#chuck won

[queerdeans]

team free will & chuck

an exploration of chuck's control over dean, sam, and cas. and maybe propaganda for the chuck won theory.

song: american teenager by ethel cain

[hoarderheart]

yeah yeah cus like the thing is that New God jack had this whole ass speech about not being hands-on and not directly interfering with life and all that and so one could easily assume that that’s the reason why he didn’t save dean from that rebar, but THEN he brings *cas* back so what is it then? is it a self-imposed rule that he gets to break whenever?? and yeah maybe he’s got a soft spot for cas but then why wasn’t reviving him the first thing he did??? and since when was cas back? is he really back?? because if he was there and he could move freely we know damn well that he would’ve saved dean, “if cas was here…” “he’s not.” HE’S NOT. did jack really wait until dean was dead to bring cas back??? jack is all powerful all present and all knowing now, so he definitely knew that dean was gonna die and how he was gonna die and when it will happen. he was in the rain and in the bunker and in that damn rebar.. does cas even know that dean is dead? if he did, why didn’t he do anything? if he didn’t, why didn’t he know? could he even really do anything about it?? where is he??? WHERE IS HE???

[strawlessandbraless]

Being a demon was the closest Dean ever got to retirement

[supernaturalsidepiece]

NOOO DONT BE DOOMED BY THE NARRATIVE, YOU'RE SO SEXY, AHA!

Inspired by my fanfic.

[chuckwon]

I was randomly thinking about this little tidbit again and realized I never posted this video on here, so I thought I'd give you all psychic damage tonight.

Misha: “Obviously Chuck would be younger [in The Winchesters], and he’d be played by a…” Jensen: “Somebody much younger than Rob Benedict, like Alex Calvert.” –August 2022 (The Winchesters started airing in October 2022 and ended in March 2023)

Yeah... that checks out.

[inthatgreatsupernatural]

"The sunrise observed in a puddle-- a great metaphor."

"In That Great River: A Notebook" - Anna Kamienska (tr. Clare Cavanagh)

[carveredlunds]

Well, if you're going to meddle in things, finish what you started. After this, it's time to get around to the "there'll be peace when you are done" part of the song.

[worrynoodle]

🥧🍻Contains spoilers for Supernatural ending🍻🥧

I take what I said about the ending back. I've been rewatching and I agree that it wasn't right.

Throughout the entire series, we consistently see Sam and Dean encounter other hunters who usually represent two paths. In this life, you die or go insane ("You either die a hero or you live long enough to become a villain" -The Dark Knight). And of the two options, Sam and Dean seem to have decided that dying is at least better than potentially hurting someone. Neither of them actually believe that because they keep bringing each other back.

But this post is mostly about Dean's ending - death, in the line of duty, by rusty rebar.

During my first watchthrough, I could see - very surface level - that yeah, sure, Dean would want to die that way. Going out saving people, Sammy at his side.

But almost every other time (if not every time) Dean is faced with his own death, he decides he doesn't actually want that. He feels he must. He dies so others can live, that's his job, it's expected. But he would live if he could. When he made the demon deal to get Sam back, he confronts his nightmare self and says he doesn't want to die. He doesn't deserve to die. With the mark of Cain, in the confession booth he tells the priest that he knows he doesn't want to die and that he wants to live and experience life differently.

Dean wants to break away from the expectation that hunters die. Maybe he can't have a "normal" life. But he wants something other than what's expected of him. What God expected of him.

This was supposed to be Team Free Will. This was supposed to be about breaking away from God's Plan. Not dying like the little soldier daddy raised him to be but to become more than that. Break away from the narrative.

In the end, though, Dean is forced to have the death that everyone else planned for him. The self-sacrificing version of himself, other hunters, his dad, God. All the people we as the audience wanted Dean to be free of, to live in spite of - he dies like daddy's blunt little instrument. Cas sacrificed himself to the empty, finding peace in the face of never seeing the love of his existence again, in the face of literal eternal nothingness so that Dean could live and be more than [Dean] thought he could be. He was happy to sacrifice his happiness for Dean's. Just for Dean's life to be cut short the same way Cas died to avoid. (Death because of the work. Death like a soldier in battle.)

All of the times Dean and Sam (and Cas) die and come back to life, all of the people they find who live happily, the family they find together, the love they find, defeating literal God - it all felt like it was building to something more substantial. That they BOTH (*) were going to get something more than they expected - or, rather, resigned themselves to.

