#The Love Triangle That Never Was

[denble]

[ARCHIVED - TLTTNW] Which Gold Saucer date (FFVII OG) is canon?

Of all the optional scenes and choices dialogues, the Gold Saucer date (FFVII OG) is one that get much debated as to which of the four choices is the canon one. Yes, objectively, it's four, not two. Aerith, Tifa, Barret, and Yuffie. And in this post, I'm doing best to find the most plausible answer that question.

1. How to decide which option is canon

Now, when a scene has options, how to concretely decide which of the options is the canon? In my opinion, it's gonna be either or all of the below:

The chosen option itself is later acknowledged in a NON-OPTIONAL scene.

The chosen option is NOTICABLLY LONGER and provide USEFUL information to the plot as a whole

The chosen option is the MOST LIKELY to happen.

And as said in my opening post, I won't count any remarks outside the game itself. Some core personnel could go on an interview and said "this is the canon" and it's still an invalid statement. In case we still haven't noticed, up until the release of Remake trilogy, Square Enix has never made a conscious effort to clear up the Love Triangle Debate. If anything, they are actually encouraging it, keeping it flaming by having contradicting details spread throughout the side materials.

2. Case study: Shadow Hearts and Chrono Cross endings

Shadow Hearts

Let's move a bit from FFVII and turn to Shadow Hearts (if you don't know the game, please just google). Basically at the end of Shadow Hearts, if you go with the flow of the event, Alice will die. If you do a bit of extra fighting, she will live. Both ending gets its own FMV. So far, I would say both endings are canonical. Because while the good ending requires a bit more work, it's reasonable enough, and it still has its own FMV where Alice open her eyes (she lives!).

But then Shadow Hearts II came out, on the premise that Alice died in the previous game. Bam! Now we know of the two endings of Shadow Hearts, which one is canon... And Shadow Hearts II is neither side material nor spin-off game. It's the second installment, with Yuri remains the main character. So we can't invalidate its presence as to what really happened, canonically, in Shadow Hearts.

Chrono Cross

Another game from Square. Like Shadow Hearts, you can do a Good Ending or Bad Ending, all depending on how you tackle the final boss. Bad Ending is easier to achieve since you only have to attack randomly, whereas Good Ending requires a bit more planning.

Anyway, who to decide which one is canon? Unlike Shadow Hearts, there is no sequel to decide that for you.

By my definition, the Good Ending is probably canon, because you get a lengthy cut-scene, and after-credit FMVs, whereas you get nothing (just credit roll) with Bad Ending (that's more like a Game Over if you ask me...).

Now, back to FFVII

3. Barret or Yuffie is certainly not canon

None of the four dates get mentioned later in the game. So by my definition, point (1) can't be used.

Coming to point (2), Barret's and Yuffie's date are short compared to Aerith's and Tifa's, and add little value to the plot (except for a bit of character development on their sides).

Coming to point (3), then Barret and Yuffie are out of the picture. Because to get to date either of them would require you making very specific choices right from the beginning. Which means the chance that you get to date either of them is rather slim, under normal circumstances (ie. without a guide).

So we are left with just Aerith and Tifa.

4. Aerith or Tifa?

There are two points people present to argue that Aerith's date is canon.

It's because Aerith OFFERED Cloud a date as payment for his bodyguard work.

It's because Aerith started off with more affection points (50 vs 30 to be exact)

Let's discuss further.

The Date payment

Aerith OFFERED Cloud a date as payment for his bodyguard work. And the Gold Saucer date is THAT day. But during the scene, Aerith just asked Cloud to go on a date, without ever mentioning about the "date" payment (and it's Aerith who has to "pay" the date, she owes him that, not the other way around). And no matter what, THE date can still be missed altogether, because it's not non-optional. If it's so important, they would have made it non-optional.

The Affection Point Mechanism

Aerith starts off with more affection points than Tifa does (50 vs 30 to be exact), meaning it's easier to date her (or so they say). What people fail to mention is that, Tifa appears in the game earlier than Aerith does, and you can score points with her right from the beginning. Meaning if you start to favor Tifa from the beginning, by the time you meet Tifa again, the point gap might not exist at all. So from a gameplay perspective, I could argue that Aerith's higher point of affection compared to Tifa's is not because the game wanted to give her a head start with Cloud, but to give her a fair start instead. You can try to see how exactly the date mechanism work here.

It's also worth noting that:

It's easy to score big points with Tifa from the early chapters.

