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Dick Grayson the Guitarist
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Titans 2023 #2, New Teen Titans 1980 #50
Batman 1940 #164, Detective Comics 1937 #386
The Flash 1987 #87, New Teen Titans 1980 #50
Batman 1940 #244
Batman 1940 #244, Death Metal
Featuring Donna Troy on vocals, Joey Wilson on lead guitar and the Pied Piper on the flute.
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Super-powered Titans beat up regular human man for fun, 1987 (colorized)
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New Teen Titans (1984) #32
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My cover art for TALES OF THE TITANS #3, featuring the one and only Donna Troy through the years. In shops this September from DC Comics!
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I love how beautifully impossible-to-label Donna and Dick's relationship is
I also love how it confuses everyone who tries to force a label onto them. It's so special and complicated and unique!
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Words can't describe how much these two mean to each other (or what exactly they mean to each other either).
This is mostly so I have all these panels in one place.
Sources (Chronologically): New Teen Titans (1980) #14, #28, #38 and #50, New Titans 92, Green Lantern (1990) #81, Batman Chronicles #7, Nightwing Secret Files and Origins, Wonder Woman (1987) #165, #167 and #180, Titans (1999) #25 and #28, Titans (2008) #23, and Justice League of America (2006) #41 and #50.
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I feel like the Titans vs Batman dichotomy with Dick Grayson gets blown out of proportion, like people can be more than one thing.
I think this Donna Troy thought bubble sheds some light on this tension.
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"He's Batman. He's the man I always knew he'd be."
These sentences are mutually exclusive. Yes, Dick is the Batman, WOW. But also, Dick has become the special, unique, amazing human being Donna always knew he'd grow up to be. In my opinion, Dick actually never feels more unique than when he became Batman, which is ironic but makes complete sense to me. I'd honestly suspect his bestie Donna would think the same.
Becoming Batman does not mean becoming Bruce Wayne. And although Bruce Wayne is troubled and has self-destructive tendencies, he's not a monster; he's just not Dick. The Titans want Dick to be Dick and Dick isn't Bruce.
Source: Justice League of America #47
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Donna Troy vs "dC CoMIcs aRE sOoOO HarD tO GEt iNTo..."
I know it seems that way. Like yeah, they're not exactly a netflix mini-series with a pilot and everything and yes, walking into a comicbook store can be (or is) fucking daunting, but we have tumblr and multiple libraries worth of pirated comics online.
Tumblr's got blogs dedicated to specifics characters, metas to familiarise ourselves with characterisation and metatext and reading recommendations for newer readers.
It's ok to dive head first into continuity, there's never gonna be a perfect starting point. I think people, writers included, massively overthink the digestibility of comics.
Donna Troy's a good example of this. Our girl has had 5-6 different origins, each which confusingly contradict the last, written to make her continuity palatable for new readers. Who in the world is a fan of Donna because of the very first chapter of her story? I love Donna because of her unique voice and her capacity to love and her compassion and her relationships with others and her growth over the years, and I like her stories because they depict her reckoning with, not just the horrors of the world around her, but also herself. I couldn't give two fucks if she was adopted by Rhea or Hippolyta or if she's a clone of Diana. I read about her taking on neo-nazis while coping with the loss of her son, trying to hold on to faith in the face of the world's cruelty and searching for her truth in the mess of it, and I'm like fuck, I'm a fan! Who is Donna Troy? Well, for one, she's more than a digestible origin story.
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Just gotta leap before you look sometimes.
Source: Wonder Woman: Donna Troy
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One of my favourite moments from the show. Definitely my favourite episode (also written by Marv Wolfman and George Perez).
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Teen Titans Chronology
Era 1: Superhero Names & Funky Nicknames
The Brave and the Bold (1955) #54 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #60 Showcase #59 Teen Titans (1966) #1-20 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #83 Teen Titans (1966) #21-22
This is the peak silly era. Goofy nicknames, (mostly) goofy one-off villains, occasional team-up, etc. As far as I'm aware, none of their real names are ever mentioned within their own title and it's just their superhero names.
It starts with Robin, Kid Flash, Aqualad (in the first Brave and Bold), with Wonder Girl being the first addition when they are officially first called the Teen Titans (in the second Brave and Bold), so I'm counting the Fab Foursome (Cool Quartet? Fantabulous Foursome?) of them as the starting point. They're a team up to #18 with occasional guests from Speedy (#4 - with notes that there were an "avalanche of mail" asking for his inclusion, #11), Beast Boy (#6 - rejected by the Teen Titans and apparently previously the Doom Patrol for not having a guardian's permission slip, interesting note that he already had movie offers here), and Starfire (#18 - definitely not who you're thinking of and instead a Russian boy).