And on Sam's end - throughout the show, they show us, surface level and parallel to deans death, that him living a "normal" life without dean is what is expected. He left the life. He left Dad and Dean, went to college, had goals and aspirations, and had a serious girlfriend. His life was laid out for him. Just like death was laid out for Dean. But when push comes to shove, Sam doesn't want to live without Dean. Even when Sam thinks he can do it, like when Dean goes to purgatory, he comes the moment Dean calls and gets back into the life. When Dean dies from the mark, he says so. He was wrong, and he'll do anything to get Dean back. Everybody asks him why he would ever come back when was almost out and he tells them that he actually loves this life. That now he isn't forced into it but chooses it. He doesn't want a life without his brother in it. And that is what he was doomed to suffer. By the end of the series, I don't think Sam would have just let go like that.

Chuck said one brother had to kill the other. In other words, one lives, one dies. And that's what happened.

*I wasnt going to but now I am. Let's talk about Cas too! Through the show Cas dies again and again and again. God hates the disobedient angel with a crack in his chassis who fell in love with a man. God kills him. God wants him out of the picture but he won't go. He can't go. The story falls apart without him in it. Dean falls apart without him. But somehow his death is considered a good ending for him (good story telling wise, externally)? That confessing his love was enough? That dying in place of Dean was where he wanted to be? Sure, he was happy but it came at the price of that very happiness. It was had and taken in a moment. He was destined to die by God and that's what happened. (And we are supposed to believe that Dean just... lives on, cuddlin his dog and eatin' pie like he's not wrecked? That every other time Cas dies he falls apart but this time when Cas dies, they defeat God and true happiness is supposedly possible now - Dean would just give up? That he wouldn't try to get him back? Especially after a love confession? That just doesn't make sense to me.

My theory is that there's more to the ending than we know. That they did intentionally wrap it up there, that you can take it or leave it. But it leaves you wanting, leaves just enough questions unanswered that if they were to do a revival there's things they can do with the story.

Tl:dr: for a show about breaking away from the narrative, choosing free will, and not being held back by expectations, the ending really didn't fit well and let us down. IN MY PERSONAL OPINION

[rosemariad]

SUPERNATURAL SEASON 15 - THE BITTER END - SERIES FINALE

We finally made it here.

Ooooooooh boy. 😬

The opening for THE series finale felt out of place to me.

You’re gonna waste minutes on this really?

How about a discussion about how they beat God, like they actually managed the impossible - 2 dudes just take the fight to the OG master & creator of the universe and won that shit with some plan they pulled outta their asses. Their surrogate child went on to become the next primordial being to reign over the universe. But no, we’re not gonna even talk about any of that.

Coulda done a million different things even with the COVID restrictions (the two actors in a room across a table, do whatever to keep them safe) but whatever 🤦🏾‍♀️

So after God comes vampires w/ masks? Really SPN?

The minute Dean slammed the Impala’s trunk shut after sundown made me nervous (that would be the last time he’s with his Impala, the last time he ever sees her w/ his own eyes 🥺😭)

Out of all the folks to pull outta the SPN peanut gallery you pick that random chick from 1x20?! Jenny?! Just to kill her off anyway (so I spoke too soon, vampJenny is the official last female to die on this show)

Ah…the nail of imminent demise

That final shot of Sam & Dean was toooo fucking intimate.

Suddenly the Wincest people aren’t so crazy. Why are y’all encouraging this?! Dude, they’re brothers!?! #brothersnotlovers. They could’ve done it like the end of Pearl Harbor where they got Ben Affleck crying over Josh Harnett’s body in the crash. Gimme weepy Sam, that Oscar moment. Dean died sooo young 🥺😒 younger than Mary (I know she was technically in her thirties but TBH she was 64/65), bobby, Rufus, Ellen & John. This is why we can’t have nice things😔

Cas is gonna be so saaaad. He always fought so hard for Dean's sake, only for the guy to die so young…it’s an insult - an outrage really. Dean fought so hard for so long only for him to say - it was always gonna end this way?! 😡

He didn’t have to make it to old age (though he deserved to) but don’t let him die like this. All accepting so soon after resolving the meta plot 😔 there were things Dean probably wanted to do and now, he’ll never get his chance. He could’ve settled down with someone (it wouldn’t have been Cas since he got killed off already but shit I would’ve settled for Dean to settle with anyone for a minute, like Sam did) - also would’ve been nice to hear from Jody or Donna and others one last time but hey fuck the side characters 🤣 (oh COVID the scapegoat that keeps on giving - it’s like the showrunners forgot the convenience of modern technology).

