#with the exception of Baylan

[skoulsons]

Active shower thoughts

“You won’t help?”

vs

“I can help you”

And shin looks distraught when the latter is said to her

[the-marshals-wife]

☾ Baylan Skoll and Shin Hati ☀︎ moodboards

[yardikins]

WHERE ARE THE BLACK SERIES FIGURES FOR THESE TWO 💔

[roseraintears]

A little teaser for an au I thought of recently……..

What if the sequels had been different?

What if they had more buildup/and a new original villain?

What if Baylan and Shin went to Peridea on their own ( The whole Thrawn, Rebels, Ahsoka stuff happening in the unknown regions being its own series while Peridea would be solely Baylan and Shins)

What if the power calling to Baylan would have been Snoke?

A being bitter and obsessed with breaking the forces cycle just like Baylan

What if Baylan and Shin would have been the reason Snoke was unleashed to our galaxy?

What if Baylan somehow died leaving young scared Shin alone alone with this dark creature that clouds her mind with lies and manipulation (Just like Kylo)

What if Shin would have been a part of the first order in the Sequels?

What if she would have been the founder of the knights of Ren?

[warsavant]

the good news is since his current allies in force users are dathomir witches and a... former inquisitor? who is very content with his apprentice, thrawn is highly unlikely to attempt to kidnap leia organa, and in this case her small son, this time around.

[illuminatedquill]

Been thinking about this scene again lately.

Huyang follows up on Sabine’s decision here two episodes later, gently suggesting to Ahsoka that there really wasn’t much of a choice for the young woman when it came to Ezra. His words even prompt the former Jedi to admit that Sabine was always fated to make that choice.

It was an inevitability. One that was obvious to everyone - except, in my point of view, Sabine. She’s blind to her own feelings and Ahsoka’s unwillingness to confront her about it leads to her literal downfall.

The struggle playing out inside Sabine when she hands over the map to Baylan isn’t a moral dilemma. She’s not struggling with the ethical consequences of her decision here: it’s the sudden realization that she has already decided to trade the map.

Sabine already said yes to what Baylan is offering her a long, long time ago. He knows it, too. The moment Baylan mentions Ezra, it’s a done deal for her.

It’s the realization of just how far she’s gone that is being expressed in this moment. Sabine had already crossed that line some time ago, made the choice in her heart that she would do whatever it took to find Ezra and bring him back home.

Sabine is struggling desperately - not against finally achieving something she’s desired for so long, but in trying to decide how much further she’s willing to go.

Because she now understands that she’s in a free fall.

How many more rules she will break, how many more lines she will cross before she hits rock bottom?

That’s the dilemma she faces here. Inevitability, fate, destiny - whatever you want to call it. Sabine was always coming here, to this place, from the moment she looked at a scrappy, orphaned boy from the streets of Lothal and decided she never wanted him to feel lonely ever again.

Baylan’s wearing all black and wields a blood-orange blade but he’s not the real villain in this scene.

It’s Sabine - it’s her feelings for Ezra, holding her hostage. All Baylan has to do is say the right words to bring her fully into the fold.

There’s no sales pitch that needs to be made, no real deal to be offered. You want to convert someone to a cause, you don’t find a skeptic. You find someone who wants to believe. Someone who is already on the precipice and just needs a gentle push.

Once upon a time there was another Wren who was willing to do anything to protect her family, even if it meant allying herself with a great evil.

But a Jedi came and, with his words, convinced her that there was a better way. Ezra Bridger, tipping the scales with his presence and his voice, convincing Ursa to intervene on behalf of daughter.

And then all these years later, another Wren puts everything on the line to protect what’s left of her family. But the person speaking to her this time is no Jedi. Baylan Skoll, tipping the scales with his presence and his voice, leading Sabine to make her choice on behalf of Ezra.

Both instances saw a Jedi point out the deepest desire of inside each of the Wren women. Essentially by asking them the question, “Who are you?” in that moment.

And both of them, mother and daughter, realized the answer is who they loved most.

[incorrectpizza]

So. The scene with Baylan, and the map. I've seen some mixed reactions to it. I feel a little torn on it myself but overall I feel like it works.

I was mad at Sabine in that moment but not necessarily at the writing because I can understand why she made the choice she did. Natasha Liu Bordizzo made me buy it. The tortured pain in Sabine's face shows she knows it's the wrong decision but she can't help herself.