You don't score many with Aerith when you spend time alone with her in Sector 5 (suprised?!).

If Tifa was chosen as Don Corneo's bride, telling Aerith to help Tifa will upset Aerith (points deduced). If it was Aerith that got chosen, Tifa would prefer Cloud to go help Aerith instead of asking if her (Tifa) is alright (points added). Interesting eh? (only if it wasn't a coding mistake...)

I don't have a suitable explanation as to how the all points addition and deduction the works the way it does. The way I see it, the game just tries to make the chance equal to both girls. And through my experience of playing the game, it's most likely the case. You just have to make the obvious choices favoring your girl, and then keep her in your party once you leave Midgar and bam, you get a date!

The game code

Another piece of information that I MUST mention: in the game code (according to the internet), in case Aerith and Tifa gets equal points, Aerith's date will play out.

If that's the kind of proof that you need to prove that Aerith's date is canon, I won't argue with you. It's clear that Aerith's date does take a higher priority (albeit only ever slightly) than Tifa's date, according how the game is coded.

WHY is it, is another matter. We can only guess. You can say it's because the game wants us to see Aerith's date (well yeah..., the game totally doesn't want us to see Tifa's date, sure). My explanation? It's because Aerith's screen time is limited in the game, so the game prioritizes her, when there's a chance. Still, that doesn't make Aerith's date canon, because despite all the apparent "favor" the game has for her date, it can still easily be missable, as it's never hard to get Tifa's date.

5. Which date is the most appropriate to the flow of the story THUS FAR?

This part is purely my (a player's) opinion, and actually doesn't hold any weight to the issue.

Well, Barret's and Yuffie's are certainly just there for the laugh, and for THEIR character development, not Cloud's.

Aerith's shreds some light on her back story (she knows somebody whom Cloud resembles), her awareness of Cloud not being himself, and her desire to meet the "real" Cloud. That much is clear.

Tifa's date, on the other hand, is a bit more complicated to interpret. On the surface, it's easy to see that she was about to confess but failed. But with the knowledge of how the game story eventually unfolds, was that really the case? Or could it be that Tifa was actually trying to talk to Cloud about his mental state?

I don't know, honestly, but my thought on Tifa's date is:

The atmosphere clearly gears towards a romantic confession than to a therapy session. The game certainly wants you to think that it's a confession (whether or not it's true is another story; it's not exactly a new thing for FFVII narrative to be misleading).

It's a bit out of place at that point of the story for Tifa to try confess her feeling to Cloud. She has better concerns on hand (particularly, his mental state) than to get Cloud realize her feeling. Not totally implausible, but definitely not well handled in my opinion.

In FFVII Rebirth, Tifa really did confess in that Gold Saucer scene though (provided that you get to date her). Just saying. Not that what happens in the Remake Trilogy, stritcly speaking, matters to what happens in the OG though. BUT, I do feel that a confession in Rebirth is appropriate, because Cloud and Tifa's relationship has been developed steadily ever since Remake (that's not the case in the OG though).

So yah, all things considered, I think Aerith's date adds more value to the plot AT THAT POINT than Tifa's because it provides players more apparent information (Zack, Cloud not being himself, Aerith being aware of the situation and her wish to meet the "real" Cloud).

Tifa's scene is not bad, but if it was EVER the game's intention to mislead us that it's a therapy session instead of a confession, they overdid it to effectively convince me that it could actually be about her trying to talk about Cloud's mental state.

6. Conclusion

So, in my conclusion, either of the dates can be canon. Normally I would say it can also be that neither is canon. But then, the Gold Saucer date scene ought to happen (because you know, Cait Sith's betrayal came next). The Gold Saucer date scene is actually non-optional, only whom you go on a date with is.

In any case, having no clear answer to that means whom Cloud dated during the Gold Saucer scene adds no value to the love triangle debate (for all we know, he could just have had some bro time with Barret, or got pecked on the cheek by Yuffie). And even if one particular date is canon, it still doesn't say much or even anything about Cloud's feelings, with the way the scenes played out.

On a side note, the whole date mechanism is NOT to determine which one Cloud himself preferred to take on a date, but to determine which one would to drag Cloud on a date :))))))))))) Ie. it's about THEIR affection towards Cloud, based on how he behaves around them (based on HOW THE GAME WANTS to add or deduce points). Asking Tifa if she was okay in Don Corneo's mansion certainly showed care and concern to her, but will get your points deduced.

You see, you think you have choices in the game, but do you really though?

