#Artemis and Persephone are pretty. for example

[aliciavance4228]

I don't like to act like an angry missy right now but why do so many people have to ship Athena with someone?

I can somehow understand shipping her with a female character because:

Many people interpret being a virgin as not having sex with a man and consider that penetration = losing your virginity;

Athena is already believed to have two romantic (though not sexual) relationships with two different women, namely Chariclo and Myrmex.

However, people sometimes really manage to come with the worst pairs ever. Athena + Medusa = LOVE; that's why she helped Perseus to decapitate her and then attached her head to her Aegis. Athena + Arachne = LOVE; that's why she bellitled her so bad to the point where she wanted to kill herself out of shame, or just turned her into a spider directly. Athena + Artemis- You know what, this one is not so bad, actually. I won't criticize this one.

Anyway, but the worst ships ever are those which include her + a male deity.

Athena + Hephaestus; Hephaestus tried to rape her once.

Athena + Poseidon; Besides the fact that they two are already known for deeply hating each other, it is said that Poseidon was the one who suggested Hephaestus to force himself on Athena while he was drunk.

Athena + Zeus; No. Just no. We already have Zeus raping Rhea and Persephone in Orphic Greek Mythology, and trying to rape Aphrodite (in the versions where she is his daughter) as well. We don't need a disturbing SA scene involving them two.

Athena + Ares; It's pretty clear that they two have a common brother/sister rivarly. That's it. That's all.

Athena + Hermes; She's acting like the big sis towards him.

Athena + Apollo; Same as for Athena + Hermes.

Athena + Dionysus; In some myth versions she literally took care of him when he was a baby.

Athena + Hades; Surprised that there are people who actually ship them two, honestly.

The more I see these pairs the more I'm starting to believe that these people cannot understand the fact that there are women who can be happy without a man as well, or that if two people of the opposite gender are getting along it's not necessarily because there's something inherently romantic/sexual in their relationship. They're really acting as if there's something wrong with being asexual or just not interested at all. Furthermore, we already have a lot of goddesses who are not married and sexually active (Aphrodite post-divorce and Demeter are the first examples that come to my mind).

The best theory that I have right now is the Forbidden Fruit Effect. To resume it shorter, the Forbidden Fruit Effect is when someone either craves for something that they clearly cannot have, or can have but with serious consequences. The best example in this case are nuns and how they are presented in an extremely sexual/provocative manner in movies, video games, fanarts etc. Which not only that is disrespectful to religious people, but it's also completely disgusting. You're specifically choosing to sexualize a category of women who made a vow of chastity and clearly expressed their choice of never sleeping with a man.

Athena is one the Three Virgin Goddesses along with Artemis and Hestia in 99,99% of Greek Mythology, so why can't people just respect that and move on?

[yamayuandadu]

In my opinion, instead of constant clamoring for Greek mythology retellings where largely or entirely villainous or monstrous female figures are reinvented as heroic, what we need is more media which acknowledges any goddesses from outside the conventional groupings of “main” Olympians (which is something variable, the version of the dodecatheon from Olympia had the personified river Alpheios and the  Charites in it , but that’s beside the point). Multiple of them actually have well defined, more or less consistent characters in myths and it’s mind-boggling that they are losing the quest for popcultural relevance with “what if Medusa was the central protagonist of Greek mythology” text posts. Off the top of my head, some good examples of such goddesses would be:

Hecate, who despite being portrayed firmly positively in her two main mythical roles, in the Homeric Hymn Demeter (where she helps Demeter look for Persephone and is later tasked with escorting her on her annual journey) and in the Theogony (where she aids Zeus and co. during the titanomachy), only ever appears as a villain in modern media, often with the point of reference being godawful new age literature or worse. The only two works of media which actually try to do something broadly accurate to her character in myths would be Theia Mania and, of all things, Touhou.

Selene, who basically doesn’t exist as a separate character in modern media because her gimmick has been reassigned to Artemis. To be fair, it’s been this way for centuries, but she actually has a plenty to offer if treated as separate. She has a very distinct iconography (lunar crescent behind the shoulders looks so cool), and at least according to Seneca a very warm relationship with her brother (in his Phaedra he fills in for her every now and then so that she can spend time with Endymion). There’s also a bonkers addition to the Labors of Heracles where she’s credited with raising Nemean Lion from the moon.

Iris, who acts as a messenger of the gods (or specifically Hera) pretty often, including during the titanomachy. She also has a unique genealogy, and an “evil twin”, Arke, who acted as the messenger for the titans and to my knowledge plays no other role anywhere otherwise. One of the only references to offerings made to Iris mentions cheesecake which one surely could turn into a personality quirk if the actual literary texts are not enough, too.

Eos, dawn, the OTHER sister of Helios, who persistently appears in myths indicating she was the one female deity sort of trying to keep up with male gods in the “romancing mortals” department. One of her lovers turned into a cicada because she forgot to ask for eternal youth when asking for eternal life for him which feels like it came out of a modern parody.

Styx, who I think basically is entirely forgotten as a personified deity in modern fiction, despite being portrayed as one of Zeus’ key allies in the Theogony, and as the mother of his various minor courtiers. You’d think a character as edgy as the personification of the arguably most famous location in the underworld would not be entirely absent from mythology adaptations but alas, she basically is. 

I would also like Thetis to not be portrayed as antagonistic in media, both of her highest profile adaptations in recent years essentially are. Thetis is the best character in the Iliad and I’d like to see an adaptation which actually keeps the scene where she brings Briareus to Olympus, but it feels like Iliad adaptations are often ashamed of having gods in there.

If you want to dig deeper, there are oddities like Malis/Maliya, a craftsmanship(?) goddess from Lydia and Lycia treated as analogous to Athena back at home, but seemingly as a river nymph in Greece (I worked on her wiki page recently).

[genericpuff]

The confirm timeline makes everything  and makes Demeter a lot more sympathetic to see her daughter do something so stupid 

oh man seeing the confirmed timeline back when it was still being updated thru S2 was when the cracks started to form for me because I couldn't fucking BELIEVE the first season took place over the course of a week. It's weird because on the one hand it tries to imply that time has passed (like with Persephone's grades slipping) but on the other it keeps writing the story event to event, often consequentially (as in, Event C happens because of Event B, which happens because of Event A) so like, the conclusions these timelines come to are pretty simple in and of themselves - these events often all happen in one day and couldn't have been separated by weeks.

For example, on March 15th, Persephone reveals to Eros that she was SA'd. She stays the night at his place so she can have a safe space away from home where Apollo often comes and goes. That's something that would reasonably lead into March 16th's events which are also all pretty condensed because it's when Minthe slaps Hades which happens the day after she stands him up. And then Hades ends up at Hera's place where Persephone also shows up for inexplicably no reason. Of course, Hades and Persephone both aren't home at this time, so it makes for the perfect opportunity for Thanatos to break in to both her room and Hades' office. And that turns into the Hades and Apollo argument after Hades drives Persephone home.

So there's no way the order of these events are being 'mistaken' for a shorter timeline, because every event interlinks so seamlessly. It undoubtedly works for people reading week to week when there's real life time passing in between each episode to give you the illusion of time passing in the comic, but when you really take these events and lay them out end to end in their most sensible order, it's ridiculous how little time has passed. It's why I laugh when people tell me LO is "better binged", like no it fucking isn't, it's worse because when you binge it, you realize just how little time is passing and how much Rachel covers every minute detail of every hour of every day.

A more recent example? Hades and Persephone are already engaged 4 days after Persephone said she wanted to take it slow.

Don't believe me? Hold on tight, because this is about to get dicey.

Day 1 (Ep 207-208) - Hades and Persephone are tended to by their friends/relatives following the battle with Kronos. Persephone has her punishment lifted by Zeus, Zeus and Hades make up. P x H have their "taking it slow" conversation and decide to be boyfriend/girlfriend. As Persephone curls up in bed with Hades, she feels like she's "forgetting something" (i.e. Demeter).

