#religious upbringing

[lgbtq-archives]

Dear Joe, thanks a lot for sharing your life story with the LGBTQ community.

[renaultphile]

Hello! I liked your observation about Ralph in your post about Edmund Gosse’s memoirs. It made me think of this comment of Ralph’s when he is talking about his mother: “Her [italics] parents were Plymouth Brethren”. MR must have had something specific in mind here. From your readings, do you have any insights about this and any other thoughts you’d like to share about Ralph’s upbringing in a “ Christian household”?

Thank you so much for this ask @eclare1000, sorry, it’s a long one! I warmly recommend ‘Father and Son’ in its own right, I loved its compassion, humour and insights into childhood, and for me there are many resonances with Ralph.  We get so little, don’t we?  Just the reference to the cruelty of ‘good women’, the PB reference and the bit about Laurie not being brought up in a ‘Christian home’ which is so bitter and angry.

I feel the emphasis with ‘her parents’ suggests his maternal grandparents are distant in some way, perhaps they cut off his mother when she ‘married out’?   It could mean his mother is no longer PB (doesn’t feel likely though)?  Or, it could mean that his father was PB too, but a convert, not born into the faith.  I suppose it means her upbringing was very strict, and it left her at a loss to cope with something perfectly natural (two pre-pubescent children showing curiosity about their bodies).  So he says ‘She couldn’t help how she felt’, as if she’d been programmed and couldn’t just be humane.  I’m struck by her inability to articulate what she felt, which I think is such a major theme in the book. 

In the Gosse, there is a very strong theme, particularly with his mother, of fatalism and letting God decide, a lack of agency.  I wonder if that plays a part, and that’s why he is so bitter, because she abrogated responsibility.  She failed to recognise perhaps that her religious upbringing was urging a kind of un-Christian cruelty on a helpless child.  Is that why he feels so responsible, because religious faith let him down and he has taken all of it on himself? 

I get the feeling that his father came from a less strict (but still Christian) background but went along with whatever his mother wanted to please her, and did the beating for her and the rather clichéd exhortation to ‘learn a clean life’. 

I also wonder if completely unrealistic expectations were loaded onto Ralph as a young child (another theme in the Gosse), making the crimes of 6-year-old Ralph all the more heinous.  And of course there is a similar fall at 19 – his expulsion being all the more scandalous for his immense prestige (as Laurie puts it).

There are some other resonances for me that are fascinating.  I had already started to wonder about Ralph’s love of language and facility for making up stories and telling lies to get out of trouble.  There are also several references to Laurie thinking he is just making things up about himself to please him!  I wondered about the idea of fiction being a ‘forbidden thing’ in a religious household, and was amazed to discover that Edmund Gosse’s mother believed fiction a ‘sin’ and kept it out of the house – he did not have access to literature for much of his childhood.  I sometimes feel that Ralph might have discovered the joys of telling stories relatively late, and relished their power.

Another thing that fascinates me about the Plymouth Brethren is that they are essentially rebellious – they were formed in defiance of organised religion.  So Ralph’s mother grew up in a ‘rebellious household’ but was indoctrinated with ideas from a young age that she couldn’t properly articulate.  Then she ‘rebelled’ on some level.  For me this ties in with that very contradictory aspect of Ralph, that he is desperate to be part of a community, but he also makes up his own rules.

And related to this, bible-study is the key – PB do not accept intermediaries telling them what to believe.  Gosse describes the way his parents spent hours discussing biblical texts together.  I feel Ralph did this as a child, and when he discovered the Phaedrus, I imagine him reading it with the same fervour, poring over every word looking for a moral code he could live by – working up what he was into a religion.

I just checked that bit again about ‘good women’ and found this: “Suddenly he seemed to remember the text of his earlier sermon” Wow!  Ralph is sermonising, but now he has found a new religion!  PB were big on converting people and in ‘Father and Son’, Gosse refers to being expected to ask strangers he meets if they are saved.  Hitherto I have felt that Ralph is in ‘Head boy’ mode or ‘school debate’ mode when he is arguing so forcefully with Laurie.  But now I am seeing a passionate and fervent preacher.  He is a proselytiser all right.  Perhaps Mary wanted to give one of her most attractive and powerful characters a bit of religious fervour when stating his cause.  After all, why should religious people have the monopoly on the right to be a decent human being?

