#another demon from the ars goetia

[umeji-writes]

Why the manga Mairimashita! Iruma-kun is a masterpiece, part # (idk at this point)

Spoilers for the latest M!IK chapter (332) under the cut ♡

Okay, I was loving this art-focused arc already, as someone who after... several years (hi I'm old)... decided to learn illustration for good. But unholy shit I wasn't expecting an actual storytelling lesson from Nishi-sensei!!! I'm specifically referring to these two pages:

..........do you see what Nishi did????? See, I always found the characters in M!IK to be exceptionally alive, as if they had independent lives outside the pages we can read. Basically all named characters are consistent and three-dimentional, even if they appeared for a couple of chapters at most. And there are LOTS of them, I tried to compile a spreadsheet for personal use and we are well beyond 100 at this point (I'm not done yet). This is most likely Nishi's writing method. It fits: "when it comes to terror designing characters, what's important is the foundation. When, where, from whom, and from what was that terror were that character's motivations born? Without that, art doesn't live". See all the crumbs of information Nishi left along the chapters, in text or drawings, or in the Q&As. M!IK's characters are alive, like the Bowing Palome. Clearly this is not new when it comes to storytelling in general, and to manga specifically. As an example, there's a whole chapter dedicated to character design in Hirohiko Araki's Manga in Theory and Practice, The Craft of Creating Manga (most recommended read btw), that goes over the data to collect even before drawing a character. I imagine that's among a mangaka's best practices. But that's the point, Nishi actually follows the rules of the Golden Way*, and created a work which is nearly perfect from any point of view: the four fundamentals (characters, story, setting, and themes), and even rhythm, art, comedy... I'm in awe. I know I sound like a smitten fan, and I am at this point, but seriously, this manga is qualitatively great, and it's a pity it's so underrated. *The set of rules/tips Araki compiled, which if followed would lead to a manga being successful, according to him. I guess there are other sources as well out there, like illustration schools? But this what I can tell you, as an outsider :D

[hey-must-be-a-devilbetween-us]

okay but if we're going down the list of the Ars Goetia (we got shax and furfur hell yeah i love them sm) to put into good omens we can't not have Stolas show up at some point in s3

literally him and Aziraphale would be buddies instantly, if you conjure him he will give you prophecies from the stars in exchange for books and human knowledge, he canonically keeps a library IN HELL and he grows plants and herbs and collects gemstones, he's literally the mix between Aziraphale and Crowley's aesthetics i cannot believe they haven't introduced him sooner.

but please please please just let him just be in his cute little owl-raven form with them LEGS and his little crown and he just hops around the bookshop actually categorizing the books and repairing them and him and Crowley exchange tips on gardening and plant maintenance.

THE LITTLE GUY !!!!

[signedkoko]

hello, good afternoon/night!

I was wondering if you could do a vox x character (?) oneshot where the other person has royal status (something similar to stolas).

I’m interested to see if vox would change his attitude if he was interacting with someone above him, or if he would act the same as usual.

either way, I hope this makes sense and thank you so much!

Vox X Reader [Romantic]

In which you are apart of the ars goetia family, and Vox doesn't know much about royalty. Reader is genderneutral.

Being one of the 72 members of the family didn't feel special from your point of view; you were royalty, yes, but what that actually meant was beyond you

Nevertheless, you were representative of innovation, and your role as an 'aristocrat' was quite literally the most dull of all: an archivist

Your role was to document, file, or archive every piece of information that has ever existed or will exist, and to protect it all in your library

You were a vast network of knowledge, not too different from a computer

That was where you and Vox became so similar, he was certainly an impressive overlord worth meeting.

You found yourself archiving logs upon logs of his creations, of his ad campaigns, of his scandals; he was always up to something

It piqued your interest, so you were sure to note the next time you were in proximity so you could meet him

Vox didn't give two shits about royalty, but what he did care about were the opportunities it presented

It was worth being nice to them and biting your tongue, and in all honesty, he wasn't much of a hot head when it came to people he didn't know

He had files on every member of the Ars Goetia, including yours, and he'd developed a bit of a 'celebrity' crush

You seemed so like him, but he knew pictures could only say so much about a person and moved on

Both of you knew the other would be at the same event, and like magnets, you came straight to one another

Vox used his television charm to lure you in, and just like you'd hoped, it worked

He is extremely nervous around royalty because, truth be told, they really are far more powerful than he or any other overlord

Not to say he doubts himself, but he understands his limits

And being technology itself, he also knows that your ability nearly pales his technology—computers are without a doubt more capable of storing information and processing it than any human or demon ever could, but you were beyond that

That is to say, he is extremely impressed with you and asks a lot about your ability, almost hoping it'll reveal some kind of trick he could use too

Unfortunately, no tricks, but he does find you to be just as kind as he'd imagined

Ars Goetia is extremely strict about the relationships they have, but fortunately for you, you knew every rule and loophole there was to know and managed to get by with 'one of hell's strongest overlords'

He is very adaptive to rules and customs, so it's no issue impressing your family with his seemingly infinite skills

" I didn't know you knew all that, Vox. "

" Yeah! You know, I didn't either! "

He absolutely goes autopilot a lot around other royals because he does not want to cause you any trouble, but you always tell him to relax and let him know you'd never let them get in the way

The hardest decision is who is moving, and when you eventually offer to abandon your lavish lifestyle for his minimalistic city style, he does whatever he can to help you adapt.

Really, you are his prince(ss), and he will treat you like the royalty you are

" So, does this make me a prince now? "

" Are you proposing? "

One of his favourite perks is that now he can really stick it to Alastor

Not that he would ever intend on putting you in danger—even if you'd win—but let's be honest

You would win against that stupid radio demon

Oh yeah, he's proud of that too

Author's Note - I ended up doing headcanons because I felt the prompt didn't have enough for me to go off of, I apologize for disappointing!~ Even so, I hope this still catches your interest 🖤

[star-daughter]

So let's talk about Vivziepop's designing skills!

The amount of sadness I feel when I see Vivziepop's designs of the demons in Helluva Boss is impossibly high

Simply comparing them from where she is pulling from feels like looking at a newborn compared to a grandma. Now let's go through them!

Lucifer

Viv's Lucifer, a popular depiction of Lucifer ("The Fallen Angel" by Alexandre Cabanel), and one with Jesus ("The Temptation of Christ" by Ary Scheffer)

You can see a big difference in a lot, as you can see Lucy (which will be Viv's version) has well. Clothing but we can give her a pass for that as I don't think Youtube would be fine with an animated dick on screen. Another thing is his lack of wings, bat-like or feathered along with blonde instead of red curled hair and yellow eyes instead of the blue Lucifer has in The Fallen Angel.

But what I see as the biggest thing is Lucy's lack of muscles! In both of these depictions I have chosen Lucifer appears muscular whilst Lucy has Viv's favorite smile and body shape.

Asmodeus

Here we have Viv's Asmodeus (Ozzie) and Asmodeus from Collin de Plancy's "Dictionnaire Infernal"

I will give Viv major props, I LOVE Ozzie's design. If we removed the feathers, made his head bigger, and some small things it would be AMAZING! But comparing it to Asmodeus it's... wooo.... very different.