Issue #19 is when they become "Fab-Four-Sometime Five" where Roy joins and Garth takes a break, so the main four changed. There are then two more team ups with Jericho (#20 - also not who you're thinking of but some boy name Joshua) and with Hawk and Dove (#21).
I think only Mad Mod became a long-term villain (?) but the list includes: Mr Twister, the Astounding Separated Man, Beast-God of Xochatan, Akkuru, Ding Dong Daddy Dowd (Demon Dragster), Diablo, The Ant (less villain and more blackmailed by Mr Krask), Mr Baltzer, Mad Mod, Honey Bun (and a spy Karl Larner), Captain Tiger, The Scorcher, The Gargoyle (who makes a reappearance in #35), Captain Rumble, The Dimensional Caper (from Dimension X), Le Blanc, Punch (Sylvester Sepastopol), Fat Cat.
Era 2: Real Names, New Teammates, Mr Jupiter, and Solo Storylines
Teen Titans (1966) #22-31 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #94 Teen Titans (1966) #32-34 World's Finest Comics #205 Teen Titans (1966) #35-39 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #102 Teen Titans (1966) #40-43
This part of the story starts to have a bit more personality and it is a lot more character-driven as opposed to (short) plot-driven stories. Their real names are finally used and they're shown to hangout as civilians and not just superheroes.
This starts at the end of #22 when Donna Troy is given a name, a backstory (one of many), a new apartment, a roommate Sharon, and a makeover. Dick and Wally was previously named in #83 of The Brave and the Bold, but Roy gets named in #24. In a way, this makes Donna feel very much like the living center of the Titans for me, her development begins with the Titans and she's intrinsically tied to it very personally (and this also feels reflected in how Garth views Donna as the "TITANS FOREVER" among all of them). After all, at this point, there's no separate comics she is in unlike the other 4 main titans. She is also the only single character that appears in every single comic with no exception (other than the very first, but they weren't known as Teen Titans then either).
There aren't so much guests as much as two new permanent members - Lilith who joins right before Mr Jupiter comes into the picture in #25 and Mal who joins right after in #26. During this time, 6 of them are mostly all there and are led and trained by Mr Jupiter. The longest disappearance is when Dick goes to college (from #25-32 except for a single appearance in #28) and occasional disappearance when they stay behind to take care of Mr Jupiter's lab (sometimes it is unexplained but I chalk most disappearance up to this). From #26 onwards, all but 6 issues are not related to Mr Jupiter (#28-29 led by Garth, #31 led by Wally, #34 and #42 led by Donna, and #43). This era also seems to establish Wally (and Donna) as de-facto leader when Dick is not around.
All other guests are really more part-time members such as Hank and Don who do their summer stint from #25-#30, Gnarrk who first appears in #32-33 and comes back in #39, and Garth who appears in #28-29 and #40.
For the first time (as far as I'm aware), a known villain gets brought into the story - Ocean Master (Orm) and an alien leader Mofo in #28-29 with Garth going after him. This part also established the easy-to-get-into-fights, easy-to-get-out-of-fights (among themselves) dynamics that I associate with the Titans. They start to place more importance on their insecurities and friendship.
There are also 2 main "friends get brainwashed" (for extended period) type storyline during this period of time (which later seems to become quite commonplace among the Titans): once with Donna (#34 which Wally doesn't see) and once with Garth (#40).
This is also the only era which has quite a lot of additional separate solo storylines. It start with Donna if you count "The Origin of Wonder Girl" in #22 (although it's kind of more like an additional story where everyone appears), and then Wally and Garth (with Tula) in #30. Garth (#30, #35, #36, #38) and Lilith (#36, #38, #41, #43) have the most with 4 each, Roy (#35, #38) and Hank&Don (#31, #39) have two each, and Mal (#35) and Dick (#36) have one each (like Donna and Wally). Superboy (young Clark) actually also has two - one with Dick (#36) and one with young Ollie (#37) that doesn't even have any of the Titans in it.
Crucially, contrary to how modern comics love to portray Batman and Robin's view on the Teen Titans, Batman actually fully supports the Teen Titans in the original and has never been shown to do otherwise almost at all. In fact, he is the one with the most team-ups with the Teen Titans and the team-ups almost always happen because he needs helps "relating to the teens" and he specifically calls on them, with full respect for them (even purposely allowing Wally and Donna to punch him real hard that one time to solidify their cover). The only mentor who does show disapproval is actually Aquaman (in Era 3), who does so because Garth gets mysteriously sick which he blames on the Teen Titans (sort of half-correctly).
