#//It's so much introspection which I love to write but he's just like 'let's go all the fucking way in.'

[recurring-polynya]

Ranking my Habitual POV Characters, from Easiest to Hardest to Write

Renji. Too easy, actually. He's a yapper. I love him, tho, he is my favorite narrator and I would never write anyone else if I could get away with it.

Byakuya. I hate this for me, too. He is a man of few words, but internally, he is also a giant yapper. Uses all the fun words you can't use irl or people will know you are autistic, like "repast" and "phantasmagorical".

Orihime. Also very fun to write! Sometimes insists on honorifics. A minor yapper.

Uryuu. Easy, but not exactly fun to write. I just gotta let my brain go into full-anxiety mode and ride the wave. It works, but, like. I write fanfiction so I don't have to listen to my brain's anxiety barf, please and thank you.

Rukia (present day). She would be a lot lower on this list if I didn't have a ton of practice and spend twenty hours a day thinking about her.

Ichigo. I don't write him very much because he's already got a whole manga about him, but he is fine and remarkably well-behaved as characters go. Also an internal yapper, worse than Orihime but not as bad as Renji.

Hinamori. The only problem with Hinamori is that she uses an entirely different naming scheme for everyone she knows than anyone else on this list and also often insists on honorifics.

Chad. Very pleasant to write, but much slower than other characters because he very carefully considers everything he wants to say before he says it, including his own internal narration. Says exactly what he means to say, no more, no less.

Kira. I am perfectly neutral on writing Kira-POV, I just think he's more fun from the outside looking in.

Have I ever written a Hitsugaya pov? I don't remember, but I feel like he should go here.

Inuzuri Rukia. What happens to Inuzuri Rukia is no one's business but her own. It is certainly not mine, the author.

Ikkaku. The problem is that I am a yapper, so every time I write Ikkaku having any sort of insight or introspection, I have to roll it back at least twice. His narration is just the thoughts that occur to him, completely in the moment, absent any sort of analysis. I could never. Doesn't use any of the fun words. Writing Kenpachi-dialogue is this, but even moreso, which is why I avoid him as much as reasonably possible.

(if you're a fanficcer and want to make your own list, please do!)

[kingspuppet]

I can't believe it took me literal hours to write a single reply. I'm just gonna roll around on the floor now to become one with my carpet. Don't mind me.

[meanbossart]

I appreciate how you write Astarion so, SO much. I feel like way too many fic writers infantilize him to a point where I honestly start wondering if I'm the one who misinterpreted him so badly.

I'd love to know more about what you think of his character and his arc. Personally I saw him and immediately went "oh god this guy is gonna be the irritating tumblr sexyman of the year🙄" and it took me until Araj basically to warm up to him. What were your initial thoughts and did they change much while playing the game?

OH thank you so much!!! That's a shame if it's the case, and a little surprising to me, to be honest! While he's definitely written be an aloof jerk a lot of the time, I always found him to be surprisingly mature and introspective whenever he's not dishing out witty remarks. He comes off to me as the kind of person who learned to benefit from seeming dumber than he actually is, overall.

HAHA I had a VERY similar experience, not just towards Astarion but all the characters, really (I really disliked Shadowheart at the beginning, too). I had only seen pictures of him and pretty much expected a vapid character that was being carried to stardom because of a talented VA - and because people go nuts for anne rice style vampires lol.

While I was definitely enjoying his voice lines from the start (Again kudos to Neil) I definitely wasn't expecting much else. He piqued my interest after so devastatingly turning my character down at the tiefling party without me even having inquired, and that's when I, the gamer, was like "well, alright, I GOTTA fuck this guy now" (this is also where DU drow's personality began to come out as you can probably guess)

Obviously, if you have two neurons to rub together you can gather pretty quickly that he's not trying to woo you because you're so interesting and wonderful, so I started getting curious! With that dynamic being so different from what you usually expect of romances in these types of games, plus the charming way in which he is written, I started being won over.

I think what really did it was how gradually his attitude changed when responding to new, mostly trivial dialogue options and doing his greetings as you earned his trust, and ESPECIALLY with how he responds to your tav when you express any kind of fear or insecurity during his romance - which was with a lot of sincerity and confidence in his resolve to support you, and in you as a person, a complete 180 from his usual front - Which, again, makes me all the more surprised to hear that he's often painted with such an immature brush.

And obviously he has a DEEPLY ugly side to him (if you've read ANE, hopefully it's clear that I know this, and that I like to explore it just as much as anything else lmao) but it's very interesting to me how it seem to always come in the form of outbursts, rather than a constant evil-streak, usually followed by a glimpse of self-awareness. It feels very much in line with someone who's actually making a great deal of effort to manage their RAMPANT emotions and going through a lot of internal conflict in the process.

GAH. Yeah if you can't tell by this friggin' thesis I just wrote, I love the way they wrote this character a lot and I was definitely proven PROFOUNDLY wrong in my first impression of him - which, if that's not irony at it's finest I don't know what is.

And as an aside! I also very much appreciate that he's a "queer" coded character who's effeminate (in the Old Homo kind of way, but I digress) and flamboyant, but taken Dead Fucking Seriously. With as much progress as we've made in LGBT rep in media, I still often feel like gay men will only get that kind of treatment for as long as they "Aren't That Gay" (I know Astarion doesn't have a set sexuality - But lets not mince words: stereotypes exist, and he fits into most of them) and as a thin-wristed gay guy who's a little too found of linen shirts, I can honestly say that experiencing a character like that helped me with my own confidence.

[brujahinaskirt]

Okay, I obviously made the above post as a leetle joke, but since it's getting not insignificant traction, I do want to offer a more serious note.

I love this about Arthur. It's probably my favorite thing about him, but let me use this fresh new RDR2 meta post to clarify exactly what I mean. Despite the aspects of his personality & appearance that are traditionally hypermasculine, and despite how often he is annoyed with people (especially incompetents or people who meddle with his plans), Arthur is decidedly NOT annoyed by the social performance of femininity or by traits that are/were frequently stereotyped as feminine. Ever. Regardless of subject. I might go so far as to say he seems to canonically prefer hanging out with women and with "feminine" men.

Your long-winded, bullet-pointed analysis is below!

The Girls. Most noticeably, Arthur actually sits down to talk with and actively confides in the camp Girls (Tilly, Mary-Beth, Karen) more than anyone else around. These three are the most traditionally "girly" (single, 20s, active, pretty, unattached, highly social, feminine, chatty) members of the gang, though of course they are still criminals and don't perfectly adhere to all period-typical standards of feminine comportment. He doesn't mock the girls** like he sometimes does with other auxiliary members of the gang (like Uncle and Pearson, playful or not). Notably, he doesn't even gently tease Mary-Beth for writing her "silly" romance novels, a highly feminized hobby which she speaks about in a self-depreciating manner, much like Arthur speaks about his own artistic hobbies. Rather, he talks to her about writing like a peer and encourages her to write more by going out of his way to get her a nice pen. Crucially, there is no canon romantic or sexual interest in any of the girls on Arthur's behalf. He just feels the most comfortable in their company and seems to value their advice/opinions on life the most. To me, this is much stronger proof than his forever-burning torch for the cultured & ladylike Mary, which is (or was once) rooted in romantic desire. ** Unless the player persists in Antagonizing them, and these lines (while sometimes shockingly cruel and offhandedly sexual in nature; see Arthur teasing Tilly about pursuing Javier) are largely about goading them for laziness or, in Karen's case, her alcoholism. That said, many of the Antagonize lines strike me as clumsily tacked-on & poorly rooted in canon, which could indicate: (1) an Arthur who is deliberately trying to be disruptive (a generous interpretation), or (2) writers instructed to add throwaway content that will make a certain type of childishly misanthropic gamer (think 13 y.o. boys) squeal in glee with relatively low impact on the overall story.

Campmates. Following the above point... who doesn't Arthur hang out with much? The manly men of the gang; the very people social mores suggest he ought to be hanging out with. Bill, Micah, Joe, Cleet, and even Dutch. (To some extent, this includes John and Sean, but I'd say John sort of lives at the edges of gang life anyway, and Sean is, well, Sean.) Conversely, which male gang members does Arthur hang out with a lot? Sweet little bookish Lenny, a wordy, positive-energy, breezy intellectual who has just barely become an adult. Introspective, soft-voiced, long-haired Charles, who is traditionally masculine by some standards (strong, usually calm, can be standoffish) but decidedly NOT so when his appearance/demeanor is judged by the white Christian American male standards that began to dominate masculinity concepts in the later decades of the 1800s.

Algernon. Oh, my, Algernon. Arthur clearly dislikes Algernon's fancy, loud, outrageous clothing. But weirdly, he seems to like Algernon, not just tolerate him. Arthur in fact goes through significant personal discomfort to avoid hurting Algernon's feelings (the awful hat, the POST.MAN. sobbing), and he immediately says yes to having tea with him without any awareness of a coming business proposition, though half the time Arthur clearly has no fucking clue what Algernon is talking about. I am left to conclude that on some level, he just enjoys hearing Algernon talk, which is word-for-word what he says while listening to the Girls argue about romance novels ("I just like listening to you [all] talk." Hello????). I mean, for God's sake, he meets the man while he's choking to death on a nut at a fancy party, and the second thing Algernon does is tell him he looks like a guy who wears a corset. If anything was going to set off the boiling defensiveness of a dude who worships masculinity, thirty seconds with Algie would have done it.

Margaret, Mistress of Fucking Danger. It's pretty clear Arthur doesn't like Margaret. But that has little to do with Margaret's femininity & cross-dressing (this doesn't faze him at all when Charles Châtenay does it; more on that below) and everything to do with Margaret's deceptiveness and highly selective memory. It's not until the bullshittery unveils itself that Arthur starts getting visibly pissed off at Margaret. Conversely, Arthur does seem more positively disposed toward Sally Nash. (That said, this quest has a lot of problems and poorly aged lines that are depressingly easy for a politically motivated jerkoff to soundbite and miscast as Rockstar being pro-bigot. Cue 800 heterobnoxious gamerbro ARTHUR MORGAN ULTIMATE ANTI SNOWFLAKE SIGMA MALE OF THE WEST YouTube videos.)

Albert, my beloved. Rather than goading him to man up, Arthur tries to persuade Albert (whom he very obviously likes) to pick safer animal photography subjects, e.g. horses, and doesn't insult him for his lack of wilderness knowledge (an aspect of traditional manliness that is highly relevant to Arthur's lifestyle). You'd think he would tear into him for this shortcoming, given that they share so many of the same interests and passions, and IMO his genuine eagerness to serve as Albert's protector and facilitate his art is highly convincing evidence that Arthur does not necessarily view masculinity as a net positive.

Arthur is a basic goddamn boyfriend-hater. He pretty much harshly disapproves of every husband, boyfriend, male partner, etc. in the game and is very, very vocal about it... except one extremely unlikely candidate: Beau Gray. Weak, dandy artist Beau Gray, whom Arthur takes one look at and promptly hands the only gun to Penelope. Arthur is curt and impish to Beau at times, but helps him in his relationship troubles willingly (without collecting repayment), and seemingly for no other reason than the fact he can see that soft, fearful Beau is genuinely head-over-heels in love with Penelope. Is he projecting his own young love for Mary onto them? Maybe/probably, but Beau could not possibly be more different from young Arthur, and Arthur seems to believe this difference will make him a good husband for Penelope. A good husband, in Arthur's view, seems to simply be a man who ardently loves his beloved, regardless of his ability to provide for/protect her, and whose only goal in life is to live that life at her side. This is completely antithetical to mainstream late-1800s views on what constitutes a good husband and what it means to be a man.

Châtenay. Arthur shows us some of the most obvious delight and mirth he experiences in the game when he's hanging out with Charles "Allo Boys" Châtenay, who is straight up in drag a third of that time. This baffles Arthur a little, but doesn't disgust or repel him. I've written about this mission elsewhere at greater length because it is one of my favorite disasters, but it's worth mentioning here too.

Trelawny. Arthur clearly enjoys Trelawny despite his grumbly claims to the contrary. Most of these "claims" are just Arthur's established way of affectionate teasing (he does much the same with Uncle and Pearson, both of whom he genuinely likes). His authentic gripes about Trelawny are all about a perceived flightiness/lack of loyalty to the gang, not about his flamboyance. And even these gripes are half-assed, in Arthur's usual way.

Bluegills & Daisy Chains. One of the most genuine moments of softness we have with Arthur in RDR2 is when he takes Little Jack out of the camp to go fishing. Arthur's usually a much truer version of himself when he doesn't have to play the Big Bad Gang Lieutenant role, but this moment of escape is especially important, and not just because Arthur reveals his fondness for children and his natural understanding of how to talk to them. I notice this: Arthur tries to gently teach Jack about fishing, and Jack is completely fucking uninterested. Jack prefers to make flower chains for his mommy. Arthur doesn't scold him for his drifting attention or his lack of attraction to masculine past-times; on the contrary, Arthur goes out of his way to encourage and protect Jack's natural sweetness and innocence. That's a wild stance for a murdering outlaw to have re: the "next generation" of his family. Hell, I've encountered far too many 21st century dads in my own family who flip their shit when their tiny sons prefer hanging out with women & partaking in "womanly" hobbies like art, cooking, and flowers rather than hunting and fishing.

"...and be a god damn man." This seems like classic masculine bluster on the surface, but what does this keynote line mean in the context in which Arthur says it? Well, it's complicated. This statement serves as (a) Arthur's goodbye to John, (b) Arthur's final call to action for John, and (c) Arthur's last wish for his brother's life. But it certainly does not mean standing and fighting or being tough; i.e., "dying like a man." In that moment, it means abandoning all masculine bluster and revenge fantasy, and running away: leaving violence and fighting and brotherhood and all that crap behind to simply be there (alive, present) for your wife and son.

The Best Women People. Who are the best people Arthur knows, by his own crystal-clear declaration? Abigail and Sadie. Sadie's a rough-and-tumble, super-violent gunslinger and Abigail's a stubborn thief & a former sex worker (in the time Arthur has known her), but they are also, critically, two wives: the most traditional feminine role for a woman of the time period (and indeed perhaps most of human history once the concept of "wife" subsumed that of "mother"). It's also important to note that Arthur doesn't truly give up on Dutch until Dutch abandons Abigail, which serves as Arthur's point of no return. The other men left in the gang at this point specifically note that she's "just a woman" and not worth going back for. Arthur is straight-up shocked by all of this; he obviously considers her among the most worthwhile and value-having members of the gang, and certainly one of the most core members of the gang. Without any hesitation or doubt, the instant it's clear Dutch is cutting Abigail loose, Arthur declares: "That's that, then."

tl;dr: Arthur unironically prefers hanging out with women and queens and I love that for them.

[mazeinthemiroh]

han jisung boyfriend headcanons.

genre: romance, fluff

word count: 0.6k

warnings: not proofread

song rec: love me harder by ariana grande

please like and reblog if you enjoy :)

han jisung.

i've been thinking about him a lot recently tbh.

he's such a comforting presence, idk. he understands people in a way other people cannot. perhaps that is down to his own introspection - dwelling and reflecting on himself is a habit he has maintained throughout his life. but with this comes with deep social awareness, which is a talent and skill in itself.

which is why i think he would be a pretty perfect boyfriend. he can read you so well, find out what makes you laugh, what makes you cry, what makes you tick. he can find out the smallest things, the intimate details, and he can find them out very quickly!

his one sole purpose in life is to make you happy. so getting you to smile at him or laugh at his jokes. and if he succeeds? his heart flutters each time without fail, and he feel immensely proud of himself.

he's so soppy with you. just wants to cuddle you and never let go, ever. mornings are hard because thats when be has to leave your grasp and accept that he won't be seeing you for a whole day. that's why nights are his favourite, when he can come home and settle in your arms again, clutching onto you like a koala bear. he can be clingy at times but never expose that little secret to the other members because they will rip him to shreds 💀

totally writing songs about you. i feel like that's just a given, really. he writes about his feelings in such a poetic and eloquent and real way, and when his life starts to become dominated by the feeling of love, he feels he has to capture that and immortalise it in his songs. so writing about how you make him feel, how he cares for you, how he forgot what life wa like without you, in his usual genius way, then he will feel very fulfilled as an artists and a lover.

he's definitely comfortable to ask for your advice on things. he genuinely shares his feelings to you and opens up to you in a way he won't do with anyone else. that's what he views soulmates are for!

appreciates the little things you do for him. he expects no grand gestures or outward declarations of love. rather, little things like taking care of him when he's sick or sending him cute little messages to let you know you're still thinking about him - yeah, that stuff means much more to him.

dates with him would include:

anime dates - his ideal night is just to get his favourite takeaway food, snuggle in his bed with you and binge an anime. it's become a very traditional occurances for you both and it never stops making him feel relaxed and grateful for having you by his side. you guys sometimes talk over whole episodes and have to rewind because you've completely missed a pivotal part of the series.

spontaneous trips - not exclusive for dates but he just loves saying 'yk what, let's go out tonight!' you don't know where or how or why but you end up in the best of places. theme parks, arcades, sometimes you end up in a completely different town or city!

café dates - in more simpler conditions, he finds comfort in ordinary things in life. while he loves going off in spontaneous trips with his favourite person, he also appreciates the mundane things in life. coffee dates may be simple and cliché, but he thinks it's cute, plus a convenient way to catch up during his lunch break.

[will80sbyers]

STurn (around look at what you see!)

or, the post where I speculate about Finn's playlist STurn being a series of hints for Mike's arc in season 5 and how this brings us to Byler endgame in the finale!! This is all speculation for fun, I don't know if it was intended to be a playlist about byler but there are so many things that make me think so and we have too much free time before season 5 so why not talk about it....

WARNING: It's gonna be long lol

Reasons why I think this playlist is about st5:

The name, obviously with ST in it but it also can be used as a play of words with '' turn around look at what you see '' or ST urn which is pretty clever if it's intentional, and I think Finn writes songs pretty often so he would play with words like this IMO

The third song is called '' After the Earthquake '' and the s4 earthquake was pretty important - I also have a theory that there are going to be other earthquakes in season 5 because the two worlds are merging with each other

It seems Finn has a habit of making playlists for the characters he plays and leaving them public

The songs were added 2 weeks ago and this means he was actively filming when he decided to make that

Reasons why I think this playlist is related to Will specifically:

Many of the songs and their meanings make more sense for a queer storyline, and Mike can only have that with Will

The cover of the Beatles song has them all with the same haircut as Will that everybody makes fun of online and I think he may have put it because of that also, I would tbh

The possible ''Turn around and look at what you see'' was sung before the scene in season 3 where Mike and Will are sharing a sweet moment about d&d and there were already plenty of speculations in the byler fandom about how that song was choosen for them... - Rhymes that keep their secrets / Will unfold behind the clouds / And there upon a rainbow / Is the answer to a neverending story

The last song is the same last song in the playlist that was made for Will by the writers during season 2 ... so many ''coincidences''

Now let's start to see what I can theorize from the lyrics of some of these songs...

I already made posts about some of the songs, and it's pretty clear that some of the songs have an obvious queer meaning like the song number 7 :

"Don't ask me to explain" by Of Montreal was written by a bisexual person and has clear hints about sexuality and I quote from that site

« The lyrics of "Don't Ask Me to Explain" by of Montreal present a complex and multilayered exploration of identity, sexuality, and social norms. The singer of the song struggles to connect with others and feel authentic in their own skin. They question whether it's possible to truly know someone else and love them when they are hiding parts of themselves. The line "Who are you hiding you from, across the table with a penny in each eye?" suggests that the person they are speaking to is not being truthful or open with them, and they are struggling to understand why. The singer also shares their own desires and fears, confessing that they would like to marry all of their close friends and live in a big house by the sea. This unconventional desire goes against societal norms and expectations, which is reinforced by the line "I'd really like to, but I'm just too shy". The singer is torn between their desires and the fear of social rejection and judgment. The line "Who will be watching my body when I sleep? Who will I believe in?" indicates a sense of vulnerability and a lack of trust towards others. The chorus repeats throughout the song, serving as a refrain and emphasizing the singer's refusal to explain or justify themselves to others. They feel that they should not be forced to explain or apologize for their desires, beliefs, or identity. Overall, "Don't Ask Me to Explain" is a powerful and introspective song that invites the listener to reflect on their own struggles with authenticity, identity, and societal expectations. »

I think this song fits perfectly for my interpretation of Mike as he doesn't yet know that Will is not being honest with him, and he doesn't get why Will is lying, he can't fully fall for him before he knows the secrets Will is hiding, he's also afraid of going against social norms, but the song to me seems to talk about someone that fights against it and overcomes these fears and wants to be authentic to themselves and that's why they are asking the other person to do the same, I think it conveys a longing feeling like the person wants to let themselves fall for this other person, but the other person is hiding themselves, and they want both of them to be honest about their feelings. In my opinion this song is about Mike wanting to love Will but waiting for him to be honest before that can happen, because he can't fall in love consciously if he doesn't even know it's a possibility- that's why he needs to discover the lie about the painting, but most of all Will must confess his feelings!!!

