#thickenmyblood

[savoytrufflephd]

The questions of Laurent’s being and behavior…

I have been informed, via @thickenmyblood’s asks (since mine were apparently not set to accept anonymous asks – which I have now changed) that my opinion about HIUH Laurent’s character is incorrect. I have been informed that he’s abusive.

My PhD isn’t in English (though it is in the humanities), but my wife was an English major and she has often told me that interpretations aren’t right or wrong, but they are stronger or weaker in the sense that they are supported by the text.

So, let’s go…

First things first. Let me be clear about the following:

The question of whether or not Laurent is abusive in this piece of fanfiction has no bearing whatsoever on whether any person you know in real life is abusive.

Similarly, any arguments that Laurent can change or that Laurent deserves a second chance have no bearing whatsoever on whether any person you know in real life can change or deserves a second chance.

Neither HIUH nor any fic should be taken as a life advice manual. Just because there are therapists in this fic does not mean that @thickenmyblood is a mental health professional or your therapist.

I am also not a therapist, nor am I trying to give you life advice when I speak of my enjoyment of HIUH.

But if I were to give you life advice, it would be this: If a piece of fanfiction makes you so angry that you feel the need to send abusive anonymous comments to the author and/or ask that author to pass on your comment “correcting” the opinion of a reader writing about that story, you should probably stop reading that fic. It is clearly not good for you. Metaphorically speaking, you are in an abusive relationship with that fic and you should end it. Write the story off and move on.

Okay, that said, the question of whether Laurent is abusive in HIUH is probably more of a series of questions:

Has HIUH Laurent engaged in abusive behaviors?

If so, do those abusive behaviors necessarily indicate that he is and will always be an abuser?

If not, what evidence do we have that HIUH Laurent can and will stop engaging in abusive behaviors?

If HIUH Laurent stops engaging in abusive behaviors, what reasons, if any, does HIUH Damen have to return to the relationship despite past abuse?

BONUS:

A. Is an HIUH Laurent who harms Damen through abusive behavior mischaracterized relative to the canon source material?

B. Is an HIUH Damen who chooses to be with Laurent despite past abuse mischaracterized relative to the canon source material?

1. Has Laurent engaged in abusive behaviors?

Yes. Although we are limited by a potentially unreliable narrator (Damen), who does not believe Laurent is abusive, we are clearly and intentionally both told and shown in the text that Laurent has engaged in abusive behavior. We are told when Neo explains as much to a skeptical Damen:

“Then you must know I’m only trying to get a feeling on how educated you are on the subject of abuse between romantic partners.” “But why ? I just told you Laurent and I never—” “Do you know what emotional abuse looks like, Damen?” “Yes.” “Give me a definition.” It’s hot in the room, all of the sudden. “It’s… making someone. Feel bad.” “It’s consistent and repeated humiliation,” Neo says. “Gaslighting. Manipulation. Verbal abuse can sometimes overlap with this. Have you ever experienced this while in your relationship with Laurent?” “We weren’t abusive.” “Did you insult each other?” “No,” Damen says. It was so long ago, it was a lifetime back. He can’t remember. “It’s—not like that. Humiliation? We never—” “You’ve said that sometimes Laurent made you feel as though the things you were feeling were inadequate.” You’re being a fucking idiot, Laurent had said about the pink sweatshirt. “What if he was right?”  “It’s never right to invalidate your partner’s feelings.” “We weren’t abusive.” “Damen,” Neo says, the soft caress before a blow. “What if we think about it from—” “There’s nothing to think about. I’m telling you, it wasn’t like that. How the fuck did you get to that conclusion? Because I complained about us arguing?” Neo ruffles his notes. “Contempt. Shame. Hurt. That’s what abusers thrive on. There’s quite a lot of those things in here.” “Laurent’s not an abuser,” Damen snaps. “Maybe not, but he grew up with one, didn’t he? These are learned traits.” Damen folds forward as though to vomit. That’s—He’s made a mistake. They argued, they yelled, they said things they didn’t mean, but they never hit each other or threw cutlery at each other’s heads. They went to bed angry, and Damen slept on the couch, and there would be rolling eyes and huffs and annoyance in the following days, but that’s not—Laurent is not— You’re sweet, Damen had said, hand to Laurent’s cheek. A sweetheart. He remembers meaning it, remembers Laurent not liking it. He also remembers Laurent’s sweetness, scarcer in the end and cloying in the beginning. Breakfast in bed, letting Damen pick what show to watch, giving up half his trail mix bag because he knew Damen liked the dried fruit pieces most. You’ll do great, you always do great. A protein shake prepped and ready to go, peace and quiet the nights before important court days. But also bigger things, biggest things. There was—and sharing a bed, and curling up under Damen to read, and letting Damen carry Nicaise up the stairs, and holding his hand under the table as firm functions, and kissing just to kiss, just because, just— He’s explained Laurent wrong.

And we are shown in the moments when Damen and Laurent talk and Damen expects a belittling response from Laurent:

“There are,” Laurent starts, stops. Starts again, “I didn’t.” He has both elbows on the table, which he used to despise. Tables are for cutlery and food, not limbs. Something about the way he rubs at the skin under his eyes makes Damen’s stomach cower as if expecting a blow. “Agnes recommended it months before you—came back. It wasn’t my idea.”

“I met him?” For once, Laurent doesn’t mock him for his question. “It was at that school play I couldn’t go to. The one Nicaise got that huge part in.”

“I want to know when the twenty-four hours are up,” Damen says, loudly, too loudly, “so we can go to the police station and report him missing. For fuck’s sake, Laurent, will you stop ? He could be seriously hurt, and you’re sitting here, berating me about the way I phrased a question. Do you even give a shit about him? Do you even—” He cuts himself off when he sees Laurent’s expression. Like he did last time with Nicaise, Damen braces himself for what’s to come, goes over the list of things Laurent can hurl at him, tries to minimize the inevitable damage. The comment will be about Nikandros, about his soft childhood in Ios, about the time he tried to discipline Nicaise by himself and ended up covered in vomit.   Nothing happens. There’s only Laurent, turning his face to the side so Damen can’t stare at it any longer. In the silence of the car, Laurent’s breathing shakes.

