#coming to terms with their feelings. accepting they're in love. and not hating themselves over it
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dandelion--darling · 3 months ago
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Lowkey kind of interested in writing an angsty mobrei fic involving the hanahaki trope... I was thinking of a plot where Reigen has been secretly in love with Mob for years but has been in denial and such deep repression about it that he winds up getting a hanahaki curse. Reigen has been nursing these feelings for far longer than he'd ever admit and he had hoped that Mob going to university in an entirely different city would have curbed the feelings. Reigen knew he was a fool for thinking that, but he was just so desperate for these feelings to go away because he knew they're disgusting and repulsive. As if he would ever be good enough for Mob, as if he deserved someone as wonderful as him... and he would never dare drag Mob down or clip his wings, never again. So, he was perfectly fine letting these feelings burn him alive from the inside out and just act like everything was fine, as it always has been.
But, Reigen ends up attracting a hanahaki curse because of his refusal to acknowledge and accept his feelings for Mob. There is a way to exorcise the curse, but it would end up with Reigen losing all love for Mob, and he outright refuses to do that. Reigen isn't quite sure what to do, but he can't tell anyone that he's cursed because they'd start asking questions, and he can't handle their inevitable disgust... so he just decides to hide it. His health begins to deteriorate, and he just pretends that he has no idea what's happening to him once Tome and Serizawa begin to get worried. Reigen tries his best to hide it and act like the constant exhaustion and pain aren't wearing him down, and he's successful for the most part.
Until he's not able to hide it anymore. Tome and Serizawa are worried sick over him, and Dimple is the one who finds out he's cursed with the hanahaki sickness. He's old enough that he knows exactly what it is, but no amount of prodding will get Reigen to admit just what it is that's driving those flowers deeper and deeper into his lungs. It gets bad enough that Reigen needs someone with him at all times to actually help him and make sure he doesn't choke on all of the petals. Tome, Serizawa, even Ritsu try to make him talk and admit what he's keeping under wraps, but Dimple is the only one who gets close.
Now... what happens when Mob returns from university and immediately takes over Reigen’s care the moment he heard Reigen was so sick-
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numberonetacostan · 2 months ago
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About that eye headcanon you made a while back: do you think that pickle would also have eye problems from s1? Do you think that taco would go done late at night for some chamomile yea(good for eye strain) and find pickle already there making some? Do you think they would be quiet, taco nervous and sweating and pickle expressionless, before pickle wordlessly offers her a second mug? Do you think they would sit in the half dark drinking tea, maybe finally talking about what happened, maybe finally understanding? Maybe they’ll make this a bi weekly thing, when everyone is two loud and chaotic and need some time to decompress but hate being alone(something that they would learn they also have in common)?
Hi Flurry!!^^ Welcome, and thank you for sending in an ask!! :]
Sure!! I love it when their past deaths impact them permanently!! Taco and Pickle having issues with the same eye my beloved <3!
I'm not sure if Pickle would be making chamomile tea, since I see him as more of a drinks-way-too-many-soft-drinks sort of guy, so hear me out: Taco comes down and finds him in the kitchen, but instead of making tea he's holding frozen peas or some sort of ice pack over his injured eye? Pickle glances at her while she's panicking in the doorway, and then looks away. He's not gonna stop her from getting whatever it is she needs. And then she offers him the tea, since it would help with his eye, she knows with her injury it helps, yeah? She stutters through the offer, he accepts it, and that helps to ease them into their talk!!
I really like this though!! They have a nice, long talk. No stakes, just the two of them in the dark, speaking softly but with a lot of emotions!! There are so so many feelings. I don't think they'd get through everything in one of their little midnight meetups, but I think over a few instances that they find themselves alone in the kitchen late a night, Taco would make them chamomile tea and they'd continue where they'd left off or bring up something new they've wanted to talk to each other about. Taco still has trouble expressing her emotions properly, verbally and to herself, so the extra time would be helpful. Eventually they'd just... run out of hurt to talk about. They may have a thing or two every few meetups but it naturally just becomes them having little hangouts. They're not best friends in a traditional sense, and certainly not like they were before, but there's a peace and understanding between them, yeah?
Also, as per the other ask you sent in, I don't mind the ship!! Don't worry about it! :) It's only season 1 Taco that I don't really like to ship because of her general intelligence and lack of understanding of what's going on at any given time, but honestly, season 1 Pickle is not far beyond her facade in terms of brainpower, so I don't mind the pairing!
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sunsetconcert · 7 months ago
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this is a fic that i would LIKE to write, but unfortunately, the actual details of writing it drive me up the fucking wall. so i am posting the general framework here, just to get it out of my system. so:
CONCEPT: Sonic Forces Metamy Political Marriage.
four months into the war. the resistance is losing ground, they only control about 10% of the planet. and rather than just crushing them outright, eggman comes up with psychological warfare - he starts to torment them with terms of surrender. in particular, he targets amy by saying stuff like "You can save everyone, Amy! The war will be over, and everyone gets to go back home! You can save everyone, right now, if you just stop caring about your principles and surrender."
the terms of surrender are actually pretty good, but they're also pretty visibly designed to inflict maximum psychic damage on the resistance. the most IMPORTANT part, though, is that the terms of surrender require a binding ceremony between the resistance and the eggman empire. it's framed as a political marriage thing.
however - eggman never intended the terms of surrender to be accepted. it was purely a psych-out tactic. he never actually expected that the terms of surrender would be ACCEPTED. and by amy rose, of all people??? so eggman basically weasels out of it by saying now amy and metal sonic have to get married. amy and metal hate it immensely but begrudgingly accept it.
amy and metal manage to peacefully coexist for all of sixteen hours before they have their first screaming match, followed by a deeply personal conversation regarding their feelings about being engaged to each other. metal basically says "Nobody will ever love me. Nobody will ever love me, so just let me pretend otherwise until this farce is over with." and amy still hates him, but like... she's not going to be a bitch about that sort of statement. eventually they agree to have a big dumb lovey-dovey pretend wedding as a coping mechanism for their respective situations, and go back to hating each other afterwards.
(spoiler: they do not go back to hating each other.)
they then proceed to get WAY too invested in the wedding. like, unhealthily so. the argument over the flower arrangements go into the history books. when the time comes for the actual wedding, amy and metal sonic both decide to go big or go home. it is the biggest, gaudiest, ugliest wedding you have ever seen. everything is either hot pink or goth black and there is NO inbetween. the cake is like sixteen layers tall, the chapel is filled with so many flowers that it makes a few people sick, everything. MAXIMALIST WEDDING. eggman is just along for the ride at this point.
the bride and groom wear the ugliest fucking wedding dresses you've ever seen. amy looks like she's from a 1980s barbie commercial and metal sonic looks like a hot topic got their shipments mixed up with a bridal goods store. they are very pleased with themselves and they are also so fucking insufferable that basically all the guests heckle them most of the way through the ceremony.
halfway through the ceremony, infinite tries to crash because he's obsessed with attention and can't stand not being the most important person in the room. unfortunately for him, in the chaos of the wedding planning, eggman is SO DONE with this loser and promptly cuts all power to the phantom ruby prototype infinite is using. the gathered guests promptly kick his ass and toss him into a dumpster outside.
at some point sonic shows up for the sole purpose of leaving a gag gift at the wedding reception. like a toolbox just in case amy wants to inspect any of metal sonic's parts. sonic does NOT know the tools will be used for foreplay and would be fucking horrified to find out.
at some indeterminate point sonic and his very canonical bestie ian jr both break out of the death egg and tear down the eggman empire's stranglehold on the world while everyone else is obsessed with the wedding. the rest of the cast find this out like three weeks after the wedding goes down.
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pensbridge · 11 months ago
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A lil rant about cast shipping
OH. MY. GOD.
The commentary about actor personal relationships has actually made me scared to come on here. When any related hashtags trend, I'm like "WHY?"
This happens in every fandom, but I honestly give props to the Bridgerton actors for keeping composure and not leading with resentment towards the life changing dream that feeds them or the stupid quote-unquote fans that need to focus on the show, because I could never! Also, that 99% of their actors successfully remain private, which I completely understand why when people act the way they do.
And why they try to protect some of their private lives..maybe clearly exhibited in the fact that some of you did this the last time! -that people were so intrusive, (coming from someone who's not even that in the know and very out of the loop until large amounts of attention are brought to it) that his last gf seemed visibly overwhelmed by some of the total lack of boundaries. And that the threats over "rejecting" a fictional character & "he should be w/her" apparently went too far that Nicola had to willingly step in. And if you think, "it's harmless, I of course would never do that"... these parasocial relationships foster a following to people that will absolutely do that and join your hive mentality.
But, seriously..thinking that anything was done wrong here by the cast...Let me break down these arguments, because I've actually been biting my tongue on this:
"Finding out he had a gf ruined the show for me because of the premiere." I think it's time for therapy, and learning to separate fiction from reality.
Perhaps this is where some of the pre-conceived notions & outrage for the show came from (idk).
"If he would have waited, it would have been better and we could accept it." You liar! NEXT.
"But he lied. I feel cheated. They both led us on to believe what they wanted us to." This is laughable. They told 98 billion times that they were friends, they flat out said they weren't dating before Part 1 even hit the screens, and you were like "they're lying! hehehe. They don't know themselves.." including interviewers in the final stretch, which is so so pathetic of them
People were flat out telling you that they weren't dating & about personal relationships (fyi I think Nicola has had a long-term bf as well; so sad 4 u~honestly not positive on this but i think), and fans were very much NOT discreet about these significant others on every platform.
"I hate that it's PR." Again, I don't think they lied to you about being friends. I don't even think they played up aspects of their relationship. There's a great read somewhere on why they fall back on handholding and being affectionate. I honestly feel sorry for some of you that there's such a harsh line between what's platonic and what's romantic/that every affectionate interaction for you=romantic love and 'we should date.' If you're stupid and see what you want, that's on you.
If you're one of these people, know that I hate you. The press reaction is honestly the worst part of every single one of these shows.
The entitlement of this fandom knows no bounds (thank God some of you are sane).
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sophieinwonderland · 10 months ago
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Hi, we wanted to ask why you target anti endos so much (you know, traumatized people) instead of just existing in your own space and we exist in ours? We don’t mean any harm, just a genuine question we have. Like, what’s your thought process? Can that be explained please?
Because hate and ignorance are infections and if you allow them to fester, the consequences can be disastrous.
And because, like it or not, we all share the same space...
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More than ever, in such an interconnected world, separate spaces don't actually exist. There are, at best, isolated spaces where you can spread a ton of hate, but that hate is going to spill out and end up hurting people who aren't in those spaces, just as it did with Aimkid.
Or more recently, the Yaelokre server:
In my opinion, separate spaces are a myth. You can try to divide them for a time, but there will always be spillover.
Besides that... my end goal is conquering that globe.
I have this dream. A dream of a world that's aware and accepting of all types of plurality. It will be slow going and we'll need a lot of support to get there. And people need to be able to feel hope that it can and will happen.
I'm not sure how common knowledge it is in anti-endo circles, but if you've seen people saying "the future is plural," that started right here with me on this blog. (As far as I know. I suppose others could have said it first.)
But getting to that acceptance means we can't be content in staying in our own isolated corners. It's not viable for the future we want to build.
And when pondering the path to that future, one of the things I've thought a lot about is the response certain firsts will get.
If Aimkid faced such harassment just being an influencer with a moderate following for being a pro-endo traumagenic system, can you imagine the harassment that the first real celebrity to support endogenic systems, or even to come out as an endogenic system themselves, will have to endure?
What will the response be to the first scripted television show that explicitly acknowledges endogenic plurality by name as a real phenomenon? (I mean, the Chicago Med tulpa episode did that with tulpas but slipped under anti-endo radar since anti-endos don't watch Chicago Med.)
Currently, the science and opinions of doctors is overwhelmingly on the pro-endo side.
But it means nothing if that knowledge never breaches the spaces where it's needed most to correct misinformation.
For example, did you know that Stanford University funded an fMRI study into tulpamancers, taking scans of their brains during switching and possession? (Possession is a tulpamancy term for taking control of the body or part of the body without fully switching into front.)
There was an AMA a few months ago about this on r/tulpas.
The budget for the fMRI study was about $50k not counting the pay of the researchers.
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This does a pretty good job illustrating how much interest there is in tulpamancy and endogenic plurality that they were willing to invest so much into this project.
And the study actually found neurological changes during possession!
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But if you go into most anti-endo spaces, they'll tell you that this research doesn't exist. That not only does the science not support endogenic plurality, but that absolutely nobody is researching it because it's not real.
And they're able to claim that because they don't bother looking, never listen to the other side, and refuse to accept anything that contradicts their worldview.
These studies are real though, they're being conducted as we speak, and we're going to see far more of them in the future!
Where we are right now though, all three of the creators of the theory of structural dissociation could release a joint statement with the ISSTD that endogenic systems are real and valid tomorrow, and anti-endos would not hear about it in their echo chambers.
In short, I target anti-endos because lies will prevail wherever truth cannot breach.
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mimikoolover · 4 months ago
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yunjin’s i≠doll is the main song about the impossible standards for idols. Here’s clips of it around timestamp 11:50 and she talks a bit about it:
https://youtu.be/ETiv2mb8GvE?si=N8s9fT_E3Oc3-xTc
her other slower songs are nice too, raise y_our glass, jellyfish. Crazier with the group which she wrote and produced.
I just find it interesting the parallells in what source/hybe do with lessera compared to bts. They are, just like bts, extremely loved and hated at the same time, and the way hate storms was handled was showing more sincerity behind the scenes in docu style videos, which then had their antis saying they’re playing the victim begging for sympathy when they just can’t sing/aren’t as talented as other groups/yunjin said she wanted to change things but then ”doesn’t do anything just conforms, so she’s fake”, and so on.
It all feels… very familiar. Except when it’s women there’s extra layers to everything.
And yes I agree, I’m sure all idols are over the ridiculous standards from audience and these fuck ass companies. Some do speak out on things more than others. But I think it’s too hard to change things from the inside right now unless somehow there’s a whole idol revolution…
I also do wonder how much power bts have in that respect, and if they’ll amp anything up in chapter 3? In a way they have power because they’re big, but at the same time they are their whole own thing with a bigger international fan base than anyone else and they’re at a completely different stage in their careers and lives than younger idols. I’m not sure how much impact they alone have on the industry, companies, kpop audience in terms of what’s considered a scandal or what’s accepted. it’s not like several of them haven’t already spoken out about things and broken idol norms in various ways. I’m not sure what exactly they’d have to do for it to have real impact, considering they also have to protect themselves, as do everyone.
ooh thank you for the link and all the recs, i have a lot to check out now which is great😊
i see all your points and agree. i honestly think the more global kpop will become, the more likely it is that there will be progress within SK for idols. but in terms of bts...i think they are doing a lot with their lyrics and such in SK...but i'm gonna be honest here. they're not leading the way with e.g. being explicitly open about who they are dating. i mean that will be a massive step maybe? but there's idols who have families (thought they do tend to be in their 30s which i hear is standard for SK (starting families later than perhaps in the south in the US)). i think there's a part to it where on the one hand you have the idol industry and on the other you have SK society in general, the two obviously influence each other so...with hybe/associated labels i think those groups are not best placed to talk about harms by labels if they're not experiencing it themselves. so it's going to come more from the societal side of things...idk i'm just rambling lol
i think the best course of actions for everyone would be just be honest and live your life unapologetically, which i think bts are really good at (also making music that reflects this). seeing that could empower others to follow so it's a good example which hopefully leads to a lot of good.
sidenote just cause i wanted to mention it here, but reading jimin's letter yesterday and him being so sincere and open with us was just the best. so different than others (outside of bts), idols and western celebs alike. we are so privileged that bts members are so open with us always, and it's nice they are able to do that but presumably still being comfortable with what they share with us.
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cynicallarrie · 2 months ago
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Polaroid is my favourite Liam Payne song but I also like Midnight and Live Forever which foretells what happened to him sadly.
Jaded, faded, self-medicated
I didn't know I was waiting for you, yeah, yeah
Broken, smoking, 'til you came into focus
Sobered me up off of one hit of you
I was always gonna live fast, die young
Wasn't even trying to chase a high
I just didn't wanna feel so low, low, low
****
Harry - favorites are Falling, As It Was, Satellite, Fine Line
Louis - Holding Onto Heartache. I really like the way the final verse just winds up to a pitch and becomes really impassioned.
You know the party's over
When you're standin' in an empty space alone
And time can always heal ya
If you let it make its way into your bones
Nothing's ever easy
To be honest, I'm not easy on myself
The second that I see ya
The space between us just comes floodin' back
---
I got to say Harry and Louis have written a lot of heartfelt break songs for a couple who many Larries believe have never split once since 2010. I think the truth is very different. You don't write a song like Fine Line about a happy relationship.
I can't listen to Liam's music anymore. There were a lot of songs of his that I listened to for the first time after the fact of his death and they just kind of made me feel this sinking yet empty feeling inside. A lot of them give a real deep insight into the way he was struggling. It's almost as if he knew he was already dead, if that makes any sense.
Even some One Direction songs are haunting now. A lot of references to falling down and hitting the ground (even though I know that's a common metaphor for falling in love) and being left alone in hotel rooms. Kind of creeps me out.
I appreciate Falling but I find it to be a slog. It kind of reminds me of John Legend's "All of Me." Sorry, I just can't help skipping it.
As It Was really had to grow on me, and I understand why it's popular. I still can't say it's in my top ten though.