Here's the line to line meaning, and I'll add byler context lol obviously you have to adapt to the situation, there is not a literal correspondence like I said for the other analysis of the playlists, it's just the general meaning because the songs were not made for byler but in another context, so the details can't be perfect - you just adapt the general meaning with what fits when you choose songs for it:

How will I ever know you enough to love you

If you're hiding who you are?

Don't ask me to explain.

Who are you hiding you from,

Across the table with a penny in each eye?

Don't ask me to explain.

Will must be honest with Mike about who he is and his feelings so that byler can happen, the line about someone hiding from them when they are sitting across the table from them so they can look at them face to face makes me think about the fact that Will in the van lied to Mike to his face directly.

I'd like to marry all of my close friends,

And live in a big house together by an angry sea

in the context of byler this can be interpreted as in Mike's desire to live with Will that's one of his closest friends and live together even if outside the sea of ''normal'' people are angry at them, they are sheltered in the house

Am I the devil's marbles, don't move on without me

Who will be watching my body when I sleep? Who will I believe in? How am I supposed to let it show when I don't even know?

I think in this part the singer is showing that even if they want this person and love them, they are disrupting the peace with their request to be honest and even if they don't want them to move on they are saying that they can't show their love when they don't even know how they feel themselves, could be applied to both Mike & Will

Besides, I don't want to be the one whose coming out first,

I'd really like to, but I'm just too shy

Don't ask me to explain

The singer is asking the other person to ''come out first'' because they are too shy/scared to do it first, obviously it's about asking the other person to come out with their real feelings, but it's clearly a queer phrasing about the ''coming out'' because the song is talking about a queer relationship... and since the person that wrote it is bi I think we can say that with 97% of probability lol

It's so easy to lie to myself

And pretend that I could love you, but I can't

I think this part is about how the singer wants in part to just love them and let go of the need to make the other person be honest, but they can't be truly themselves and be in real love unless both of them are honest, so ''they can't'' just let go of this need, and they keep asking the other person to take that step with them!

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But let's go back, the first song in the playlist is Ballad of a Texas King by Cut Worms and this song fits Mike's fear of the unknown and the changes he will go through in season 5 - his personal arc even not counting Will in the equation, Mike is scared of things changing around him... (this song also briefly mentions California)

As the writer of the song said in his personal site:

On “Ballad of a Texas King” Clarke sings, “Hey kid come along… something is wrong… I believe you know… All this to say, only one way that this can go…” It’s as if he’s reaching out to his younger self, letting him know the changes are inevitable. How do we hang on to a dream? How do we not lose ourselves in a world that is lost? The only way out of a nightmare is to keep going.

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The second song is the one with the cover that reminds us of Will lmao - '' What you're doing to me'' by the Beatles

This song is in the same context as the others about asking your lover to stop lying so you can be with them - Mike asking Will in this context, Mike is his true love

I've been waiting here for you

Wondering what you're gonna do

And should you need a love that's true - It's me

Please stop your lying

You got me crying, girl

Why should it be so much to ask of you

What you're doing to me?

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Song number 3 is "After the earthquake" by Alvvays and I found this online that it's interesting not only for the references to someone in a coma and the earthquake but metaphorically it could be applied to Mike finding out about the painting lie and his world being turned upside down, maybe by a fight with Will that doesn't get resolved because something happens before it can be...

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Song number 4 is Promises I've Made by Emitt Rhodes and I think this could be Mike still pining after Will even after they have their fight, if the fight happens before the time jump maybe he spends one year with Will trying to distance himself/or just not trying anything because he thinks there's no point and Mike trying to repress all his feelings for Will, or alternatively we can say he already started this process after season 3, and he's trying to just repress it but can't

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Song number 5 is '' Angst in my pants'' by Sparks

But when you think

But when you think you've made it disappear

You're sure you made it disappear

And you've still got angst in your pants

I hope it doesn't show

It'll go away (go away)

It's just a passin' phase

It'll go away (go away)

I hope it doesn't show

It'll go away (go away)

Give it a hundred years

It won't go away

pretty self explanatory, Mike is trying to repress his sexual feelings for Will and trying to convince himself ''it's just a phase'' and he's not queer... personally I feel like the song IS about queerness because it's from 1982 and there's a literal man dressed as a woman, like.... pls

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Song number 6 is ''The Better side'' by Audiotree and The Slaps and I couldn't find the text online so I have transcribed it myself but if there's some lyric wrong let me know because I wasn't sure for some words:

You're never gonna see the sun

you're never gonna see me run

and I say oh baby don't make me stay out too late

imma go into sleep I know you'd cry

and I'm trying to keep you by my warmth

You're never gonna see my eyes

You're coloring other skies you want to

and I say Oh baby don't make me do the falling when I'm drinking of you

you're on the better side

you're always the better one for me

I'm trying staying alive, keep my head on the better side when you're far away and you're horny as hell

and you're all that I need

I'm not gonna miss you anymore

I interpret this as Mike pining for Will again and how Will is the better choice for him and the one that he truly needs

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Song number 8 is ''What do you want me to do?'' by Pointed Sticks

This song makes me think about Mike & El and I think it could be sort of a break up song between them although I don't think it's literal but more ''angry after a break up scene - vibes''

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Another song that I think is about Mike x El is ''Substitute'' by The Who, song number 9 :

I interpret this song as a guy that tried to change himself for the girl he likes but he's never enough for her even changing everything about himself - so not a real relationship based on knowing each other deeply and he's tired of pretending to be someone else

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Song number 10 is ''The Rebel Kind'' by Modernettes

I think this song is about someone embracing ''being different'' and wanting to stick with the ''rebel'' kind, the people that rebel to society's standards and expectations, Mike wants to be part of that no matter what happens

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Song number 11 '' Block Rockin' Beats'' by The Chemical brothers... is almost without words but it's funny to me how you could put duffers instead of chemical there lol anyway it could be just a vibe song to prepare for the finale, maybe something action packed happens and this song is good for a fight scene...

right before the ending that as we said before is the same song that Will's playlist had at the end... song number 12 is a love song, a winning the love of your life song!!!

''Just what I needed'' by The Cars has the vibe of a song you would hear at the end of the movie right after the main couple finally gets together and they are happy!

'Cause when you're standin' oh so near

I kinda lose my mind, yeah

oh so you mean...

you'll go crazy (together) ?

[joocomics]

Yo! How'd you know i love the moon?! Haha 🌙 anon fits perfectly, thank you 🫶🏻 I love reading your work, unknowingly you've piqued my interest in Xdinary Heroes too 😆 Love their latest music, will definitely be checking out more. You write beautifully for them too 👌

Anyway, I've come to contribute a thought to your Keeho writings (hopefully). I've been thinking about how Keeho is funny and all, sure, but he's also so introspective and well spoken. Very mature, maybe because he's the leader. So I was thinking of him in a sort of ... Calm Boyfriend x Golden Retriever Girlfriend dynamic. Admittedly I'm not the most girly or cutesy 🥹 So sometimes I daydream about Keeho with a S/O that's a little bit tomboyish, golden retriever-ish, but is also just as sensitive and thoughtful as he is. So much that it makes him look like the calm and quiet one between the two 🙂‍↕️🙂‍↕️ Very self indulgent I must admit...

I would love to hear your thoughts 👀 be it soft and/or hard thoughts ☺️

Have a good weekend! I'm almost done with my readings for uni so you can 100% expect me to drop by more often soon.

- 🌙

i can see him in such relationship! since his field of work can be often overwhelming he would like to have a person in his life that would take his mind off of things and would allow him to tone down his personality in a way; someone who can be fun and playful around him, and not mind it if he’s enjoying their company in silence…

calm bf!keeho would let his golden retriever!gf take him anywhere, anytime… every time you share about a place you’re interested in going to, he plans it right away. doesn’t matter if it’s a restaurant, a trip or any other activity he always makes sure to make it happen because he loves how excited you get whenever you get the chance to explore new things and places. you bring him new experiences and he appreciates that.

during trips you often walk ahead of him with a wide smile on your face, pointing at different cool spots to see and he nods reminding you to watch where you’re going cause it’s crowded. if you’re in a different town or country you haven’t been before he frequently has to pull you towards him by your hoodie or by gripping your backpack when you get too excited cause he’s on edge you may slip away from him.

his friends absolutely love you. some of them may even tease him about how such an ordinary guy like him managed to impress such a fun girl like you. whenever you hang out together keeho always lets you tell all about your trips without feeling the need to join you. he has good skills when it comes to storytelling, but the way you get along so well with his friends makes him really happy, and he doesn’t mind when you’re in the spotlight. he actually really likes it, and has more fun listening to your enthusiasm ringing in the room.

calm bf!keeho with a golden retriever!gf results into lots of skinship… although none of you say it both of you are secretly suckers for the way you always end up touching each other no matter what you’re up to. you like the way his hand always finds yours as you’re out and about - he intertwines your fingers together and you swing your hands back and forth; he loves when you cling onto his arm in the elevator that always makes him pat you on the head; or when you follow him around, wrapping arms around his body from behind while he’s doing something.

༻ nsfw

make out sessions often have banter in the most passionate way which turns the foreplay into one long edging. personally, i see keeho as a switch, he prefers to go with the flow when it comes to sex, and this applies here too. sometimes he dominates, sometimes not so much, one thing that’s for sure is that he loves receiving body worship until he’s left in all kinds of marks.

in bed, i see him really enjoying it when you take your time teasing him. he doesn’t need to admit it cause it’s written all over his face, and the way his body succumbs under your touch says enough. biting, scratching, marking - he stays still with eyes shut in bliss, letting you use him like he’s your toy. your playfulness in addition to your confidence always turns him on, and seeing your lustful smile as you kneel in the middle of unzipping his pants is enough to get him leaking. he slides two fingers into your mouth and takes them out with a smirk after realising you’re already drooling for him. even if you didn’t have oral fixation before you will end up having one after dating him cause he loves having your mouth on him 24/7…

a/n: i’m happy to hear you like ur emoji AND xh! <3 they’re amazing and deserve all the love. tysm for the kind words omg 🫶🏼 i really hope you enjoyed reading my thoughts, it’s my first time writing this dynamic and i’m a bit nervous if it turned out well. i don’t mind talking about it more tho cause i can really see keeho with a s/o like this, it fits him a lot ~ and most importantly, we’re here to indulge in our own fantasies!!

hope you’re having a nice week <3

[batsplat]

yes please write about jorge/valentino's teammate dynamics

right then! so in the interest of reasonable post lengths [ed.: questionable description] and given I've now gotten several asks on this, I've decided to only focus on 2008-10 here (and what preceded it) - which I imagine are also the years of the teammate relationship people are the least familiar with. 2008 is jorge's rookie season and valentino's 'comeback' to reclaim the motogp crown, 2009 is the actual title fight between the two of them, and 2010 is jorge's first premier class title while valentino breaks his leg and signs for ducati. there'll be zero discussion of their second teammate stint here, that's for another day. so let's have a crack at figuring out what their deal was during these years

this teammate relationship was always expected to be a tense one. both valentino and jorge came into this partnership with reputations; both were seen as big characters with big egos. both were looking for very different things from this partnership. in many ways, their rivalry was a lopsided one - not in how good they were as riders, but in terms of the significance of the rivalry for both parties and the degree of their emotional investment... even in how much time they spent thinking about each other. jorge is 20 years old when this partnership starts, about to turn 21, and boy does it show. he is working on establishing an identity for himself. he wants to build up a 'character'. he is trying to figure out who he will be as a person. he does not do this in private; instead, he discusses all of this in publicly available sources, introspective and conscientious to a fault. he is also engaging in this journey of self-discovery with constant reference to valentino. this is a young man who is modelling himself after valentino not just as a rider - but as a person, who is continuously studying what valentino is doing on and off the track to make him so successful in all walks of life. sometimes he wants to imitate valentino, other times he wants to define himself against him, occasionally he deliberately wants to avoid valentino being his reference point at all... but again and again, it comes back to valentino

what we have, then, is a bildungsroman, a coming-of-age arc that jorge is consciously engaging upon. his life is a story - it is one he tells with frequent references to popular culture and its tropes. he is writing the narrative of his life in his own head, and valentino plays a sizeable role in this narrative. a constant reference point, someone to learn from, the rival who jorge will have to beat to come into his own. defeating valentino rossi is supposed to be an important step in jorge's journey. one day, he will ride like valentino (if not better). one day, he will be loved like valentino is (if not more so). one day, he will have the impact that valentino has had on the sport (if not an even greater one). valentino is the established legend who jorge can topple in his ascension - and how could this have worked out any better than for jorge to be his teammate, to be provided with the opportunity to learn from him and measure himself against him from the very start of jorge's journey in the premier class?

obviously, valentino is not doing anything even remotely comparable in jorge's direction. he did not want jorge as a teammate and still does not want him there, but you never really get the sense in 2008 that valentino thinks jorge is going to be his number one problem that year. even when valentino has to upgrade jorge to a more pressing threat in the following year, fundamentally jorge is nothing to valentino apart from just another rival he is determined to defeat. the disparity extends to what they both are looking to get from that partnership. valentino wants to beat jorge. jorge wants to learn from valentino... and also beat him. valentino doesn't particularly want jorge to learn from him, and he's decided it's in his interest to mostly not engage with this kid. there's one or two hints that he's aware of the extent of jorge's interest in him, but either way he's clearly decided he's not going to indulge it. mostly, however, he limits himself to studied disinterest rather than open animosity, with a few of his preferred underhanded tactics thrown in to attempt to exert pressure on his young enemy in their 2009 title fight. it takes until 2010 for the hostility between the two to properly escalate, and eventually it boils over to a point where the partnership did not feel particularly sustainable

in a lot of ways, this is a rivalry that is more interesting from jorge's perspective than it is from valentino's. it is the rivalry jorge uses to come into his own, the one that jorge uses to figure out who he wants to be (and maybe who he actually is). jorge at this stage of his life is poorly socialised, a little awkward, prone to being misunderstood while also overly concerned with how misunderstood he is. his inner circle, who form a deeply questionable support network, are not especially helpful in this regard. the 2008-9 period in particular is a time of real personal turmoil for jorge, which has a destabilising effect and provides an additional source of stress he continuously had to deal with (see here for more information). everything for jorge in those years is so much. it's all intensely lived and experienced - and this is also reflected in how he reacts to everything valentino says and does. for valentino, by contrast, this is essentially nothing more than a professional relationship. we already know who valentino is by this point - and while it is his first truly strained teammate relationship in the premier class, the fact that it would be strained came as a surprise to quite literally nobody. this version of valentino is experienced enough to deftly motivate himself using his rivals, give himself a little fuel by deliberately 'personalising' a rivalry and spurring himself onward with a healthy amount of spite... but ultimately, this is not one of the rivalries where his opponent had the power to genuinely hurt him on a personal level. beyond all the noise and the petty dramatics, what jorge represented to valentino was simply another obstacle. what valentino represented to jorge was a little more complicated

though there is one other way, apart from the teammate angle, in which the jorge rivalry was a new departure for valentino. after all, this was his first real run-in with just how annoying it can be to have a rival who has modelled himself after you and has taken direct inspiration from some of your more unsavoury traits. you either retire a hero or race long enough to become a villain in order to attempt to rid yourself of your most irritating imitators. or something

early scuffles

so, let's get into it. first of all, the fact that valentino did not want jorge as his teammate was absolutely a matter of public record. now, what I'm going to present here is a massively simplified narrative of the 'what was yamaha playing at 2005-07' rider market story. there's a lot we could get into here, a lot of quite frankly contradictory sources to unpick - but to keep things moving, I'm going to skip most of that and present a straightforward version of events. the most important point to remember is that yamaha had good reason to be wary of this partnership from the get-go, with the specific reputations the pair of them had cultivated. valentino was in the process of cooking up premier class feud number three, while jorge had already pissed off several of his lower class rivals (including but not limited to dani, dovi and casey - he got the full set). jorge was also known for being a hard racer back in those days, most notably bagging himself a race ban after motegi 2005 (a race in which by a quirky coincidence valentino also dropped an absolute howler as far as race craft was concerned). years later, he would say it was this ban that made him get his act together as far as riding standards were concerned, but some of his 250cc rivals might have something to say about that.

'He's a tough kid, cheeky,' was the diagnosis of 'The Doctor', Valentino Rossi, during post-season testing for Yamaha at Jerez in November 2007, the first time they had come face to face on a MotoGP track. - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

and of course, there is the fact that jorge was a very highly rated young rider, not least as a result of bagging two consecutive 250cc titles (albeit on a more competitive package than dovi's)... and you were pitting him against the bloke who had dominated the premier class for the first half of the noughties. both were expected to be extremely motivated to assert themselves within that team - and it was clear that jorge was certainly the type of guy who absolutely believed he could beat a seven time world champion first time of asking. not only did people expect this was going to get ugly, they thought it would get ugly fast

^catalunya 2007: jorge's signing had not yet been officially announced, but it was basically common knowledge that it was almost certainly coming. one of these men is more of a natural at smiling at the camera than the other

in one of the interviews from that riveras tobia book (this from december 2007), jorge is asked about valentino wanting to block him as a teammate. here is what he says:

In my opinion, I think it is true that Valentino vetoed the Stoner deal because Colin Edwards was in the team at that time and Valentino also wanted to cover his back by not having a hungry young rider in the same garage. But after Melandri left, Yamaha didn't have a youngster. They had the best, in Rossi, but they also had to look to the future, to his eventual replacement. They were the factory that expressed the most interest in me. To get an offer from a factory that, alongside HRC, is the best in the world - as well as the fact the Yamaha have had better riders than Honda over the course of their history - I can tell you that to get that call and be told that you are their future... that was nice, make no mistake! What Valentino thought about it didn't worry us too much.

jorge is then asked whether he doesn't feel like he should have a "man-to-man chat" with vale about the whole situation:

I'd like to. But I guess we've both got more important things to do than sit down and talk. It's hard to imagine the day when we say, 'Okay, let's sit down and talk.' I'd like to but it's not going to happen. I'd like to be able to learn things from him because he's an interesting person both on and off the track. But it's not to be and that's normal - I'd do the same in his situation. You don't give your food rations to your enemy! If you can avoid it, then you avoid it. If you can stop the other guy from moving forward, do it. But that's as far as it should go. If you can prevent another rider from coming then fine, but you shouldn't wish bad things on anybody. I'd like that to be the philosophy between us.

so, let's just be clear about this from the outset: jorge wasn't harbouring any delusions about how valentino felt about his arrival at that team. his feelings towards valentino at the time weren't conditioned by naivety (well, not in that way, in any case) - jorge knew what valentino was like as a competitor and was prepared for it. if anything, it was this reputed ruthlessness of valentino's that jorge wanted to learn from, but he also knew valentino was not interested in teaching him anything whatsoever. perhaps it's just a way of preparing himself for what was to come, a way for jorge to make the whole situation sound better to himself... but jorge goes as far as to say that he understands where valentino is coming from. this is a young man who has come to believe that valentino is the greatest to have ever raced in the sport. he has decided there's a lot to learn from him - and jorge believes one of the things he can learn from valentino is how valentino treats his rivals. which perhaps was in itself not ideal for everyone involved. jorge looked at valentino being a dick, decided 'yes, that's good and sensible behaviour', and just took it from there

though, again, let's not forget that valentino's teammate relationships up until this point in the premier class hadn't even been an issue! generally, he's gotten fairly good reviews, whether it's the role he took mentoring young honda hopeful nicky hayden after his transition from superbikes or his close friendship with colin edwards. yes, yes, you can say that's because valentino felt less threatened by any of his other teammates (though it's worth pointing out that hayden was seen as very promising and did go on to, y'know, win a title against valentino) - but the point is that valentino was actually pretty short on experience when it came to intra-team feuding in the premier class himself. this is a story the two of them created together, a new flavour of feud for the both of them that they could experience for the first time with each other. brings a tear to the eye, doesn't it

^first group photo at teammates!!

there is another key detail to mention in the run-up to the 2008 season: the wall. rumours of this wall dividing the two sides of the garage started cropping up around the middle of the 2007 season - but it was most likely more of a 'happy coincidence' for valentino than anything deliberately aimed at jorge. over the course of the 2007 season, the first year of the unpopular 800cc bikes, valentino had become increasingly frustrated not only with his bike but also his michelin tyres, which he felt were a liability in his fight against casey on the bridgestones. casey was generally pretty adamant that his rivals were just looking for excuses for their failures, but valentino was flirting more and more with a switch to bridgestones - which was a politically tricky thing to do, given his long-standing relationship with michelin. you do not want to piss off the tyre people, especially not in an era where there was a disparity in the quality of tyres different riders were being provided and there were a lot of vaguely sketch things going on behind the scenes. and, to be clear, there were also races where the bridgestones were clearly the worse tyre to be on... but eventually there was just one too many races where valentino felt he was at a serious disadvantage, one too many where he believed the cards were stacked against him. and so he made the switch