“Is his name really Dog?” Laurent says, sitting down next to Damen. Between them, the two cups of coffee and the small pile of croissants both steam. “I didn’t believe Nicaise when he told me.” “I,” Damen starts, lie ready on his tongue, and stops. It’s very meta. “I’m not good with names.” Laurent picks up his coffee instead of agreeing with Damen. Instead of mocking. The space between their bodies is comfortable enough—they’re not touching, not even their knees or thighs. They’re not looking at each other either, not with the entire park stretching green and busy in front of them.

2. If so, do those abusive behaviors necessarily indicate that he is and will always be an abuser?

I take this to be one of the major points of contention on the part of the angry readers. As you can probably guess, I don’t think the text suggests that Laurent in inherently abusive. Besides the stuff coming in my answer to question 3, we have several reasons to believe that Laurent’s abusive behavior is the product of particular circumstances rather than a generalized personality dysfunction.

We know, and Neo just reminded us above, that abusive behaviors are learned behaviors. We know Laurent was abused in multiple ways before he was able to leave his uncle’s house. We know that he is still very young and that it has not been that long since his uncle’s trial. We know he has not been comfortable talking to Damen about his abuse, which gives us reason to believe he still experiences a great deal of shame. That shame is hinted at here:

“He respects you,” Laurent says before Damen has made up his mind about the yelling. “He looks at you and sees a standard to meet. Normalcy. It’s hard to disappoint people you respect. Especially people like you.” “Like me.” “You do things your way. Everyone else does them wrong.” “That’s,” Damen starts. The absolute inaccuracy of the phrase leaves him hanging. “What the fuck?” Laurent ignores him. “He doesn’t respect me, and he also knows I have no room to judge. It’s different. We’re—it’s just different.”

We also know that Laurent is specifically and intentionally not abusive toward Nicaise. We have seen that he has been absorbing a ton of anger, vilification, derision, denigration from Nicaise almost entirely without complaint and without lashing out at Nicaise in return. In fact, after the breaking of the paperweight, when Laurent feels that he might not be able to avoid reacting in a way he will regret, he calls Damen to safely remove Nicaise from the situation. Having taken the lock off Nicaise’s door for reasons many parents would no doubt consider justified, he realizes it was a mistake:

Damen doesn’t look down at the twisted little bolts on the floor. “Actually, you should watch this part in case you ever want to dismantle it again.” “I won’t.” Damen rubs his sleeve over a weird spot on the knob. “You’re betting a lot on Nicaise’s hypothetical good behavior.” “It was dumb, taking the lock away as punishment. I…” Laurent’s thumb glides over the edge of the glass. It traces a full circle before stopping and going white, digging in. His jaw twitches like he’s munching on something. “Privacy shouldn’t be a reward.” “Wasn’t this about safety? He locked himself in, wouldn’t come out or reply when you called…” Laurent’s reply is slow to come. After a while, Damen stops expecting it to come at all. He goes back to testing the lock—twice, waiting for that click sound—opens the door, closes it, and rattles the knob a bit. Just to be sure. “My uncle made it about safety too,” Laurent says. “Locks on doors were for adults. Not children.” The lonely ice cube in his glass floats around aimlessly, not quite touching its confines. “The first to go were the bedroom locks. What if there’s a fire and you can’t get out? What if someone breaks in through the window and—well.” Laurent smiles, small and ugly. “That kind of thing. You know.”

He ensures that Nicaise sees a therapist, meets with that therapist regularly, and follows professional advice about putting Nicaise on medication.

Laurent also maintains a strong friendship with Ancel, whose judgment the text has taught us to trust, through Damen’s evolving relationship with him. Laurent is capable of non-abusive, non-superficial relationships.

3. If not, what evidence do we have that HIUH Laurent can and will stop engaging in abusive behaviors?

From the moment we see Laurent interact with Damen in the present of this story, he is trying to treat Damen better. Not because he thinks he can get back together with Damen, but because he realizes he needs to make a relationship with Damen possible for Nicaise. We have already seen above that most of the time when Damen expects Laurent’s ridicule in this story, he does not actually receive it. In very stressful conversations, when Laurent does lash out, he now tends to pull back or even to acknowledge and apologize:

Coffee. Damen takes two long sips, trying to rinse the bad taste out of his mouth. They’ve had arguments in public before, probably louder than this one. For some reason, the thought isn’t as comforting as Damen would have once found it. They broke up to be better than they were together, didn’t they? They should be better. Except this doesn’t feel better. Or different. Laurent says, “That was out of line.” Now, cooled off, Damen feels clammy. Wobbly. He knows Laurent is right, and yet the thought of sitting through a reprimand makes him want to melt away. “It was.” “I—apologize.” Damen looks up from his coffee to Laurent’s profile. He’s facing the wrong way, Damen thinks stupidly, because the window is to their left. “You apologize.” Half a question. “Go ahead,” Laurent says. “Rub it in.” Damen doesn’t want to. Nausea is curling around him, closing in. “I was out of line too, so.”

And we know now that Laurent has thought through some of his past behaviors toward Damen:

“I was angry at you,” Laurent says, “all the time. Sometimes it was justified, but when it wasn’t I just—I found ways to justify it. That wasn’t fair. Of me.” Damen’s palm is numb around the glass. “Why were you angry?” “Nicaise.” “Justified,” Damen says. “And the rest of it?” Laurent is facing him again. “Paschal says I have a tendency to expect the worst from everyone. Especially you. You’d make comments, and I’d think you were being cruel instead of…” “Instead of what? Ignorant?” Laurent doesn’t reply. “That makes no sense,” Damen says. “We never argued about me being fucking sadistic. We argued about you acting like some things were obvious and I was simply too much of an idiot to get them.” “I never thought you were an idiot.” “You said it often enough.” “I’m—sorry,” Laurent says. “It doesn’t change anything, but—even if you had been the biggest idiot in the world, you didn’t deserve…” A blinking spree follows. “I’m sorry.”