So Chuck definitely won - he's no longer burdened by having to deal w/ the universe and one of the Winchesters died anyway. Not exactly as planned but they never broke free, not really. I totally subscribe to this theory. Especially since it’s alluded to that Dean Jr - Sam’s son - is a hunter also at the time of Sam’s death by old age (we think…I’m just saying that’s an awful not of tubes and stuff for the old man, maybe just to monitor his heart rate/health - eh)

The Sam wig is bad but eh - doesn’t bother me - we’re talking about a CW show wrapping up a project, it’s not the end of the world people, the plot is what matters and the plot here is a fucking shit show my lord. It’s not the first show to suffer a shit ending for a show that captivated worldwide audiences, but damn this is a bummer.

But yay for Sam apparently - couldn’t think of a better name for your son than Dean Jr.? It only makes sense to make the kid a junior if it was Dean’s actual kid, like Dean would’ve been Dean Sr. And his boy would’ve been Dean Jr. or Dean W. The II. And and hello there Woman Whose Face we don’t get to see (really committing to limiting women’s presence in the show - again probably blaming in on COVID but if you have a literal baby with this giant man, you can chance a woman being there in an actual camera shot where we can see her face 🙄) Back to Dean - again cuz of COVID? I guess - we don’t get to see him reunite with anyone (not his MOM even?) except Bobby for like 1 second and then he’s just driving around in his car. No roadhouse, no fishing, nothing but sitting in his car, alone killing time until Sam inevitably returns to him.

Oh what a shame…

So that happened I guess. SPN was something else, for better or worse. Probably never gonna get a show like that again. They tried it with the Winchesters spin off about a supposed alternate universe MaryxJohn thing and friends but honestly if its not about the Winchesters brothers or Destiel who cares 🤣 they pretty much wrapped up Sam & Dean’s stories thanks to this finale but Dean (per the Winchesters flop) could be brought back into the fray somehow if they wanted - but hey that’s what fanfiction’s for 😁

Well SPN it’s been interesting…sort of.

On that note…

I wanna thank the fans of the show, your hot takes, memes and general fervor over this show/story is what finally made me watch it all. Cuz I remember the TV spots from back in the day, cruising the CW channel on weeknights after school. I was too busy watching other shows to give SPN a chance while it aired. So thank you 🙏🏽

[dryaddean]

i have some thoughts about the finale. i don't hate it, i just find it hilariously stupid and nonsensical.

Cas helped. let's suppose Cas is out of the Empty and powerful enough to be working on restoring Heaven by the time Dean is dying on the rebar. Cas doesn't lift a finger to help him, in my opinion, selfishly because this is how he gets Dean to "come home" to him. i'm just trying to follow the writers' logic: Cas is around + Cas lets Dean die = Cas is fine with Dean dying. Dean is now literally in Cas' sandbox. yay?

let's suppose Jack had decreed that angels don't meddle in the affairs of humans, including Dean. when was the last time Cas, the indomitable Mr. Crack in His Chassis, was shown to be any good at following orders, especially where Dean is concerned?

Cas let Dean go on believing he was in the Empty, unreachable. ergo, i'm inclined to believe that that same Cas actively chose not to get involved in Dean's final death. it's very selfish but also very funny.

And your mom and dad... they got a place over yonder. omg let these people get away from each other. John and Mary-once-risen-twice-died are completely different people from who they were when they last were together (discounting 14x13). the fact that the line is delivered by Bobby when this Mary and AU-Bobby got it on close to her death is pretty rich.

and have we forgotten this (5x03)?