Satellite is one of my favorites too. It's got a pretty, outerspace-y feel to the instrumental and a cute meaning. Would probably put it in my top five if not top three Harry songs.
This one is about to be a wall of text, so my apologies lol...
Fine Line sounds like an evening spent on the beach after a long, hard day. The gorgeous guitar in it sounds like waves and that's probably on purpose. The little synths that suddenly come in toward I think the middle or close to the middle of the song and that you can just barely hear tug on my heart strings; they kind of give the vibe of, like, childhood innocence and I can't explain why? Maybe they're reminiscent of a toy piano or something? Then Harry's singing in a soft voice and high key throughout the entirety of the song, which almost evokes the tone of someone who's on the brink of tears as he sings about a relationship on the brink of falling apart. However it's still a feel-good song because there's a sliver of hope that things will be "alright" since they'll always be a "fine line," meaning that they'll just have to accept that they'll always be at that breaking point but never let themselves give in to the urge to quit just because it's the easier thing to do. It's a beautiful, beautiful song that I simply cannot attribute to a short-term relationship. I'm not trying to take a detour down Larry lane, but it sounds like everything marriage has always been about. I mean, Harry has never publicly been with a woman for more than two years. I simply cannot imagine somebody writing a song like this or a lyric like "you've got my devotion, but, man, I can hate you sometimes" about someone they've only been with for a brief period of their lives. That lyric alone screams marriage. Don't get it twisted by the way. This is my favorite song of his regardless of who it's about. It's very relatable on its own and again has such a lovely instrumental.
I'll have to give Holding On To Heartache another shot as it's normally a skip for me. Just one of his more boring songs imo. Honestly much of FITF for me is a skip. Whenever an album has an absurd amount of songs, it's usually a situation of quantity over quality. FITF had 18 songs to Walls' 12, and I only have 6 out of the 18 songs from FITF saved to my playlist on Spotify whereas I have 10 out of the 12 from Walls.
There are a lot of reasons to believe H & L broke up some time around 2016 and got back together some time around 2019. Or maybe it was super on-and-off. Who knows what the timeline was. All I know is Louis said Walls was about breaking up with "Eleanor" and then coming full circle back to her. Songs like "Always You" and "All Along" are telling. Harry's debut album seemed like a break-up album, and Fine Line and Walls—both released a month apart from each other—seemed to be about getting back together and trying to make it work again.
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protagonistheavy · 9 months ago
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The failure of Concord has me wondering what the future of multiplayer-focused games is going to be like, in a future where gamers are simultaneously exhausted of live-service games and the FOMO attached to it... but yet also refuse to play a game that isn't constantly being updated with both patch notes and all-new content. It really feels like the middle-ground here is nonexistent, because I can't imagine a game like Overwatch or LoL being anywhere as successful as they are if they didn't thrive on live-service elements -- what are competing games supposed to do?
It feels like gaming, in this regard, is in an unforgiving bottleneck. The effect of overwhelming FOMO has resulted in gamers celebrating the lack-of-success in games -- people are happy to find out that a game isn't popular and thus they don't have an obligation to go and play it asap. Gamers are instead stuck with just a handful of live-service games that they refuse to let go of, because they've already invested so much of their time in making that game their personal live-service game, they don't have room in their schedule to learn a different game, play by different rules, pay attention to new patch notes, keep up to date with evolving metas, watch all the videos from content creators, etc. This creates an atmosphere that's hostile to new properties and keeps players locked-up in their choice of live-service.
And that negatively effects these other competitor games exponentially, because multiplayer games like this absolutely require a constant stream of players to fill up queues. Constantly -- at no point can the queue afford to dry-up without killing the whole game. And the only way to keep players engaged long-term, realistically, is to keep providing new content, new progressions, patching the game, etc. so that players have a reason to keep coming back. Otherwise, players naturally lose interest -- even games with extreme depth and long learning curves will inevitably lose the attention of most players that are more interested in shiny cosmetics or brand new characters to play with. 1v1-oriented games can sort of get away from this system, like fighting games, but even those are nowadays relying a lot on scheduled balance changes and new content in order to keep an audience that isn't just the top 1% skill bracket replaying the same thing over and over.
I guess what I'm at odds with is how the community actually feels about live-service games, because people love loudly declaring that they hate live-service games and hope they die, but then contradict themselves by constantly pouring their time and expendable income on live-service games -- with the nerve to then complain about other games "being dead" if they don't have a concurrent playerbase in the quintuple digits. And then there's the argument over what kind of live-service is acceptable, where again, people will say that they hate free-to-play live-service games, but then scoff at the idea of a live-service game coming with a one-time entry fee to get all the content.
So lol what do we want? Do we want these large multiplayer games to be one-week-long fads that you pay $60 for before the whole game effectively dies due to a lack of interest beyond that first week? Or do we want long-lasting multiplayer games that require new content and updates in order to retain a wide-enough audience to keep the game alive? I genuinely think a lot of people would read this choice and say "neither :)" and they are either totally not the target audience for these types of games (yet feel entitled to an industry-wide opinion about these genres) or they're the most miserable type of gamer that commits themself to playing games they actually hate.
Mind all this, I never expected Concord to be a big hit, because it had a lot of other problems going against it too. But when I see people celebrating its early demise, much of the attitude seems to be pointed towards the live-service system as a whole, despite live-service being the only realistic option for a multiplayer game to thrive in this current age. At some point, I think we need to accept that live-service is gonna be inevitable for games to stay afloat, and instead of hoping they all fail and gaming reverts by two decades, we instead figure out and speak-up about what live-service strategies are ethical and work well vs systems that are oppressive and unwanted.
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themeraldee · 8 months ago
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I already sent this to @blindmagdalena already, but I like how both of you characterize homelander. So I wanted to know you thoughts too, HEAR ME OUT. Desperate homelander having a hallucination of an uninterested reader. Think, the scene in "the great" where peter hallucinates Catherine. I just love the ideal of him hallucinating y/n as a much different version of themselves, one that's as cruel as he is, and while his heart breaks a little more at the idea of y/n hating him, can't help but also feel an intense drive to earn their favor, while reader is just. Not that. Like he sees them in such an intense way that the idea of them eating a literal heart at dinner while giggling menacingly about how they are going to make him suffer, is more realistic them then finally accepting his intense version of love. The fic POTENTIALLLL
(not me being mentioned alongside the queen herself, I have PEAKED)
I am giving everyone a heads-up that I am insanely culturally inept. Mention a movie, tv show, play, song, album and there's a 99% chance that I haven't consumed said media. For someone who's chronically online I am somehow consuming the same content over and over again instead of anything new lol.
The reason I'm saying that is because I've missed any reference you mentioned in your ask 😂
Anyway!!! Onto your ask. I can't particularly decipher whether you meant that this is a budding or already developed relationship that Homelander just has a skewed idea of or if it's more someone he's pursuing and the idea of them rejecting him and his love is so terrible he'd rather they show any care at all?
I do often think about how messed up his idea of what a genuine relationship really is. All the relationships in the past have always had some caveat. So really, if the most powerful man in the world gets to experience love as this heinous thing that comes with terms and conditions from every love interest he's ever had then....that's what it's gotta be, right?
After all the previous experiences I wonder whether he'd be able to genuinely look at the person he loves and believe with his whole heart that they love him back. Or would he forever have the voice in his head saying that they're scared of him? Only just playing along because it's convenient or because he's handy to have around? The thought of that would be so heart-wrenching that's it's easier to spare yourself the pain.
Like a victim would avoid the potential chance of reliving what they've been through just for the lucky odd chance that this time it's gonna be right.
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frostise · 1 year ago
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8 & 12!!
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𝐒𝐇𝐈𝐏𝐏𝐈𝐍𝐆 𝐌𝐄𝐌𝐄   ┇   accepting ♡
8. Does your muse usually take the lead in relationships?
she definitely does wear the pants in the relationship when it comes to a woman. louise gives them the best queen treatment they've ever experienced in their entire life! usually ranging to spa treatments, sharing clothes, taking them out to five star hotels/restaurant, hosting surprise parties and taking care of their emotional needs...but with a man? she's a totally different person since she does expect them to worship the ground she walks on lmfao! if they prove themselves worthy of her time and attention then i can definitely see the ice queen melting at their devotion and displaying heavy amounts of affection for them as well! so it's very likely louise will spoil her partner rotten and become dominant in a relationship although she doesn't really mind if they take the lead as well. but she's going to be cheeky with it! that's just how she is ^^
12. What is your muse’s love language?
act of service and words of affirmation always come in first place because she's a firm believer of showing one's actions rather than words is how you determine what a potential partner feels about you. plus, she can easily read someone and would appreciate how honest they are. if you show trust and understanding after a typical lovers spat? then i think louise will come out of her shell more often and show off her vulnerabilities too, which she rarely ever does because of her overbearing pride and ego.
coming in close second is quality time and physical touch. louise works her ass off 24/7 but is willing to spend most of her spare time with her beloved whenever she gets out of work. it's no surprise louise has severe abandonment issues she's trying to work through so the paranoia lurking in her thoughts doesn't get the best of her if they're not available for a date. it's an obvious requirement for a relationship to be long-lasting and most importantly healthy in terms of communication! louise is confirmed to be touch starved around her partner and will be restraining herself most of the time to save herself the embarrassment because she knows some people absolutely hate being touched actively unless they're receptive to her affections. she has been pretty needy in the past and deeply suppresses that vulnerable side as much as she can.
benefits of dating louise lincoln explains everything about her love language but!! i will extend it based on what i saw in the media. frost is the type of lover to be extremely protective. not to the point where she ends up possessive but i can definitely see her being overprotective if her partner is in danger or wounded in battle. it roots back to her past trauma when she couldn't get to crystal enough and that resulted in her death with firestorm. she will do absolutely anything to keep her significant other safe. killing whatever poses them as a threat will always be number one option or if that's somehow not an option on the table? then she'll resort to injuring them and crashing their sanity before fussing over her lover about their physical state.
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angstsplatter · 4 months ago
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Hey there I know Leo is your favorite like yeah he’s great I love him too. I was curious what’s your opinion on Raph? I mean for any iteration you have seen so far.
Great question. <3 Thanks so much for prompting me to think and talk about this.
I think Leo is my favorite because he's most who I want to be/be seen as. My favorite characters tend towards the serious, angsty ones (mostly the angsty thing) who put a lot of responsibility on themselves to take care of others.
But Raph is really the one I can most relate to. Especially 2k3 Raph, which I watched as a struggling, angry teen growing up in a volatile home dealing with my problems in a manner very similar to Raph.
I love Raph. I love all the turtle family (whether they be turtle, rat, human, or other). There's not a strong order of preference for favorite character after Leo, but if I was pushed to come up with one, Raph would probably come out #2 (omfg, he'd be seething).
I love how, on the face of things, we're given these four very strong, stereotypical personalities that seem so simple on their face but can hold so much more depth.
Leonardo's the leader in blue Does anything it takes to get his ninjas through Donatello is a fellow, has a way with machines Raphael has the most attitude on the team Michelangelo, he's one of a kind And you know just where to find him when it's party time
Raph is the angry, sarcastic one most likely to bite back.
But dig a little deeper, and there's a wealth of reasons behind this.
90s and 2k3 versions really dug into this and leaned into the whole injustice angle. Like it's easy to brush Raph off as mean and rude or whatever, but you know what? He's right. The lot they were all handed in life, being raised with the morality and conscience to care about this world that would sooner discard and mistreat them? It's garbage!!! It sucks!!! It's so hard to care about someone who hates you or is disgusted by you or fears you, and yet continuously, Raph and his bros put themselves out there and do the right thing anyway. 2k3 and 90s Raph especially deal with this seeming "grudge", but you just can't blame them. They are children finding their place in the world and coming to terms with the fact that their place is unwelcome.
90s movie Raph is really interesting because I think a lot of his struggle is also coming to terms with his place with his family. He feels like such an outsider, and it's not just to the world. No one in his family seems to share his anger or frustration or sense of injustice. In fact, a lot of the time, he's treated as being unreasonable and overreacting (taking over a role that tends more to be Mikey's in other iterations). He can't be a part of the world, and he can't seem to be a part of his family either, since they're more chill with just laying back and chilling and doing their own thing. It had to have been an incredibly lonely journey for Raph before he was able to accept he did have a place in his own family.
2k3 Raph is really interesting because this Raph is more connected with his family. When he's angry with his family it's party because he trusts that he can be angry around them. He has a voice, and he uses it. But that perhaps makes it harder to accept his lot in life because why can't other people be the same? I think April and Casey do a lot of good for Raph coming to terms with living in secret. Because it breaks the black and white thinking he was raised with that all humans will hate or fear them. But Raph learns it's not all humans. He's not just a freak. There are good humans who might be afraid or confused at first but who will take the time to look past their own nose and learn who he is. I think Raph being against PTSD!Leo's desire to get involved in the gang wars going on in the city shows that Raph has a very strong understanding of his own reach. Leo wants to save the world but Raph realizes that's beyond any individual. The world has to be willing to work together to do that for itself. When he starts building more relationships, this actually makes things less confusing for Raph and therefore easier to accept. Raph can't save the world (unless aliens attack: then a lot of world saving will occur, but petty Earth disagreements will still occur). But not all humans hate him. Raph can make a local difference. Raph can trust some humans. And that matters.
2k7 Raph is an awesome delve into this. This Raph has come to terms with living in the shadows and being a secret. He's come to terms with the fact that the people he's helping and saving might turn against him. Humans are humans. Who cares? They're not Raph's family. This Raph is angry with his family. His family is what's not making any sense to him. Why did Splinter choose to tear their family apart and separate them? Why did Leo choose to keep them separated and all but abandon them? Why have Mikey and Don given up on what matters and spend their time on pursuits that don't even bring them joy or satisfaction? Why did his family turn their backs on him?
MM/Tales Raph is, of course, just good fun. Other iterations put stock into their fighting because A) it protects their family, and B) it's something he can be good at. This Raph kinda just enjoys the violence, lmao. It's a bit more of a simplified take, but ofc the over protective Raph fighting for his family is still there. He is their strength and shield, and if that's what he as to give, he's going to give it. But this Raph definitely relishes the violence for the sake of violence, too. No Raph is shy about fighting or pulling out a good, ol' fashioned threat, but god this one just gets euphoria from it. I love it. This Raph is definitely the funniest Raph. He's less inhibited by inner strife and it brings a lightness to his time on screen.
Then, of course, there's Rise, and holy fuck did this version do something genius and, quite frankly, revolutionary for the series. Rise said "let's do something new", and they went into it with their whole heart and make it so successful. I dare anyone to watch this version and not fall in love with Raph. The idea of keeping Raph and Leo's personalities in tact but switching their roles to create an entirely different team dynamic did AMAZING things. I LOVE that this Raph's anger turned to anxiety because Raph at heart is an extremely caring guy. Rise could have taken the lazy way and gone "he's just an angry guy, which makes him a bad leader" but instead they held onto the core of Raph's being and asked "how would this change him?" Raph loves his family and so he accepted that responsibility. Anger was too destructive to take care of them in his position, so he internalized all that and it became anxiety instead. He's still rash and brash and answers with his fists. But he's also more vulnerable. He doesn't just consider himself or the situation. He considers his brothers and the impact it will have on them, especially given their age differences. Dragging your same-aged brother into a fight is a lot different than throwing your barely-teenaged brother into a fight. This Raph ended up a lot less focused on his place in the world because he was given a clear place on his team. He has a purpose, a directive. He's not just the shield or the barbarian-fighter. He's the big brother. The stand-in father. He's got a sense of purpose that he can fully understand and accept. It's a HUGE bummer to me that we'll never get to really explore what Rise had in stock with the leadership switch. I just know they were gonna develop over a couple more seasons and bring us some really interesting character exploration beyond having to just wrap everything up in one movie. I could watched 10 seasons of Rise and been happy.
I don't know; I just love how much and how deeply Raph cares. He doesn't lash out because he's selfish or a jerk. He lashes out because he's hurt and the strength of the team shouldn't be seen as vulnerable or 'weak'. Raph is an absolutely fantastic character.
*I've watched 2k12 but I wasn't as into it as other versions, so I never rewatched it as much as other iterations, and it's been a longer time since I've seen it, so I don't have much to say about it specifically. It also followed 2k3 pretty closely, so those Raph's are pretty similar. I have also seen the Bay movies but only once and only because my sister's gf at the time liked the ninja turtles and my sister really wanted us to bond lmao. I just can't get over the look of them or the misogynistic sexualizing of April to get into the movies.
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bonebabbles · 2 years ago
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I felt dissatisfied by the ending when I first saw it; and now after lurking in the tags, I really feel like Wolf Children is a fascinating movie if you read it like a tragedy
The story is about Hana, and about her acceptance with life and loss. It's about coming to terms with the loss of her husband, and about her loss of purpose as her children grow up. In this sense, she finds contentedness in the lack of control she has over her life.
She tries her best, alone and mourning, but she is just a human, like @wyvernslovecake says. She isn't capable of teaching them to balance the wolf and human parts of themselves because she's not a wolf. Her idea of supporting her daughter is teaching her the self-soothing chant and creating the dress... and ends up teaching her that her wolf-side IS something to be suppressed and controlled.
Hana ends up enabling Ame's disconnect with human society, and confirming Yuki's budding fears that it (as a whole) will reject her.
And adding the lens of gender over the story provides a whole new layer. Ame is a boy, so he's encouraged to cut himself off in a way that WILL INEVITABLY become extremely destructive to his mental and physical health. Yuki is a girl, so she must learn to deny and suppress the part of her that brings joy, until her male love interest gives her permission to express it privately, to him.
