#ML fandom salt

[jennrypan]

..too many people are tryna give Marinette a pass cuz shes 14 and whatever the fuck. She's not 14 anymore, and not to mention.

Adrien and Alya got dogged on for way less for YEARS and they were around the same age and they haven't done nearly as much shit as Marinette has. Adrien got flamed just for destroying a damn chimney.

Compare that to her breaking his fucking amok. (Or a girl's prosthetics cuz she couldn't let Adrien have a damn friend that isn't also her friend.) Like..No, she isn't getting sympathy from me cuz she hasn't learned a damn thing. She's still not treating Chat as her equal partner and she's still consistently lying to Adrien and she's STILL going ballistic over him being around girls.

No. This isn't salt to point out exactly what She's done and has been doing, there's no excuse for that nonsense and the show brushing it off as "haha classic Marinette" is an issue. Cuz if thats her usually..she needs to fix it. Idc

[buggachat]

honestly just in general it's very exhausting to try to analyze media that is literally meant to be analyzed, only for the replies to be filled with people arguing not against your analysis, but against the premise that the media can be analyzed at all.

i don't even know what to say about it without starting to really betray my frustration, so i'll just settle with— just don't engage with analysis posts? I'm serious. if you're typing a response to a media analysis post, reread what you've written and ask yourself "is this comment/response against the very concept of analyzing the media at all?" and if the answer is yes then delete it all and go sit in the shame corner. throw your curtains away if you want to so bad and stop telling me that I'm not allowed to hum and haw at the fact mine are blue

[wisteriasymphony]

WORLD WAR TWO OCCUPIED FRANCE FIRST PROMPT FOR LADYNOIR JULY?? NAZI OCCUPATION OF PARIS FIRST PROMPT FOR LADYNOIR JULY. WORLD WAR TWO PROMPT FIRST DAY OF LADYNOIR JULY. IS THIS REAL. AM I DREAMING. AM I GOING INSANE. hey hey hey you guys realize the optics on that are awful right right right you realize having that at all much less day one is terrible right because in an open community event like this theres no guarantee very sensitive and serious topics like this are treated with proper care right right right right hey you realize how bad of an idea this was right. please. hey

[gale-gentlepenguin]

Show!Adrien: So A lot of people are complaining that you're a misogynist? Movie!Adrien: Why would they think that? Show!Adrien: According to the comments, By saying Ladybug should be your sidekick. Movie!Adrien: It was Bravado, new chance at freedom and I was trying to sound confident. Besides as soon as she showed how awesome she was, I realized I was more of the sidekick and even said so publicly. It was never about gender I was trying to hide my insecurity and hollowness. Show!Adrien: Fair, sounds like they didnt understand that while watching the movie. Movie!Adrien: Thank you, though I do wish I got along better with her at first like you did. You were much more in sync and more competent. Show!Adrien: Thats nice of you.

[angelshizuka]

"If you met someone like Chloe in real life you'd probably hate them."

No shit, just admit you don't understand the difference between a fictional character and a real person and go, no need to embarrass yourself.

[bugoutreviewgirlie]

One thing that gets me is that people will say they want flawed characters, but when said character exhibits said flaws, suddenly Ladybug is a bad person for undervaluing Chat and Marinette is a bad main character because she--

*checks notes*

--shows symptoms of ADHD, and had symptoms of PTSD from years of constant bullying.

[lady-de-mon-coeur]

Let's make a list:

It was Emilie who used the broken peacock miraculous (yeah, I know, she had her reasons, and she wasn't aware of the risk).

It was Gabriel who started akumatizing people.

It was Nathalie who helped him (yes, I know she betrayed him in the end).

It was Félix who stole all the miraculous and gave them to Monarch (yes, I know, he had his reasons).

It was Chat Noir who cataclysmed Monarch (yes, I'm aware it wasn't done on purpose).

And for some stupid reason, it's Marinette who should be feeling guilty for all of this, although all of this is not by any means her fault. And, obviously, Adrien should leave her and never speak to her again once he finds out what others have done. He needs to let his anger out, and he'd better lash out at Marinette, whose only fault is that she got to know all these secrets and didn't know any better than trying to keep skeletons in the closet.