First you can see is Asmodeus does not look conventionally attractive with his strange old man face, elf ears, bull head, ram head, serpent tail, and literal chicken legs. Ozzie does have the 2 heads on his shoulders (just very small) and a tail (not a serpent one) but other than that the similarities end. Though I do think taking Asmodeus the direction to being physically attractive to most people was a good way to go.

A personal nit pick is the clear lack of a BADASS DRAGON. Yes, Asmodeus has a BADASS DRAGON. On his little Dictionnaire Infernal image he's sitting on a BADASS DRAGON which he holds a banner as he rides. Viv you could have made Fizz a cool dragon demon! Make him look LESS like Blitz's twin brother and more like something that related to the Ars Goetia canon.

Beelzebub

Now this is Viv's Beelzebub and a fly-like Beelzebub (Beelzebul) (I've left out the more manly versions of Beelzebub to keep it fair as Beelzebub is a woman)

So a big thing we can see is Beelzebub is a furry whilst Beelzebul is a straight up fly, taking the term "Lord of the Flies" much more seriously. Now comparing these two is basically impossible minus their wings and extra arms. Now with them looking nothing alike I'll put some of my own personal critique's in.

One, Beelzebub's hair and tail makes me want to vomit. It's constantly moving thus every frame it must be moved which is HORRIBLE on an animation stand point. Two, Her clothes. A direct quote from the Helluva Boss wiki says "Beelzebub represents the animal tamer/animal shows" when her clothing looks like that it's hard to believe. If it was casual clothes? Okay I'd believe that but it being her debut episode wouldn't you want her in her normal clothes? And that's ignoring her magical disappearing bra... is that just an arm strap? Three, the ear thing. God the ear thing! Viv said they were supposed to appear like beehives... girl what beehives have you been seeing? Maybe she meant honeycomb? Still I see zero resemblance.

Mammon

Here we have Viv's Mammon, Mammon (Mam) from the painting "The Worship of Mammon" by Evelyn De Morgan, and Mammon (Mon) from Collin de Plancy's "Dictionnaire Infernal"

As we can see Mammon looks like the Teen Titans Go Robin mixed with a Christmas tree, the Christmas theming is quite clever I'll give Viv that. Christmas is a time of greedily taking all that is given to you through gifts. Now I could complain about how Mammon is poor rep for a fat character and simply is a widened version of her normal body type but I already made a post about that

But comparing him to Mam and Mon? Nothing similar. Mam we can see appears like a very large naked buff dark skinned man whilst Mon is a freakish old man with wide eyes and tattered clothes. Mammon shares zero similarities to either of them.

Another thing is Mammon's monster form... I believe everybody has seen it and hochie momma it is HORRIBLE! From the screenshots I've seen we don't see all of it but he's clearly intended to be a spider of sorts which is great! Spiders can often be seen with 6 flies trapped on their web being hoarded for later but Viv seems to have taken the lazy route of extra legs and 2 extra set of eyes. Anthro spiders can be so so SO cool but I feel scammed. Stolen from. My life savings have been taken by this shitty design.

Paimon

Here we have Vivziepop's Paimon and Paimon (Paimonia) from Collin de Plancy's "Dictionnaire Infernal"

As we can see they appear nothing alike minus the crown and odd chicken legs though Paimon lacks the camel that Paimonia has. Paimonia also has a feminine face and a humanoid body, nothing like Paimon. Though I personally think Paimon's design is stunning what made Viv connect the two, is it because the Goetia family is intended to all be ripped from the Ars Goetia? I feel though that Paimon's design takes as much as it can from Paimonia while making him look related to Stolas but why does he need to be named Paimon?

Stolas

Here we have Vivzie's Stolas and Stolas (Stolos) from Collin de Plancy's "Dictionnaire Infernal"

So, I have a lot of issues with Stolas's design, it's ugly first of all but compared to Stolos's cute yet shocked wide eyes and charming little beak it's even more obvious how ugly it is.

First, Stolos is shown as an owl (but also is described as a Raven). which Viv got right along with keeping his crown and odd horn-like feathers. However, I believe making Stolas that skinny doesn't follow the model of most owls as they can be pretty fluffy and plump. Even Stolos has a round fluffy chest that trails into his comically long legs.

Second, that cape is very horrifying but not in a good way. Nobody wants to animate a cape with that many rips! Even if they don't have to be precise. Also, why do his buttons have no lineart when everything else around it has lineart? I have the same issue with Blitz's design and his random chest orbs.

Feel free to put in your own reblogs and replies with your opinions! You can also send in asks with designs from HH or HB that aren't linked to previously existing designs unlike these fellows and I'll throw in my personal thoughts.

-Mod Paimon

[ripplestitchskein]

@angelshizuka I didn’t want to add on to your post and derail it so just doing a screen grab.

But this really bothers me. Like WHY did Blitz think this was a good idea? And how did he plan on keeping it once he had it? He’s not like unintelligent, the whole business is a good idea and they have no competitors we’ve seen other than CHERUB trying a reverse uno.

I pointed out in another post about this topic that Blitz is aware that there are other ways to get to Earth. He dated several succubi and incubi who have crystals. He was able to get one really easily to find Barbie. He could have gotten back with Verosika or any of the others if he was willing to have sex for it. It’s the same kinda arrangement and would involve a few groveling phone calls instead of a heist and fingers crossed you aren’t arrested or killed if you get caught. For Verosika her feelings probably stopped him there but there are other succubi and incubi and obviously he has the game to convince them.

Like if the plan was sneak in, get the book and he won’t know it’s me, fine. But he was already caught and Stolas already confirmed he knew who he was. That same plan would also work a lot better with lower risk at some succubus’s apartment than a royal party. And Asmodeus has hundreds of succubi and incubi and associated crystals versus one guy’s personal spell book. Risk analysis says. “Steal some random nobodies crystal from their probably unsecured house”. And even after Stolas clocks him he’s still like “I’ll just take it” and then thought just ghosting Stolas after would be enough??

I just feel like there has to be a reason, even if it’s like a subconscious one. Why Stolas? What reminded Blitz of a royal who has a book that can go to the human realm 25 years later when he had fairly recently ended a relationship with a succubus who can also do that? And Barbie was able to find a job to get to Earth so it seems like that was also an option. He could have doubled up, run drugs or human shit and also killed people at the same time and done it legitimately. Partnered up to ride along with a succubus even, “Hey, you go do your sex demon shit and I’ll be killing people, we’ll meet back here at 3”. He’s still the boss in that scenario even if he also works with someone else to do it, he’s doing that with Stolas anyway. The consequence of running afoul of Asmodeus if he finds out and is mad because of his partnership with Fizz is only slightly higher than it is stealing from an Ars Goetia.

I don’t know if it was to fuck with royals specifically? He thought Stolas would be an easy mark, but he doesn’t really know him now from what we’ve seen so that’s a weird assumption to make. He seems to think pretty negatively of royals why would he assume this one wouldn’t be the same if he was caught?

Did he follow Stolas before hand to get a vibe? How did he know about the party? Did he just pick a random day and there happened to be a party? What was the lead up? I guess it was in the paper, maybe he saw it there and was like “Now is my chance”. I can buy that from an impulsive desperation level but like I said, there were easier ways.

I hope they get into that but I dunno if they will, it’s not like crucial to the story so maybe better to not waste time in it, it really just adds to the basic framework established but I just have questions.