But back to Hana... she did her best. She did what she could. She LOVES her babies and only ever wanted the best for them, her whole life was dedicated to her family. But it wasn't what her kids needed.
I don't have the language for this but I think about it all the time; Someone can fail you but have done nothing wrong. Someone can do everything they're supposed to and it still wasn't right for you. Pain without blame. Love itself isn't always enough.
Hana's story has been told, but her children are ten and eleven at the end of the movie. They should have very long lives after this... if Ame doesn't die horribly like his fox mentor, whose cause of death was "broken leg." Both parts of him are social animals, and if Yuki can't deny her wolf half, Ame absolutely cannot deny his human side.
He WILL need to re-enter society one day, unprepared, unsocialized, and we can only hope that he finds someone who can help him make that jump.
And Yuki... I'm sure her love interest is a fine boy, but it's a terrible situation to be forced to rely on one single person (your implied future husband!) for all of your emotional needs. What if she, y'know, doesn't love him when they both aren't 11? What will happen if she has children and has the same instincts as her dad? Will she always be struck by anxiety when she thinks of how she's "a monster"?
She WILL be hurt by this constant shame and fear, now hateful of a natural part of herself that used to bring her joy. She is in a cage and appointed her love interest as a zookeeper; we can only hope that one day she can step out.
Really hated the ending of Wolf Children, honestly. Not because it’s sad that the little boy left his mom but he’s literally 10. I don’t care he’s “adult when he’s a wolf“ what the hell is he going to do when he INEVITABLY has to re-enter society in, what, 8 years?
There are no wolves in Japan. They’re EXTINCT there for a reason. He can’t form a pack, a thing normal wolves do, so he’s going to need to find friends and family somehow, and the only way to do that for him is to shift back into a human and have all the same problems he did growing up, except this time he’s Jared, 19, and he never learned how to read
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leorawright · 2 years ago
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Can I request Ashe, Mercy, Pharah, Symmetra, Tracer and Zarya with omnic!S/O, who used to be human, but was assassinated by Talon, only to upload their mind in omnic and feeling themselves comfortable in it? Sorry if it's way too rough for ya.
Umm I think I get what you're asking? Making Tracer platonic since she has a girlfriend!
Overwatch with s/o who's consciousness has been uploaded into an Omnic
Ashe
When she first sees you in your omnic body she's skeptical to believe it's you
She asks you tens of questions to confirm that it is you
Once it's confirmed she's so thankful you're back
If you hadn't come back she might have gone insane
Mercy
She most likely figured out how to upload you into an omnic body
When you woke up and remembered being human she was so relieved it worked
After checking that everything works good expect a long hug after all she almost lost you
Pharah
She doesn't believe it's you for a while
She thinks it's some Talon scam trying to lull her into false security
When you convince her it's you the tears start to fall
She lost you and she's never letting it happen again
Symmetra
She's one of the quickest to accept that it is you
She doesn't have a grudge with Talon so she has no reason to think they're tricking her
When you come back as an omnic she couldn't care less she's just so relieved you're back
After checking to make sure you're okay she just needs a minute to soak in that you're back
Tracer (platonic)
She was nervously waiting with Emily for Angela to finish the process
When she could go inside she nearly knocked you over with a hug
Emily was a lot more gentle about greeting you again
You're under lock and key after that Tracer isn't losing her best friend again
Zarya
She's the most conflicted about it
She's hated Omnics ever since they destroyed her home
But now you, a person she loves, is an omnic
She needs a while to come to terms with it
But eventually she accepts you once again and after that everything goes back to normal
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n1ght-shift · 2 years ago
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I am cringe.. But I am free.
UHMN... Okay so I made him up a family tree because I've been thinking about his niece a lot. And the fact he still seems on good terms with her even if it was a super brief mention. D2b family HCs?! 🤯
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I ALSO COLOUR CODED IT BASED ON WHAT I THINK HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM WOULD BE (AS A RESULT OF NO LONGER BEING STEVEN) I DON'T EVEN KNOW DON'T QUESTION ME
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I also wanted to.. Uhmn.. Explain each relationship he has with these family members but just to clarify let me explain the colours more-!
Green || A good relationship, hardly affected by him becoming Dr. Two-brains.
Orange || It's.. Ify. They don't really like him anymore, nobody down right hates him. It's more pity, and distancing themselves from him because of how much he's changed and or because of his crimes.
Yellow || Complicated! They're noticeably affected by the change, but don't dislike him like the oranges. Very concerned. Don't really view his crimes as his.
// FAMILY DYNAMICS / RELATIONSHIPS //
Dad – His dad and him were fairly close when he was Steven, not exactly best buddies but they would talk normally and do stuff together on occasion. No hard feelings about anything. Probably bonded over science a lot when he was a kid. After Steven became Dr. Two-brains and began crimes he feels his son is well. What he is. A criminal. Not taking into account the reasons why, and not having the willingness to reach out to who his son used to be. He wants him imprisoned, for an actual normal amount of time, and for him to stop his life of crime after completing the sentencing. And come back to them. As Steven. Of course they all want Steven back, but he's the least accepting of the new identity.
Mom – He also had a normal relationship with his mother, maybe a bit closer because I imagine her the type to coddle. She misses Steven deeply, and doesn't really understand who or what Dr. Two-brains is. Finding interaction with him awkward and uncomfortable but not wanting to abandon her son for an incident/experiment gone wrong. Tries to talk to him normally, but there's a difference. And they both know it.
Sister – his only sibling! I think they were very very close siblings, and still are, she obviously misses her brothers old ways but does her best to ignore the change and it doing a better job than their mother. They hang out, talk, and still interact like family. Where as others act more as though he's a stranger. Reminds him of a lot of old memories to try to keep that side of him going.
Brother in law – they didn't really know one another beforehand, they had met, but not bonded. His brother in law worries having a criminal around his children, despite Two-brains displaying absolutely zero threat to them it is understandable. Avoids him but will talk to him if interacted with. I feel like he calls d2b “buddy” in a really condescending way. His sister has told him about what he used to be like and he believes her but it doesn't help.
Niece and Nephew – Good! In canon he seems to be on a good relationship with his niece, given the mention of her graduation being a normal thing. I imagine the same for his nephew who is younger than his niece. They remember how he was before, they think Steven is more fun. But are both worried in their own ways.
Uncle – I think our resident weird uncle had a weird uncle of his own! Had to learn the trade from someone. Dynamic is about the same as his mother, but a but more open and joking with d2b. Also trying to keep his memories intact.
Cousin – they were friends beforehand, not best buds that talked a lot but they had an okay relationship. Now the cousin is a bit scared of him but tries to uphold the positive memories and realizes that he can still be normal sometimes.
As for Dr. Two-brains himself he feels bad for creating a noticeable shift in his family and loves them all, still acting like their family member. Just a very different one. Squeaky doesn't like them, I imagine, but Steven over powers in this regard.
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liketheinferno2 · 3 years ago
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Coming out of Endwalker like... so many thoughts I am not quite ready to organise without looking back, but I think I have figured out why a lot of people see Stormblood as the odd egg out in this story. It's not the pacing, and it's not that the characters are as unbearable as a lot of people make them out to be either, it's just a step backwards thematically. It backs off from the personal emotional stuff and is a big wide plot thing, and it makes sense that it would be, considering a lot of it was apparently plotted out before even Heavensward and still running on ARR logic. But there's this long running thing in this game that was always better expressed through figurative feelsy stuff where the pain is grand and unreal, sometimes literally inconceivably great the way big numbers don't compute in the human brain. Stuff that is tethered closer to emotions than physical events and gets as close to the characters as possible. Write what you know but not with actual events I guess?
FFXIV at its brightest is about grief, depression, denial and escapism and how you have to move past all of that to make your life worth living -- For those we have lost, for those we can yet save -- but more than that, how this is only really possible through new and surviving bonds. You can't save everyone and you can't get those people back. There's no way to rewind or undo the loss and trauma and the characters who cause themselves suffering are all either out for revenge, or reincarnation that they could never live to see, or more broadly they're looking for a meaning in life that has a finite end point. Estinien, G'raha are both extremely relevant additions to the cast for this reason, it's far more than just fan appeal. 1. Guy who lived to kill, not just for lost loved ones but a life he could have had; almost ends the life he has now if not for new love and friendship. 2. Guy who lived to die out of love, and when denied this had to come to terms with the fact that removing yourself from a loved one is not a kindness, and one person cannot be the beginning and end of where you find purpose. The amount of beloved characters who only enter the main cast proper after you stop them from offing themselves was never lost on me.
Anyway, if Heavensward was when this theming got LOUD and ANGRY, Shadowbringers is when it was cold and alone. I came out of Shadowbringers rattled, genuinely exhausted. Endwalker is not like that. It's the story not just for people in the abyss, but those of us who have climbed out again. A lot of people are Hermes in this story, but I'm a Venat type myself... and it's something you can only achieve after digging through the mud. Extremely rare to ever have a story like this written from that perspective. Once I realised what her white robes meant I changed mine. That's neither here nor there but Endwalker eases you in, stresses you out, hurts over and over but keeps giving you anchors to hold onto and relationships to push you forward, and up to the very last second it's harder and harder (for the characters at least,) but then the relief! Shadowbringers felt like washing up on the beach, Endwalker lets you down gently! God it's good.
I know what an actual character end feels like so I wasn't crying in that final area, I think my prevailing emotion was "I hate these nihilist cunts" "I hate that all this destruction was needless" "I hate this fucking crab bucket dimension" but in a completely positive way. It's that frustration I feel when someone refuses to accept that they have defined their own meaninglessness, it is not inherent and it is causing them all this unnecessary pain. This is the suicide expansion, that's just what it is. I had my doubts when that first came up in the patches but not once did it feel cheap, even when the game beats you over the head with it. The end reveal that "suffer with me" was never even supposed to be kindness, because of course it wasn't, of course there's rage and fear in that, Hermes said himself that killing something that wants to live is not beautiful.
And there's debate about whether the Ancients had an "actual utopia" or not -- A. Of course it was because Emmie said so, B. Of course it wasn't because Hermes and Meteion suffered -- but that's not even the right question to ask in my opinion. It was an actual utopia, caveat: in a piece of fiction written with the idea that utopia and perfection is unachievable and would destroy anyone who could reach it. It being actually genuinely all but free of pain for mankind is not a loss of a great society that could never be rebuilt, but a sort of literalised escapism, literalised denial, an unreachable world that people on real world (the sundered one, in-universe) can only wish or hope existed, if somehow we could ever be free of strife. You go to the Garden of Eden and it's a lab. It's heaven bro. It's heaven and you can't reach it through violence.
Ironically Zenos who was such a... ???? ... in Stormblood ended up being best adapted to the themes of Endwalker because here's 3. Guy searching eternally for what meaning he can find through violence, when actually hurt for the first time in his adult life finds it the closest thing to closeness he's yet felt. But instead of identifying that closeness as what he wants, blames it on the violence instead, literally chases you to the ends of the earth hoping you'll kill each other in some ultimate act of physicality and what is, to Zenos, love! The nearest thing to it. The harder he pushes this way the further he pushes any reasonable person away from reciprocating. He gets so close to realising what he's done wrong, not in his actions but in the meaning he has defined for himself. Alisaie gets closer than anyone to cracking him just by telling him he'll die hated and alone. And personally I do think the rescue button was made of his regret, some last second realisation that dying is not what he wanted, and more than that, he does not want the person who at least tried to give his life meaning to die too. Loving or hating this character are both completely reasonably strong reactions but he loves YOU, like it or not. That's kinda the point...
Terrified I'm gonna lose this post so I end it here. Endwalker was unmatched. Best Game.
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seyaryminamoto · 3 years ago
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Sorry but can I ask for some examples of redemption arcs you deem better than Zuko's? I am not asking this contentiously, I'm legit curious as I'd like to expand y reference pool for the concept.
Tbh I should have braced myself better for this question one day xD I've said that line enough times in the past that clearly it was going to bite me in the ass if I didn't start compiling my list, and here we go, you caught me without a proper list in hand! Hence why it's taken me a while to answer xD
Anyway, I'm going to list off the characters I can think of who fulfill my personal preferences in terms of redemption arcs. Not every character in the list will sit well with everyone, as I know a lot of people have a knack for holding characters' wrongdoings against them forever and ever and for some of the audience, seeing any changes doesn't mean the characters have answered for their mistakes in full, and so on and so forth. I will try to point out a few faults in the ones who do have certain things they still should answer for even if the redemption arc works for me, but in general, the characters listed below have ticked these three specific boxes in order to be featured here at all. These three boxes are:
Faced genuine consequences for their past mistakes
Unlearned toxic behaviors, objectively (as in, didn't repeat said toxic behaviors once the bulk of their growth and journey was done)
Did not feel entitled to rewards of any kind (be it others' trust, acceptance, love or approval, let alone more ambitious rewards than that) solely on the basis that they had a change of heart.
So! With that in mind, let's get into it:
1. Aeryn Sun - Farscape
The first name that always comes to my mind whenever someone says "better redemption arc than Zuko" ever since I watched Farscape is Aeryn Sun. I'm going to be blunt: Aeryn's arc is everything Zuko fans have deluded themselves into believing Zuko's arc is. It seriously is. She's a soldier brought up in a very toxic culture that promotes violence and emotionally represses its people. On the very first episode, that culture turns its back on her, effectively betraying her while pretending SHE is the betrayer, leaving her with no choice but to join the rogue band of protagonists, a group of prisoners of war that her culture persecuted and that are very pissed at her for belonging to said culture, even though they reluctantly accept her among them because they don't really have much choice at the time.
Over the course of a single season, Aeryn's arc sees her clashing with everyone on that ship in various ways, bonding with people who have very good reasons to hate her, saving their lives just as they save hers because, whether they like each other or not, they're stuck in this mess of a space adventure together. Her redemption arc is so smooth and gradual that when she's facing mortal danger and one of the prisoners (the one who hated her the most, initially) is sitting by her potential deathbed, keeping her company when she looks like she's at her last moments, you actually find it absolutely moving and beautiful that these characters could reach such a point of mutual respect and understanding over the course of a SINGLE SEASON, and that growth process was believable for all the characters involved. Aeryn's journey is incredible, honestly. That her personality is closer to Azula's than Zuko's also helps in showing a very nice glimpse of what an Azula redemption could look like, if, you know, Azula was a space warrior xD
So, how does Aeryn fulfill the three points I bring up? The first one has a whole episode dedicated to it: at one point, the show uncovers flashbacks from Aeryn's past before she gets stuck with the crazy space gang, flashbacks that reveal she had a hand in horrible events that took place on that very ship long ago. She participated in a horrific, inhumane practice that one of her first friends on board, the Pilot, is still reeling and recovering from: when Pilot realizes she was involved in said horrible thing, he lashes out very violently at her. Even though Aeryn has already learned better and changed, she faces consequences for her horrible actions in the past, actions she now deeply regrets and that she does her best to make amends for, openly, without shirking off her responsibility in those actions to someone else. She faces her wrongdoings and acknowledges them, ready to face any punishment the wronged party feels is necessary because she understands this is not about how much she changed, but about how much someone was hurt by her choices and actions in the past. It's a goddamn refreshing thing to see, and this is just one example of her facing consequences for her past, the events of ONE episode. She spends most of the first season facing said consequences and learning from it all, every step of the way.
Unlearning bad behaviors is literally what her whole arc is cemented on: you can't look at Aeryn in the last two seasons and compare her with the Aeryn in the first one and conclude that she's still the same person. She outright has a subplot in a space station helmed by her former culture and people where Aeryn gets to see just how much she has changed when someone else she knew in her past acts pretty dreadfully towards her, spitefully, as a rejection for who she has become. The other character then serves as a mirror where you get to see who Aeryn used to be and how different she is now. She goes from the stern, stoic, heartless warrior to someone who's guided by her heart instead, whose expertise and strength goes into helping those she cares about, into protecting lives rather than destroying them. Her arc, ultimately, is about helping her find her humanity and realizing that this humanity inside her is valuable. That it makes her BETTER, no matter how much heartache she endures along the way.
Lastly, she never acted like her growth and change had earned her the friendship or the trust or the faith of any of her friends. She never behaved with any sort of entitlement to rewards of any kind for who she had become: her journey was a reward in itself, because she experienced so much stuff she NEVER imagined possible and she was profoundly grateful for it. That she was rewarded in some ways is evident, it's absolutely fine... but she wasn't fishing for rewards. She wasn't waiting for someone to put a medal on her lapel. That was never her attitude, because in fact that's one of the things she unlearned from her culture:
"What did you imagine, for your life?" "Service. Promotion. Retirement. Death."
That's an actual exchange between her and another character: the beauty of the dialogue is in the fact that all of this is what she has tossed away because she no longer wants/needs any of this after the journey she's been on. Her priorities have changed completely and she has accepted that change with open arms, becoming an incredible, admirable person in the process.