7. Extra: Cloud's reaction to the dates

I'm not including Barret's and Yuffie's here because we can all agree that their dates are just pure comedy.

Aerith's date

At the end of the date with, Aerith asked Cloud:

“Don’t you like being with me?”

To which Cloud can reply either “No, I don’t.” or “That’s not it.”

Tifa's date

At the end of the date, Cloud asked Tifa:

“By the way, what did you want to say a minute ago?”

I honestly can't get much from the dialogues. As far as I'm concerned, Cloud is pretty neutral and doesn't show much to both girls. If anything, you actually have the choice to be rude to Aerith by choosing to say you don't like being with her, whereas you're quite okay with Tifa. But as you know I don't do choice dialogues, we can skip that one.

[insanesonofabitch]

Thinking about how the plot of season 6 wouldn’t make sense if you do not acknowledge the fact that Cas and Crowley working together was an affair, or at least it felt like so to Dean.

Majority of the people that I heard saying that they disliked that conflict, say that it doesn’t make sense because Dean should’ve understood Cas’ point of view. And that Dean has also worked with demons before, more than once, out of desperation. Which is why he doesn’t have the right to be mad. And I understand that. But it wasn’t about working with demons. No. Not really. The thing that hurt Dean the most about Cas’ choice was how he chose to ask for help from Crowley, instead of him. Cas chose Crowley over him.

“Look me in the eye, and tell me you’re not working with Crowley…”

“You’re in it with him? You and Crowley?? You’re going after purgatory together??? You have, huh? This whole time!”

“No, you had a choice. You just made the wrong one.”

“I was there. Where were you?”

The plot literally doesn’t make sense if you do not acknowledge destiel or crowstiel or deancascrowley. And I think that’s insane, especially for a show from 2005.

[cultofcipher]

Bill Cipher thoughts (BoB Spoilers Ahead)

I'm really sitting on how Bill's displayed so much of himself indirectly in the BoB. How during the Love section he denies having exes, marking them out. How said exes show up SEVERAL times scratched out or are regarded with this bitterness of someone who did NOT do the breaking up part. Bill got dumped. Every time. And is desperately trying to bury his feelings.

And that's something I think the Book of Bill really highlights in a way. The fact that Bill has feelings. That deep down he's a broken triangle. It's all over the book's writing. Him pointing out how to use denial and rationalization and other bad coping mechanisms to basically ignore and lie to himself (and show us how to do it) and basically convince himself that he is as heartless as he tries to be. Him avoiding his exes. The tone he uses and the avoidance really giving the "I don't handle breakups well and I'm still petty about it". Him constantly telling himself that he's fine. He's not fine. Him crying over Ford leaving and getting wasted. Him being bitter about the henchmaniacs not calling. His regret over what happened to his world. His loneliness. GOD his loneliness. His self-hatred. His scathing remark about definitely NOT having some tragic backstory that humanizes him and how he's not an "I can fix him case". Calling himself a monster. His longing for home. The "Last one breathing". The "I tried to change the past". The "my hands shaking, as I realized I could never undo the". The "until there was no one left but me, covered in blood, alone in the universe". The goddamn "I don't want to die alone" Valentine's card. The last few pages. Just, the last few pages. That isolation, his pained "I'M FINE". The almost sad plea for someone to let him out.

Bill cares. He's fucked up, unstable, violent. But he does care about people he gets along with and he feels understand him. For every "I'm just playing the bit" and using people with nice gestures, I think a fraction of that is somewhat genuine. And he hates it. He hates his own vulnerability. He hates his lack of apathy. He's denying himself his own emotions constantly under so many layers of distractions, eldritch horrors, and repression. He can't think about home, about failure, about how every relationship he's ever had, platonically or otherwise, ended. And it wasn't on his terms.

Him talking about/to his mom when he's drunk. How his mom called him Billy as a kid. How his home life sounded simple. How Bill as an individual is anything BUT simple. And how his drunken state holds such fondness for that simplicity, yet it was suffocating. How he would've broken free eventually, inevitably, because he knew that's who he was. It's his nature. He was destined for more.

How it cost him everything.

How he's constantly chasing insanity like it's a drug. Like he needs the power trip to stay high. To not think too hard. To drown out his emotions and his self-reflections and everything he hates about himself.

How in Gravity Falls he still tried to get Ford to side with him after everything, cause that was his vulnerability showing, for the slightest glimpse of a moment. Cause he doesn't want to do it alone. Him reaching out to the reader in his book, because he doesn't want to do it alone. Can't do it alone. Even when he eventually betrays that person, I think him offering Ford that cushy spot alongside his henchmaniacs makes me think that yeah, Bill actually would've upheld his end of the deal.