We know that Laurent is still in therapy, and we know that he has been talking about his relationship with Damen there because Paschal has suggested couples counseling for them. And Laurent has invited Damen to do that couples counseling, showing that he wants them to build a better foundation for their relationship  going forward.

4. If HIUH Laurent stops engaging in abusive behaviors, what reasons, if any, does HIUH Damen have to return to the relationship despite past abuse?

Damen is deeply in love with Laurent. At the beginning of the story, he is in denial about this fact, but the uncontrollable flow of his thoughts still shows us how much he feels the loss of their relationship. Once he and Laurent are speaking again, seeing improvements in their communication, and experiencing moments of comfort and fun in their interactions – and once Laurent has broken up with Maxime – Damen admits to himself that he wants to be back together. Neo, as usual, prompts the self-recognition:

“I’m asking you to think about what life might look like in two years,” Neo says, “for you and Laurent. Time does not only pass for you, Damen.” A smile, crinkling the corners of Neo’s eyes. “That’d be ideal, wouldn’t it?”  Two years. Damen sits with the question for a while, looking at it, prodding it. In two years, Nicaise will have gone away to college. Maybe Laurent will move, relocate, start over somewhere closer to Vask. He’ll post about his new life on Instagram, or details of it will make it to Damen as second-hand gossip. They could still be friends, over text or the phone or fucking letters, Damen thinks, yet there’s something bitter in the back of his throat, filling up his mouth like vomit. Maybe Laurent will date again. Probably. Most likely. And Damen— When he looks up from the armrest, Neo is looking straight back.  Damen can’t say it. Earlier today, as he typed his last email of the day at the office, he kept drafting a plan for today’s session. He’d explain his argument with Laurent, then the party at Ancel’s, then the way he keeps looking at Laurent in all the wrong lights, in all the wrong ways, and still finds himself wanting to kiss him. Neo would make a disapproving face, maybe, but it would be easy to brush off; anyone that doesn’t know Laurent would find it hard to understand how easy it is to want to kiss him. Except that isn’t all Damen wants. What Damen wants isn’t a settling of the score, a cleaning of the slate. He doesn’t want to do it once for old times’ sake, or twice out of gluttony. He doesn’t want to make any long-distance phone calls, write any letters, see any pictures on Instagram of Laurent and someone that isn’t him. He doesn’t want things to stay like this, in this careful antiseptic stage. He doesn’t want them to be friends. “It’s not what I want,” Damen says, at last. Neo leans back into his chair. He rolls his wrist once. “You think it’s what I should want, right? Letting go and all.” “I wouldn’t say that,” Neo says. “Should and shouldn’t are very loaded words. It also doesn’t matter what I think you should or shouldn’t do, in general. What is it that you want, since we’ve already established what it is that you don’t?” Don’t make me say it out loud. “I want,” Damen starts, and stops. The words look so stupid, jumbled inside his head. I want him back, like Laurent is a toy someone took away and won’t return. Like Damen is a child, begging. Don’t make me say it.   Seconds trickle by, piling into a minute. Then two. “Do you want to be in a relationship with Laurent again?” “I thought I already was,” Damen says. “A friendship is a kind of relationship. You said that.” Neo closes his eyes, keeps them like that for a while. “I did, yes. Let me rephrase that—do you want to be in a romantic relationship with Laurent? Again?” There is no loophole this time, no two-meaning word Damen can latch onto. The truth sits heavy in him, not on his chest but somewhere deeper, inside a little crevice between some (probably important) organs. Saying no would be lying, saying yes would be diminishing.  “I want things to be good,” Damen says. “That’s all.”

And in chapter 19, Damen is brutally honest with himself about how, even after everything, he still wants Laurent:

“You meet new people,” Neo says. “You go on dates, make new friends, find new interests. Despite what you might think right now, Laurent isn’t your only option. Dare I say, Laurent might not even be your best option.” The room is dark, darker than it was when the phone call started, but Damen’s eyes hurt like he’s been staring at a ball of light for too long. Everything hurts in a strange, modest way. A throb here, faint. An ache there, heatless.  “I don’t want other options,” Damen says. “Well.” “How fucked up is that?” “Pretty fucked up,” Neo says. It makes Damen stop blinking. “Luckily, you’re already doing therapy. It’s only bound to get less complicated from here on. Or more, depending on how you look at it.” “I don’t even wanna look at it, to be honest.” “Then don’t. Take time off, let things cool down, think about what’s been said… No one is asking you to choose right this second.” It’s not that anyone is asking. It’s that it feels like he’s already made his choice. 

“You didn’t tell me,” Damen says before he can think not to. “Tell you what?” “How bad it was.” Laurent’s thumb traces the t in team. It’s a bit crooked, even from Damen’s perspective. “It was pretty bad,” he says, slowly, “before you came back. Things were better once he started seeing you again.” “You call that better?” “Yes,” Laurent says.  I would have come back, Damen thinks, if you’d told me. Except it’s not true; he would have come back for much less. He’s here now, sitting across from Laurent in this mediocre coffee shop, talking things out, making an effort, thinking of reaching out to finally, finally, hold Laurent’s hand.  It’s strange, looking at Laurent and knowing he’s the only other person on earth that feels the same way he does. Where else would Damen go? Who else would he talk to? No one will ever get it, not the way Laurent does. And Laurent knows it. He must, or else he would not be sitting here either. There is only this, Damen thinks. At least for him, there will only ever be this.

So there is that. Damen is hopelessly devoted to Laurent. But that doesn’t make getting back together with him a good decision. Love would not be a good reason to return to an abusive relationship.

