three

I mentioned in the comment section of one post that his desire for power parallels with Okidogi. Additionally, he shares similar sentiments with Fez and Munki. He wants to be “cool” like the ogre (achieve a cool status that of a hero, admired for their strength) and seeks knowledge on the ways to succeed like us - he wants to know how to become stronger -  “why can’t I be like you?”. This is shown through his tactics, team member swaps and appearance change at the end. 

Foils with other characters

I find it sad how as Ogerpon learns to open up, heal and receives support, Kieran does not have a proper, stable one since the start - his sister has supported him in some ways of course, but her attitude/actions likely has also contributed to his sense of inferiority. Thus, the combination of misunderstanding, cultural norms, strained familial relationships, miscommunication, and self inflicted misjudgments have pushed him further down the hole. It’s almost as if he is the foil of Nemona (yet also alike) in terms of how strength as a social arbiter determines one’s worth and outlook. Nemona became so strong but at a social cost; no one wants to compete or keep up with her and misreads her passion (likewise with Kieran and his interest in history). She just wants someone to battle with with all of their efforts and enjoy the battle the same way she does, which she does not mind losing. On the other hand, if you’re weak then you would likely get made fun of or ignored, which we see Kieran has internalized that idea through his accusations of us and Carmine laughing behind his back (perhaps this is a common concept that runs in blueberry academy? Competition and becoming the best are of utmost importance). Moreover, he is, in a way, a foil of Arven in ascribing to a legend and superstition - except Arven learns to embrace support after being alone for so long, heals and accepts korai/Mirai, while Kiki feels further isolated, loses grasp of who Ogerpon really is by going against her boundaries and runs away from opportunities of support. As for Penny, it is clear that they share a reclusive nature and willingness to not conform to, but to confront social standards. Penny takes self accountability for her actions, whereas for Kieran, while he does apologize at times and keeps his word - soon gets lost in a convoluted, distorted sense of right and wrong (him stealing the teal mask, and him not wanting to join the mask retrieval mission may seem selfish at first, but it could be that he didn’t want to be a burden as well as be seen sulking). He unfortunately (would) becomes the antagonist or better yet, the oni in our path.

Peach Symbolism

On another hand, kieran may be the peach boy in a sense but reverse. His actions and desire fulfilled the required conditions for the resurrection of the loyal three (desire for “revenge”) and thus indirectly leads them to endanger Ogerpon.  In one of my previous posts, I wrote a poem about how Kieran's dreams were sweet like peach, but then got crushed. And like certain fruits, it has seeds that contains some poison but not at a dangerous level (unless consumed at high amount ofc), which ties to the toxic chain and dokutaro that has been theorized to be external influences partially responsible for his behaviour.

Hero + heroic values

Finally, that one part when he says you’re like the hero of the story (that line goes hard and breaks the fourth wall, it’s been mentioned a lot in visual works on pixiv and social discourses), is a dealbreaker of his wish to keep his new friendship. Despite the portrayal of him hating the player (through memes which I do laugh at, and artworks/ discussions which I agree while sad about it) I think he is mad at us for sure, but not spiteful. Or maybe slightly. I think above all, he is mad at himself;  he constantly faces inner turmoil  to overcoming his helplessness, insecurity, and the process of revising his dreams and outgrowing his old ones. He had to forfeit his one childhood dream and now recognizes that he has to change in some way (albeit a bit extreme). In an ironic way, he would likely become his idealized version of strength, like "his" ogerpon - a strong “oni”- aka champion of bb academy. But again, while physical strength is a quality emphasized many times, Kieran wants to grow mentally strong to endure losses and humiliations both as a trainer and individual (ex. he is told down by his sister as seen in the beginning). He wants to be appreciated and not looked down as someone who is meek, weak and cowardly, which he tries so hard to build himself up on the virtues of a hero. He values honesty and a fair fight and tries to fulfill them to "earn" respect from people + ogerpon as a trainer. And maybe, that is when he feels that he is equal on par with you, and that he can be considered good enough to be our friend.

I really feel a lot for Kieran, because I do see myself in him (not in an obsessive way though) - hated losing, shy, hyerpfixations… I see his good traits and flaws - he is curious, sensitive, empathetic, has a critical mind of mainstream narratives but is also insecure and stubborn. I see too much simplistic takes on them (Kieran is narcissistic victim, Carmen is abusive,etc), like I get some aspects of the ideas, but saying that in a deterministic way does not define the character at all…

[crosshairslongasslegs]

they cannot make me hate you sol

[ilynpilled]

Have you seen that post on how Cersei pushing Jaime into forcing sex on her is an abuse technique on her end?

no, but i checked his tag now lol. while i know that george explicitly expressed that the sept scene was intended as consensual by him, i still believe that jaime’s pattern of pushing to have sex with cersei, and how, speaks of an unhealthy relationship with consent in this relationship on his part too, a lack of respect for boundaries on his part, as well as objectification on his part that cannot be removed from the context of this society’s gender dynamics, especially when it concerns cersei’s themes and her character (to contextualize and expand on what i mean, heres a very quick collection of quotes regarding how jaime’s relationship to cersei, sex, swordplay, and even violence blend or function similarly in relation to very heavy dissociative tendencies):

i understand the jc dynamic’s set up:

“She has never come to me, he thought. She has always waited, letting me come to her. She gives, but I must ask.”