He thinks he wants multiversal domination. He thinks Weirdmageddon is his Magnum Oppus. His purpose. But he's so lost. If he ever does get what he wants, he won't know what to do with himself. He'll be faced with the "Now what?". He'll hit the end of the road and realize how unsatisfying it is. How this isn't what he wanted.

How lonely it is to be God.

I think the Axolotl sees that in Bill. It's why he doesn't try to destroy him or attack him or anything. He sees that inner self of Bill. Sees him for what he really is. Someone who needs a LOT of therapy, a true, honest to goodness friend or partner in his life, and maybe a more sustainable life purpose or hobby. He has so much potential and in a way his pursuit of power, rather than being an actualization of his abilities, is a waste of them, because it gets him nowhere.

And he needs help, even if he doesn't think he does. He's a depressed alcoholic frat boy trying to drown his misery in a way that hurts and kills worlds. He's a girlfailure, a bisexual/pansexual disaster (he's at LEAST canonically bisexual or at MOST canonically pan cause this guy has dated both ways).

Bill's book is so incredibly amazing for what it is. All the lies, all the unrealiable narrator parts of Bill's facades and flaws and him being himself and all of his genuine thoughts and feelings bleeding through the lines and showing themselves but only in a way that you can really understand if you understand him and can tell when he's lying and when he's not. To see the real parts of him, and everything else. This book was perfect, and it was perfectly imperfectly him. This truly is Bill's book. It's so him in such a raw and genuine yet dishonest way. I'm gonna cherish this damn book forever.

[doctorsiren]

working on a short animatic/animation, here’s a flat colour frame from it :)

I’ll be done in the next couple days and I’ll put it on my YouTube channel

[lauraisakilljoy]

lost is really good as it is but it would’ve been even better if the writers had known these four were bi

[hypertechnica]

i’m going to make fiddauthor art with fidds wearing his wedding ring and you are NOT going to like it

big obligatory banner that says “cheating is bad don’t do it i just like stories with relationship drama”

closeted, internally homophobic gay men who are married with kids has to be the trope i’m weakest to. no person involved is escaping the despair brought on by a relationship built on a well intentioned, desperate lie, born out of a desire to be normal and good

he WANTED to love her so fucking badly. he felt no ill will towards her and he loves their son more than words can say. he thought the attraction, the way she felt about him, would come with time. it didn’t. he doesn’t want to hurt her yet was doomed to from the start, and he’s truly, truly sorry. this does not absolve him of anything whatsoever and she has the full right to never want to speak with him again. he lied! he pretended to feel the same when he never once felt anything but platonic affection! he’s been in love with someone else this whole fucking time! and their kid… he’s caught in the middle of it all, too young to understand why his father would hurt his family like this.

and then he disappears and never comes back. imagine you’re 5 and your dad goes to the middle of the woods with his buddy for science shit, all of the sudden your parents are yelling on the phone and signing papers, and then he goes MIA. for years.

imagine your husbands “buddy” was the one he was thinking of all this time, not you, never you. and the first chance he gets to run away from you, he takes, and you should have been suspicious by the rushed frenzy of it all, the phone calls getting shorter and shorter until it fizzles to nothing. he forgot to get you a christmas gift. he hand-made him two. there has to be something wrong with you, it has to be your fault. you wish you married the man he becomes when he’s in his presence.

he folded when you started questioning him directly - he’d been to neurotic to ever be a good liar. you thought he was the one. he thought you were nice.

by the time the divorce is finalized he’s different in a wrong way. confused, angry, forgetful, insane - if the giant homicidal robot pterodactyl you’ve been harassed by is any indication. (he’s had a bad habit of building homicidal robots when he’s mad since they met -engineer things- but it was never directed at her - thankfully it never actually does anything) he’s clearly abusing drugs - you’d feel bad if he hadn’t abandoned you with the burden of explaining why your son can’t see his father anymore.

it’s a rotten bit of your soul, but time heals you. you move on and no longer think of him. trust in your career. find a man who truly loves you with no motives attached. raise your kid to be a good man. and in a fashion not unlike shakespearean dramatic irony, this makes him move to gravity falls to find and take care of his father. you couldn’t care less what hee doing now, but damn it, it’s his father, what is the kid supposed to do? but its futile- he appears to have no remorse, hell, no memory of the incident in the first place. (this isn’t his fault but how are they supposed to know that?) so he grows bitter and cold just like his mother used to be.

imagine that.

all over a mans inability to do anything but live in denial. to force himself to live in a box and pine like a dying man over the right one at the wrong time, destined to crash and burn. to take denial to a new level- a cult, brain damaging radiation, a total ego death - just to take the edge off. take off that damn wedding ring

[coldblooded-angel]

My thoughts during the Churro™ scene as a professionally licensed Yapper:

SPOILERS UNDER THE CUT:

While they’re in the canteen, there’s a moment where Art looks at Patrick and you can clearly see the relief in his eyes that he has his friend there with him. (Or does he??)