Another NOT good reason would be Damen believing the fact that he made mistakes cancels out Laurent’s harmful behavior. The text makes that explicitly clear through Neo:

Neo’s pen hops; a period appears at the end of a sentence. “Apologies can be hard to navigate. It’s sort of like… You’ve wronged me, and you know that you’ve wronged me, and now you’re apologizing for it while expecting me to forgive you. It’s quite a lot to put on a person.” “There are degrees to wrong,” Damen says. His chair feels smaller, like it’s locking him in instead of holding him up. The armrests keep getting in the way of his elbows. “And it’s not like I didn’t have stuff I had to apologize for too. I don’t get why you’re trying to make this seem like a bad thing.” “I’m not.” “Then why—” “Do you think you deserved an apology from Laurent?” Damen leans back and back and back, until his shoulder blades find something solid. Did he deserve…? He’d wanted one, once. In Nikandros’s guest room, with only beige and white and terracotta everything around him, he’d had staring matches with his own phone. He’d thought Laurent might call, at the very beginning. Apologizing. Begging. But Laurent never did. “Yeah,” Damen says.  Neo’s head begins to tilt. “You don’t sound too sure about that.” “I am sure.” “All right,” Neo says. “Why do you deserve an apology?” “I told you already. He treated me like I was an idiot.” “How?” “How—what?” “How exactly did he treat you like you were an idiot? What were his actions towards you?” “I,” Damen starts, but something in Neo’s face makes him pause. “He’d say things when we argued.” “Such as?” “That I was an asshole.” Neo nods. “And how did you feel when you heard him say that? Did you feel like it was fair?” “I felt like he was an asshole,” Damen says. “Sometimes.” “Whereas now you feel like he was right?” He was right about Nicaise. And maybe about Ancel, too. “I don’t know what you want me to say.” “I don’t want you to say anything,” Neo says. “I’m just trying to get you to think about things from a different perspective. Laurent apologized, which is an important—not to say crucial—step in rebuilding any kind of relationship. But it seems to me that you’re holding onto this newly found belief that because you acted a certain way, because you made mistakes, you somehow deserved the way he treated you throughout the last stages of your relationship.” “That’s not what I think,” Damen says.  “All right. Then you think you deserved the apology because the way he treated you was wrong.” “Yes. But…” “But…?” Damen’s face feels hot, the heat lodged right over his molars. “Doesn’t it kind of cancel out? Like, we both fucked up.” “Those are two different issues,” Neo says. “So no, they don’t cancel out. What he did to you and what you did to him are obviously connected, but someone doing something wrong or bad is not an excuse to do the wrong or bad thing back to them.” Neo gives his pen a tap. “Or it does, I suppose. It depends on your belief system. But you don’t strike me as an ‘eye for an eye’ fan.” I don’t want any eyes, Damen thinks. 

I interpret the failed second try (or second strike) of Damen and Laurent’s relationship to have been somewhat based on the “cancel out” reasoning from above. The “cancel out” and move past approach  did not work because they failed to address the many insecurities, communication failures, and problematic patterns that plagued the first time around. A discussion with Neo (again) makes this clear. Damen hasn’t yet learned to listen to what Laurent is saying without letting his insecurities and anger get in the way:

But Damen isn’t in Laurent’s position. You’ll never get it, Laurent had said about Nicaise. Maybe it’s true. “I get why he did it. I’ve been thinking, and it’s not—I get it. Nicaise being embarrassed, wanting Laurent in the room because he was the least angry of—” “I don’t think that’s why,” Neo says. “Or at least, that’s not what you’ve just told me Laurent said about the whole thing.” “What?” “Laurent talked extensively about roles. Did you notice that?” “No.” “He presents himself as the scapegoat for Nicaise’s anger, while you’re the one Nicaise admires and wants to impress.” Tap, tap, tap. Damen imagines Neo’s fingers flying across the keyboard. “It seems to me Nicaise wasn’t concerned about the different intensity levels of your—as in, yours and Laurent’s—anger. He knew you were both angry.” “Laurent was better at handling it.” “Was he?” “I couldn’t stop thinking about the guy,” Damen says. Guys, his brain supplies, helpful as ever. “I still can’t. Even now, I know it’s not—that’s not important. I was yelling at Nicaise. I wasn’t listening.” “And that’s why Nicaise didn’t want you to go with him to the clinic?” Damen closes his eyes. He needs to repaint his ceiling, do something about the lack of texture there.  “Laurent said something about abandonment,” Neo tries. A nudge. “You’ve mentioned Nicaise doesn’t do well with change, that he’s got a tendency to latch onto routines and people. Do you think it might be possible that he was trying to preserve the relationship he has with you?” “By keeping me out of a medical examination room.” “Yes.” “That’s what Laurent said.” “Well,” Neo says. “It sounds plausible.”

Damen wanted magically for them to be over their past:

“Right,” Damen says. “You don’t do should and shouldn’t. I forgot.” “Are you upset?” Are you angry with me? “I don’t know,” Damen says. “We were supposed to be past this, and now it’s out there and I can’t—we can’t—” “How were you supposed to be past this, if this had never been discussed before today?” “You said it’s impossible to discuss everything.”

So, I don’t think it’s a strong interpretation of the text to say that @thickenmyblood is trying to present Damen in an unfairly negative light in order to excuse Laurent’s much worse behavior and thereby make it okay for them to get back together. Cancelling out isn’t what the HEA of the story is set up to be about.

That said – and given the fact that Damen is still in love with Laurent – what GOOD reasons might Damen have to try the relationship again?

For one, he is beginning to understand better what the fights with Laurent about Nicaise were about. Moreover, they have now explicitly acknowledged that they are co-parenting Nicaise and Laurent has expressed a clear commitment to them parenting Nicaise as a team.

For another, Damen has a much improved understanding of the role of therapy and the complexities of mental health. He has a long ways to go on this front, but I don’t think we’ll see him dismissing or belittling Laurent’s mental health needs. Moreover, Damen has ways of addressing his own mental health needs and talking things through with a person who doesn’t share his triggers and emotional investments around Laurent.

For a third, he has made a commitment to working through their issues in therapy and has concluded that he trusts Laurent to try just as hard as he will to repair and strengthen their relationship.

Crucially, Damen has also learned to stand up for himself when he feels Laurent is implying that he is incapable of understanding things. This means he can point it out and Laurent can recognize when he is retreating into a defensive, harmful pattern. This also allows Damen to indicate that something isn’t obvious to him and to ask Laurent to explain it kindly and clearly. I think that is the only way they can reconcile their very different life histories and relationships to social normativity.