Interestingly, up to this point there are actually more team appearances of what I'm calling Alternative 5 or Alt5 (Wally, Donna, Roy, Lilith Mal) than of Fab5 (Dick, Wally, Donna, Garth, Roy). In fact, up to this point there were 12 appearances of Alt5 over 5 appearances of Fab5. This is mostly because Roy and Garth actually have very little team-ups because Roy became a permanent basically the same time that Garth stopped being a permanent member.
Titans Villains (other than Ocean Master hat one time) in this era: Hell's Hawks, Harry Tout, Dr Pauling, Councilman Buckminster (Santa Claus), Demoness possessing Magda Drachwyck (Miss Wickersham), Calibano Della Loggia (x2), Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse, Black Earl of Moray, Captain Barstow's Phantom, Lord Beetle
Era 3: When Fab5 was Defined, More Teammates, Teen Titans West, and Splitting Up
Teen Titans (1966) #44-53 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #149
There was a more than 3 years gap from the last issue #43 in February 1973 to issue #44 in November 1976 which translated to a 2 year in-comic hiatus of the Teen Titans. There's also a change of regular writer from (mostly) Bob Haney to Bob Rozakis. All this culminated in a change in tone of the characters being a bit more aggressive and antagonistic towards each other, especially with Roy (note: Snowbirds Don't Fly happened in 1971 so it's not because that occurred in between the break since it actually happened before the break). They fight a lot more this era and the storylines are longer and bleed more into one another.
Another obvious change is that Wally is shown to be way more into Donna than before (in his thoughts especially) instead of their more casual flirting. Wally does eventually confess to Donna who rejects him in this era. The other "official" relationships are Mal/Karen and Lilith/Gnarrk (funnily because Mal/Lilith was a thing for a bit).
In story, Mr Jupiter decides to close shop (unknown reason) and so they broke up, with Mal taking care of the labs and the rest pursuing their individual careers instead as they agreed upon (but Mal is unhappy about). This... doesn't really make sense because I'm not sure what "individual career" Donna has, but never mind.
Lilith is no longer in the main team (later explained that she settled in the West Coast with Gnarrk which is very contradictory to her last statement in #43 that the Teen Titans is her family). Garth comes back from #45 when he is mysteriously summoned by Mal's horn and it's like he never left. He wants to resign in #51 because his insecurities making him physically sick, but he agrees to finish the mission and they all ended up disbanding anyway. Karen appears first in #45 as Mal's girlfriend and joins as Bumblebee in #49, but Duela joins the team first in #46. Because of these lineup changes, Fab5 appearances started to catch up to Alt5 until eventually Alt5 (15 appearances) just barely edges out Fab5 (13 appearances). Interestingly, Dick-Wally-Donna-Roy-Mal actually end up appearing most (17 appearances).
They (it's honestly mostly Dick, Wally, and Donna) discuss the idea of a new headquarters first suggested by Donna in #45 (like I said, she's very much the living centre of the Titans). Dick makes the decision (because he is Leader-Man and Bruce is funding it) to have their headquarters as a restaurant front, Gabriel's Horn (named after Mal's horn given by the angel Gabriel in #45), run by Mal and Roy (the jobless duo apparently) in #46 and they set it up in #49. Mal and Roy also started forming the rock band The Great Frog (a job!) in #45 which plays in their restaurant.
Teen Titans West first meet up and is established in #50 with some familiar faces (Gar, Hank, Don, Lilith, Gnarrk) and some complete newbies (Bette, Ch'al) to the roster. Issues #51 and #52 have the East and West team up, resulting in basically every Titans ever joining with the exception of Tula (but then again, at this point she only appeared in Garth solo story and never in the main storyline). At the end of which, they have a big feast (sponsored by Dick) and decided to part ways to improve and work towards eventually becoming the future Justice League (as they were always meant to).
The final story #53 establishes their origin and formation story which includes Roy, but had Roy basically saying he wanted to be involved only whenever he wanted and not permanently (ahem commitment issues), establishing Fab5 as the clear founders of the Teen Titans in the last issue.