[richardsphere]

So there's a strange "defense" of Miraculous I've seen crop up on occasion. The idea that everything wrong about the Lovesquare powerdynamic is deliberate and will all be explored next season (lets put aside that this defense has been cropping up for 3 seasons now). The claim that Soon(TM), the writers are gonna make the characters face the concequences and explore the fallout of the entire jenga-tower of BS they've been "carefully" setting up all along... Which... isnt a defense I vibe with, cause it fundamentally boils down to "its not a Kids Rolemodel Show, its a deconstruction of a Kids Rolemodel Show". It's a defence that would place Marinette alongside Tyler Durden, Walter White and Rick Sanchez in the "you werent supposed to relate to them" pantheon. And while i think there are plenty of reasons that deconstruction is a usefull tool (even if i hate the dime-a-dozen "Childrens Fairytale but its depression" and "Superman, but psycho"' decon-stories out there). I'd argue 'Kids Rolemodel Show' is the one genre that should never be deconstructed, or at least not in the slow-burn,long-form way the people arguing this claim the show to be doing. And i hold that stance for one simple two-part reason: Poe's law, and the fact that the deconstructed genre is aimed at an audience with absolute zero media-literacy. (reminder: "5-6 year old kids" is the one audience where that is not an insult, simply a statement of fact.) A show aimed deconstructing a genre with an audience for whom it may actually be their first big piece of media is legitimately dangerous. Because there is no way a 5 year old can be expected to tell "deconstruction of a formulaic kids cartoon" from "Formulaic kids cartoon". The idea that "they've been making Marinette into a bad example deliberately and are going to reveal the entire show to have been a carefull ruse in season 6/7" is supposed to be a defense? Its frankly absurd. A 6 year kid who watched the show when it first aired and idolised Ladybug, could be old enough to drink by the time S6 reveals she was supposed to be a bad example. A little girl who based her relationships on the way Mari pursues romance would have a restraining order by the time the show indends to pull this twist. And some of y'all are claiming that "actually its a long-form deconstruction" is a defense? I legit don't get y'all.

[literaphobe]

i was thinking about not saying anything because really i just want peace amongst the lands but as a person who likes torturing herself on bad social media sites i wanna say the situation with the 'movie is better vs show is better' thing isn't as simple as two camps sprouting simultaneously.

if anything, after the movie was premiered in theatres and leaked there was this camp who saw it that very loudly and harshly spread this whole hate campaign on the show, straight up worshipped the movie like it was the best thing since sliced bread, just started hating on the show like they were antis. in all honesty some people talked like they were being PAID. because 'movie is way better than the shitty show!!' was all i could see on twitter for over a month and i didn't watch it so i was like um maybe it really is groundbreaking?

but then the movie officially released and all of a sudden i saw a lot more 'tbh i didn't think it was that great' takes pop up in replies and comments and posts. it was evening out and then i started to see 'just let people enjoy the movie!! stop bullying us for preferring it over the show!' tweets and 'theres two cakes!! can't we just eat!!' type posts. and i genuinely think most people (on tumblr) want to keep the peace and aren't trying to cause harm. but it puts a slightly bitter taste in my mouth because people were straight up harassing thomas astruc over how the movie did everything so good and his show version was so awful lousy and cringefail. and regardless of how he responded or what your opinion is of him ifl people went too far in their 'support' of the movie at the expense of the show. and having this context and knowing how awful people have been could be sort of... eye-opening? i guess?

because its one thing for two camps to suddenly start fighting. its another when one side was poking the bear for no reason whatsoever for AGES only to start victimizing themselves when the opposite happened (and never usually to the same extent)

[marimbles]

if ive been at a restaurant cheerfully and enthusiastically waiting for the chicken parm to be served for like 5 hours, am I not allowed to be disappointed that it turned out to be salmon instead. sure salmon is really tasty to some people but what if I just don’t like salmon. why are they serving salmon in the chicken parm restaurant? “it’s such an interesting surprise that the chef brought out salmon! I can’t wait to see what’s for dess—” no. bring me my chicken parm .

anyway that’s how I feel in the miraculous ladybug fandom rn lol

[buggachat]