The seesawing fortunes of the tyre manufacturers changed once again; this time Michelin in trouble, for the second consecutive year at the rollercoaster Californian track. Valentino was Michelin's top finisher in fourth, but a massive 30 seconds behind winner Stoner, who increased his championship advantage to 44 points. "From Laguna we knew that the championship was already finished," he said at the end of the year. "Today the difference between us and Bridgestone was too big, " he said after [Laguna Seca 2007]. "A tyre should be an instrument in racing, not the deciding factor. People are fans of bikes and riders - Ducati or Rossi or Stoner - but they're not fans of Bridgestone or Michelin. Racing like this is pretty frustrating, but there's nothing we can do." In fact there was. This was when he started talking with Bridgestone about using their tyres in 2008. - from Oxley's 'Valentino Rossi: All His Races'

and of course, tyre manufacturers don't want to be sharing data with each other, so they are the ones to insist on a wall if two riders within the same garage are on different tyres. the point here isn't to rehash late noughties tyre politics - it's that when valentino made this choice, frustrating his new teammate really will not have been his number one priority. on the surface, then, valentino's decision was motivated solely by his desire to beat casey stoner on his ducati with his bridgestones. the tyre switch is less 'kill two birds with one stone' and more 'kill one bird with one stone, but don't complain when the stone subsequently drops down and gives the other bird a concussion'. there is one source out there that suggests valentino insisted jorge would have to use michelins - if so, then my guess is that jorge didn't know about it because his biography would surely have mentioned it. you could also argue that it would be odd from yamaha to agree to this, if their lead rider was so sure that the michelins weren't up to scratch - but since we don't have firm facts either way, let's move on

the most important bit is that valentino had a free and easy excuse to enforce some nice and healthy boundaries (by building a literal wall) and maintain his personal space (plus keep his lovely data for himself). but of course, nobody knew at the start of 2008 whether valentino's decision to switch to bridgestones would be vindicated. and valentino had a lot to prove going into that year... losing one title can happen to anyone, losing two is quite another story. the general consensus was that a lot of bad luck had been involved in valentino's failure to win the 2006 title, but 2007 was a little harder to explain. sure, as casey will happily remind you, many people attempted to discredit casey's championship that year - but valentino at the very least was entirely aware of how dangerous his young rival was. and valentino publicly lost another battle in his inability to stop jorge from being signed from his beloved yamaha. he was now 29 years old and it was a serious possibility that his best days might be behind him, that he had won all the championships he was going to win - still a very successful career, of course, one that had many label him the greatest of all time, but one that might have already seen its brightest days. was the switch to the bridgestone tyres a clever move or a sign of desperation? it was certainly a risk... valentino had spent the entirety of 2007 bemoaning the disadvantage he had because of the tyre difference from his title rival - which meant that now he was down an excuse if he lost again to casey. and not just casey... dani, too, on michelin tyres had outperformed valentino by a single point in 2007 (albeit under pretty unfortunate circumstances). and if, worse still, valentino's rookie teammate managed to beat him... well, then valentino's grasp on the sport might well and truly be slipping

and what was valentino's response to all this pressure? well, simply put, it was to shut up and get to work. publicly, he never slipped from his confidence in his tyre switch gamble - even though initially it looked like he might have made a massive blunder. his rookie teammate qualified on pole at his very first premier class race in qatar... and while initially valentino was fighting at the front of the pack, he slipped down the order to finish a lowly fifth. jorge finished on the podium and seasoned bridgestone aficionado casey took another win at the circuit. valentino insisted the tyres weren't the problem, that he simply had to figure out the set-up to make the bike work with them, and continued on in his stride. second race is in jerez and once again jorge qualifies on pole. after the practise sessions that weekend, he is the heavy pre-race favourite... but in the end, dani had both yamaha riders beat - and valentino managed to get the better of his teammate this time

^this is the spanish king handshake podium by the way, after the dani/jorge handshake refusal at qatar. heartwarming: local dickhead accidentally ends up spending time with two men who hate each other more than they hate him

in estoril, jorge again bagged pole position, making it three poles to start his rookie season - and this time, he converted it to his first win, scrapping with valentino in what actually counts as proper racing for the first half of the race (far from guaranteed in that era). valentino came home for third place after both jorge and dani, who were the joint championship leaders at this stage. and still, valentino was talking a big game about trusting the process, determinedly publicly unfazed by his early season results. it helped that the defending champion casey was having a pretty nightmarish time of it after the race win in qatar... and, really, valentino probably still saw him as his main threat, whatever the championship standings were saying. as long as valentino was consistently bringing home points - if he eventually clicked with the tyres, then the rival he was probably always going to be worried about above all others was casey

VR: "The situation is very much in evolution. I had good grip from the beginning but I knew I had to ride very smooth to save the tyres." JB [his crew chief, speaking about the switch to Bridgestone]: "I think it's the best thing we've ever done. Valentino is very happy - he can ride the bike the way he wants to ride the bike. With a little more work everything will come our way." - from Oxley's 'Valentino Rossi: All His Races'

the excerpt above is what valentino and his crew chief were saying after estoril. "the best thing we've ever done"... you'll note the rhetoric here is pretty bullish - valentino and his team are not willing to countenance failure. it's this kind of thing that really forms the foundation for the move to ducati, the first major roll of the dice that didn't work out. but here, valentino seemed happy to believe he was making progress - and publicly there was no real sign of animosity between the yamaha riders at this stage. which actually made valentino the exception amongst the aliens. jorge wasn't slacking as far starting drama in his rookie season was concerned, and he'd managed to seriously piss off both dani and casey within four races. jorge wasn't making snide remarks about 'the championship's starting now' in valentino's direction to the best of our knowledge. and remember, three races in, valentino was the only alien who had not yet won a race that season. unlike, say, casey, he was also very much not the defending champion. did jorge in his youthful cockiness and self-confidence believe that he essentially already had valentino covered? well, we don't have any proof either way, but from third party descriptions of jorge from the time, it wouldn't exactly be surprising if he secretly believed he had already gotten the measure of his teammate. and if he did believe as much, it also wouldn't be surprising if valentino was aware of jorge's attitude. we can't be certain - but crucially, jorge refrained from openly saying anything controversial about valentino and valentino alone

^save me jorge lorenzo cunty lollipop.... jorge lorenzo cunty lollipop save me... jorge lorenzo cunty lollipop...

so they were committed to keeping the pace, but everyone knew the estoril win and what it said about that particular teammate dynamic mattered. jorge was beating valentino, he was ahead of valentino in the championship standings, it was time for contract negotiations... and while jorge already had his business sorted out until the end of 2009, valentino's contract still needed to be renewed

The significance of Lorenzo's win should not be underestimated. With the balance of power now shifted in Yamaha's favor, The Doctor may well be forced to take a pay cut, from the rumored 12 million euros a year he is currently receiving, a sum close to double what the next best earners in the paddock are paid. The pay cut could be as much as 30%, which is a lot of pride for a seven time world champion to have to swallow. But with Yamahas currently dominating the MotoGP field, a move away from the Iwata factory could be a very risky move indeed. Kawasaki has expressed an interest in Rossi, although no discussions have ever taken place, and widespread rumors persist that Rossi is a likely target for Ducati, although this is probably more wishful thinking than anything else. If Rossi wants to recapture the MotoGP crown, then Yamaha is probably his best bet. In the end, it will come down to what is more important for Rossi: the money, and the associated prestige of his exceptional position within the MotoGP paddock, or the real prestige of yet another world championship. - from here

the article also discusses the possibility of yamaha replacing the italian fiat with the spanish telefonica as their title sponsor in what would have been another blow for valentino. now, obviously, in the end valentino re-signed for another two years and fiat stuck with yamaha a little longer - but despite the public civility, the power struggle was already very much in progress

yamaha must have known that this would be a difficult situation to manage... so why did they sign jorge in the first place? the first reason is that yamaha would eventually need a succession plan, given valentino's age - as jorge points out himself in one of the interview excerpts above. the other explanation was supposedly valentino's public flirtations with leaving motogp, which he had been engaging in for years and years. according to yamaha team principal lin jarvis, the only reason they signed jorge was that they thought valentino was headed to formula one:

"So, when you have competitive riders in the team it elevates the team, they push each other, and you just have to hope that they are not self-destructive." "We were just smiling because when we hired Jorge when he was a rookie, before he was even in the MotoGP class, we hired him to replace Valentino Rossi because we thought Valentino Rossi would retire soon and go to race in Formula One, and this was back in 2006, and it's kind of like 'who could ever have predicted that Jorge Lorenzo would retire before Valentino retires?' Life is strange sometimes." - from here

now, this may not be an entirely accurate depiction of events from jarvis, but there is something fitting in how the f1 rumours dried up at a time when valentino was facing some sustained adversity in the premier class. eventually, he found a new target in casey to provide him with plenty of competitive motivation. and setting aside off-track contract negotiation shenanigans, his target that season would remain casey. for in the end, jorge's rookie momentum and confidence ran dry. his season took a dramatic turn for the worse at the fourth race, with a massive practise highside at shanghai breaking both of his ankles. jorge managed a heroic fourth, while valentino won his first race of 2008. at the next race at le mans, valentino won again while jorge joined him on the podium on crutches. jorge crashed out of the race at mugello, while valentino won once more. and after a brutal crash at catalunya, one that prevented jorge from even taking part in the race, even his heroic results dried out. jorge did a lot of learning in his rookie year, but he also did an awful lot of crashing - while simultaneously having a protracted painful break-up with his manager that will unavoidably also have affected his mindset that season. the other aliens conducted their war between themselves for the rest of the season as jorge tended to his wounds

the valentino rossi complex

now that jorge is injured and valentino can spend his time concentrating on his favourite hobby of the alien era (figuring out how to get under casey stoner's skin), let's backtrack for a minute. whatever jorge might have been willing to openly admit to, deep down he would have felt that he had a chance of beating valentino in their first season together... but remember, his main stated aim had been learning from him. jorge wasn't just becoming any old rider's teammate, after all - and he had put plenty of thought into what he should be learning from valentino. once upon a time, he had been a biaggi fan and had rooted against valentino in a classic bit of contrarianism. he was having arguments about whether valentino would be succeeding at yamaha with his father (who thought valentino would finish 2004 no better than seventh in the standings). in 2007, at a time in which jorge already knew he would be joining yamaha in one form or another, he was publishing articles about the bloke, wrestling with how shocking it was to watch him crash, speculating how similar he was to an alien or even a god. jorge had, after all, become increasingly aware of just how good valentino was over the years

ER: You were a Biaggi fan. At what point did you change and start watching Rossi? JL: It was always obvious that Rossi was extremely good but I wanted to believe that he won because he was lucky, or because he had a better bike. Once I started out in the World Championship myself I stopped watching out for Biaggi because I started to be more concerned with myself and less about other people. That's when I started to realise that Rossi had something - that it was no coincidence that he kept winning every weekend.

while he had been instructed by those around him to pay attention to valentino as a rider, to study the very best, jorge himself seemed more interested in what sort of a character valentino was - what sort of an impact he had on the sport. like this (longer excerpt here):

Jorge is talking, hardly stopping for breath. 'Valentino arrived on the scene and revolutionised everything,' he says. 'He brought radical change. I remember that at school, on the day after a race, everybody would be talking about the battle between Doohan and Crivillé... and then about Valentino Rossi! It wasn't normal for us to be interested in the winner of the 125cc race! But he did things differently, he started to improvise. [...] He did things that nobody had ever done before. He was different from everything and everybody, he worked really hard and he was really fun.'

another interview excerpt (see here) again frames valentino as unique, as someone different from greats in the past, not because he is a great rider but because of the impact he has had on the entire sport. jorge seemed particularly taken by the joy of valentino's persona, the excitement he brought fans - and of course, jorge's love for valentino's celebrations is particularly significant. jorge may have already been naturally inclined towards a showy style of celebrations of his own that he had indulged in ever since he was a kid (see here, also includes discussion of the vale/biaggi rivalry and again describes valentino as "fun"), but he clearly had a real fondness for valentino's

If Rossi hadn't started celebrating like he does then maybe it would never have occurred to me. Who knows? Obviously he was an inspiration to me in the beginning. The thing is they were so good, and there were so many... they were so funny and so smart. I had a few ideas and I thought it could be good fun but I never did anything thinking that I could become Valentino Rossi II. - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

you know how sometimes people start out hating something, but increasingly they engage in behaviours that make them virtually indistinguishable from actual fans? they were so funny and so smart... the problem with this sport is that, if you're below a certain age, it actually seems really hard to not have a valentino rossi complex of some kind - and you can see it with all three of casey, jorge and marc, if in completely different ways. they weren't all fans of him in the same way and to the same extent, but he was their 'reference' point, always... and they all show it. notice how jorge can't even say for sure how much valentino inspired him - because that's how inescapable valentino is, how interwoven he is in every aspect of the sport. and valentino came first... one of the problems that jorge would face ever more and more as he tried to establish himself against the sheer weight of rossi's presence was that he had been preempted... that the public was so unwilling to take kindly to someone who was obviously aspiring to become - well, not another valentino rossi, but certainly a successor of sorts. there's a cruelty to the whole thing, that celebrations in the same style of valentino's were increasingly mocked when they came from jorge... when they had always been part of his identity as a competitor. he loved to hate rossi, he admired rossi, he wanted to be the next rossi - and he would never be able to escape the shadow of the legacy entirely. and yes, inevitably it will have coloured how his flamboyant celebrations, particularly evident in his 2006 250cc season, were perceived by the public

^valentino and jorge at le mans 2008, when jorge finished second place with two broken ankles and had a chair in both parc fermé and on the podium

incidentally, the biography does include some suggestion that valentino was aware of just how much jorge had discussed him before the start of their partnership. this from the december 2007 interview:

ER: And there came a point where you publicly stated that Rossi was the greatest of all time. When he was told about that he said: 'Wow, at last he's admitted it, but it's taken a while!' JL: I don't like that. Even though he thought it, I don't think he should have said it. I never thought he'd say that! I didn't imagine he would. Even though he's the best, and he's won eight titles, he could have said, for example, 'I appreciate the comment and Jorge is also a great rider.' I would have expected that from any other rider, but not him.

what a fantastic little nugget this is (and it's very kind of jorge to give valentino one more title than he had at that stage). there's obviously some context missing here from valentino's purported remarks, like what had prompted them, if there had been a bit of a history of jorge refusing to publicly call valentino the greatest. has he been informed of what jorge's said about him over time, is this part of a longer story? what tone did he say it in? it does read like a slightly dismissive gag, along the lines of 'well of course I've been waiting all this time for the approval of this twenty year old 250cc rider'. valentino is obviously being a bit of a dick here... but he is joking around, if in a somewhat pointed manner - and jorge does not take particularly kindly to it. he thinks valentino should have gone for a very pr-friendly response instead, and the one he proposes is more respectable but also very dull. jorge can engage with goat discourse, but it's almost as if valentino's status should preclude him from getting involved in this kind of petty snarking, as if he should somehow be above it ("I would have expected that from any other rider, but not him"). at the end of the day, we don't know much about what that relationship looked like pre-2008, except that it wasn't particularly close. though paddock gossip of the time suggested that valentino already disliked jorge

The prospect of Lorenzo in MotoGP is a very interesting one, for along with a great deal of talent, Jorge Lorenzo brings a not inconsiderable ego, and a manager with considerable personal animosity towards Alberto Puig, who manages Dani Pedrosa. So there is not just the matter of the world championship to contest, but also, and perhaps more importantly, the title of Spain's favorite rider. And besides the animosity between managers, there is also rumored to be some animosity between Valentino Rossi and Jorge Lorenzo, Rossi said to be not at all enamored of Lorenzo's ego or his antics. All in all, 2008 is already shaping up to be a fascinating season, and we're not yet done with 2007. - from here

all that being said, I am a little curious if anyone in valentino's circle ever bought this biography (first version published in spanish in 2008) and happened to relay some of this stuff to valentino. maybe just get his thoughts on a few of the details in this book, like this conversation between jorge and his buddy when they were eighteen years old:

The arrival of Palau was an important moment in his life. The had a great time playing on the PlayStation, surfing the Internet and chatting online or playing online games - 'like GP500, which is really old' explains Jorge, as if to demonstrate his gaming pedigree. One afternoon things changed completely. Once again a telephone call would prove to be a key moment in the relationship between Dani and Jorge. 'I remember it well,' says Palau. 'I was in a park with some friends and the phone rang. It was Jorge.' 'PalaWeb, how would you like to be my Uccio?' 'What's an Uccio?' Palau didn't know anything about bikes. In fact, until that point, until that point, he hadn't even watched a race that Jorge wasn't competing in. 'Uccio is Valentino's buddy. He goes with him everywhere. It's just that Dani (Amatriain) says he thinks you're a good guy and he wants you to come to all the races with us.'

or how about the way jorge and his psychologist analysed valentino's character to try and figure out why he was so popular?

Valentino, though, is a person who interests Jorge both on and off the track. He has always been aware of Rossi's incredible personality and also fascinated by his charisma. There's that word again: 'charisma'. Jorge took the opportunity to discuss Rossi's special personality with somebody who could give a professional opinion and explain clearly and authoritatively how and why Valentino finds it so easy to communicate effectively with so many people. Miguel Ángel Violán recalls: 'We used to speak about Rossi, and analyse his public appearances. There is a technique in psychology called psychomorphology, which refers to the way a person can transmit their character through their facial expressions and posture. In Rossi you can see a person who is naturally happy, congenial, creative, artistic, good fun but with a competitive edge too. Jorge's expression, on the other hand, made him seem like a serious person who can't even muster a smile.' 'Try to smile,' Miguel Ángel Violán would say. 'But what if I'm not happy?' Jorge would reply. 'Just try to be. People want smiles! You'll win more fans. It might not feel natural at first, but it will come.'

or about jorge's thoughts on becoming a legend like valentino:

ER: I remember at Jerez, when you were doing a report for TVE with Alex Crivillé, we asked you if you'd like to have a corner named after you. And you answered: 'I wouldn't want a corner named after me even if I win the World Championship. I'll only accept it if I pull off an 'X-fuera' [overtaking on the outside] in that corner.' Can you seriously imagine yourself with that kind of legendary status? JL: To be a legend is something huge. It depends how well I do in the future - on my results, on how I evolve. Right now I'm a long way behind Rossi, in terms of personality. We are two completely different characters, even if our celebrations may be similar. To create a better character than Valentino has managed over the years is very difficult. I've just got to find my own way and try to make my own character be as attractive as possible, to create a character that is different, very different. Maybe that way it can become legend. ER: From what you say it sounds like you'll only be happy when you've established your true character... JL; Yes, but when you're younger it is more difficult because your personality changes so regularly. Bit by bit you become more secure in yourself and you change it less. The more sure you are of yourself the less you self-analyse. But you always want to improve those aspects of yourself that you don't like and if you stop self-analysing altogether then you can't improve. It's a tricky one, isn't it? It is a vicious circle and it's difficult to break.

right then. *cracks knuckles* let's get into it. first off, this miguel angel violan fella who is going on about 'psychomorphology' is not in fact an actual psychologist - and is instead a media consultant and journalist who provided jorge with instruction in public speaking. it was jorge's decision to get a media coach in late 2006, which the biography portrays as a choice stemming from his desire to avoid being misunderstood. (this angel violan donny also gave him advice on a number of other subjects, including how to *checks notes* better communicate with girls.) so jorge and his media consultant turned to the best communicator in the sport, and decided to use him as inspiration

^still le mans. valentino's second consecutive win and when he took the lead in the championship by three points over dani and jorge. quite the effort from jorge, but he keeps injuring himself worse and worse after this - and it's the last podium he bags until eight races later in misano

there's something charmingly straightforward to this line of thinking, really. jorge wanted to be the best motorcycling racer to ever have been. he wanted to both win a lot and be super popular. so he looked at the bloke who was considered by many (including jorge) to be the greatest of all time, as well as the most popular rider of all time, and was determined to closely study his approach. but, because it's jorge, of course he's not just going to 'copy' valentino or say he wants to be the next valentino or any of that, he wants to draw inspiration from him and pay him a lot of compliments in an ever so slightly pompous, self-serious way while doing so (his review of catalunya 2008 is also charming) - before adding his own spin to the whole thing. valentino has a close friend who travels with him everywhere and also plays the role of personal assistant? then jorge must get his own uccio! valentino finds it super easy to communicate with the public in a likeable and seemingly authentic way? then jorge must get his own public speaking coach so that jorge can learn to be just as effective! valentino smiles a lot? well, jorge should be doing more of that too! valentino has fashioned his own 'character'? jorge will manage to do so too, even though it will be hard to have a "better character" (?) than valentino! to jorge, valentino is the truest and ultimate reference point, one who jorge both emulates and strives to distinguish himself from. it even comes through when he's discussing chapter titles with his biographer, and whether 2009 should be framed around how close he'd come to beating valentino:

'The year I faced up to Valentino' seems to me like the best way to encapsulate everything that happened on the track and a good starting point to tackle the various prisms through which to analyse his second year as a MotoGP rider. However, a long silence and the look on his face says no, he's not happy with that. Jorge thinks that his life is his own and shouldn't be judged in comparison with anybody else, even Rossi. He prefers to reflect on it as the year when he fell one step short.