I don’t think Art was lying about not keeping in touch with Patrick. In between his tennis career and his relationship, Patrick has neglected Art (which I think is because he’s so used to him being there that he just never fathomed him not being there which makes him complacent in their friendship).

But when Art realizes that once again Patrick has been taken away by just the mere image of Tashi, he’s hurt. I think in that moment Art wanted to feed that hurt, lash out and make Patrick feel the pain he feels for being left out.

Art jokes about Patrick not being there to visit him because he misses him. He misses his friend, his constant and yes, it’s in a joking manner but Patrick sees thru him (as he always does).

(The fucking head tilt took me out because it screams fond like ‘aw baby u really did miss me ure so cute when ure jealous but wont admit it’)

The entire scene (for me) turns into reassurances and doubts. Their friendship was being tested to see if it could withstand having to share their love and space with a third. Having to make concessions and space around their new desire and jealousy.

When Art tries to downplay his thoughts, trying to twist Tashi’s words to manipulate he was clearly being petty but I also think there’s some truth to his statement of not wanting Patrick to get hurt. He is his friend first but he also knows him (the same intrinsic way that Patrick knows Art) and how his friend will be able to bounce back from any relationship because Art truly doesn’t think these two are that serious (blinded by Patrick’s history and his own feelings). So Patrick sees the manipulation for what it is.

(The fond look in his eye when Art isn’t looking. That man is in love your honor!!!!!)

Patrick knows Art was trying to manipulate him. He knows it and he likes it, encourages it even. He looks at him like he’s proud of Art. The fact that it mattered more to him that Art was actually being vocal about his own wants instead of repressing as he always did, even if it was through breaking him and his girlfriend up. He didn’t even see it as a threat because it never occurs to him that he could lose Tashi to Art (or vice versa) because at this point, he’s secure in his place within the triangle. But also reveals how insecure Art feels within that same triangle because of his perceived isolation.

[aroaceleovaldez]

i still think a lot about how technically, it's implied Anubis and Walt started dating each other before they asked out Sadie, and if Sadie had said she wasn't interested they would have gone "Entirely fair have a nice day" and proceed to just go continue to date each other.

Cause like, that was the entire thing. They decided that themselves. That things would work best if they were together (as in both physically sharing a body and also relationship-wise). The "asking Sadie about it" part was secondary. If she had said no, they would have stayed together, because among other things Walt would kind of die if they didn't. Walt and Anubis are technically the first gay couple in the Riordanverse. AND they're in a polyamorous relationship with Sadie. Why does no one talk about them ever.

[mike-milkyway]

Zoro not falling in love usually and then getting the biggest most gut wrenching crushes on an stretchy guy with a special interest on pirates and almost immediately after on a cook with self-esteem issues.

[shrimpchipsss]

professor shen qingqiu, the most confusing man in academia

(redraw of that indiana jones scene)

[khaopybara]

❝Every morning, as soon as I wake up alone, the pain strikes me.❞

NAKAMURA YURIKA as HAYASHI FUYU and SUGAI YUUKA as HARUMOTO ITSUKI episode 1 of CHASER GAME W2

+ but it's all a dream because your bae is 1. living in another country and 2. she's still married:

[denble]

[ARCHIVED - TLTTNW] Analysis style - Before we enter any discussion...

Before I created this Tumblr blog, I was writing a series of posts on Wordpress detailing how there was never a love triangle, not even in the OG. The project is scrapped now because @dutchdread already did a much better job that I have little of value to add.

But I did spend a lot of time writing, and it just seems a waste to let them stay as drafts forever on my Wordpress blog. So yeah, here they are, on this Tumbler blog, just for archiving purpose.

But who knows, maybe I will keep writing, if only just to practice my English writing skill.

The series is named TLTTNW - The Love Triangle That Never Was, just for the sake of archiving.