Day 2 (Ep 209-214) - Hades wakes up from a nightmare, which includes hints as to what happened to Thanatos while Hades was being possessed, leading into the start of the next day with Persephone comforting him. They get to work "fixing" the Underworld by doing a Steven Universe dance. During this time, Demeter is looking for her daughter and finds out from Artemis she's in the Underworld, so she decides to go find her. We get the flashback sequence showing Demeter's backstory with Hades and why she was never made Queen of the Mortal Realm. Meanwhile, Hades and Persephone are checking out "Elysium" (which just seems to be a few trees and a river in the Underworld lmao) and start splashing around in the river. Demeter intervenes right as they're returning from their outdoor excursion, still dripping with river water. Persephone and Demeter reunite while Hades talks to the dog but it's a short-lived conversation as she refuses to go back to the Mortal Realm with Demeter claiming she "seems to still be in love". Persephone sends Demeter on her way, who's spotted by Minthe and a few other nymphs. Minthe claims she "has something to do" and walks off, with the heavy implication she's about to approach Demeter. This leads into the Minthe flashbacks depicting her backstory with her own mother and showing what happened to her after her plant curse was lifted. The day she tried to get back to the Underworld, she finds a lost child who she returns to nymph preschool, where Minthe ends up getting a job as a substitute. Right after that, she's summoned to a conversation with Persephone, who reveals to her that the realms are cut off and she's been a plant for three years. Back in present day, Minthe ends up in a conversation with Thetis (who's now married and the mother of a baby Achilles) where she effectively tells Thetis to fuck off. Minthe continues forward, making it to her real destination, which is her job teaching nymphs life skills like making a resume (effectively making the Demeter cliffhanger pointless clickbait). Day 3 (Ep 214-223) - Hades is preparing breakfast (literally a single donut) for Persephone, during which he thinks back to the conversation with Demeter where Demeter asked Hades how he could let her make the deal with Erebus (this goes nowhere). Hades insists Persephone should take the day off. Hades meets with Hecate, revealing to her that he's ashamed his realm is in such bad shape for Persephone. Hades wants to speak with Kronos, but Hecate convinces Hades it would be a bad idea to go down today. Instead, they opt to speculate on how he could have returned, and decide the only person who would know what happened is Hypnos.

Thus begins the most pointless fetch quest in all of LO *deep breath*:

Hades and Hecate have no idea where to find Hypnos, so they decide to go seek his brother Thanatos for help, but Thanatos doesn't want to talk to Hades because Hades treated him like shit and fired him; despite this, Daphne lets Hades in anyways where Hades and Than have a shitty 'make up' conversation that solves nothing between them; we also get flashbacks of what happened between Than and Daphne during the time skip; Hades finally asks Than where they can find Hypnos; they pick up boba tea for Daphne and then drop her off; Thanatos guides Hades to Hypnos' location which was under his nose the entire time, in the HR department of the Underworld Corp; they find Hypnos, who reveals how Kronos was able to take advantage of his powers; Hecate takes Morpheus under her wing as an apprentice of sorts; Hypnos reveals that Kronos has taken a child captive; despite saying they weren't going to talk to Kronos today, Hades and Hecate head down to Tartarus to speak to Kronos, but they can't access it because Kronos has the doors locked and won't open them for anyone but "his Golden Traitor" (implying Hera). This whole fetch quest ends up being useless btw when we find out later that Kronos has been able to talk to Hera the entire time.

*heavy breathing*

Anyways, while all this is going on, Persephone is in Olympus, enjoying her day off, when she's intercepted by Daphne (remember, she had been dropped off by Hades/Hecate/Than!) who's met up with Eros; Persephone reveals she and Hades haven't "done it yet", Eros reveals that he's married with kids now and has to run off to tend to them; Daphne and Persephone leave the restaurant, where they spot a presidential campaign ad featuring Apollo; Persephone and Daphne go to the bank where Persephone runs into her old classmate Tori and acts like a huge Karen to him just because he gossiped about her once 10 years ago; she finds out through Tori (as he works at the bank) that she has an account that's accrued a shitload of money which allows her to buy an apartment that same day, we KNOW it's the same day because it cuts to Hades who's thinking about everything that went down and wondering how he's gonna tell Persephone; he meets her at her new apartment where they proceed to have Chinese (???) takeout. Hades talks a little about how things went but doesn't go into detail, he doesn't tell her about the child deity. We suddenly transition to Persephone at Hades' house where Persphone's packing up her things to take to her new apartment. They end up having the sex conversation, spurred on by Eros/Daphne questioning her about it earlier. Ares shows up that night drunk and looking for Persephone. Hades goes out to comfort him while Persephone stays behind in the bedroom. It's revealed that Aphrodite has left Ares. Hades finds Persephone in his personal theater, where they proceed to watch a movie from 1920's post-WWI Germany and it's heavily implied they have sex during this (*they do not). Ares texts Aphrodite, who's in bed with Hephaestus.

Day 4 (Ep 224 onwards) - The next day starts with Aphrodite/Ares/Heph flashbacks revealing why Aphrodite left Ares, and with a "first meeting" between Heph and Aphrodite. Back to present day, Aphrodite blocks Ares on her phone and meets up with Psyche for coffee. Persephone and Hades are getting ready to leave for work when they find a note left by Ares, which we later find out is urging Persephone to meet up with him to talk about her fertility goddess powers. More Heph / Aphrodite flashbacks. Hades finally mentions the child deity to Persephone. Hera shows up at Hades' work where they proceed to info dump the Kronos/child deity stuff on her. Persephone gets jealous of Hades calling her 'Bunny'. Hera wants to plan Persephone's coronation. Persephone decides she'll be the one to talk to Demeter about her coronation. Hera leaves, this is where it's revealed Kronos has been living in her head for an undisclosed amount of time. Psyche and Hephaestus speak in private, where Psyche reveals she's stolen a pen drive off Apollo for Hephaestus to investigate. Kassandra is revealed. We get some Psyche flashbacks showing how Psyche became a goddess for the purpose of spying on Apollo on Zeus' behalf. Heph gets Psyche to track down Kassandra through Eros/Aphrodite. Cut back to Hades, who's on his own (while Persephone is spending her first night at her new apartment) and is trying to create an engagement ring for Persephone, while reminiscing on their conversation the night before about "the hegemony of virginity". He's summoned by Persephone, who immediately bursts into tears about how upset she is that she got jealous of Hera (not that Hades called her Bunny lmao). This happens in the same day because Persephone says "I got jealous today." More TherapySpeak where Hades makes it all about him. Persephone reveals she's going to meet up with Ares, so Hades decides to accompany her in moth form. Persephone goes to the Mortal Realm to meet with Ares where, according to him, it's "after evening" (w/e the fuck that is, it doesn't look like night time though). This meeting is also counting as her obligatory "date" with him. Ares shows her an old temple with statues in it depicting the fertility goddesses. Ares is barely able to give her any extra info on it that Hades couldn't have already told her. Persephone touches the depiction of Metis and is immediately Avatar'd into the nth dimension where she meets with Metis. Metis tells her about Gaia and how fertility goddesses are a part of the Ouranos lineage. Persephone wakes up from her Avatar state (it's actually visibly night at this point) to find Ares has ditched her. Hades reminds her that she had a visit with Demeter already planned and shouldn't forget it. Demeter sabotages their visit with the whole TGOEM purity club intervention, during which she cages Hades. Hestia lets Hades free, and he immediately proposes to Persephone. Hades takes her away to the Underworld.

WOW that was a lot. But my god, I do not blame the creators of that timeline in the slightest for calling it quits (from the looks of it, they haven't updated it since Season 2). It's absolutely insane how crazy the timeline is. I'm almost half-tempted to finish what these folks started, especially if they stopped due to some kind of divine intervention from Rachel (tinfoil hat theory, but it wouldn't be the first time Rachel's sabotaged a fan project).

This only covers the Free episodes of course, but SPOILER Hades and Persephone end up having to get married literally the next day due to an embargo Demeter's placed on them under the rules of xenia (according to Zeus).

So. Yeah. They've been officially together for 4 days and got married on the 5th.

Peak romance fiction, y'all. They totally got back at the haters who said they were rushing shit.

[stagkingswife]

Hey there! I hope you're well today!