'even rossi' is not allowed to be someone jorge is judged against! and the thing is, right, jorge has clearly put a lot of thought into this. he's using his interviews to opine on the relationship between confidence and self-improvement. this is a kid who is deeply interested in narrativisation of his own experiences, in how he is perceived and managing that perception. he believes he's very much on a character arc here - there's a bildungsroman happening in his own head that he is the protagonist of. which inevitably means valentino is constantly being cast into roles that make him jorge's foil. he's the reference point, he's the past great, he's the one who jorge can learn from, he's the enemy, he monopolises attention. he's the middle film antagonist in the trilogy of jorge's career (or maybe the first film, I'm not sure if dovi gets his own entry as an origin story villain). jorge will take down the old guard and then supplant and surpass him using the lessons he's learnt from valentino. this isn't jorge's own words, but it's telling how the biographer frames jorge becoming valentino's teammate: "it is ironic that destiny has taken jorge as close to rossi as any rider could possibly be, sharing team colours, a garage (albeit with a wall down the middle) and maybe even the posters on the walls of young fans all over the world". okay, yeah, destiny, though it does also help that there's only three teams where a super highly rated young rider could have gone, and really the choice would have been primarily honda or yamaha. also jorge did choose to go for yamaha. like I get what you're saying, but that was a deliberate choice jorge and his team did very much make

^another photo from le mans. come on, this one's kinda compelling, isn't it?

destiny or not, the biography really emphasises what jorge wanted to get out of this opportunity. "keen to get to know valentino personally", "learning from him on the track", "eager to discover some of the secrets that make the world champion such a media phenomenon"... this was a chance to get up and close to valentino so he could study him! yes, obviously, to some extent any rookie would do this when partnered up with a more experienced rider, but well. jorge sure does think there's a lot to learn

ER: We have spoken a lot about Rossi but you haven't described him to me as a rider yet. What's he like? JL: What can I say about him? He's got everything. He has worked on everything to the point where he is good at everything. Maybe the only part he could still improve is his starts. He brakes well, really hard. He has good corner speed, he accelerates well. He is a great strategist and he wins a lot of races with his head. He's just extremely fast. He's also a racer - he's not necessarily one for practice, even though he has like 50 pole positions . . . he's won over 100 races. He is very strong when it comes to a mental battle and he has talent. And I'm sure the level of his talent means he doesn't have to be as physically well prepared as other riders.

setting aside for a minute jorge shading valentino's gym-going habits and mediocre starts, all the above excerpts taken in their entirety do help give you a nice sense of what exactly jorge was seeking to emulate in valentino. again, the bit you really, really have to be paying attention to with this rivalry is that what jorge is interested in is both the off-track and the on-track stuff. jorge speaks admiringly about how valentino has made the sport grow, about how he is a model and an inspiration in a way past riders cannot match. about how, while increasingly making the switch from 'fan' to 'competitor', he had to acknowledge for himself just how good valentino was. and what exactly makes valentino so good... he's well-rounded in his skills, even if he's more of a racer than a qualifier - but above all he "wins a lot of races in his head". it's his skills as a "strategist", in winning 'mental battles' that make him so dangerous. now, look, none of this is particularly original or all that insightful, including ragging on valentino's starts. that being said, it's a useful passage insofar as it tells us exactly what jorge was paying attention to when it came to valentino. always the mental stuff... jorge did more or less know what he was in for against valentino. he knew he was going to face someone who is smart, ruthless both on and off the bike... and a winner in both of those domains. and jorge wanted to win just as much as valentino had, if not even more

it's a great set up for a teammate rivalry! jorge is a real valentino rossi scholar and thinks he understands him very well, but he still doesn't know what it's like to have valentino take him on for the title. and valentino has ensured that jorge is already cut off from a key way to learn from him: by seeing valentino's data. valentino is facing several different threats in that era, from both outside of his team for supremacy in the championship and and within the team for supremacy in yamaha. again, just to restate the obvious: valentino had not spent years studying jorge. he's really not even done much intra-team warfare in the premier class, except insofar as he's applying pressure on management (rather than on teammates). but, hey, he's always been good at adapting to new challenges. jorge might have proven that he was not yet ready to fight for a title in his rookie season, but most are expecting his time will come sooner rather than later. and jorge is going to be fighting not just for yamaha's loyalty and not just for the championship - but also to get the public to love him every bit as much as they do valentino

vibes in the garage, plus a title fight

so, let's operate under the assumption that valentino had at least some level of awareness of how determined jorge was to learn from him. he certainly was wise to the threat jorge posed from the very start - and he clearly hadn't wanted jorge in the team, if given the choice. what do you do in that situation, if you're valentino and want to stave off this encroaching challenger for as long as is possible? okay, you've managed to engineer a scenario in which he can't look at any of your lovely data... but is that enough? what kind of relationship do you intend to cultivate with this kid?

valentino's answer seems to have been a very firm 'none whatsoever'. once valentino had lost the battle that led to jorge's appointment as his teammate, his response wasn't to immediately attempt to undermine him or mess with him... it was to ignore him. here's an excerpt from a december 2008 interview in the biography:

JL: We have never had an in-depth conversation. The relationship is cordial, but I've noticed that he puts a kind of barrier up. He doesn't want any kind of friendship with me and as far as I'm concerned it is not exactly essential to have one either. So we are polite with each other, we say 'hi' and that's it. Whenever we have to spend time together, like for example at the races when they send us out together in a convertible to wave to the public, we try and exchange a few words so that the situation isn't too tense, but you can tell that neither of us completely opens up. ER: And do you think that's a good thing? JL: I'm not the kind of person that thinks that just because you're risking your life racing against another person on the track, just because your livelihood depends on it, you can't look each other in the eye. Personally I would like to get on well with all the riders but because of the time constraints and the reality of a Grand Prix weekend it is just not possible. But I'm not one of those who think that just because you are my rival, you can't be my friend. ER: But you don't seem to look for that middle ground either. Do you think that any attempt to make friends is a sign of weakness? JL: It shouldn't be that way but... maybe if somebody has a lot of interest in getting on well with somebody, that person could possibly interpret it as a sign of submission. Of conceding ground. And Valentino, with good reason, will think that he is above his rivals. He is made to believe it by his fans and by the media and I'm sure he thinks that he is better than everybody else. The reality is that it's true, because right now he is the fastest rider and he won the World Championship.

right! let's discuss. first off, jorge is confirming for us that valentino did not opt for open or even private animosity in 2008. if he had, jorge sure would have talked about it in this tell-all biography. valentino instead essentially put this teammate rivalry on the back burner, while also making a clear decision to not have any kind of relationship with jorge that can be destroyed. this broadly tracks with his approach to rivals post-2004 - though he's still friendlier than this with dani and casey. you can speculate as to the reasons for this difference. the most obvious one is that jorge immediately established himself as a threat inside valentino's house, and was thus always to be treated with more suspicion than those other two. and yes, that is probably the most important reason... though it should be said that from the extremely limited anecdotal evidence we have at our disposal, it does seem to be that both dani and casey had more positive pre-motogp interactions with valentino than jorge did. which might also be because those two both had a link (if at times a tenuous one) with valentino - dani through their shared history at honda, casey by dint of sharing a nationality with most of valentino's crew. this little hint of pre-motogp tension, whether it's paddock gossip or jorge believing valentino was mocking him, also marks jorge out. was that really just a result of jorge's potential future with yamaha, when casey had also been a yamaha hopeful and seemed to be on friendly terms with valentino pre-2007?

there is also the option that valentino did not treat jorge all that differently from his other rivals. jorge says, after all, that things were "cordial" between the two of them - and it's not like valentino's relationship with either of the other two aliens went that far beyond 'polite colleagues' at the best of times. at this juncture, however, we should bring in a third party perspective on that rivalry:

Hector Martin has also been a first-hand witness to this intriguing relationship, or lack of it, with Valentino and he sums it up really well: 'Neither of them wants anything from the other. I have been with the pair of them on the way to an autograph signing session in Australia and they didn't say a word. They sat opposite each other in silence. It was lucky that on the way back Colin Edwards jumped in and he is so easy-going and such a good laugh that it broke the ice and the atmosphere was completely different. They even started talking! Valentino is really chatty but not with Jorge. And of course Jorge is his usual self - shy and very proud.' - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

all right then! the only other piece of evidence we have from that time is the commentators talking during the races about jorge and valentino being fairly friendly with each others in pressers and doing a small talk with each other (in both 2008 and 2009), which is nice of them to mention but obviously also an incomplete picture. if the above excerpt is really representative of their behind the scenes interactions, obviously this does cross the line to being quite unusual behaviour from valentino. we have no way of knowing whether he would have treated casey or dani the exact same way - but either way, it does feel like a deliberate approach on valentino's behalf. ever since the gibernau rivalry, valentino has demonstrated how calculated he can be in conducting relationships with his rivals on his terms, and adjusting the levels of interpersonal warmth according to what he considers appropriate in any given situation. by all accounts, valentino in 2008 did not attempt to make jorge's life in yamaha unpleasant. he was not being mean to him, not talking ill of him in public or even to the best of our knowledge behind the scenes. he wasn't taking the opposite approach either in being markedly friendly or charming to jorge (an approach he is now less associated with given that all his major rivalries went through a *coughs* rough patch, but one he was also perfectly capable of). instead, he chose... nothing. the bare minimum of socially mandated interactions. if they weren't having conversations in private, that wasn't down to the socially awkward, shy jorge - it was down to the outgoing conversationalist valentino, who could sweet talk a cactus if he put his mind to it. valentino decided he had no interest in engaging with jorge, and jorge essentially had little choice but to accept this state of affairs

so... why? it's not like valentino struggles so much to distinguish his friends from his rivals that a little small talk would stop him from being aggressive towards jorge on-track. is his post-2004 frigidness towards his rivals so extreme that he can't even chat a little during their car trips? well, again, his dynamic with casey and dani doesn't suggest as much, and it's also not like the 2008 version of valentino will necessarily see jorge as a bigger threat than the defending champion. did valentino just not like jorge's vibe? this does seem to have played a part of it... but we've already established a plausible explanation: completely ice him out as a simple, straightforward and pretty stress-free preventative measure to limit how much jorge could learn from him either on or off the track. here's the fun question: was this approach affected by any prior knowledge on valentino's part of how much jorge was intending to learn from valentino? given 'trying to learn from your older and more experienced teammate' isn't exactly the most unusual dynamic in the universe, would valentino have frozen out dani or casey in the same way? did jorge's celebrations play any role in this? did jorge doing a goat discourse play a role? how much of this was tailored to jorge's new role in the team and how much of it was about jorge the person?

let's switch perspectives and take another look at what jorge thought of all this. "maybe if somebody has a lot of interest in getting on well with somebody, that person could possibly interpret it as a sign of submission"... well, look, we've already established that valentino does use interpersonal friendliness as a kind of power play... but interpreting doing some small talk as a 'sign of submission' feels like it maybe tells us a little less about valentino and a little more about jorge and his understanding of valentino. jorge is very dedicated to his analysis of valentino - which seems to lead to a few unusual critiques of his rival, but also a tendency to try and rationalise all of his behaviour. if you think valentino is the greatest 'character' this sport has ever seen and has managed to successfully weaponise his charms to enthral the masses... then yes, maybe you will end up seeing valentino's unwillingness to open up to you as this complex stratagem to ensure you don't interpret his friendliness as a 'sign of submission'. what we're talking about are a few car rides, valentino's probably not doing much 'opening up' on the way to autograph signings with anyone. if anything, given how it does feel a touch far-fetched that valentino's friendliness towards his rookie teammate would be interpreted by anyone as him being a try-hard 'submitting' to jorge, this reads a little more like an explanation of why jorge is not engaging valentino in conversation than vice versa. does jorge's interpretation of valentino's behaviour as a sign of arrogance check out, given valentino's ample willingness to chat to other non-jorge riders, not least the aforementioned former teammate colin edwards? at a certain point, when you're dealing with someone with a reputation of mind games and you're very invested in figuring out how those mind games are working, sometimes you can fall prey to getting too invested in your sophisticated analysis of your target's motivations (a little more on that dynamic here, cf the casey 2009 anecdote)

^valentino following jorge around at mugello 2008. insert lame caption about 'who's learning from who'

there's more we could get into here, but let's not get stuck in 2008 here... the main point is that according to pretty much everyone, the relationship was more or less 'fairly polite' in 2008 and it explicitly wasn't a process akin to disillusionment from jorge's perspective - if anything, he seems keen to emphasise a degree of mutuality to the lack of opening up, his prior understanding of valentino and even a degree of 'sympathy' for valentino's approach. reporting from the time from a somewhat more neutral source than jorge's biography corroborates this, like here (in an article mainly about the more long-standing dani/jorge rivalry):

When it was announced last year that Jorge Lorenzo had signed to ride for Fiat Yamaha, lovers of gossip and scandal around the planet rubbed their hands in glee at having two of the largest egos on the planet sharing the confines of a single pit garage. The widespread expectation was that we would see more fireworks between the two Yamaha heroes than during a Chinese New Year celebration. So many people have been surprised by the air of if not quite harmony, then perhaps quiet acceptance of each other that has permeated the factory Yamaha team. Valentino Rossi and Jorge Lorenzo have rubbed along fairly quietly, without rubbing each other up the wrong way, much to the disappointment of the more sensationalist Italian press.

a win for restraint: valentino and jorge got a full year through their relationship as teammates without attempting to stab each other. let's move on to year two

the first thing we have to address, of course, is a controversy that was already bubbling along during late 2008. after a mass exodus from the michelin camp in late 2008, sparked by dani switching mid-season out of sheer irritation with the tyre's underperformance, motogp made the decision to only having a single tyre manufacturer. this meant that there was no longer any reason for a wall down the centre of the yamaha garage. time to get rid of it, right?

Theory, however, is foundering on the rocky shores of Valentino Rossi's will. The Doctor has been very public about his desire to keep the wall in place next year, leaving him and his team to focus on the job of defending his 2008 world title.  His Fiat Yamaha team mate, Jorge Lorenzo, disagrees. Both men were attending the Monza Rally Show at Milan's legendary Monza circuit in Italy, and while there, Lorenzo was asked what he thought of the wall dividing the two pit boxes. "It's Vale's choice, not mine," he told Italian site GPOne.com. "Now that we're both on Bridgestones, we don't need it any more, there are no secrets to keep. Rossi's attitude looks like a sign of weakness towards me, but he has won 6 MotoGP titles, I haven't won any. I don't understand." Rossi's reply was fast, and clear. "There are two riders who both want to win the world championship at Yamaha," Rossi said. "The wall improves the harmony in the team, and it worked well this year. Why change?"  But The Doctor was willing to offer some concessions to Lorenzo, however ironic: "I'll only keep the wall on my side," he joked, "But Jorge can pull down the one on his side!" Adding insult to injury, Rossi finished the Monza rally in 2nd place, while Lorenzo managed only a 38th place. - from here

the reasons why both sides took the stance they did should be fairly obvious by this point, so I won't dwell on them too much. while the issue of data sharing does seem to have been an issue in yamaha contract negotiations before the tyre switch (cf casey discussing the matter in his autobiography), of course it provided valentino with a pretty straightforward excuse to keep his secrets - and it's easier to insist on the status quo than enforce a departure of tradition. once the wall was up, valentino could work to ensure it stayed in place. timing played into his hands here when his tyre switch coincided with jorge graduating to the premier class, and he took full advantage. the biography suggests this wall may have counterintuitively been beneficial for jorge, which your mileage will very much vary on. in some ways, they will have both benefited from a little bit of distance from each other - though they did prove in their second teammate stint that they were perfectly capable of cooperating more closely. it probably would have helped them at times to have a more cooperative dynamic back then but, at the end of the day, it also probably didn't make much of a difference in terms of their actual results. it provided a nice little source of needle for both of them, but it did not cause that much open animosity. there may have been a wall, but the two riders were not at war

despite this wall and supposed separation between the two camps, there was still a fair bit of competitive paranoia to be mined for all sorts of petty arguments. again, this never spilled over to full-blown hostilies in 2009, but provided a backdrop of small-scale arguments fought via proxies in the press. here is jorge on the atmosphere in the team:

Such criticism eventually came to be a source of friction between Jorge and Rossi during 2009. 'Yamaha haven't got involved in it. [Lin] Jarvis just asked for a good atmosphere in the team and said that he didn't want either of us winding up the other. I think we've both pretty much respected that, but Valentino has let the odd thing slip out. For example, the time he told the press that it was him that had developed the Yamaha, even though it was his crew who copied settings from us at some races! I'd like to hear him explain how it was at some races that they were lost in practice and then, after looking at our data, seeing where I was braking, they improved. At some races I have been much faster using my own data rather than using his settings. And then he says that he created the Yamaha and that I don't deserve the same treatment or the same material. I don't think so! I'm not having that. I'm afraid I can't accept it.' - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

wouldn't the line "at some races I have been much faster using my own data rather than using his settings" imply that... he had tried out valentino's settings...? never mind, look, they were clearly both at it and then retroactively played this petty game of he said she said in the press - with valentino mostly making snide implications in jorge's direction and jorge mostly making loud and direct rebuttals in valentino's. their teams got in on the fun too:

Valentino's crew chief, Jeremy Burgess, added to the controversy at Mugello when he commented; 'We have a rider in Valentino who develops the bike and on the other side of the garage a guy who just has to ride it.' However, at the Sachsenring, when Rossi beat Lorenzo by just 0.099 seconds, the Australian reportedly made a sarcastic remark to one of Jorge's technicians, thanking him for the settings. 'I am almost certain that at some races Valentino's team have changed his bike according to our information,' Jorge maintains. 'As far as I'm concerned the facts are that Valentino has developed the Yamaha since 2004 - with the help of Colin Edwards, by the way. Let's not forget that. But if we're talking about the changes you make to the bike over the course of a weekend, it is vnot true to say that we copy his data. I have my crew chief, who is the person that sets the bike up for me, and throughout this [2009] season we hardly made any major changes to the bike from the first race to the last. Valentino's telemetry is not available to me and neither is mine to him. That is perfectly normal, but don't then go and say that things are only going well for us because we're using your settings, because that is a lie.' - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

valentino and jb - very much a rider/crew chief dynamic of two blokes who matched each other's freak, with jb nicely prone to being just a little bit messy himself. attentive readers may note there is a slight disparity between jorge's insistence that he doesn't copy valentino here and couldn't do so because of the lack of data sharing and him saying he's "almost certain" valentino was copying him (and also straight up saying valentino's crew had copied them in the excerpt above). obviously, this is all quite silly, a classic mix of competitive paranoia and sheer, undiluted pettiness. it is also mostly just noise - argument for argument's sake that doesn't tell us all that much either about their dynamic or genuine emotions towards each other or anything else. it does tell us something insofar as 'coming up with fairly flimsy reasons to have a public spat' is something both jorge and valentino are incredibly adept at, so it's hardly surprising their teammate relationship featured plenty of this, even in the early years. we still need to contextualise this: just because they were making snide insinuations in each other's directions, it still doesn't mean they were feuding. they were still outwardly cordial towards each other, low on the open hostilities... but clearly, the war within yamaha was already waging at this time

^indy 2009. see, they can do small talk!

the other manner in which this war was waging was by way of endless rider market speculation. let's leave a more detailed timeline for another day - the most important point is that both of them were more than happy to provide the media with free and easy content when it came to talk of their futures. you have valentino increasingly threatening that it is impossible for him and jorge to coexist in yamaha, that yamaha can only have one main rider. you have jorge on the one hand taking a line of 'it's not me who has a problem with coexisting within yamaha' and on the other making a big song and dance out of the process of re-signing with yamaha for 2010. while valentino's contract ran until the end of 2010, jorge's was up at the end of 2009 and he was thus very publicly courting and being courted at various stages by both honda and ducati. negotiations with ducati were complicated by how ducati very actively pursuing jorge while casey was out with illness - and reportedly ducati offered jorge far far more than they were paying casey, plus were (according to rumours) even willing to offer him number one status. at one point, it was being reported that the deal with jorge and ducati was basically done and would soon be announced, which does suggest that these negotiations went pretty far. (it was this development that played a big part in definitively destroying the relationship between ducati and casey.) eventually, jorge re-signed with yamaha on a one-year deal, announced in august of 2009 - but it really cannot be overstated how much jorge had deliberately whipped up media speculation until that point to make it into a major talking point. an excerpt from an article from the time:

Lorenzo has had to bring his decision forward due to the pressure being put on him by Yamaha. Tired of being made to wait, and leave their own plans in limbo while Jorge Lorenzo makes up his mind, the Japanese factory has reportedly issued Lorenzo an ultimatum, and he will have to make a decision by the time the MotoGP circus reaches Indianapolis. At Indy, Lorenzo is due to give a press conference to announce his decision, and put all this wild speculation to bed. In a little over a week's time, we will finally find out how much of all this has been the product of hyperactive journalistic imaginations, and how much has a basis in fact. Whatever the outcome, a lot of people are likely to be relieved that the whole rigmarole is finally over.