[religion-is-a-mental-illness]

I'm curious did u ever come across any religious upbringing or experiences etc?

I grew up with a superficial Catholic upbringing. Went to church, did the milestones and ceremonies. But it didn't exist at home. We didn't pray, didn't have any crucifixes or other religious tchotchkes. As far as I know, we didn't even have a bible.

I confirmed with my parents years later that what little we did came from social expectation, not profound spiritual conviction.

Suffice to say none of it actually stuck, for myself or my siblings... or my parents.

[gramarobin]

Only my whole childhood, every sunday and some saturdays and wednesdays too. Growing up with charismatic pentecostal parents when you are an introverted little redheaded girl was just too much...talk about your nervous system being overloaded with too much - try being 10 y.o. and watching all the adults around you in church cry, moan, shout, jump, fall down, jerk, dance, babble, clap all at the same time, over and over. It was too much.

[notamuse]

one way street

would you look

both ways

would you consider

more than two colors

could you forgive

your version of sin

could you forget

remembering that shit

should the world fold

and do what it’s told

should we stoop to the devil

that you call your level

is the reason i’m gay

because i’m not okay

is the personality I posess

forever a work in progress

are the tears I feel coming

from thoughts i’ve been suppressing

are the positive parts of reality

the blind spots we cannot see clearly

[the-autistic-system]

dont think i'll ever get over the easter morning my family dragged me to church and the fucking preacher turned the whole sermon into a hate speech on gay people and I was just sat there the entire time like:

[haikuswithdani]

love is hard work.

I used to pinch my skin all over, enough to hurt but not scar. Punch my thighs, wrench belly fat confide to myself, "you're worthless."

My beauty was just average, but my ugly was beyond compare. My successes, just passable but my failures all-consuming.

"you're worthless"  *punch* worthless  *pinch* worthless  *wrench* worthless  *slump and cry*

26 years takes a toll on a girl.

A year ago, I bought pants that fit in a moment of clarity, a vision of hope./ The fog rolled in, just like always. "Still worthless" droned on in a chant.

Fall came. I bought orange nail polish. I never really wore it before. I stared in wonder at the vibrancy of my fingertips, berated myself for my vanity. But I kept the polish anyway.

I let my leg hair grow long and soft, wondering if I could find beauty, if this made me a Real Feminist now. I stroked my calves, an internal wind rustling and "worthless" took a breath. I decided there's something to both hair & smoothness — the covering & uncovering are both sacred.

I rang in the New Year dreaming of death while suppressing planning my suicide, while "worthless" drowned out any hope.

After all, 26 years takes a toll on a girl.

A week later, I started wearing makeup — anything to distract the self-loathing. My lined eyes widened, glossed lips parted: "I look good" breathed hesitantly — a battle cry.

This week, I've broken down daily. This is where the self-harm would begin.

But I've started new rituals.

pour oil in bath water "you're worth it" pull razors safely across legs "you're worth it" moisten my face "you're worth it" dab color on skin "you're worth it" pull on pretty clothes "you're worth it" drink plenty of water "you're worth it" paint color on nails "you're worth it" go to bed when I'm tired "you're worth it" eat food that I want "you're worth it" make art when I'm scared "you're worth it" spend time with my friends "you're worth it"

worth it worth it worth it my god, am I really worth it?

26 years takes a toll on a girl and love is hard work. But that's okay. I'm worth it.

[mattdobbins]

To Those Reaching Out

To Those Reaching Out

I have been so overwhelmed with Jehovah’s Witnesses from my past reaching out. I’ve pinned this to my social media accounts. I’m really surprised that I have heard from those in my past. It’s sad and really heart wrenching for me. I want it to stop unless it’s sincere. To all my Jehovah’s Witness family and friends who have been trying to contact me recently: It’s been overwhelming to hear from…

[octopotacto]

when i was a child i would get violently and physically sick thinking about "heaven" because my southern baptist family would always say "it's a home in the clouds" and i imagined plain white as far as the eye could see and got like secondhand claustrophobia so bad that i started doing "sins" (ie saying fuck at school) because i didn't want to be stuck in a plain white room forever and ever and ever. i imagined myself spending 40 years playing with a yo-yo, learning cat's cradle, and still being bored

[lgbtq-archives]

Dear Van-Martin, thank you very much for sharing your story.