ONCE AGAIN, believing this about HIUH Damen relative to HIUH Laurent does not mean that I believe this is something all (or even very many) real life people who were previously in unhealthy relationships should aim for or could achieve.  

Which brings us to our bonus questions:

A. Is an HIUH Laurent who harms Damen through abusive behavior mischaracterized relative to the canon source material?

No, in fact, this is not a mischaracterization. Laurent abused Damen in canon. He took him as a slave. He sought Damen’s public humiliation. He had Damen whipped to an extent that would have killed most other people. He placed Damen in a situation that (for almost any other person) would have resulted in a violent public rape. He also forced Damen to engage in public and non-consensual oral sex. Later, when he understood Damen more emotionally and was feeling insecure or threatened, he lied about his feelings and motivations out of shame and self-hatred and with the aim of hurting Damen enough to drive him away.

B. Is an HIUH Damen who chooses to be with Laurent despite past abuse mischaracterized relative to the canon source material?

Damen fell in love with Laurent after all that abuse because he came to understand its source and because he saw other sides of Laurent that were caring and honorable and expressed a commitment to achieving justice, even if not by fully honest means. He came to understand Laurent as a survivor, even before he became aware of what exactly Laurent had survived. He stuck with Laurent through all of Laurent’s attempts to push him away and fought for what should have been an impossible relationship. And throughout this process, he learned about his own naivete and to question key elements of his upbringing, like the quest for war glory and the belief that “perfect treatment” justified slavery.

Captive Prince is a seductive and enthralling trilogy. And we willingly suspend any disbelief about whether Laurent’s trauma can truly be overcome simply by Damen’s noble nature and magical healing cock.

Why not do the same for HIUH? (Or, you know, just stop reading it.)

Although I do think Maca may owe us some healing cock. Just sayin’.

[jadejedi]

Okay if anyone else has read @thickenmyblood 's absolutely wonderful captive prince fic Hand in Unlovable Hand, then you know why I am absolutely obsessed with it. So obsessed that I made a HIUH x Taylor Swift playlist, because that's the kind of person I am, apparently. The last three songs are sort of my guess for the ending, and are therefore subject to change. The playlist is supposed to be from Damen's POV, and should not be shuffled as it follows his arc through the fic.

[captaindamianos]

Hi! Can you recommend some good Captive Prince fics? I just finished the series and I loved Laurent so much

Hi anon!! Welcome to the fandom 🤗

I've considered doing a fic rec post for a long time so this is a perfect opportunity for me. Please forgive me for the delay. It was Eurovision week when you sent this and it was (and still is) incredibly distracting for me.

Here are some of my favorites, I'm going to offer a variety of things, because I absolutely love AUs, all variations of them, but I know that's not everyone's cup of tea and immediately after finishing the series people tend to like canon and canon-divergent the most, so I'll try to focus on those:

Canon Divergence:

Ransomed Prince by Turtletotem

I started reading this fic back when I still was in the fandom and I absolutely loved it. When I rejoined in 2021, the last few chapters got posted and I've reread it like 10 times already. Please heed the warnings but I just really enjoy the development of their relationship in this fanfic.

Winged Cupid Painted Blind by Kittendiamore

A lot of scheming from Laurent, which is always a good time in my book. It's been a bit since I've read it, but I always enjoyed it.

No Rush by blacktofade

One of my favorite things are Auguste lives AUs were they meet under different circumstances. This is one of my absolute favorites of those and I've read it again and again.

When the sun is on again by thickenmyblood

I've read this story once and it absolutely destroyed me. I was not okay for a few days haha. It's still one of the most amazing things I've ever read. So I would still recommend it, but be careful.

An Arranged Marriage by Josselin

The slow build of this one, I absolutely love rereading it every few months.

Bright as lightning by blacktofade

Another arranged marriage AU haha. Please trust me on this, this is such a good story.

sanguinary poultice, love charm by Lapin

God this is so good, nothing really to say besides do yourself a favor and read it.

How To Not Court A Veretian Prince by Entity_Sylvir

It's been a while with this one as well but I know it was one of my favorites.

Canon Compliant:

The Consummation by Josselin

I have to admit it's been a while since I've read this one. But I know that I really enjoyed it, and it's a very real depiction on how this could go and how the unification will likely have its hurdles.

Wicked Game by onekingdomonce

An anmesia fic, that I've read at least twice. It's painful, but it's worth it. I can recommend everything by that author that is Damen/Laurent. I've not really read any of the other pairings, because i don't multiship Damen and Laurent.

Alternative Universe:

four sevens and a ten by fahye

I know people tend to recommend Fahye's everything (their ´Lines On Palms' series and their tumblr ficlets (link 1 link 2) in particular). But I've grown up absolutely adoring the Swan princess movie, so this one sticks out to me personally. It's a lot darker than the movie, and it has it's very own narrative and development. But god do I love and recommend it.

The Veretian Flytrap by Just_Another_Day

Technically this feels very very canon divergent to me, but since the whole story is Omegaverse I'm putting it here. I know a lot of people don't enjoy Omegaverse fanfics, which is totally valid. But this fanfiction is one of my favorites in this fandom of all time. The world building, the character development, the culmination of it all. I adore it, I reread it every few months and I can't recommend it enough.

A Touch of Heavenly Light by forthelongesttime

I would recommend reading everything by this author. I am absolutely in love with their writing. I like how realistic they write and how they don't shy away from facing ugly things as well. This story in particular is dark and I urge you to check the warnings. It's not for everyone, which is why I recommend checking out their entire list of fics. But if the warnings don't scare you, please check it out!

Alternative Universe - Modern:

between the motion and the act by fahye

And to be contrary once more, I'm also recommending another one of fahye's AUs haha. I really liked this show, and I think it's an amazing fit for a modern AU for Damen & Laurent. Fahye just has an absolute talent for putting them into alternate universes and make them believable to me.