at the end of the year, in midst of another round of valentino-to-ducati rumours, valentino added fuel to the fire by strengthening his stance and saying yamaha would have to choose between jorge and him. jorge too had left his options open - it seems likely that the short length of the new contract was his choice rather than yamaha's, and he will surely still have been interested in exploring options with both honda and ducati if yamaha could not give him what he wanted. one of the major sticking points, as ever, was money. if yamaha could not adequately compensate him and bring his salary in line with valentino's, then perhaps he would take another look at that lovely big money ducati offer

so, this was all the off-track faffing about, but reportedly motogp did also have 'races' in 2009 where there was actual 'racing' between the riders. and at the end of the day, on-track performance would always matter more than anything else in deciding supremacy within yamaha. how, then, did the two of them fare when competing directly? jorge had a full year of experience of motogp under his belt and could now fight for the title, valentino had reclaimed his throne and was the defending champion. who could fail to be excited by the prospect of this confrontation?

well, most of motogp, as it happens. it wasn't a particularly exciting prospect for the simple reason that this was not the title fight people went into that season expecting to see. we were supposed to get casey/valentino, round three, with dani and especially jorge perhaps playing bigger roles than they had in years past. casey had finished 2008 as the form man, along with valentino, with the pair splitting the last four races - and all the noises from ducati were positive that they had actually decided to try and improve their bike for the start of the season this time. qatar once again proved a happy hunting ground for casey in a spectacularly dull race where he won by over seven seconds and valentino was a further eight seconds ahead of jorge. it was immediately readily apparent that honda and its riders were not going to be in title contending form for various reasons - but jorge inserted himself into the conversation by winning the second race in motegi ahead of his teammate. jorge had been talking down his chances before the season started, stressing he didn't think he'd be in the title fight yet this year... but could he be misleading us? could we be in for a three-way title fight?

well, maybe not. jorge started on pole at jerez and was the clear pre-race favourite, but for some reason his pace just wasn't there. valentino ended up hunting down first casey (lovely block pass into the final corner to eventually get past, sans contact for a change) and then dani to take the win. jorge, perhaps pushing too much at frustration with his poor race, crashed out. it was a costly error that immediately weakened his championship challenge, and valentino and casey were the early leaders in that title fight. was jorge still not ready to launch a proper title bid? were there still just too many errors in his game to allow him to compete with the very best? was he too impatient? too brash?

not to worry, it was valentino's turn to show that experience is no antidote to idiocy. at a flag-to-flag race at le mans, valentino handed in what was surely one of the most embarrassing performances of his career, one that saw him *checks notes and takes a deep breath* pit too early to switch to slicks, crash, go back to the pits to change bikes, get a penalty for speeding in the pitlane to be served by riding through the pitlane, and later pitting again to change bikes a third time. valentino had gone through that lane three times before jorge had pitted once. he stubbornly soldiered on - and did not get rewarded for this in the slightest by finishing in 16th place, last of the remaining riders and two laps down. (see here for his expression in the post-race interview, he's looked happier.) jorge won the race. after this, it was time to go to valentino's favourite track, his beloved home race at mugello where he had won seven straight years. surely, this would be the place to smooth over the errors of le mans, to stamp his authority back on this year's championship and show everyone exactly who was in charge? eh. not quite. this was another messy race, and this time the conditions made valentino decide to be cautious - however much he loved his home race, he could not afford another major mistake. valentino finished in third place. mugello had fallen, and worst of all it had been his number one rival casey to take the win. to add insult to injury, he had also been beaten by his young teammate. valentino didn't publicly seem particularly bothered by this after the race, but the italian press sure was bothered. this was supposed to be the defending champion, italy's hero, and he had only won one race of the first five that season. he was third in the championship standings, a staggering five points behind jorge and an even more appalling nine points behind casey. did he really believe this was acceptable behaviour? what did he think he was playing at? was he even putting any effort into this shit?

reportedly, the pressure only grew over the course of the weekend at the next race. valentino had lost out in qualifying to jorge and had qualified a shocking second. the italian media were happy to give him a piece of their minds sunday morning of the race, publicly contemplating the extent to which their one-time icon was now extremely washed. this race had additional significance, since motogp had followed up a visit to valentino's home with a visit to jorge's. it was time for catalunya

right, we will have to give this one a fair bit of attention. it's their most famous battle, it completely changes the momentum of that season, and it's also a fascinating text in the rivalry between the pair of them. valentino and jorge initially need a little bit of time to escape the chasing pack, including casey who makes a feisty start but is soon physically flagging. from then on, we get a rarity in that era: an actual race-long duel for the win. both competitors size each other up, both spend some time in the lead - at one point, in classic fashion, valentino seemingly deliberately lets jorge ahead for a chance to stalk and study him. when it comes to the conclusion of the duel, I'll let jorge himself tell you how it went down:

[Lorenzo's sports psychologist] Pep also had his own ideas about what went wrong at Montmelo. 'He thought it was a problem of mental elasticity, of knowing how to adapt to situations in hand-to-hand combat. I mean, I did the best I could considering how few times I'd found myself in that situation before. In 250s I used to escape whenever I could, and on the odd occasion I had to fight my way through the pack. In MotoGP I have been in battles with other guys when 1 have been fighting back from bad starts but I wasn't used to fighting throughout a race with a rider on the same pace - especially not somebody like Valentino, who is the best there is at that.' The moment is upon us. If it was exciting watching and experiencing the race at Montmelo first hand, then hearing about it from the horse's mouth surely would be too. 'The truth is that I did everything right. I played my cards as best I could, which was making the most of my superior corner speed. Basically my tactic [throughout the race] was to use that speed through the final corner to get into Rossi's slipstream and then pass him at the end of the straight. I did it well, apart from on one occasion when he passed me back around the outside under braking - the one where he had to pull his knee back in as he passed me. I still wasn't braking well at that point and it was really tough for me to make a pass stick because he was so much stronger on the brakes.' Jorge stops in his tracks, closes his eyes, and visualises the pass again. He smiles. 'Then came the last lap,' he picks up again. 'This time I managed to pass him in the slipstream and close the door at the end of the straight. I told myself I had to do whatever it took to block every gap. First he passed me in the Repsol corner. I braked late but I didn't cover the gap and he dived inside, braking even later to the point that I knew he couldn't hold the inside line so I could pass him back. I thought to myself, "Okay, that's the first one out of the way!" I knew he was going to try it again in the next corner, the slowest on the track, so I blocked it off. In theory there was only one more place to defend - the corner that leads into the stadium section. I got a really good exit from the third-gear corner that leads onto the short back straight and left him a little bit behind. I moved to the inside line to prepare a block, braking hard and tight into the turn so that it was impossible for him to pass. However, he came around the outside and got his braking just right, recovering the few metres I had taken out of him on the' straight. So he was right on my ass again. There was a remote possibility that he might try it in the final corner but I don't know, there was a part of my brain that wanted to believe it was impossible, that the race was won, and another part that just knew he was going to try it.'

It is an intense moment and Jorge is blinking hard/as he speaks. Even Hector Martin, seated a short distance away, is straining to hear. 'A part of me was saying "This cabron. is going to try it any way he can, even if he's right up on the rumble strip. He's either going to try it on the way into the corner or under acceleration on the straight and he won't care if we both crash." At this point I'll bring up something Pep Font said that he believes came into my mind: "If I'm leading and there are two corners left, if I can be really fast or at least faster than him, then logically I will win the race." In a way that is true. "If I ride perfectly then it's impossible for him to pass me," I thought. But of course that didn't account for him trying something on the inside, something big. He could interfere with my line and block my route so that I couldn't take it as quickly as I wanted. That lack of "mental flexibility" cost me the race. I braked late but kept the corner open so that I could get out of there as quickly as possible. It was a normal line but not a line that blocked a pass, which is what I should have done!' It later emerged that Rossi had already tried that pass on Stoner two years earlier. Jorge, who has been watching races since those early days with his father back in Mallorca, knew it. 'But I thought that if I managed three very, very quick corners then it didn't matter what he tried. Sometimes you can be riding on the limit and feel it is impossible to go any faster, and then you see other guys are taking two seconds a lap out of you. I'm sure that Valentino could have gone quicker through the last three corners, if he was giving everything to do that, because we were neck and neck, but instead of letting off the brakes where - I did he left it a fraction later and he still had them on until the point where he was on my line. Once he was there I had to either ride over him, which wouldn't have been very smart, or accept second place.' That defeat was the first step in a process of change in Jorge's mental approach and training programme. - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

some points of order: the bit where jorge describes valentino out-braking him down the main straight and retracting his knee to get back past happens on the penultimate lap (screenshots here). when he says he managed to 'close the door' on the final lap, he does mean almost running valentino off the track. also, to the biographer, valentino didn't 'try' that pass on casey, he successfully executed it - and it didn't 'later emerge' he'd tried that pass because casey himself repeatedly brought it up (in between attempting to not keel over dead) in order to rag on jorge for not having seen it coming

and a few more key details. jorge's mistaken belief that he would have the race won as long as he was ahead going into the final corners was something that according to the race commentary, he did quite literally tell them in the week before the race (which, don't ever do that?) - which is also referenced in this 2020 interview, where he said he "kind of" saw it coming and also talked about the casey 2007 move. valentino never gives us quite this much info on the race, but he did tell journalists afterwards that he had been visualising the overtake in his mind the past week:

It also shows how important the mental aspect is of motorcycle racing. After the race, Valentino Rossi told reporters that he had been dreaming of that pass all week, preparing it in his mind in case he needed it. Jorge Lorenzo said that he had left the door open, not expecting Rossi to be able to pass there, and was surprised to see him appear up the inside.

this race does fit into a tradition of valentino being extremely adept at managing momentum over the course of a season, plus is part of a history of somewhat unlikely wins that ended up representing significant turning points (see here). and jorge and dani have spoken about how valentino's entire approach to racing was built around making himself a nightmare in direct combat (see here, also on valentino's 1 vs 1 record against jorge). but let's get back to jorge. this will have been a doubly frustrating defeat in that it happened at his home race (nothing valentino likes more than beating spaniards there), triply so because valentino goes all in on his celebrations, makes a point of breaking out of parc fermé to receive the adulation of jorge's countrymen (which jorge then likewise did). quadruply so in interrupting jorge in his interview to make sure the initial post-race exchange is caught on cameras and mics (jorge manages to not say anything controversial). quintuply (?) so when jorge will have later seen the ecstatic celebrations of valentino's team and valentino pointing at the number 99 on jorge's bike as he claimed his 99th win. there's nothing that valentino enjoys more than making his rival suffer a little more when they are already hurting, to bite harder when his opponent is bleeding. if you will. point is, this is a defeat that hurt. jorge had almost beaten the great valentino rossi in a direct duel, he had come as close as it is possible to doing so. and he had failed

^valentino going over to tell his young teammate what an amazing race that was :D what's that? ten cameras in their faces to capture just how much jorge is returning the smile? well, I'm sure that's just a coincidence :D

note too jorge thinking during the race that valentino would be willing to make them both crash. this may well be correct. of valentino's three most famous career overtakes - jerez '05, laguna '08 and catalunya '09 - this is the 'cleanest' in that there is no contact and the victim had no grounds to complain after the race. still, they do all involve a significant amount of risk, and jorge acknowledges he had to make the choice to adjust his line to stop them both from crashing. given that jerez and laguna represent such glaring examples in which valentino did clearly make the 'if we crash, we crash' call, given the state of the title fight and the significance of this battle within that fight and the yamaha situation and their entire rivalry, given how easily this move - which was very much not at one of the track's 'overtaking spots' - could have gone wrong.... well, it's hardly unreasonable to suggest that valentino really would have been willing to accept both of them crashing out. jorge made an error in forgetting that you can't just defend in racing by 'being faster than your opponent' and should maybe also consider 'actually defending your lines' - but what if he hadn't done that? do we really think if jorge had been a little more diligent in protecting the inside line that valentino wouldn't have tried that move?

of course, it would have been a little awkward in the yamaha garage if valentino had turned a comfortable yamaha 1-2 into a ducati win at the very last corner... and casey, after all, as the then-championship leader was on paper and vibes-wise valentino's most serious threat that season. maybe valentino only made that pass because he knew he could do so with acceptable levels of risk. maybe it was entirely reasonable to expect that jorge would make the right choice and settle for second. or maybe jorge made a mistake here (beyond the shortcomings in his defence) and should have taken the hit, stuck it out and let them crash if it came to it. maybe jorge made it too easy for valentino at every stage of that final corner, maybe valentino learned that day that in direct wheel-to-wheel combat, there was only so far jorge was willing to go. whatever your interpretation, however, the two of them had demonstrated markedly different approaches that day: jorge had worked to be the fastest and valentino had worked to beat jorge. and so, jorge had unwittingly played his part in providing valentino with one of his most memorable victories. there is a tone of resentment in describing the intensity of valentino's post-race celebrations, in particular in the dorna-produced 2010 documentary, as if valentino had overplayed what an important victory it was. after all, jorge had spent much of that early season downplaying even being in the title fight. but valentino had never made any secret of how seriously he took jorge as a threat

^jorge pulls valentino down from the podium to give him a hug, giving us these interesting vibes. casey emotes from the side of the screen (he's trying not to collapse)

the title fight after catalunya is tied at a pleasing 106 points apiece between casey, jorge and valentino - but from then on, valentino gets the edge and never entirely relinquishes it. he comfortably wins assen to take his 100th win, outperforms both of his title rivals when he slots in behind dani at laguna. he wins another highly dramatic duel against jorge at sachsenring by a mere .099, further establishing the decisive edge he holds in wheel-to-wheel combat. then, a wet race at donington, which quite frankly is a horror show from all of the aliens in different ways - but crucially valentino crashes and works his way back up to fifth and jorge just crashes. and at brno, valentino wins while jorge crashes again. both times, it's out of the lead. brno is the first of three in which casey does not compete due to his mystery illness, taking him definitively out of the title hunt. to borrow a commentator's cliche, it seems that valentino has one hand on the title already

it is at this point that valentino is kind enough to bring some life back into proceedings by crashing in indianapolis, when he should have comfortably finished second behind jorge. whichever way you slice it, this was obviously a deeply stupid and unnecessary error given the state of the championship - and does characterise the general tone of that particular title fight... a lot of dumb errors from all parties, a lot of very boring races, spiced up by the occasional classic race. but valentino bounces back successfully at misano, donning a donkey's helmet on his way to victory, as well as donkey ears on the podium, in order to make fun of himself for the indy error. let's get jorge's thoughts:

Rossi's donkey. At Misano my Captain America was replaced on track by Rossi’s donkey - the one he put on his helmet and the ears he wore onto the podium. It is one of the funniest celebrations I have seen Valentino do and I laughed when I saw him get the helmet out. He is an expert at turning things around, and that wasn't the only occasion he put that talent to good use this weekend. On the podium he tried to hush the fans who were whistling at me. Personally I saw their reaction as normal because they were defending one of their own. - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

... oh, jorge

the championship once again seems comfortably in valentino's grasp - but at estoril, another twist: some set-up errors from valentino and just a lack of pace leave him stranded in fourth (casey has returned to nick a podium spot off him) while jorge wins. three rounds to go and a mere eighteen points between the pair of them, hardly a comfortable margin. plus, the very last race is at valencia, and everyone knows valentino straight up sucks there. it's perhaps the most error-strewn of any of valentino's campaigns since his rookie season, and momentum is on jorge's side. they go to phillip island next - a circuit at which valentino has more of a history of success than jorge. will he be able to open up the gap between the two of them once again?

yes, as it happens. valentino tries a new trick and decides to actually bother being fast in practise. it's not a bad approach, so obviously intimidating is the pace that himself and casey can run that weekend. jorge is on the back foot - and it's quickly clear that he might have to contend himself to fighting it out with dani while casey and valentino battle out front. in the end, jorge can't even manage that. he makes a major error headed into turn one and crashes, while valentino (who had been informed of a personal tragedy the day before, tw suicide) settles for second behind casey. it turns a close title fight into practically a done deal. valentino seals the title with a somewhat rough performance in the wet at sepang - and celebrates by making a chicken-related gag about how he's old now, because of course he does. jorge is once again kind enough to provide us with his take on valentino's celebrations:

Not such an old hen. As for his celebration - the old chicken makes good soup - I thought it was a good idea; so was the egg idea but I don't think there was a subliminal message. The one thing I don't agree with is that he's as old as he says because Bayliss won at 37 and he [Rossi] is still only 30... My congratulations. I have been asked if I found it difficult to congratulate Rossi. It is a matter of respect, of being a gentleman and recognising the bravery and talent that the man has. If he is better than you, as he was this year, you have to recognise that and congratulate him for it. So my congratulations go to him. As for the nice things he said about me. I've also been asked if I thought he was being sincere. You have to remember that Valentino is a well-liked rider for a reason, and if he behaved that way it is because he thought he should - because he felt he should for the same reasons I felt I should congratulate him. - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

....... oh, jorge

both here and in misano jorge is very committed to his stance of magnanimity towards valentino. perhaps just a hint of posturing mixed in with the sincerity, but he's keen to emphasise the respect between the two of them... how much jorge appreciates the celebrations, valentino shushing the italians booing at misano (which jorge is in any case understanding of), valentino complimenting jorge after the 2009 title fight was concluded. valentino is a "well-liked rider for a reason" - for now they are still operating within a morally correct and righteous framework where they both act as 'gentlemen' towards each other and can appreciate the other's merits. of course, valentino has demonstrated in the past that he is perfectly willing to throw away that framework under the right circumstances, but for now he is still willing to play to it

When Jorge congratulated Valentino on the title in Sepang, the Italian replied: 'A great year, a great rival.' - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

the season ends with a dani win after casey crashes on the warm-up lap - and in possibly jorge's greatest crime of the season, he finishes behind valentino at valencia. that's a wrap on 2009... but of course, the grind never stops, and both of them were already being a bit messy to the media over the course of the off-season. valentino knew headed into 2010 that jorge would be no easy foe the second time round and openly acknowledged as much (though jorge was struggling with a hand injury during pre-season). his season started on the best possible note, with a win at qatar for the first time since 2006 when habitual qatar winner casey crashed out of the lead. then, valentino bagged himself a nasty shoulder injury in a motocross crash. from that point onward, he was on the back foot and knew as much. he may not have missed any races as a result of the shoulder - but he was managing high levels of pain and was hampered competitively. jorge won the next two races. at mugello, with jorge in the championship lead and valentino pushing harder and harder to overcome his physical issues, valentino crashed during practise and broke his leg. his title bid was finished

special enemies

from this point onward, jorge would dominate the rest of this season and seal his first championship with a comfortable margin. it also conclusively shifted the balance of power within yamaha - who now had their new champion, a younger rider who had proven he could live up to his potential. and it set the stage for valentino's ducati misadventures, partly inspired by genuine passion for making the italian fairy tale come true and partly driven by his frustration at having to coexist in the same team with jorge (cf the financial crisis and valentino reportedly being handed a significant pay cut). in truth, this situation probably couldn't have gone well for much longer - and valentino wasn't the only one publicly flirting with other manufacturers as a result of feeling inadequately respected by yamaha (see more on the 2010 rider market here and a little more on 'valentino + ducati' here). but valentino was one of the two riders engaged in this war and in the end he was the one who made the error of moving to ducati... in the end he was the one who would have to pay the price for this competitive misjudgement

so, let's set aside all this title fight business and get to the serious stuff: what does beating valentino mean to jorge? when we're assessing any particular rivalry, it always always important to establish the actual stakes. there's the obvious stakes of the competition in itself, in this case winning the title. there's the added tension created by the teammate dynamic, how both have repeated the adage that the first rider one has to beat is one's teammate, how their rivalry was shaped by the battle for yamaha's loyalties. but then, of course, there is a little more that defines that relationship. there is the inter-generational aspect, wherein jorge wants to supplant valentino's place in the sport. winning a title fight isn't just about racking up another title - it is about what the future of the sport looks like. and in jorge's grand coming-of-age arc, valentino's role is one of additional significance. valentino is, according to jorge, the greatest of all time. valentino is the reference point. if jorge can just beat valentino, then he will have taken a big step in becoming a legend to rival valentino

On 30 October 2008 Jorge Lorenzo was quoted in the Spanish daily newspaper AS as saying: 'I get more excited by beating Rossi than Pedrosa.'

the biography doesn't mention it but let's reinsert some context here - when jorge gave the above quote, the last time he had finished a race ahead of valentino was in june. this was also two days after dani had beaten jorge directly, in a race in which jorge had almost crashed them both out during the last lap. which, yes, is very jorge, but also is kinda telling in how jorge was already looking ahead to victories to come after he had been repeatedly bruised and battered that year. dani might be his rival for the soul of the spanish nation, but valentino is his rival for the soul of motogp. and reading those words, reading the above excerpt, reading his biography (with several updated versions that in its final form covers jorge's story until end of the 2009 season), there is one omission that does kinda jump out at me. it is a question that I ask myself frequently anyway, but it particularly bothered me in this case... it felt especially glaring here, almost galling in how obvious the question should be. I am talking, of course, of one of our world's most common queries - one I'm sure all of you have often asked yourselves too, that many of you have perhaps been asking yourselves while reading this very post... where is casey stoner?