I was wondering if you have any tips on doing divination with a spirit for the first time. There's a spirit I'd like to reach out to whom I have not met before outside of dreams. I want to know if you have any suggestions on how I can prepare for a divination reading with an unfamiliar spirit, mostly in regards to protections and boundaries. This is my first time interacting with a spirit so I'd like to be prepared!

Also do you think the spirit would take offense if I asked a deity to be present for protection? I rely heavily on my deities in my practice and trust them strongly, but I don't want to potentially offend the spirit or make them feel like I don't trust them.

Thank you if you choose to answer and no worries if not. Hope you have a good day! :)

I know I took a while to get to this, so I hope I'm not too late for this advise to be helpful to you Anon, or if I missed the window with you, maybe this will helpful to someone else. I, personally, do not recommend involving a 3rd party in a first meeting with an unfamiliar entity unless you know for sure what the relationship between those two parties is. For example, if you are meeting Apollo for the first time and want to involve Artemis, that's probably safe. But if there's no lore to suggest that these two entities have a amicable relationship, or if the lore might be open to interpretation or depend on which aspect meets with which (Hades and Persephone, or Zeus and Hera, for example), I always opt or caution and approach the new entity on my own. The Otherworlds are vast and complex, you never know who has beef with who, and you don't want to upset anyone. (It is perfectly possible to work with two entities who dislike each other, you just need to balance it.)

The egos and personalities of spirits aside there is a lot that you can do in terms of protections to set yourself up for success on a first meeting. I always like to present myself to the entity as competent, but not scared or aggressive, which is a fine line to walk. I also like to approach them with trust, like I am expecting the best from our first encounter. For me that means that I leave my carefully warded home, as a sign of trust. (Because I live in an apartment, this just means that I go outside into the courtyard). I come equipped with reactive shields that will trigger on certain conditions that I have programed into them but I am otherwise unwarded until something triggers that shield. Some example conditions I build into my shields are "if the entity tries to hurt me physically" or "if the entity tries to make an attack on my Otherworldly form". I don't personally include emotional attacks such as intimation and fear, because I usually see those as posturing that I can respond to with my own communication and presence. I can also trigger the shields with a command word if I feel unsafe. If you want to involve your deity in your protection I would involve them in the building of a shield like this. It would give you the piece of mind of having them involved, having your back so to speak, but not actually present so there's no potential politics to worry about. I know engaging with an unfamiliar spirit with only reactive ward might not be everyone's cup of tea, it's just what works for me. So if you wanted to layer your protects you could also do that. Think of you baseline boundaries vs your break glass in case of emergency conditions - and then build a sustained ward, maybe on an enchanted piece of jewelry, for the baseline and the reactive shield is your emergency response. I can't really lay out for you what your baseline boundaries should be, they're different for everyone, and I admit to having a pretty high tolerance for spooky spirit nonsense. If you've warded you home and set up "house rules" that would be a great place to draw inspiration from! If you have specifics that you want to brainstorm, assume I'm not answering this too late and you don't mind coming off anon feel free to DM me and I'm happy to be a sounding board for specific boundaries for you.

[winns-stuff]

LO APPRECIATION:

Okay, to get my mind off of the sick shit that I keep realizing about Hades and Persephone’s relationship I’ve decided to come back to these. This character, luckily didn’t get as much hate as Leuce did but there were still some haters presence like all characters who aren’t brainwashed into thinking Hades and Persephone are great, didn’t deserve the cold shoulder that some people gave him because he’s just too majestic and wonderful to even be discussed in a negative way. But let me stop stalling so we can talk about and admire one of my many favorite characters, the lovely and breathtaking Hypnos.

Yes, yes everyone clap he’s great I swear. Honestly when we first saw him I loved his sense of humor, he’s such a character and it’s refreshing seeing other characters actually speak their true opinions and be so outspoken. I missed that cause we haven’t gotten a call out like that since Artemis and Zeus, I’m not sure if we’ll see them too much going forward. I just absolutely love laughing at everything he said to Hades cause it was genuinely funny to me, I haven’t had a good decent laugh like that in this series so it was nice that Hypnos gave me my first.

Next I wanna talk about his design cause I enjoyed it enough. I wish that there was something different about it and yes, I know that he’s supposed to be Thanatos’ twin but I also wish there was something about him that makes him stand out from Thanatos. Like you can be twins but there has to be some sort of distinction between you so that people can tell who’s speaking and who’s being shown like for example it could be in clothes, shoes, favorite colors, accessories, music taste, etc. But anyways, besides that I actually liked the design for what it was I thought he looked really graceful and elegant but he also just exudes calmness. Which is pretty neat because he’s the god of sleep so that’s really in character for him.

Also I loved his hair, something about this very long flowy wavy effect he has going on is really selling it for me. I enjoy looking at it because it just looks so cool, like his hair is floating almost. Just like Thanatos I love this sort of color pallet where the grey and blue of their skin is contrasting with the white of their hair. It’s so pretty to me.

Anyways, that’s the end of this appreciation for now but best believe I’ll waiting and losing sleep until I get to see him again. Hopefully we will but who knows, he could’ve only been used for the Kronos investigation which would really crush me. He has a lot of potential and I really wanna see the tension between him and Hades, I mean there’s gotta be some more animosity between them since Hades’ mistreatment of his brother. I feel like it would really muster up an honest apology from Hades that doesn’t involve making the whole conversation about him, something about Hypnos tells me he won’t stand for that happening again. Also speaking of Hypnos calling him out, I hated that everyone got mad at him for that it was true after Persephone got banished he crumbled and neglected his responsibilities as a king and allowed his whole realm to be completely in shambles. At some point he’s got to take responsibility because he really did neglect them and only thought about her, I get missing someone but you were a king before you knew Persephone even existed so you can definitely continue to be king without her, you’ve been doing it for this long grow up please you have a kingdom to run first you can get into the bed of a forever 19 year old later.

[nonne-est-luna-pulchra]

Just warning everybody now

I do read webtoons for fun and i might enjoy some of them that are considered problematic and bad, doesn't mean I support the creator, just means I enjoy the plot.

If i don't enjoy the plot then I just don't read it 🤷

For example, from my knowledge people really don't like Lore Olimpus because of the age gap between Persephone and Hades, also the way they made Apollo a villan and i've heard someone say it has only one body type. For me the age gap is literally in the miths and the miths are....ya know, pretty bad. With Apollo, someone had to be the villan and who else should be given an affair other than a son of Zeus? (I love that it's also a conflict for Artemis had with supporting her brother or her best friend with the little information she was provided with). And I have to disagree with the one body type thing, even tho there aren't many bodyinclusive comics anyway and noone seems to care for that. I'm all for them, don't get me wrong! Like the series "Cristal City Killers" or "Chainlinked". I love them and am supper happy diferent body types are getting included but I think you should draw what you want to and feel like drawing and haveing one type of body in your comic isn't a crime even if it isn't necessary realistic.

Another example. Boyfriends. I've read the whole series because I enjoy the art style and was in need of a cheesy romance. I enjoyed it at the moment but after educating myself on the creator and realising some of the characters are annoying or even offensive towards LGBT+ people, my "love" for it died down and I might even skip reading it if it gets another season.

TLDR: I read webtoons, even if some are problematic cuz I don't need to agree with the creator and if the series itself is shit, it's a skip

[nysus-temple]

I'd like to request an opinion-based essay.

I saw the post about how you can picture the gods however you want. I'd like to know what you think of my theory:

How you picture the gods is usually influenced by your own appearance, idea of beauty, culture, and environment. For example, I am white, so most of my deities appear white to me because that is the skin I am most familiar with. My idea of beauty is rooted in the American idea of beauty because I'm American, and so on.

I'd genuinely like to know what you think!!!

I hope you have a good day

Greetings, hope you have a good day as well ! <3

Your theory is not that wrong, honestly. I can even give it several points in his favor, however, I feel that it falters in more things.

Let's see, it makes sense to see them from your own ideal of beauty, after all, it is how the Greeks themselves saw them back then. They had a canon ( depending on the moment, established by a different sculptor ) different from that of other cultures, hence, for example, when they saw the group of Egyptian deities, they thought they were their own gods… But wrongly done. I mean, it's funny to think about it.