Fear not the thorns by relenafanel

Back then written by one of my favorite Stucky writers, I still absolutely adored it when I reread it in 2021. I definetely recommend checking it out if modern AUs are your thing.

A few authors I'd like to recommend in general:

idratherhaveyou (lots of different AUs, all of them a pleasure to read)

PenguinMerchant (again a lot of different AUs and settings. The worldbuilding is immaculate and always leaves me in awe. All of those AUs also fit them so well.)

Holly_Golightly (one of my favorite unfinished wips in this fandom, I'm still holding out hope haha but everything else they've written was absolutely amazing as well. Very spicey usually. Can't recommend them enough.)

elesary (Can you tell I love AUs yet?? Some are canon compliant or canon divergent, but I especially adore their modern AUs.)

ahdriking (another one of my favorite wips - hardest of hearts - and also just a lot of really spicey stuff, but god, so good.)

[colgatebluemintygel]

eeeek thanks for all the fic recs!!! you're the best!! just finished a fic called Hurling Crowbirds at Mockingbars by Wrapped Up if u want something cute to read!! also captive prince is such a good series eek if you also wanna give recs from there please do! but only if u wanna!

my mothy friend i am so sorry that this reply is so very late 🤒 i have been so terrible with catching up on all the sweet messages i received while i was hermiting 😭

hurling crowbirds !! @wrapped-up truly never ever ever ever misses <3 even just thinking about the neck kissing scene is making me twirl my hair 🤭 i'm just always in awe of the way she writes her characters;; like with remus, all the subtle details that are lent to his characterisation and mannerisms always make him feel so incredibly human. and sirius, who always has me laughing and tearing up all at once <3

CAPTIVE PRINCE FIC RECS ... say no more :o))) i have been subjecting @pancakehouse and @maybebabyplease to my recs for months and now i get to unleash them on YOU

lines on palms (series) by fahye - this is an absolute classic and one that i re-read yearly <3 laurent is sooo.... i love him..

sanguinary poultice, love charm by lapin - i am a slut for a good auguste lives canon divergence longfic and this is my favvv that i've read in a long time <3

in the absence of a king by itallends - this fic made me go from crying laughing to crying crying in 10 mins flat. this laurent is so......just sooooo <33 (don't be deterred by the chap count ;; it's been left at a satisfying spot)

hand in unloveable hand by thickenmyblood - i actually don't even know what to say about this other than that it is a masterclass in character writing and made me sob 😃

scorching the hillside, our manic rhapsody by grumposaur - GAHHHH........ giggling and twirling my hair 🤭 i genuinely go bananas for an auguste lives au and this is absolutely no exception ❕ when laurent says ATTEND ME .... 👆 funny how it was written for my beloved em by my beloved maddy and is also my dream fic 🤭 it's almost like we're all soulmates.....

that's all for now, but i cycle back to capri fic at least once a year so... if you’d ever like more recs :-))) you know who to call !! hairflip

[forgetmenottpott]

An attempt at a different style and my favorite yoga buddies

By @thickenmyblood

[luisunflower]

fic-rec list of Captive Prince triology<3 I gonna add fics time by time 💛

don’t judge it, it’s what I love and wanna share with you all

1- Marionette, Poppet, Prince by  KaerWrites (what if to read CP by the Laurent POV?) unfinished and in process (1 and 2nd finished, 3rd in process)

2- Take me back to Ravenel by  thesmophorias (johnandsherlocks) ( A.k.a: What would have happened if Damen and Laurent wouldn't have fixed things up after their fallout in Kings Rising? How different would their lives be? And how would they come back to one another either way?) unfinished and in process

3- Prisoners and Princes by  flightinflame (Daemon AU covering Captive Prince and Prince's Gambit. Can be read separately from the other fics in this series) unfinished and in process

4- Hand in unlovable hand by  thickenmyblood (It’s not supposed to be this way, he thinks. It’s been four months. Surely by now, he should have stopped caring) unfinished and in process

[metalandmagi]

Can I ask your top 10 fav fics ever (from any fandom, if you don't mind)?

Also, just curious, is there a story behind your name "metalandmagi "?

Haha so the thing about me and fanfic is....for a long time I didn't have an AO3 account, so I didn't have a way to save fics for many years. When I did finally get one, I'd forget to bookmark or keep track of fics I like, and I have the memory of a goldfish that keeps me from remembering some of my faves. So I'll just put in 10 that I do have bookmarked in no particular order😅 (so most of these are Captive Prince related).

As for my name...well...I first made it when I was getting a Twitch account. I wanted it to be metal and magic (as a reference to Undertale), but idk if it was to long or something, because Twitch would only let me type as far as metalandmagi, which I thought was fine too, so I just went with that.

Kind of a cop out, but all of flightinflame's daemonverse fics for Captive Prince are fantastic! https://archiveofourown.org/users/flightinflame/pseuds/flightinflame

Even in Another Time by plegmatic is another great Captive Prince fic with a very Outlander type of feel because of its time travel.

The Stone Unturned by surveycorpsjean is one of my favorite Breath of the Wild stories (Sidon/Link with plenty of angst)

Good Old-Fashioned Lover Boy by Aurum_Auri (a great author I repeatedly revisit) is a fantastic Great Pretender fic, and it deserves more love since it's such a small fandom (sugar daddy Laurent/Makoto AU)

A Night On The Town by SteeleStingray is a fun, action oriented Captive Prince fic focusing on Nicaise (modern AU with secret agent Damen/Laurent)...pretty much anything by SteeleStingray is a fun time.

Give Me A Reason To Stay Here by danegen is an adorable modern AU Wei Wuxian/Lan Zhan fic for The Untamed/Grandmaster of Demonic Cultivation series.

(D)umb (N)erd (A)ttraction by Iaintnosidekick is a modern Rey/Kylo Ren fic where they're two scientists who go from friends to lovers. This is where I out myself as a secret Reylo shipper and that I'm literally playing The Last Jedi in the background as I make this list 😆 There's also one where Rey and Ben are Pokemon Go fanatics that I loved, but I don't have it saved.