------------

Before we enter any discussion, there are a few points I want to make clear, regarding how I approach any topics.

1. I support Cloud x Tifa

I like Tifa as a playing character and support Cloud x Tifa just because the pairing makes sense with all what presented in the game to me.

2. This series will largely talk about the infamous love triangle

Or as I like to say: the love triangle that never was. No non-bias promise (I'm human after all), but I guarantee you that I won't be toxic.

3. When discussing OG, I disregard all the side materials (novellas, Ultimania, ...)

And to a lesser extend, spin-off games like Crisis Core. As far as I know, UP UNTIL THE RELEASE OF REMAKE TRIOLOGY, side materials provide all sorts of conflicting information that is of no help in determining the "truth". One can quote this and omit that to support their claims. And thus, the war goes on...

Another problem is, it's questionable as to whether all those side materials and spin-off games can be considered canon. Heck, I don't even know if the core people involved in making the side materials and spin-off game did play the OG or not, OR if the OG core developers had any say in those, OR if the OG core developers remembered the game they made well AND tried to stay as cohesive as possible with all those side materials and spin-offs.

So, to be fair to all side, everything said in those side materials are none of my concern. Only what happened in the game matters the most. If you need side materials to confirm something that none of the characters in the game acknowledge, such confirmation doesn't weight much in my opinion. If you want players to know something, let them know through the game they're playing, not through some side materials, be it official or not.

Now, ever since FFVII Remake was released, I've noticed that Square Enix has been trying to tie loose ends with new side materials (Traces of Two Pasts novel, accompanying Ultimanias), Crisis Core Remake, and an "entirely" new game Ever Crisis that spans the whole timeline of FFVII Universe from way back when Sephiroth is young to the current, with visual elements from Remake Trilogy. Those, I think we can safely assume that, are canon, and cohesive as a whole. Some details of events are a bit different, but ultimately it's the same story. So, while I will stay mostly with the OG (let's kill the love triangle way back in OG), when comes the time to discuss Remake Trilogy, I think it's safe to take those into account.

5. This is a video game

A. The interaction and multiple choices nature of video games

All works of fiction (a novel, a movie, a TV series, a video game, etc.) will tell a story. Each fiction medium will have its own way and restriction as to how the plot and narrative being handled (you can watch this video (and read the comments) to get explained more on the topic). Among those, video games is distinctly different because players have interaction with the game as the story unfolds. You have choices to make, options to decide. Those are a part of the game play and the narrative, and not necessarily the (canon) plot. Some options are there just to have you involved and immersed in the game world. That's all.

A clear example of options not being canon is the endings of Shadow Hearts (a JRPG, you can goolge for more). In Shadow Hearts, you can play the game in a way to get the good ending, in which Alice is not killed, but canonically, she is dead, as presented in the sequel Shadow Hearts II.

Another thing to consider is, unlike the plot which needs to stay consistent, the behavior of a character that the players get to choose through options might not necessarily be so. For example, you could choose not to give Tifa the flower, not to accept her cocktail, but admit to Aerith that Tifa is your girlfriend, and then later when then three of you fell down the sewer, you decide to check on Aerith first. Nobody in the game will question your inconsistent behaviors because it actually doesn't matter to the plot. The purpose of having choices in a game is more for the gameplay and the players' gaming experience than to establish the plot. Reinforcing it? Maybe. Establishing it? I don't think so.

So in my opinion, if I want to to correctly determine any truth in the plot, I should disregard any choice dialogues and optional scenes. Because if a part is so crucial to the plot, it won't be made optional and thus missable.

B. The narrative nature of a work of fiction and how realism only works to a certain extend

a. The narrative nature of a work of fiction

First and foremost, a work of fiction is created by an author. What happens in it is decided by the author. When it is delivered to you, all courses of action has already been decided. You, as an audience, actually have no say as to how the plot progresses. In case of video games, you may be presented with choices to slightly alter the events, but the core plot will and always stay the same.

Now, the only exception to the above statement is an on-going work of fiction - manga, anime, TV series, ... where audience feedbacks might influence the author to change the course of the plot from the initially intended. But even if that's the case, in a GOOD narrative, the change has to happen gradually, with enough details paved, before the climax happens. Such changes also need not to contradict what have been presented all a long. The author can't just pull an Uno Reverse Card by the end of the work.