They represented their deities like they themselves were, with all their faults, even ( the gods were not immune to fate, they can be seen having regrets ) and even if they turned into animals, they had nothing to do with the Egyptians and hence they thought of them that way. It's not even THAT weird to imagine when you know most ( if not all ) cultures just saw the same things with their own interpretation based on their enviornment.

· ) Examples ( ·

The Sun and Moon in Greek Myths are portrayed as a god and a goddess, but in Norse Myths ( correct me if i'm wrong, i haven't done much research about Norse Mythology ) they're the other way around, the Sun was portrayed as a goddess and the Moon as a god. In the Aztect culture, they went more far away and legit said the Sun and the Moon were in a constant fight, and that's why they were moving all the time, instead of riding around in chariots like Helios and Selene did. Points for being creative, if i'm being honest !

· ) Examples ( ·

Now, yes, we can have the belief, as you say, that the gods presented themselves in different ways depending on the person ( example: Athena transforming into an acquaintance of Telemachus to make him go out in search of news of Odysseus ) but it is not usually their "general appearance" with which they represented said gods.

The Greeks represented their Greek gods as them.

Although I personally don't think it's all that bad to see the figures of the gods as we want, I do prefer something safer and even respectable for, in this case, the Greeks.

I am not myself a Greek, I am a xenoi, as one could say, and when imagining the gods I usually look for representations of their moment or as similar as those times as possible.

For example, since this blog is mainly about Dionysus… Normally I have seen him with a young appearance, long and tousled hair and of course with waves.

( One of my favourite Dionysus' sculptures of all time, but not a Greek one tho, thanks i'm aware ) the reason why i see him this way is since i have preference for Euripides' design for him, how he describes him in The Bacchae. It's my favourite work and my favourite tragedy author, so it's obvious that i'm gonna prefer his interpretation than, let's say, Hesiod's.

BUT take as another example, someone who sees Dionysus with a beard, and more old-like.

It would be fine as well !

Neither one is more correct than the other, both are totally valid.

Now, about the skin tone... Well, Greeks nowadays consider themselves "white", technically, but you see, skin is faaar more than just "black and white", so we really shouldn't listen to people complaining about Greeks making Greek gods white.

You see, i would tell you that there was no problem seeing the gods with your standards as an American, since as i said, the gods may manifest in many forms. However, in this current day, i would say it's better to give them at least one little piece of detail that reminds you of how they were represented back then.

Mainly due to ( not in your case, but many others ) appropiating of these gods, that are from a culture that isn't theirs.

I say the same with the rest, let's say, Egyptian gods, Hindu, Norse, and so on. Usually it's better to view them based on the culture they're from. If i want to, for example, make art related to the Hindu deities, i'll probably look around representations that the people who originated with said culture made.

i think it's fine to view some figure details how you want and are most familiar with, but it's better to make research in order to honour the culture you're interested in with all the accuracies and respect possible.

Let's say, Apollo is most of the times described as blonde, but if you wanna see him with black hair, i mean, sure, go ahead, why not. But it wouldn't be very nice of anyone to "score a Percy Jackson" as i like to call it now and say stuff like "the Greek gods are in America because their power is stronger here" or whatever the hell the book said i don't remember neither do i care.

In the end, the best way to view the Greek gods, is looking for Greek sources. You may prefer one interpretation than other, but it does not matter what it is for, it is best to research at least for the bases.

[moonrose-mortem]

Since everyone is loving my TOH analysis posts, I think it's time to do one for the best girl witch: Willow Park.💚

✨From the start she became my favorite, everything except the hair color and ears, she looked like me when I was a kid. We even have similar personalities and a love for plants. When we are introduced to her she was sweet and shy, as well as showing kindness to the smallest flower that she stepped on. And when she got mad after Amity bullied her I'm not going to lie I had an "oh shit" moment that later on had me thinking that she was going to be a strong ally for Luz someday. Characters in anime and cartoons that show that level of power early on are usually going to be an important one, villain or hero. Like nature, Willow is a force to be reckoned with. Her own namesake resonates with the same power willow trees have had for thousands of years.🌿

🔮From my own studying of magic and witchcraft for years, I looked up anything and everything magical about my favorite trees and plants, and even before that I liked willow trees (kid me thought they were pretty because they "had hair" and I loved Grandmother Willow from the movie "Pocahontas".) Willow trees have long been associated with witches, ghosts, the moon, water, magic, music, love, and goddesses like Hecate, Persephone, Demeter, Artemis and Cerridwen. So when the episode "Hootys Moving Hassle" came out and they did the moonlight conjuring, I knew it wasn't a coincidence. It is also a tree that stands for healing of emotional wounds and the heart. 💚

🌱Willow has shown time and again that the process of healing from past wounds isn't steady, but the results are worth it. From there she found out her own strength and goals that she went for. It's also important to not forget the bad as much as the fond memories we have. (I almost forgot that Willow loved books as much as Amity as well as being covered in band aids all the time. Great episode to rewatch again.)🍄

🐝On to her palismen: Clover. I thought this was the perfect creature for Willow being both a pollinator and a fierce little buggy. Bees also have been considered sacred to goddesses of nature, Rhea, Freya, and Aphrodite, and is a symbol of the feminine energy. "Tender yet tenacious" is the best description the Bat Queen gave for both Willow and Clover. Bees are also an animal that symbolizes hard work, reaching for your goals and dreams, strength, unity, and most importantly family and community. Bees are a reminder to enjoy the sweetness of life and rhythms of nature.☀️

Her goal as a witch was "to be strong and wise to protect her loved ones and that if anyone gets in her way they feel the sting of defeat." Willow Park is the definition of strong and sweet, a great example that you can balance a female characters' best qualities. I'm so excited to see where Dana Terrace takes this character for the finale. Of course, I am excited for the possibility of her and Hunter. And yet most have forgotten that she is a great character outside of getting shipped with characters like her former bullies(really?) If anything her relationship with Hunter is meant to enhance her character and not overshadow it. Future analysis of their relationship will be made so I look forward to writing that.😊

[teawiththegods]

challenge/game time!!

give a fun fact/random little thing you’ve noticed about each of your deities (or whoever you really feel like doing this for)

some examples would be:

on the occasion i attempt to drink bitter/especially strong coffee (and fail, mind you) hermes laughs and calls me a wimp as i fill my cup with cream and sugar

apollo’s hair length varies for me, sometimes it’s about shoulder length (or shorter) and others it’s long (think waist length)

whenever i envision hypnos in modern clothes, i’ll see him in comfy sweats and hair tied up (half up/half down)

for me, hades has long black hair and dark eyes (his hair is usually down, haven’t seen him with any particular style just yet)

Ooooo this is fun!!

Aphrodite is pretty much always naked when she shows up. I don't think i've ever seen her with clothes on. I'm of course not complaining

Apollo always has his hair up in elaborate pretty styles. Lately he has cute little space buns with two loose strands framing his face.

Artemis doesn't like being indoors often, which is why she insists I sit outside on my lunch break. Its also why shes not around as much as some of the other gods. She gets very antsy.

Hermes secretly (or maybe not so secretly) is actually the most sensitive out of all the gods in my experience.

Eris doesn't talk much, but her face tells you all you need to know. Also she likes to wrap her wings around me when she's feeling protective of me and I really like that.

Demeter really is the ultimate mom! Like she would be that mom at Pride adopting all the queer kids who don't have supportive parents and then she'd go punch those parents in the face.

Persephone in the Spring/Summer is very different from Persephone in the Autumn/Winter. Tho I have more experience with Queen Persephone, I'm curious if now that I'm spending time with Demeter if I'll get more experience with Kore.

Athena has a great sense of humor although its usually at the expense of her siblings...mostly Ares. Also Athena and Artemis have this weird competitive relationship, idk if anyone else gets that vibe. But whenever they're in the room together they just glare at each other like they wanna arm wrestle or something. Maybe its because they're lesbians.

Zeus has such a BOOMING laugh! Its kind of like thunder but a lot more comforting and warm.