no, seriously. if you read the book, you would be forgiven for thinking that valentino had won the 2007 title. jorge's rookie season was taking place during casey's title defence - like casey was very much the guy to beat in that season, which valentino at least did seem to be aware of. there's plenty of stuff about dani, plenty about valentino, a fair bit about dovi, but not about 2007 champion and 2008 runner-up casey stoner, who jorge did also race in the lower classes basically as much as he did dani. casey does get mentioned - there's a hilarious line about how jorge thought young casey wasn't pr conscious enough, a segment about his 2009 negotiations with ducati that are pretty funny when you read them side-by-side with casey's opinions on the matter - but he's otherwise oddly absent from jorge's narrative. casey has been kind enough to provide us a little colour about those years from his perspective, including his description of how arrogant jorge had been towards casey at the start of his rookie season (they're included here). you end up getting the sense jorge didn't really pay all that much attention to casey before the latter started beating his ass on a honda. I'm not bringing this up just out of a deep-seated compulsion to include a casey tangent in all of my posts, but because it's quite a neat demonstration of how important the power of narratives was in jorge's head. those three other rivals had a clear role in jorge's story, whereas casey was 'that other guy who also won a championship that one time through the power of the red bike, I guess'. by all accounts, jorge should have been a little more focused on casey when he entered the premier class - given how, and I cannot stress this enough, he was very much the defending champion when jorge made his debut. but beating dani meant more to him. and apparently, beating valentino meant most of all

of course, not everyone would agree with this assessment. here is what jorge's trainer-turned-manager had to say in 2009:

The final word goes to Marcos Hirsch: 'Our mental preparation includes the depersonalisation of rivals. We are not competing against Rossi or anybody else. Jorge is racing against unnamed obstacles. - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

this bears some surface-level similarity to casey's rhetoric in his autobiography of never getting obsessed with his rivals, and is obviously nothing at all like valentino's approach. valentino doesn't race against 'unnamed obstacles' - which is to his advantage, for over the course of his career he has thrived in the exact flavour of personalised combat jorge's trainer is here rejecting. here's a question: is this suggested approach a good idea? is it even feasible to race against 'unnamed obstacles', unless you see races as a mere extension of time attack mode where your fate is contingent on your pure pace and nothing else? is it to your benefit to pretend like you are "not competing against rossi or anybody else"? at the end of the day, jorge was competing against valentino in 2009. he was competing against valentino when he was robbed of the victory at the very last corner at catalunya. that is a move perhaps only valentino would ever have made, but he made it - and he had made it before in catalunya 2007 (see what happens when you don't pay enough attention to casey and his victories). say you're headed to a different final corner, a few years down the line against a rider who is known for being a) very aggressive, and b) a massive fan of valentino, who had once made an infamous race-winning move at that very same corner. when you're judging how much to defend into that corner, how much space to give, you probably don't want to ignore those two facts, do you? jorge generally did not manage to depersonalise his rivals in quite the manner his manager was suggesting - but to the extent that he did so, was that really such a good idea?

the october 2010 edition of gq italy features an interview with valentino. while by a fun coincidence it was published shortly after the race in motegi (more on that in a moment), I think we can probably safely assume the interview was conducted before that race. here is what valentino had to say about casey and jorge:

Q: Since you’ve hurt yourself, it seems that Stoner and Lorenzo have finally found the courage to say what they really think about you. Rossi: Yes, and I am glad. When you are injured and start to lose blood, the younger ones immediately feel stronger and think they can tear you apart: it’s like the jungle! But I like it. That’s just the way it is. At the beginning, Lorenzo, like Stoner, used to say: “Ah, Valentino, he was my hero when I was little”, but it is not true. It’s all rubbish. I am just an obstacle, a target. Like Biaggi was for me. When 2 people are fighting for the same goal, it is normal to hate each other. You are lying if you deny it. I am not talking about homicidal hate but violent, yes. As such, it pleases me that Stoner and Lorenzo say what they really think about me. Because it is the truth. Q: We watched the race at Mugello, and when Lorenzo was in front of the cameras wishing you to get well soon, we were amazed. What do you think? Rossi: How fake…

the interviewer references how tensions between valentino and his two primary rivals of the time had seemingly risen after valentino had broken his leg. this is broadly correct, as is the suggestion that there were some more open criticisms of valentino by his rivals during that time period (hilariously, the ever-tactful casey was talking about how much nicer the british grand prix was without valentino's fans). valentino expresses his preference for open hostilities as he has done at various stages of his career (notably so after 2004) - and it isn't a coincidence he brings in the biaggi comparison here. valentino once had a biaggi poster in his room, then he did his best to destroy him. jorge and casey have both spoken about how much they admire valentino, now they want to do to vale what vale once did to biaggi. this kind of emotionally detached situationally nasty type of rivalry is in many ways the mode of engagement that valentino is most comfortable with. while casey and jorge might have had all kinds of complicated emotions towards valentino, vale does not reciprocate these - and instead uses a sort of impersonal negative affect to motivate himself. valentino wrote in his autobiography that he did not 'hate' biaggi, whereas here he does talk about hate for competitors... but broadly speaking, in both cases he's talking about a 'pure' competitive impulse of a sort. one that isn't affected by some kind of a prior personal relationship with his rival, one where he hasn't been hurt by his enemy. valentino could never have been hurt by casey and jorge, because he never care about them in the first place (after all, he could only be hurt by a 'friend'). to the extent that interpersonal animosity motivates him, it is quite a shallow kind - one that valentino is happy to discard when the competitive landscape no longer requires it. hating might help valentino fight harder, but it doesn't mean anything to him

there is also the emphasis on authenticity, the idea that the underlying truth of that dynamic has been 'revealed' at least. this, too, is a common theme in valentino's output - and one he also has a tendency to link to biaggi. his first serious feud, his first serious rivalry in the premier class, and one that in a way set the tone for everything that was to follow. biaggi never made a secret of his distaste for valentino, and valentino took his cues accordingly. of course casey and jorge would hate valentino. of course he would hate them. that's what they're all there for, isn't it?

^do we think his team bought a shirt from one of the merch stands or what

and then, there is the question of the t-shirt jorge wore at mugello, the one valentino dismisses with the line "how fake"... from anecdotal evidence, he was not alone in this assessment. valentino did not have to do much work himself here - for jorge was already seen as a bit of a try-hard, a little inauthentic. this was a gesture that was practically tailor-made to be dismissed, with its naked appeal to valentino's home crowd, everyone's knowledge of the simmering tensions between the two teammates, and the general assessment that of course jorge would be happy that the defending champion was removed from his path. who wouldn't be? what kind of competitor would feel differently? why was jorge always so determined to go that extra step, the one that opened him up for mockery as his gestures were rejected? why did he need to be seen as a good sportsman? why did most people refuse to see him that way?

let's bring in something jorge said shortly after the race at mugello:

"You know, before Valentino crashed we beat him two times in a row," said Lorenzo. "I don't know if this affected his mind or not. I don't know if he crashed because of that or not. But it's a pity for everyone that he is not here." Ironically, the pressure Rossi may or may not have been feeling was instantly transferred onto Lorenzo, albeit in a different form. And it was a lot for the 23-year-old to take in. "Maybe at Mugello I was a little bit confused, because when Vale crashed the championship changed a lot for us," said Lorenzo. "There was not long between his crash and the race. It was difficult to process everything that had happened in that time." - from here

and that's the thing about jorge, isn't it. in retrospect, the optics of the mugello t-shirt were 'not ideal' - too easy to mock, too easy to be considered insincere - but he only had one day to make that choice at a time when he himself was still processing what had occurred. he had been transformed for one of two title rivals to essentially the champion elect overnight, the overwhelming favourite for the rest of the season. he wanted to play the moment just right, determined not to come across as gleeful, determined to seem respectful, especially in front of the mugello crowd. but however much jorge is actively invested in selling himself, at the end of the day his incredible earnestness has a tendency to sneak through. this is how you get the perhaps ever so slightly tactless suggestion that jorge had psyched valentino into breaking his own leg

why did he say that? why would you even need to air that theory? well, there's a pretty straightforward reason: on some level, jorge was already concerned with how this championship would be perceived. whether he made that connection in his head consciously or not, by emphasising his wins in the two previous races, by suggesting that valentino's crash had been a direct result of the pressure jorge was exerting, jorge was making the case that this event wasn't just a 'lucky break' for him and instead something that could in some way traced back to jorge's actions. what he says next... well, on the one hand he's providing evidence for the impression that he was concerned with how his title would be viewed, but on the other hand he's kinda undermining his own case:

"Winning a world title is always great, but without Valentino maybe the world championship has lost a little bit of its value," he confessed. "That's natural. Before we had 17 riders and now we have 16, and of course the rider who crashed was Valentino, who has won so many titles. But it doesn't mean it is an easy job for me now. "I think the best approach now is to keep improving my riding style and not to think about results or where the other riders are. "Maybe I could win this championship with Vale on the track. We will never know," he mused. "Before his crash I was leading the world championship. It could have happened. Now I will try to beat everybody who is left." - from here

by the time the season ends, jorge has gotten his story straight and is firmer in the dorna-produced documentary in pointing out he was already leading the championship when valentino broke his leg. here, he is still a little more conflicted - and perhaps a little too earnest for his own good. while he does stress that it's hardly game over for the title fight just because valentino's gone, while he again brings up how he'd been outperforming valentino in recent races, he also says he doesn't know if he would have beaten valentino. "without valentino maybe the world championship has lost a little bit of its value"... this kind of thinking is natural, it has a tendency to crop up in all kinds of sports discourse - but jorge needn't have contributed to it himself, given many were perfectly happy to do so of their own accord. perhaps jorge felt like he had to address that line of thinking, perhaps it truly was something he was struggling with, perhaps a combination of both. is there any better way to capture what beating valentino meant to jorge than him publicly wrestling with the notion that his title might be devalued by not defeating valentino to claim it?

let's change tack, move away from questioning simply what it meant to jorge to beat valentino... let's pose another question: what does beating valentino even mean? what does it involve to beat valentino? what does jorge have to do to achieve that goal? again, there's the obvious answer - jorge beats valentino if he beats him on-track and beats him to premier class titles. valentino is, after all, jorge's goat pick, which makes this a formidable goal in and of itself. but it is not the only manner in which jorge wants to beat valentino. we have already established the long-standing interest in valentino's off-track character and persona and popularity, in his historical significance that consisted of so much more than being successful in racing. and so, then, there was another battle jorge was determined to compete in: not just for the soul of motogp, but for its heart. jorge did not just want to win, he wanted to be loved

^heart eyes from the reporter here, mind you. this is the shit jorge was going up against

in this post, I included a bit of the biography where jorge is frustrated at how many people online seem to hate him, including for being valentino's rival. here is another extract that follows on from that:

Despite initially losing his cool for a few moments, Jorge calms down, remembering that we are referring to the 'democracy' behind the Internet and the noisy minority who throw stones from behind their screens of anonymity. 'What actually happens is that when they see me at the GPs anybody who comes up to me does so to say hello and give me their best wishes. In fact, at the Catalunya GP, Lorenzo shirts outsold Rossi shirts by 55 per cent to 45 per cent. Where were all the critics then? How could I have sold more shirts than Rossi if I'm so bad? You have to keep everything in perspective, but it is so annoying having to put up with criticism from a handful of faceless idiots!'

in the post I linked to, I also described how jorge already went into the valentino rivalry with a little bit of baggage where his popularity was concerned - in large part due to how he was perceived in his 250cc days. jorge demonstrates rather nicely what a major preoccupation his popularity was to him, both in his unfortunate tendency to check what people on the interwebs were saying about him and in his concern with whether him or valentino were... *squints* selling more shirts. bit unfortunate if jorge's camp ended up contributing to valentino's shirt sale numbers at mugello 2010, eh

of course, this preoccupation goes beyond just simple concern with how popular jorge was when compared to valentino, whether valentino fans were nasty about jorge online or who was winning in the most important metric: shirt sale numbers. valentino uses the media to become more popular, but he also leverages that popularity when spreading his version of events via the media. remember all the 2009 faffing about who was copying whose set-up? you'll be delighted to hear there's more to be said on the matter. here, jorge describes his frustration with the narrative he was essentially coasting off valentino's hard work, to the extend he "let fly at the press":

There came a point when I got tired of it. I got tired of hearing people say that I was quick on the bike because Rossi had developed it. At Indianapolis I let fly at the press. I told them there were times when [crew chief] Ramon Forcada should have been paid double. Not just because he is really good, which he is, but because those who were accusing us of copying settings were the ones who were doing it the most. It is a bit like the Hamilton and Alonso thing. I am a huge fan of Alonso - he is a winner, a non-conformist and the best there is. But complaining that Hamilton was only going fast because he was copying his settings is not intelligent in my book, and I don't agree. Hamilton was fast because he has huge talent and he adapted well to the car. A slow driver can't go fast on anybody's settings. The Yamaha is exactly the same. People who are not on my side pick up on the argument just to have a go at me because Valentino said it. I was getting criticised for being fast. If it was that simple then Valentino, who 'created' the Yamaha to fit him and developed it to match his style, should be much faster on it than me, shouldn't he?' - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

at a certain point, valentino doesn't even need to do that much work himself to get his version of events spread. did he really believe any of this? eh. his general approach to some of these rivalries was sometimes akin to just throwing a bunch of stuff at the wall, knowing that the resulting chaos was probably going to annoy his opponents more than it did him (more on this approach in the mind games post). once you get that reputation and a friendly media ecosystem, you don't necessarily even have to do that much work to contribute to these narratives - and instead sit back and hope your enemies end up getting het up about what is, at the end of the day, pretty silly discourse. and jorge himself discusses how valentino deliberately adapts his messaging to the situation:

'One thing I can learn from Valentino is choosing the right moment to make certain statements,' recognises Jorge. 'Normally when things are going well he lets slip the message he wants to put out. The jibes tend to come when he has won, whereas I speak out when I feel hard done by, even though I might have just crashed, and maybe that's not the most intelligent thing to do. Sometimes you have to swallow your pride and not say anything. In that sense, when it comes to dealing with the media, Valentino is very good. It is good to watch what he does, how he manages certain situations.' And since we are on the subject, Jorge takes the opportunity to get something else off his chest. 'I am a little upset with the written press, with the headlines they put into my mouth, even though they haven't come from me. In the end I'll have to say that I won't answer questions about Rossi, that I'm not speaking about Pedrosa any more, that I won't talk about anybody else because then they'll call me disrespectful. This year not a single criticism left my mouth, yet a lot of headlines were published that were completely out of context, making me look bad and not accurately reflecting what I had actually said. Luckily I am learning the hard way what to say or not to say. I know what headline they're looking for even before I answer. I'm ready for it and I think before I speak. But there are a few sneaky journalists looking to trip you up with trick questions and when they get you, they screw you!' - from Riveras Tobia's 'Jorge Lorenzo: My Story So Far'

over the course of valentino's career, this idea that vale prefers to attack from a position of strength is broadly correct. obviously, there's a few exceptions - but those tend to be saved for special circumstances, when valentino is making a big play with his back against the wall, rather than day-to-day business. (the obvious counter-example is the continual bickering with casey after 2009, but we all need hobbies.) there's something fascinating about how much both jorge and casey have spoken about learning from valentino how to engage with the media (see here for casey). jorge found out in 2009 and 2010 that maybe he just couldn't win this fight, maybe the only option was to just not answer questions about valentino and dani anymore... except he just couldn't do that, and casey could attest to how refusing to play the media game simply isn't an option either. jorge would arguably eventually become a little more refined in his approach... but a little too much of that earnestness would always remain. I also enjoyed his suggestion right after mugello 2010 that, well, we all retire one day anyway:

"People are used to seeing Vale on track, but you know basketball is just as popular now as when Michael Jordon was playing. Maradona was the football star of the '80s, Pele the star of the '60s and the '70s," he said. "There are always these special superstars. "But all sportsman, unfortunately, we have to retire one day. The sport itself is the only thing that remains." - from here

at the end of the day, the game was already rigged against jorge from the start. this was never a level playing field, valentino already had a massive in-built advantage in winning this particular war against jorge. the unfortunate part for jorge was that it was a war he really did care about - and one he had dedicated so much of his time to. he would never have imagined he would eventually be cast not as a hero, but instead as the sport's villain

collapse

on the 5th of june 2010, valentino broke his leg during practise at mugello. on the 18th of july, he returned to racing with a fourth place at the sachsenring. on the 15th of august, while jorge was establishing a 77 point in the championship standings, valentino's two year deal with ducati was announced

valentino returned to racing considerably ahead of schedule - but his season was not plain sailing from there. it was not the leg that proved the most troublesome, but rather the shoulder he had injured in that motocross accident early in the season and knew he needed to get surgery for. he continued to delay said surgery, determined to finish his season before getting his shoulder fixed in the off-season. it made the rest of the year painful and gruelling for him (see some of his later descriptions here), as he attempted to make adjustments to his riding style to make it bearable. his results suffered too - not that it mattered by this point. jorge was firmly in control of the title fight. this was perhaps the single least competitive season of the alien era, one where the champion was never really in doubt after a mere four rounds. apart from jorge's skill, he was aided by a yamaha that was convincingly the best bike that year. ducati regressed between 2009 and 2010, becoming quasi-unrideable even to casey; honda would make a lot of progress in the years to come, but for now they too were a step behind yamaha. and it was this project that valentino had chosen to leave - not because he was blind to this competitive landscape but because he wanted to complete the italian dream and reinvigorate ducati himself. meanwhile, any remaining suspense in the title fight was removed when a throttle cable malfunction caused dani's honda to crash in practise at motegi, 14/18 rounds into the season, resulting in a broken collarbone and jorge firmly in control of the championship. all he had to do was ride the title home. what could possibly go wrong?

well, as it turns out, nothing was going to deny him that title. but valentino decided to take one for the team and ensure everyone still got a little excitement late in the season. his results after his return had not been poor, exactly, but he was still hampered enough that he finished six consecutive races behind his young teammate. at motegi, dovi secured his first ever premier class pole, while valentino pushed jorge off the front row in the very least seconds of qualifying - his first front row start since his return. it was the first time jorge was off the front row for the first time all year and he was visibly furious (valentino, you'll be shocked to hear, was delighted). still, going by most of the weekend, it seemed like the fight might be between dovi and jorge for the victory. in the end, casey had unexpectedly found something towards the end of saturday that none of the others could match and kept dovi at bay for the entire race. valentino had gotten one of those typically mediocre starts of his and jorge found his way through with a feisty first lap move around the outside of vale. a few laps later, valentino got back past and stayed in front with some sturdy late braking. the race settled down to the default of those years, with the frontrunners riding around in an orderly manner. but valentino never managed to drop jorge and there remained the question mark about whether his shoulder would affect his race endurance - though he had been bullish before the race about the levels of pain that weekend and was dangling his leg to increasingly comical extents in one of those aforementioned riding style adjustments. with eight laps to go, jorge closed back in; seven laps to go and jorge made his next move, diving past before valentino immediately got him back, sweeping in front of jorge to ward off any further attack. the leg was being dangled further and further, perhaps to physically block jorge from getting past. with two laps, jorge had another go and almost ran into valentino's leg. this was the moment they bump into each other in the tunnel, where valentino determinedly moved back past while physically shoving jorge aside

jorge was still close enough to stick it on the inside two corners later in the S-curve section, and when they flick it back around valentino shoved jorge halfway across the track (seriously, this move is a lot). on the very last lap, jorge got past in the S's again, before valentino ran the tightest of all lines and just about got the bike stopped headed into turn 9 to block pass his way past jorge again. unsurprisingly, jorge had to sit the bike up to avoid crashing. valentino manages to hold him off for the rest of the lap. at parc fermé, the mic picked up vale telling his team that it "was fun", which is certainly one way of putting it

Yamaha management were not impressed. Lorenzo was on the verge of securing the title, so they watched the duel in horror. "After the race Yamaha asked me to race with more attention," grinned Valentino later. "So next time I will try to beat him again... with more attention!" - from Oxley's 'Valentino Rossi: All His Races'

so, let's play a little game of compare and contrast with catalunya 2009. set aside the actual viciousness for a moment and what it tells us about their relationship for a minute, and let's just look at what this duel is actually accomplishing. at catalunya, the stakes are glaringly obvious. valentino is on the back foot that season, jorge is looking like an increasingly realistic championship threat - it's early stages of what is looking like a tight title fight and they have arrived at jorge's home circuit both looking for victory after valentino's own home race had ended in disappointing fashion. they are both fighting for supremacy within yamaha and it is still unclear who will come out on top in that contest. at motegi 2010, these two riders are not in a title fight. whatever hand-wringing was going on within yamaha, at this stage it would take some pretty extreme misfortune to deny jorge that title - valentino was making a nuisance of himself, but his antics did not pose any serious threat to jorge's championship. they are not fighting for the win, but are instead having it out for the final spot of the podium. valentino is leaving yamaha. of course, everyone prefers to finish on the podium than fourth, but on paper none of this is really justification for what most would probably put on their list of 'top five most vicious valentino rossi career fights'

on the flip side, you could say valentino has nothing to lose (though I can't imagine falling on that shoulder would have been particularly pleasant). his championship is over and he has been provided with a free and easy way of pissing jorge off. it is a spite ride, pure and simple... though, as ever, it's a two-way street. jorge could have prioritised the championship picture and decided there were only so many goes he was willing to have at a valentino who was clearly willing to crash them both out rather than lose. but of course, jorge himself got angry - and also did not want to let valentino believe he could get away with that kind of riding. there's a lot of gleeful malice in that valentino performance, a determination to remind jorge of just how big a nuisance he could be, even after a string of tricky weekends and amid continual pain. that day, valentino decided to have some fun, consequences be damned

yamaha was not pleased, and neither was his teammate. here's what a visibly pissed off jorge had to say after the race (you can watch the clip here)