[hazbinhotel-bitch]

He Knows: Alastor x (Name)

(Name) had a few more times after being confronted by Alastor. She was a little surprised he knew who she was, but she knew he had many connections and probably sent out his shadows to keep an eye on every Overlord and probably noticed a reoccurring face. (Name) was glad that Alastor let her continue with her research to see if it was worth writing about. But with the few visits she made she started to like their company, there was a certain pull about the sinners that resided in the Hotel.

(Name) was by the bar talking with Husk and Angel-Dust. They were all chatting and laughing as (Name) was telling them of her times as a human. Granted she did have to look back at her journal that she kept a page entry of memorable memories of her life. She kept a few of her happily memories as a human where she would bring up in conversations from time to time.

"So picture this; it's late at night. I was a young woman dressing like a young man but if I'm being honest I looked like little boy, but I was trying to get into a pub that lead to an underground fight club. So when they kicked me out from the front door I decided to get in through the back, luckily for me knew the building layout so I was able to break into a home that had a connecting basement." she explained "But because of the two Basements were connected I though it'd be easy but, it turned out this place was connected through several other building and I ended up getting lost."

Angel just laughed at the misfortune she had and called her a stupid bitch which she took no offence. She was pretty young at the time she was only in her early 20s at the time so she thought she knew everything. But in the end she published her experience in the underground tunnels and that many building basements that connected intricately with one another. She went on to talk about how if she stayed longer she was afraid she would find the underground people who live in the swerves. In the end of anecdote she compared the idea of meeting the underground cavillation is no different to hell itself and the people inhabiting the place. Through out this Alastor was listening from a distance with an arched brow, he kept his smile up as he let his intellectual mind wonder.

She certainly has a way with her story telling... and she does seem to captivate people with her charms.

Alastor thought as he watched her with a slight curious gaze. In no means did he think he was lacking in his work with the broadcast she's had for years, but in the seven year hiatus he took notice that no many sinners cared he had left or when he came back, aside from Vox the demon with the TV head who was pissed that Alastor decided to come back to the limelight. But Alastor had been keeping tabs a fairly known writer under the name of Siege, a couple of decade after he arrived he noticed paper article titled "Siege's Scandal Sheets" where it would be highly detailed of very sensitive subjects on many Overlords and even those from Ars Goetia and the Seven Deadly Sins. The Radio demon was rather impressed but wary but soon caught on that the scandal sheets has started to slow down since (Name) made an appearance near the Hazbin hotel. It wasn't long until he realized (Name) was the cunning writer, Siege from the scandal sheets of hell.

Alastor was debating whether to use (Name) to his advantages and have her work for him to get him more stories of hell to get his listenership up again, and who better than the infamous Siege of the scandal sheets.

"Ah My dear (Name)" Alastor finally said making his way to the trio of sinners "What a lovey anecdote"

(Name) sighed with a smile still recalling her time as a young human journalist doing whatever she could to get the biggest story with freedom.

"I was curious my dear. If you were journalist in your human life, what are you doing here in hell of an occupation?" Alastor asked with a smile.

(Name) didn't trust his interest. When she started showing up more and more Alastor either avoided her like she was a fly on a wall or if she started to try and get some kind of information he would belittle her simply offer her a deal of an exchange of secrets which she refused. But this was new. He was asking her of her occupation in hell.

Does he know? Surly he know... he's one a very intelligent and cunning man. There's no way he doesn't know who I am... or maybe I'm looking too much into it. Maybe he is wondering why I am here all the time... that has to be the reason he is asking me.

(Name) thought to herself in her inner monologue moment in her mind as she simply stared at Alastor. From the outside it looked like she was simply taking in his features, as if she were to paint his face on a canvas and she was simply as admiring. But she smirked when she noticed his smile twitch in annoyance along with his eye as he waited for her answer.

"I've had a few odd jobs here and there, but Journalism doesn't really work well here in hell. Velvette is the main dominator when it come to news here in Hell" (Name) mentioned with a shrug.

"Perhaps... but Velvette never facts checks her news, which makes her unreliable. Feeble gossip and nothing more" Alastor mused out "But~"

His voice was like a sing song tone. (Name) could feel her heart race as he drew closer to her as his smile seemed far more sinister now.

"There is one person the people of hell wait for" he was close to her face before he straightened up with pride as he looked down at her "Aside from myself that is"

"And who is that Mr. Radio demon" she scoffed trying to keep her tone aloof like her expression.

"Siege of the Scandal Sheets"

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Previous Chapter: Here Next Chapter: Here

[kyomint]

Theory: Stolas' trial

I'm going to put my theories about what will happen in Mastermind/Sinsmas in order.

At the beginning of each episode, we have a content warning. In it, we can hear a "ticking", very similar to the noise of the hands of a clock. This ticking starts in the episode "Truth Seekers" and recently some people have pointed out how the sound has decreased over the episodes. In the beginning it played during the entire warning, in "The Full Moon", it stops halfway through the warning.

Another interesting detail that we can notice in the warning is the symbol that appears in the background. This symbol is known as "Devil's Trap" and originally appears in "Solomon's Clavicle" (no, it's not from Supernatural), a grimoire with a vast collection of ancient spells, with the Devil's Trap being a spell used to immobilize and control demons.

In the LVL UP trailer, we see scenes of what appears to be a meeting between the 7 Deadly Sins and the Ars Goetia. We can assume from Vassago's lines, "Where is Stolas, anyway? We have to summon him at once" that the meeting's agenda is something that Stolas is responsible for and given Vassago's stress and Andrealphus' interference, things are ugly for him.

From the trailer it is also possible to deduce that Stolas will lose his powers at some point since in the scenes below, we see that he is completely defenseless against Andrealphus, who theoretically should be less powerful, since in the hierarchy of Ars Goetia Stolas occupies position 36, while Andrealphus occupies position 65.

Okay, but what does the ticking have to do with the meeting and Stolas' powers? Simple, the ticking of the clock is marking the time until the trial of Stolas and the I.M.P.

I believe the meeting will aim to discuss Stolas' actions and whether or not he should be tried for allowing I.M.P. to use his grimoire to gain illegal access to the human world.

Thanks to the group's carelessness in episode 6, the D.H.O.R.K.S. were able to obtain irrefutable proof of the existence of demons, which led the human government to finance the activities of the organization, which in a short time was able to discover a way to access hell.

Even if the D.H.O.R.K.S. aren't a threat at the moment, it's only a matter of time before they figure out a way to actually open a portal and then, yes, hell will have something to worry about.

Andrealphus and Stella, knowing about the affair between Stolas and Blitz, will take advantage of the situation to formally accuse him, convincing the Ars Goetia that he and I.M.P. must be judged and held accountable for their actions.

As punishment for breaking the laws of Hell, Stolas loses his titles and has his powers temporarily sealed by the Devil's Trap while he awaits official trial. Meanwhile, Stella and Andrealphus take possession of Stolas' possessions, which now rightfully belong to Stella, as the divorce has not yet been made official.

In the midst of all this, Octavia's custody will also be officially passed on to Stella, who, knowing how much Stolas cares for his daughter, will prevent them from meeting, further damaging their relationship, as we see in the speech "You don't love your mother, and you don't love me, you love HIM".