CASTIEL What about you? DEAN What about me? I don't know. Honestly, I'm good. I can't believe I'm saying that, but I am, I'm really good. CASTIEL Even without your brother? DEAN Especially without my brother. I mean, I spent so much time worrying about the son of a bitch. I mean, I've had more fun with you in the past twenty-four hours than I've had with Sam in years, and you're not that much fun. It's funny, you know, I've been so chained to my family, but now that I'm alone, hell, I'm happy.

he had just once let himself be unburdened of the duty to family drilled into him by his father. he had in Cas a shining example of defying conditioning and paving one's own way. It's been a long time since I've laughed that hard. It's been more that a long time. Years. are we supposed to believe he was happy post-15x18? over and over again, he kept falling into the same rut of carrying the weight of the whole world on his shoulders, of assuming the burden of responsibility, of familial duty. whose idea of heaven was it that the same man who had once expressed feeling chained to his family is now chained to his family for eternity? it's sickening.

lastly, considering that we know families are confined together, let's remember that Sam was married, with a son. i think this is something a lot of people who celebrate the brothers reuniting in Heaven tend to overlook, that soon enough Sam will be joined by his wife and son and perhaps his family too, and so it goes. who actually thinks Dean will care to stick around these virtual strangers?

i think he'd rather be off with his angel who has the power to carve out their own little piece of heaven. <3

[bubbles-on-the-tide-of-empire]

*banging on your window at midnight* -because you see, by rewatching Supernatural I to am doomed by and dooming myself to the narrative, and no matter what choices I make we always end up here, dean and I holding hands and throwing ourselves off this cliff together and onto fucking sharpened rebar just to wake up in the dark and find out that Dad's on a hunting trip, and he hasn't been home in a few days...

[hoarderheart]

Oh. Oh. So Dean made a deadly deal with Billie, but Cas couldn’t let him or any of the Winchesters die for it, so Cas broke the deal by killing Billie, who, exactly through the process of getting killed, gets revived and promoted to the embodiment of Death herself, who then eventually goes after Dean for killing her again, and Cas now has to sacrifice himself to save Dean by activating the end of another deal that he can’t and won’t break this time. A deal that he made because he couldn’t let their then dead son be taken away by The Empty, his son who had previously also brought him back to life, which angered The Empty in the process, The Empty who is petty and cruel enough to go after Cas and his son, and to make them suffer through a deal, a curse that Cas willingly accepts. A string of cosmic consequences. He won’t let them die, he won’t let them sacrifice themselves, but he will willingly do the exact same thing for them. Because he cares about them. Because he loves them. And for someone that is trying so hard to fight destiny, who’s had arcs about tearing the pages of it, that’s one hell of a poetic, fate-driven end. Tie the rope in any way, it’s still wrapped around your neck.

[purgaytorysupremacy]

You truly love each other so you might have been truly happy -- not one couple in a century has that chance no matter what the storybooks say and so I think no man in a century will suffer as greatly as you will.

Prince Humperdinck (to Westley) in The Princess Bride (1987)

[supernaturalsidepiece]

Another Chuck Won themed amv except this one's ~aesthetic~.

[chuckwon]

I simply don’t like when people act like what happened to Jack is what should have happened (as if the show didn’t deliberately spell out it would be Bad beforehand!), or like we can hand-wave GodJack as being fine and good in a continuation as long as other ~more important topics~ like destiel are eventually addressed.

Jack’s fate is the crux of the tragedy of the finale. Supernatural is a show about parents and children, and that cycle of violence remains unbroken. Jack was forced to become like his grandfather (the cosmic Father of the universe) because that’s who his fathers needed/wanted him to be. Jack shouldn’t be seen as an afterthought or a side note. He’s the thematic center that ties everything together, including the queer family structure of destiel.

So here’s my hot take: whether or not they go fully explicit with any kind of Chuck won concept (and they don’t necessarily have to)… any continuation must address that what happened to Jack isn’t a good thing — for him, for their family, or for the universe since the show stated God shouldn’t have personhood — in order to truly be fulfilling.

[inthatgreatsupernatural]

From the start I had a great desire to change the language, for example, to replace the word “grace” with something else. I was annoyed by the word “humility” and many other words, which I hadn’t used in a long while. It seemed to me that “faith” was also a matter for the dictionary. Of course, language is a system of metaphors and contains the whole experience of farming communities, migrant peoples, various social orders, monarchy, slavery, serfdom. We’ve grown used to many words, forgetting that they’re only metaphors, though in their own time they were actively metaphoric, new discoveries. I thought that ceaseless linguistic invention was required even in the realm of faith. Thinkers must be poets.

I’m slowly relinquishing my claims in linguistic matters, though, and I humbly return to faith and to humility, since these are word-vessels so saturated with content through ages of thought and use that to abandon them would be the act of a heedless parvenu.

"In That Great River: A Notebook" - Anna Kamienska (tr. Clare Cavanagh)