It felt very Trials of the Darksaber to me. Except, this time, she's ACTUALLY lost her biological family. And her found family. And her "master". She doesn't have Kanan there guiding her, holding her back, helping her work through things. She's alone. And Baylan's manipulating her, pushing all her buttons.

It felt very Sabine like in that moment, for her to be reckless and stupid and selfish. She's lost everything. She's the girl who was broken. Yes, she healed before, but then she was shattered again. She failed. She failed Kanan, failed Ezra, failed Ursa and Alrich and Tristan, failed Ahsoka. And now all she wants is to risk it all for the one person she still has a shot at saving. Is that too much for her to ask?

[squidthoughts]

why doesn't shin leave?

that's the question, right? there are secondary ones, of course – why didn't she kill sabine/was she sandbagging their duel/did she intentionally perform a nonfatal stabbing/was she sent there to interact with sabine at all, or just for the map.... but really, my question at the end of ep1 was:

why is she waiting here at all?

"we've been looking for this," shin says, and that's what, an accusation? conversation-starter? she's here to talk? maybe, okay – except she's actively thieving, so what can she be expecting by sticking around but a fight? so she secures the map and she waits for sabine. to fight her. but the question is still why and in my unqualified opinion i think the answer is found back here:

"ahsoka tano's former apprentice is on lothal."

what do we know about baylan? he was a jedi, once. he witnessed the purge of his order and adapted to a life of survival – he maintains certain jedi traditions, he passes these traditions to his padawan: the braid, the traditional construction of the lightsaber, if not the crystal inside (standing mystery, though). he is nostalgic but not melancholy, connected perhaps to the more elegant and noble history of the jedi but evidently strongly opposed to assuming that title at present.

what do we know about shin? well...almost nothing. except that when baylan speaks, shin listens. she obeys unquestioningly. when morgan speaks, shin watches baylan. they are close; there is mutual trust, though clearly more dependency on shin's side. and she is likely – though not certainly – born after order 66.

i'm confident answers will be forthcoming about shin's past, but in the meantime, working with the (very!!) little we have, assuming the subtle intricacies of the shot direction and ivanna's acting are all intentional, and with the full disclaimer that im brainrotty for wolfwren......i want to answer my original question.

shin has never seen another apprentice before. beyond baylan and inquisitors (apparently), she has probably never seen another lightsaber-wielder before. and yet – her master, while scorning the label of jedi, is steeped in jedi history. he seems to be training her according to some traditional jedi principles (though...what with the mass-murder and the mercenary work, of course we don't yet know the extent of those principles), and it would follow that he would have imparted the history of the jedi as well.

baylan skoll is not a jedi. but ahsoka tano is. or, was. but the antagonist squad refers to her as a jedi, so from shin's perspective it's not just "ahsoka tano's apprentice" on lothal. she is being told there is a real, live jedi apprentice on lothal.

and the jedi are extinct.

we're into the rampant speculation part of the meta now, because what is shin thinking in this moment?

there's a green lightsaber before her – a jedi apprentice before her – or at least the former-apprentice-of-a-jedi, but shin is the apprentice-of-a-former-jedi, and at some point the semantics get in the way of the exhilaration. this is probably (again, this whole thing could get disproven in the next episode or something) the first lightsaber battle shin has ever had with someone who might actually kill her. (i assume baylan wouldn't engage in prolicide while sparring.)

this is, i think, shin at her most excited. on the one hand – it's another apprentice! it's another member of an order (her order??) that was supposed to be wiped out! this is proof of concept maybe, that shin isn't so alone! and on the other hand – this is a test, no? like, the first real test of shin's full abilities, assuming she's never dueled before? again, i wish we knew more about her motivations, but it stands to reason a padawan that powerful and devoted would constantly be looking for ways to both prove and improve herself, right?

and then. sabine. sucks.

she's sloppy and weak and doesn't use the force. she's untrained and undisciplined and slow and gets tired too quickly.

shin starts blocking with one hand. she starts sidestepping sabine's wild swings. there's no way she's is trying to kill her at this point; shin is playing with her food.

i just...think she's disappointed?? like, she was probably expecting so much more from a proper jedi's apprentice, and i think we'd need more information about her to extrapolate what exactly she wants in this scene, but i'd be willing to bet it wasn't this sub-par, former-apprentice bitch-ass fight. (love to sabine but like. she did get her clock cleaned. obviously.)

regardless, i am excited to see how this experience influences the forestfight™ we know is on the way...and also if sabine, like, feels...anything....about being skewered like a county fair corn dog?? i mean trauma or anger or fear or drive or?? bc we know shin wasn't actually trying to kill her, (this is my official stance and im sticking to it) but sabine sure doesn't!!