"Yes, the show is great for the business of the motorcycle, people enjoy, it's fantastic. But you know when you are a rider and you are riding a MotoGP bike who gets the 300 kilometre per hour in the straight and on the corners 200, 180, and then you are feeling the other rider touch you, it's not a beautiful feeling and emotion, no, because you know you are putting your life at risk at this moment. The three or four moves I made to Valentino, I thought was correct and legal, not legal but correct and fair. Instead, his movements were legal but a little bit on the limit for my point of view. And I - also, I think the way he likes to fight, happens with Gibernau, and then with Stoner and now with me. Maybe in the future, his rivals will get a little bit mad, and we will act like he usually make."

and here is what valentino said in the presser, with a massive grin on his face:

"Yes, was very funny. Unfortunately at the beginning, Jorge want to overtake me on the Turn 3 - and we go wide, together, and also Jorge at the beginning doesn't have the good pace, so I lose three, four tenths behind him for the first four laps. When I was able to overtake him, already Casey and Andrea have 1.6 of advantage that more or less remain the same gap to nine, ten laps to go. From that moment I was start to struggle because I was very tired, I start to finish my power to stop the bike, and I slide also very much from entry to the acceleration and Jorge come back with better pace and from that moment start a good fight, we have some overtaking, but you know in the last laps for take a victory or also for take a place on the podium, you have to never give up. But was very funny, especially because I arrive in front!"

later, he gets a question from the floor about jorge using the newer engine that weekend, and he starts his answer with the following:

"First, I forget I also have to make the congratulations to Jorge because was a great, great battle - also he never give up. "

we also then get a lovely follow-up to this in sepang, where jorge pretends not to understand what the moderator is referring to:

“What happened in Japan? Oh yes, I signed two more years with Yamaha."

it's hard to capture this moment in writing, and I very much recommend you look at these gifs of valentino and casey's reactions to the question. jorge had come in for some criticism after the motegi race, both for his remarks about valentino and his decision-making in engaging in the battle in the first place, while valentino had himself been criticised for his riding (and it was obvious to everyone that yamaha was not thrilled). between motegi and sepang, jorge had decided it was in his best interest to attempt to minimise the controversy - not least because he had a title to concentrate on. dani still wasn't back in action, and jorge just needed to finish ninth or better to seal the title. but nobody wants to seal a title with ninth place. they want to win the race

at sepang, jorge starts from pole this time, with valentino back in sixth. valentino gets a howler of a start and ends up eleventh coming out of the first corners as jorge and dovi escape out front. dovi, who himself of course has a little bit of history with jorge, stalks jorge around before eventually making it past, forcing jorge wide and right into valentino's clutches. the commentators cheerily discuss how lin jarvis is not making any eye contact with anyone in the garage and is instead determinedly studying the timing screens. (another fave: "rossi just looks so determined today. it's amazing what dangling the carrot of lorenzo winning the title will do for a shoulder injury, isn't it?") with eleven laps to go, valentino has closed right up and sends it up the inside of jorge from a few miles back - an ambitious move, but without contact. a little bit later, valentino once again sends it from very far back while getting past dovi, who ran it wide while attempting to defend against valentino. the race isn't completely over after that, and valentino and dovi swap positions twice with five laps to go as jorge closes right up, but eventually they make it to the chequered flag in the same order. and so, both yamaha riders have ample reason to be delighted that day. valentino, always a fan of his meaningful numbers, had sealed his 46th win with yamaha - his first victory since qatar that year and impressive with an impaired shoulder in the sweltering heat. jorge has sealed his first premier class championship in exceedingly dominant fashion. both celebrate with pointed exuberance at a short distance from each other, but they both manage to warmly congratulate the other

it is, of course, a particularly satisfying victory for valentino, managing to ever so slightly spoil jorge's triumph by snatching an unlikely win. it is also very valentino for that to be the first post-leg break race win. but there is only so much you can do to spoil a first premier class championship. that was the last battle they had in 2010. at the valencia test, valentino had an early worrying encounter with the desmosedici, before flying home to finally get surgery on his shoulder. the delay cost him and his shoulder would continue to affect him into the next season

most important of all was jorge's first premier class title. he had successfully managed to fulfil his bildungsroman arc - even though not the way he would have liked, given he was denied the chance to directly beat valentino. the defeats at motegi and sepang in wheel-to-wheel combat will also have stung, just a little. still, jorge had yamaha for himself. all valentino could do was offer a parting jibe on his way out

"Jorge is great, because he has managed to unite everyone in their dislike of Lorenzo. I won't say he's intelligent because that's a big word; let's say he's cunning." - from Oxley's 'Valentino Rossi: All His Races'

nasty, but not completely inaccurate (the first bit, not the second). popularity is one of those things that is always tricky to judge, but jorge was not alone in his impression that the 2009 title fight had dented any affections the public held for him. the 2010 season only seemed to make matters worse. valentino was certainly in part to blame for this, but he did not singlehandedly turn the public against his soon-to-be-former teammate - after all, jorge already had plenty of detractors in the lower classes, plenty of people who would never have grown fond of the cocky young man, so prone to being misunderstood. it is something he openly wrestles with, including in his biography, including in the 2010 documentary. in the end... perhaps it is going too far to say he gave up, but he certainly stepped back from this particular battle. if given the choice between winning and being loved, he was always going to choose the former

^always important to track whenever a feud crossed the line to being so bad neither side would acknowledge each other. jorge and valentino would reach this exciting new stage a few years down the line, but they do not at any point in their first stint as teammates

in the years to come, jorge would recede into himself just a little more, focusing on winning far more than any repeat of the elaborate celebrations of his 250cc days. after a few memorable early 2010 gags, the well dried out. he never abandoned the lorenzo's land celebrations, but at times with a somewhat more defiant tone, as if staking his claim on land others would wish to deny him. to a lot of the fanbase, he was the villain - but spite is as good a source of motivation as any

Jorge Lorenzo had tired of trying to out-Rossi Rossi and was a more calculating figure than the showman persona he’d carried through 250cc and into his first MotoGP season. - from here

there is an underlying cruelty here in just how aware jorge was of the fact that success in itself was not enough. after all, talking about valentino is "not like talking about doohan or rainey"... jorge knew all the winning in the world couldn't turn him into valentino. he had been willing to go the extra mile to establish himself as a 'character', one that could match even valentino. all this introspection and all this extracurricular training he had been willing to put himself through, done in the name of figuring out how to accurately communicate who he truly was to the public... and it was all for naught

this rivalry was conducted in the mind as much as it was on the track. jorge's long-standing fascination with valentino, the games they both played in their attempts to win yamaha to their side, the tactical dimension of their on-track battles, the shape of their title fight and how valentino leveraged momentum, the ways each used the press... valentino might have been adept at mind games, but jorge had always been a very willing student. he had modelled himself after valentino as much as he had defined himself against him. that is where the lopsided nature of the rivalry had come from - in just how much longer jorge had concerned himself with valentino than vice versa... in just how closely jorge had analysed valentino. how much this intra-team battle meant to him. this wasn't just about winning titles, this was about legacy

but at the end of the day, this is still a sport. for all the time jorge had spent figuring out to tell his story, he eventually learned there was only so much he could do to change people's minds when they had already been made. no matter - he had a title and he had yamaha. this wasn't the coming-of-age story he would have chosen, but it still ended up being one regardless. it all eventually worked out... not least for yamaha, who had withstood the pressures of this volatile dynamic and walked away with three consecutive rider's titles for the first (and last) time since the early nineties. their bet on jorge had paid off. jorge had fulfilled his early promise. he had become champion - and he had grown up

[crowroboros]

!!! Opinions on: chase.

There is a very solid chance that Chase is my favorite character not just in Echo VN, but in any Echo Project work. He might just be. I just think that he is such a boyfailure in all the best ways. He's such a sopping wet man and he captivates me. I've written and rewritten this so many times because it is so hard for me to even explain why (it's also 3am at the time of me writing this. I'll put it in queue when I'm done)

I think back to how characters in-universe (Chase included) say that he's dull or lacks personality, and I've seen people in the fanbase say that too. And I don't know if I agree with that. Though I do think that his personality is subdued thanks to the presence of the Samulation. He's kind of awkward, easy going, a bit of a pushover, and somewhat friendly. He really is a normal guy. His communication skills are non-existent, especially when he was younger, but he does grow over the course of the VN in most routes. And he seems at least somewhat introspective. A lot of his inner monologue is him reflecting on and being ashamed of his past actions.

Let's talk about those actions. Sydney oh boy oh god. I think a lot of people focus on Chase drowning Sydney but don't look at their relationship leading up to that. It's fucking sad all around. Sydney is said to have considered Chase a close friend, which really just....ow, you know? From all the interactions between Chase and Sydney we see in flashbacks, and from Chase's own words toward the end of Flynn's route, I really don't think Chase liked Sydney but I also don't think he hated him either. I see Chase's thoughts about Sydney and I see a kid going way too far with his efforts trying to protect a friend.

Chase said himself that he was a fucking asshole as a child and I believe him fully. He spread around the rumor that Sydney killed his father, manipulated Carl's fear of ghosts to get what he wants, drowned Sydney, etc. But in the ~12 years since Sydney died he really has grown as a person and I think that's part of what makes Chase so captivating to me and why I like him so much. He did several fucked up things. He was a dick when he was younger and in his teenage years. And to see him during the events of the main game, it's kind of remarkable. Even with that change though, he says himself that he fully believes that Sydney was a danger to TJ and to others and that he's glad he's dead. Yet he still feels a lot of guilt for killing him and has repressed those memories enough to where it is debatable that he even remembers that he did it in the routes where it isn't directly brought up. I find his complexity so intriguing especially when layered with the fact that ever since Sydney died, Chase has been possessed and influenced by the Samulation.

This is hard to write haha. Chase has so much going on that it's just so difficult to get my thoughts in working order to talk about him. Uh to put it simply: I'm a massive Chase fan. I really like this otter. He's so interesting in every way, from his thought-process, to this past, to the little tendencies he has. Fucking love this guy. Maybe I'll make a series of posts talking about different aspects of Chase from his relationships with other characters, to the things he does and the decisions he makes cause there is just SO MUCH to talk about with this otter.

[kiwiaok]

aftg is eating up my brain so badly, I have a constant stream of ideas and I’m shit at actually writing them but I need to get them out of my system bc it’s suffocating, so:

• an au where king and sir turn out to be shapeshifters so andreil magically acquire two spoiled kids

• andreil saying to each other ‘IU’ instead of ‘I hate you’ or ‘I love you’ or anything else. they use it in every kind of situation bc it’s the testament of how much they feel about each other and that’s more important to them than anything else. they’re fighting? IU (I hate you, I’m scared for you, I’m scared of how much power you have over me, I still want you to stay) they’re having sex? IU (I trust you, I love you, I’m going to take care of you, I’ll make you feel good) they’re breaking down? IU (I’ve got you, I’m here, I’m going to stay, I’m going to help best I can)

• a fic where neil dies in baltimore and we see the aftermath told from his perspective as a ghost: introspection, character study, cannibalism, polaroids, inspired by strangers by ethel cain:

• neil taking great pleasure in buying andrew expensive things and seeing him use them, not out of possessiveness but bc he truly just wants andrew to be happy and taken care of. and andrew learning to accept those gifts bc neil never wants anything in return, not even gratitude

• neil getting drugged at eden’s by some stranger and proceeding to glue himself to andrew’s side. the next day andrew is frustrated by that show of trust and he asks how neil could know that it wasn’t him doing the drugging. to which neil replies that he didn’t know that, but he knew that andrew wouldn’t drug him or let anyone touch him without a good reason. so it was okay, he just needed to trust andrew’s judgement and stick by him. and then andrew realising just how much faith neil has in him and having a breakdown about it

• after neil’s bad days, andrew spoons neil and keeps his hand wrapped around neil’s throat while they’re sleeping. it makes neil feel safe and grounded and makes andrew drunk on trust and control (bonus scene: foxes witnessing this one day and completely failing at understanding their dynamic)

• neil getting into a habit of spitting after his time at the nest bc riko used to spit into his mouth and make him swallow it as a power play. whenever neil remembers it the thought of any spit in his mouth, even his own, makes him sick. so he spits

• whenever aaron is on the edge of relapsing instead of telling anyone he just trails after andrew 24/7 bc he knows his brother won’t let him destroy his life

• tlou au where andrew is traveling the world in search of his twin brother and he’s hired to transport neil somewhere. meanwhile, they fall in love with each other and they find out andrew was supposed to deliver neil into his father’s hands (andrew promised neil safety and he refuses to break his promise so this becomes the first job andrew ever failed)

• andreil breaking up and neil desperately trying to prove to himself that he can move on so he takes the page from andrew’s books and starts sleeping around, but he only succeeds in hurting himself and feeling miserable (they get back in the end bc I need them to be happy)

• OH MY GOD HORNY KANDREIL CLASSICAL MUSIC AU!! kevin (and neil?) playing violin and drew being freakishly good at playing every instrument he ever touches but especially the piano. kev giving a performance and andreil sitting in the first row, neil getting a hard on bc kevin looks so good in his suit, with slightly greying hair combed back and passion burning in his eyes. andrew discretely edging him on, palming neil’s dick through the fancy suit’s material and keeping eye contact with kevin the whole time

AND SO MUCH MORE AAAAAA. this is insufferable, I’m writing fics in my head to fall asleep and then I’m waking up literally quoting aftg (genuinely happened last week, I felt like a lunatic) and then I’m going to uni and I spend every lecture thinking about how I can use my degree to better write about those stupid murderous college athletes. what kind of crack did you put in this series, nora?????

[dragonfly0808]

Riven: The Thesis

TW: ALLUSIONS TO AND MENTIONS OF CHILD ABUSE

First things First

If you checked out my Fate rant, smth that truly pissed me off was how they made Riven just straight up unlikable, an ass and low-key a villain.

To me, Riven’s story was always one about how you can change for the better. That it’s okay to be a bit of a prick as a teen cause you’re just a teen and you still have time to grow and change.

So you can imagine my frustration when in the OG, Riven’s character arc was pretty much reset at the start of every season, especially when I feel that they did a great job at showing Riven’s introspection and his wish to change in s1, all for nothing.

And thus… my version of Riven was born.

I tried very hard in s1 to give him a hard shell and a few outbursts but still showing that he’s got a soft heart deep down and is really only lashing out due to how he’s always depended on only himself to survive. And I think I did a pretty good job at that if I do say so myself.

And post s1 we see Riven slowly learn to lower his guard and realize that he’s not on his own anymore. He has a few slip ups because obvs he’s not gonna magically be great at communication but he gets there eventually.

Shirley Holmes and Riven Watson

So, I think that, aside from Tecna, Riven was prob the one that benefited the most story-wise in the changes I made to his family.

Riven has pretty much no one. His dad is very abusive and never truly cared for him and his mom left when Riven was about eight years old, leaving him not only on his own, but to take care of his five year old sister, Shirley.

I gave Riven a little sister to give him even more reasons to have his guard up, because it’s not just his own back he has to watch out for, but he has a sister that depends on him. Shirley herself tells the squad that Riven pretty much raised her on his own.

I love writing these two, who only had each other growing up and are so very close. Up until the age of fifteen, Shirley only ever really trusts her brother.

I think that dynamic adds a lot to Riven’s character. Showing that he is a really caring and protective person, even in the worst of circumstances he always did his best to keep Shirley not only safe but also happy.

Nothing Good Starts in a Getaway Car

Yep, we’re talking bout Darcy.

In my version of events, it would not have made sense for Riven to ever trust Darcy out of nowhere, due to how high he has his guard and the fact that he’s not dumb.

How did I chose to solve this?

Well… Darcy and Riven were childhood friends and had planned to runaway together before Darcy betrayed him, took the money and ran. He knew her as Jennie, his best friend.

Riven only ever had her. Of course he’s got Shirley but… it’s different cause Shirley is his responsibility, while Jennie helped him steal and do whatever they had to do to survive.

Their relationship is def a tragic one due to the fact that they truly loved each other and had each others backs for so long and they were oh so very close to making it, to running together and starting a new life.

But then… Darcy meets the Trix and makes the choice of leaving Jennie behind, which included betraying Riven when they’re fourteen and so close to running.

This is obvs another reason why Riven is especially prickly when we meet him in s1, a betrayal like that was bound to make him even more angry at the world.

But again, Riven is incredibly protective and, once he loves someone, that means he’s also loyal to them, and Riven isn’t someone who stops loving easily. And so… he trusts Darcy. And it nearly costs him his life.

But this is also the thing that truly makes him realize that he doesn’t want to keep on like this. That he wants to change and let his friends in. That he wants to let go of his anger before it consumes him the way it did Jennie… Darcy.

You Don’t Have to be Sorry, for Leaving and Growing Up (Matilda is low-key a Riven song) 

A big thing for me about Riven, especially early on was, again, showing his softer side mainly through Flora, Shirley, Timmy and even Darcy.

His rougher side is on full display in his arguments with Sky.

At the end of s1, something happens that allows Riven to finally be safe enough to lower his guard and start growing, he moves in with his maternal grandparents along with Shirley. And, while it takes both of them a while to trust their grandparents, once they do, Riven can finally, finally, focus on himself for the first time in his life.

He develops a close relationship with his grandma, and starts doing some introspection (with help from Flora and Helia) and starts working on himself.

A big help in this is Musa, who also struggles a lot with letting herself be vulnerable.

Now, this journey of Riven’s is not smooth sailing because you can’t just snap your fingers and undo years of abuse and survival instincts, but he works hard on it and we can see that through his relationships.

Season 2 is Riven learning to be vulnerable and fully trusting his friends. His nicknames are kinda a way to let the squad know how important they are to him, he allows himself to be more goofy and more relaxed and comfortable in his own skin.

He struggles the most with Musa due to the fact that, before a relationship, there is a friendship. He and Musa find themselves being vulnerable with one another, which is huge for the two of them. But as they grow closer, Riven is reminded of his relationship with Darcy and finds himself pulling away.

He eventually makes this right but it was very important for me to have him stumble a bit in his relationship with Musa at least at the beginning cause my boy has Darcy PTSD kay? And that was not going to go smoothly if we’re realistic.

Season 3 was for Riven fully coming into his own, embracing what little magic he has (which he never did before cause he got his magic from his father that he hates so yeah…) and just fully getting a good grade in communication something that is both possible to achieve and normal to want.

In season 3 it’s mainly Musa who struggles with communication, which makes them both struggle but they work through it, this time as a couple. Wooooo. Hoorah for two traumatized kids learning how to communicate in a healthy way!

Thoughts Behind his Main Relationships

Helia

These boys are two sides of the same coin.

They both have had anger issues and, surprisingly enough, Helia was a lot more violent than Riven ever was since Riven had a better hold on his anger due to facing major consequences (*cough* *cough* his dad *cough* *cough*) but they bond over trying to better themselves.

Riven learns to meditate with Helia and occasionally even paints with him. Helia learns to fix stuff with Riven and they both love the routine that comes with being Specialists second only to Brandon so they often do work-outs and bets with each other.

Their friendship is one of very different yet similar lives. They get each other in a: we’ve both come face to face with the darkest versions of ourselves and came out on top, we’ve both hit rock bottom and we’re both working on figuring out how to be better.

They’re both very aware of their darker emotions but never judge the other for it. They both have nightmares regarding their pasts and they can open up because they know that they get one another.

Riven trusts Helia surprisingly quickly, seeing himself in the Wizard. The two can trust each other with their past and their shame, knowing they will only get full support from the other.

Musa

I always loved the idea of Rivusa but hated the original execution.

I really like the idea of two kids who have been so hurt by the people that were meant to protect them figuring out how to love each other. How to be open and trusting and just how to work as a couple.

Riven and Musa fall very slowly over the course of a year and a half, they get to know each other, be friends, quite crucially: they’re able to be vulnerable with each other. Which is huge for both of them.

And, when they realize that these feelings are serious and more than just a crush, they are both terrified.

I talk a bit more about Musa’s feelings on her thesis but for Riven, he’s terrified of being betrayed yet again. Of giving his heart just to have it shattered.

He’s also very afraid of Musa not wanting him if she learns more about his past and all the things he did to stay alive.

The part I love about this is that this means that even after they get together we get to see them fuck up. Because just because they’re together doesn’t mean they’re just going to forget years of trauma and having their walls up.

And, in my version, once they’re together, it’s Musa who fucks up by keeping secrets and not being able to bring herself to be vulnerable.

I think my fave part about writing these two is writing about how they grow together both as individuals and as a couple, how they learn to communicate and be vulnerable and realize that they are both here to stay and that this relationship is soft and safe and everything that they have been denied for so long.

That’s what this couple is to me. Two kids learning to love and not be afraid of it.

Flora

Riven and Flora are soulmates. I have no other word to describe their bond. Even soulmates doesn’t feel like it can fully encompass their bond and how important they are to one another.