𝐘𝐨𝐮𝐓𝐮𝐛𝐞 𝐋𝐢𝐧𝐤: https://youtu.be/7zKizi-u1XY

[inkskinned]

the thing is that they're so fascinated by sex, they love sex, they can't imagine a world without sex - they need sex to sell things, they need sex to be part of their personality, they need sex to prove their power - but they hate sex. they are disgusted by it.

sex is the only thing that holds their attention, and it is also the thing that can never be discussed directly.

you can't tell a child the normal names for parts of their body, that's sexual in nature, because the body isn't a body, it's a vessel of sex. it doesn't matter that it's been proven in studies (over and over) that kids need to know the names of their genitals; that they internalize sexual shame at a very young age and know it's 'dirty' to have a body; that it overwhelmingly protects children for them to have the correct words to communicate with. what matters is that they're sexual organs. what matters is that it freaks them out to think about kids having body parts - which only exist in the context of sex.

it's gross to talk about a period or how to check for cancer in a testicle or breast. that is nasty, illicit. there will be no pain meds for harsh medical procedures, just because they feature a cervix.

but they will put out an ad of you scantily-clad. you will sell their cars for them, because you have abs, a body. you will drip sex. you will ooze it, like a goo. like you were put on this planet to secrete wealth into their open palms.

they will hit you with that same palm. it will be disgusting that you like leather or leashes, but they will put their movie characters in leather and latex. it will be wrong of you to want sexual freedom, but they will mark their success in the number of people they bed.

they will crow that it's inappropriate for children so there will be no lessons on how to properly apply a condom, even to teens. it's teaching them the wrong things. no lessons on the diversity of sexual organ growth, none on how to obtain consent properly, none on how to recognize when you feel unsafe in your body. if you are a teenager, you have probably already been sexualized at some point in your life. you will have seen someone also-your-age who is splashed across a tv screen or a magazine or married to someone three times your age. you will watch people pull their hair into pigtails so they look like you. so that they can be sexy because of youth. one of the most common pornography searches involves newly-18 young women. girls. the words "barely legal," a hiss of glass sand over your skin.

barely legal. there are bills in place that will not allow people to feel safe in their own bodies. there are people working so hard to punish any person for having sex in a way that isn't god-fearing and submissive. heteronormative. the sex has to be at their feet, on your knees, your eyes wet. when was the first time you saw another person crying in pornography and thought - okay but for real. she looks super unhappy. later, when you are unhappy, you will close your eyes and ignore the feeling and act the role you have been taught to keep playing. they will punish the sex workers, remove the places they can practice their trade safely. they will then make casual jokes about how they sexually harass their nanny.

and they love sex but they hate that you're having sex. you need to have their ornamental, perfunctory, dispassionate sex. so you can't kiss your girlfriend in the bible belt because it is gross to have sex with someone of the same gender. so you can't get your tubes tied in new england because you might change your mind. so you can't admit you were sexually assaulted because real men don't get hurt, you should be grateful. you cannot handle your own body, you cannot handle the risks involved, let other people decide that for you. you aren't ready yet.

but they need you to have sex because you need to have kids. at 15, you are old enough to parent. you are not old enough to hear the word fuck too many times on television.

they are horrified by sex and they never stop talking about it, thinking about it, making everything unnecessarily preverted. the saying - a thief thinks everyone steals. they stand up at their podiums and they look out at the crowd and they sign a bill into place that makes sexwork even more unsafe and they stand up and smile and sign a bill that makes gender-affirming care illegal and they get up and they shrug their shoulders and write don't say gay and they get up, and they make the world about sex, but this horrible, plastic vision of it that they have. this wretched, emotionless thing that holds so much weight it's staggering. they put their whole spine behind it and they push and they say it's normal!

this horrible world they live in. disgusted and also obsessed.

[edwardgdunn]

Liberating Happiness: Overcoming the Burden of a Fundamentalist Upbringing

Introduction

Childhood shapes the very core of our identities and influences our outlook on life. For those raised in a fundamentalist environment, characterized by strict beliefs and rigid rules, the effects of such an upbringing can reverberate into adulthood, hindering the pursuit of genuine happiness. While the intentions behind fundamentalist teachings might be rooted in care and conviction, the unintended consequences often include diminished life satisfaction, emotional struggles, and challenges in adapting to a diverse and ever-evolving world. This article delves deeper into the reasons behind the impact of a fundamentalist upbringing, supported by scientific research, and offers practical strategies to navigate and transcend its influence, ultimately fostering a life of happiness and fulfillment.