[incorrect-kotor-quotes]

Thinking back on the Ahsoka series, I know many people, myself included, drew parallels between Baylan Skoll and Kreia. They both show a pretty cynical outlook, and Baylan's plan is likely rooted in distrust of the Force, much like Kreia's. That's about where the similarities end.

Whereas Kreia infamously cannot shut the hell up, Baylan is the opposite, excessively cryptic. One reason I find Baylan more sympathetic than Kreia is that he at least thinks he's going to help people once he... does whatever he's attempting to do. Kreia pays lip service to the idea of helping people by rejecting the Force, but it's pretty obvious manipulation and her actions aren't meant to help anyone except herself.

I think the better comparison is between Baylan and the Exile.

Both were Jedi Generals, both were among the few survivors of the Jedi Order's near-extinction. What really sets Baylan apart from Kreia and makes him closer to the Exile is choosing to teach Shin. In an age of darkness where many Force-sensitives never discovered their power, Baylan found one and trained her. Certainly a non-traditional apprenticeship, but still with elements of Jedi culture, like Shin's padawan braid. The foundation is presumably similar. Shin thinks of herself as a Jedi, though Baylan says she's something "more" than a Jedi, whatever that means. Explain yourself, you enticingly vague dilf.

As far as we know, Baylan never joined the Sith/Empire at any point, to any degree. He wasn't an inquisitor, or any kind of imperial agent, and he seems to loathe Vader specifically. How he and Shin survived for decades is uncertain, but they must've kept themselves far from galactic society, far from the Empire. In exile. There's no loyalty to Thrawn, the admiral just happened to be where Baylan wanted to go and Thrawn's followers could help him get there. When he recalls the Jedi, he's saddened they were killed and wants to understand why it happened. The Order wasn't what Baylan wanted it to be. He's devastated that it's gone.

Baylan's not dark, he's wounded.

[flilisskywalker]

I feel like people are not understanding the gravity of Sabine's arc. It's obviously not just about finding Ezra. This is clearly not just about bringing him home. It's clearly about her wanting to BE WITH HIM. Whatever that means to you.

Baylan read her thoughts.

She feels Ezra is the only family (Whatever that means to you, but don't tell me this term is exclusively platonic) she has left, even though we know the rest of the Ghost Crew (Except Kanan, Force bless his soul) is alive.

Her goal as Baylan says is to be reunited with her long-lost friend, but then Thrawn points out that's not simply her goal: That's her DESIRE.

And she accepted the possibility of being stranded in that galaxy forever with Ezra. That's literally what she wants. To be with the person who understands her the most, this dorky man she has witty banter with, who always paid attention to her and tried to cheer her up.

She wants the happy ending she couldn't get in Rebels and now, she will have to fight for it like she always has.

Going even further. Baylan asks Sabine in Part 4: "Do it. FOR EZRA." , but in Part 6, Ahsoka says: "A choice she made FOR HERSELF."

Finding him has nothing to do with fulfilling some promise like the ending of Rebels implied. The mission aspect of it is just a cover.

Sabine wants Ezra.

[cisheteronormativityfetishist]

Except in this metaphore Baylan executes Ezra in front of Sabine the second they get to Peridia.

[welcometocaritas]

when wolfwren are left to babysit. . .

excerpt from my fic 'you and i were born in fire'

'' is used for when Shin and Sabine communicate through their thoughts/the bond. "" is normal talking.

. . .

"I don't know what to do about them," Jacen admits, voice almost too quiet to hear. "The other kids. I tried to be their friend but they didn't want that. Then I tried ignoring them but. . . well, they didn't want that either."

Shin can relate. Those are two methods that she tried all too often herself - with no success. If people want to hurt you, they will hurt you. There is very little you can do to prevent it except hurt them back.