HOW the story unfold before you (the narrative) is also decided for you, to get you involved in the story IN A CERTAIN WAY. Which detail is shown, how it is shown, how much of it is shown, how clearly it is shown. In a GOOD narrative (the keyword here is "good"), everything happens before your eye already has a purpose. Certain characters fill certain roles, certain actions lead to certain consequences, or can be explained later by back stories. If something is there, it's because the narrative wants to tell you something. If something is not there, it's simply because it's not vital to the main plot. There is no randomness when it comes to what a character does or doesn't do or to what kind of fate awaits them. Cloud didn't survive the fall to Sector 5's church out of pure luck (in the OG, he didn't even have the grappling gun like he did in FFVII Remake). He survived because the plot decided so, because he's the main character (or as we usually say: plot-armor). Likewise, Aerith's death was not just an unfortunate event happened out of no where. She died because that's part of the plot and it's necessary to advance the story further.

Another important point of narrative in a work of fiction is that, you can actually expect how true a certain event is, based on the way it is presented to you. For example, in a movie, when an important character dies, if he dies on-screens, with all the slow-motion, epic music and flashback, you can say for certain that he is dead. But if he only APPEARS to die, or die unceremoniously, there's a chance that you will see him well alive and kicking later.

b. Realism only works so far

The world of a work of fiction is very limited compared to real life. There simply isn't room to accommodate all kinds of variables there might be as in real life. In a typical hero-saving-the-world type of story, there can only be one hero/hero group that can beat the villain. No one else will try to, or can, do the same.

Which means we should not apply real life's logic how the events in a work of fiction happen, as long as it is logical within its fictional world. The moment you hear yourself saying: "But in reality ...", just stop. Because if you can't take (fictional) events presented to you at face value, nothing the narrative is telling you actually matters anyway. One argument I've seen is "Even if Cloud and Tifa had sex during the Highwind scene, it still didn't mean that Cloud had romantic feelings for her because in real life, people have sex all the time without having to be a couple." I mean, bro, are you alright? I might not know what the Highwind scene actually means, but I'm sure it's not a dating crash-course trying to teach you that that love and sex might or might not come together.

All in all, I believe the correct attitude to any events being presented to you is not to ask "how I want to interpret it?" but "how the author wants me to interpret it?". And to dig deeper to the truth, you have to ask why. Why the author wants me to interpret it THAT way.

c. Genres matter

Another thing is worth pointing out is that fiction genres exist for a good reason. And that reason is that genres establish the main theme of the plot. If it's a romance story, you will see a lot of angst and emotions and dramas between people. Other life matters are trivial compared to the quest of finding one's true love. If it's a detective story, you will see a lot of, well, investigations. The romance aspect could be there, but it's certainly will be quite minimal and straightforward. You can't have have a main character chasing both a criminal and the love of his life at the same time, certainly not in a way happening in a romance story. Because (1) it's gonna prolong the story, and (2) it will dilute the plot and its main focus.

So, how you read a certain event also depends on what genre the work of fiction you are experiencing is. In a romance story, the main couple declaring their love right from chapter 1 could certainly mean that their love will get tested hard throughout the course of the story, or their actual true love awaits them much later. In a detective story, if the main character has a girlfriend/wife from the beginning, the chance the girlfriend/wife stays the same throughout the story is high. They are not the focus of the story, so no need to make it complicated UNLESS IT MATTERS TO THE PLOT AS A WHOLE.

And if it isn't clear enough, the main plot of FFVII isn't romance. I believe we can all agree on that.

C. Plot holes, weak writing and bad writings happen

Due to various reasons (incompetence, time constraints, etc.), plot holes, weak writings and bad writings do happen, and it certainly happened in FFVII OG. My take on it is just to accept it and get on with the game.

One example of weak writing in FFVII plot is when Rufus wanted to borrow Cid's Tiny Bronco. Why the hell did the President of a big corporate want to borrow a small plane from a "retired" pilot? Logically, even if he was strained far away from a Shinra base, getting a plane to him should only be a matter of hours. My guess is that maybe he just happened to be in the area, and just wanted to get shit done as quick as possible. Still, that part is certainly not well-written.

My point is that, when it comes to the love triangle debate (and other debates), some people tend to over analyze the details. But overanalyzing a detail only works if that said detail is NOT a plot hole or bad writing. Heck, they even try to analyze the postures and facial expressions of the polygons in the game :))))))

Now, as far as I know, some of those over-analysis is true to some extend (but their values are just like icing on the cake, and not being the cake itself). Some others are just the fan reading too much into it. There certainly are nuances presented in the game, but I'm pretty sure you don't have to use a microscope to see it. The nuances are there to make things MORE detailed and exciting, NOT to establish or change the whole narrative.