Hestia is so darn cute! She has the sweetest softest voice and she always goes "Yay!" cutely whenever I finish my chores! xD

The few times I got to hang out with Ares i noticed that he doesn't shut up! lol! Like seriously. He has ongoing commentary for EVERYTHING! I even cross referenced this with @theoi-crow and he concurred that Ares does indeed not shut up for anything! (Except maybe Aphrodite xD). Also he's best friends with Artemis.

[the-ghost-king]

wait Apollo isn’t originally greek? thats so interesting 👀👀

Where ever did you hear that? /ij

Definitely putting all of this under a read more, it’s a long one!

Cw: Greek statues, they're naked :/

But yeah, Apollo was actually an inherited god, it’s likely that because of this as well he was a blending of multiple different gods to some extent. It’s also good to note that Apollo’s name is unknown, meaning that nobody really knows what exactly Apollo means, which is pretty weird all things considered about the Greeks who placed such importance on the god’s forenames (ie, phoebeus, acestor, age’tor, etc). 

"Though Apollo was the most Hellenic of all gods, he derived mostly from a type of god that originated in Anatolia and spread to Egypt by way of Syria and Palestine." (X)

There’s a couple of different things which point to Apollo being a Anatolian god (or being of, coming from him) named Appaliunas, and it is said they were on opposite sides of a war most beloved of their people during the fight. It’s important to note that it’s believed Appaliunas means “father light” and that he shows some level of importance over drafting peace treaties (which Apollo has some reputation in as the bringer of civilized order). We don't know too much about their connections however, because the documents are incomplete.

This theory also makes sense, because the name Leto (Apollo’s mother) is Lydian in origin, and there’s decent connections to her having been worshiped on the coast's of Asia Minor. And it is known the Greeks have adopted Anatolian gods into their religion before, see Cybele (sometimes called Cybele-Rhea), and the origin of Kore (later Persephone). There's stuff which points also to an Anatolian goddess called "Artimu" (Artemis) who is often confused to Cybele for some reason, and again this bears connections to the Lydians which worshipped Leto. There's information which points to Hekate being a goddess from Anatolia as well, which shows significance considering she is Apollo and Artemis's cousin (leading to my personal question of was Phoebe Anatolian in origin?). Apollo's divine number being 7 shows Babylonian or at least Mesopotamian Origin.

The Geographical location of these two places also bears similarities, they are close to one another, and it's known the Greeks had decent travel capabilities over water. There's also the fact that both of these lands border Troy, which is shown to have significant values in Greek culture and mythology, as well as the Greek belief that the Anatolian gods were present at Troy as well as the Greek gods.

(It's also notable the similarities in naming traditions, Alaksandu for one such example, does not sound too far off from the later Latin name Alexander, which came from the Greek name Aléxandros).

The other possible origin given for Apollo is Aplu (Apulu), a Hurrian god (of people who lived in Anatolia, Syria, and Northern Mesopotamia). Aplu and Apollo bear semblance to one another in more than name, Aplu was the god of plague (bringer of the plague more specifically) and he bears a large amount of resemblance to Apollo Parno'pius/Smitheus and Aplu's main story provides reasoning as to why Apollo may also be the god of healing and Medicine.

The story of Aplu involves the idea that the individual which brings the plague, must also be the one to banish it. This makes Aplu both bringer of plague(s) but also, protector from plague(s). From this we learn Aplu's name means "son of" (please note here Apollo's iconographic connections to "youth" and "sonship" among the Greeks, as the god of kouros), but the connection of "the son of" was a title granted also to the god Nergal (worshiped by many different people(s) across Mesopotamia) who is at least in part someone who holds power over the sun, and holds connection to Shamash (Utu).

Aplu is also often depicted naked (ya know) but wearing a laurel leaf, and part of a cloak... It's funny how these images are Apollo though:

Aplu is also symbolized by a staff and laurel a twig(s), while we know Apollo to be associated closely with the laurel because of Daphne, and Apollo having iconography related to staffs involves him giving his away to Hermes- which perhaps has to do with the caduceus being interpreted as the symbol for medicine, or the connection of Apollo to Asclepius and the rod of Asclepius.

Aplu isn't isolated necessarily either, there is also the Etruscan goddess Aritimi (Artume, Artames, or Artumes) and she oversees animals, human assemblies, and is considered a hunting deity. As well as scrolling through this list, you'll note more than one Greek/Roman mythological figure.

There's also a ton of stuff from Etruscan mythology (Hurrian mythology is just a subsect of Etruscan mythology) which overlaps with Greek mythology, some sources even state Etruscan -> Greek -> Roman mythology (I wont comment on that because I don't know well enough).

There's some other places Apollo's name might have come from, but those are probably the two most likely under the assumption that Apollo is a collective of many gods.

These are the specifics of the Anatolian god's Apollo may be born of/from, but there's a variety of things which point to him and mythology around him being of other origins as well (Minoan, Dorian, and Proto-Indo-European... yeah)

You may have heard one of Apollo's sacred animals is dolphins, Apollo Delphinios/Delphidios, this is because of a Minoan god named Paiawon (Paion) who was worshiped on Crete and also originated in Delphi. In the second part of Homeric hymn to Apollo, Apollo would transform his shape into that of a dolphin and carry the new priests to Delphi for the transfer of religious practices:

"Phoebus Apollo pondered in his heart what men he should bring in to be his ministers in sacrifice and to serve him in rocky Pytho. And while he considered this, he became aware of a swift ship upon the wine-like sea in which were many men and goodly, Cretans... Phoebus Apollo met them: in the open sea he sprang upon their swift ship, like a dolphin in shape, and lay there, a great and awesome monster, and none of them gave heed so as to understand but they sought to cast the dolphin overboard. But he kept shaking the black ship every way and making the timbers quiver. So they sat silent in their craft for fear, and... so they kept sailing on; for a rushing south wind hurried on the swift ship from behind... They wished to put their ship to shore, and land and comprehend the great marvel and see with their eyes whether the [dolphin] would remain upon the deck of the hollow ship, or spring back into the briny deep where fishes shoal. But the well-built ship would not obey the helm, but went on its way all along Peloponnesus and the lord, far-working Apollo, guided it easily with the breath of the breeze..." (X)

Apollo Delphinios was largely only worshiped by people of Crete and surrounding islands, but this is also largely where Paiawon was worshiped as well. There's also many things from early Grecian history which simply state Apollo to be Paiawon or of Paiawon, or at least doesn't bother to specify which god is being talked about.

In the earlier parts of Greek history, seventh-sixth century, there was distinctions made between the pair:

"and in Solon's opinion it is Apollo who makes a man a μάντις (soothsayer) but healers do the work of Paion" (X)

The whole thing with Apollo being descended from Paiawon however, is that Paiawon may not be Minoan but Mycenaean in origin, which means even if Apollo is originated in Minoan culture one of the gods who has influenced that origin wasn't even necessarily Minoan but taken in. Others believe Paiawon was Minoan or Aegean in origin but very far in the past, since his songs used a meter of pre-Greek origin.

You'll also not the commonalities between Paion (a spelling of Paiawon) and Paean (also spelled Paian), Apollo's original name according to Homer. It could mean a variety of things but "who heals illnesses through magic" and "pre-greek" are the most common translations of the word Paean, but it is also associated with music (most specifically a song sung by Thetlas who cured the Spartans) and is said to denote hymns for Apollo.

"PAEAN, that is, "the healing," is according to Homer the designation of the physician of the Olympian gods, who heals, for example, the wounded Ares and Hades. After the time of Homer and Hesiod, the word Paian becomes a surname of Asclepius, the god who had the power of healing. The name was, however, used also in the more general sense of deliverer from any evil or calamity, and was thus applied to Apollo and Thanatos, or Death, who are conceived as delivering men from the pains and sorrows of life... From Apollo himself the name Paean was transferred to the song dedicated to him, that is, to hymns chanted to Apollo for the purpose of averting an evil, and to warlike songs, which were sung before or during a battle." (X)

In regards to the possibility of Apollo having been of Minoan origin, one must consider not only his origins but the origins of the gods and goddesses around him and how they may have developed over time.