At least in her experience.

"You could kill them. That would solve the problem."

Jacen stares at her, the wideness of his eyes suggesting that this may not have been what humans consider to be an appropriate solution. But Jacen is part alien so Shin suspects he'll adjust. "Is that what you did?"

"Yes."

"Oh." He blinks. ". . . did it work?"

Shin tilts her head, thoughtful. "They never hurt me again. So. . . Yes."

"It doesn't sound like something a Jedi would do."

"I'm not a Jedi."

"I know but. . . I want to be one."

Shin resists the urge to roll her eyes, or sigh one of Baylan's disappointed and world-weary sighs (she finds them coming out of her more and more these days, living on this base). "You shouldn't. You could be more."

Jacen, apparently, lacks her self-control - for he does roll his eyes. "I know, Aunt Shin."

So she may have said this to him before. Many, many times before. Possibly every time that they converse.

But somebody has to.

Shin frowns. "I'm not your aunt."

Perhaps the bullies delivered a knock to his head as well?

She should check for a brain injury.

"Well. . . no," he allows. "But Sabine isn't my aunt, either. Not technically. I don't actually have anyone who is technically my aunt. Or my uncle. Or, well. . . anything. At least, not since Grandpa died. . . So Mum said that technically doesn't matter. I get to choose who my family is."

Rather than alleviate her confusion, his words only intensify it. "And you've chosen me?"

"Affirmative."

He was most definitely hit on the head.

Which means he ought to be checked for a concussion.

Shin reaches out to do exactly that, placing a hand on his forehead.

Jacen frowns, attempting to twist away. "What are you doing?"

"Scanning you."

"For what?"

"Yeah, Shin? For what?"

She twists around to see Sabine walking towards them, a cocky grin in place that she absolutely does not find attractive. Distracted by the potentially perilous state of Jacen's health, Shin didn't hear the door open.

"A concussion."

Sabine pauses. "And why are we scanning Hera's only child for a concussion?"

"Some children on base assaulted him."

"What? I'll kill them." Sabine whips around, as if searching for the culprits themselves in amongst the graffitied walls of their room. A pointless endeavour. Shin would have picked up the signatures of any extra life forms upon entering.

"I suggested as much as a solution but Jacen is reluctant."

"Killing is wrong," he says, looking at them pointedly. "And also illegal."

Sabine waves that minor protest aside. "Not a problem if you don't get caught."

"Which we won't."

They're not amateurs.

Sabine dumps herself down onto the bed. "Now. . . tell me about these little brats."

Shin catches her eye. 'Are we really going to kill them?'

Because she will. But she's admittedly a little surprised by Sabine's gusto.

Sabine hesitates. '. . . Probably not.' To her credit, she appears as unhappy as Shin about this conclusion. 'Hera would disapprove.'

'That's not a problem for me.'

She likes it when Hera disapproves.

'Okay, not really for me, either,' Sabine amends. 'But it might be morally wrong. To kill a bunch of kids. Even if they are complete jerks. . . I mean, I'm probably headed to hell anyway but I think that'll buy me a one-way ticket.'

Shin focuses on the rock in Jacen's hands. Jagged and uncomfortable as it may be to touch, it does look beautiful.

'And I guess we'd be setting a bad example for the squirt. . .' Sabine frowns - before brightening. 'Still doesn't mean we can't make them regret the day they were born!'

'So torture, then?'

Sabine blinks. "Uh. . ."

Jacen sighs. "Mum says it's rude to have a silent conversation with someone in front of someone else."

"Your mum invented that rule of etiquette after meeting Shin because she doesn't like being kept out of the loop. It's not a real thing."

Shin suspects it might be a real thing. But she's willing to cede to Sabine's judgement when it comes to the rules of social engagement.

[isagrimorie]

I love the look on Sabine's face when Thrawn was giving his final taunts to Ahsoka:

This was the part that gave Ahsoka pause.

Sabine also takes a beat, she freezes and it makes me wonder how much Ahsoka shared with Sabine about Anakin and who he became.

Her issues aren't over. Just because she's wearing white doesn't mean her issues are over, especially with the fear that she could become like Anakin and Fall.

I actually clapped when Thrawn said, 'Ronin.' Bokken, ronin, a few Japanese words mixed in Basic.