So... honestly, Aeryn is in the absolute top redemption arcs in the history of television for me. I'm honestly putting her as my #1 here because I can't think of anything better. I won't pretend my opinion is absolute because it's not... but out of everything I've watched, I can seriously say hers is such a good redemption arc that even when the writing started to get really weird in this show (namely in the final season), her growth remained crystallized as something so great that nothing they could dare do would dampen it. She's the gold standard for me, and unfortunately that means most things will fall short next to her. Zuko, sadly for him, absolutely does. If his character arc were remotely as impressive as Aeryn's was, I'd probably not be a Zuko fan anyway because, like I always say, his character has certain things that just don't do it for me. But I'd be an advocate of his writing, of his growth, of his progress and change: I'm not, and once I saw Aeryn's character arc, it became increasingly easy to see exactly why. Hers is seriously what redemption arcs should be modeled after... and Zuko's arc had the potential to be this good. Unfortunately for him, his writing doesn't come anywhere close to Aeryn's growth and redemption arc.
2. Thor - MCU, up to Thor: The Dark World EXCLUSIVELY
I am at war with the MCU. Everyone knows this. I've had such a bad falling out with it that I need to be pushed into watching any new content they release and I don't even want to watch most of it. But when the MCU was starting out... oh, when the MCU was starting out...
Thor's redemption arc is simple. It's very, very simple. It gets to the point in the space of a single movie. There's, surprisingly, a lot of growth within that single movie (growth that, to my absolute bitterness, the whole community of movie-goers decided to sleep on and still don't care to acknowledge). This guy goes from the reckless fool that wants to rush into battle mindlessly because someone injured his ego, to the guy who will readily sacrifice his powerless body in order to save those he cares about: he will also sacrifice his thus-far only way to meet the woman he loves in order to save the world. It's the quintessential "selfish to selfless" arc and, because of its simplicity, it works.
How does it fulfill my requirements? Thor's banishment from Asgard is the obvious consequence to his stupidity from the start of his first movie. But that's not even close to the entirety of the consequences: he is no longer worthy of wielding his hammer once he finally finds it again. His arrogance, his belief that he had everything under control, gets beaten out of him when he finds that the power he always would fall back on is no longer his for the taking. Thus, he hits a low point that goes even lower when Loki tells him that Odin is dead and that he's still not allowed to come home: Thor doesn't throw a tantrum demanding to be made king instead of Loki in this scene. He's so lost and so broken that he eats up Loki's lies and accepts his condemnation as something he has earned. This gets so overlooked by everyone, whether fandom or even the more recent MCU writers, that it's embarrassing. Only then, when he's questioning who he is and what he'll do with his life now, only when he gets his chances to bond with Jane properly, to listen to her wisdom and knowledge (as well as Selvig's) does Thor begin to be worthy again. He's ready for a more humble life, for the best life he can try to lead in Midgard, and there's even details that got deleted from the movie (to my utter outrage) such as him visiting the coffee shop where he broke the mug to replace the one he broke. Like... it's so blunt and direct and STILL so overlooked??? But it's PRECISELY what a redemption arc is supposed to look like! :'D
All this is also part of the unlearning of his behaviors: when he realizes he's no longer worthy of his alleged destiny, Thor starts to change. He stops taking his privileges for granted, stops believing he's entitled to anything (hence, point #3), and fully changes into a perfectly decent guy who will stand up against a huge Destroyer to plead with his brother not to hurt innocents anymore. In the bravery of his diplomatic attempt to reason with Loki, Thor proves he has changed. He makes it clear he is no longer jumping into violence mode immediately. He doesn't want to fight Loki later on either, but Loki goads him into doing so: even then, the final nail on this redemption arc is the fact that his defeat of Loki isn't a matter of smashing his brother to tiny little bits like most Marvel movies like to do: he defeats Loki by taking away his ability to use the Bifrost to destroy things anymore. He is no longer an advocate for destruction, which is exactly what he is when the story begins: thus, GROWTH! And so, I've also pointed out that he expects no rewards, Mjöllnir's return to him is practically a surprise, but he's not an arrogant ass about the return of his power. By the end of the movie, he's telling his father he has a lot left to learn: even his eagerness to take a throne he's not ready for is gone, giving way to a man who's much more responsible than he ever was.
This is the Thor from The Dark World, too. He's a responsible guy, with his humorous moments, but in general, he's a good man with his priorities straight. I could really just use the first movie as a reference, but The Dark World gives him a line that I think is crucial to understand his character growth: "I'd rather be a good man than a great king." I heard this damn line around the same time as when The Search Part 3 was coming out, too... and that comic carried the exact opposite message with Zuko. The whole scene with him putting on the Fire Lord's hairpiece as some sort of symbol of him "accepting his destiny" feels like the exact opposite direction Zuko's growth should have taken: his growth was meant to be personal. This guy was just like Thor, not ready to be king at all. The difference is Thor acknowledges it, reflects on it, and Zuko doesn't. Even if his rule is not going particularly well in the comics, he won't question the "divine right to rule" that he's so certain he possesses. Ironic, considering people act like Azula is the one who acts that way, all because she said that line... meanwhile, it's Zuko who privileges a throne over being a decent person at most stages of his life, with only a handful of moments where it seemed like something was more important than his advancement :') sad, isn't it? But Thor, up until Thor: The Dark World, embodied exactly the opposite concept. And as poorly managed as the MCU may be in current times, they pulled off a great redemption arc in their early days and I will never be ashamed of bringing it up as some of the very best writing Marvel movies EVER did.
3. Marisa Coulter - His Dark Materials
First seriously controversial choice... it's possible that those who haven't read the books would likely think I'm insane for picking out this character, but to be perfectly honest? She fits the bill for my favorite redemptions wonderfully because of what a messed up, flawed character she is.
Marisa Coulter is a terrible person. She has done absolutely unforgivable things. She has hurt people she loves, people she hates, she has hurt herself in a thousand ways, and it seems like she never stops doing it, too. The newest adaptation of the books has done a brilliant (in my opinion) job of showing how damaged she is, where that damage has come from (a very oppressive society), and how she struggles with her own nature. But the most important thing about her character, for me, is what the show hasn't adapted yet: the final book of the trilogy (skip ahead to #4 if you don't want spoilers xD).
Mrs. Coulter is first found in the third book attempting, in a very twisted way, to be a mother to her child. She has wronged this child many times in the past, and she's literally wronging her right then and there... but she is terribly aware, too, of many things. The first of those things is that, if given the choice, her daughter would have nothing to do with her. The second of those things is that her daughter is safest in hiding with her, away from the two factions of a war that are literally hunting down this little girl. She's trying to protect her: when the previous book ended, she literally KILLED a man, one of her closest allies, to ensure he wouldn't find her daughter and that Mrs. Coulter would have a chance to protect her. Then she goes rogue and abandons her entire life, EVERYTHING she's worked for, for the sake of keeping her daughter safe...
... And it fails :') they're found eventually, her daughter is taken from her, and Mrs. Coulter loses her shit. She becomes a prisoner to the daughter's father, no less, and here's when we start to see her true colors: we see how hurt she is, how feral, how fiercely she loves her daughter even though she's, for one thing, completely aware of how unlikely it is that her daughter could ever love HER, and for another thing, how ready she is to spit in the face of authority (literally too xD) if that means standing her ground and what she believes in, and right now, what she believes in is in protecting her daughter however she can.
Suddenly, this woman becomes an actual action heroine, stealing hi-tech vehicles, defusing bombs at risk of getting blown up and killed in the process, and fighting METATRON, the actual angel of Abrahamic tradition, in order to keep her daughter safe. She literally sacrifices herself and spends the rest of her existence plummeting into an endless abyss to protect that girl...
... And that girl never finds out that's what happened to her mother :')
So... faces consequences for her wrongdoings? Yes, since her daughter hates her for those wrongdoings and there's never any patching up that relationship after its downfall. The more the story progresses, the easier you can see that this relationship is becoming Mrs. Coulter's entire purpose in life... and it's a relationship she absolutely destroyed with her early mistakes. The consequences she faces are so severe she never bounces back from them, literally. There's no forgiveness for Mrs. Coulter, not from a lot of readers, and certainly not from the one person she cared about most (her daughter).
Unlearned bad behaviors... she did indeed, a little too late, unfortunately, but I'd say she does. It doesn't have enough bearing on the plot once she gets taken away by Asriel, but she starts to act like her daughter, something Asriel outright remarks on: she used to be the absolute antithesis to her daughter, the perfect lady with ideal manners and complete control over her emotions, and now she's acting just like that wild child did, recklessly spitting at someone and rebelling as openly as possible. I'm pretty sure that's a very strong case of unlearned behavior xD she takes advantage of her deceptive abilities to sabotage the organization she belonged to (the Magisterium), all be it to save her daughter... and then she indeed fights the Authority himself (Metatron), right after having spent her whole life enforcing whatever she thought the Authority wanted from her. She doesn't necessarily become a great person, no... but she takes advantage of her worst traits for better causes. She repurposes her darkness in order to do the right thing and save the life she wants to save (her daughter's :'D).
Lastly, never expected rewards... well, it's not only that she never expected them, in her case, it's that she never EVER got them. There's zero rewards in the cards for Mrs. Coulter. She's only a tragic figure for (some) readers: she's a despot and a monster in her world and her daughter will always be in the dark regarding what happened to her, so she has no idea that her mother made the right choices in the end. Zero rewards, whatsoever, and she knew she'd get none, but she still leapt into that abyss and didn't hesitate, all be it for Lyra's sake :')
This is what a tragic redemption looks like for me, and that's clearly not what Zuko was going for, but it's, IMO, brilliant. It proves there's no single way to redeem a character, and that you absolutely can pull off an amazing character arc of this nature even if the payoff isn't "and they lived happily ever after." An arc that you could say resembles hers is Darth Vader's, which I haven't featured here because... well, it works, but it doesn't tick the boxes quite as well as I would like it to. Still does in general, but there's enough room to be improved in it, if you ask me. Mrs. Coulter's arc feels like what Vader's arc could have been like if it had been fleshed out better, and it's an incredible story if you ask me. She never did become a perfectly good person and I have no trouble admitting that (hence why I know some people would never consider hers a redemption arc), but I don't think I needed her to be a perfectly good person... because what she did, all on its own, is such an extraordinary feat of love that she never managed to show Lyra in any other way. Now that she's to be eternally absent from Lyra's life, Mrs. Coulter succeeded at giving her daughter the very best life she could have... and that's a life without her. Sad, tragic... and yet so goddamn effective!
4. Regina Mills - Once Upon A Time
This is another controversial choice due to a reason I have no trouble acknowledging: yes, Regina should have faced real consequences for her behavior with the sheriff/huntsman and I wish she had because, if she really had, we'd have one of the best redemption arcs in television, uncontested and near-impossible to criticize. Unfortunately, they dropped the ball massively with that storyline and treated something so serious, a crime that ugly, with such disregard and disrespect that it definitely mars what is otherwise a great character arc.
Past this initial hurdle... Regina is the almost mastermind of everything wrong in Once Upon a Time. She's another person who was hurt and damaged so badly by someone in her past (her mother) that she ends up becoming terribly similar to the very mother she hated. She's out for her own benefit, for her revenge over something that, admittedly, is HORRIBLE, but that feels excessive, in the end? It's not that I would defend Snow because I didn't like her one bit x'D but Regina's rampaging war over the man she loved and lost is pretty unfair due to the fact that this idiot girl, Snow, was manipulated by someone else (Regina's mother, Cora) into revealing information she shouldn't have relinquished at all. It sucks, but ultimately, the bigger bad is Cora, not Snow.
But that's really just the starting point: Regina is the indisputable villain in the first season, with occasional glimpses into her past and depth, but all in all, she seems to be a pretty shitty person :'D she has great one-liners and great eye-liner, but all in all, she's not a good person. She's basically enslaving a whole community in order to punish all of them for the crime of trying to live happily ever after upon ending her tyranny in the Enchanted Forest. Once season two arrives, it's the reckoning: Regina is screwed over by the circumstances and it's clear as day that she's not getting away with her transgressions anymore.
The process of her growth is very slow, she does a lot of shitty things after getting caught too, but little by little, she starts to understand why her adoptive son couldn't possibly love her as she was. It's a veeeery gradual thing, but eventually, Regina manages to become someone who takes a stand against other villains and other characters in order to do the right thing: if I recall correctly, the season 2 finale is basically her trying to contain a magical bomb thing that could nuke the whole town xD then Emma comes in to help her so together they save everything and all is right with the world (?). As the story progresses further, she's even given the chance to give Henry (the son) a forehead kiss that becomes True Love's Kiss in a much more wholesome way than what we're used to seeing: it's proof of how much she has changed that she, the dark witch, loves her son so profoundly that she can now use the purest form of magic (TLK :'D). Her growth eventually gets weird because the whole show goes bonkers in a terrible way, but all in all, the concept of her growth works in ways that Zuko's just... drops the ball at, frankly?
First of all, consequences: her son's rebellion against her is what jumpstarts the entire story. This is a consequence that she causes for herself because Henry decides he's got to find a "savior" to fix the fucked up world he's being raised in. This is the very first consequence she faces, and then she faces many more as the story progresses (with the exception of what I mentioned in paragraph 1 in this section, which... ugh). Her journey to redemption is far from easy, especially as most people around her aren't all that forgiving at first, but she manages to become a much better person over time because of the consequences she faces, because they prove to her that she's doing something WRONG and, unless she fixes it, she's going to lose the one thing she still loves (as in, Henry), forever.
Second: unlearning behaviors. From condemning communities to everlasting curses, Regina ends up being the one saving them. From using her magic to her own ends and for her own purposes, she starts using it to protect others, even if it's dark magic. She's still a sassy asshole and burns people at least once out of every three lines she tosses in their direction, but she uses her darkness for different purposes now, deliberately empowering herself with it in order to do the right thing now, something unthinkable for the Regina we see early on in the story. She learns to respect others she despised, she stops sabotaging other people's lives, hell, I HATE the whole storyline with Robin Hood but when she "loses" him at the end of the third (was it?) season, her reaction isn't to obliterate everything she's worked towards just to get him back. She's angry, she's frustrated, but she's no longer as destructive as she used to be, not even in the face of a similar catastrophe than the one that drove her into darkness the first time.
Third: rewards...? I don't really think she was looking for a reward by the time she's killing that nuke xD I won't pretend I remember this whole show perfectly but I think that whenever she was doing things for selfish reasons (aka wanting a reward), she faced consequences for it and didn't get away with what she was looking for. It was only when her actions were truly selfless that she received any form of reward at all, and that means she wasn't looking for a reward in the first place, especially whenever she thought she might have to die in order to save her son.
In short, hers is a less intense arc compared to that of Mrs. Coulter but still worth bringing up. It's profoundly flawed, much like Zuko's, but it gets some things right that Zuko's doesn't, especially the consequences department. Regina usually doesn't get away with the shit she tries to pull (save for the sheriff mess... ._.), things backfire on her often, and she doesn't get to pretend someone else is responsible for it: it's her fault, her responsibility, her problem, and the show persistently makes that clear, which is why it forces her to start on her own path of redemption, since she really can't shirk the responsibility of her faults to anyone else. And it's clear since day one that the only person who can fix everything she broke is her, so that's what her journey is all about.
5. Vidia - Tinkerbell franchise
I am being 100% serious about this one. I know the Disney Fairies are hardly taken seriously as media content and seem way too childish to be treated as such :'D but I treat it as a very fun set of spin-offs that proved a looooot better than what I expected when I first watched them.
So, what's the deal with Vidia? She's an asshole from the start, a selfish and self-absorbed fairy who wants nothing to do with Tinkerbell, which is honestly 100% valid and I don't really think the first movie was trying to make that into Vidia's mistake xD it was Tink's mistake to think she could be friends with everyone, even someone who made it clear, constantly, that she wanted nothing to do with her. But Vidia eventually gets so sick of Tinkerbell and her constant attempts to befriend her AND switch to a different talent than the one she was chosen for that Vidia does something really nasty in order to get Tinkerbell into a fuckload of trouble. Eventually, Vidia's schemes collapse under their weight when Tink figures out a way to sort out the problems she caused... and Vidia reveals she's the one who pushed Tink into making her initial mistake, in a moment of anger and carelessness. Thus, she gets punished for being the instigator for the trouble Tink causes, and Tink is beloved by everyone now :'D
The next time we see Vidia, it's in movie 2 and only for a very brief glimpse of her acting dismissively at the blue fairy dust... right until she gets a small moment to herself and we see her actually rejoicing in it :'D it's a small moment but it's cute nonetheless.
The redemption arc happens in movie 3: Tink is right back to her dumbass antics of trying to befriend someone who wants nothing to do with her! :'D but when Tinkerbell ends up in trouble because Vidia, as usual, was trying to teach her a lesson, the whole world of fairies is bound to be revealed to the nasty humans! :'D and so, Vidia tries to fix her mistake, enlists help and starts a rescue operation for Tink. In the process, she comes clean about how her own foolishness landed them all in this mess... and the other fairies don't blame her, to her utter surprise: that moment of remorse becomes a moment of acceptance. Later, when Tink is almost captured by a human who wants to sell her to museums as some sort of rare butterfly, Vidia shoves Tink out of the way and the one who gets captured is Vidia herself! Effectively sacrificing herself for Tink's sake! Effectively crystallizing a friendship that Tink had no idea was in the books at all, at this point!
So then the fairies rescue Vidia, everything gets sorted out, and now Vidia is genuinely friends with Tinkerbell and all her friends :D which is a very wholesome and happy ending... but it's not an ending just yet.