The Impact of a Fundamentalist Upbringing

Rigid Belief Systems: Fundamentalist upbringings often emphasize unwavering adherence to specific belief systems, discouraging questioning or exploration. While this approach may offer a sense of security during childhood, it can hinder an individual’s ability to adapt, learn, and evolve in adulthood. This rigidity can lead to difficulty accepting new ideas and changes, potentially breeding cognitive dissonance and inner conflict.

Emotional Suppression: Suppressing emotions and feelings that do not align with the fundamentalist worldview is a common outcome of such environments. While it may appear to maintain order within the community, over time, this emotional suppression can lead to difficulties in understanding and managing emotions. The consequences often include anxiety, depression, and other mental health challenges.

Limited Exposure: Fundamentalist upbringings often limit exposure to diverse perspectives, cultures, and ideas, fostering a narrow worldview. This limited exposure can make it challenging for individuals to connect with and understand people from different backgrounds in adulthood, potentially resulting in difficulties in forming relationships and engaging in meaningful dialogue.

Strained Relationships: The emphasis on strict adherence to dogma can overshadow personal connections and relationships. This can lead to strained relationships with family members, friends, and partners who do not share the same beliefs. These strained relationships can contribute to feelings of isolation and loneliness.

Scientific Study Supporting the Negative Impact

A study published in the journal “Psychological Science” conducted by researchers from the University of Rochester and the University of California, Irvine, further substantiates the negative impact of a fundamentalist upbringing. The study found that individuals raised in environments with high levels of religious fundamentalism tend to experience greater difficulty in adjusting to new situations, managing stress, and maintaining healthy relationships in adulthood. This research highlights the profound and lasting consequences of a rigid upbringing on various aspects of adult life.

Overcoming the Burden of Fundamentalist Upbringing

Self-Exploration: Begin by embarking on a journey of self-exploration. Allow yourself to critically evaluate your beliefs and values. Engage in open-minded inquiry, questioning assumptions, and considering alternative perspectives. This process can help you develop a more flexible and adaptable mindset, essential for navigating the complexities of adulthood.

Emotional Intelligence: Cultivate emotional intelligence by learning to recognize, understand, and manage your emotions. Embrace the idea that all emotions are valid and natural, and seek professional support if needed to work through any emotional suppression or challenges that may have arisen from your upbringing.

Educational Pursuits: Make an active effort to expose yourself to diverse viewpoints, cultures, and ideas. Engage in continuous learning through reading books, attending workshops, or enrolling in courses that expand your horizons. This will not only broaden your knowledge but also facilitate empathy and understanding.

Building Relationships: Focus on nurturing relationships built on mutual respect and understanding. Seek connections with individuals from various backgrounds, fostering an environment where you can engage in meaningful conversations and broaden your perspective.

Mindful Exposure: Gradually expose yourself to different ideas and experiences to desensitize any fear of the unfamiliar. This exposure can assist in becoming more comfortable with ambiguity and uncertainty, which are crucial skills for adapting to an ever-changing world.

Seek Support: Reach out to others who have experienced similar upbringings. Online forums, support groups, and therapy sessions can provide a safe space to share your struggles, gain insights, and receive guidance.

Define Your Own Path: Take deliberate steps to define your personal path and values. Craft a journey that resonates with your experiences and aspirations rather than strictly adhering to what you were taught. This process empowers you to live authentically and in alignment with your true self.

Conclusion

A fundamentalist upbringing, despite its intent to provide guidance, can inadvertently cast shadows on the pursuit of happiness in adulthood. The rigid beliefs, emotional suppression, limited exposure, and strained relationships that often result from such an upbringing can impede personal growth, relationships, and overall life satisfaction. However, by undertaking a deliberate journey to overcome the limitations of this upbringing, individuals can free themselves from its burdens and create a life brimming with happiness, fulfillment, and authentic connections. The path to liberation begins with self-exploration, an open heart, and a willingness to embrace the diversity and fluidity of the world around us. By cultivating an adaptable mindset, nurturing meaningful relationships, and engaging in lifelong learning, we can transcend the constraints of a fundamentalist upbringing. In doing so, we empower ourselves to shape our identities, beliefs, and futures based on genuine understanding, compassion, and an unwavering commitment to our own happiness and well-being.