When The Sun Is On Again by thickenmyblood is a soul destroying Captive Prince fic that left us all in shambles.

And When You Laugh, My Heart Goes Wiggly (as a slime) by JayJEx is a Raven Cycle/Slime Rancher (Ronan/Adam) fic that I can't believe exists. It married one of my favorite series to one of my favorite games, and I just had to include it because it's also great!

Yellow Joy, Orange Fire, Red Desire by SteeleStingray is a Captive Prince fic that's just a good old fashioned horny joyride. I have no explanation. Again, pretty much all of SteeleStingray's Captive Prince fics are amazing so I could have put all of them on here.

Sorry I'm not getting specific with plots or anything. I kind of just picked stuff at random.

[katamount]

“…wedding bells tinkled at the chapel, which invites guests to marry ‘whomever or whatever’ they want. It was Heller who came up with the concept for Luna Luna more than three decades ago.”

@thickenmyblood, you and @savoytrufflephd should get married at the Luna Luna installation. I will pop the champagne and throw the confetti.

[thelioncourts]

Rules: post the first lines of your last 10 fics posted to ao3. if you have less than 10 fics posted, post the first lines of all your fics.

In descending order -- thank you for tagging me @isabellehemlock 💕

I was born to press my head between your shoulder blades - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Explicit

When they had first met, Damen had been fairly certain that Laurent hated him.

The Mannequin Gallery - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Mature

Damen knew what people thought about him.

Unintended - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Explicit

The first time it happened, it was an accident.

the horror was for love - Captive Prince - Auguste/Laurent - Explicit

His outward composure betrayed the erratic beating of his heart.

with luck, it might even snow for us - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Unrated

There were many things Laurent disliked about the house in Kempt.

into the trees with empty hands - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Unrated

As far as Damianos was aware, everyone across the continent knew of the Witch of Vere.

but the story is this - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Teen and Up

Laurent braced both hands on the splintered railing of the bow as the ship rocked violently from the impact of the third cannonball.

Beyond the Pale - Captive Prince - Damen/Laurent - Teen and Up

Laurent DeVere was off limits.

I know there are only 8 here, but the rest of my stories are so old, so I'm going to share some first lines of unpublished things.

One had a better chance at winning the lottery or getting struck down by lightning than getting into one of Professor DeVere’s classes.

Boring was good.

You could tell spring was coming by the smell of the water.

"A lot" was a ghastly understatement.

Across the room, Violet was clutching at Laurent's legs, her small hands clasped behind his knees, her own feet on top of his as he danced her in careful circles to the music coming from the speaker nearby.

The sound of a dozen voices scream-singing “Buon compleanno!” filled the room the moment the candles on the cake were deflamed by Damiano’s breath.

The words hit Sam like the heel of a palm against his throat.

I honestly do not talk to enough people anymore (my fault) so I'm going to harass my lovely capri group <3 @deripmaver @silentdescant @thickenmyblood

[folfar]

11, 39, 43

11. Link your three favourite fics right now

Okay so this is SO hard, but I'm narrowing it down to these ones that i've read/re-read recently:

the full length of the soul - spinawren (@wrenaspun)

I love amensia!fic so much, i could eat it with a spoon, i could have it for breakfast lunch AND dinner and still be hungry for supper. also this fic focuses on my favourite man in the world, damianos of akielos, and spina is a genius, so it has to take first place. it also features my favourite trope of all time, PINING WHILST MARRIED (i was raised on heyer novels and am incapable of changing at this point) and everyone should read it. this fic should have a thousand kudos, or, failing that, five hundred comments, so let's get it together, fandom

hand in unlovable hand - @thickenmyblood

okay yes it is everyone's favourite fic but it is everyone's favourite for a REASON, because once again it focuses on my babe damianos at his worst, and i love to see a character reduced to ash and be forced to build themselves back up again with an understanding of how and why they have failed. this fic made me want to change my life. PLUS: best ancel ever??

Ultraviolence (in my linen and curls) - @rmayuscula

if kallias has a million fans i am one of them, if kallias has ten fans then i am one of them, if kallias has one fan, that's me. if kallias has no fans, i am not alive, if the world hates kallias i hate the world ETC. and this is the kallias fic OF ALL TIME. I really love Kallias as a POV character - he's a brutal romantic rather than idealistic one; he's a version of Jokaste that makes sense; he's what living with the consequences looks like. And this fic gets that - Leo puts it together so beautifully and so well that it makes me cry. I love this fic.

39. Share a snippet from a WIP

From an upcoming chapter of Sunblind!

“Excuse me,” Laurent says, and slips out with Lord Soandso.

“You are from the south?” Auguste says, because what else do you say to a spymaster. 

Kallias nods. “Akielos.”

He doesn't seem inclined to say anything else, but Auguste is still jittery, still wants to talk, anything to stop thinking about the baths.

“Have you been in Laurent’s service long? Were you a courtier, before?”

“I was a slave,” Kallias says, in the same way men used to say to Auguste that they had served in the borders, or out at the archipelago. Auguste doesn’t know how to talk to slaves. But he does know how to talk to soldiers.

“I am glad you’re free of it,” he says simply. “Where?”

A little crinkle forms at the edge of Kallias’ mouth. “Ios.”

“The palace?” Kallias - sylph-slim, curling hair - the cheekbones - beautiful once, he thinks again.

The crinkle shows again. “Correct. In the household of the older prince.” 

“He must have been a brute,” Auguste said. “I saw what he did to Damen’s back.”

Kallias raises his eyebrows.

“Damianos-exalted,” Auguste hastily corrects. “I know ach- akielons like titles.”

“Yes,” Kallias says. “That’s it.”

Laurent slips back in. He’s white as a sheet, and Auguste hurries over to his side.

43. Do you take a sadistic joy in whumping your characters, or are you more the "If you hurt them I would kill everyone and then myself" kind of person?

anon. let us be serious here. OBVIOUSLY the former. I gave auguste a bunch of friends for the sole purpose of killing and maiming them.