Three movies later, Vidia and Tink are the best of friends. Vidia is a sassy little shit, who trolls Tink whenever she has the opportunity... but their bond is so tight it's really impossible for me not to interpret theirs as the very best of friendships within their circle of friends. It's effectively a full bounce from antagonist to best friend and when you see the payoff, IT'S BEAUTIFUL! :'D
So, Vidia, kind of like Thor, gets a simple arc, much simpler than some in this list (because she gets two movies for the consolidation of the arc, so nowhere near as much as those who got whole seasons of TV shows or book sagas). But she faces consequences for her actions in both instances where she acts out, her main flaw is being a shithead and not wanting to be a team player, and that behavior is 100% corrected by movie 3, where she's absolutely in this group and she's firmly cemented as Tink's best friend from that point onwards.
Three movies later, she's the very best character in that cast and continues to have an incredible friendship with the headliner :'D So, consequences were faced, behaviors were unlearned, rewards were not expected (crazy girl was ready to get gutted and dissected in a museum as long as it wasn't Tink getting that treatment?! Like, man, that's one HELL of a sacrifice xD) but still got to be friends with Tink later on, because she proved herself and Tink is just thrilled to have a new BFF as far as anyone can tell... again, very simple, but very effective and it works on all three fronts I need it to. Vidia isn't at all that bad a person/fairy xD but even in that case, she gets a redemption arc that works as though she were much worse than she is... and in that process, it gives her a great opportunity to prove that giving some people a chance (or more than one) goes a long way if they've never had anyone giving them a chance before.
6. Ruki Makino - Digimon Tamers
Oh, my female lone wolf... :') Digimon is my first fandom, outright. I've loved it for ages, and it's given me several redemption arcs that are worth rejoicing in. Several of them happened in Digimon Tamers too, one of which is possibly even better than Ruki's, and that's Impmon's redemption arc. That was one hell of a cool redemption arc xD and it definitely ticks all my boxes. But for the sake of brevity, I'll leave Impmon as a reference of another great redemption arc and focus instead on Ruki's:
Ruki is the loner of the Tamers crew. She starts out as an emotionally stunted girl who treats Digimon as data and nothing more. They're not living beings to her, no matter if she has an actual corporeal digimon (Renamon) who often beats up other corporeal digimon :'D and she spends several episodes acting like her understanding of the world is absolute and not wrong at all. But when things get complicated, when she starts to realize this isn't a silly card game and that these creatures are actually alive (and that her own life can be endangered by them, too), Ruki has a bit of a breakdown and wants nothing more to do with it, or so it seems. Her digimon ditches her because she, as well, is struggling to find meaning in her life. After a chaotic incident, Renamon and Ruki are reunited and Ruki finally opens up slightly... but only slightly, at first.
Her growth is gradual, all in all, but it helps her become someone new, someone different, without sacrificing everything else she has been. She becomes a girl who literally makes leaps of faith right into what looks like mortal peril in the hopes that, in doing so, she'll be able to save her friends' lives. A girl who won't escape the Digital World without making sure she can bring Impmon with her, and who takes a huge risk in saving that little troublemaker no matter the horrible things he did in the past, because she sees herself reflected in him, herself and her mistakes. It's a beautiful character growth and a very underrated character arc.
The thing with Digimon is that it prizes character growth and constantly strives for it (... when it's well-written, that is). Thus, in order for the digimon to reach higher levels of combat, the children characters have to make serious progress, emotionally and personally. This is true for Ruki, who goes from being that emotionally stunted girl to someone who leaps into danger to save Culumon, a digimon she used to find annoying and that she ends up doing anything she can to save from the clutches of what appear to be evil digimon. She becomes self-sacrificial, again it's an arc that hinges on selfish-into-selfless, and it's even represented in the outfit she wears: at first, Ruki's t-shirt sports a broken heart. Eventually, her family gets her a new t-shirt, the exact same model but the heart's no longer broken. It's so simple, but it shows how she's gone from such a lonely girl who pushed everyone away into a kind soul who protects others (such as her friend Juri... or that thing that looks like her @_@).
So, consequences for her mistakes: Ruki gets harassed and chased after by a creepy IceDevimon who wants her to become his tamer, it freaks her out horribly, and it's because she's a cold-hearted little shit so the nasty big ice demon claims they're basically fated partners. It's another mirror she refuses to look into, and one that shatters her perception of the world and herself: when she chases Renamon away, Renamon doesn't return until Ruki needs her and KNOWS she needs her. Her angry outbursts have consequences, consequences that render her lonely and miserable until she finally realizes she's going down the wrong path and takes her time to understand what she wants to do with her life instead.
In unlearned behaviors, Ruki stops isolating as much as she used to, learns to work with a team, takes Juri under her wing and makes friends with people she would have never imagined herself bonding with. From disdaining characters like Culumon or Impmon because they were weak, she ends up taking huge risks to save them when the situation requires it. The Ruki from the very start of the story would have never considered sacrificing herself for "mere data", and yet so many episodes down the line, she's doing everything she can to protect those two little annoying fellows, no matter the cost to herself.
And in rewards... Ruki's not really doing things for a reward, I think, but because she realizes she's not at peace with herself as she is. She's looking for that peace, so if someone wants to interpret that as a reward, that's their business xD but as far as I can tell, she's not kind to Juri because she thinks Juri will do something for her in return. She's not saving Culumon or Impmon because she expects to make them her new digimon partners and use them in battle or so: she's doing all those things because these people and digimon matter to her. Because she wants them to be part of her life, and she's ready to put in the work to keep them there. Her situation is of course not nearly as dark as that of some characters listed here... but it's a very nice glimpse into what a wholesome character growth arc looks like, especially a wholesome redemption. It flows far more smoothly and hits the nail on the head as bluntly as Zuko's arc attempts to... only, in Ruki's case the growth is absolutely tangible and reflected fully in her choices and actions, in ways Zuko's, regrettably, is not.
7. Jaime Lannister - A Song Of Ice And Fire EXCLUSIVELY
This is a common character mentioned in terms of character arcs and redemptions, or at least, he used to be until the TV show butchered his arc and character completely, all be it to provide fanservice and to satisfy the craving the showrunners seemed to have for at least featuring one incest couple on their show at a time... :')
Anyway, the show doesn't really concern me. I'm going to talk about the original Jaime Lannister, controversial man as he always was.
I admit, I have a love for the Lannister characters due to how messed up they are because that genuinely makes them interesting. I actually don't hate the relationship between Jaime and Cersei: it's beyond twisted and that's precisely the point of that relationship. Of all relationships we get to see in the books, it seems, for a long time, to be the most passionate one and I have no doubts the bulk of it comes from the very concept of it being transgressive on EVERY possible level it can be. Judging from the point of view of a moral human being, their relationship is disgusting. From a more artistic point of view, it's a very intriguing portrayal of just how dark and messed up human beings can be.
Thus, I don't really see Jaime and Cersei as "the villains" and I never did. Both were far more complex than that from day one, and GRRM fortunately knew better than to portray them with more simplicity than he did.
Jaime is basically the stereotypical golden knight with the shining armor. He's the perfect guy on paper, as much as he thinks he's an idiot, he really isn't that stupid, and he's a great warrior too. How do you take this stereotype of the golden knight and turn it into something awful? Well... through his relationship with Cersei :'D
This relationship is the entire driving motivation of Jaime when we're first getting to know his character. He's not a POV character until Book 3, if I'm not mistaken, but we get a very thorough glimpse of what a corrupted knight he is when he has that very intense conversation with Catelyn Stark while he's her son's captive. It still sticks with me how he goaded and taunted Catelyn all through that conversation like a complete boss while showcasing that he's 100% loyal to his sister while Catelyn's Eddard allegedly had committed indiscretions and cheated on her, ergo, presenting himself as a much more pure person than the very upstanding Ned.
This is basically what makes Jaime interesting. He's not unaware of why he's fucked up, but he happens to take all the greatest values of knighthood and uses them for aaaaall the wrong reasons and purposes. His redemption's ENTIRE purpose is making him come to terms with that disconnection in his choices, actions and honor as a knight, while losing the more material things he valued and that he mistakenly assumed were what made him a worthy knight at all :'D
Once Jaime's journey with Brienne begins, we actually get to see how his mind works. We get glimpses at flashbacks where Cersei berates him for flinging Bran out the window (despite she's the one who asked him to do ~something~). We get to see how she's basically his everything in the most messed up way possible... and we also get to see him butting heads with Brienne, who's 100% everything Cersei is not, and yet ironically embodies what Cersei, in some ways, always wanted to be :'D so Jaime's journey is complicated, I can't remember all the details about it, but his clashes with Brienne end up resulting in his development of respect for Brienne over time, all the way to him losing a hand for her (his sword hand, no less) and jumping into a bear's cage in hopes to help her survive a brutal battle despite he wasn't in much better shape than her at the time.
In those sacrifices, in those moments, Jaime is losing the perfection he was completely built upon. The golden polish that makes him the ideal knight, all stripped off him completely... while, simultaneously, he displays the most nobility and honor he ever has, in his entire lifetime. His character arc is based on him realizing honor and nobility are NOT what he has always assumed they were, what the textbook concepts of such things pretend they are... instead, it's in the things he learns about during his journey with Brienne. It's in developing respect and true understanding with someone, no matter how different from yourself they may be. Cersei, in Jaime's head, represented his "feminine half" in a very idealistic and messed up way, which suggests a very strong narcissism, despite Jaime's not even aware of it, I think (Cersei, on the other hand...). Brienne is basically everything he never thought a woman should be... and that's exactly why it's so pivotal and crucial that she's the one who brings him to understand true respect, nobility and honor as a knight. He actually treats her like an ally and friend once their journey ends, defending her from the heartbroken Loras who wants to avenge his dead king by killing her, and he sends Brienne on a key mission to find Catelyn's daughter.
All his growth is then profoundly showcased in his interactions with Cersei... well, after their reunion in the Sept of Baelor, that is. Where Cersei expects her brother to be exactly who he used to be, Jaime has been profoundly changed by his experiences. This is one thing I cannot forgive the show for: where Cersei comes to Jaime in hopes to seduce him and, in doing so, convince him to support her and let her have her way... Jaime, in the show, thinks with his dick and accepts everything she asks of him because of that. Jaime, in the books, refuses to go along with it because he now has a stronger understanding of duty and honor than he ever did before. It strongly looks like the first time he has refused Cersei anything, and it blows her away in the worst of ways. She's outraged and storms out on him, and from there on, she treats him terribly in retaliation for his behavior. Jaime is hurt because, as much as he's growing, he isn't exactly ready to toss aside the very twisted relationship he's had with Cersei all along just yet. Toxic relationships tend to be difficult to get rid of that way. So things get worse and worse until Cersei decides she just needs an excuse to get rid of her brother and sends him out on some missions away from King's Landing.
Ah, but I forget myself. Tyrion, Jaime's little brother to whom Jaime was usually very nice, discovers through Jaime's confession (while trying to break Tyrion out of King's Landing before he gets unfairly executed) that Tyrion's wife from ages ago actually loved him and that Tywin had Jaime break up their relationship as violently and horribly as it happened because it wasn't convenient for the Lannisters :'D Tyrion flies into a rage and then tells Jaime what we as readers already know: Cersei is 100% unfaithful to Jaime and always has been. This knowledge arrives very late for Jaime, it's somewhat difficult to fathom that he'd be so unaware of it, frankly... but it happens well after Jaime has already rejected Cersei at that crucial moment. This knowledge, too, sours things between them to a point where Jaime's journey through the lands north of King's Landing is mostly him brooding over all the people Cersei fucked while he wasn't available or paying attention :'D it doesn't help his development much, no, I have no trouble admitting that x'D
But... the final moment of Jaime's appearance in the fourth book is really what I consider the cusp of crystallization of his character arc: Cersei is in BIG trouble, and she begs him to come save her. Her letter is written in desperation, she trusts and believes he will come forward to help her. She trusts him that much! :'D
... And Jaime burns that letter.
The fact that the show refused to feature this moment is just... man, you can't take such showrunners seriously if they CAN'T do something like this. It's absurd to completely fuck over a character's very long arc, very complex and very interesting arc, just to continue drooling over an incest couple. It's ridiculous. Because they're not even exploring Cersei and Jaime in the very layered and complex way GRRM did in the books... no, they were really just in it for the incest. Which says more than enough about the priorities those showrunners had.
Basically, though, Jaime faces consequences for his past wrongdoings in many ways: he gets captured and imprisoned by the Starks, he loses his hand, he loses all his prestige, his pride as a warrior, his sister... all these things that he valued and that he thought made him the perfect knight were slowly but surely taken away from him, and they left him beaten and bloodied, lost in a world he had no place in anymore. If someone faced consequences for his wrongdoings, AND THEN SOME, it's definitely this guy.
The unlearning of toxic behaviors is basically everything I wrote up there xD Jaime spent most his life in a very messed up relationship with his sister and then it's by HIS choice, by HIS decision that there were boundaries to abide by, that there was honor he had to adhere to, that this relationship falls apart. It hurts him, yes, but Jaime stands his ground and no longer allows Cersei to manipulate him and use him the way she did in the past. He also respects people he had no respect for (Brienne being the prime example but Catelyn Stark as well), and he realizes there's no point in being a knight in shining armor if what's underneath that armor is... well, basically shit, to put it as eloquently as the show would xD
Finally... the rewards. Again something the show fucked up at majorly.
I actually love the relationship between Brienne and Jaime in the books... platonically. Platonically. 100% platonically.
And this is why.
Jaime himself knows Brienne's worth by the time they part ways. Even if they feel a romantic connection could exist between them, I'm absolutely certain Jaime would not feel worthy of Brienne in the least. Their inverse Beauty and the Beast situation sounds very pretty on paper, but once you really think about the characters as they are? Brienne is not about to let a man derail her whole life, that's EXACTLY the one thing she doesn't want and won't stand for. Jaime? He would never want to be that man. He respects her too much. He knows he's a huge mess and he would always think she deserves better than him, the guy who has spent his entire life in a relationship with his sister. His actions with Brienne, to me, have NOTHING to do with him trying to win her over romantically. He has never betrayed any interest in doing so, but even if, like I said, the urge were there, I don't think Jaime would genuinely act on it out of, once more, RESPECT for Brienne and for everything she stands for. This man drank respect women juice by the gallons when he met that awesome warrior lady, and what the show did to them was, on one hand, blatant fanservice, and on the other hand, a brutal character assassination, FOR THE BOTH OF THEM. The sudden, shortlived relationship where Jaime bails as soon as he hears Cersei is in trouble reduces him to the garbage man he is actively trying NOT to be in the books, and Brienne into the helpless woman pining over a man who doesn't deserve her that she has always tried NOT to be. It's not beautiful, ironic or interesting: it's plain stupid. Because, like I said, it was done for fanservice primarily, and it was a massive disservice to both characters in the end.
Point and case being: Jaime in the books is not hoping Brienne will fall into his arms, hopelessly in love, now that he dumped Cersei for good. Jaime in the books is actively, genuinely, looking to set things right. He tells Tyrion the truth when he does because he wants to be honest, because he's done being the Lannister moron who just follows on his sister and father's footsteps without thinking anything through. He has a heart, and it's so much better than he realized it is, and that heart guides him into doing what really is the right thing, no matter how difficult it may be to follow it at times (he has effectively lost both the people he cared about most in the past, Tyrion and Cersei, at this point in time, because he's done the right thing). So... there's really no reward for Jaime. The point of his arc is, if anything, that there's no NEED for reward when you're a true knight. And only when he's lost his hand, the woman for whom he used to fight for and all his prestige as a golden knight in shining armor, does Jaime Lannister truly become a knight.
And THAT's why his arc is goddamn beautiful, in its very twisted, fucked up sort of way :'D So, yes, Jaime absolutely fulfills my three requirements (BOOKS ONLY!) and he's a really good example of what a solid redemption arc looks like, not only when you contrast the beginning and the end, but when you actually analyze how that development takes place and how he becomes the man worth rooting for that he is, at least in what we've seen so far in the books. In comparison to Zuko... well, Zuko happens to become EXACTLY what he always intended to be, only, he's supposed to be a nice Fire Lord rather than an asshole Fire Lord, sure. He's not forced to reason with his goals and needs in depth at any point in time the way Jaime is. And yes, Zuko changes, but he sacrifices next to nothing that truly means anything to him, and gets back everything he sacrificed eventually, to boot. Imagine how cringworthy an arc it would be if Jaime Lannister supposedly changed his ways only to come right back to Cersei a "changed" man but without losing a hand or truly making sacrifices that mean anything, and he returns to his role in the Kingsguard just like that, betraying next to no hesitation or growth when it comes to anything he should have been reasoning with :'D maybe even marries Cersei and nobody cares, so he gets to fulfill his whole life's dream, just after a life-changing field trip where he made one (1) new friend and that's it!
... Well, minus the hand, that's basically what GOT represented him as, which is exactly why he's completely worthless there, heh...
8. Chocolove - Shaman King
This guy had the greatest redemption arc in Shaman King for two reasons: first of all, he was done VERY DIRTY in the original anime adaptation of this manga, and he came off as a very pointless, annoying character whose sole redeeming quality was his spirit companion, who happened to be a really cool jaguar :'D
Fast forward to 2021's adaptation and Chocolove gets the makeover of the century. Not only because the new show is handling his character better... but because it's closer to the actual, original storyline now, too! :'D
Chocolove McDonell is a huge dork. He likes to make bad jokes. This is basically all you know about him when you watch 2003's show.
In 2021's show, Chocolove McDonell is a tragic character, a victim of gang violence who then became a gang member, commiting violence just as bad as that which was committed against him, until someone helped him find a better path in life that might guide him towards real peace :')
He became an orphan early on in life due to gang violence, then he becomes a gang member too and, no matter how young he may be, he commits several crimes of his own, including murder of innocents for robberies and such. He's such a dark character in those flashbacks that it's very hard to believe he can be the same goofball you see in recent times: but Chocolove is found by a man who teaches him a new path. A mentor who helps him find a love for comedy and life that Chocolove had in him all along, but no one helped him find until this man did.
Then the mentor gets killed :'D by Chocolove's own gang.
The lessons of the mentor don't go to waste, though: Chocolove decides he has to change the world with laughter. He knows what the world of violence and crime is like, and he believes a better world than that one can be built. That's his true goal as a shaman and why he wants to become the Shaman King. It sounds silly as a premise... until you actually see the darkness this premise came from, which makes it a very touching concept instead.
Chocolove wouldn't be on this list, however, if it weren't for the fact that the children of the guy he killed on one Christmas night have been hunting him ever since :'D
The two kids show up on this super OP golem and they murder Chocolove's old gang (whom he had reformed, following fit with everything he learned with his mentor). He has to face those kids and face what he did: his own parents were murdered and now he's confronted by two kids who are a perfect mirror of who he had become during his gang days. So Chocolove outright DIES in this confrontation, is brought back to life later, and is shown having reflected on some really profound things once he comes back. He's so much stronger, but his true hope isn't to silence these kids, to make them feel bad for him and his suffering, to accept their dad is dead and to move on... no, it's to save them from the pain he has inflicted upon them, just as he wants to save the world with laughter.
He wants to fight for reasons that are truly worth fighting for, and he sacrifices his eyesight in order to become a stronger shaman yet to fulfill his true purpose.
So, once again the roundup: the children of the man he killed are, without a doubt, the consequences for his past actions. It's a complete, direct way to confront everything he did and everything he regrets, and the story pulls it off really well.
Unlearning toxic behaviors is what his journey with his mentor consisted of, as well as the whole message he's putting forward by reforming his gang and becoming a champion of laughter rather than violence. His whole character is basically a testament to unlearning toxic behaviors.
As for rewards... there are rewards indeed, I suppose, in what Chocolove achieves in this story. But I don't think that's what he's really going for. It isn't a matter of wanting people to worship him for having steered them in the right direction: he wants people to laugh so that they may find happiness and turn away from violence, because that's what he learned will be better for the world and for each individual. I really don't think there's any selfishness in that and, upon glancing at what the wiki says about Chocolove's future, I really do think he wasn't taking ANY sort of action for the sake of rewards at all. Hoping to become the Shaman King is a bit of a reward for sure, but what Chocolove wanted to achieve with that power is so distant from material or selfish goals that it's reeeeally hard not to root for the guy xD So, in short, he's a very good example of redemption, far better than a few other characters in this show who, yes, aren't half bad in their redeemed state... but I don't think any of their stories really hold a torch to Chocolove's.
9. Blackwall - Dragon Age: Inquisition
... I'm gonna be honest here, writing this one actually hurts xD because Blackwall BROKE MY HEART, and yet his redemption arc is possibly the best one in all of Dragon Age. But he still broke my heart. I'm still getting over it. That's where the consequences are, spoiler alert x'D
Anyway, Blackwall is a polarizing character in DAI (what ISN'T polarizing in Dragon Age, tbh...?). A guy who spends most the story lying to you can only achieve that sort of a reaction, right? :'D
The thing is that, when you meet Blackwall, he's a Grey Warden. A slightly sketchy Warden, sure, but he seems to be a stereotypical Warden indeed. Maybe a bit fanboyish. Maybe a bit odd. But then you see him interacting with his fellow Wardens during the quest of Here Lies the Abyss (if you brought him with you), you see him inspiring the other Wardens to STOP fighting and to return to their true purpose, and you can't help but think this guy's so cool! :D
... And then you discover Blackwall is long dead and the guy you've been hanging out with is Thom Rainier, who has been pretending to be Warden Blackwall for many, many years now.
Thom Rainier was not a good man. He was not a saint by any means. He was a captain in the Orlesian army who actively helped Orlesian lords fight each other in "the Game" by taking up unsavory jobs that were criminal and dreadful. The main horrible job he did entailed murdering a family of innocent civilians, children included, for the political advancement of one political party: the outcome saw Thom Rainier and his men being hunted down by the Orlesian law. His men were unaware of what they'd done for the most part, so Thom Rainier was the only one who truly understood the magnitude of the crime even before it was committed... and he still commanded it anyway, because he had been paid to do it.
It's a horrible story. It's dreadful. It's so bad Thom Rainier can't even live with himself afterwards. He spent most his days in taverns until the real Blackwall found him one day and recruited him to join the Grey Wardens. But, in typical dramatic fashion, the real Blackwall dies before Thom Rainier can complete his Joining ritual, he panics and fears the Wardens will think he killed Blackwall if he comes back with the dead man, and in a fit of said panic, decides he'll impersonate the real Blackwall... and that's how the players come to know him as Blackwall :'D
This whole backstory is revealed to the player veeeery late in the game. So late that my cute little elven Inquisitor had fallen in love with this big bear of a man, and she loved him dearly... and then she found out he had ditched her after banging her in a barn (yep .w. so classy), and when she finally tracks him down, turns out he's interrupting an execution in Orlais: he's interrupting the execution of one of his men, because he's here to take responsibility. He turns himself in to the law and reveals his true identity.
Turns out that, in all your heroic actions as the Inquisitor, Blackwall finds himself inspired to do good, to be a force of positive change in the world... but he knows that he can't just overlook the past and pretend none of it happened, which is what he's been doing so far. He's very much remorseful for it all, so he decides to fix it as best he can... and the only way to do that is to save his men, if he can, and to accept the punishment he deserves for his crime, too.
The game actually forces you to get him out of that situation because the writers are wicked that way xD I actually played through that quest recently and thought that, if possible, I'd just leave him to get executed by Orlais as he wanted to be, but no. He gets very angry at you for breaking him out, though, goes without saying... and he wants, he absolutely WANTS, to face the consequences of his past sins. Whatever good he's done in the present cannot feel right until he atones for the past. And that makes him a very compelling character... no matter how heartbroken my Inquisitor felt about this whole thing :'D
Alas, you can forgive him and get him to be your boyfriend again if you're like me (?) I did it, yes, and it wasn't the same ever again, every time I talked to him I couldn't resist clicking the meaner options because my Inquisitor was still upset at him xD but you can also choose to send him to the Wardens for good this time, once the main story ends. You can force him into serving the Inquisition against his will too, if you want to be an asshole (?) so those are your choices, and that's how you choose to deal with this man on his redemption arc.
Any of those choices, however, impacts Blackwall/Thom's arc very little, all in all: he's a man repenting, and he's ready to pay the price for his mistakes. You name that price, you determine what it will be, and he will face it when the time comes. You can't change his mind about that need for atonement: that's 100% on him, and that's what his whole character is about. The only thing you get to decide is how you will react to it all.
So, Blackwall absolutely faces the consequences of his actions, even if very late after committing them. He's inspired by the Inquisitor to set everything right, and it's a very touching story even if it still leaves a sour taste because of how Blackwall spent so many years running away... and yet it becomes a poignant lesson in not taking for granted that it's "too late" to atone. He decides to own up to his mistakes and to do things the right way, even if it takes forever. Not everyone will accept this, of course... but he's still doing his very best to atone indeed, and that means a lot more than pretending you did the right thing, playing up false innocence, or justifying your actions with embellished explanations :'D
He unlearns his behavior, of course, seeing as he never again commits the crimes he did after the disaster with the Callier family. He's a brooding drunk afterwards, but then he becomes a warrior who battles Darkspawn and trains common folk to defend themselves. He's done awful things... but see, the funny thing about Grey Wardens is that they give everyone a second chance, no matter how badly they may have mishandled their first chance at life :'D Blackwall may be an extreme way of showing just how absolute that Grey Warden concept of second chances is... but it works very effectively, if you ask me. He makes the most of this second chance, and even decides to face the necessary consequences for his crimes despite he could just as easily have continued to lie forever, but he couldn't stand doing that.
As for rewards... he's definitely expecting no rewards, the man outright gets mad at you for not letting him die in atonement for his crimes x'D it's you who chooses to reward him for being a better man, but he absolutely doesn't do ANYTHING in hopes of a reward of any nature. Does he disapprove if you turn him into a servant of the Inquisition against his will? Well, yes, but that doesn't mean he won't do it xD also disapproves if you say good riddance to him, but it doesn't really change his willingness to face those consequences. Basically he'll just be upset at you for trying to get in the way of justice being dispensed just so you can take a petty vengeance over having been lied to (which, yes, is VERY petty compared to what Orlais wants from him, and I think we all can acknowledge that). So... the man is a good man in the end. He wasn't always, but he is now, which is the point of any redemption arc. And while it's definitely difficult to accept that he deceived you for as long as he did, the cutscene where he's finishing building that toy for the kids in Skyhold just hits so damn hard that I can't stay mad forever. He's a much better man than he knows, so much better than other men in this very same franchise :'D and he has no interest in being acknowledged as one: all he wants is to do right by people, to help those who need help and to accept every consequence of his past if need be, for he won't feel worthy of a future before he does that. There's a humility to many redemption arcs, such as his, that certain arcs just... can't hope to attain and frankly are not any better for it.
10. Soren - The Dragon Prince
I admit, I never anticipated Soren redeeming himself. I really thought Claudia might be the one to do it... but I do admit, Soren's redemption was a lot more wholesome than I ever thought possible for a character who starts out as the idiot sort-of-bully who messes with the protagonist as often as he does.
Soren isn't a bad guy, deep down. He's just a jock, and he's pretty dumb. But for someone raised by a father as messed up as Viren, Soren is remarkably decent, if you ask me.
Still, Soren only gets to really shine in season 3. Season 2 doesn't help him much, though it breaks him pretty badly right before Claudia heals him with the dark magic she uses to set him all back to what he used to be :'D in this sense, I think Soren's character is a bit like Jaime Lannister's: he has some limits, yes, he's not truly evil and he's a big goofball in general, but for most the first two seasons, he's really not much to write home about. He gets smashed by a dragon in the second season, which paralyzes him and that was a very interesting development up until Claudia, like I said, heals him with dark magic. By then, Soren's a little weirded out by circumstances around him and when he faces Viren with Claudia on the next season, he's taken aback by the fact that his father is gaslighting them as blatantly as he is. Claudia gets swept up by it, he's completely disappointed and heartbroken.
So, Soren's arc really builds up from slowly coming to terms with his own limits, as far as I can tell, and gradually seeing Viren for what and who he really was. His sister can't really do that, but he does: he helps Ezran escape, he turns his back on Viren when he and Aaravos start doing insane magic to turn warriors into crazy monstruous beings, and he runs to help Callum, Ezran and Rayla shortly after having been completely dreadful to them back in season 2. Soren even scores one of the best dialogues/monologues in the entire show when he inspires everyone to fight Viren: "the only way to stop this is to look evil in the face and say 'no more'," and who would have thought a character who came off as a completely hopeless jock would be the one to say those words in this show? xD
Soren faces consequences for his actions, yes, by earning both the distrust of his father and his sister, and of Callum's group. Hell, the dragon's attack that leaves him so badly injured is just another conseqeunce for his behavior. He wants to play heroics, to pretend he's some great hero and warrior, only to find himself paying such a steep price for it that he's completely lost as to what he's doing and why he's doing it at all by season 3.
His unlearned toxic behaviors are, of course, everything he regrets and repents for in season 3, his willingness to stand side by side with those he had once seen as enemies (elves), his leadership and help to those who are supporting Callum's group. He's still using his warrior training... but now he's using it for the better. All the way to attempting to KILL his own father, whom he no longer sees as a great hero or a man worth the admiration he used to feel for him, because now Soren serves Ezran, the actual king he's supposed to serve, rather than Viren, who basically just controlled him because he was Soren's father. Soren is a true knight now, taking a stand for what matters, even remediating the wrongs of the past generation (where Viren greedily sought power and took down King Harrow when he could, now Soren fights for Ezran's right to be king, all the way to confronting his father as he does).
Lastly, rewards... well, I don't think the rewards Soren gains are remotely as big as the ones he would have gotten if he had just closed his eyes and let Viren do whatever he wanted. He would have become more powerful, much stronger if he had let Viren mutate him :'D he would have stayed with his father and sister, whom he loved and cared about. Instead, he turns against them and helps the kids who may or may not hate him (at least, he expects two out of three will hate him), all be it in order to do what he has learned is right, and to serve the true king he wants to serve, Ezran. So... yes, Soren is definitely a redemption arc done right. Could it have benefited from muuuuch longer process? I would say so, yes. But with what we were given, I think it works fairly well for what it is. Would I have loved to see Claudia redeemed? Absolutely, and admittedly it's what season 2 really seemed to suggest would happen? But who knows if the future will bring something better... at any rate, Soren, for what we have in TDP so far, is a good example of a good redemption arc.
11. Steve Harrington - Stranger Things
This one is, I think, one of the most popular examples of good redemption arcs in modern-day media. The thing with Steve is he wasn't THAT bad, something that becomes starkly obvious once Billy shows up, but he wasn't exactly the most upstanding guy either. In general, he feels like a popular guy with a bit more nuance than usual in the first season. This nuance comes from the fact that he's in a relationship with a girl who used to be a regular nerd, not popular at all, and while he could be as big a bully as his asshole friends are (because he's part of THAT crowd), he generally doesn't act like that. All he really wants, at first, is to have his relationship with Nancy and nothing else really seems to be much of a big deal for him.
Then Jonathan comes into the picture with literal pictures and, while I'm not going to excuse Steve at all, Jonathan wasn't exactly the most appropriate guy either, taking pictures of their group's secret pool party mess without anyone's awareness that he was even there, and taking some pictures of Steve's girlfriend that do NOT paint Jonathan in a flattering light in anyone's eyes... other than Nancy's, of course. Steve was not at all entitled to beat up Jonathan or break his camera, his territoriality over Nancy is absolutely wrong, but let's be real: the behavior exhibited by Jonathan is not what most people would consider agreeable ways to flirt with your crush, worse yet if said crush is already taken. It's very valid, imo, to feature Steve considering Jonathan's behavior as creepy because IRL, I think that's what most people would and should react like.
But like I said, this doesn't justify Steve's outburst... and he knows it. His attempt to "defend Nancy's honor" by beating up Jonathan and doing all the shitty things he and his friends did in retaliation for her dumping him was completely childish and stupid. And like I said, he knows it. That's why it doesn't even take longer than one season for Steve to regret being such an idiot, and why he finds himself in a surreal, supernatural chaotic adventure (or misadventure) with Nancy and Jonathan when the first season is ending: he wanted to apologize to the two of them, and because of his great timing, he ends up joining forces with them against the nasty monster :'D
By the time we start season 2, Steve is a much more mature guy. He's a fascinating way to explore what comes AFTER redemption, if you ask me. People who pretend redemption stories end when the character changes his ways... well, they're completely proven otherwise by Steve and his story, because it ony gets BETTER after he's changed his ways.
Nancy is clearly still hung up on Barb's tragedy and her feelings for Jonathan once season 2 gets going. She and Steve have very strong divorcing couple vibes here, so eventually it's over between them and I don't really remember it being dreadful, just that they go their separate ways. After getting ejected from the teenage drama, though, Steve undergoes the transformation that cemented him as a fan favorite: DAD STEVE IS BORN! From being the jock of the cast, he suddenly takes a protective role with the kids of Stranger Things, especially with Dustin. He's fighting alongside these crazy kids, helping them against some very nasty threats, and just all around being a great guy. He even drives Dustin to the dance and gives him tips on how to do his hair and look cool xD
And in season 3, despite we thought Steve would have already reached the heights of his character, he got an even BETTER deal than I thought possible: his contentious relationship with co-worker Robin is a TON of fun to witness, especially once she starts to show she can be one hell of an asset to Steve and Dustin's investigations. The more Steve and Robin spend time together, the stronger the chemistry between them... chemistry that Steve misinterprets, as does the general audience that didn't get spoiled that Robin was gay by all early viewers xD she eventually admits this to Steve, just when he's as good as assuming the next natural step in his friendship with Robin is to try to start a romantic relationship with her, now that they really are vibing together... and then you see his reaction to her confession and it's amazing. He's not being a selfish asshole, he's completely understanding of her and their chemistry is even BETTER for it. He's so supportive and they become the BFF team nobody even imagined they wanted for Steve. It's such a great storytelling choice that it just continues to cement Steve as the best breakout character in this entire show.
So... Steve faced consequences for his wrongs with Jonathan for sure, since he lost Nancy, the one girl he was truly in love with. He is implied to have had a lot of relationships but she's the one that he really cared about. In being an ass to Jonathan, which is frankly his only true fault, Steve ends up paying the price of losing the one thing we knew he cared about. He gets no new girlfriend later as a consolation prize either: he has to find other things in life, on his own time, that make his life worthwhile, because his ship with Nancy has very much sailed and isn't coming back.
He unlearns the toxic behaviors in the obvious way, by showing us he's not acting the way he did with Jonathan anymore. He outright regrets it and apologizes to him and Nancy, and there's no sign of him acting like that with anyone else again. Then, when Robin can't be the girlfriend he briefly thought she might be for him, he doesn't fly into a selfish rage: he knows better than that. Nancy may not have been the most painless lesson ever, but it's still a lesson he learned and he won't get in the way of the happiness of a girl he cares about, so lesson very much learned.
Lastly, like I said, there's no real consolation prize for Steve. He doesn't get the love of a lifetime he's looking for. It's entirely possible the story won't ever give him another girlfriend that makes him as happy as Nancy did. But that doesn't mean he's bitter about his growth and development: he's found other things, other people to care about, and now he makes the most of the new friendships he's found with the least likely people (Dustin and Robin, particularly). It's a much less hardcore redemption arc than many of the ones I describe in this post, but it hits the three important points I need a redemption arc to hit and turns a character who could have been a boring stereotype into a truly engaging, interesting character worth rooting for.
12. Johnny Lawrence - Karate Kid + Cobra Kai
Another controversial choice! xD Johnny Lawrence's redemption arc is a bit wonky and weird, I admit as much. The thing is, once you revisit the original movie, you find that he was a dick... and that Daniel was also pretty much picking fights in revenge even when Johnny wasn't doing anything to him. So it's a slightly ridiculous situation all in all, and the true victim of it all is, ultimately, Ali (?) Good thing that girl got out of there on time xD
Anyway, Johnny respects Kreese's agreement with Miyagi that there will be no more fighting until Johnny and Daniel can sort things out directly at the tournament. Daniel, ironically, instigates conflict in a childish, playful way after said agreement is reached... but this isn't about Daniel anyway xD Johnny is, of course, a dick as well, he's annoying and doesn't seem to respect Ali's choice to either dump him or date someone else. Still, by the end of the movie, things start to feel a little odd when Kreese has Daniel injured on purpose by one of his students and tells Johnny to take advantage of the injury. Johnny looks hesitant, but eventually he follows his teacher's order. Once he gets defeated unexpectedly by Daniel with the controversial move that still is in the midst of legality debates (?) Johnny surprises everyone in a... 5 second scene where he picks up the trophy and hands it over to Daniel by saying "you're alright", which suggests he underwent some sort of express redemption arc!
This redemption arc is, in my opinion, finalized through Cobra Kai. I have my misgivings with season 3 of said show (haven't watched the fourth yet), but season 1 was basically the ideal answer to the original movie in terms of working with a sequel that not only honored the original but showed just how complicated Johnny's life has been: his redemption really only started in that scene at the tournament, and he's spent the rest of his life falling apart and being a mess because he's a chaotic guy, practically the living embodiment of a meme of an 80's guy still stuck in the past. He, somehow, becomes the Miyagi to Miguel Diaz, a neighboring kid who's very nice to him and to whom Johnny ends up teaching karate due to Miguel's problems with his own bullies. We get to see Johnny's side of the story, which no doubt is biased as hell... but that side of the story becomes remarkably compelling due to the subversion of tropes here. Cobra Kai went from the karate school of the privileged amoral assholes to the school of the underdogs who are looking for the strength and confidence to overcome the trappings of their status as school nerds. Miguel is the poster boy for this new Cobra Kai, but the story wisely features a character like Hawk, whose confidence and strength turn him into a bully in his own right. Meanwhile, Daniel starts teaching Robbie, Johnny's son, Miyagi-style karate. There's plenty of chaos there, with both Daniel and Johnny following on Mr. Miyagi's footsteps in odd ways (Johnny by helping the weak kids, Daniel by teaching a single student in the arts Miyagi taught him). Everything, then, comes to a head in the tournament that year...
And it all results in Johnny realizing the error of not just his ways, but of Cobra Kai's ways. He's forcibly reminded of his own disastruous tournament, when he was told by his teacher to take advantage of the injury that nearly rendered Daniel unable to keep fighting. And he's forcibly reminded of that... because that's the way his "no mercy" Cobra Kai students are behaving. Miguel has a very petty and stupid teenage conflict going on with Robbie over Samantha (Daniel's daughter) that's basically the same conflict Johnny and Daniel had over Ali... and he's acting on impulse, rage and vengeance much like Johnny was encouraged to in his younger years. Miguel's even worse about it, I'd say, mostly because Johnny IS trying to reel him back, and Miguel won't hold back at all. He's even proud of defeating Robbie as brutally as possible... while Johnny can't even savor the triumph because he's just seen the story from the other side. He's no longer just the proud teacher of a WINNER! No, he's the estranged father of the loser, and he's the one responsible for Robbie's injuries by having taught Miguel to act the way Miguel is acting.
It's honestly such a strong storytelling choice because it forces Johnny to confront his wrongdoings directly. He's no longer just Cobra Kai, he's also Miyagi-do because of Robbie. He cares about his son, and he's wronged Robbie SOOOOO much, throughout all of Robbie's life, and he can't even do right by him when it comes to karate because his son's decided to join Daniel to piss off Johnny (at least, that was his sole purpose initially). Miguel is a surrogate son, one who sees Johnny as a great father figure that Johnny doesn't even feel like he is, because he's screwed over Robbie so many times (mostly without meaning to). Even when he tries to be there for his son, things always take a turn for the worse. And right as the first season ends, Robbie walks away from his father, injured and having lost a tournament, but seemingly having won something much more important: the father figure he's been lacking all his life, in Johnny's life-long rival rather than in Johnny himself.
So Cobra Kai's strongest writing was really back in these days because it really drove the point home about Johnny's growth and forced him to confront things he had been neglecting or deliberately ignoring for all those years. It's a redemption arc done right because it's no longer "Oh yeah so Johnny suddenly had a moment of clarity when his teacher gave him a horrible order and he accepted his loss with dignity!", it's "Johnny is confronted by the reality of his actions and the true horrors of Cobra Kai philosophy when his student/surrogate son beats up his actual biological son because of his teachings". It really improves on the original massively when you look at it this way, and it's the entire reason his redemption arc can make it into this list.
There's a lot of questionable choices in the later writing of Cobra Kai, I haven't even watched season 4 yet but season 3 was mostly unpleasant. Even so, based on what I've seen, I can definitely point to the three signs of an achieved redemption arc with what I saw so far:
Johnny pays the consequences for his mistakes through his son becoming the Daniel to Miguel's Johnny in season 1. He faces consequences for not reasoning with Cobra Kai teachings from his youth and imparting them carelessly to young, impressionable kids who may not be terrible people, all in all, but who are quick to take advantage of those teachings in impulsive ways, without reasoning with them just as Johnny didn't. He actually realizes what his role as a teacher and mentor has to be throughout the second season and we get to see a stark contrast between him and Kreese when Johnny shows that his No Mercy philosophy is no longer what it used to be. Then he outright kicks Kreese out of Cobra Kai, and gets screwed over in retaliation for it, but he creates his own dojo... and he continues to try to follow a newer and much better code of behavior that feels like his own philosophy, his own ways of being fierce without being as impulsively violent and destructive as he used to be. So yes, I'd say he faces consequences very often, consequences that he reasons with and that persuade him to try to be better, even if he doesn't always succeed at that. He faced consequences for his actions in the original movie too, but his arc isn't really as insightful as it becomes when Cobra Kai expands on it.
Unlearning toxic behaviors is basically what Johnny is trying to do in the second and third seasons of Cobra Kai. He's not necessarily doing a brilliant job all around, but he gets to showcase his growth as he starts letting go of the worst sides of his behavior and tries to be better and do better in most aspects of his life. You absolutely can see the progress in Johnny's case, and it's really annoying at times to see the show resorting to cheap drama that dampens that progress and sabotages Johnny's growth just for the sake of convoluted storytelling, but what can you do...
Finally, rewards: the only thing I think Johnny wants at this point in time is to do right by the next generation. I could be wrong to think he'd accept Robbie turning his back on him permanently if he KNEW Robbie's life will be turned around by doing so... but in some ways, that's exactly what he did in season 2 by accepting Robbie was with Daniel and even trying to get his kids to stop hounding him and mistreating his son. If doing the right thing means he'll earn Robbie's affection and respect, he'll be happy for it... but sometimes, Robbie can be very messed up :'D and even in those cases, Johnny is shown making difficult decisions that Robbie might not forgive him for. He makes them anyway, though, because he's learning better and becoming a better man. All of which includes owning up to his fuckups and doing better as a father and teacher to all the kids in his charge. If season 4 messed up all this growth and development somehow, I don't know yet... but until season 3, at least, Johnny manages to retain a lot of his core character traits and repurposed them for the better, letting go of so much baggage he didn't really reason with and understanding he has to be better, do better, in order to make his life worthwhile. What was a mediocre redemption arc in the original movies becomes so much more than that when this show puts him in complicated situations and positions as a teacher for all those kids, as well as his role as a father to Robbie. It's complicated... but like I said, unless season 4 really messed up majorly, his redemption arc is most likely the best element in the entire show and the one narrative thread that really kept me invested in the show back when I first watched it.
13. Diana Cavendish - Little Witch Academia
This one's a bit complicated because Diana wasn't really evil at all or a villain or anything like that xD Diana was, instead, the smartest girl, top of the class, too good to be true, heiress to a big magical family and all that. She's a very interesting character and posibly the best one in the entire story... and she's constantly at odds with Akko, the protagonist, during the majority of LWA. She solves problems in unexpectedly effective ways, whereas Akko sorts out issues in completely ridiculous ways. They're both contrasting characters and rivals... and yet Diana always holds at least a modicum of respect for Akko that Akko doesn't even seem aware of, on the most part.
Their rivalry is persistent up until the moment when Diana is supposed to leave the academy because of her family issues. Akko, meddlesome as she is, pokes her nose into that business and ends up following Diana all the way back home, trying her very best to get Diana to come back because the school won't be the same without her and Diana has always wanted to be a witch. In helping Diana, Akko awakens a new power in the Shiny Rod, and Diana proves she's a much better person than stereotypes of her role suggest, by often putting other people's lives and safety first, well above her own needs and obsessions with her family's legacy.
Sometime after Akko learns the truth about what happened to her magic, Diana also puts together what happened to her own: Diana spent years unable to perform any magic at all because Shiny Chariot, childhood idol of both Akko and Diana, stole their power when they were children. Diana managed to regain her power and became a remarkable, studious and talented witch because of her hard work, whereas Akko was 100% unaware of what had happened to her and didn't really know why she couldn't perform magic the way others could. Once they learn about it, Akko is very depressed... and Diana is the one who starts getting Akko out of that rut. By the finale, Diana is the very last person standing next to Akko as they try to prevent a global disaster from happening, nukes included and everything xD
Diana's isn't a classic redemption arc because she really doesn't have that much to answer for. Being arrogant isn't exactly a sin in my books, being proud isn't one either. Still, you can see a very interesting change in her character and true growth the more she sees that Akko, the chaotic girl with no magic or magic family to speak of, becomes an actual witch through her determination more than anything, a witch who thinks magic should be used to make people smile. It's really an interesting situation since Diana is about as stern and unwilling to smile as Akko is happy and emotional all the time... and yet in Diana's growth, you can see her smiling more often as things move forward, as she gets to understand Akko better and respect her as the witch she is.
So, once you get to the bottom of it: Diana faces consequences for her actions when she, in all her studiousness and looking down on someone like Akko, is forced to acknowledge that maybe she doesn't have all the answers, and that Akko may just be relating to magic in a very valuable and important way that Diana has long set aside. So Diana may be lauded and beloved by all the important people... but she knows, deep down, that Akko has answers she doesn't, and that those answers are worth respecting. She embodies that respect with more and more strength as the story progresses until she becomes one of Akko's best friends.
Unlearning toxic behaviors is what I already said above, I guess xD she stops looking down on Akko on principle, stops pretending Akko is inferior and instead becomes as helpful to Akko as she can be, down to even being the one to find Akko and talk her out of her horrible depression after she learns the truth about Shiny Chariot. She knows Akko is valuable and that Akkko matters, and she's not afraid to admit it, no matter if she's a member of the very famous magical Cavendish family and Akko is a nobody, socially speaking.
Lastly, no rewards... she really isn't expecting rewards, in my opinion, when she sacrifices the opportunity to take back her family's control form her villainous aunt, all be it to save Akko, her aunt and her cousins when she has to choose between both things. She's not ambitious in a reckless way. She gets rewards because of her excellence, no doubt, but she's still trying harder and getting those rewards never feels like her endgame goal because she just never stops with her overachieving tendencies xD but most importantly, unlike the Croix/Chariot conflict about who gets to be the magical blessed lady with the fancy Shiny Rod, Diana actually accepts Akko in the role of wielding the rod without much issue. She encourages her and even helps her in that process, and that's really just a testament to how selfless she is, in the end. Once more, rewards are not what she's looking for, even if by the end she earns Akko's friendship anyway.
14. Artemis Fowl - Artemis Fowl saga
This one probably should have been so much higher on the list xD but it's the problem with redemption arcs done right, sometimes they just escape your notice because they're solid character arcs, so solid you barely recognize them for what they were xD
Artemis Fowl, IN THE BOOKS, is designed to be a 12-year-old villainous boy. It's really that simple. He's the titular character, but he's by design the villian of his own book and that's honestly a really fun narrative choice. The heroic character standing opposite to him, Holly (an elf), gets kidnapped by Artemis, who demands for a huge ransom from the fairies for the safe return of their captured LEPrecon officer :'D it might sound silly but it's a pretty fun story as it was. Artemis gets moments when he can be the actual kid he is, but mostly, he acts like an adult in the body of a boy and that's why he's such a ridiculously fun character.
Of course, Artemis has motivations to act the way he does, and it's possible that those motivations are the most humane part of him for the bulk of the story: he wants to help heal his mother's very severe mental illnesses during the first book, caused by his father's disappearance. Then, he also wants to find his father and patch his family back up once more. He achieves both goals... through slightly questionable means in the first case, through slightly less questionable ones in the second one. He does a lot of sketchy stuff all along, and he's very unconcerned with consequences until they literally punch him in the face :'D he has a bodyguard who he assumes will protect him from harm 24/7/365... and that assumption makes Artemis a lot more vulnerable than he realizes he is. For, if that bodyguard isn't around, yes, he's going to get punched in the face. But more than that, he's going to struggle with certain situations and problems where he has to be put to the test in order to really survive dangerous situations.
His bodyguard's last name is Butler, and of course, Butler serves as Artemis's shield on the most part. The moments where you see consequences hitting Artemis are usually when Butler is out of the equation... and on one such case, he's out of the equation because of Artemis's own mistakes and terrible choices. In a reckless, foolhardy attempt to sell fairy tech to a very dangerous man, Artemis winds up walking right into the dangerous man's trap and Butler gets shot, nearly killed in the process. Butler isn't the same ever since, Artemis goes well out of his way to get help for his best friend and bodyguard, but he knows this is his fault, all in all.
Similar situations happen throughout the books, probably more of them than I can remember atm, but very often, Artemis is the one who starts his own problems and the one who has to figure them out. Sometimes he's not the one who starts the trouble, admittedly... but what matters is the times when he causes trouble and resolves it by growing as a human being in the process, evidently. Even if he's so reiterative and makes so many mistakes xD
Artemis's mistakes, to me, never felt like he was treading over the same things over and over again. At most, the situation in the Time Paradox with his mother's sudden illness felt like a possible revisit to his initial willingness to do anything for his mother... and he pays a hefty price for it because Holly realizes he's manipulated her, and their strange near-romantic relationship is frozen over before it can become any more romantic :'D that's her choice, and he accepts that. So, typically, Artemis isn't devoid of consequences in his bad choices. He faces a lot of consequences for his wrongdoings, but Holly realizes there's potential in that annoying know-it-all mastermind to be a good person, or at least a slightly better person, and she says so in Book 2. It's one of the very best scenes in Artemis Fowl altogether, once she hands him the coin that she uses to represent his potential to do good things and be better than he usually wants to be. That coin is a wonderful way to tell the readers that Artemis indeed can change, and will be allowed to grow out of his worst on his own time.
Indeed, as the story progresses, you get to see how Artemis's instinctive, insidious and curious nature changes. His willingness to unravel every mystery remains there... but it's no longer a matter of figuring things out for his benefit, or for the benefit of a few people around him (namely, his family). He discovers threats to the fairy world, he helps them fight against them, he helps keep them properly safe and hidden in their underground world, and ultimately he manages to save the whole world by sacrificing himself to put an end to a very dangerous cataclysm that the most recurrent villain of the books was ready to set in motion. Quoting what I'm seeing on Wikipedia about this last book (do cut me a little slack for having to use Wikipedia for this, I read it forever ago x'D): Colfer stated that he wanted the novel to deal with Artemis' transformation "from being a selfish criminal to a hero who is prepared to sacrifice everything for a good cause." We're talking about a character arc that was always plotted, from the get-go, to hit the points I need in redemption arcs to feel like they actually work xD so it's an ideal example of a redemption arc, in the end, and a more complicated one than most seeing as the protagonist IS the villain who needs to redeem himself.
Like I said, Artemis's every action nets him consequences. He gets away with a lot of things because he's a sly lil' shit, but all in all, he faces consequences in many ways throughout his journey. It's when he sets things right, when he shows he's not really as morally corrupt as he often acts like, that characters like Holly decide he may be worth more than he wants anyone to think he is. As the story progresses, his past mistakes come back to haunt him (such as in The Time Paradox). He has a lot of moments to reflect on his growth and he slowly fazes out his more villainous ways into a more reflective, thoughtful approach to still being a mastermind, but no longer one who's putting others at risk with his choices.
Unlearning behaviors is, yet again, the core of Artemis's journey. He makes a lot of stupid mistakes for sure, impulsive mistakes based on his persisting mastermind-y behaviors, but they are less common as the story progresses, as he faces consequences so steep and severe for his actions that he nearly watches Butler die, that he LITERALLY watches Holly die in front of him one time and he outright turns back time to save her life at all costs. He regrets things much more openly and actively seeks to make amends for his mistakes as he grows, and eventually becomes enough of a good person that he can be, indeed, the hero who is prepared to sacrifice everything (including his life, because he outright does) to do what needs to be done and save everyone else.