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Phew that's long. I hope I present myself clear enough as to how I would like to discuss the points and events in FFVII OG. Now, let's dive into the discussions itself.

[stardustandglitterglue]

I know I'm late (I have my copy of the Book of Bill but I've yet to read it bc I've been busy) but BoB basically making BillFord canon in the year of our lord 2024 is so fucking funny and weirdly vindicating bc BACK IN THE DAY!!!! I saw that shit. So many of us saw the way Bill acted around Ford and went, "...he kinda fruity, huh?" and we were MOCKED!!!! SCORNED!!!!!!!! TOLD WE WERE "glorifying abusive relationships" WHEN ACTUALLY, WE SAW THE TRUTH!!!!!!!! 😤😤😤

[jade-of-mourning]

sorry sometimes i think about mako and my heart hurts so much. this kid raised himself and his brother on the streets in homelessness and utter poverty from eight through fifteen, promptly after seeing the violent death of his mother and father. he turned to the triple threats because they couldn't survive as a pair of wretched kids without any adult support, and the environment forced him to turn into the exact character that killed his parents in a terrible twist of irony. and after sheer-fucking-luck hits and they aren't homeless anymore, their livelihood wavers on the outcome of what's a literally game to everyone but them; and after things are finally starting to look up and their team is going places and things just might be okay, his gradually stabilizing world unceremoniously expands and everything goes to shit.

and the city that chewed him up and spat him back out, ruined him as a child and took away his ability to stay afloat in a true sense of normalcy as an adult — when it's on the verge of destruction and falling to pieces before his eyes, he gives himself to save it with the full expectation to die. he went from the kid who didn't and couldn't care about anything outside of himself and his brother, to finding redemption for his younger self in his police work despite its injustice against him, to willingly sacrificing himself to a world that had never loved him.

he's a desperate people pleaser, socially and emotionally stunted for the adult he had to be as a kid, unable to navigate interpersonal relationships easily yet still trying his damned hardest. he's intensely and entirely devoted to the things that matter to him and for so long it was only him, bolin, and ensuring their survival — yet by the end, that devotion has expanded to protecting the rest of the world. he starts out entirely self-reliant and ends in trusting the people he cares about to know their own needs, to be able to take care of themselves, to be okay without him despite having spent so much of his life defined by his role in others' well-being.

just. what the fuck i'm such a big fan of this fictional guy and i'm unashamed about it at this point. also let him cry please (if you won't i'll do it i'll let him cry)

[iiiumihottie]

can you guess who my favorite (non mabel) mizar is? :p

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[anonymous-chicken-was-taken]

So, how rare ARE Ford's extra fingers, anyway?

I'm not gonna lie, at first I was skeptical of Ford's claims that the Weirdness Magnetism had an effect on him. Like, yeah, the whole having six fingers thing isn't exactly common, but it's a naturally-occurring event. Stan describes it as a birth defect, and there doesn't seem to be a noticeably great number of people with those in Gravity Falls. It wouldn't be all that farfetched for Ford to think he was just Built Different, for like, at least 7 reasons, but then you start actually thinking about it.

Polydactyly isn't exactly common. Approximately 1 in 1,000 babies are born with some form of polydactyly. While it's true that postaxial polydactyly (extra digit is past the pinkie) is the most common form, which is shown to be the kind Ford has in the x-ray at the beginning of AToTS, there are several other extreme circumstances.

Extra digits in polydactyly aren't usually found on all limbs. It can occur on hands and feet (and Alex has confirmed that Ford does, indeed, have six toes on both feet) but rarely does it occur on both feet, or both hands, much less both hands and both feet. And even when it does occur more than once on one person, the extra digits aren't usually fully-formed. Oftentimes they don't even have bones. When they do have bones, they're usually much smaller, or barely opposable (if they have joints at all). When they're big enough to be maneuverable, they usually interfere with the structure of the hands/feet in negative ways. All this means that an extra finger or toe which doesn't direly require a surgery to remove the extra digit within the first year or two of life is incredibly uncommon.

And let's remember: that's just for one extra digit. Ford has four.

For Ford to have fully functional polydactyly on both hands and both feet, to the point where it's basically impossible to tell which one is finger x without x-rays... the odds of that are astronomically unlikely. Never-before-recorded, one in a kazillion, borderline medically unfathomable sort of rare.

I think I do believe the Weirdness Magnetism could've affected Ford, actually.