“She wanted to draw his face to hers for a kiss. Later, she told herself, later he will come to me, for comfort. “We are his heirs, Jaime,” she whispered. “It will be up to us to finish his work. You must take Father’s place as Hand. You see that now, surely. Tommen will need you . . .”

i also understand how george seems to establish communication and patterns within this dynamic that reinforce his expressed intention, which is also apparent in a scene that a third party witnesses and how that mirrors the sept, and i obviously also do not think these two would do all of this healthily and establish things akin to safe words (lmao) (though i take issue with a lot of things here still when it comes to grrm and how consent is framed):

and i understand george framing cersei utilising sex, or even love and affection, as a means to have power, and that being a big factor in this relationship’s dynamic and how she takes control (see instances when cersei does initiate— jaime’s narration is not entirely correct, we know of the inn, which is unique but important, so it is interesting that he chooses not to connect this until feast, that would mean confronting something he doesn’t want to— and what motives she has: “She smiled for him, so sweetly. “Do you remember the first time I came to you like this? It was some dismal inn off Weasel Alley, and I put on servant’s garb to get past Father’s guards.” “I remember. It was Eel Alley.” She wants something of me. “Why are you here, at this hour? What would you have of me?” His last word echoed up and down the sept, mememememememememememe, fading to a whisper. For a moment he dared to hope that all she wanted was the comfort of his arms.”

but i do not think that changes much about the issues on jaime’s part, or how patriarchal hegemony works, or how a lot of fandom frames cersei. we know cersei only enjoys sex with jaime (it is sex that is categorized as different from lancel, osney, taena, and robert — all of these also cannot be conflated for obvious reasons — by her), she says so, but that doesn’t change that she still believes that it is her only source of power and means through which she can reach equal ground within her society. we can understand why cersei thinks and functions this way: we understand how she was reared and how she was viewed as a sexual object and a tool for political transactions with no autonomy since childhood by every adult around her. we see how and why jaime is needed by her to feel “whole”, and how he is her “sword.” it is also not difficult to acknowledge that while the abusive dynamic is not what i would consider equal: jaime does not verbally berate her to the degree she does him, does not physically hit her and throw things at her, does not use her or emotionally abuse her the way that she does him (and no, i personally do not agree with people that say they are equally terrible to each other or they equally benefit from this relationship), jaime still ultimately has some power over her due to his gender (the physical is obvious, but on top of that this is a medieval society with extreme levels of gender inequality), and nothing will really erase that because this relationship does not exist in a vacuum. this is not diminished by how this relationship functions, her status as queen and jaime’s status as her kg, and other variables that play into the unequal power dynamic. it will always have to be acknowledged that cersei is a woman + everything that comes with that being the case in a medieval society with complete patriarchal domination. i also think the unhealthy belief system of “we are one. you are me. i am you. we are two halves of a whole” will have effects on the understanding of consent and how both parties function in the relationship. i think this extreme delusion would lead to a plethora of issues when it comes to consent and boundaries. with cersei too, the moment she (including her offering sex) is rejected by her “other half” she emphasizes and says things like “you swore that you would always love me.” and “i was a fool to ever love you” or starts verbally berating him, emasculating him, being ableist etc. this relationship operates on some absurd conditions and ultimatums, it is not healthy, hence things like “the things I do for love” too. in reality, it really is the opposite of “unconditional destined lovers.” both of them have things that they end up prioritizing over the other, and both have an incorrect idea of the other that fits their specific needs and wants. i just despise this whole “cersei groomed and manipulated jaime since they were children” bullshit. a child is not capable of this. teenaged cersei was navigating the strict and dehumanising boxes that her father and society forced her into since she was 7 years old. she looked to her brother for comfort and escape as much, if not in many ways more at this point, as he did. i also think cersei escapes into the relationship to subvert those societal patterns in many ways (i have seen people discuss that jaime views her as an equal and a person more so than others: “If I were a woman I’d be Cersei.”) but this still does not change the flaws that jaime has. he is not only a man in westeros, he was also reared by tywin lannister lmao. he is a misogynist with a skewed understanding and view of a lot of things. no point in denying this.

and all this aside, i also understand “mutual abuse is not real”, and understand the damage ignoring that can do to narratives revolving around victims of abuse, and the issue with framing ‘retaliation’ or ‘bad victims’ as mutual abuse (see discussions regarding robert and cersei for example and some of the putrid narratives that come out of that), but we are talking about fiction and its themes, discussing an author’s known intention and execution of that intention (that we can also criticize), as well as what is written in a text, and i do not think we should be ignoring the nuances when it comes to applying a modern lens to a medieval society with some very different and more severe and strict paradigms when it comes to gender inequality and the oppression of women.

here are george’s actual comments that i do not believe contradict the bulk of my perspective either tbh: