#relationship parallels

[anthurak]

So ever since the first season of Hazbin wrapped, there’s been more and more people (myself included) discussing and analyzing the parallels that Charlie and Vaggie seem to have towards Lucifer and Lilith. However, I’ve also started seeing a bit of debate as to how these two relationships parallel; namely whether Charlie is the parallel to her mother OR her father in this relationship, and whether Vaggie likewise parallels Lucifer OR Lilith.

And what I think is so INTERESTING about this is that the more I’ve looked back over what we’ve seen of both Chaggie and Lilith/Lucifer, the more I think we’re going to have to recognize that the parallels Chaggie has to Lucifer and Lilith actually cut in BOTH directions. That Charlie parallels BOTH Lilith and Lucifer in this relationship, and that Vaggie likewise parallels BOTH Lucifer and Lilith.

Because when you start looking back at Season 1 and all the analysis people have done, you really start finding a LOT of strong evidence for BOTH interpretations:

We have stuff like Charlie being an extremely powerful (half)human woman who inspires the people of Hell through her singing just like her mother, while also being an optimistic dreamer who longs to help humanity just like her father. Or stuff like Vaggie being a fallen angel and victim of Heaven’s cruelty just like Lucifer, while also being a woman hurt and cast out for not wanting to be controlled just like Lilith.

Really, it’s actually funny just looking at the scene of Charlie’s and Vaggie’s first meeting and seeing the number of people reading Charlie as Lucifer and Vaggie as Lilith, and the number of people reading Charlie as Lilith and Vaggie as Lucifer, being pretty much equal.

Charlie finds and gives comfort and shelter to Vaggie just as Lucifer did for Lilith, and Vaggie falls for Charlie just as Lucifer did for Lilith.

And we can find that kind of duel parallelism all over the place with Chaggie.

Charlie is the taller of the pair just like Lilith and Vaggie is the shorter one just like Lucifer, yet Charlie is the super energetic, optimistic dreamer which seems to parallel more what we’ve seen/heard about Lucifer while Vaggie is the more cool, quiet and sometimes more cynical one which likely has more in common with Lilith.

We’ve gotten hints that Lilith has been working on her own plan to help her people which led to traveling to Heaven to cut some kind of deal, just as we seen Charlie attempting. Yet when Charlie goes to Heaven she winds up speaking out against them and decrying what they’ve been doing, just as Lucifer has. And as I’ve discussed in other posts, Charlie’s dynamic with Emily has some potentially VERY interesting parallels to Lucifer and Eve: Charlie gives Emily knowledge that was long forbidden to her (the truth of the extermination) just as Lucifer gave Eve the apple of forbidden knowledge.

And in this regard, Vaggie’s not-so-well-hidden jealousy of how well Emily is getting along with Charlie could easily reflect how Lilith may have felt about Eve getting so close to Lucifer (something we KNOW happened thanks to the finale), yet the entire big reveal of that episode is that Vaggie is in fact a Fallen Angel just like Lucifer.

Then we have the two iterations of the song More Than Anything: The first version between Charlie and Lucifer is all about just how similar Charlie is to her father, with Lucifer not wanting his daughter to be hurt just like he was, yet also RELATING so much to Charlie’s goals.

But then we have the romantic reprisal of the song later between Charlie and Vaggie, which has Vaggie paralleling Lucifer, which in turn hints to Charlie more paralleling Lilith.

Now one way of interpreting this could be that Charlie is meant to exhibit the traits of both her parents, ultimately representing the best of both of them. Which in turn could naturally lead Vaggie, being Charlie’s romantic partner, to parallel both Lilith and Lucifer in her dynamic with Charlie. The Lucifer to Charlie’s Lilith AND the Lilith to Charlie’s Lucifer.

Just to give an example of this dynamic from a different show, just look at Blake and Yang in RWBY in relation to Blake’s allusions to Beauty and the Beast. Because Blake is an allusion to both ‘Beauty’ (Belle) and ‘the Beast’, this has led to Yang likewise showcasing nods to both in order to compliment wherever Blake is in her development; in the early volumes of the show when Blake is very withdrawn, brooding and standoffish like the Beast, Yang is very upbeat, positive and trying to get Blake out of her shell just like Beauty/Belle. And in later volumes when Blake has become much more upbeat and optimistic just like Beauty/Belle, Yang has likewise become more brooding and withdrawn much like the Beast.

HOWEVER, I think there may be more going on with Vaggie’s parallels to Lucifer and Lilith than just being an extension of Charlie’s own parallels. Namely that a number of her thematic parallels exist INDEPENDENT of her dynamic with Charlie. Like we have Vaggie’s being a Fallen Angel giving her a parallel to Lucifer even before she met Charlie. And if it turns out that Lute has one of those hyper-repressed, homophobic ‘hate-crushes’ on Vaggie and they were kinda-sorta a ‘thing’ back when Vaggie was in the exorcists, then that also basically makes Vaggie the Lilith to Lute’s Adam.

Not to mention we have the strong potential for things like Vaggie and Lucifer bonding over their shared experiences as fallen angels, as well as parallels drawn between Vaggie’s hiding her past from Charlie and Lilith’s own secrets.

All in all, while I think it’s still too early to call where exactly the story may be going with these character parallels, I do think we should be expecting and keeping in mind that Charlie and Vaggie seem to be paralleling BOTH Lucifer and Lilith in fairly equal measure.

[jojoblessed365]

Okay, quick thought out of my tired brain:

Has anyone realized that Lorelai gave Luke the horoscope when they first met and he kept it with him in his wallet for 5 whole years?

And Jess gave Rory an annotated copy of Howl, with a shrug and a "what is much?" at their first "real" meeting outside Rory's house and on the street? Where did Rory keep that book all those years? Of course, maybe it was in a Jess box, but maybe, just maybe... she actually keeps it in her back pocket/bag when her feelings eventually resurface for Jess?

Sorry just got inspired by @literatigifs new parallels post of Lorelai and Jess.

[lilith-91]

"Katara was the first one to reach out to Zuko"

Nope, it was Aang

and zuko has never forgotten his words :)

[thefirstlivingart]

all this love i have refuses to die inside of me

pinterest / vonko magno on flickr / troye sivan, one of your girls / virginia woolf, a letter to vanessa bell, august 1908 / @hannahlockillustration on tumblr / sara luisa kirk, begin here / fyodor dostoevsky, a letter to anna gregorevna dostoevsky, may 1880 / archbudzar on instagram / jeanette winterson, lighthousekeeping (transcript under the cut) / caitlyn siehl / @wormbus-art on tumblr / jonathan safran foer, extremely loud and incredibly close / lidia yuknavitch, the chronology of water: a memoir / sleepy.corvid on instagram / @froody on tumblr / @borderlinejackiee on tumblr / always together 2, frrrankkky_art on instagram / andsome4747 on tiktok / arthur miller, the crucible / cheryl strayed, tiny beautiful things: advice on love and life from dear sugar

[hualianschild]

the jade of lan clan and white lotus of xianle seems to have a type

I've been waiting to see how long it takes for others to talk abt the sqq erasure 💀

[poorly-drawn-mdzs]

Bonus 8: How met your mother (CSSR design by @qourmet!)

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[lovely-abeille]

on the cruelness of fifteen

@/petrichara // the shape of a girl, joan macleod // @/cowboyvamplikeme // fifteen, taylor swift

[mardyart]

can you believe they invented the quote “to be loved is to be changed”

[retreat-to-your-mood]

[llovelymoonn]

on human connection

@loveology2022 + @swordheld's tags \\ @cerleansky \\ david abram \\ @lalallorona

kofi

[booasaur]

Vigil - 2x02

[anthurak]

Thinking about your posts regarding Emily being as to Charlie and Vaggie as Eve was to Lucifer and Lilith, that potential dynamic has become very interesting given Lucifer’s… comments about Lilith and Eve during the finale

And what's REALLY interesting is that a lot of the parallels between Chaggie and the Morningstar couple has framed Vaggie as more of the parallel to Lucifer. Which certainly has some FUN implications as to Vaggie and Emily (jealousy leading to 'rivals-to-lovers' perhaps? XD)

But in all seriousness, yeah the reveal of a potential Lucifer/Lilith/Eve polycule is VERY interesting and I'm certainly now super curious as to what we might learn about what really happened between those three.

Like I would not be surprised at all if Charlie's storybook turns out to be an unreliable narrator and we find out something like how it was actually Lilith who gave Eve the apple. Which of course would certainly parallel nicely with Charlie revealing the truth of the extermination to Emily.

As I mentioned in my theory post on Rosie being a disguised Eve and possibly even being Charlie's real/other mom, I think it's pretty likely that something bad went down between Lucifer, Lilith and Eve in the intervening years and likely caused Eve to go underground and may have even contributed to Lucifer's and Lilith's separation.

All of which could easily position Charlie, Vaggie and Emily as a FOIL to the OG Unholy Trinity by not repeating their mistakes and truly coming together.

[jojoblessed365]

Jess isn't Rory's Luke; he's her Lorelai

Okay, hear me out:

I know there's a full circle element to the premise of Gilmore Girls, but as with a circle, very often it can be concentric, tangent or congruent.

But think about it: many of Rory and Jess's important scenes are repeated in Luke and Lorelai's scenes as a couple. Both Rory and Luke's arcs have a thematic element of "legacy" while Jess and Lorelai's arcs have a thematic element of "rejecting conventional paths". Rory and Luke are the ones who deny their feelings for Jess and Lorelai respectively, and Jess and Lorelai often (unintentionally) take Rory and Luke for granted (IMHO).

Since there are so many posts about it, I thought I should highlight an important point as to why Jess and Rory are not the next Luke and Lorelai respectively but rather Lorelai and Luke respectively. So after rereading 'The Summer I Turned Pretty', a YA teen series that I read when I was 14 and is now a series on Amazon Prime, I realized how similar Conrad (another version of Jess) was to the protagonist Belly's mom Laurel, who is in fact, Belly's most toughest (but also healthiest) familial relationship. And Jeremiah (Belly's other love interest) was so similar (in the third book) to his and Conrad's dad Adam.

If you think about it, Jess = Lorelai, Dean (and I know you will disagree but this has been talked about in a book on Gilmore Girls) = Luke and Logan = Christopher.

It's no doubt that Gilmore Girls has been about this mother-daughter pair, and yes, their relationship has their flaws (as with any relationship), but it has been the strongest of all of Rory's parental figures in the series.

[pocketgalaxies]

C3E18 || C3E85

[witchesroad]

SUCCESSION 3x05 / 3x08 / 4x04 / 4x07

[gallantblade]

Mithrun Dungeon Meshi is probably my favorite disabled character ever, largely because his disability is completely invisible to anyone who doesn't know him, entirely internal/mental, and still INCREDIBLY, INARGUABLY debilitating. But at the same time he's not a one-note sob story; he's a driven and intelligent person who just needs a great deal of support and understanding. And he gets it! Originally because he is useful, but even just by the time he first appears on screen he has at least one person who genuinely values his health and survival.

And then the end of his arc as the manga comes to a close is just perfect! He'll never get back what he lost, but the wounds are healing and with help he's found a path forward. He has reasons to keep living even if life itself is not something he can value for its own sake. His disability, as terrible as it is, doesn't doom him to misery.

And all of this is really inspiring for me, someone who struggles to meet my physical needs and who struggles to want things and who isn't sure how to build a life worth living given my own depression and executive dysfunction.