Check out the Happiness 2.0 Podcast — https://podcast.edwardgdunn.com/

Happiness 2.0 Blog — https://edwardgdunn.com/blog

[hup123hup123slapslap]

So a thought has been kicking around my head for a bit...what if Helio knew exactly what he was signing up for by making Kristen his chosen one?

It has always struck me as odd that when describing Doreen in Helioic heaven, Brennan mentioned her flirting with men and women. It also strikes me as odd that Kristen never got any pushback from Helio about turning her back on him. Even if he was similarly 'out of the picture' like sol was while Arthur was wrecking havoc, Kristen's powers should have faded when she fully committed to not worshipping him. You need to worship a god to get powers, and this is emphasized heavily in the latest episode. Kristen worshipping the vague idea of religion but Definitely Not Helio just doesn't cut it. Sure, taking away a PCs powers wasn't really in the cards in season one, but Brennan works very well and very caringly with what he has to establish as canon.

Kristen was looking for a reason to drop Helio from the get-go. His frat boy appearance and non-answer to a nearly impossible question didn't truly matter at the core of her feelings. She wanted an out from the prison she was trapped in with the Helioic faith, even if she didn't realize it fully. She had tension with her mom and her ideals from the scene one! She wanted to connect with people the church actively shunned. Helio was never the true problem.

Now, gods are shaped by their worshippers. So on some level Helio is shaped by people with shitty ideals. But there's still a foothold of good, especially if there are out and proud gays in heaven. Especially if Kristen Applebees of all people is the chosen one.

When you have worshippers misinterpreting your whole deal, going with Sol's shitty messaging and transferring it onto you and using it for bad things, what can you do as a god? Because you ARE what they say you are. So how can you fight back?

Well. You make your chosen one someone that embodies your true heart. Someone that can actually turn the tides of your worship.

There is an emphasis on tracker reinventing and revitalizing her religion. Changing it for the better. Taking the old and not tossing it out, but making it better.

Isn't that what Kristen struggles with the most? That's what she needs to learn how to do.

Tracker also established that she can worship multiple gods when she helped with Yes?. Kristen doesn't need to settle for one even if she (fingers crossed) brings Kassandra back.

Because the season opened with the slow apocalypse of endless night. Endless daytime would end similarly. There has to be a balance. They are two sides of the same coin. Day and night. The surety of the sun and the doubt of the shadows.

Kristen wants both. And she can fucking have it if she decides to.

Ally once said they appreciate that the enemy is always the church. Organized religion. Kristen is perfect for disorganized religion though. Chill frat boy vibes and anxious doubts and the ultimate message of 'just do your best'.

I think religious trauma is a compelling, close to the heart topic for a lot of people. And some turn away from religion entirely and wash their hands of it. But some people don't. Kristen is a cleric. She can't. She wants a god, she wants answers, and she just can't find them in the established community she was raised in. That doesn't mean the core of her religion was wrong. The church was. So you take the religion and you harness it in a way that means something to you.

Maybe Kristen being desperate enough to invite Helio back into her life is what this has all been leading to.

She can remake a god. She's done it before. Because Kassandra was good at the core. Maybe Helio can be too.

[fictionadventurer]

Maybe the problem with Christian fiction is that it's non-denominational. People are just "Christian", with no effort put into showing what practicing that religion looks like for them specifically. No indication that there are other Christians who could have different beliefs. No wrestling with differing ideas and the struggle of how one should live out their Christian faith. And that makes it unrealistic and unrelatable.

[slavicafire]

not to start a heavy subject but. sometimes I find myself in the company of people who had a very good childhood and a very functional and well-off family, and as we discuss these things they look at me with shock - and as if I am the shocking minority. being totally and fully oblivious that it's them who are a minority - and that whatever they think the average experience of a child is, in poland and otherwise, is simply untrue. the average child has it much, much worse than they could even imagine

[haredjarris]

louis: i must be a devil. i am made of sin. i don’t deserve anything. i belong in hell. i am so disconnected from everything good and pure about human life. god has forsaken me and was right to do so

also louis: [decorate the christmas tree all nice]