Can I just say?

Is such an Anakin move. She learned it from her Master, and the mere fact that she was seems to intimidate Thrawn a lot.

But also, this goes to show that Thrawn doesn't know Ahsoka because she can be negotiated with.

What does he really want out of this? I know he's being called Heir to the Empire, but why would he want that?

People can talk to Ahsoka. Maul almost got to Ahsoka, but he kind of bungled his way out of a possible alliance with Ahsoka.

Ahsoka can be reasonable in the way Anakin couldn't be. She's able to make an alliance with pirates that almost killed her and the kids under her care.

It's the same with Baylan, except he didn't talk with Ahsoka but passed judgment immediately.

[aymethyst]

Ahsoka offers Shin a hand, a new start. A chance to start over after a heavy defeat, except that would be betrayal to Baylan. Baylan who was already beytrayed by the clones after his life of service to them as their general during the clone war that lead to the extinction of the Jedi Order, both who he had once blindly but his trust in. Plus Sabine’s betrayal to her master is what got them here in the first place. Going against direct orders for her own gain. Yet here her master is, back from the dead, defending her despite practically endangering her masters mission and the galaxy’s whole future, going rogue making up her own mission, for a /chance/ that an old friend is still alive. /That/ is what interests Shin in the first place. That refusal of black and white thinking, taking risks with huge consequences, Shin never thought was possible, only foolish. A world of possibilities await, yet its dangerous, and she’d be alone or at least without her master, the only one who truly knows her and her strength after all these years. What if something went wrong? She’d end up on her own, in a galaxy far far away with no way to reach back to her master, /if/ he would even take her back. Would all her training be for nothing? Would she no longer have a purpose in this universe? How can Sabine make such a rash decision that could ultimately lead to their destruction, so quickly and with confidence. She sees something she wants, and she goes for it. Doesnt matter who stands in her way. Quickly turning her back as she leaves, Shin can see the desperate urge in Sabines eyes, locked in on her, but this time Ahsoka is there to reign her in. Its too intense a gaze, knowing Sabine will do all in her power to make her own path come true. But this time, Shin knowns, this time Sabine is coming for her, and to make it even worse, she isn’t coming for just a fight and wont take no for an answer.

[pandora15]

okay i'm gonna rant a lot (like. a LOT) about the ahsoka series and most of it is like. pretty critical, so please skip if you love the series! (you're valid and there are things I did like about the show i'm just. frustrated and tired i guess)

i think i just really miss animated ahsoka and like. ahsoka having actual flaws y'know? and like being an actual character that I can relate to.

it bothers me SO much that she like. has no reverence or even respect for all the jedi who mentored her, to the point that she won't even mention them? instead she mentions anakin, who yes had a major role in her training, obviously, but he's also the source of a lot of her trauma. HE'S the one who stormed the temple and killed jedi. he's the one who spent years afterwards hunting down the rest and killing them — the same people who took ahsoka in when she was a child and raised her.

literally, anakin is the one who tried to kill HER in rebels.

but it's fine because "he's the only one who stood by her even when no one else would" right? and "he was a good master" because he left recordings for her and taught her to survive and —

like okay.

okay.

anakin and ahsoka's relationship is wonderful and important and I love their dynamic in TCW. seeing anakin be in a position of mentorship was really cool, and ahsoka's personality worked with his PERFECTLY.

but TCW also made it a point to see ahsoka be mentored by other jedi, and that was one of the things I loved most about it. we get to see ahsoka with plo koon, with aayla secura, with luminara unduli, with tera sinube, and it was amazing to see all these different jedi and how they're all wonderful and unique and AMAZING through the lens of ahsoka.

but now it's like. she doesn't even mention any of them? in rebels she did mention a few and I was happy to see that, but in the ahsoka series it's like. only anakin, the rest of the jedi don't even matter to her because "wow anakin was the only one who ever stood by me no one else did anything for me"

also damn i used to LOVE sabine. when I was watching rebels I was so in awe of her because she's so cool and interesting and intelligent and has that creative fun side to her as well? and the fact that tiya sircar is an american with bengali origins (just like me) made me feel like. really good about her and her character.