Anyway, this is what I think will happen in the next episodes, I hope the text wasn't confusing, as English is not my first language. I'm looking forward to seeing how this plot unfolds, and whether or not I got anything right!

[chaifootsteps]

So a while back I saw some screenshots of Viv answering questions on her Patreon Discord (I'm guessing it was that, anyway), and apparently, Stella's original name was Sibella.

And that got me thinking.

While Viv just liked the name for the Gentleman's Guide song, I noticed the name is derived from Sibyl from Greek myth and means "prophetess".

Imagine if they had leaned into that idea? Like Stella not only has a gift of prophecy, but also a degree of psychic knowledge? In Helluva's canon, there isn't really a grasp of how the grimoire works, but what if there was? What if Stolas didn't really have a drive to learn about it (hence him never teaching Octavia), but Stella did? And she ends up using a spell of sorts combined with their arranged marriage to have power over Stolas? So that even though Stolas is an Ars Goetia, who's incredibly powerful to most and has a full demon form, by the constraints of Stella using the grimoire's magic and studying it, he can't harm her, but she can harm him?

That route would actually make Stolas feeling threatened and caged by Stella make a lot more sense, give Stella more of a character, and give the grimoire more plot relevance and a solid understanding of how it works.

Sadly, in Viv's hands, she' isn't's a lot more one-dimensional and less likable as a villain. But if Viv had gone a route like that, she could have at least have some interesting elements to her even with Stolitz being mangled.

... You know what? Screw it. I'm taking my random AU headcanon for Stella and transposing it onto the Lady Macbeth character in my steampunk musical take on Macbeth. With a villain song inspired by this for good measure. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XSTgVQzGEA

Leave it to Viv to hold yet another golden opportunity in her hands and squander it in every way imaginable.

Love your steampunk musical idea! As for me, I'm headcanoning Sibella as this gorgeous demon with psychic powers and a killer singing voice that Stella ultimately rides off into the sunset with.

[aleafinacup]

Identifying Demons: Ars Goetia

Pretty random thing to attempt but I wanted to try it, mainly thanks to posts by @mintaikcorpse :]]

This is what I got so far and I’m gonna list why I think this is who’s who below the cut (also even if it’s revealed these are wrong or irrelevant I don’t really care that much bc there’s little chance I’m gonna write using the Goetia much

Vassago: Pretty simple start, it’s already confirmed

Raum: Described as an Earl ruling 30 legions of demons, his description mentions him taking the appearance of a crow and he is then also described to “steal treasures out of kings' houses, carrying them where he wishes” — so from the appearance of this bird guy, he seems to really like his gold since his anthropomorphised wing-hands have gold rings all over them

Sitri: Honestly my favourite look out of this group :] a Prince ruling over 60 legions of Demons, he’s one of the few Goetia depicted as having a leopard appearance, alongside griffin wings. Fits pretty perfectly for what’s in the picture

Shax: Marquis having power over 30 legions of Demons (on evil horses apparently) he is depicted as a stork, and I think with the long beak and thin neck that’s what he’s implied to be. His outfit also sort of looks like the uniform dressage riders wear (at least in my eyes) with the black coat and white shirt underneath, so that could potentially cover the “evil horses” thing

Botis: Pretty easy one as not a lot of Goetia appear to be serpent like. A President that commands 60 legions of Demons and depicted as an “ugly viper” aww poor guy :(( I think he’s silly looking

Ipos: Prince that commands 36 legions of Demons. A pretty hard one to figure out, but in this pic he’s very vulture like, so googling “vulture ars Goetia” brought me to Ipos’ page, as he is sometimes described as a vulture (although very rarely, he’s commonly a fuck ton of animals smooshed together)

Buer: President with 50 legions of Demons under his command. This was definitely the toughest one T-T the picture of this lil guy very much yells goat to me but looking through all the Goetia descriptions the only time I could see anything like that was in Buer’s text, which says “He has been described as being a wheel with several legs, or even as a lion head with multiple goat legs.” That was all I got, but given that there’s several Goetia already with lion features, I decided to focus on the singular goat part and leave it at that 💀

It’s fun and definitely satisfying to put names to faces, as for me I like to have things like this tucked away to potentially use in stories

I severely doubt all 72 Goetia are ever going to show up in Helluva or Hazbin, but given how many there are and how plenty of them have a surprising amount of description, there’s a lot of overlap in animal features and I do hope that if any more are shown they aren’t just all birds

Maybe I’ll make another post like these if they get more screen time?

[morgana0anagrom]

do you believe in demons and the supernatural? been years since I wanted to draw Sallos. I always found him interesting, and I finally painted him, this is my depiction of him, I hope he likes it... (please don't haunt me) I will be drawing other demons from Ars Goetia. and I'm already working on another Demon, hint: 🐫

[ceruleanwhore]

I know it's been a minute since Hazbin dropped and I'm late to the hate train but I have things I want to say, so I shall.

First off, the whole thing makes absolutely no fucking sense, conceptually. There is really no good way to execute this batshit idea of Lucifer having a daughter and that daughter deciding to start a fucking hotel in Hell to redeem sinners so they can go to Heaven. Also, the culling shit with the angels showing up to just kill already dead souls for no reason also makes no sense and there really isn't any way to make it make sense.

Secondly, when making yet another piece of media inspired by Christian canon, even if it is Christianity and you hate the religion, you absolutely have to know the source material before you go fucking with it. That's why, for example, Dogma is such a good movie but this series falls flat even though both are comedic critiques of Christianity - Dogma understands the subject well enough to criticize it intelligently whereas Hazbin feels like it was conceptualized and made by someone who only watched like two episodes of Veggie Tales and otherwise knows jack shit about the religion. Throwing Lilith in there is worse because she isn't even in Christianity and it has the same vibes as when CCD classes host a Passover Seder by and for a bunch of gentiles to 'teach' about what Jesus was up to when he was around. It's just so disrespectful. Actually, that's what it is - the creators learned everything they know about Christianity, Heaven, and Hell from Tumblr posts which is definitely why she's in there.

If they knew more about the thing they're trying to make a whole ass show about, Adam and Eve wouldn't have been angels, there would be no hotel because you could just have the creation of Purgatory instead or, at the very least, some take on the harrowing of Hell and salvation of the virtuous pagans in Limbo. Also, even if you don't want to touch the Bible because it's icky (and I mean yeah), all you had to do was read like Dante's Inferno and peep the Ars Goetia and then actually make a structured Hell with a hierarchy and everything. I think kinda like what Rachel Smythe did with the worldbuilding in Lore Olympus, they wanted to modernize Hell for some reason, so the turf war/mafia type shit was supposed to replace a stronger hierarchy of Hell with princes and dukes and presidents and such, but I fucking hate it and there's no goddamn structure.

More importantly, the worldbuilding of Hell itself completely misses the fucking point of Hell as a thing. Hell is there both to contain Satan and the fallen angels who joined him in that uprising thing that one time and also to serve as a place where sinners go when they die and are punished for their sins. We never see even once any sort of actual system for sorting all these souls and punishing them for their sins. On the contrary, characters like Angel Dust appear to get to do drugs for the rest of their immortal lives and, since they're dead, it's not like those are going to kill them so it really doesn't read like a punishment. The closest we get to actual punishments are when the sinners/demons have gone and made deals that give other residents of Hell control over them, like how Husk is under Alastor's control and then Alastor apparently also has some kind of deal screwing him over, and Angel's situation with shitty boa dude is pretty similar too. It feels like they did the extermination shit to replace punishment in Hell along with these deals we see here and there, which is utterly fucking ridiculous and makes absolutely no sense.