im gonna be honest i think the "adrien being a sentimonster was randomly thrown in season 4 with no planning on the writers' part" theory is really funny. like the writers of this show are just so bad at their job and so stupid that they tripped and fell in season 1 episode mr pigeon and accidentally spilled "a strange relationship to feathers" all over adrien by accident. they stubbed their toe on the coffee table and accidentally set up a mystery surrounding emilie's relationship to a feathery miraculous in season 1 volpina before we even knew what its powers were. then they spilled coffee all over their favorite shirts and at the same time spilled more white feathers around adrien in season 2 episode gorizilla. while writing the same episode someone had a really nasty sneeze and got boogers all over the script that said "use the imagery of two twin rings intertwined as the opener for the film of adrien's dead mother". they forgot to look both ways before crossing the street while writing the season 2 finale and were struck by a truck labeled "the peacock miraculous gives life" and then by a second truck with the license plate "it does so using white feathers identical to the white feathers that surround adrien in his ads" at the same time. they plummeted down an open manhole and hit the ground with a loud whack that sounded like "sentimonsters like bugette are just as real as any human..... and isn't bugette so...... perfect?" in season 3. on their way to the hospital they slipped on ice that had frozen in such a way to perfectly resemble the sentence "the word 'perfect' is consistently used throughout the series and by the creator ominously to denote how characters like adrien and kagami are 'different from everyone else', ever since season 1 episode simon says". during season 3 someone on the team got food poisoning and when they threw up felix came out instead and started another whacky series of comedic errors. the answer to the mystery of "how and why did emilie die? what life did adrien's loving mother create that she was willing to die for?" was originally gonna be "idk maybe she just exploded or somehting" probably, but then there was a really painful rock in one of the writers' shoes while walking to work that put them in a mood so bad that they forgot their original plan and instead made some bullshit up that somehow ended up being something that made sense with what we knew and put all the puzzle pieces together and actually made the show even more interesting and impactful on a rewatch because it put a lot of shots that at the time seemed random into a new and logical perspective as clear foreshadowing. it's actually impressive how stupid these silly clown writers are that they put strangely specific things so consistently throughout the entire series that resembled foreshadowing while never actually having intended it a single time! like........... really.......... really impressive............... i think..............

[gryficowa]

Let's be honest, Marinette and the rest of the characters put more effort into trashing Chloe herself than into actually helping (And they still have the nerve to say they were trying to help when in reality all they said was "Be nice" and nothing else, it's a strong attempt to avoid making an effort to help, which the person needs)

Yes, I'm pissed, that's why there are so many posts, but seriously, the fandom still believes that the characters tried to help Chloe and it's all her fault because she didn't accept "Help", too bad it wasn't even help (This song fits so well)

Yes, I get annoyed with people in the fandom who say that the characters tried, it's bullshit, they didn't do anything to help her (And that's why they put more effort into destroying her than actually helping her), and empty words are things anyone can say

[motherofplatypus]

After seeing several response about Sublimation, I can't help but feel like people are using Adrien's lack of social skill to justify Marinette's stalker behaviour.

"He's okay with it, so it's not stalking", "He doesn't know, so it's okay", "No one was harmed, so what's the big deal" are the excuses I've seen the most. And with Sublimation, people were going "Oh, he knows her so well, that's cute". I can't help but ask what exactly is cute about that?

Folks, this guy is someone who's been socially depraved for YEARS since he was a kid with his only friend being Chloe. He has little to no awareness of what is acceptable in society and what is not.

Him accepting the treatment and behavior doesn't make it okay.

[coffeebanana]

istg half of the post-s5 finale fics i see have some sort of disclaimer in the tags or summary (or i even just saw one in the title!!) saying the fic was written because the show sucks or the finale sucked or they just hated everything about it

and it's frustrating because i probably would have enjoyed a lot of these fics! but now i'm not even going to touch them because i don't want to engage with people shitting on the show

[m3nt4llyr4v3d]

It’s honestly disgusting how two teenagers, who’s downfalls were specifically orchestrated by Hawkmoth, who has targeted them, egged them on, preyed on their insecurities, and spied on them

Are worse than him somehow.

It’s weird how stans will get on Lila and Chloe’s case for “siding with Hawkmoth” (ignoring that this is an adult taking advantage of people’s negative emotions but okay), but willingly ignored Hawkmoth holding Chloe’s parents hostage, cornering her, and using her insecurities to get her to side with him, as well as him and Nathalie spying on Lila, purposefully trying to aggravate her with targeted messages and groom her into being an akuma victim.

Weird of the narrative (and the fandom by extension) to continuously hate these teenagers, ignoring all depth, background, and the adults surrounding them that may make them act the way they do, but will always show sympathy to the adult terrorist manipulating them because he has a dead wife.

[nobodyfamousposts]

The irony when people are coming at you with reasons for why Marinette deserves the hate for failing to be a perfect hero when everyone else is just A-OK after abandoning their positions or attacking the city instead of reasons why Fu was an idiot for choosing children as the heroes in the first place. Without training. Or explanation. Or PLAN.