In this case Britomartis (Diktynna) is of particular interest, she was the Minoan "mistress of animals", she was a goddess (or sometimes nymph, or oread) of the mountains and the hunt. There's points to the name meaning "sweet maiden" or other similar things, but it is debatable.

Eventually Britomartis would become the goddess of nets in Hellenic myths, and would simply be closely identified with the goddess of Artemis. However, to the Minoans Britomartis wandered alongside a bow-wielding male hunter who's name has been lost, it is likely that aspects of this hunter were absorbed into Apollo; when the introduction of worshiping Artemis was brought to the island of Crete where Britomartis was also worshiped they were compared and quickly said to be of one another.

It is also said in some variations the myths of Britomartis that she was taken to the mainland in the nets of men after fleeing Minos, this seems like a euphemism for her as a goddess of worship being brought by fisherman to mainland and taken into their culture and worship, more so than it sounds like a goddess's story. Perhaps this led to her becoming Artemis, although most myths seem to agree Artemis gave Britomartis immortality... So who knows, but it's a point of particular interest for me.

Also I know I mentioned proto-indo-european origins for Apollo and I could analyze gods and goddesses relating to Apollo being a Minoan god like Aphaea, but I am not going to lie I am rather sick mostly of sourcing everything and I don't like to talk about stuff without stuff to back me up because I don't want to come across like I'm pulling information or ideas out of thin air because that's how misinformation spreads... But yeah, here's a somewhat simplified piece on Apollo's possible origins as a pre-Hellenistic god, and I hope you enjoy because I know you sent the ask a bit ago <3

[spirits-child]

Types of Theoi

Good morning pals! (or whatever hour is there) So, i saw this post that is basically everything a baby hellenic polytheist should know and now im just going to do part of the research for you- But please remember we should all do our own research so read and research. (Also feel free to correct me if I did any mistake)

Primordial gods (Protogenoi) The first born gods and goddesses who were formed by fabric and components of the universe. 

Some examples: Uranus, Gaia, Pontus, Ourea 

Olympian gods  Gods who reside or that are associated with Mount Olympos

Some examples: Zeus, Hera, Apollo, Aphrodite, Ares

Chthonian gods (Theoi Khthonioi) Gods of the Underworld and Earth

Some examples: Nyx, Thanatos, Hades, Persephone, Hekate

Titan Gods Pretty self explanatory 

Some examples: Themis, Prometheus, Atlas, Rhea, Tethys

Sky Gods (Theoi Ouranioi/ Meteoroi)

Some examples: Helios, Eos, Anemoi, Hesperides 

Sea gods (Theoi Halioi/Einalioi)

Some examples: Amphitrite, Thetis, Aphrodite, Galatea

Rustic gods (Theoi Nomioi)  Gods of the countryside, the pastures and wild forests

Some examples: Artemis, Ariadne, Dionysus, Pan

Agrarian gods (Theoi Georgikoi/Khthonioi) Gods of the agriculture

Some examples: Demeter, Dionysus, Horae, Persephone, 

[lady-of-the-spirit]

see i would love Zeus actually being a clever and useful character but i just know Rachel is just gonna make sure his "redemption" is only via helping HxP/bowing to their demands/groveling to Hera over just letting him be a good tactician and leader and caring more about taking out a tyrant than having to be another simp for this boring AF couple and the Lisa Simpson knock off.

Lisa Simpson knock off I love it

same here! it's been pretty consistent that anyone who doesn't like Hades and Persephone are the antagonists or just not trustworthy (Artemis and Demeter are examples of the latter). I want a Zeus redemption, or at least him becoming less of a shitty person, but I absolutely do not want him to get there only by giving in to Hades and Persephone and/or Hera. Guess what, both sides fucked up! it's not entirely one-sided!! (at least in the case of Hades and Hera. Persephone hasn't really done anything to him.) (Zeus's fuck ups, while usually being worse, are not the only fuck-ups.)

anyway yeah, give me Zeus doing better by doing better, not just by giving Hades and Persephone everything they want or by apologizing to Hera without her own behaviour being acknowledged.

[godsofhumanity]

⚝───⭒─ 30 DAY HC’S | HERA ─⭒───⚝

HERA | her skin is fair. her hair is a dark chocolate, always tied up into a bun that sits on the crown of her head, with two neat strands resting on her shoulders. her eyes are a turquoise colour. she is always seen wearing her crown. she is an average height, leaning towards the taller side. she has a slender build.

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i've always imagined Hera to be the epitome of regality. she is elegance personified, a magisterial beauty.

yet, i hc her to have another side; though it is true that Hera is always dignified and cool, i think she can also be fun, and even crazy.

i like the idea that Hera is always wearing fashionable outfits, looking incredibly sophisticated, but at the same time, she's also prepared to eat cake off the floor and swear with language you didn't even realise existed.

she's a party girl, she's insane. but she's also beautiful, and she's powerful.

i think this idea is enforced by Hera's usual role in myths, where she plays the part of the vengeful, jealous wife, the pursuer who makes the hero go through all forms of hell. and yet, Hera herself always remains the Queen of Olympus, and few are bold enough to tell her off.

something else which i don't think people talk enough about, is how Hera is a skilled warrior. during Dionysus' Indian War, and during the Trojan War, Hera shows off her skill when she beats Artemis without breaking so much as a sweat.

i love the idea that archery is one of Hera's skills, and i love the idea that she shared her skills with her war children; Ares, Enyo and Eris.

as we all know, as a child, Hera was swallowed by Cronus along with her other siblings, so she didn't have much of a childhood, nor did Rhea have much of a chance at parenting.

i have this hc that Hera is the most similar to Rhea from all of Rhea's children. and i think that because they're so similar, Rhea has the hardest time bonding with her.

this explains, for me at least, why it is said in the myths that Hera spent time in Oceanus and Tethys' house, and why Hera often calls the two her "parents".

relating to the idea of Hera spending much of her youth in Oceanus' house, i like the idea that Hera was close friends with many of Oceanus' daughters. in particular, i like the idea that Metis and Hera, while not close, were at least decent towards each other.

some might say that Hera would have never liked Metis because of her relationship with Zeus, but Metis was Zeus' first wife, so i've always seen it that when Zeus was with Metis, it was before he had loved Hera, and before Hera had loved Zeus. thus, there was no reason for Hera to feel jealous or malicious towards Zeus.

and if Hera and Metis were friends, then it explains why Hera inevitably forms a rather good relationship with Metis' daughter, Athena, despite Hera usually being quite cold to her step-children: they become allies during the Trojan War, they both support Jason in his quest for the Golden Fleece, they team up to overthrow Zeus when they get sick of his arrogance, etc. (Hera's anger at Athena's birth wasn't so much directed at Athena herself, but rather Zeus for having performed the role of "mother" and "father" by giving birth to Athena on his own; an offensive act to Hera, being the goddess of women, family, and childbirth.)

going back to Rhea and Hera; something that has always stuck out to me about Hera is that she always takes Zeus back even though he cheats on her so many times. part of this is, of course, that Hera doesn't want to lose her status as Queen, but i definitely think that part of it is because she loves Zeus.

so yes, Hera does go pretty insane sometimes, and she does some terribly cruel things to the unfortunate lovers of Zeus, but why would she reduce Semele to mere ash, or torment Io with a gadfly, or force Leto to run from island to island unable to give birth, why would Hera do such malicious and evil things if she didn't feel genuinely hurt and betrayed by Zeus? if she didn't love Zeus?