The other thing I'd add kind of going off that is that Heaven in this series also makes literally no fucking sense. It's actually also the biggest issue I have with Good Omens that it makes NO SENSE for the angels to have no clue what God's plan is or, in this case, how souls even get into Heaven. The whole fucking point is that there's an entire, nicely structured hierarchy for exactly this. Seraphim, cherubim, and thrones are all closest to God, so they can get the info from Them and pass it to the lower ranks. Hell, this could even be how you get problems, like you make it a bit of a gimmick that Heaven runs on a massive game of telephone. It also could've been a way to have some really cool variety in character design, so maybe some of the higher ranking angels look like the weird biblical shit with all the eyes and fire and they get progressively more normal as you go down the hierarchy. Instead, they picked like three recognizable names, made them into pretty people with wings and potentially also stupid Homestuck looking masks, and threw them in our face while just refusing to actually bother with worldbuilding or character design.

That brings me to the third thing which is that, when doing a series like this based on something like Christianity, you really have to sit down and figure out what kind of God your Christian God in your series is going to be, even if They never show up on screen. Is this God distant and neglectful and that's how all this shit is happening? Or do we have the wrathful God of the Israelites who regularly exterminates Hell out of pure sadistic rage? Or do we have a weak God on the verge of death who is barely present out of necessity while the angels take advantage of that absence and run amok? And it's not even just that determining what kind of God is supposed to be the God of this series would inform why stuff happens like it does, it would also help the writers to have a sense of direction and motive for what happens.

The writing in the show is all over the fucking place and figuring out what kind of God this God is meant to be is the very first question they should've asked themselves and it would've prevented most of the problems that currently exist in the show. If we had that, then maybe we wouldn't have weird shit with Lucifer where he very much does not feel like he's the devil at all and also Charlie is supposed to have daddy issues but then he shows up and is just a really adoring and supportive dad so that doesn't make sense. If we had that, then maybe Hell would have a fucking structure because we would actually have the motive behind Hell itself and why it exists. If we had that, then maybe we could get into the nitty gritty of the ethical/theological complexities of Hell and how, no matter how you slice it, it's really God's will at the end of the day so we could get a whole debate over if Lucifer is even evil or if God is just controlling and sadistic and all that. If we had that then maybe we could even have some reveal about how sin isn't even a concrete thing and the true nature of Hell is that it's a place people choose to go when they die because they don't feel worthy of salvation and they feel in their soul that they need to be punished. Anything, really.

Fourth is that it really, really shouldn't be a musical series. The pacing fucking sucks and they overexplain everything and I just feel like if you took all the time spent on shitty musical numbers and instead put it into showing, not telling, and also developing characters and relationships, it could be a lot better. If there was more time for shit, then maybe Charlie could not be a Mary Sue and Vaggie could have a personality and Angel could be an actual fucking character that isn't just an animated twink with trauma who gets off on violating people's boundaries. Also, I just really didn't like most of the songs in the series (outside the series they're fine) and I skipped a lot of those scenes.

Fifth and final is that it really just wasn't funny. A lot of the stuff that was supposed to be funny was just excessive swearing that felt completely unnatural, like that tiktok going around of that girl saying the n word. If you're bothering to do a whole series set in Hell that's ostensibly about Christianity, then why tf aren't you leaning more into biting criticism of Christianity for your humor? If they'd just gone full Dogma with this, it would've been so much better but no.

So yeah, it fucking sucked and so did the character design.

[edensremains]

consequences 2

↳summary: aftermath of consequences!

↳LALALALALALALALALALALALALALA Vox in pain

Vox only realized after three weeks that you really weren’t coming back.

He’d spent those first few days watching the city cameras for any sign of you without any luck, the last time he was able to see you being you walking away from him and out of his life for the foreseeable future. He didn’t think how permanent that might be, not that he was able to think much at all after you’d walked out on him.

He figured you’d take a few days to settle with things, get comfortable with the idea of going public, and they’d move past the entire hypnosis thing with a chat and everything would be fine. Like it always was.

Three weeks without his love.

The one that he could tell was just a pretty little lost thing when you’d first arrived in the Pride ring, having teleported to the wrong ring and found yourself wandering the streets unsure of what to do with the turn of events while your energy was depleted, back when you were fresh to it all. Stunned by their appearance, Vox had nearly tripped over his own feet trying to rush over and introduce himself. Who the fuck knew there was a new Ars Goetia in Hell? This could make a good story, his station could be the first to break the news in all of Hell! A diamond in the rough that could be cultivated by his hand for his brand, all depending on if he played his cards right.

You’d been so, so sweet to him back then. So much, in fact, he’d forgotten all about his goal of making you a sensation and instead let you talk his ear off while the two of you walked to the V tower, Vox having extended his help after hearing your story for the reason of later redeeming a favor in exchange for your temporary stay, while you regained your energy. A multitude of possibilities crossed his mind as he walked alongside his new acquaintance.

He remember how you’d fluttered around the tower at first, trying to earn your stay by fumbling with the cleaning and keeping things tidy and in order when you could spot anything that wasn’t already pristine. Usually after one of Valentino’s tantrums, you’d be quick to sweep up the shattered glass from a bottle and have the spilled wine cleaned up before the demons assigned to it could even get the mop.

He’d admit, it felt nice having almost-royalty play housekeep to you after a long day of dealing with the Vee’s stressing him the hell out the entire day with their shenanigans. You’d do what you could while waiting for him to come home like a sweet thing so the two of you could continue your chat, and you could ask him how his day went and offer some insight about what to do when Velvette was seconds away from sparking another outrage with her commentary on an Overlord that would get their underlings all up in a frenzy.

Sometimes he’d take that advice, and be baffled when it actually worked out in his favor. When the agreed week and a half was up and you were ready to go, he’d asked you to stay on impulse after a particularly successful day, thanks to you. You’d asked if he was redeeming his favor, and he’d said he wasn’t but he’d make it worth your time if you just stayed a little longer. And he did, feeding you tidbits of the rings he knew about and who ruled over what territory in this ring, which you jotted down enthusiastically. Something about a mentor, who he’d later come to despise for wrenching you out of his hands for some stupid fucking trip to a ring where you’d stay for an extended amount of time and leave him pacing and yearning like a fool head over heels. Like one of those bitches on a leash being strung along helplessly, some simp in love that he certainly wasn’t.

Back then, when the third week had passed after he asked you to stay yet again, you’d said you really must be on your way before their mentor, Lucian, began to worry. He remembers the jolt of displeasure, the rising feeling of wanting to just reach out and drag you back into his office for a little longer so you could tell him all about whatever it is you were fixated on that day once more, filling his senses with nothing but your voice. So instead, he’d decided to redeem his favor for a date.

And what a fucking time he had. By the end of it, he was sure he NEEDED to have you either in his arms or his bed by the end of the night.