There is a third "friends get brainwashed/used" (for extended period) type storyline with Lilith (#50-52), except she's not evil, but her powers are manipulated for evil. With Duela, there is also the first instance of villain's children in the Titans (in future there is Joey and Rose most prominently), setting up the stage for Titans raising villain's children. They actually brought Two-Face in to visit Duela at least once (right after a crime too???) which is... interesting?
This era has many more appearances of known villains including Dr Light, The Fiddler, Two-Face, and Mr Esper (Captain Calamity). The final issue is where Antithesis first appear (he is a recurring villain or at least comes back in future issues), and the remaining unimportant ones are: The Wreckers, Flamesplasher (x2), Sizematic (x2), Darklight (x2), and Rocket Rollers led by Brian the Brain.
Finally, there are some unexplained mysteries. Where the hell did Mal's horn go since it went missing in #49? Who is the blonde "Little Queen" that Garth meets from #36 (because I don't think it's Nirka McDuff from #40)? Who are Lilith's parents? What's up with Mr Jupiter? Is he Donna's dad (#35)? Do they ever make use of the possibly haunted mansion and fortune they inherited in #43? Why did Mr Jupiter not bother to make Roy, Wally, and Lilith face their fears (#38)? Does he think redheads have no fears? Are we going to address the fact that Lilith is apparently Juliet reborn (#35-36) and decided to give up Romeo (who she was very enamored by for a while) for Gnarrk?
To be continued~
Some Statistics (For Fun) - Need Updates
Most to least appearances, we have:
Donna (60) - only missing from the very first story before they were coined the Teen Titans
Wally (58) - missing from 3 stories all during Mr Jupiter era (twice unknown reasons and once because he is watching the lab)
Dick (54) - missing from 6 issues for his college
Roy (41)
Garth (37)
Mal (28)
Lilith (22)
Mr Jupiter (12) - not a Titan but I was curious so I counted him
Hank and Don (11)
Karen and Duela (8)
Gnarrk (5)
Gar (4)
Bette and Ch'al (3)
Tula (1)
Most to least trio appearances (within Fab5):
Dick-Wally-Donna (50)
Wally-Donna-Roy (38) - the love triangle lmao
Dick-Donna-Roy (33)
Dick/Donna-Wally-Garth (32)
Dick-Donna-Garth / Dick-Wally-Roy trio (31) - DWDG and DWDR limiting factor
Wally/Donna-Garth-Roy (14) - Roy/Wally-Donna-Mal/Lilith have more than this (25, 23, 19, 18)
Dick-Garth-Roy (13) - Fab5 limiting factor
For quartets, Dick-Wally-Donna-Garth (DWDG) quartet (31) ends up exactly equal to Dick-Wally-Donna-Roy (DWDR) quartet (31).
Special note that because of Lilith separation in Era 3, even though Garth is brought back, the Rebirth "OG" line up (Fab 5 + Lilith) actually only has 3 appearances together. On the other hand, Alt 5 + Dick have 9 appearances (but no Garth). World's Finest line up (Fab5 + Karen) have 7 appearances but only 4 of which Karen is actually Bumblebee and fighting with them, while the Silver Age Final line up (Fab5 + Mal) has the most with 10 appearances.
Ultimately, Lilith does still make more sense to me than Karen to balance the team with more girls, because she definitely was there earlier, had more appearance than Karen, and also doesn't have the additional association of joining because of Mal since she predates Mal. That said, the girl with the most Fab5 teamup might actually be Duela who also has 7 appearances with Fab5, all of which she is on their side (although half their issue was trust which wouldn't make so much sense if she was with them from the beginning). The person with most Fab5 teamup is unquestionably Mal though (10). It's curious to see what is more "valid" but my personal opinion is that there is no point in making a Fab6 just let leave it be and acknowledge it as product of its time.
If you want to have a look at the data out of curiosity, it's here.
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wh-
what do you mean by that
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Yay I finally got time to draw that bride and the ugly ass groom meme :> I love drawing mlp style horses and have been meaning to do this meme for a bit now.
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I'm making this one as two stickers. One for the koala and one for the milkshake so you can put them together!
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What can be done to make the pilot process faster. How much more money do you need until we get the fully formed episode?
To be completely honest we need thousands more and I've been hit by a lot of financial strife lately. Any donation or even just sharing the project around helps immensely.
Our donation pages if people want to support/share. Thank you.
-๐Ÿฐ
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Note: I wasn't sure how to approach the UK, so I will be including England and Scotland separately from each other as both have multiple representations. There is also a United Kingdom Barbie which I will include separately also.
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(Note: Princess of the Renaissance Barbie is canonically from Florence and represents Renaissance Italy.)
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