Amphitrite is the wife of Poseidon, another notorious cheater in the Greek pantheon. yet, the retribution of Amphitrite against Poseidon's lovers are significantly less known than the antics of Hera. i personally think that this is because Hera's love for Zeus is real. it's not simply out of duty. she really, willingly loves him, and i think he returns that love, though i won't go into Zeus' perspective here.

now back to Rhea; Rhea goes through unimaginable pain at the hands of Cronus. in my Rhea hc's (scroll down to Rhea's section) i wrote that i imagine Rhea to have a forgiving nature. i like the idea that in spite of what Cronus does to her, she still forgives him. and i think that Rhea's forgiving nature is mirrored in Hera.

time and time again, Hera continues to forgive Zeus and welcome him back. Hera is devious at times of course, i think this cunningness comes from Cronus. but she is also forgiving. in a sense, she is stubborn and determined. and i think this headstrong characteristic is what she gets from Rhea.

related to the previous discussion, i've seen a lot of people say that by having so many affairs, Zeus disrespects Hera's domain as the patron of marriages. that it's ironic that the goddess of marriage herself is the one most in need of a divorce. but honestly, i disagree.

in fact, there is no one more suited to the role of marriage than Hera. she is the model of loyalty, steadfastness, and purity. no marriage is perfect, Hera's least of all. but still, she somehow finds the strength to continue. she remains loyal to Zeus. there is no one who understands the meaning of marriage more than her. and i think that's what makes her so perfect as the goddess of marriage.

now, on a semi-related note; i've heard of the take that Hera would be close siblings with Poseidon. personally, i disagree. as i said earlier, after Zeus, Poseidon is probably the next most infamous cheater. i can't imagine that Hera condones his actions, and as such, i just can't see Hera being extremely buddy-buddy with Poseidon.

of course, i think that Hera loves all her siblings, and they all get along somehow or the other, but if i was to name her closest siblings, i feel that Hades and Demeter would be the most viable candidates.

even though Demeter has a child with Zeus, i don't think that Hera has ever been malicious towards Demeter because of it. i say this because i can't recall any myths where Hera is cruel to Persephone, the lovechild of Demeter and Zeus. in fact, Persephone ends up joing the ranks of Hera and Amphitrite as a fellow queen, so i don't think that Hera hates her terribly.

one last final thing; related to Hera's step-children. i read somewhere that Hera only ever attacked the lovers of Zeus whom she feared Zeus loved more than her or who could threaten her status as Queen. so, Hera didn't attack all of Zeus' lovers (actually, i think this explains why Hera doesn't attack Demeter- i don't think that Zeus was ever in love with her).

furthermore, Hera is the goddess of motherhood and family. she has a strong maternal nature. i think Hera is undoubtedly peeved about the fact that she has so many step-children, but i don't think that she hates them.

there are many instances in the myths where Hera works well her step-children. she forms an alliance with Athena during the Trojan War, when Hera and Artemis are fancied by the giant sons of Poseidon, Artemis slays them both (and one could argue that she defends Hera's honour in doing so), Apollo became her ally when she tried to overthrow Zeus, Dionysus was the one who summoned Hephaestus to free her from the golden chair which imprisoned her, and i can't think of a specific example relating to Hermes, but it is generally said that Hermes was so charming and well-spoken, that all the gods loved him, including Hera.

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[winns-stuff]

LO RANT:

Okay this is petty to say, but it’s late and I was thinking about Lore Olympus heading into it’s new episodes and I just… I don’t get it. All the plots are kinda done and over with if you think about it, toxic girlfriend is gone, kronos is dead, no more college, no more TGEOM, no more controlling mom, and no AOW storyline. What will be left is Apollo, marriage, babies and you can easily just give that one or a few episodes because let’s be fr, Rachel did that with the whole 10 year thing. Everything is gonna be dealt with without any character development or any real message. This is supposedly a feminist story yet it depicts the story of a young girl falling for an older much richer and powerful man and the young girl leaving everything she loves and everyone she loves to be with this man after three weeks just to marry and have kids. I don’t know about you guys but I just don’t want to see Persephone become a housewife, I don’t want her to be just a baby maker for Hades and before you even say anything let’s be real that’s where this story is going you may not like how I say it but I’m saying this in the nicest way I possibly can. Persephone is literally just there to “fix Hades”, give him kids, and be with him so he won’t be lonely. He’s so dependent on her emotionally that he physically doesn’t know what to do with himself, a lot of people mistake that for love but in the context of their relationship I see it as desperation.

Hades has always been desperate. Desperate to be like his brothers, to have a queen, to have a wife, to not be lonely. He’d literally pick anyone to be his wife at this point if he hadn’t met Persephone because we’ve seen him trying to flirt with women before, it’s always giving escort and no I don’t mean to sound like I’m shaming escorts or anything that’s pretty dumb seeming as they’re literally doing a job but in this context the women he’s choosing aren’t escorts they’re just unlucky women who have to deal with him. He pays them and buys them gifts and everything and gives them everything they have just so they’ll stay with him. I’ve been noticing that, and then once he finds another young woman he does the same thing. That man is so utterly pathetic it’s scary, if you��re ever going to get into a relationship you should at the very least deal with very huge behavioral problems, for example Hades’ temper, something doesn’t go his way he riots like a child or you disagree with him and he’s upset, you give him criticism and he’s rushing out in the rain. You see what I’m getting at? Hades isn’t a very suitable person because he expects the woman in the relationship to be able to fix himself for him, to make all his problems go away, to deal with him at his ugliest and everything when he can’t even comfort and help Persephone when she confessed to him, or Minthe when she was getting insulted (badly might I add) by his own family to his face. He doesn’t even try being there yet those women are gonna have to bend over backwards to please him or he’ll go find someone else to whine to. Hades is pathetic and I despise him immensely, I hate him with the passion of a thousand suns and I wanna make that intensely clear to anyone who comes across this page for the first time. He was never a good person and he can’t even better his ways for Persephone.

Anyways, that’s the end of this rant. I’m a little eager for Saturday since I have a few things I wanna say about the episode but yeah, school is back in session as most of you know and I am running out of rants and even some appreciations. I believe I was going to appreciate Artemis next though so I’ll just use this post to remind me whenever I get the chance. But as I always say these are completely meaningless I don’t want anyone taking this seriously, I’m just stating my thoughts and opinions and if you agree with it that’s great and if you don’t that’s great too. By the way, this isn’t to bash Hades Lovers or anything if you like the man I don’t want you to back down from him just because I, a random teen on the internet, said something about it. If he’s your type he’s your type and this wasn’t a bash or anything so hopefully it doesn’t seem like it if it does I’m very sorry.

[blog-jei6x]

Mostly about character's flaws in LO

I want to talk this time about protagonist`s purpose, action and flaws in LO.

Let’s start that usually protagonist has some goal and protagonist does something for implementation this purpose, and has flaws which hinder to take this purpose. Few examples from some of my favorite stories (you can make parallel with yours and see that it s fair for them too).

Kaiman from Dorohedoro, his purpose is to understand who he is and what happened with him, he catches mages for this, we literally see it from first panels of manga. And this goal goes with him to the end, it main intrigue of plot. On my opinion his main flaw is self-rejection, to find yourself is his purpose and his main problem and it works with each other very interesting.

Furiosa from Mad Max, her purpose is fight for freedom and independence for her and other girls, we understand it very fast and it literally movie plot, yes, her acting changes but purpose still same. it s difficult to notice her flaws, but I think her main problem that she is very separate and doesn't trust others.

Over the Garden Wall, Wirt wants to return to home, his adventure is way to home and his purpose, and his flaws are arrogance and cowardice, after he coped with it, he found the way.

The Tatami Galaxy, protagonist wanted to find love of «raven-haired maiden» and for this he joined different campus clubs, he said about his purpose so many times that it was understandable and it was leitmotif of all story. Oh this dude has a bunch of flaws, he is cowardly, diffident, contemptuous, and I like him, his flaws don’t make him terrible person, they make him human, none of us is perfect. btw it s not very popular anime but rly cool and heartwarming , so check it.

So it s very different stories, but they all have few general features: protagonists have purpose (it is said or understand visually), push their story by actions and cope with own flaws. It s very important moment: not story pushes protagonist, protagonist pushes story. (you can make parallel with yours favorites and see that it s fair for them too).

Sometimes it can be unfair for nasty passive protagonist which has bad finale in the end or protagonist, which trouble is inaction and such person changes in finale, but it s specific stories.

Hades

Part about flaws is fair for Hades and Persephone, Hades actually has bunch of flaws, but they make him displeasing person, not more live. It s sounds hypocritically, isnt it? But flaws makes someone likeable, if this person pay for own flaws, in Tatami Galaxy protagonist can't move forward because of it, he sinks in own mistakes. Hades pay nothing for own flaws.

Let's see on his flaw - anger and how he works with it.

My favorite example of Hades anger: it is when he tortured guy and stolen his eye.

Look at those bastards, they are casual talking above tied guy, they clearly do such thing not in first time. I think would be great if Hades would have to pay for it, for example his reputation would sufferer and Persephone would start to fear or became angry him, he would take apologize of this guy, would sincerely repented and would became a better person and after it Persephone would start to became closer with him, but no he, only became closer with her, he doesn't need became better and to work with uncontrolled anger.

yeah, he returned Alex's eye, but Hades still terrible person, he didn't think that to hurt someone is wrong. He did not change at all.

so at least Hades has goal, he want to find true love, and he think it's Persephone and do some action for it, he wanted to step up to Persephone on party, he saved her from different accidents (tower 4, riot on Styx) he found her when she hidden and he is protecting her from Zeus.

Hades still poor written protagonist, but he has purpose.

Persephone

With Persephone everything is much worse. She doesn't have purpose, she doesn't push own plot, she doesn't work with own flaws. She is just there as beautiful lifeless manikin which goes with the flow.

Let’s see on it more detailed.

First scene where me met Persephone it s scene where another person chosen dress for her, so in first scene we saw how passive she is, she event can’t wear what she chosen, and she did not want to go on this party and Artemis forced her.

From this dialogue we can think that her flaws should be inaction and uncertainty, but again she never had trouble because of It, everyone think that it s cute and attractive.

Just watch on plot further, because she is inexperienced, Eros gotten drunk her, (don't drink with strangers irl, it's actually dangerous) and he and Aphrodite put her in Hades car and everything were fine after as you know. yeah she had some trouble with TGOEM but it s more not because of her flaws because Hestia is mean.

And it's going in all story, she is pushed by plot, or other characters, if you wish. She is in TGOEM because Demeter, she lived on Olympus because Artemis, she started to work in Underworld because Hera, she has salary because Hades likes her, she said Hades to return eye because her classmates, she gone in Tower 4 because Minthe, she became uncontrolled angry because Minthe and evil villagers, and it is mostly her action, she did something because someone pushed her.

She almost didn't do something which was her real decisions, or someone pressed her or she just uncontrolled yourself. And we can't say that it's her flaws because flaws mean to have trouble because of wrong actions.

But for sure she has flaws, again on my opinion uncontrolled anger is flaw, and she has this. Does she have trouble of it? - Not really. Does she try to work with it? - Definitely no. Does she feel guilty? - In very weird and selectively way.

I want to touch two episodes village's incident and Minthe's transformation.

All first season she didn't care what she have done with this people and doesn't show any sorrow about dead nymphs. She said to Hades that she tired from them, no trauma, no sadness. you know if you lose someone which you love you never will say something this way.

But when the truth was revealed she started to show how sad she is, it s very conveniently, show feelings when they are useful. I think it s not normal behavior, usually people can't control yourself so good (she lost her friends few weeks ago and can talk about them so). So looks like her feelings are insincere.

About people she doesn't care too, she never thought about them, never tried to learn how control yourself or get rid of this power, she just continue to live, she doesn't need to work with this trauma, it s so repulsive, I just can’t empathize such person and she doesn’t need it because she already fine.

So she doesn't pay for it emotionally, maybe does she pay for it in another way? - Indirectly, Zeus wants to punish her but everyone condemns him for this, and Hades protects her, she just became closer with Hades and he loves her more because of it.

Almost the same about Minthe transformation, Persephone tried to uncurse her, and shown some kind of remorse, but she danced in next episode and doesn't care, others don't care. Hades was a bit sad few hours I think.

And that s all, no guilty, no remorse, no changes: she just goes forward and lives.

In LO nothing does effect on protagonists, they always the same, they don't need to meet own flaws and defeat them, because everything will be fine anyway it s pretty boring and even nasty in some way, because usually they torture someone weaker and they don't have trouble because they have money and power, it's not enough for making characters interesting.

[antiloreolympus]

10 Anti LO Asks

1. Why does RS keep putting Aphrodite down? Like she keeps teasing us we’ll get more on Aphrodite and then uses her like a punching bag like she does with Minthe. Like Aphrodite got “redeemed” sorta 

2. Is there like no justice system for the Nymphs? Daphne turned into a tree, echo and Thanatos know, but nothing is getting down about that. Minthe is a plant for like Idk how long it’s been 3 days?? Maybe more??? Hades told Thanatos she’s a plant (just like his gf) and nothing is getting done about that??? BUT HES CALLED A NARc for actually turning Persphone in which is something that Zeus really wants (I know Poseidon said it but I don’t much on his character which way he leans on this whole thing) honestly feel like this trial arc was written by someone who doesn’t know basic court room stuff

3. Didn’t Rachel mention that she thinks Artemis and Apollo are black? Cause if that’s true, that’s just another example of a poor portrayal, and making those characters black is very…questionable? 

From OP: Artemis in her dream cast was black, Apollo wasn’t there but it’s pretty unlikely that they’d be completely different races (so, he’d be black as well).

4. Maybe Rachel should have played the multi-award winning games Hades™️ to get the basic idea that the three sections of the Underworld are as ancient as Time itself, and no one, not even Nyx, was there when it was created, and Hades and Persephone and co. are merely servants to the realm, not them controlling it and adding whatever they want to it as they please. JFC, how can Rachel claim to be so well researched and even a voice for accuracy when she makes stuff up so egregiously like this?

5. Hey! Not really, LO related (sort of) but I wanted to know if you’ve ever heard about this musical called Mythic? It’s another kind of modern adaption of the Hades/Persephone kidnapping, and although it’s not perfect, it’s probably one of the better ones I’ve seen. Again, there’s a few problems with it, but the fact that Demeter isn’t demonized and there’s actually a healthy mother & daughter relationship already makes it so much better than LO and a few other adaptations I’ve seen

6. yeah im also under the impression the "trial" seems more like rachel trying to "one up the haters" and frame any and all critique thrown at LO as "character assassination" and "slander" when its like, girl, you know she's only on trial for murdering a whole village because YOU wrote it that way, right? the people critiquing it didnt write it this way, YOU did. she seems to be act as if LO exists out of thin air and she can't be held accountable for it or its writing when its HER work!

7. Ah yes, the Goddess whose character consists of making baklava and scrapbooks, the epitome of beauty,  grace and wisdom even though she would be about an infants age in godly years. I also love that fields of Asphodel has been reduced to some purgatory places.

You know what hurts me the most, recently I’ve written a research paper of modern iterations damaging the authenticity of knowledge. For example, due to translation errorthe biblical use of Hades is hell, so most of the western people associate Hades with the Devil while Hades is both the god of the dead and the place where dead people go.

Lastly I find it relevant since how I started my Greek Mythology journey was through the Percy Jackson series and it shaped my initial thoughts, it might be possible that young people will actually associate god Apollo with r**e 

8. There's so many canon LGBT+ couples and characters in greek myth and yet the best Rachel could do was to make up a ship that makes no sense and has as much chemistry as two piece of stale white bread. i dont want her to force diversity, but seriously? it seems like she went out of her way to make it as heteronormative and 1% status quo as possible.

-----FP Spoilers/Mention-----

9. So Hades in all that time of being the absolute monarch, instead of making Elysium or the Asphodel Fields himself to prove he's a caring and thoughtful king, he decided instead the best option was to enslave them so he could make his vast fortune off of their labor? Like this plot point isn't just stupid in regards to how bad LO tries to make Persephone "powerful", this reinforces LO Hades is literally evil, and a random teenage intern has to try and "fix" his self-made issues instead of himself

10. FP// even if Persephone wants to "save the Underworld" (whatever that means) that doesn't negate the flaws in her writing? She even admits its not for the shades or out of the goodness of her heart, it's for herself to feel better, so it's not even a "Savior" moment. No one cared if she if could be dark and complex, we want that! The issue is Rachel going out of her to always excuse P's actions and this "Elysium" plot only proves she doesn't get why P's depiction is critiqued in the first place.