Neither had happened of course, because you’d excused yourself the moment the two of you were done at dinner to fix yourself up, and he remembers the odd feeling of anxiety that you’d come back and see right through his facade, and call him out on just how eager he was to have you around him for just a moment longer than he should. Instead, you two walked home together hand in hand with your quiet giggling and his quick remarks, and he watched you go back into the guest room with a dopey smile on his face, a lingering imprint of a lipstick stain on his screen.

It was a sweet dream come true.

And now, he’d finally woken up.

It was like the night after getting shit-faced or come down from a good high, the sudden awareness that you felt like shit and probably looked like shit too. It was bad when even Val came to him about it, asking where you’d gone and why the hell his screen was going through error after error whenever you were brought up, slow pixels overtaking his expression before he could force it back down.

Dealing with Valentino and Velvette was a headache, interviews and hosting his regular shows was a fucking drag and he’d put a bullet through his wires if he had to see another surveillance screen devoid of your presence. How the fuck were you avoiding all his cameras? What the hell were you doing, either holed up somewhere like a mole or were you flying above them? Were you still even in the ring? It boggled his brain and made his circuits itch, suddenly having you withheld from his reach after your time together. Did two years not mean shit anymore?

Being outed publicly to being with two notorious Overlords couldn’t be that bad, could it? There’s enough attention that comes with being an Ars Goetia anyways, whatever the hell was going on in high society. Whatever it is, his partner was off the fucking map and he was losing his shit.

What the fuck are you even supposed to do first? He’d done everything he could, reached out to every unfortunate soul under contract, had eyes and ears everywhere for even a sighting of an owl-like demon, but nothing ever came up. The facial recognition system never came up with anything when he was powered down and unable to stare at the multitude of screens for a passing glimpse of the one he’d called his for the last two years.

It only bit him in the ass now to have asked so little about their mentor. All he had was a name, absolutely nothing else. Was he an Ars Goetia as well, or hired by one to guide you? What ring was he in? What did he do when you were gone? Where did he come from, where did he stay?

In a way, he liked having you all to himself.

He realized far too late he didn’t like sharing. It grated his nerves to hear you being brought up across the airwaves, even if he was the one who pushed you out into the light as his own, the commentary and speculation’s made him want to claw everything in sight when they’d gotten something wrong or a little too right. He didn’t want to hear about the person that you spent so much time with, the one that he’d never met but knew would take away the one thing he held so tightly at night, claws digging into your sides with arms wrapped crushingly around you before you’d make a small noise of complaint and he’d force himself to ease up or risk waking you fully. He hardly ever powered down at night when the two of you were new to your relationship, instead choosing to run out of battery in the middle of the day rather than miss a moment of his one and only in blissful slumber after helping to preen your feathers for the night.

He’d fucked himself over, giving you a name for yourself and having that be the thing that tore you from his grasp. He’d always known where you were, where you’d be, where you’d go, when you’d be home, all the time as if on schedule. Suddenly having you so far, it reminded him of the times you’d be away on those trips of yours , still full of anticipation he’d see them again soon.

As more weeks passed by, he was sure it was over.

And what could he do with that?

Swallowing thickly, he’d reclined in his seat in front of the wall of monitors. He’d sent out a last ditch request and had his underlings scope out anyone by the name of Lucian that belonged to the high society of Hell in this ring currently. The result? This Lucian must be a goddamn hermit, or you had been lying to him.

That was out of the question. You had never lied to him before, you’d never had a reason to, he made sure of that. So this Lucian must be with you, if he had to guess, the one keeping you under wraps. Or worse, taken advantage of his love in this delicate time and kept you for his own like he’s real fucking sure he’d wantedtodoallalon—

He sat there and let out a long sigh.

Every time he thought about you, he only wishes you’d just turned to look at him when he’d turned on that hypnotic swirl on his screen a second time as you were walking out of his life.

He could have sat you down and they could have talked about things. He could have forced himself to apologize when he turned off the hypnosis after making sure they weren’t going to leave him right then and there. They could still be together, if you’d just looked at him.

When did you stop doing that?

Was it all really just because of the announcement?

He couldn’t help but think maybe you’d wanted to leave him. How else could it have been so easy to disappear out of his life like this? Did you have a plan, or force yourself to figure it out when he’d made them lose their will?

He silently cursed at himself, the least he could have done was take down that stupid fucking broadcast that ruined everything for him. A simple broadcast or you. He’d never weighed it against each other, never believing you leaving was ever in the question.

They’d hardly ever argue, you and him had an understanding about each other, or so he had thought you two did. He thinks he could have changed if you’d asked him, but he knows he wasn’t listening to you that day, too amped up on the elation of Hell finally knowing he’d managed to snag an Ars Goetia for himself, one that wasn’t like the rest of these pricks that tried to undermine everything he’d built at every turn the second they could. One that never made him think he could lose it all with one misstep, until he did.

He’s sure he could make things right if he saw you again. Mend what he broke so carelessly in his excitement.

You’d come back to him, or he’d find you. It was only a matter of time. And when that time came…

He could tell you all about this period of his life when he reunited with you, like talking about a bad dream when you were back into the safety of someone’s arms, all warm and content, basking in your presence and the scent of your skin.

So he’d wait.

And look at these feeds without wavering until he saw the familiar sight of your feathery figure again.

Till death do the two of you part, and you both are already dead, so where did you think you were going?

The sound of an alert hits his screen and he jolts up, eyes wide as his screen hones on on a figure, the facial recognition system having zoomed in on the one he had been desperately waiting to see all these weeks.

There you were.

[pinkgy]

Belphegor Theory

Ok, so I might and might have not spent about two hours doing some research about Belphegor because that "Halo" of his has me questioning a lot of things, and this is what I came up with, but extremely summarized.

I'm most definitely no expert on the topics I'm about to talk about, I just dug a bit too deep into the internet and got some interesting things, I would like to know if I'm wrong and I would love to read opinions about this.

I got the information from looooots of sources, and credit to all of them.

So, we know that What in Hell is Bad is heavily inspired by biblical concepts, the Seven Deadly Sins are from Christianity, the Seraphims are mentioned in Christian, Islamic, and Jewish Literature, and pretty much all of the nobles are from the Ars Goetia, and many of them are associated with Christian Demonology.

The game also has many references to other religions and beliefs, but if I were to make a list of all those references, I'd be here writing for days.

Let's dig a bit into who is Belphegor outside the game.

Belphegor is referenced in both Jewish and Christian traditions, he originates from the Moabites, a very ancient tribe that habited the region of Moab, an ancient Levantine kingdom. Belphegor is originally the Moabite god Baal-Peor, who was associated with fertility, sexual power, and orgies, then he was absorbed into Hebrew mythology and later into Christian demonology.

In Christian Demonology, Belphegor is one of the seven princes of hell, and he represents the deadly sin of Sloth. He is also associated with laziness, apathy, and negligence and his name means "Lord of the Opening"

Belphegor is physically described in many ways, a very interesting fact is that in the Dictionnaire Infernal, a book written by Jacques Auguste Simon Collin de Plancy that summed up, is an illustrated version of the demonology, he is described as always having his mouth open, and the hand placement he has in the banner that Prettybusy recently released could be making a reference to that.