when natasha liu bordizzo was cast as sabine for ahsoka I was pretty disappointed — not because she wasn't asian because she absolutely is, but because to me, sabine was indian-coded. in rebels, her entire family (except for her father iirc) were all portrayed by indian voice actors. that could not have been a coincidence. it was something that I was grateful to see — that I can see interesting, intriguing characters in animation and in star wars that look like me.

but like, fine. I decided to look past it and try to be excited for the show.

but now I feel like sabine is like. a totally different character who she was in rebels. and I understand that the show tries to write off her change in personality as grief over what had happened to her family, but it just doesn't feel like a logical direction from where she is at the end of rebels to where she is at the beginning of ahsoka. maybe if the show decided to take more time to explain what happened during that time or even gave us some flashbacks to that time, i'd be more accepting of it but it doesn't. it just feels jarring to me.

more than that, sabine literally condemns the home galaxy to whatever thrawn will end up doing in his attempts to bring back the empire because she gave baylan the map. rebels sabine would never have done that. it's as though she completely forgot not only what kanan sacrificed when he died, but also ezra at the end of rebels.

and the fact that we don't see ezra finding out about what sabine did (and we likely never will) is INFURIATING to me. like????? this is such an important thing and he doesn't know about it?

and we think about the fact that sabine doing all of this for ezra is something that's like. so attachment-coded and such a central theme of star wars but then not really facing any consequences for doing that is like. hello????? it almost feels like the show is encouraging unhealthy attachment, which is extremely counter to what star wars and being a jedi is all about.

and to be clear, the concept of a character in their thirties who was previously considered non-force sensitive training to become a jedi but struggling to reach the force is definitely interesting. i feel like if it was done for a different character, I may have been more on board for it. the problem with it being sabine is that I feel like this arc is almost at the expense of the arc she had in rebels and it takes away from the aspects of her personality that I really enjoyed in rebels -- like her art??? her mandalorian identity????

i would've also been okay with her like. becoming someone like chirrut imwe — like being someone who believes in the force and the jedi way, and like seeking internal balance for herself, but her becoming force sensitive "because she trained and trained and really wanted it so badly for literal years" (even though rebels never showed us that she wanted to be a jedi, even when she was literally living with two of them and learned solely to use a lightsaber from kanan).

also no one tell chirrut imwe that he could've become force sensitive all this time, he just wasn't trying hard enough i guess. RIP.

okay another random topic change.

i'm eternally GRATEFUL that we didn't end up seeing ahsoka taking obi-wan's place on mustafar to fight anakin because that would've. i probably would've turned off my tv right then and there. (there was a leak about obi-wan's dead body being shown i'm assuming on mustafar but who knows. and genuinely i think that would've traumatized me. i'm not kidding.) i was so NERVOUS about this happening, and i'm really glad it didn't. here's hoping they don't do it in season 2 or whatever ends up coming next for ahsoka.

(ewan please stay away from the mando-verse shows i'm begging)

that being said, looking back at ahsoka's journey from start to where we are now, I just feel sad. I feel like we hit such a beautiful ending point to her arc at the end of rebels and now this show completely soured it for me. I have no idea how they're going to resolve it from here, and I'm getting this sinking feeling that we're never going to get to a beautiful ending point for her character now because we've gone way too far and there's no way to step it back.

I feel like sabine is like. a completely different character than who she was in rebels. literally, in my head, sabine from rebels is a different person. I think that's the only way I can make sense of this in my head. I can't connect the two together.

anyways, sorry for the long rant, now that it's been almost a week since the finale and I had time to reflect, I'm realizing that I'm not very happy about this series. there are things I did like (ie. ezra, huyang, baylan, shin, the music), but I feel like they really fumbled on the main two characters here and it's really unfortunate.

[hobbitkiller]

I find it interesting how much Ahsoka keeps referencing fate and destiny. Morgan, Ahsoka, and Baylan have all talked about fate, the future, and whether it’s clear or clouded.

I also find it interesting that the Nightsisters were able to see everything coming to pass except for Sabine, which is part of why they saw her as dangerous. They had this very clear plan that they had been working on, and Sabine comes in as a wild card.

To me this says Morgan was always going to make it to Peridea whether or not Sabine helped—which makes sense given I’m fairly certain Sabine wouldn’t have been able to destroy the map given Baylan could have easily just killed her before she did. Her being present has the potential to unravel whatever threads of fate are at play.