They have similar fears and traumas, though they respond in wildly different ways. He can’t let himself be vulnerable, she can’t stand her ground. But they find each other and somehow, they start healing and growing together

Their bond is ‘there are people that you just have to meet in order to become the best version of yourself and I know that if I hadn’t met you I would never have been able to become my best self. There are people that just have something to teach you just by knowing them, there are people that love you so purely that you can do nothing but want to grow with them and teach each other so much just by existing together. And you know that if there are other lives, you’ve met them in every past life and will meet them in every future life because you own a piece of each others puzzles that you both need to complete yourselves.’

Their love is absolutely pure, I just love it and can’t quite find the words to describe just how special it is.

Who is Riven in this Rewrite?

Riven’s arc is one that I just have really loved to write. The story of an abused, angry boy that struggled to survive finally being safe and getting to work on himself and let go of that anger.

Riven is someone who has had to look out for himself his whole life, who always been pretty much on his own, the only people he trusted stabbing him in the back.

What is most important to me is that Riven is someone who refuses to let his past define him.

He gets the chance to go to Red Fountain after jumping and trying to rob one of the teachers (James) but, when he gets that chance, he decides to make the most of it, to make a good life for both himself and for his sister.

At his very core, the most important part of Riven’s character is that he is first and foremost, a protector.

He’s the big brother who took beatings to keep his baby sister safe. He stole for his sister and for Darcy to keep them both fed. He’s the boy who, before s1 even started made a friendship with Timmy and dared anyone to make fun of him.

He would do anything for his friends, for Helia, for Flora, for Musa and of course, for Shirley. Because once he gives even a small piece of his heart to someone, they have it for good. For better or for worse.

Riven is a boy growing into an amazing young man against all odds. He’s a boy who took the cards he was dealt with and made a royal flush.

Riven is someone who chose to let go of his anger and grow. He’s someone who decided to become someone he could be proud of.

——————

Masterlist

Riven Moodboard

Riven’s Instagram

Riven and Helia Moodboard

Riven and Musa Moodboard

Riven and Flora Moodboard

Shirley Moodboard

[bibibbon]

Wait, did Hori completely skip over their second and third year at UA? Or is the graduation talking about a different year?

Love how there's still absolutely ZERO introspection from anybody about the war, what drove Aoyama's parents to force him into being the traitor, Tokoyami and Izuku possibly being Quirkless, or Aizawa being such a shitty teacher that he never noticed the UA traitor being one of his own students.

And Shinsou can go kick rocks. I've never liked him since I learned how pervasive Fanon!Shinsou is in the fandom, and seeing his Goob from Meet The Robinsons ass being rewarded for his victim mentality really irks me. Again, love how Aizawa supposedly hates favoritism despite turning around and favoring Shinsou (and Bakugou).

#BringIzuku'sFluffyHairBack

Hi @nutzgunray-lvt 👋

No hori didn't completely skip over 1A's seconds and third year. The time skip was only a few days (which bugs me even more) so I was talking about mirio and his classes graduation. Personally I feel like it's too early to do such a thing but I mind of see it as hori making a full circle moment with what he mentioned in the war arc.

Oh my Iam so mad that there is no and I mean NO INTROSPECTION about what everyone or anyone just went through!??!?! Like y'all just went through a whole war and there is nothing acknowledging that!!!! Heck not even last chapters hospital scene made an effort in acknowledging what went down. The only type of acknowledgement we get is mirio's speech talking about how the heroes are trying hard to go back to square one and how they know there is a lot of work cut out for them but other than that complete radio silence which is weird as hell.

I mean we have seen people die in that war arc, many suffered injuries or lost things, many are probably mentally or physically scarred or both and hori opening no acknowledgement to that and trying to go back to normal is just horrible writing. The fact that it's been a few days since the war and they're going back to school is horrible in itself.

The series in itself doesn't even bother to mention aizawas faults as a character or teacher. Look I got into MHA because of the fanon promise of dadzawa (so Iam bias and have a soft spot for it) but dam horis writing of aizawa is such a let down to what fics and friends have told me about dadzawa. Also it's such a shame that aizawa apologises to izuku mid battle using his first name btw and then we are never brought back to that moment it's simply a one off. Also the simple lack of intropsection and information coming from every character is seriously annoying me it's like I can tell that they're simply puppets that hori is horribly controlling.

Also yuuga deserves better I have talked about how I wanted hori to use the idea of transfer students and students dropping out but this was unsatisfactory. Iam not saying that yuuga shouldn't of dropped out but Iam saying that there was no point considering that he went through that whole ordeal saying that if he fights that the education system may overlook his treachery but now he is leaving?!?!?!?

I like the potential that shinsou had but in all honesty he is way too underdeveloped for anything. There hasn't been any acknowledgements of his own mistakes and flawed ideology, we never see his interaction with Izuku and him learning that izuku isnt privileged, we don't see him apologising to ojiro for insulting him, we don't see him actually warming up to 1A rather he seems to be happier in his own class. I have talked more about shinsou and what he could of been here

Honestly it never made sense to me why aizawa likes bakugo so much when bakugo is like a carbon copy of his childhood bully so🤷‍♀️. Shinsou I kinda get but dam it's not a good look for sure.

#BRINGIZUKUSFLUFFYHAIRBACK

Horikoshi has no reason to take away Izuku's fluffy hair!! I need it to comeback and I beg for him not to give izuku a disgusting undercut like those aged up fan arts do. Also best Izuku is MHA 411 izuku!!!

[shehungthemoon]

Just dumping my Ina Paha thoughts here. 🙃

First of all I did NOT know it was the 100th episode going into this, so i was very confused watching the montage at the end lol

I also had to click out and make sure I didn't click the wrong episode when the Pilot started playing at the beginning. When I heard Danny's voice on the phone instead of Hesse's I swear I got whiplash

It's filmed so well (bar where they reshot the pilot where Steve gets Danny on the phone instead of a dead dad, in which they literally forgot to put the same filter over the scene to make the stitching coherent) and I absolutely love the camera work they did with the white-room and the video projections. It felt very much a level above normal network television cinematography, especially the parts where Steve's going in and out of the hallucinations.

Steve finally FINALLY killing Wo-Fat was so cathartic, it should have happened ages ago but I'm willing to look past all the dumb ways he survived just to allow this incredible ending to his story.

Ina Paha gave me Kono doing... this. I owe Grace Park my whole life. Pls costuming department put her in hot pink again 💗

yes, it was a Steve episode. but Danny REALLY shone, first as the only resident Actual Detective figuring out what happened to Steve by the tire-tracks, rampaging through the compound steadily and efficiently and knocking people off without a pause, and then in Steve's mind shooting Hesse's kneecaps off?!?!?! That was CRAZY and probably not suppose to be as hot as it was and definitely made me want an ex-mobster AU immediately. Basically I have a competency kink and really like badass!danny shit 😊

Seeing Chin's long hair again made me swoon

My jaw dropped when I saw Jenna! I think it's really interesting that Steve still thinks of her so much, and I was surprised that she showed up in both the actual dreams and the montage. I definitely underestimated how much she impacted Steve's life, it seems, and I hate that we'll never hear him address that and we'll only know about it inadvertently like this.

(hand over the heart for how lori got like. one team shot. poor girlie.)

⭐I took the montage at the end as being flashbacks and memories that Steve was having as he left the compound. Looking at it through that lens certainly makes one unwell.

Obligatory squeal for Adam appearing just to save the day :))) look below to see the love of my life! :)))))) ⬇⬇⬇

Of course, the obligatory mcdanno bullet(s). It writes itself! The way Danny said Steve's name so small and broken when he found him. The way they look at each other on the ground, the pain their faces. I need an official apology statement from Scott and Alex for it. Can we talk about what flashes by during the montage at the end? (IMO it being Steve's memories.) So much Danny.

The first thing is Danny and Steve's first meeting. Jfc. The showrunners milk it SO MUCH and who's complaining

The big, rocking hug. The hands clasping underground. Gracie of course. And then Danny collapsing from the bioweapon, which to be honest I was NOT expecting to see at all--it felt like a genuinely strange choice to include in there and it really ONLY makes sense if you go along with all that being what Steve's remembering. Even then, I was surprised to see it, so basically this is Hawaii Five-Oh making mcdanno gayer than even I was wanting them to be. Steve still thinks about that? From so long ago? Even with so many other close calls in between then and now? Good fucking lord ok then loverboy that's WILD. Canon accepted ig this show is just pure whump.

Danny goes through all of this just days after losing his brother and killing Reyes. JFC can we please address that. I need a 30k introspection fic to let me into this man's mind rn.

The Wo Fat v.s. Steve fight at the end was INCREDIBLE. I would love to give the choreographer's hand a shake, it's some of the best work I've seen on television in a long time. It was impressive for a procedural like this. It was long and physical and you truly didn't know what the outcome was going to be; it everything that their built-up relationship deserved for a conclusion. It also happening with a Steve coming off of hours of torture and drugging was crazy (guess we finally know who would win a PVP if they were both at full strength!). That being said I was really impressed with Wo Fat's capabilities and physical prowess, I was not expecting it to be so even and close to the line. I actually jumped when Steve LIFTED him up into the lighting fixture. We do not talk about Steve's (Alex's???) raw upper-body strength enough.

Anyway. Electricity in the water play. The physicality hell that this gif below is ⬇. Fire extinguishers and loaded needles. Crazy martial arts. Chair and buckets (holy shit did y'all see the force with which Wo Fat SHOT that bucket?????) flying. All's fair. I loved it.

The shot going right through the forehead, clean. I don't know how to put into words why that's so monumental to me but it is.

The mystery bad lady was SO intriguing, I wish we got more from her... How does she know Wo Fat? Why was she entrusted with all that information on him and Steve and especially Doris? Absolutely where did she come from, what was her name? Why did I have a huge huge hot crush on her? All important questions. (Goes to show that h50 CAN give us some more genuine badass, not just there to date someone women characters, just explicitly choose not to. I'm holding out for Ellie to remain platonic so hard right now.)

Almost forgot Danny in that black Hawaiian shirt. Will be whimpering over that image forever. The whole episode I was trying to focus on the underlining betrayal mystery they were laying out but every time my brain started working too hard Scott with his stupid waist and those flower patterns just started flashing into my head

Again, are you seeing this:

I'm unwell and so so happy.

H50 you're a gem when you want to be.

[ao3userforgets]

i need to mutter into the void so i’m going to post under the cut the trials and tribs of my current clegan fic writing experience so no one including (especially) me has to make eye contact with it. it’s basically a diary entry. god bless anyone that reads it lol. love and light 🫶

goddamn writing this fic is kicking my ass. it was just meant to be an angsty gale introspective. then i started another and that was meant to be them just fucking absolute nasty style. now i fear they have combined, morphed, metamorphosed, and it’s becoming a monster. goddamn. what does one do in this situation? it would be my first time posting in this fandom and my second time posting fic at all. i’m shaking in my boots about it. there is so much wonderful fic being posted for this pairing and so many approaches and styles. i would love to get mine out and see it amongst those works. i’m just not sure how to go about constructing this fic and how to post about it. i’d like to post some bits and pieces and maybe someone will see it and tell me it’s worth it to finish it but first and foremost i’m really writing this for myself, because it’s the type of fic i love to read and also i feel like i need to be writing it so my mind is creating something. and it would feel like a waste to me and a let down for myself if i never post it. also i’m projecting very hard onto it and onto gale as a character, so it feels kind of personal in some parts? which can’t totally be avoided but because of that and because the way i write is also very personal to me it’s making something that should be fun to post about feel quite daunting. but i want to push myself so badly because it’s been years since i’ve done that, maybe i’ve never done that. and Of Course it’s wwii yaoi that’s gotten me to this point.

anyway, y’all ever think about gale identifying as a more feminine being than is expected for a man like him in the time he’s in, thus manifesting itself into years of repression he’s not entirely aware of until he meets and grows closer to bucky, and how he comes to terms with being awakened in such a way that has laid dormant until he’s in the literal u.s. military, and eventually in one of the least survivable theatres of the war, and in suffocating proximity day in and day out with one john bucky egan? and how he navigates his bond with marge, now in contrast to how he feels for john? and how even his childhood and the lives of his parents is being pushed forwards in his consciousness in relation to his sense of self and his place in the lives of others? oh and also how absolutely Biblically he wants john, in the most unconventional and all encompassing ways? all while he has no context for queerness and sexuality as it relates to himself? i dunno what freak would be into writing or reading that 👀 🚬💀

[total-drama-brainrot]

If you can change anything about total drama what would you do?

I'd change the writing.

My main gripe with the show's writing is how it treats it's girls.

I know it's a product of it's time, but something about how practically every girl's story arc in the show revolves around a guy (or at the very least, somehow shoehorns in something about her love life) rubs me the wrong way. The only girl who doesn't have an androcentric subplot going on is Heather, until World Tour came along and centralised her whole 'redemption' arc around Aleheather.

Even Katie and Sadie fall into this trap; their whole thing is being unhealthily co-dependant with each other, and yet they're always at odds with each other over a boy (usually Justin).

But the worst offender for me is the way Courtney is treated. Courtney's whole character revolves itself around her feelings for Duncan- to the point that her elimination is literally caused by her being his "love interest" (thanks Harold)- and all of her development as a character stems from Duncan's influence. Meanwhile, all of Duncan's development as a character is entirely introspective, Courtney doesn't really influence anything about him that wasn't already apparent. Maybe she softens his hard outer shell a bit, but we already know that he's got a "heart of gold" behind his tough guy persona so Courtney's influence doesn't really achieve much in terms of Duncan's growth. That's just in Island! In Action and World Tour, Courtney's whole character still revolves around Duncan to the point she becomes obsessive and controlling. Every conflict she faces is centred around Duncan. She's never allowed to grow and change as a person without it somehow circling back to Duncan.

Let these girls have story arcs and conflicts that don't revolve around the men in their lives.

But the writing overall is just... inconsistent? Sporadic. Weirdly paced.

The reboot is the worst victim of poor writing choices, in my opinion, which I know is probably caused by the time constraints due to a significantly shorter allotted runtime, but especially in season two of the reboot there's this constant feeling of wonky pacing and weird plotline priorities. Julia's whole plotline is stilted and the majority of her interesting actions happen off-screen. Subplots are established and built up just to be discarded within the span of an episode or two; i.e. the Rajbow cheating arc, whatever "Normal" Girl has going on, Zee's soda brand deal, Millie's teased character arc and resulting character derailment, ect.

And the main focus of the season? The most boring romantic plot of all time. Priyaleb could've been something great, and I believe that with my whole heart, but the way it actually played out just left a sour taste in my mouth. It wasn't fun to watch, it wasn't engaging or otherwise entertaining to watch, it was just painful. Again, it's the weird pacing and sporadic shifts in narrative that make it all fall apart. I could rant about how disastrous the Priyaleb plot was for hours.

And I really don't mean any disrespect towards the writing team when I say all of this. It's a hard job, made even harder by the time constraints and the limitations they've probably got set in place as a children's show. But I can't help but wonder where this show's potential could've taken it if the writing wasn't so... Like That.

[llondonfog]

Hi!! Feel free to ignore, but I was just thinking about kid silver being adorable AND Halloween because of the upcoming event...and this thought was born—

(This is so long I'm sorry 😭😭)

So, Silver gets de-aged (bear with me here lol)—maybe due to a potions mishap or a spell gone wrong, it doesn't matter which. It's during Halloween week, so everyone's kinda frazzled due to everything being set up, etc. Lilia gets called to deal with it while Crewel tries to figure out a counter-potion/spell wears off because nobody can get in touch with Malleus, and therefore goes to Diasomnia's vice to help take care of Silver (not knowing that they're father & son).

Silver spots Lilia and yells "Papa!" while running to hug Lilia—while Lilia tries to cover up what Silver said. Regardless, he still picks Silver up and cuddles him—he's a silly old man who loves his kid, who can blame him?

Anyway, kid Silver hijinks ensue: running off with the animals on campus, taking naps surrounded by deer, birds, squirrels, etc., calling Malleus "big brother" and Lilia "papa" while around other Diasomnia students (they wouldn't say anything, because Malleus looks so endeared by the little human and Lilia glares and hisses *unknowingly* at any of them who DARE to interrupt their family).

Silver sees Sebek and looks back at Lilia. He's like, "Why did you make him so tall?? Papa, change him back, please!" *cue puppy eyes* he genuinely thinks Lilia pranked him. As much as Sebek says that he dislikes Silver's behavior, he's actually the one to take him everywhere. "You shouldn't miss so much school, Silver! I won't let you besmirch Waka-sama's good name!"

OK, but back to Halloween—Silver dresses up as a knight, or a prince. Maybe a unicorn??? DRAGON?? Any of them are cute tbh. Anyway, they end up going to each dorm to trick or treat (on Halloween night ofc) and Silver charms everyone, because he's Silver. Then, you have Lilia behind him just being the creepiest little demon fae you've ever had the misfortune to see...

As they're going to one of the dorms to get more candy, Silver sees another kid pouting at the lack of candy said dorm has, and their meager amount. Silver, despite having only a few more pieces himself, gives the kid most of his, and gives the other kid a hug. "There, there, you can have some of mine."

Honestly, you can do whatever you want with this, but I'd love to see this written out more coherently, if you want lol

I've been thinking about this for a while, and I NEED more kid Silver being cute and adorable and pure!! He deserves to be cuddled by his family and to eat candy :D

oh my goodness, this whole entire prompt was adorable and thank you for practically writing the premise into my inbox!! i'm not sure this is coherent.....or cuddly....but my mood with lilia has been in a pretty introspective place for sometime so i do hope you find something to enjoy :')

(and i did end up keeping that paragraph after so many of you seemed to like it akaldjll what do i know about anything)

for a fae as long-lived as he, the concept of time is an ephemeral thing. one does not count the years in a decade nor the decades in a century; a fae knows time by the erosion of a mountainside, by the loneliness of an abandoned settlement, or even by the chance meeting of a human wearing the face of another long since passed. 

silver fills his arms, helmet askew and heavy with satisfied slumber, and lilia feels the ache of every day that has gone by since he was last able to cradle his son so tenderly in his embrace. 

he may be the only fae that now minds his days by the sharpening of his son’s features, a change emerging far too quick and now, strangely, unwelcome.

beside him, serene, the heir apparent to the valley of thorns— looking most pleased himself in their resplendent costumes so artfully reminiscent of the admirable long, yet any dignified mysticism is rendered charmed by the plastic pumpkin bucket clutched in his crimson-tipped claws, brimming with brightly wrapped candy. the overflow is nearly double the amount given to the visiting children, even with silver eagerly dispensing his sugary treasures to any who asked, for no dorm had been able to resist his solemn request coupled with those adorably drowsy eyes and plastic sword when he had so politely asked for one piece more so that their prince might experience trick or treating for the first time. not wanting to be the dorm known for stiffing the fae heir on the most magic-blessed night of them all, both toddling knight and noble dragon walked away, tiny hand in careful claw, with a bounty piled high between them and matching smiles on their twin eager faces. 

lilia had been so torn over which to get a photo of first, cheeks aching from stifling his laughter; the vulnerable delight on malleus’ face as silver so kindly presented him with his share of candy, or sebek’s ill-disguised fussing as silver’s sword had slipped from its sheath to drag across the ground. 

what kindness to be able to share such precious memories with them once again.

what cruelty to remind him of what would disappear tomorrow morning, crewel’s antidote ready and waiting for them in the dorm. 

“...i can see why silver enjoyed such a night of festivity and why he spoke on those memories with you so fondly,” malleus’ reflective tone scatters his wandering thoughts, leaving him to pull his focus back to the present with no small amount of difficulty. “I wish i could have participated in the revelry, but i understand now why you might not have invited me, lilia. the presence of their prince would have dampened any carefree spirits, and i would not have wanted to spoil the fun.”

a wry smile tugs at his lips at malleus’ inaccurate assessment, crooked and out of place, and he can feel the prince’s gaze weighty upon him with surprise, brows furrowing and lips parting with the question on his tongue— 

there had been no such festivities, no happily shrieking village children for silver to scamper among, sharing in the night’s delights and trickery with all the innocence of youth. 

there had only been an old fool of a general, taking it upon himself to fumble through the recreation of a human spectacle, for no other reason than he could not bear the sight of the boy’s features even mildly unhappy. 

he might have wondered how far he could have fallen to find himself repeatedly affecting surprise as he opens the door time and time again to a giggling child, but he knows better now; he had always been steeped in a miserable, lonesome darkness, and to nurture the vulnerable child curled into his chest was to bask in an undeserving light. 

without consent, his arms tighten around the slumbering boy in his arms, and malleus is wise enough not to comment. 

“I do wonder if silver will be able to remember tonight’s events,” lilia comments lightly as they continue their walk to the dorm, seemingly apropos of nothing and unbothered by the watchful gaze of his young companion. 

and he wonders which is more selfish; to wish it so, to have his son’s head filled with such saccharine-sweet dreams of a proper halloween as only a sweet and darling boy like none other deserves— or to cling to the lonely truth of the past, in which a bruised and battered soldier finds a purpose too kind for his bloodied hands in protecting that high and clear laughter of his child, delighting over and over again in the simple fact of his father opening the door.