(Another interesting fact is that he's said to be hard to conjure because his sacrificial offering is excrement, but I prefer to ignore that)

Belphegor is also referenced in the Kabbalah, which is like a philosophy, or to be more precise, an esoteric method, discipline, and school of thought in Jewish mysticism that deals with the essence of God and the universe (I just copy&pasted this, it's a bit hard to explain, srry)

In the Kabbalah, guess what Belphegor is.

A fallen angel.

To be more precise, he was an angel in the order of the principalities.

Belphegor is known to be an enemy to the sixth sephiroth and the archdemon (or the leader) of the Togarini, they are the demonic counterparts to the angels that rule over the 10 Sephirot of the Tree of Life.

For context, the Sephirot are the ten emanations or attributes of God in Kabbalah.

I also read that some demons under the Togarini are Lilith, Samael, and Thaumiel, but there's very little information about that so I'm not going to use this as a fact.

The reason why he fell from grace is not explicitly mentioned, but it's somewhat implied that it was related to his association with the sixth Sephirah "Beauty" and the fact that he is depicted as a demon who tempts individuals with ingenious inventions, wealth, and discoveries (I also copy&pasted this)

It's also said that he rules over seduction, promiscuous men, and MISOGYNY.

I'm not sure if there are references from the Kabbalah in What in Hell is Bad, but if there were, it would be super interesting, as I said in the beginning, the game has a lot of references from various religions and beliefs, I would love to make a separate post about that just because I may have way too much free time to investigate that.

Or maybe I just spent 2 whole hours writing almost 700 words about a ton shit of things I barely know anything about and creating a theory just because of a black circle above a fictional character's head that it's probably just a horn just like @thrones-of-buer said on a post.

(I still have some doubts about that because it seems like in the new illustration that pb released of him today he has a unicorn horn just like Beelzebub, but I could be wrong)

This is just a theory tho, I'm most likely wrong, but I thought it would be interesting to share this with y'all :D

Sorry if there are any typos, I'm reaaally sleepy right now.

[moistrodent]

Bro sorry for sudden random rant but I fuckin hate viv for ruining demonology like we get it not everything should be accurate but the way she drew and wrote 7 deadly sins and ars goetia and UWU'D/purified them.....I fuckin can't I can't even able to find to look them up without that pathetic dumb sex obsessed owl who pretend to be stolas....even helltaker demons make more sense than whatever viv made if viv can't handle the fact about (1 demons are evil and immoral. (2 hell is eternal punishment and not some kind of magical Hollywood wait every year for angels to come down do punishment (3 sinners are in hell for reason and not misunderstood (4 sins aren't good thing and it cause suffering in way or another,then she should stay away from demonology before she ruin more demons...what's next? Krampus is a rainbow wolf demon and is a good guy who adopt homeless kids and is dating santa?

thank you anon. Viv seems to not understand how all sins overlap. “Mammon represents all the sins” SO DOES EVERY OTHER DEADLY SIN OH MY GOD-

It pisses me off so much. As a satanist.

[soulfulazrael]

Why me not likey Stolitz and how I decide to write it

In light of recent news that the Full Moon episode will come in this lifetime and will be most definitely HEAVILY Stolitz centric I decided to make a post about what I do not like about this ship (I know, revolutionary) and how I prefer to write it and how I would prefer for it to be written in the show itself... Okay. I am not 100% honest here. Part of the reason why decided to write cringey post about a ship in a disappointing cartoon is this:

THE REASON KIDS ARE TOLD TO NOT TO TALK TO STRANGERS IS BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU! (Yes, Filthy Frank reference. I am not in fact saying they are some predator, I just think they are cringey enough to warrant a reference to good old days when you pointed and laughed at this shit. Do not harass them. Fuck you if you do.).

Okay. Let's get to the ship. Careful... This is going to be long. Filled with annoyance and frustartion boiling over due to collective brain damage I get whenever I see Stolitz shippers talk like teenagers in heat. Enjoy this cancer.

Stolitz has LOTS of issues. Mainly, the writing. Which is atrocious on it. And the worst part about the writing? It didn't have to be this way. Because to me all of the issues with it are amplified by how much of a missed opportunity it is. But let's not lose track. Basically the writing on it is pretty much a standard Disney fare of first sight love which already puts us in a very VERY bad position. This Ars Goetia, one of the most powerful immortal demons is all over this one Imp because they saw them once as a child as they tried to make balloon animals and saw them smile on a line. Riveting. The whole childhood thing already kills A LOT of my interest here. It's so transparent what they are doing that this is just embarrassing. It's manipulative as all Hell (yes, yes, I said Hell, get it out of your system) and adds fuck all to this relationship besides the amount of cheese to make everyone in the world lactose intolerant. And you use this kind of plot for an ARS GOETIA from HELL. WHY!? Why do this? I know it is subversive, but it is so goddamn stupid.

And the stupidest part about it is what this garbage takes away. Because, due to this DAMN ship Ars Goetia are not different in ANY way to normal Hellborn. At all. They just have magic and look like furry avian Habsburgs. All of them are almost indistinguishable from normal Hellborn aside from us being told they are royalty and them having magic. They age the same way as Imps, Hounds and Humans do and if you want to give the "HELL YEARS" excuse, let me remind it would mean in a year time in this show we would have to go to sci-fi and there would be constant wall of bodies falling from the sky every day.

Basically this robs Ars Goetia of being truly unique. They have no unique culture, they have barely any different personalities, they are just bird people. And it's a shame because woes of immortality could be explored here in VERY interesting ways and much of that could have been applied to Stolas as well which I will delve into later. All you need to know for now is that this already puts a SOLID hit to worldbuilding of this setting and makes all the more boring.

Which is what this relationship is at this point. BORING. It's boring now because now it is very clear what direction it will all go in as both Blitzo and Stolas are just pushed as this perfect for each other pair where most amount of conflict is simply "Will they? Or Wont they?" Oh Gee! I wonder what the answer is about this relationship with a character you admitted to change because you found the pairing cute. Golly Gee. I am so anxious to find out. It is simply a waste. There is NO meaningful conflict left here besides them just finding out they are perfect for one another and then beating all those meanies that are in their way and the most meaningful conflict will probably be about forcing Octavia to see how GOOD Blitzo is and how it is okay for Stolas to do what he does... I may or may not have some prior knowledges btw, but I wont say anything. All you need to know is that I want to die.

Which brings us to the most insulting in my opinion issue with both Stolas and Blitzo (O is not silent you gremlin). NOTHING is allowed to be their fault. NOTHING. Every time something seems like they fucked up is immediately forgiven, revealed to NOT be their fault or is swept conveniently under the rug under the guise of "it's just a comic relief bit" or "it's just filler". I genuinely hate that. Both Stolas and Blitzo are awful and flawed people and it would be NICE if this show LEANED INTO THAT. Because that is interesting, but instead this show wants you to root for them by making you forget they are flawed, awful people. Where everyone against them is the evil one or a friend that needs to forgive them and see how hurt THEY are. That is infuriating because it makes both of them a goddamn chore to watch as they are facing no consequences or accountability for any action they did. There is no nuance there. They are just nice people who at most have issues with communication and like to swear, have sex and cry (which doesn't make them deep). I must say Blitzo has SOME interesting conflict to him, but it's beaten down by how much this show tries to make him into some ultra cool badass who is never really in the wrong despite him acting like a complete twat. Which makes me feel like the writing team genuinely thinks like Daffy here at the end:

And I know this is set in Hell, but it means Jack when you try to make people believe your "asshole" characters are not them. You do not embrace it. You just try to have a cake and eat it too and Viv, you need to go on a diet with how much it happens in both of your shows.