[vampsiltonpitch]

Last Sentence Tag Game ✨

Tagged by: @eriquin

Rules: Post your last sentence and then tag as many people as words in the sentence.

Eddie would if he could.

I haven't written in weeks, bc work's been kicking my butt so bad, it's not even funny. But hey, this is the last sentence I did write, so it must count for something? I guess? Some motivation to go back at it, at least.

Anyway! No pressure tags: @eddies-artofsuffering, @cranberrymoons, @larrysballetslippers, @iminthisstanshit, @thickenmyblood

🩵

[savoytrufflephd]

Let's talk about the title...

Having created this Tumblr for no other purpose than send HIUH (Hand in Unlovable Hand) asks to @thickenmyblood, I figured why not dedicate winter break to fic analysis posts?

So let's start with the title!

How could you possibly be here if you're worried about spoilers, but...

Hand in Unlovable Hand.

At first I was oriented toward the Mountain Goats song (“No Children”), you know how it goes :

I am drowning there is no sign of land you are coming down with me hand in unlovable hand

And throughout the fic's posting, lots of readers have been alternately finding Damen and then Laurent very hard to like (which was an awesome reading experience in and of itself because fanfic doesn’t always tend toward deeply complex characters). So the sort-of-toxic relationship view felt plausible (except I was always going for “appears-toxic-but-is-actually-true-love-and-totally-fixable” because this is make-believe anyway and it’s based on CP, so).

But now I’m thinking, what if the “unlovable” is actually about people who think they are unlovable? And what if that’s not just both Damen and Laurent, but also Nicaise?

So, like, what if what this little family actually has in common – even if Damen appears to have a very different history and Laurent has said they are too different – is their individual fears that no one will ever really love them?

Like Nicaise obviously doesn’t think Damen can actually love the real him and tries to be on his best behavior (even while pushing Damen’s boundaries). And Nicaise seems like he’s doing his level best to drive Laurent away, so that when Laurent eventually abandons him – as he fears - he can pretend that’s what he wanted anyway. 

And Damen has panic attacks about Maxime not because he gives a shit about Maxime but because he’s let Maxime represent the idea that Laurent never really loved Damen, but was just using Damen and moved on quickly and painlessly. And Damen had no mother and had a distant father and a resentful half-brother and he’s only just beginning to believe that chosen family can be real family.

And Laurent completely doesn’t get that Damen has this insecurity because he sees Damen’s life as so normal and charmed.

And, finally, even though our unreliable narrator thinks Laurent has always been in control of everything, including their relationship and entrance into the family formed by Laurent and Nicaise, Laurent’s insecurities (on nearly full display in Chapter 19) have been sprinkled throughout this fic like breadcrumbs.

In the original breakup:

“We’re different. We want different things.” Damen said nothing. The coffee was ashy in his mouth. Dry. “I’ve got Nicaise,” Laurent said, “and I can’t—this is not working. It was never going to work.”

In the overheard conversation with Ancel:

Ancel’s back is all Damen can see. His hair shakes from roots to ends when he tilts his head in Laurent’s direction. “I thought,” he says, slowly, “that you wanted different.” “I did.” “Ugh, Laurent, you’re giving me a headache. What even is the pro—” “I’m not,” Laurent says, louder than before. The shock of sound works like a slap, and Damen wants to move back into the hallway, to scurry to the other bathroom, to leave them alone, but his legs simply won’t take him there. “ I’m not. I’m still—you heard what Nicaise—”

In Laurent's interpretation of the breakup:

“You wanted out,” Laurent says, “so I gave you out.”

But Damen finds Laurent so loveable – and he didn’t ever really talk to Laurent about the effects his abuse – that he can’t understand how unloveable Laurent feels.

So I feel like they three are all so much alike (and so lost in insecurity) that now they’re all talking past each other.

But I also feel like when they come back together in the right way, the family will be so good for each other, damn it!

[silentdescant]

music meme! tagged by @normalamber

Rules: shuffle your “on repeat” playlist from Spotify or the music service of your choice and post the first 10 tracks

my on repeat playlist was a bunch of songs i've literally never heard of because I just put on random classical playlists all night or while i'm reading, but here's a shuffle from my liked songs!

lovely (with Khalid) - Billie Eilish

Rise - Johann Johannsson

Brace Yourself - Howie Day

Never Enough - Loren Allred

Fourth Confluence - Austin Wintory

Piano Sonata No. 20 in A, D. 959 : 2. Andatino - Franz Schubert (Andras Shiff)

Resurrection Hub (From TV Series "Battlestar Galactica") - Joohyun Park

I'm Sorry - Jon Henrik Fjallgren

One of Twelve - Johann Johannsson

Animals - Extended - Martin Garrix

what a vibe lolol

tagging @deripmaver @aphnxrising @sevensforasecret @sevenpoints @theonecalledeli @thickenmyblood

[idkdrarryig]

Tag 9 people you want to get to know better

I’ve been tagged by @titboob to do this!! This has never happened before and is the highlight of my tumblr experience <3

Three ships: drarry (it’s a crime if I don’t include), selix from nowhere boys, and probably moreid (idk I mainly read drarry)

First ship ever: if I’m lying it was drarry, if I’m honest it was probably phan or peterick sue me

Last song: paralysed by colours in the street and the faim

Last movie: Gretel and Hansel (genuinely awful I’ll never get that hour and a half back

Currently reading: Christine by Stephen King, not enjoying it as much as I thought I would :((

Currently watching: a lot of things but mainly Degrassi

Currently consuming: double strength black tea!!

Currently craving: sleep

Tagging @fire-atwill @suborbitalrailgun @thickenmyblood @dodie-y3llow @drummer-from-down-under @khaohyuck @art-by-mira @sickwithenvy @raidahblossom

[laurent-ofvere]

:( c’mon y’all, send in your kings rising rewrite fics

everyone go badger @thickenmyblood about this :)

[forgetmenottpott]

Laurent and Damen chapter 10 in my favorite fic of all time

@thickenmybloods Hand In Unlovable Hand

“You gonna stay there all day?”

“As long as you let me”