Lastly, as far as rewards go, I won't pretend Artemis wants no rewards whatsoever... but the rewards he's after are surprisingly selfless more often than not. The true shock in the first book comes in the form of finding out that all his heinous actions are really the actions of a child with the brainpower and the means to take it upon himself to find his father and heal his mother. That's really what he's trying to do. There's other situations where he does awful things for very stupid reasons (book 3, for instance) and regrets it later (which nets him a brainwipe as consequence for his recklessness).
But the more the story progresses, the more it feels like his interest is in discovering truths, in learning valuable things, rather than in obtaining a financial gain. Book 3 is already the last legs of his selfish criminal career, and he basically was trying to have one last attempt at being his old self before facing that he absolutely can't do that any longer. I really don't think he expected Holly to ever become his friend so I don't think he ever made choices for that sake... I do think that, once they did become friends and allies, she became a big priority for him and doing what was right by her was very important. Hence why his betrayal of her in The Time Paradox was such a rough point for both characters, and why he goes out of his way to make it up to her. Ultimately, he's trying to save his family and friends for the bulk of the books... and then, by the very last one, he's trying to save the whole world instead :'D he would have known there was a chance he might not be resurrected at all in Book 8, but he still sacrifices himself as he does and crystallizes his entire growth by doing so. It's honestly as good as it can get with a redemption arc done right, and Artemis very fortunately gets it right and practically set a standard for me, without my full awareness, of what fully-rounded redemption arcs should look like.
15. Loghain Mac Tir - Dragon Age: Origins
Another DA chracter! And this time one that's very unpopular because few people pick to keep Loghain alive because that means sacrificing your bond with Alistair, who can become your best friend, boyfriend or what-have-you if you have a positive relationship with him for most the game :'D meanwhile, Loghain's arc is very brief and you can end up missing out on A LOT if you already finished most the DLCs and such by the time he joins your party...
This being said, though, Loghain is the epitome of a good redemption arc, in his journey throughout all three games. I never ever imagined I'd like him as much as I do, but after having him become a Warden, the guy really grew on me on record time.
Basically, Loghain is your typical bad guy politician who thinks he has all the answers, has been here for ages and manipulates everything from the shadows in order to stay in power. He wants that power to repeal the Darkspawn invasion and to ensure Ferelden, his nation, stays strong forever! :'D but unfortunately he goes about it in such sketchy and terrible ways that he's always at odds with the Warden, the player character. When the Warden defeats Loghain, this guy is responsible for:
Abandoning his king on a battlefield when his duty was to send in reinforcements to save the day.
Attempting to assassinate a political rival (Arl Eamon).
Attempting to assassinate the last Warden in Ferelden (the player character).
Selling elves of the Alienage into slavery to the Tevinter Imperium.
Associating himself with a nasty-ass nobleman who murdered a whole family in order to gain more political power.
Letting said nasty-ass nobleman torture other nobles and imprison them, turning a blind eye to his BS just because.
Letting said nasty-ass nobleman take Loghain's own daughter Anora as his hostage in order to set a trap for the Warden that you inevitably have to fall into.
Lies and defames the Warden in the Landsmeet in order to present himself as the nicer guy and the true protector of Fereldan values. Particularly accuses the Warden of selling out their own to Orlais (with zero evidence) while there's evidence of HIM selling the very people from the city to a very reviled land of slavers :'D
With all this in mind, this guy is... not good news. At all. He definitely makes plenty of people on this list look like harmless puppies in comparison. He has no excuses of "I did it because I was taught to be a terrible person", or "someone else ordered me to do it", nope, Loghain makes his own choices and he's ready to die for them, as shown once you defeat him in the final one-on-one battle you have against him. So it's very easy, veeeery easy, to be tempted to just kill him and be done with it at this point... but if you don't?
If you don't, Loghain becomes a Warden. As explained above with Blackwall, Loghain's whole past is forfeit now as he becomes a Warden and all his life so far is discarded. He has to serve the very organization he DESPISES, which sounds like poetic justice... but then you discover that one of the ways in which he can serve is by DYING to kill the actual final boss of the game. So you outright get the chance to kill this man if you want to, and you even get an achievement for it! xD
But if he DOESN'T die... Loghain becomes everything a good warden has to be. He's there to support you on your decisions, to impart his wisdom, his experience, his opinions while still respecting yours far more than you imagined possible. Once you get to the expansion, Awakening, Loghain shows up at one point to check on you and I could barely BELIEVE it when he showed up. It seriously felt like seeing a good friend once again xD
Ultimately, you can kill him AGAIN in Inquisition (this guy's just always courting death, clearly) by having him stay in the Fade in Here Lies the Abyss instead of Hawke. This way, Loghain gets that final atonement for all his mistakes by sacrificing himself to help your new hero, the Inquisitor, save the world... if you let him live, he just goes right back to the Wardens and continues service for them, as expected of him.
So, once more the round-up: faces consequences for his wrongdoings? Yes, the game is literally designed to make it so xD You're the one who determines, personally, what kind of punishment suits Loghain best. If you're particularly passionate about hating him, maybe killing him is more cathartic. If you're a little more cold-blooded, you could conclude forcing him to discard his life as a politician and warrior-hero is more satisfactory a punishment since he's NOT going to enjoy his life as a Warden in the slightest. Either choice implicates a punishment for Loghain and it ultimately sits with you, the player, to choose which one you think is more fitting (also at the potential cost of losing Alistair, like I mentioned earlier). If the choice is made for him to die, there's no real redemption arc imo. He doesn't get to set his wrongs right, so evidently when I talk about redemption arc, I mean it's when Alistair is gone (whether as king or abandoning the Wardens for good) and Loghain becomes a Warden. Then he can correct his bad behavior indeed, by no longer being a force of separation that causes extra trouble in a very troubled nation that he was trying to save in his own way. Now he has to work alongside the main character and fight at his best to protect his nation. Basically, his goal wasn't wrong, it's the same one you have: it's his choices and methods that aren't correct, and that's exactly what he gets to fix when you let him become a Warden with you. Even after he's no longer a companion, Loghain becomes an old friend you're actively happy to see in Awakening, as briefly as you do, and in his choices and actions during Inquisition you can actually feel he makes the most sense in the role of the "good Warden", due to his experience and his knowledge of what a corrupt leader with very controversial choices looks like. In the end, his arc works very well because there's really no room at all for him to fall back on old bad habits and behaviors. As abrasive and nasty as he may be with some of your companions during interactions, Loghain's still proving, upon getting this chance to be a Warden, that he's a better man than the bulk of the game's storyline ever let you see him as.
Lastly, there's really no reward in this for Loghain. He wants Ferelden free and safe, that's all he cares about, and he thinks nobody else can guarantee this but himself: that's what drives him to make all the horrible choices I listed up there. When you defeat him in combat, it becomes apparent to Loghain that he's wrong: YOU can do what he thought only he could. In fact, he decides maybe you're the one who truly should do it, the force of unity Ferelden needs, not himself. And ultimately, that's what matters to him: thus, once he becomes a Warden, Loghain doesn't seem particularly bitter about the outcome. All he really wants is Ferelden's safety. Would he have preferred it if said safety had come about without him becoming a Warden? I have no doubts about it xD but I do think that he's not that resentful with his lot in life because his true priorities, his country and his daughter, are saved by your actions as leader of the Wardens and the defenses of Ferelden.
In short... Loghain pulls it off really well for a guy who has a virtual neon sign screaming "I'M THE BAD GUY" hanging over his head for most the story. It's honestly pretty impressive that Loghain gets such a good arc on such short notice, because there's really not that much room for him to really interact with the rest of the party and become a good friend and ally to your main character. Even so... it works so damn well that, once again, I was absolutely blown away when I saw him standing in the Vigil's Keep, greeting me like an old friend, checking on me right before taking off to his new Warden assignment. Maybe I'm too much of a softie in some cases xD but when it came to Loghain, I really found myself far too attached to the guy when I used to think I'd NEVER want anything to do with him. It's a really good storyline and I'm very happy that bringing him into the team is a possibility the game extends to you, no matter if I don't choose it all that often. I really think people who haven't experienced bringing Loghain with them should do it at least once in a playthrough xD it might not have the same effect on them as it did on me, but I'll say, his arc is definitely better than many I've seen out there. Definitely worth the shot if just to experience a very effective, very strong redemption arc in a short span of time.
16. Phil Connors - Groundhog Day
Lastly, what I suspect may be the actual quintessential redemption arc in the history of cinema: the very famous character portrayed by Bill Murray in Groundhog Day.
I don't even know if it's necessary to recap this movie because I feel like everyone would know it xD but in case it's necessary, Phil is a weatherman for a TV network who gets sent to a Punxsutawney in Philadephia, a town well known for its Groundhog tradition: if the groundhog sees its own shadow, this will somehow determine whether the winter will be longer or shorter. It's very ridiculous, hence why Phil doesn't want to be there to begin with :'D
Phil, however, is an asshole. He's a self-absorbed guy with a narcissistic complex, whose entire existence revolves around his needs, his interests and his advancement. Thus, when he gets stuck in a time loop that forces him to relive February 2nd for an indefinite amount of time (according to Wikipedia, possibly around 34 years worth of repetitions?), his entire life falls to pieces. The first few times the loop happens, he's confused. Eventually, he decides to make the most of it and goes completely buckwild with his time loop, doing whatever he wants and even whoever he wants, taking advantage of his "you can always start over" situation in order to learn more about people, find out how to obtain money whenever he wants to, to trick complete strangers into thinking they've known him forever... up until it stops going as well as he wants it to, when his co-worker Rita won't get swept up by his charms no matter how hard he tries (in fact, his persistence and weirdness makes her reject him sooner each time :'D). Eventually, Phil reaches such a low point... that he starts committing suicide in the hopes that this is what will break him out of the loop. But after dying, he still wakes up again, every day, and it's still February 2nd, every day.
His desperation eventually sees him coming clean to Rita and telling her everything. She's intrigued, though she doesn't believe him at first, and they spend a whole day testing if he truly knows EVERYTHING, and in the end it looks like he does, because he's already spent forever in this town and knows everyone :'D Their day together is much better this time, but it leaves Phil with the idea to make something better of himself once he wakes up, on February 2nd, without Rita yet again. Their one good day, totally erased.
Thus, Phil's journey into being a better guy begins. It's devastating when he finally decides he's going to help an old beggar on the street, only for the beggar to die because it's what's fated to happen that day, basically. He tries and tries, but it never works and that particular situation always made me sad as a child :'D but Phil starts to do good things all around, to even try things he never had before like playing the piano, he finds out about basically every tragedy and troublesome thing that could happen on a given day in the town, and he has a whole routine to help each person that needs him, one after the other. Eventually, Rita finds herself utterly mindblown upon seeing how much different he is from the Phil she knew on February 1st xD and she starts to develop real feelings for him too. He of course is in love with her, but he's taken for granted that nothing lasts and he just makes the most of the time he's given each day. In a very unexpected way, Phil seems to find peace in this time loop...
... And that's exactly when the time loop breaks.
This movie is called Groundhog Day. It could basically be called "Redemption Arc" instead. That's the entire point of the whole movie. That's the character arc Phil is on. There's no way he breaks this loop until he becomes a better person, and that's that: the loop obeys no logic, no reason, it's just happening, there are no instructions, no understandable motives... it's just something that happens to this one unpleasant stuck-up guy in town. Nobody else was affected by the loop, only him. And the only way the loop breaks, because he basically tested EVERYTHING, all the way to killing himself, was by becoming a better man.
The loop is the obvious consequence to Phil being an asshole: he's stuck in February 2nd until he breaks his own curse of being a dick to everyone he knows :'D Unlearned behaviors are, as ever, what the final chunk of the movie is about. As for the rewards... he got the great reward indeed of breaking the loop, but like I said, he never expected it. He's completely shocked when the radio sounds different on February 3rd, when life finally, suddenly, gets started again once he does things the right way at last. His relief is huge... but his lessons stick with him. At the start, Phil wants nothing to do with Punxsutawney and he can't wait to leave: when the movie ends, he asks Rita to live in this town with him. One would think that, after being stuck in the town for all that time, Phil's first instinct would be to LEAVE, at once xD but instead, such is the peace he found in this place that he's outright fond of it now. This has become so important in his life that he's ready to spend another lifetime in Punxsutawney, but this time willingly. He's grown to genuinely love the place he's in, and like I said, to feel such peace there that he'd settle there forever.
Frankly, this one is bound to be the first redemption arc I was ever exposed to, and that I remembered it last is shameful of me xD but it's yet another case of a redemption arc so strong that the movie outright has become a classic and is frequently considered one of the best movies of all time. I watched this one when I was very young and it stuck with me ever since. The way Phil's redemption isn't something anyone forces him to do, but something he, himself, chooses to do for the first time in his life, makes this arc work smoothly. It's especially important to me that we don't even know for how long Phil has been stuck (by watching the movie only), and we don't even know how many times Phil improved himself, his actions and choices all the way into that final timeloop day, where he finally breaks his own curse. It hits every important point for a redemption arc in the best of ways, so frankly, with a movie of this magnitude, with a narrative devoted exclusively to a redemption arc, it's magnificent that it delivers upon its premise seamlessly.
...
And I guess that's what I've got at the moment xD I really didn't want to drop this ask with just 3-4 examples so I've been adding to it gradually ever since you first sent the ask until I finally felt I had enough redemption arcs to at least give you a comprehensive idea on what really comprises a quality redemption arc for me, and why certain arcs don't reach me the way they intended to.
While I have no doubts Zuko's arc was indeed intended in this manner, I've analyzed him probably a little more thoroughly than I should have, and there's too many elements in which the show comes close to attaining the right components for my standard of a good redemption arc, and then they shirk things away and dial up the elements that, to me, don't matter at all (you've always been good deep down and that's more important than all those times when you were bad and never owned up to it, your mistakes are not your fault because you have a sad backstory, you're allowed to repeat toxic behaviors and commit mistakes you allegedly learned from because you say you're good now and we believe that's true even if we're seeing you haven't changed all that much, everyone needs to forgive you because you're changing your ways and if they're not forgiving you that easily we'll find a way to make it happen extra fast so you can have every reward we want you to get).
It's really frustrating to me with Zuko because it really wasn't that hard to get it right... and it's extra frustrating because people keep using him as a standard for redemption arcs in spite of all the gaps in logic and reasoning within his redemption arc. I have better and worse days with Zuko, the latter frequently happen whenever I bump into his classic, irritating fans who seem to think he can do no wrong and who throw fits of rage every time you want to bring Azula's struggles to the table instead, to say one thing, because the whole world should revolve around Zuko and his pain, and Azula had it super easy and she's a selfish asshole for not suffering over her brother 24/7. On those better days, though, I can see Zuko with slightly more neutral eyes and I can absolutely tell the issue in his writing comes from a lot of inexperience in the writing team, not nearly enough screentime devoted to what actually matters, and even a lack of understanding, by the show's own writers, of what Zuko's growth process really required in order to truly work. Have all the wholesome relationships you want to have between uncle and nephew: Zuko still didn't learn the most crucial lessons someone in his position should have, lessons his beloved uncle absolutely could have taught him if only the writers had bothered making it so. Unfortunately, they didn't.
Fortunately, I can at least point to 16 other characters who got things right that Zuko didn't, 16 other redemption arcs that hit the nail on the head of what redemption TRULY is about, and show us how characters in villainous or antagonistic roles absolutely can turn around and become so much more than they originally were meant to be (all the way to even becoming some of the most compelling, if not the absolute most compelling, characters in their respective stories).
I may update this in the future with more characters if I can think of more, but I'd hope these 16 are a good starting point. I know there are a few others out there who are solid choices too, but admittedly, I'm not a real expert on their stories and there are arguments that can be made against their redemption arcs being great. Anakin and Vegeta, for instance, came to mind: the redemption in Anakin's case is the whole climax of the original Star Wars trilogy, but while we see him making such a pivotal choice, we don't exactly see the journey of growth that I'm usually looking for. Vegeta, on the other hand, has occasional regressions to very unpleasant behaviors because, to be fair, he's violent and aggressive by nature, so even when he changes, there's a side of him that will always be like that. The difference, I suppose, hinges on how he exteriorizes it later in life... but as I haven't watched Dragon Ball in full in a LONG time, I can't fully attest that his growth process is perfect and works wonders. Same is true for Piccolo, both can be good examples of redemption but I definitely don't feel qualified to analyze them as I am :'D There's also some debate regarding a character from She-Ra, Catra... I've seen people say her redemption arc is garbage, just as I've seen people say it's the best one they ever saw. Me? Well... I never watched She-Ra :'D so I have zero judgment on her redemption arc because I have no basis to judge it at all xD Still, if anyone who watched that show wants to know whether or not I'd approve of her redemption arc, the three key points are right there: does she face consequences for her misdeeds? Does she unlearn her toxic behaviors? Does she undergo the entire process of growth and change without doing it just for the sake of an eventual reward? If so, then her redemption would work for me. If any of these elements is missing... then she wouldn't make it on this list even if I watch that show. Yep, simple as that.
Okay... I hope this veeeeeeeeeeery long post is thorough enough to address both what I want in redemption arcs, as well as offering examples of various redemption arcs that fulfilled my requirements! Thanks for the ask and for the excuse to ramble about characters I love xD
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