In this topic I think user named crooked-wasteland made a better case than I ever could about the way this show tries to absolve Blitzo at least. Linke here: https://www.tumblr.com/crooked-wasteland/735943916971524096/the-anti-bojack-anti-intellectualism-and-the?source=share

It's a good read that delves nicely into why Blitzo's conflicts end up being so shallow. Also adding to that post. Think about it. Barbie is made up to be the child killer, drug dealer and someone who *gasp* doesn't forgive little pure Blitzy who just wants to reconcile. It's clear who's side this show wants you to be on. Again. NO nuance. Just telling you what to think.

And then there is the side characters in this "conflict" where most characters are basically just props. Loona? Prop to make Blitzo look better. Octavia? Stolas needs some conflict, let's throw her dumb ass in (HOW DO YOU NOT KNOW STARS APPEAR AT NIGHT!? Your family's entire shtick is astrology!!). Stella? Oh she is just evil and stupid. Andrealphus? He is just evil, but actually smart! (actually no, he is also as dumb as a stump, but he speaks like he is not so I guess he is not supposed to be, but something did not pan out too well). Paimon. Boring shithead we saw a million times already and yet another shitty dad, because relationship issues and daddy issues are two things Viv apparently knows. A good video about it I have below:

TL;DR this ship brings down SO MANY characters down the drain just to make these two look as good as possible. Where nothing is their fault and the most amount of conflict is them realizing how perfect they are for one another and convincing others of that fact I guess. And the worst part is that there has been hints of good writing for it in Season 1 at least in Ozzie's before this series decided to just quickly throw that into the garbage can.

Your best episode and you try to minimize impact it had as much as possible... I am so confused about this direction. Just... WHY!? Now for what I would prefer...

First what I think should have been done. I think this show should have leaned in more into Stolas being an Ars Goetia. An immortal, few hundred years old Ars Goetia. Because that already provides this story with a lot of possibly interesting conflict. Because this one fact would make Stolas all the more complicated as he would already be out of reach in terms of judging him by our own mortal standards. A creature that is few hundred years old that felt empty and bored over so much time of pure stagnancy that finds some semblance of joy and pleasure in the arms of an imp it would not even look at in any other way. A creature that because of it's immortality revels in such new experiences to feel a semblance of anything at all. Where it's purpose is lost to it and instead this demon takes joy in every bit of pleasurable experience that it can latch onto, but in doing so he hurts A LOT of people around him, like his own daughter and while he likes to say he cares for her he still inheritly still wants to feel alive as he is never allowed to.

That already gives Stolas on his own a lot of interesting conflict. He is still understandable in his pursuit of joy and happiness and excitement, but also showing the hedonism and pure selfishness in this pursuit. Where he throws all he has on the wind all for the sake of seeking something good for himself. Is it wrong? Is it correct? No idea. What do you think? That is the thing this series should do. ASK questions. Not answer them! Treat your audience like adults who can make up their own mind which is something this show simply doesn't do which infuriates me on a deep level.

And Blitzo. Lean in, into him being a greedy piece of garbage that gets his just comeuppance when he decides to latch himself onto this noble due to his own greed. Make it his faults that get him into this position and make him stay in it. And maybe if he does start to feel something for this demon as this other one may as well, maybe delve into WHY both of them are attracted to one another. As Blitzo could be attracted to power his position gives him and Stolas to the freedom he receives by being with Blitzo. Both of them loving more the ideas each one allows them to know instead of the people they really are and maybe have the conflict be about first them discovering those growing feelings, but then discovering what they are really pointed towards.

And there is no need to make Stella innocent either as she could be also another extreme adding to the misery, but not because of any inherited evil nature that wants her to hurt Stolas for LOLS, but instead is another victim of the immortality and status all Goetias have. Where it is almost impossible to not be on some level broken in mind.

And in this conflict it could be Octavia who is the anchor for both. A piece of normalcy as she did not live for so long and so is the most human piece in that place.

Some ideas here. And here is how I write it. Because me personally I choose to write it as Blitzo and Stolas both being attracted not to each other, but to what the other gives them. Stolas being forever frustrated about the position he never asked for giving him no freedom where he finds this one Imp that allows him to revel in his deepest and darkest desires and Blitzo being someone who deeply regrets his own decisions, but is too deep to pull out without losing all that he has gained and so pushes Stolas to be worse so he can keep profiting off of him.

Stella in this scenario is not a innocent soul either as in my version she is far more cold, distant and is obsessed with order and subjugation of others in order to elevate the status of her family which she actually cares about, but in a way that feels cruel and demanding. A contrast to Stolas who is a pure hedonist who while seeks joy and happiness where he doesn't have to be afraid is still a monster who's idea of happiness is indulging in most depraved acts without having to care for anyone.

And anchor there being Octavia who both of them care about, but is still hurt by both as both of them find it hard to look at the world in the way that is different from what they were taught and accepted through hundreds of years of their lives. Where many terrible events shaped their lives into those two extremes that have way of existing with one another without the risk of them both destroying one another as Stella wants Stolas gone for tarnishing their reputation and putting their family at risk while Stolas hates Stella for always pulling him with his leash he had to live with all his life. And Octavia through all of this has to find her own way to become someone better. Where she needs to find a path where she can possibly not lose either one and come out of this as someone better.

This is what I would prefer. A conflict where no side is really good, all of them are deeply flawed, complicated and very hard to pin as to which one is good or not. Where it is up to those in the audience as to what to think of this conflict. In another post here I made (like first one and this is second) I linked that fic so I will just say the name.

Song for the Quiet Bird. Stella/Moxxie ship fic. Yeah, I know. If you find it interesting check it out. And no. I do not say Stolitz should be written as I would want it to be. I just say this ship needs more nuance, more interesting characterization, more chemistry and interesting ideas. It needs to be less... cartoony than it is right now because so far it just feels like a dumb telenovela.

Okay... That was... a lot. I definitely did not cover everything I think of Stolitz. I have too much chaos in my head and I feel dizzy after typing all of this shait. Agree with me or not. It doesn't matter. If you read this that means you got very far into my incoherent rambling and I thank you for it no matter what you take from it.

I am just a human disaster with weird goddamn obsessions. Sorry for this being so chaotic. It's a reactionary piece of dumbassery from me. Maybe I will some day post something more coherent. If anyone cares. For now... Take care. Canon Stolitz is shit. At least for me. Disagree? Feel free to! Agreed? Sweet... Leave a comment if you have something to add to this... thing. I always enjoy that. If anyone gets this far.

[wihellib]

I knew there was a demon called Amy in Ars Goetia and that he’d probably show up at some point, but I was really hoping that PrettyBusy would use the alternate spelling of his name, Avnas.

I know several Amy’s in real life and I think that it’s a beautiful name (means beloved), but I’ll have a very hard time taking this demon from Hell seriously while also calling him Amy.

On another note, I’m surprised that they didn’t make him a pyrophile, since in Ars Goetia, if he’s summoned, then he first shows himself as a flame.